Re: [Emc-users] Haas thoughts

2016-10-12 Thread Gene Heskett 
On Wednesday 12 October 2016 11:55:12 Mark wrote:

> On 10/12/2016 09:54 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > You mentioned gedit, which gets my attention.  That "thing" has
> > scrambled a file for me for the very last time. I don't even install
> > it on a fresh install, but nano to avoid remote x problems, and
> > geany for a gedit-like editor that has yet to record or miss-record,
> > usually because I am typing on a membrane covered keyboard and don't
> > hit the key hard enough.
> >
> > When I started to make TLM work with a 5i25 card because software
> > stepping wasn't fast enough, I had to nuke the .ini and .hal files
> > and start from scratch with a fresh run of stepperconf in the first
> > month while I was adding this and that to complete the working
> > config. About every 9 or 10 times I called up gedit to fix a typu, I
> > would fine the files was scrambled by picking up a kilobyte of it
> > and randomly inserting it 2 or 3 other places in the file, with the
> > start of the insert being mid-line of the inserted section, and
> > inserted mid-line where it was inserted.
> >
> > Save yourself such potential gcodeing headaches by making the
> > default editor geany in the axis.ini file. IMO gedit is a TTD, a
> > Textually Transmitted Disease.
>
> You must have something inexplicably incorrect.  I've used gedit for
> years and never ran into any of the problems you've had with it,
> running it either locally or over the network.  And that's with a
> bunch of plugins installed, both for software development work and for
> the G Code editing.
>
> Mark

I had the huge majority of the plugins installed. After about the 4th 
time it happened, I ripped it all out, nuked everything gedit related in 
my home dir, then spent several hours getting back to square two with 
nano. Never hiccuped once. Backed that up in the nightly amanda run. 
Safe, I tried and installed the bare metal kit of gedit again.  3 edits 
of that .hal file and it was destroyed again, took about 20 minutes.  
Back to the house & called up amrestore and recovered the good file.  

Then I went looking for a good editor with a decent gui, and came across 
geany.  Its not quite as well equipted with syntax helpers, but it has 
more than enough for my needs.

It has yet to make a mistake I didn't make.  That was on the atom, 
D-525-MW motherboard with 2 gigs of dram.

I don't like to admit it because more than twice is my fault but gedit 
made a blithering idiot out of me 8 to 10 times before I swore off.

Sorta like girls, some do, and some don't.

Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 

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Re: [Emc-users] Haas thoughts

2016-10-12 Thread andy pugh 
On 12 October 2016 at 22:52, Erik Friesen  wrote:
> So assuming I used a 7i48, when does the 3ppwmgen get updated?  In the base
> thread?

3ppwmgen is updated in either the servo thread or the FPGA thread,
depending on what you are asking.

-- 
atp
"A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
lunatics."
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Re: [Emc-users] Haas thoughts

2016-10-12 Thread Erik Friesen 
So assuming I used a 7i48, when does the 3ppwmgen get updated?  In the base
thread?

On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 11:55 AM, Mark  wrote:

> On 10/12/2016 09:54 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > You mentioned gedit, which gets my attention.  That "thing" has scrambled
> > a file for me for the very last time. I don't even install it on a fresh
> > install, but nano to avoid remote x problems, and geany for a gedit-like
> > editor that has yet to record or miss-record, usually because I am
> > typing on a membrane covered keyboard and don't hit the key hard enough.
> >
> > When I started to make TLM work with a 5i25 card because software
> > stepping wasn't fast enough, I had to nuke the .ini and .hal files and
> > start from scratch with a fresh run of stepperconf in the first month
> > while I was adding this and that to complete the working config.
> > About every 9 or 10 times I called up gedit to fix a typu, I would fine
> > the files was scrambled by picking up a kilobyte of it and randomly
> > inserting it 2 or 3 other places in the file, with the start of the
> > insert being mid-line of the inserted section, and inserted mid-line
> > where it was inserted.
> >
> > Save yourself such potential gcodeing headaches by making the default
> > editor geany in the axis.ini file. IMO gedit is a TTD, a Textually
> > Transmitted Disease.
>
> You must have something inexplicably incorrect.  I've used gedit for
> years and never ran into any of the problems you've had with it, running
> it either locally or over the network.  And that's with a bunch of
> plugins installed, both for software development work and for the G Code
> editing.
>
> Mark
>
> 
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Re: [Emc-users] Haas thoughts

2016-10-12 Thread Mark 
On 10/12/2016 09:54 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> You mentioned gedit, which gets my attention.  That "thing" has scrambled
> a file for me for the very last time. I don't even install it on a fresh
> install, but nano to avoid remote x problems, and geany for a gedit-like
> editor that has yet to record or miss-record, usually because I am
> typing on a membrane covered keyboard and don't hit the key hard enough.
>
> When I started to make TLM work with a 5i25 card because software
> stepping wasn't fast enough, I had to nuke the .ini and .hal files and
> start from scratch with a fresh run of stepperconf in the first month
> while I was adding this and that to complete the working config.
> About every 9 or 10 times I called up gedit to fix a typu, I would fine
> the files was scrambled by picking up a kilobyte of it and randomly
> inserting it 2 or 3 other places in the file, with the start of the
> insert being mid-line of the inserted section, and inserted mid-line
> where it was inserted.
>
> Save yourself such potential gcodeing headaches by making the default
> editor geany in the axis.ini file. IMO gedit is a TTD, a Textually
> Transmitted Disease.

You must have something inexplicably incorrect.  I've used gedit for 
years and never ran into any of the problems you've had with it, running 
it either locally or over the network.  And that's with a bunch of 
plugins installed, both for software development work and for the G Code 
editing.

Mark

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Re: [Emc-users] Haas thoughts

2016-10-12 Thread Peter C. Wallace 
On Wed, 12 Oct 2016, Erik Friesen wrote:

> Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2016 08:30:06 -0400
> From: Erik Friesen <e...@aercon.net>
> Reply-To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)"
> <emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net>
> To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)" <emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net>
> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Haas thoughts
> 
> Does or doesn't LCNC support softdmc?
Not LinuxCNC does not support SOftDMC

>
> Correct me if I am wrong here, but my calcs are these.
>
> I can't find a pole count for the Yaskawa servo motors, but I assume they
> are 8 poles.  Encoder counts are 32768 per rev, 6mm ballscrews.
>
A 3000 RPM motor may be 4 poles (8 pole Fanuc are ofteb 1750 RPM max)

> So at 700IPM, that is 50 Rounds per second, encoders right at 1.6mhz
>
> 50 RPS * 8 Poles = 400 Motor cycles per second.
>
> 400 MCPS * 32?? = 12800hz needed servo period?  This seems a bit out of
> reach of being handled in software, and I am not sure that 32 steps would
> be enough.
>

32 steps are probably way more than needed at maximum speed for a couple 
of reasons, 1 being that the motor inductance and lack of voltage headroom at 
full speed will make the motors current response be in the millisecond 
region at that speed (dI/dT = Vbus-VMotor/LMotor) and 2 being that small 
angular errors cause very little torque ripple due to the torque vs 
angle error curve being close to a cosine (that is even square wave commutated 
motors with +-30 degrees of commutation error = 6 step commutation have only 
about 13% torque ripple)

My guess is that 4 to 8 KHz would be fine and if the FPGA hardware could 
interpolate the values, even 1 KHz would be fine


> On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 7:35 AM, Erik Friesen <e...@aercon.net> wrote:
>
>> It uses an atmel chip.  However, that isn't the hangup to me.  I see
>> context switching as a real challenge.  So you hit the edit button, then
>> what?  Open gedit?  I'd really like to limit GUI excursions and control the
>> whole thing closer than that.
>>
>> On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 11:16 PM, Gregg Eshelman <g_ala...@yahoo.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Look on the back of the keyboard for microchips, or on a board that the
>>> keyboard connects to. Google the numbers to see what they are.
>>>
>>> I'd thought about hoking up the keyboard from the Anilam Crusader 2
>>> system that was on my big mill. Shouldn't have been too difficult since a
>>> cable went from the keyboard to another small board with a matrix to RS232C
>>> chip. Would have mostly been figuring out the pinout of the header on the
>>> adapter board then setting up a text editor to take input from a COM port,
>>> then poking every button to see what characters it sent.
>>>
>>>
>>>   From: Erik Friesen <e...@aercon.net>
>>>  To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) <emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net>
>>>  Sent: Tuesday, October 11, 2016 6:59 AM
>>>  Subject: [Emc-users] Haas thoughts
>>>
>>> Are any of these items valid any more?
>>>
>>> http://blog.cnccookbook.com/2014/12/16/10-features-pros-hobb
>>> y-cnc-controllers-dont/
>>>
>>> What would it take (software wise) to fully integrate a haas keypad so
>>> that
>>> most of the functions would be usable?  The ones I see as a challenge are
>>> items like Posit, Offset, and all the edit functions.
>>>
>>> Reference keypad http://aercon.net/Public/HaasKeyboard.jpg
>>>
>>>
>>> 
>>> --
>>> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
>>> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
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>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>>>
>>
>>
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Peter Wallace
Mesa Electronics

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Re: [Emc-users] Haas thoughts

2016-10-12 Thread Gene Heskett 
On Wednesday 12 October 2016 07:35:22 Erik Friesen wrote:

> It uses an atmel chip.  However, that isn't the hangup to me.  I see
> context switching as a real challenge.  So you hit the edit button,
> then what?  Open gedit?  I'd really like to limit GUI excursions and
> control the whole thing closer than that.

You mentioned gedit, which gets my attention.  That "thing" has scrambled 
a file for me for the very last time. I don't even install it on a fresh 
install, but nano to avoid remote x problems, and geany for a gedit-like 
editor that has yet to record or miss-record, usually because I am 
typing on a membrane covered keyboard and don't hit the key hard enough.

When I started to make TLM work with a 5i25 card because software 
stepping wasn't fast enough, I had to nuke the .ini and .hal files and 
start from scratch with a fresh run of stepperconf in the first month 
while I was adding this and that to complete the working config.
About every 9 or 10 times I called up gedit to fix a typu, I would fine 
the files was scrambled by picking up a kilobyte of it and randomly 
inserting it 2 or 3 other places in the file, with the start of the 
insert being mid-line of the inserted section, and inserted mid-line 
where it was inserted.

Save yourself such potential gcodeing headaches by making the default 
editor geany in the axis.ini file. IMO gedit is a TTD, a Textually 
Transmitted Disease.

> On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 11:16 PM, Gregg Eshelman <g_ala...@yahoo.com> 
wrote:
> > Look on the back of the keyboard for microchips, or on a board that
> > the keyboard connects to. Google the numbers to see what they are.
> >
> > I'd thought about hoking up the keyboard from the Anilam Crusader 2
> > system that was on my big mill. Shouldn't have been too difficult
> > since a cable went from the keyboard to another small board with a
> > matrix to RS232C chip. Would have mostly been figuring out the
> > pinout of the header on the adapter board then setting up a text
> > editor to take input from a COM port, then poking every button to
> > see what characters it sent.
> >
> >
> >   From: Erik Friesen <e...@aercon.net>
> >  To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > <emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net> Sent: Tuesday, October 11, 2016
> > 6:59 AM
> >  Subject: [Emc-users] Haas thoughts
> >
> > Are any of these items valid any more?
> >
> > http://blog.cnccookbook.com/2014/12/16/10-features-pros-
> > hobby-cnc-controllers-dont/
> >
> > What would it take (software wise) to fully integrate a haas keypad
> > so that most of the functions would be usable?  The ones I see as a
> > challenge are items like Posit, Offset, and all the edit functions.
> >
> > Reference keypad http://aercon.net/Public/HaasKeyboard.jpg

I could only see one advantage there, the keypad itself is innately 
swarf-proof unless its still hot enough to burn the plastic. Chromerics 
keyboards are rated 10 million presses per key, but is that a 
Chromerics? The cheap ones can fail in 5000  or less presses.  And the 
layout is a bad dream for a true typist. I ran screaming to refill my 
coffee cup which was caught empty.

I could, if I was using canned code, but I write 95+% of what I run, 
eventually get used to that layout, but I am now used to the std 
computer keyboard.

Que that comment and old dogs and new tricks.  Fits me and my muscle 
memory well. And I am not, in your wildest dreams, a touch typist.

My $0.02 but adjust for 82 years of inflation. {O_o}

Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>

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Re: [Emc-users] Haas thoughts

2016-10-12 Thread Erik Friesen 
Does or doesn't LCNC support softdmc?

Correct me if I am wrong here, but my calcs are these.

 I can't find a pole count for the Yaskawa servo motors, but I assume they
are 8 poles.  Encoder counts are 32768 per rev, 6mm ballscrews.

So at 700IPM, that is 50 Rounds per second, encoders right at 1.6mhz

50 RPS * 8 Poles = 400 Motor cycles per second.

400 MCPS * 32?? = 12800hz needed servo period?  This seems a bit out of
reach of being handled in software, and I am not sure that 32 steps would
be enough.

On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 7:35 AM, Erik Friesen <e...@aercon.net> wrote:

> It uses an atmel chip.  However, that isn't the hangup to me.  I see
> context switching as a real challenge.  So you hit the edit button, then
> what?  Open gedit?  I'd really like to limit GUI excursions and control the
> whole thing closer than that.
>
> On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 11:16 PM, Gregg Eshelman <g_ala...@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Look on the back of the keyboard for microchips, or on a board that the
>> keyboard connects to. Google the numbers to see what they are.
>>
>> I'd thought about hoking up the keyboard from the Anilam Crusader 2
>> system that was on my big mill. Shouldn't have been too difficult since a
>> cable went from the keyboard to another small board with a matrix to RS232C
>> chip. Would have mostly been figuring out the pinout of the header on the
>> adapter board then setting up a text editor to take input from a COM port,
>> then poking every button to see what characters it sent.
>>
>>
>>   From: Erik Friesen <e...@aercon.net>
>>  To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) <emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net>
>>  Sent: Tuesday, October 11, 2016 6:59 AM
>>  Subject: [Emc-users] Haas thoughts
>>
>> Are any of these items valid any more?
>>
>> http://blog.cnccookbook.com/2014/12/16/10-features-pros-hobb
>> y-cnc-controllers-dont/
>>
>> What would it take (software wise) to fully integrate a haas keypad so
>> that
>> most of the functions would be usable?  The ones I see as a challenge are
>> items like Posit, Offset, and all the edit functions.
>>
>> Reference keypad http://aercon.net/Public/HaasKeyboard.jpg
>>
>>
>> 
>> --
>> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
>> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
>> ___
>> Emc-users mailing list
>> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>>
>
>
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Re: [Emc-users] Haas thoughts

2016-10-12 Thread Erik Friesen 
It uses an atmel chip.  However, that isn't the hangup to me.  I see
context switching as a real challenge.  So you hit the edit button, then
what?  Open gedit?  I'd really like to limit GUI excursions and control the
whole thing closer than that.

On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 11:16 PM, Gregg Eshelman <g_ala...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> Look on the back of the keyboard for microchips, or on a board that the
> keyboard connects to. Google the numbers to see what they are.
>
> I'd thought about hoking up the keyboard from the Anilam Crusader 2 system
> that was on my big mill. Shouldn't have been too difficult since a cable
> went from the keyboard to another small board with a matrix to RS232C chip.
> Would have mostly been figuring out the pinout of the header on the adapter
> board then setting up a text editor to take input from a COM port, then
> poking every button to see what characters it sent.
>
>
>   From: Erik Friesen <e...@aercon.net>
>  To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) <emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net>
>  Sent: Tuesday, October 11, 2016 6:59 AM
>  Subject: [Emc-users] Haas thoughts
>
> Are any of these items valid any more?
>
> http://blog.cnccookbook.com/2014/12/16/10-features-pros-
> hobby-cnc-controllers-dont/
>
> What would it take (software wise) to fully integrate a haas keypad so that
> most of the functions would be usable?  The ones I see as a challenge are
> items like Posit, Offset, and all the edit functions.
>
> Reference keypad http://aercon.net/Public/HaasKeyboard.jpg
>
>
> 
> --
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> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
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Re: [Emc-users] Haas thoughts

2016-10-11 Thread Gregg Eshelman 
Look on the back of the keyboard for microchips, or on a board that the 
keyboard connects to. Google the numbers to see what they are.

I'd thought about hoking up the keyboard from the Anilam Crusader 2 system that 
was on my big mill. Shouldn't have been too difficult since a cable went from 
the keyboard to another small board with a matrix to RS232C chip. Would have 
mostly been figuring out the pinout of the header on the adapter board then 
setting up a text editor to take input from a COM port, then poking every 
button to see what characters it sent.

 
  From: Erik Friesen <e...@aercon.net>
 To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) <emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net> 
 Sent: Tuesday, October 11, 2016 6:59 AM
 Subject: [Emc-users] Haas thoughts
   
Are any of these items valid any more?

http://blog.cnccookbook.com/2014/12/16/10-features-pros-hobby-cnc-controllers-dont/

What would it take (software wise) to fully integrate a haas keypad so that
most of the functions would be usable?  The ones I see as a challenge are
items like Posit, Offset, and all the edit functions.

Reference keypad http://aercon.net/Public/HaasKeyboard.jpg
   
 
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Re: [Emc-users] Haas thoughts

2016-10-11 Thread Peter C. Wallace 

On Tue, 11 Oct 2016, Erik Friesen wrote:


Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2016 19:06:33 -0400
From: Erik Friesen <e...@aercon.net>
Reply-To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)"
<emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net>
To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)" <emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net>
Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Haas thoughts

So how does the drive know how much pwm to give the motors?  Or that

depends on the a and b levels in that case?

Yes, normally these set the three phase angle and current

The controller that outputs these signals must of course get its 
reference (rotor) phase angle from an encoder of some type (hall effect/ 
absolute encoder/resolver/ quadrature encoder + simulated hall etc etc)



On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 6:56 PM, Erik Friesen <e...@aercon.net> wrote:


That is the pinout between the control and the drive.  The drive doesn't
have any direct encoder input.

On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 6:33 PM, andy pugh <bodge...@gmail.com> wrote:


On 11 October 2016 at 23:24, Erik Friesen <e...@aercon.net> wrote:
> omehow these amps have to figure power and
> location for the bldc phase,

Is that the pinout between the motors and the drive? Or is it the
control signal to the drive?

--
atp
"A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
lunatics."
?? George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1916


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Re: [Emc-users] Haas thoughts

2016-10-11 Thread Erik Friesen 
So how does the drive know how much pwm to give the motors?  Or that
depends on the a and b levels in that case?

On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 6:56 PM, Erik Friesen  wrote:

> That is the pinout between the control and the drive.  The drive doesn't
> have any direct encoder input.
>
> On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 6:33 PM, andy pugh  wrote:
>
>> On 11 October 2016 at 23:24, Erik Friesen  wrote:
>> > omehow these amps have to figure power and
>> > location for the bldc phase,
>>
>> Is that the pinout between the motors and the drive? Or is it the
>> control signal to the drive?
>>
>> --
>> atp
>> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
>> designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
>> lunatics."
>> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1916
>>
>> 
>> --
>> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
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Re: [Emc-users] Haas thoughts

2016-10-11 Thread Erik Friesen 
That is the pinout between the control and the drive.  The drive doesn't
have any direct encoder input.

On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 6:33 PM, andy pugh  wrote:

> On 11 October 2016 at 23:24, Erik Friesen  wrote:
> > omehow these amps have to figure power and
> > location for the bldc phase,
>
> Is that the pinout between the motors and the drive? Or is it the
> control signal to the drive?
>
> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> lunatics."
> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1916
>
> 
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Re: [Emc-users] Haas thoughts

2016-10-11 Thread Peter C. Wallace 
On Tue, 11 Oct 2016, Erik Friesen wrote:

> Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2016 18:24:36 -0400
> From: Erik Friesen <e...@aercon.net>
> Reply-To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)"
> <emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net>
> To: Greg Bentzinger <skullwo...@yahoo.com>,
> "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)" <emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net>
> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Haas thoughts
> 
> The pinout coming from the brushless amps is
>
> 610-1 +A CHANNEL
> 610-2 ANALOG GROUND
> 610-3 +B CHANNEL
> 610-4 ANALOG GROUND
> 610-5 ENABLE
> 610-6 LOGIC GROUND
> 610-7 FAULT
> 610-8 LOGIC GROUND
> 610-9 NOT USED
> 610-10 SHIELD/ANALOG GROUND

That looks very similar to the drive signals for AMCs analog input AC servo 
drives: 2 phase analog sine wave drive (phase C is just the difference between 
A and B so synthesized in the drive)


>
> Any ideas what signal levels and types those will be?  The encoders feed
> through the mocon pcb, so somehow these amps have to figure power and
> location for the bldc phase, and I don't see how that is accomplished.
>
> On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 3:29 PM, Erik Friesen <e...@aercon.net> wrote:
>
>> My haas is a 1996 and it shows.  Attempting 0.1" engraving at 40ipm G187
>> E.001 doesn't work, and I think it is a control limitation.  See two paths
>> in this pic?  aercon.net/Public/Engraving.jpg  The top is attempted at 40
>> IPM, the bottom at 15.  To me it looks like a trajectory planning
>> limitation.
>>
>> The only person to attempt a haas vf conversion never finished it.
>>
>> On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 3:03 PM, Greg Bentzinger <skullwo...@yahoo.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Perspective on anything read on cnccookbook.com
>>>
>>> Keep in mind that site exists to promote his software and his articles
>>> are written by someone who does not have long term (if any) experience with
>>> "Big Iron" in an industrial business environment.
>>>
>>> His opinions are biased towards the hobby/semi-pro market as that is the
>>> best he knows. Some info offers keen insights, while others are plain
>>> wrong. His software can be helpful if you are willing to make a windows PC
>>> with internet connection available to employees on the floor. ( Network
>>> connection is required so software can phone home to validate your
>>> subscription license.)
>>>
>>> Personally I use the other (competitor) option which has a Buy once cry
>>> once license option and is cross platform so it will run on my Android
>>> phone as well as PC.
>>>
>>> I know there are a very large group who loves the HAAS control, I
>>> however, after having to try and keep 8 lathes and 3 mills running and knew
>>> my Haas repair crew better than any other vendor, so I'm definitely not one
>>> of those fan boys. I like toggle switches and rotary knobs I can see status
>>> from 10m or yrds away. Plus tapping a membrane key to increment up or down
>>> a feed rate or spindle speed seems just wrong on a full sized machine.
>>> (Desktop mini router - I can see running just a kyb and E-Stop.)
>>>
>>>
>>> Not sure if Mesa's SSerial card for pendants could do that. There is
>>> definitely money to be made if some enterprising person or company were to
>>> make a plug in adapter harness for Haas and FADAL control consoles.
>>>
>>> Greg Bentzinger out yonder in Colorado
>>>
>>> 
>>> --
>>> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
>>> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
>>> ___
>>> Emc-users mailing list
>>> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>>>
>>
>>
> --
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> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
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Peter Wallace
Mesa Electronics

(\__/)
(='.'=) This is Bunny. Copy and paste bunny into your
(")_(") signature to help him gain world domination.


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Re: [Emc-users] Haas thoughts

2016-10-11 Thread andy pugh 
On 11 October 2016 at 23:24, Erik Friesen  wrote:
> omehow these amps have to figure power and
> location for the bldc phase,

Is that the pinout between the motors and the drive? Or is it the
control signal to the drive?

-- 
atp
"A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
lunatics."
— George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1916

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Re: [Emc-users] Haas thoughts

2016-10-11 Thread Erik Friesen 
The pinout coming from the brushless amps is

610-1 +A CHANNEL
610-2 ANALOG GROUND
610-3 +B CHANNEL
610-4 ANALOG GROUND
610-5 ENABLE
610-6 LOGIC GROUND
610-7 FAULT
610-8 LOGIC GROUND
610-9 NOT USED
610-10 SHIELD/ANALOG GROUND

Any ideas what signal levels and types those will be?  The encoders feed
through the mocon pcb, so somehow these amps have to figure power and
location for the bldc phase, and I don't see how that is accomplished.

On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 3:29 PM, Erik Friesen  wrote:

> My haas is a 1996 and it shows.  Attempting 0.1" engraving at 40ipm G187
> E.001 doesn't work, and I think it is a control limitation.  See two paths
> in this pic?  aercon.net/Public/Engraving.jpg  The top is attempted at 40
> IPM, the bottom at 15.  To me it looks like a trajectory planning
> limitation.
>
> The only person to attempt a haas vf conversion never finished it.
>
> On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 3:03 PM, Greg Bentzinger 
> wrote:
>
>> Perspective on anything read on cnccookbook.com
>>
>> Keep in mind that site exists to promote his software and his articles
>> are written by someone who does not have long term (if any) experience with
>> "Big Iron" in an industrial business environment.
>>
>> His opinions are biased towards the hobby/semi-pro market as that is the
>> best he knows. Some info offers keen insights, while others are plain
>> wrong. His software can be helpful if you are willing to make a windows PC
>> with internet connection available to employees on the floor. ( Network
>> connection is required so software can phone home to validate your
>> subscription license.)
>>
>> Personally I use the other (competitor) option which has a Buy once cry
>> once license option and is cross platform so it will run on my Android
>> phone as well as PC.
>>
>> I know there are a very large group who loves the HAAS control, I
>> however, after having to try and keep 8 lathes and 3 mills running and knew
>> my Haas repair crew better than any other vendor, so I'm definitely not one
>> of those fan boys. I like toggle switches and rotary knobs I can see status
>> from 10m or yrds away. Plus tapping a membrane key to increment up or down
>> a feed rate or spindle speed seems just wrong on a full sized machine.
>> (Desktop mini router - I can see running just a kyb and E-Stop.)
>>
>>
>> Not sure if Mesa's SSerial card for pendants could do that. There is
>> definitely money to be made if some enterprising person or company were to
>> make a plug in adapter harness for Haas and FADAL control consoles.
>>
>> Greg Bentzinger out yonder in Colorado
>>
>> 
>> --
>> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
>> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
>> ___
>> Emc-users mailing list
>> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>>
>
>
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Re: [Emc-users] Haas thoughts

2016-10-11 Thread Erik Friesen 
My haas is a 1996 and it shows.  Attempting 0.1" engraving at 40ipm G187
E.001 doesn't work, and I think it is a control limitation.  See two paths
in this pic?  aercon.net/Public/Engraving.jpg  The top is attempted at 40
IPM, the bottom at 15.  To me it looks like a trajectory planning
limitation.

The only person to attempt a haas vf conversion never finished it.

On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 3:03 PM, Greg Bentzinger 
wrote:

> Perspective on anything read on cnccookbook.com
>
> Keep in mind that site exists to promote his software and his articles are
> written by someone who does not have long term (if any) experience with
> "Big Iron" in an industrial business environment.
>
> His opinions are biased towards the hobby/semi-pro market as that is the
> best he knows. Some info offers keen insights, while others are plain
> wrong. His software can be helpful if you are willing to make a windows PC
> with internet connection available to employees on the floor. ( Network
> connection is required so software can phone home to validate your
> subscription license.)
>
> Personally I use the other (competitor) option which has a Buy once cry
> once license option and is cross platform so it will run on my Android
> phone as well as PC.
>
> I know there are a very large group who loves the HAAS control, I however,
> after having to try and keep 8 lathes and 3 mills running and knew my Haas
> repair crew better than any other vendor, so I'm definitely not one of
> those fan boys. I like toggle switches and rotary knobs I can see status
> from 10m or yrds away. Plus tapping a membrane key to increment up or down
> a feed rate or spindle speed seems just wrong on a full sized machine.
> (Desktop mini router - I can see running just a kyb and E-Stop.)
>
>
> Not sure if Mesa's SSerial card for pendants could do that. There is
> definitely money to be made if some enterprising person or company were to
> make a plug in adapter harness for Haas and FADAL control consoles.
>
> Greg Bentzinger out yonder in Colorado
>
> 
> --
> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
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Re: [Emc-users] Haas thoughts

2016-10-11 Thread Greg Bentzinger 
Perspective on anything read on cnccookbook.com

Keep in mind that site exists to promote his software and his articles are 
written by someone who does not have long term (if any) experience with "Big 
Iron" in an industrial business environment.

His opinions are biased towards the hobby/semi-pro market as that is the best 
he knows. Some info offers keen insights, while others are plain wrong. His 
software can be helpful if you are willing to make a windows PC with internet 
connection available to employees on the floor. ( Network connection is 
required so software can phone home to validate your subscription license.)

Personally I use the other (competitor) option which has a Buy once cry once 
license option and is cross platform so it will run on my Android phone as well 
as PC.

I know there are a very large group who loves the HAAS control, I however, 
after having to try and keep 8 lathes and 3 mills running and knew my Haas 
repair crew better than any other vendor, so I'm definitely not one of those 
fan boys. I like toggle switches and rotary knobs I can see status from 10m or 
yrds away. Plus tapping a membrane key to increment up or down a feed rate or 
spindle speed seems just wrong on a full sized machine. (Desktop mini router - 
I can see running just a kyb and E-Stop.)


Not sure if Mesa's SSerial card for pendants could do that. There is definitely 
money to be made if some enterprising person or company were to make a plug in 
adapter harness for Haas and FADAL control consoles.

Greg Bentzinger out yonder in Colorado

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Re: [Emc-users] Haas thoughts

2016-10-11 Thread Todd Zuercher 
I would have said it was more incorrect and misleading than out of date.

And the fellows claim of DNC as being a "feature" is laughable.  I work with 
Fanuc controls all day, DNC isn't a "feature" it is a band-aid work-around for 
the controls limited memory, and a huge pain in the ass to have to work around 
to.  Did you know many of Fanuc's custom macros features don't work in DNC or 
that you can't run a sub program unless either it or the main program are 
stored in the machine memory.  The list of Fanuc DNC limitations goes on and 
on.  The only thing more annoying then trying to use the DNC, is trying to 
load/unload programs into the machine memory all the time. 

And tool compensation isn't any easier to use or more or less functional in 
Fanuc than it is in Linuxcnc. As far as I know all the same rules need (or 
should) be followed.

And code compatibility is also a joke. Our shop has 3 different Fanuc control 
models (11m, 21i, and oi-MB) in the shop on 7 machines from 4 different 
manufacturers, and the code for each manufacturer's machines are incompatible 
with all the others.  There are some basic similarities, but for the most part 
the code I run on our Linuxcnc machines is no more different from the code for 
one of our Fanuc controlled machines than our Fanuc controlled machines are 
from each other.  


- Original Message -
From: "Dave Caroline" <dave.thearchiv...@gmail.com>
To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)" <emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net>
Sent: Tuesday, October 11, 2016 9:33:11 AM
Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Haas thoughts

That is very out of date, LinuxCNC having branching etc in the gcode
as well as rigid tapping, read the docs for real info not random
websites

Dave Caroline

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Re: [Emc-users] Haas thoughts

2016-10-11 Thread sam sokolik 
If you look at the comments - Seb counters almost all of his points ;)

sam

On 10/11/2016 8:33 AM, Dave Caroline wrote:
> That is very out of date, LinuxCNC having branching etc in the gcode
> as well as rigid tapping, read the docs for real info not random
> websites
>
> Dave Caroline
>
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>


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Re: [Emc-users] Haas thoughts

2016-10-11 Thread Dave Caroline 
That is very out of date, LinuxCNC having branching etc in the gcode
as well as rigid tapping, read the docs for real info not random
websites

Dave Caroline

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[Emc-users] Haas thoughts

2016-10-11 Thread Erik Friesen 
Are any of these items valid any more?

http://blog.cnccookbook.com/2014/12/16/10-features-pros-hobby-cnc-controllers-dont/

What would it take (software wise) to fully integrate a haas keypad so that
most of the functions would be usable?  The ones I see as a challenge are
items like Posit, Offset, and all the edit functions.

Reference keypad http://aercon.net/Public/HaasKeyboard.jpg
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