[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, peterklutz peterklutz@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, peterklutz peterklutz@ wrote: [snip] http://nuclearweaponarchive.org/News/Lebedbomb.html And the relevance of this to Israel's position on Iran's nuclear capabilities is what, exactly? The relevance is to your un-informed, biased, wish-full, a-naivite-that-will-get-everyone-killed position. Actually that was Steve Clemons's position (you know, the post I quoted from that you weren't able to comment on and snipped). Lady, who are you kiddin..? Oh, did I miss all your comments on the Clemons quote? I didn't see any. :-) A hundred nuclear suitcases on the loose (at least); an Iran that is threatning the extinction of another state whilst purportedly not yet having the Bomb. And this is why we should bomb Iran's nuclear facilities, to keep Iran from obtaining and using one of these nuclear suitcases that's floating around? I'm not sure how that would work, exactly. In fact, I should think it might *inspire* Iran to get hold of a few nuclear suitcases. Or are you advocating wiping the country out entirely? Just how many countries would you like to wipe out in order to feel safe from nuclear suitcases? Remember, we'd probably need to get rid of Great Britain and a whole lot of other nations where terrorists are known to live. You're a fuckin' nutcase. Why bother to reply to people's postings when you don't bother readoing what they say? Translation: She nailed me. But I'll pretend otherwise, 'cause I ain't got no answer. Are you this stupid or is this some sort of game your playing..? Funny, I was going to ask the same of you. You were not. Well, yeah, I was, actually. You sure haven't said anything sensible *yet*. This thread no longer serves a menaningful purpose. Walk in peace.. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with hope and healing http://us.click.yahoo.com/lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/UlWolB/TM ~- To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, peterklutz [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, peterklutz peterklutz@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Gillam jpgillam@ wrote: snip Apparently one big reason the U.S. is coming down so hard on Iran is that if we don't do it, Israel will, and then the world of Islam will *really* be pissed. Except that I've been reading that Israel doesn't think Iran is that much of a threat to it. Where did you read that - Al Jazeera dot com? Uh, no, a post by Steve Clemons on TPM Cafe. See some quotes and a link at the end of this post. Not sure why you'd think that would be an Al Jazeera position. Seems to me the Al Jazeera position would be exactly the opposite. The context was criticism of the administration's fear-mongering, as opposed to Israel's purportedly more sensible perspective. That Israel is likely to attack Iran, so we need to do it first, is a talking point of Bush's supporters, so of course it has been given great prominence in the mainstream media. On 7 September 1997, the CBS newsmagazine Sixty Minutes broadcast an alarming story in which former Russian National Security Adviser Aleksandr Lebed claimed that the Russian military had lost track of more than 100 suitcase-sized nuclear bombs, any one of which could kill up to 100,000 people. http://nuclearweaponarchive.org/News/Lebedbomb.html And the relevance of this to Israel's position on Iran's nuclear capabilities is what, exactly? The relevance is to your un-informed, biased, wish-full, a-naivite-that-will-get-everyone-killed position. Actually that was Steve Clemons's position (you know, the post I quoted from that you weren't able to comment on and snipped). A hundred nuclear suitcases on the loose (at least); an Iran that is threatning the extinction of another state whilst purportedly not yet having the Bomb. And this is why we should bomb Iran's nuclear facilities, to keep Iran from obtaining and using one of these nuclear suitcases that's floating around? I'm not sure how that would work, exactly. In fact, I should think it might *inspire* Iran to get hold of a few nuclear suitcases. Or are you advocating wiping the country out entirely? Just how many countries would you like to wipe out in order to feel safe from nuclear suitcases? Remember, we'd probably need to get rid of Great Britain and a whole lot of other nations where terrorists are known to live. Are you this stupid or is this some sort of game your playing..? Funny, I was going to ask the same of you. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, peterklutz [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, peterklutz peterklutz@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Gillam jpgillam@ wrote: snip Apparently one big reason the U.S. is coming down so hard on Iran is that if we don't do it, Israel will, and then the world of Islam will *really* be pissed. Except that I've been reading that Israel doesn't think Iran is that much of a threat to it. Where did you read that - Al Jazeera dot com? Uh, no, a post by Steve Clemons on TPM Cafe. See some quotes and a link at the end of this post. Not sure why you'd think that would be an Al Jazeera position. Seems to me the Al Jazeera position would be exactly the opposite. The context was criticism of the administration's fear-mongering, as opposed to Israel's purportedly more sensible perspective. That Israel is likely to attack Iran, so we need to do it first, is a talking point of Bush's supporters, so of course it has been given great prominence in the mainstream media. On 7 September 1997, the CBS newsmagazine Sixty Minutes broadcast an alarming story in which former Russian National Security Adviser Aleksandr Lebed claimed that the Russian military had lost track of more than 100 suitcase-sized nuclear bombs, any one of which could kill up to 100,000 people. http://nuclearweaponarchive.org/News/Lebedbomb.html And the relevance of this to Israel's position on Iran's nuclear capabilities is what, exactly? The relevance is to your un-informed, biased, wish-full, a-naivite-that-will-get-everyone-killed position. A hundred nuclear suitcases on the loose (at least); an Iran that is threatning the extinction of another state whilst purportedly not yet having the Bomb. Are you this stupid or is this some sort of game your playing..? Just as well the missing suitcase bombs are a myth, the USSR did have some portable nuclear devices but they were all accounted for when dismantled at the end of the cold war. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [...] Based on working with him directly for fourteen years, and on watching his predictions and proclamations in the decades since then, I would probably bet anything -- much less the world -- that if Maharishi says that X is true, it isn't. 14 years working with him directly... Let's see, that would mean that you were working for the TMO at the highest levels from 19xx to 19xx+14. Just when did you learn TM and when did you become part of the inner circle and when did you leave? To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, peterklutz peterklutz@ wrote: [snip] http://nuclearweaponarchive.org/News/Lebedbomb.html And the relevance of this to Israel's position on Iran's nuclear capabilities is what, exactly? The relevance is to your un-informed, biased, wish-full, a-naivite-that-will-get-everyone-killed position. Actually that was Steve Clemons's position (you know, the post I quoted from that you weren't able to comment on and snipped). Lady, who are you kiddin..? :-) A hundred nuclear suitcases on the loose (at least); an Iran that is threatning the extinction of another state whilst purportedly not yet having the Bomb. And this is why we should bomb Iran's nuclear facilities, to keep Iran from obtaining and using one of these nuclear suitcases that's floating around? I'm not sure how that would work, exactly. In fact, I should think it might *inspire* Iran to get hold of a few nuclear suitcases. Or are you advocating wiping the country out entirely? Just how many countries would you like to wipe out in order to feel safe from nuclear suitcases? Remember, we'd probably need to get rid of Great Britain and a whole lot of other nations where terrorists are known to live. You're a fuckin' nutcase. Why bother to reply to people's postings when you don't bother readoing what they say? Are you this stupid or is this some sort of game your playing..? Funny, I was going to ask the same of you. You were not. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, peterklutz [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, peterklutz peterklutz@ wrote: [snip] http://nuclearweaponarchive.org/News/Lebedbomb.html And the relevance of this to Israel's position on Iran's nuclear capabilities is what, exactly? The relevance is to your un-informed, biased, wish-full, a-naivite-that-will-get-everyone-killed position. Actually that was Steve Clemons's position (you know, the post I quoted from that you weren't able to comment on and snipped). Lady, who are you kiddin..? Oh, did I miss all your comments on the Clemons quote? I didn't see any. :-) A hundred nuclear suitcases on the loose (at least); an Iran that is threatning the extinction of another state whilst purportedly not yet having the Bomb. And this is why we should bomb Iran's nuclear facilities, to keep Iran from obtaining and using one of these nuclear suitcases that's floating around? I'm not sure how that would work, exactly. In fact, I should think it might *inspire* Iran to get hold of a few nuclear suitcases. Or are you advocating wiping the country out entirely? Just how many countries would you like to wipe out in order to feel safe from nuclear suitcases? Remember, we'd probably need to get rid of Great Britain and a whole lot of other nations where terrorists are known to live. You're a fuckin' nutcase. Why bother to reply to people's postings when you don't bother readoing what they say? Translation: She nailed me. But I'll pretend otherwise, 'cause I ain't got no answer. Are you this stupid or is this some sort of game your playing..? Funny, I was going to ask the same of you. You were not. Well, yeah, I was, actually. You sure haven't said anything sensible *yet*. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Gillam [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- shempmcgurk wrote: The DL's turn the other cheek philosophy of non-violence led to a horrible bit of ultra-violence, as Little Alex would say, didn't it? It's as if the Dalai Lama recognized that his people could not really be killed. That life cannot really be taken. Like what some spiritual masters would have us believe. Or, speaking practically, as if Tibet didn't have a chance standing up against China, so why embrace the karma of killing? Both, I think. Plus, he knew that Tibet had almost no army with which to defend itself from one of the largest armies on the planet, and no resources with which to develop, arm, and train one. He *asked* for help -- very vocally -- from almost all the nations he thought might be interested in helping his nation stand up to the Chinese. All of them, including America, ignored his pleas completely. China had been trying to take over Tibet for many years. The Dalai Lama we are speaking about is the Fourteenth, but the Chinese tried to invade Tibet back in the reign of the Sixth Dalai Lama, and actually assassinated him. It was an inevitability that if China really wanted Tibet, they could have it at any time they wanted. Another factor to consider at that time was the importance placed in Tibetan society on prophecy and the ability of the State Oracle to see the future accurately. The Oracle in this case saw the end of Tibet as its people had known it, and no possibility of stopping it. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with hope and healing http://us.click.yahoo.com/lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/UlWolB/TM ~- To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
You have heard that it was said, An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth. But I say to you, Do not resist one who is evil. But if any one strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also; and if any one would sue you and take your coat, let him have your cloak as well; and if any one forces you to go one mile, go with him two miles. Matthew 5.38-41 He doesn't say anything about letting yourself be truely harmed either. Cheek slaps, clothes and a little extra exercise might not mean what everyone thinks it does... Hey, I like that interpretation. Forbearance and forgiveness only apply to slapping, the taking of clothing and forced marches of one mile. In all other slights, Christians are free to kick ass. Oh yeah, and to crucifiction. Jesus asked forgiveness of those who crucified him. Otherwise, somebody messes with you, put him down. LOL. Wonderful exchange, Patrick. Anyone can interpret scripture any way they want to. But the bottom line of almost all such interpretations is that it enables people to say, See...God/Jesus/Mohammed/Krishna/Buddha/ whatever *ssid* that what *I* do is correct...so there! Christians *re*interpret Christ because it's fuckin' *inconvenient* to live life the way he said it should be lived. Hindus *re*interpret their scriptures because it's fuckin' *inconvenient* to live the way they say live should be lived. Bunch of wimps, if you ask me. :-) To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You have heard that it was said, An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth. But I say to you, Do not resist one who is evil. But if any one strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also; and if any one would sue you and take your coat, let him have your cloak as well; and if any one forces you to go one mile, go with him two miles. Matthew 5.38-41 He doesn't say anything about letting yourself be truely harmed either. Cheek slaps, clothes and a little extra exercise might not mean what everyone thinks it does... Hey, I like that interpretation. Forbearance and forgiveness only apply to slapping, the taking of clothing and forced marches of one mile. In all other slights, Christians are free to kick ass. Oh yeah, and to crucifiction. Jesus asked forgiveness of those who crucified him. Otherwise, somebody messes with you, put him down. LOL. Wonderful exchange, Patrick. Anyone can interpret scripture any way they want to. But the bottom line of almost all such interpretations is that it enables people to say, See...God/Jesus/Mohammed/Krishna/Buddha/ whatever *ssid* that what *I* do is correct...so there! Christians *re*interpret Christ because it's fuckin' *inconvenient* to live life the way he said it should be lived. Hindus *re*interpret their scriptures because it's fuckin' *inconvenient* to live the way they say live should be lived. Bunch of wimps, if you ask me. :-) Yeah, but those muslims are hanging in there: kill the infidel. Inconvenient, but scriptural. (of course some intellectual wimp ass whiners will say Mohommed meant infidels to refer to local enemies, not not muslims.) Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with hope and healing http://us.click.yahoo.com/lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/UlWolB/TM ~- To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies - correction
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Gillam [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- Gillam wrote: Jesus asked forgiveness of those who crucified him. Should read, Jesus asked his Father to forgive the crucifiers. Of course, that may have been a specific instance, and not universally applicable. Jesus could be fickle. Actually I was thinking about a story that Charlie told. It may have been after he was stabbed. (I talked to him 3 days afterwords). Asking Maharishi if he should defend himself if attacked or 'turn the other cheek'. Maharishi's comment was defend yourself. And the other thing was from the Course in Miracles about the difference between forgivness on the level of content and action on the level of form. Forgive in the heart and act natually on the level of form. BTW, if that was an attack, I'll just turn the other check, it's only email after all :-) JohnY To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Gillam [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- jyouells2000 wrote: You have heard that it was said, An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth. But I say to you, Do not resist one who is evil. But if any one strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also; and if any one would sue you and take your coat, let him have your cloak as well; and if any one forces you to go one mile, go with him two miles. Matthew 5.38-41 He doesn't say anything about letting yourself be truely harmed either. Cheek slaps, clothes and a little extra exercise might not mean what everyone thinks it does... Hey, I like that interpretation. Forbearance and forgiveness only apply to slapping, the taking of clothing and forced marches of one mile. In all other slights, Christians are free to kick ass. Oh yeah, and to crucifiction. Jesus asked forgiveness of those who crucified him. Otherwise, somebody messes with you, put him down. Hey, I thought it was funny... To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies - correction
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jyouells2000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Gillam jpgillam@ wrote: --- Gillam wrote: Jesus asked forgiveness of those who crucified him. Should read, Jesus asked his Father to forgive the crucifiers. Of course, that may have been a specific instance, and not universally applicable. Jesus could be fickle. Actually I was thinking about a story that Charlie told. It may have been after he was stabbed. (I talked to him 3 days afterwords). Asking Maharishi if he should defend himself if attacked or 'turn the other cheek'. Maharishi's comment was defend yourself. Jesus, MMY, Jesus, MMY... hmmm its a tough call. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Gillam [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: A key ally with an important voice in the debate is Israel, whose leadership has warned for years that it viewed any attempt by Iran to begin enriching uranium as a point of no return. I was told by several officials that the White House's interest in preventing an Israeli attack on a Muslim country, which would provoke a backlash across the region, was a factor in its decision to begin the current operational planning. In a speech in Cleveland on March 20th, President Bush depicted Ahmadinejad's hostility toward Israel as a serious threat. It's a threat to world peace. He added, I made it clear, I'll make it clear again, that we will use military might to protect our ally Israel. See http://tinyurl.com/hyfsf The hypocrisy here makes me vomit, as if Israel are doing anyhting to help world peace! There treatment of the palestinians is one of the worst human rights abuses happening on earth. And Bush has given them support in annexing even more land on the west bank thus guaranteeing endless war. The question is, would attacking Iran cause more trouble than letting them have the Bomb? This whole situation will be a good test of MMY prediction that we are on the brink of world peace due to the new pundit project. I like predictions as they either come true, or they don't... Anyone care to lay a bet on the outcome? Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with hope and healing http://us.click.yahoo.com/lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/UlWolB/TM ~- To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, hugheshugo [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Gillam jpgillam@ wrote: A key ally with an important voice in the debate is Israel, whose leadership has warned for years that it viewed any attempt by Iran to begin enriching uranium as a point of no return. I was told by several officials that the White House's interest in preventing an Israeli attack on a Muslim country, which would provoke a backlash across the region, was a factor in its decision to begin the current operational planning. In a speech in Cleveland on March 20th, President Bush depicted Ahmadinejad's hostility toward Israel as a serious threat. It's a threat to world peace. He added, I made it clear, I'll make it clear again, that we will use military might to protect our ally Israel. See http://tinyurl.com/hyfsf The hypocrisy here makes me vomit, as if Israel are doing anyhting to help world peace! There treatment of the palestinians is one of the worst human rights abuses happening on earth. And Bush has given them support in annexing even more land on the west bank thus guaranteeing endless war. The question is, would attacking Iran cause more trouble than letting them have the Bomb? This whole situation will be a good test of MMY prediction that we are on the brink of world peace due to the new pundit project. I like predictions as they either come true, or they don't... Anyone care to lay a bet on the outcome? Nope, but only a madman wants the pundit project to be a failure... Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with hope and healing http://us.click.yahoo.com/lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/UlWolB/TM ~- To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, hugheshugo richardhughes103@ wrote: Anyone care to lay a bet on the outcome? Nope, but only a madman wants the pundit project to be a failure... Absolutely, looks like we'll have to wait and see... To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, hugheshugo [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig sparaig@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, hugheshugo richardhughes103@ wrote: Anyone care to lay a bet on the outcome? Nope, but only a madman wants the pundit project to be a failure... Absolutely, looks like we'll have to wait and see... I have to back up one step and challenge the thought-stopper, Only a madman wants the pundit project to be a failure. I don't agree with that statement. I *fervently* hope that it's a failure, and is perceived as one as soon as possible. My reasons for thinking this way are that I have never seen *any* indications that a bunch of pundits chanting, no matter how many of them there are, can affect the conditions of life for anyone on this planet. And yet, the TMO continues to piss away millions and millions and millions of dollars on projects that *claim* to be producing more and more of these pundits. So far, very little can be shown to have resulted from all of this money spent. The TMO can't produce very many of the actual pundits themselves, and they can't produce any research that says that the ones who do exist have changed diddleysquat in the world since they've been chanting. So it's a very *pragmatic* and *practical* thing on my part to hope that EITHER 1) proof of the pundit's effectiveness is forthcoming, and soon, OR 2) the pundit project is recognized as the dismal failure it is, and the money that is being pissed away on it is diverted to more productive ends, such as helping more people to learn TM. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, hugheshugo richardhughes103@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig sparaig@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, hugheshugo richardhughes103@ wrote: Anyone care to lay a bet on the outcome? Nope, but only a madman wants the pundit project to be a failure... Absolutely, looks like we'll have to wait and see... I have to back up one step and challenge the thought-stopper, Only a madman wants the pundit project to be a failure. I don't agree with that statement. I *fervently* hope that it's a failure, and is perceived as one as soon as possible. My reasons for thinking this way are that I have never seen *any* indications that a bunch of pundits chanting, no matter how many of them there are, can affect the conditions of life for anyone on this planet. Just because you fail to experience or cognize a correlation does not mean there isn't one. Are you willing to bet the world on that you are right and other people, such as HH MMY, is wrong in their cognizing and experiencing? To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, hugheshugo [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Gillam jpgillam@ wrote: A key ally with an important voice in the debate is Israel, whose leadership has warned for years that it viewed any attempt by Iran to begin enriching uranium as a point of no return. I was told by several officials that the White House's interest in preventing an Israeli attack on a Muslim country, which would provoke a backlash across the region, was a factor in its decision to begin the current operational planning. In a speech in Cleveland on March 20th, President Bush depicted Ahmadinejad's hostility toward Israel as a serious threat. It's a threat to world peace. He added, I made it clear, I'll make it clear again, that we will use military might to protect our ally Israel. See http://tinyurl.com/hyfsf The hypocrisy here makes me vomit, as if Israel are doing anyhting to help world peace! There treatment of the palestinians is one of the worst human rights abuses happening on earth. And Bush has given them support in annexing even more land on the west bank thus guaranteeing endless war. The question is, would attacking Iran cause more trouble than letting them have the Bomb? This whole situation will be a good test of MMY prediction that we are on the brink of world peace due to the new pundit project. I like predictions as they either come true, or they don't... Anyone care to lay a bet on the outcome? Yeah, you'll be proven wrong in all your mindless babbling about Israel. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Gillam jpgillam@ wrote: --- sparaig wrote: --- peterklutz wrote: President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad in a recent statement: The Zionist regime is a rotten, dried tree that will be eliminated by one storm. Israel should beable to withstand any conventional attack, but at what cost? No-one survives a nuclear exchange unscathed. Apparently one big reason the U.S. is coming down so hard on Iran is that if we don't do it, Israel will, and then the world of Islam will *really* be pissed. Except that I've been reading that Israel doesn't think Iran is that much of a threat to it. Where did you read that - Al Jazeera dot com? On 7 September 1997, the CBS newsmagazine Sixty Minutes broadcast an alarming story in which former Russian National Security Adviser Aleksandr Lebed claimed that the Russian military had lost track of more than 100 suitcase-sized nuclear bombs, any one of which could kill up to 100,000 people. http://nuclearweaponarchive.org/News/Lebedbomb.html To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, peterklutz [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, hugheshugo richardhughes103@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig sparaig@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, hugheshugo richardhughes103@ wrote: Anyone care to lay a bet on the outcome? Nope, but only a madman wants the pundit project to be a failure... Absolutely, looks like we'll have to wait and see... I have to back up one step and challenge the thought-stopper, Only a madman wants the pundit project to be a failure. I don't agree with that statement. I *fervently* hope that it's a failure, and is perceived as one as soon as possible. My reasons for thinking this way are that I have never seen *any* indications that a bunch of pundits chanting, no matter how many of them there are, can affect the conditions of life for anyone on this planet. Just because you fail to experience or cognize a correlation does not mean there isn't one. Are you willing to bet the world on that you are right and other people, such as HH MMY, is wrong in their cognizing and experiencing? Based on working with him directly for fourteen years, and on watching his predictions and proclamations in the decades since then, I would probably bet anything -- much less the world -- that if Maharishi says that X is true, it isn't. He just doesn't have a very good track record when it comes to seeing. In fact, he has a rather *dismal* record...very *little* of what he has predicted or pronounced over the years has ever come to pass. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with hope and healing http://us.click.yahoo.com/lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/UlWolB/TM ~- To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, peterklutz peterklutz@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, hugheshugo richardhughes103@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig sparaig@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, hugheshugo richardhughes103@ wrote: Anyone care to lay a bet on the outcome? Nope, but only a madman wants the pundit project to be a failure... Absolutely, looks like we'll have to wait and see... I have to back up one step and challenge the thought-stopper, Only a madman wants the pundit project to be a failure. I don't agree with that statement. I *fervently* hope that it's a failure, and is perceived as one as soon as possible. My reasons for thinking this way are that I have never seen *any* indications that a bunch of pundits chanting, no matter how many of them there are, can affect the conditions of life for anyone on this planet. Just because you fail to experience or cognize a correlation does not mean there isn't one. Are you willing to bet the world on that you are right and other people, such as HH MMY, is wrong in their cognizing and experiencing? Based on working with him directly for fourteen years, and on watching his predictions and proclamations in the decades since then, I would probably bet anything -- much less the world -- that if Maharishi says that X is true, it isn't. He just doesn't have a very good track record when it comes to seeing. In fact, he has a rather *dismal* record...very *little* of what he has predicted or pronounced over the years has ever come to pass. You may believe this or not, but there are people out there who probably understands the work of the TMO better than any the whining 'insiders' that seem to populate this list. I dare say so since what you are questioning here does not appear to be the succesful application of something but its applicability in the first place. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
In a message dated 4/15/06 1:03:43 A.M. Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: the ability of the State Oracle to "see" thefuture accurately. The Oracle in this case "saw"the end of Tibet as its people had known it, andno possibility of stopping it. Al Gore. America's state Oracle. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' SPONSORED LINKS Maharishi university of management Maharishi mahesh yogi Ramana maharshi YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "FairfieldLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
On Apr 14, 2006, at 7:52 PM, authfriend wrote: (I can hear Barry revving his engines now.) You just *can't* let it go, can you? If you can hear Barry revving his engines in your imagination before the poor guy has even said anything, you need to get a life. Have ever considered aversion therapy? To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, peterklutz [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Gillam jpgillam@ wrote: snip Apparently one big reason the U.S. is coming down so hard on Iran is that if we don't do it, Israel will, and then the world of Islam will *really* be pissed. Except that I've been reading that Israel doesn't think Iran is that much of a threat to it. Where did you read that - Al Jazeera dot com? Uh, no, a post by Steve Clemons on TPM Cafe. See some quotes and a link at the end of this post. Not sure why you'd think that would be an Al Jazeera position. Seems to me the Al Jazeera position would be exactly the opposite. The context was criticism of the administration's fear-mongering, as opposed to Israel's purportedly more sensible perspective. That Israel is likely to attack Iran, so we need to do it first, is a talking point of Bush's supporters, so of course it has been given great prominence in the mainstream media. On 7 September 1997, the CBS newsmagazine Sixty Minutes broadcast an alarming story in which former Russian National Security Adviser Aleksandr Lebed claimed that the Russian military had lost track of more than 100 suitcase-sized nuclear bombs, any one of which could kill up to 100,000 people. http://nuclearweaponarchive.org/News/Lebedbomb.html And the relevance of this to Israel's position on Iran's nuclear capabilities is what, exactly? From Clemons's post, titled U.S. War Planners Should Listen to Israel Regarding Iran: As I stated on Christopher Lydon's NPR show, Radio Open Source, tonight -- one of the take-aways from my recent Israel trip is that Israeli national security bureaucrats -- diplomats and generals -- have far greater confidence that there are numerous potential solutions to the growing Iran crisis short of bombing them in an invasive, hot attack. One of the issues that came up in many of the national security related discussions I had was that Israel has maintained and cultivated a very strong human intelligence network inside Iran. The two nations were close strategic allies 25 years ago -- and continue, in many behind-the-scenes ways, to communicate and possibly even to coordinate certain actions. It doesn't mean that Israel is ready to appease Iran's regional ambitions, but it does mean that I have witnessed far more worries about Iranian President Ahmadinejad's anti- Holocaust and anti-Israel rhetoric in the U.S. than I did in Tel Aviv or Jerusalem. Many serious Iran watchers in Israel think that chances are relatively high that internal developments will emerge in Iran to constrain Ahmadinejad's political options and political life Yes, those putting war plans together for Iran think carefully. We have botched so much already; don't repeat errors. And in this case, TALK TO THE ISRAELIS -- the ones responsible for national security there. I found their sensibilities on Iran to be remarkably well informed, nuanced, confident, and sensible. Nearly everyone I spoke to in Israel who ranged in political sympathies from the Likud right to Maretz left thought that the tone of the AIPAC conference had been too shrill and that Israel thought it wrong-headed and too impulsive to be engaged in saber-rattling with Iran at this stage. In the past, I've been occasionally critical of Israeli influence over U.S. decisionmakers when I felt that American and Israeli national security interests were not as convergent in some respective case as some argued. However, in this instance on Iran, Israel's national security thinkers and diplomats are on the side of logic -- and it is in American national interests to hear the Israeli position and consider the roots of their surprising position. Steven Clemons is Senior Fellow and Director of the American Strategy Program at the New America Foundation and publishes the popular political blog, The Washington Note. http://www.tpmcafe.com/node/28567 Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with hope and healing http://us.click.yahoo.com/lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/UlWolB/TM ~- To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Apr 14, 2006, at 7:52 PM, authfriend wrote: (I can hear Barry revving his engines now.) You just *can't* let it go, can you? If you can hear Barry revving his engines in your imagination before the poor guy has even said anything, you need to get a life. Ah, yes, poor Barry. As it happens, Barry was revving his engines about my views on a different topic, as we've seen all too clearly this morning. This only a few days after his latest public vow to ignore me (after the earlier one had collapsed in a matter of a few weeks). But I'll *guarantee* you that if someone had quoted my comment to which I was referring and Barry had seen it, he'd have posted a rant about it. Now, if I were Barry and you were me, I'd claim you were attempting to distract attention from Barry's racist parallel attempting to cast the Israelites as terrorists. But of course you would never do anything like that, would you? Have ever considered aversion therapy? Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with hope and healing http://us.click.yahoo.com/lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/UlWolB/TM ~- To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies - correction
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Gillam [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- jyouells2000 wrote: And the other thing was from the Course in Miracles about the difference between forgivness on the level of content and action on the level of form. Forgive in the heart and act natually on the level of form. Can you elaborate? Seems to me that forgiveness in the heart will have a profound influence on what actions ensue. BTW, if that was an attack, I'll just turn the other check, it's only email after all :-) It wasn't meant as an attack, but I admit it was aggressive humor. Thanks for your forbearance. Seems to me that forgiveness in the heart will have a profound influence on what actions ensue. Yup, but not necessarly Ghandi-like non-violence in a personal defense situation, is what I was clumsily trying to convey. And as far as the subtle interpretation of re-re-re-re translated scripture, I think that's taken far too literally. And that's what I was trying to show as well. Take the recent stir about the 'Gospel of Judas' - lots more than we thought we knew. And TorquoiseB, as far as the caste system - strongly against it. I think there are more chances for it's distortion for control purposes than even our flawed system. Think Vedic Surf ... u JohnY To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
On Apr 15, 2006, at 10:34 AM, authfriend wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Apr 14, 2006, at 7:52 PM, authfriend wrote: (I can hear Barry revving his engines now.) You just *can't* let it go, can you? If you can hear Barry revving his engines in your imagination before the poor guy has even said anything, you need to get a life. Ah, yes, poor Barry. As it happens, Barry was revving his engines about my views on a different topic, as we've seen all too clearly this morning. This only a few days after his latest public vow to ignore me (after the earlier one had collapsed in a matter of a few weeks). But I'll *guarantee* you that if someone had quoted my comment to which I was referring and Barry had seen it, he'd have posted a rant about it. Now, if I were Barry and you were me, I'd claim you were attempting to distract attention from Barry's racist parallel attempting to cast the Israelites as terrorists. But of course you would never do anything like that, would you? Considering I had not read any those posts, it's rather unlikely. If you're not pleased with Barry's performance in ignoring you, why don't you see if you can counter that with a longer period of non- response to his posts? Or try aversion therapy. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 4/14/06 6:28:35 P.M. Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Ok. I see your initial question and this response as basically a nit- pick regarding my original post. No big deal- we'll see what happens soon enough... Nit Pick? You may see it that way, but I saw a serious allegation of the United States providing arms, including chemical weapons, to Saddam, to use against Iran, which was not true or at least not proven to be true. The only thing Saddam got from the United States of real military value was Satellite intelligence. Russia and France have provided the overwhelming majority of Saddam's military weaponry. But if anybody has any real proof, documented proof, that the US supplied Iraq with Gas or chemical weapon, I'll be happy to read it. Fair enough, but the real issue I was addressing was a poster's contention that we had been turning the other cheek with regard to Iran, which has NOT been the case... Funny how that was overlooked. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with hope and healing http://us.click.yahoo.com/lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/UlWolB/TM ~- To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, peterklutz peterklutz@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Gillam jpgillam@ wrote: snip Apparently one big reason the U.S. is coming down so hard on Iran is that if we don't do it, Israel will, and then the world of Islam will *really* be pissed. Except that I've been reading that Israel doesn't think Iran is that much of a threat to it. Where did you read that - Al Jazeera dot com? Uh, no, a post by Steve Clemons on TPM Cafe. See some quotes and a link at the end of this post. Not sure why you'd think that would be an Al Jazeera position. Seems to me the Al Jazeera position would be exactly the opposite. The context was criticism of the administration's fear-mongering, as opposed to Israel's purportedly more sensible perspective. That Israel is likely to attack Iran, so we need to do it first, is a talking point of Bush's supporters, so of course it has been given great prominence in the mainstream media. On 7 September 1997, the CBS newsmagazine Sixty Minutes broadcast an alarming story in which former Russian National Security Adviser Aleksandr Lebed claimed that the Russian military had lost track of more than 100 suitcase-sized nuclear bombs, any one of which could kill up to 100,000 people. http://nuclearweaponarchive.org/News/Lebedbomb.html And the relevance of this to Israel's position on Iran's nuclear capabilities is what, exactly? The relevance is to your un-informed, biased, wish-full, a-naivite-that-will-get-everyone-killed position. A hundred nuclear suitcases on the loose (at least); an Iran that is threatning the extinction of another state whilst purportedly not yet having the Bomb. Are you this stupid or is this some sort of game your playing..? To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Gillam [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Is it just me, or does anyone else perceive Passover as an act of terrorism? It commemorates the slaughter of Egyptian children as a means to persuade Pharaoh to make a political decision. Fascinating, because the first known use of the words 'terrorism' and 'terrorist' in the English press were to describe that actions of Jewish militants in Palestine, planting bombs to force the UN vote that created Israel. Historic deja vu, and all that... To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Gillam [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Is it just me, or does anyone else perceive Passover as an act of terrorism? It commemorates the slaughter of Egyptian children as a means to persuade Pharaoh to make a political decision. Fascinating, because the first known use of the words 'terrorism' and 'terrorist' in the English press were to describe that actions of Jewish militants in Palestine, planting bombs to force the UN vote that created Israel. Historic deja vu, and all that... To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Gillam [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Is it just me, or does anyone else perceive Passover as an act of terrorism? It commemorates the slaughter of Egyptian children as a means to persuade Pharaoh to make a political decision. No, but thank you for reminding all the Mad Mullahs out there who might be lurking this site. Perhaps the only way for the West to stand up to Islamist violence and still preserve the values of the West is to embrace Christ's teaching to turn the other cheek. Otherwise, the terrorists win. This has already been tried, by the US since the Iranian revolution. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
The US turned the other cheek? When did this happen? I must have missed it. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, peterklutz [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Gillam jpgillam@ wrote: Is it just me, or does anyone else perceive Passover as an act of terrorism? It commemorates the slaughter of Egyptian children as a means to persuade Pharaoh to make a political decision. No, but thank you for reminding all the Mad Mullahs out there who might be lurking this site. Perhaps the only way for the West to stand up to Islamist violence and still preserve the values of the West is to embrace Christ's teaching to turn the other cheek. Otherwise, the terrorists win. This has already been tried, by the US since the Iranian revolution. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, peterklutz [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Gillam jpgillam@ wrote: Is it just me, or does anyone else perceive Passover as an act of terrorism? It commemorates the slaughter of Egyptian children as a means to persuade Pharaoh to make a political decision. No, but thank you for reminding all the Mad Mullahs out there who might be lurking this site. Perhaps the only way for the West to stand up to Islamist violence and still preserve the values of the West is to embrace Christ's teaching to turn the other cheek. Otherwise, the terrorists win. This has already been tried, by the US since the Iranian revolution. So before the Iranian revolution, a CIA fomented coup overthrew the legitimately elected president of Iran, and installed the Shah, who's CIA trained secret police SAVAK had a fearsome and well- deserved reputation among the populace, equaling anything Saddam H. dished out. Then after the Iranian revolution, we cozied up to Saddam and gave him whatever he wanted militarily, including poison gas, to use against Iran. Now, the US military is engaged in covert ops within Iran to destabilize the country. (not the CIA this time-- would've required that pesky Congressional oversight and approval, something Rummy figured out a way around...) Y'know, I just can't for the life of me figure out why they hate our f'ing guts. Can you? To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
I would be interested to know what the slain first born son does symbolize if you can remember. Ego? mind or intellect? Seems like we are living out an entirely symbolic play, doesn't it - with the same symbolism repeated on just about every level of existence. . --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The Kabbalistic interpretation of the Exodus story is actually the story of the soul in bondage (Mizraim, the Hebrew word for Egypt means bondage)--and thus the journey is the expansion of soul till eventual union with God (on Mt. Sinai). The bondage is left behind when they cross the Red Sea, which is actually the soul attaining a higher level of existence till the vision of God face-to-face. I forget what the actual symbolism of the slain first-born is supposed to signify, but it's much deeper than terrorism. On Apr 14, 2006, at 2:00 PM, Patrick Gillam wrote: Is it just me, or does anyone else perceive Passover as an act of terrorism? It commemorates the slaughter of Egyptian children as a means to persuade Pharaoh to make a political decision. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
In a message dated 4/14/06 1:11:55 P.M. Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Perhaps the only way for the West to stand up to Islamist violence and still preserve the values of the West is to embrace Christ's teaching to turn the other cheek. Otherwise, the terrorists win. This has already been tried, by the US since the Iranian revolution. Didn't the Dalai Lama turn the other cheek? Might have done something for him personally but what did it do to Tibet? To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' SPONSORED LINKS Maharishi university of management Maharishi mahesh yogi Ramana maharshi YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "FairfieldLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
In a message dated 4/14/06 1:58:33 P.M. Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Then after the Iranian revolution, we cozied up to Saddam and gave him whatever he wanted militarily, including poison gas, to use against Iran. Please, go into detail on this. I like the whatever he wanted militarily, including poison gas part best. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "FairfieldLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, feste37 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The US turned the other cheek? When did this happen? I must have missed it. We didn't nuke 'em. We're about to correct that error, it seems. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, peterklutz peterklutz@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Gillam jpgillam@ wrote: Is it just me, or does anyone else perceive Passover as an act of terrorism? It commemorates the slaughter of Egyptian children as a means to persuade Pharaoh to make a political decision. No, but thank you for reminding all the Mad Mullahs out there who might be lurking this site. Perhaps the only way for the West to stand up to Islamist violence and still preserve the values of the West is to embrace Christ's teaching to turn the other cheek. Otherwise, the terrorists win. This has already been tried, by the US since the Iranian revolution. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- authfriend wrote: The decision Pharaoh was being forced to make (by God, not by the Jews themselves, according to the Hebrew Scriptures) was to let the Israelites leave Egypt, where Pharaoh had held them in slavery and slaughtered all *their* firstborn male children, and subsequently all their male newborns. Not as efficient as Hitler's genocide, of course, but then that was a pre-technological age. And of course Passover does not commemorate the slaughter of Egyptian children, it commemorates God having saved the children of the Israelites from *being* slaughtered: the angel who was killing the Egyptian children *passed over* the children of the Israelites. This a more palatable story, to be sure. We were persecuted, but did not have to rise up and kill in our defense. Instead, God did our killing for us. Violence I can't abide I have no wish for genocide But if you wish to take my life Remember God is on my side To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shempmcgurk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, MDixon6569@ wrote: In a message dated 4/14/06 1:58:33 P.M. Central Daylight Time, jflanegi@ writes: Then after the Iranian revolution, we cozied up to Saddam and gave him whatever he wanted militarily, including poison gas, to use against Iran. Please, go into detail on this. I like the whatever he wanted militarily, including poison gas part best. Yes, I'd like to hear that one too! I've excerpted the info below from a George Washigton University website. The source material comes from declassified NSA documents. Although there is no direct evidence of the USA providing Iraq with chemical agents to use against Iran, we appear to be pretty friendly about it, or at best, talking out of both sides of our mouth. === From: http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB82/ Shaking Hands with Saddam Hussein: The U.S. Tilts toward Iraq, 1980-1984 National Security Archive Electronic Briefing Book No. 82 Edited by Joyce Battle February 25, 2003 9/22/80 Iraq invades Iran. 1983-The White House and State Department pressured the Export- Import Bank to provide Iraq with financing, to enhance its credit standing and enable it to obtain loans from other international financial institutions. 12/83 Rumsfeld as US special envoy visits Saddam in Baghdad. The U.S. restored formal relations with Iraq in November 1984, but the U.S. had begun, several years earlier, to provide it with intelligence and military support (in secret and contrary to this country's official neutrality) in accordance with policy directives from President Ronald Reagan. These were prepared pursuant to his March 1982 National Security Study Memorandum (NSSM 4-82) asking for a review of U.S. policy toward the Middle East. Although official U.S. policy still barred the export of U.S. military equipment to Iraq, some was evidently provided on a don't ask - don't tell basis. In April 1984, the Baghdad interests section asked to be kept apprised of Bell Helicopter Textron's negotiations to sell helicopters to Iraq, which were not to be in any way configured for military use. The purchaser was the Iraqi Ministry of Defense. In December 1982, Bell Textron's Italian subsidiary had informed the U.S. embassy in Rome that it turned down a request from Iraq to militarize recently purchased Hughes helicopters. An allied government, South Korea, informed the State Department that it had received a similar request in June 1983 (when a congressional aide asked in March 1983 whether heavy trucks recently sold to Iraq were intended for military purposes, a State Department official replied we presumed that this was Iraq's intention, and had not asked.) Iran had submitted a draft resolution asking the U.N. to condemn Iraq's chemical weapons use. The U.S. delegate to the U.N. was instructed to lobby friendly delegations in order to obtain a general motion of no decision on the resolution. If this was not achievable, the U.S. delegate was to abstain on the issue. Iraq's ambassador met with the U.S. ambassador to the U.N., Jeane Kirkpatrick, and asked for restraint in responding to the issue - as did the representatives of both France and Britain. 1988- Ceasefire signed between Iraq and Iran. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
In a message dated 4/14/06 3:38:25 P.M. Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: The decision Pharaoh was being forced to make (by God,not by the Jews themselves, according to the HebrewScriptures) was to let the Israelites leave Egypt,where Pharaoh had held them in slavery and slaughteredall *their* firstborn male children, and subsequentlyall their male newborns.Not as efficient as Hitler's genocide, of course, butthen that was a pre-technological age.And of course Passover does not commemorate the slaughter of Egyptian children, it commemorates Godhaving saved the children of the Israelites from*being* slaughtered: the angel who was killing theEgyptian children *passed over* the children of theIsraelites. Excellent example of karma. Pharaoh kills first born of Hebrew slaves and God kills first born of Egyptians. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "FairfieldLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
In a message dated 4/14/06 5:34:12 P.M. Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: In a message dated 4/14/06 1:58:33 P.M. Central Daylight Time, jflanegi@ writes:Then after the Iranian revolution, we cozied up to Saddam and gave him whatever he wanted militarily, including poison gas, to use against Iran. Please, go into detail on this. I like the whatever he wanted militarily, including poison gas part best. Yes, I'd like to hear that one too!I've excerpted the info below from a George Washigton University website. The source material comes from declassified NSA documents. Although there is no direct evidence of the USA providing Iraq with chemical agents to use against Iran, we appear to be pretty friendly about it, or at best, talking out of both sides of our mouth. === From: http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB82/Shaking Hands with Saddam Hussein:The U.S. Tilts toward Iraq, 1980-1984National Security Archive Electronic Briefing Book No. 82Edited by Joyce BattleFebruary 25, 20039/22/80 Iraq invades Iran.1983-The White House and State Department pressured the Export-Import Bank to provide Iraq with financing, to enhance its credit standing and enable it to obtain loans from other international financial institutions.12/83 Rumsfeld as US special envoy visits Saddam in Baghdad.The U.S. restored formal relations with Iraq in November 1984, but the U.S. had begun, several years earlier, to provide it with intelligence and military support (in secret and contrary to this country's official neutrality) in accordance with policy directives from President Ronald Reagan. These were prepared pursuant to his March 1982 National Security Study Memorandum (NSSM 4-82) asking for a review of U.S. policy toward the Middle East.Although official U.S. policy still barred the export of U.S. military equipment to Iraq, some was evidently provided on a "don't ask - don't tell" basis. In April 1984, the Baghdad interests section asked to be kept apprised of Bell Helicopter Textron's negotiations to sell helicopters to Iraq, which were not to be "in any way configured for military use". The purchaser was the Iraqi Ministry of Defense. In December 1982, Bell Textron's Italian subsidiary had informed the U.S. embassy in Rome that it turned down a request from Iraq to militarize recently purchased Hughes helicopters. An allied government, South Korea, informed the State Department that it had received a similar request in June 1983 (when a congressional aide asked in March 1983 whether heavy trucks recently sold to Iraq were intended for military purposes, a State Department official replied "we presumed that this was Iraq's intention, and had not asked.") Iran had submitted a draft resolution asking the U.N. to condemn Iraq's chemical weapons use. The U.S. delegate to the U.N. was instructed to lobby friendly delegations in order to obtain a general motion of "no decision" on the resolution. If this was not achievable, the U.S. delegate was to abstain on the issue. Iraq's ambassador met with the U.S. ambassador to the U.N., Jeane Kirkpatrick, and asked for "restraint" in responding to the issue - as did the representatives of both France and Britain.1988- Ceasefire signed between Iraq and Iran. I see nothing about the sale of military equipment, especially "whatever Saddam wanted", maybe some trucks and some helicopters that were not fitted with military equipment. I don't see anything about the sale of poison gases here, just a very vague innuendo at best.What we do know was given to Saddam was military intelligence about Iranian troop movements that maintained the status quo and kept one side form defeating the other. Those Iranians and Iraqis sure had to pump and sell a lot of oil to keep their little war going which kept OPEC prices down. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' SPONSORED LINKS Maharishi university of management Maharishi mahesh yogi Ramana maharshi YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "FairfieldLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
On Apr 14, 2006, at 3:54 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:In a message dated 4/14/06 1:11:55 P.M. Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Perhaps the only way for the West to stand up to Islamist violence and still preserve the values of the West is to embrace Christ's teaching to turn the other cheek. Otherwise, the terrorists win. This has already been tried, by the US since the Iranian revolution.Didn't the Dalai Lama turn the other cheek? Might have done something for him personally but what did it do to Tibet?Well no that's not what he did, that's a gross misrepresentation of what truly occurred. It's the kind misinformation that's common on the web.The truth of the matter is that "the Great Thirteenth", the current Dalai Lama in his last life, knew all about these eminent events. In fact not only did he know about it, he tried to do something about it. It was well known--and understand as "advisors" we are talking about someone who had numerous close associates who were in what you call Unity Consciousness. The fact that China would come pouring over their eastern border was known literally many decades before it occurred. Consequentially, the Great Thirteenth knew very well he had to do something in his lifetime or the force of karma would be irreversible. So he made a campaign of it and went to eastern Tibet and warned the populace of what was to come. He told the people flat out. He told them they not only had to recruit armies but they had to fortify the border. This was decades before the Chinese would come and which would not even occur in his lifetime (it occurred during the lifetime of his current incarnation, the 14th DL). The people well understood what needed to be done. But they refused. Do you know why they refused?In would have required an increase in taxes.By the time the same scenario was passed on to a spiritually mature but politically naive (and very young) 14th Dalai Lama, the forces were already in place and Tibet was utterly unprepared. Invasion and genocide followed as prophesied.However, consider the big picture. The high lamas of Tibet were spread like dandelion seeds across the earth. And thus another prophecy was fulfilled: When the iron bird flies and horses run on wheels, the dharma will spread to the land of the red-faced people. And so it has. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' SPONSORED LINKS Maharishi university of management Maharishi mahesh yogi Ramana maharshi YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "FairfieldLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 4/14/06 5:34:12 P.M. Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: In a message dated 4/14/06 1:58:33 P.M. Central Daylight Time, jflanegi@ writes: Then after the Iranian revolution, we cozied up to Saddam and gave him whatever he wanted militarily, including poison gas, to use against Iran. Please, go into detail on this. I like the whatever he wanted militarily, including poison gas part best. Yes, I'd like to hear that one too! I've excerpted the info below from a George Washigton University website. The source material comes from declassified NSA documents. Although there is no direct evidence of the USA providing Iraq with chemical agents to use against Iran, we appear to be pretty friendly about it, or at best, talking out of both sides of our mouth. === From: http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB82/ Shaking Hands with Saddam Hussein: The U.S. Tilts toward Iraq, 1980-1984 National Security Archive Electronic Briefing Book No. 82 Edited by Joyce Battle February 25, 2003 9/22/80 Iraq invades Iran. 1983-The White House and State Department pressured the Export- Import Bank to provide Iraq with financing, to enhance its credit standing and enable it to obtain loans from other international financial institutions. 12/83 Rumsfeld as US special envoy visits Saddam in Baghdad. The U.S. restored formal relations with Iraq in November 1984, but the U.S. had begun, several years earlier, to provide it with intelligence and military support (in secret and contrary to this country's official neutrality) in accordance with policy directives from President Ronald Reagan. These were prepared pursuant to his March 1982 National Security Study Memorandum (NSSM 4-82) asking for a review of U.S. policy toward the Middle East. Although official U.S. policy still barred the export of U.S. military equipment to Iraq, some was evidently provided on a don't ask - don't tell basis. In April 1984, the Baghdad interests section asked to be kept apprised of Bell Helicopter Textron's negotiations to sell helicopters to Iraq, which were not to be in any way configured for military use. The purchaser was the Iraqi Ministry of Defense. In December 1982, Bell Textron's Italian subsidiary had informed the U.S. embassy in Rome that it turned down a request from Iraq to militarize recently purchased Hughes helicopters. An allied government, South Korea, informed the State Department that it had received a similar request in June 1983 (when a congressional aide asked in March 1983 whether heavy trucks recently sold to Iraq were intended for military purposes, a State Department official replied we presumed that this was Iraq's intention, and had not asked.) Iran had submitted a draft resolution asking the U.N. to condemn Iraq's chemical weapons use. The U.S. delegate to the U.N. was instructed to lobby friendly delegations in order to obtain a general motion of no decision on the resolution. If this was not achievable, the U.S. delegate was to abstain on the issue. Iraq's ambassador met with the U.S. ambassador to the U.N., Jeane Kirkpatrick, and asked for restraint in responding to the issue - as did the representatives of both France and Britain. 1988- Ceasefire signed between Iraq and Iran. I see nothing about the sale of military equipment, especially whatever Saddam wanted, maybe some trucks and some helicopters that were not fitted with military equipment. I don't see anything about the sale of poison gases here, just a very vague innuendo at best. What we do know was given to Saddam was military intelligence about Iranian troop movements that maintained the status quo and kept one side form defeating the other. Those Iranians and Iraqis sure had to pump and sell a lot of oil to keep their little war going which kept OPEC prices down. Ok. I see your initial question and this response as basically a nit- pick regarding my original post. No big deal- we'll see what happens soon enough... Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with hope and healing http://us.click.yahoo.com/lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/UlWolB/TM ~- To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wayback71 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I would be interested to know what the slain first born son does symbolize if you can remember. Ego? mind or intellect? Seems like we are living out an entirely symbolic play, doesn't it - with the same symbolism repeated on just about every level of existence. Law of Fives: we create the patterns that we perceive. . --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj vajranatha@ wrote: The Kabbalistic interpretation of the Exodus story is actually the story of the soul in bondage (Mizraim, the Hebrew word for Egypt means bondage)--and thus the journey is the expansion of soul till eventual union with God (on Mt. Sinai). The bondage is left behind when they cross the Red Sea, which is actually the soul attaining a higher level of existence till the vision of God face-to-face. I forget what the actual symbolism of the slain first-born is supposed to signify, but it's much deeper than terrorism. On Apr 14, 2006, at 2:00 PM, Patrick Gillam wrote: Is it just me, or does anyone else perceive Passover as an act of terrorism? It commemorates the slaughter of Egyptian children as a means to persuade Pharaoh to make a political decision. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with hope and healing http://us.click.yahoo.com/lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/UlWolB/TM ~- To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
In a message dated 4/14/06 6:28:35 P.M. Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Ok. I see your initial question and this response as basically a nit-pick regarding my original post. No big deal- we'll see what happens soon enough... Nit Pick? You may see it that way, but I saw a serious allegation of the United Statesproviding arms, including chemical weapons, to Saddam, to use against Iran, which was not true or at least not proven to be true. The only thing Saddam got from the United States of real military value was Satellite intelligence. Russia and France have provided the overwhelming majority of Saddam's military weaponry. But if anybody has any real proof, documented proof, that the US supplied Iraq with Gas or chemical weapon, I'll be happy to read it. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "FairfieldLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Gillam [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- authfriend wrote: The decision Pharaoh was being forced to make (by God, not by the Jews themselves, according to the Hebrew Scriptures) was to let the Israelites leave Egypt, where Pharaoh had held them in slavery and slaughtered all *their* firstborn male children, and subsequently all their male newborns. Not as efficient as Hitler's genocide, of course, but then that was a pre-technological age. And of course Passover does not commemorate the slaughter of Egyptian children, it commemorates God having saved the children of the Israelites from *being* slaughtered: the angel who was killing the Egyptian children *passed over* the children of the Israelites. This a more palatable story, to be sure. We were persecuted, but did not have to rise up and kill in our defense. Instead, God did our killing for us. It's actually *the* story. Ain't no other story. (I can hear Barry revving his engines now.) Anything else is a story *about* the story. (Collective you, not personal you, Patrick, meant from here on.) Now if you want to make up a story about how it was really the Israelites who ran around killing Egyptian children, and that the bible story is a scam, fine, just make it clear that's what you're doing. Likewise if you want to dump on the God of the Hebrew Scriptures and declare that anyone who believes in such a cruel God is a terrible person--or just dump on the idea of God in general--fine, but again, make it clear that's what you're doing. But don't misrepresent the story itself. In the story, the Israelites weren't terrorists, they were being slaughtered themselves; and Jews today don't celebrate the slaughter of the Egyptian children, they celebrate their escape from bondage and attempted genocide. Violence I can't abide I have no wish for genocide But if you wish to take my life Remember God is on my side To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 4/14/06 1:58:33 P.M. Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Then after the Iranian revolution, we cozied up to Saddam and gave him whatever he wanted militarily, including poison gas, to use against Iran. Please, go into detail on this. I like the whatever he wanted militarily, including poison gas part best. When Saddam broke away from the USSR by attacking Iran (another Soviet Client State in the Middle East), he left an opportunity for the US to exert greater influence in the region, so we turned a blind eye to his use of WMDs and Congress changed the law to allow dual-use chemicals to be sold to him. The CIA even went so far as to claim that it was the Iranians who gassed the Kurds to keep Iraq off the shit-lists as a terrorist nation. We also made sure that he had access to soviet-compatible ammo from our allies. We sold him very few weapons directly because all of his stuff was soviet-made, but we made sure he had access to replacement parts and ammo. We even tried to get him to buy from Israel, but he refused. Later on, the Soviets realized their mistake and repaired relations with him. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with hope and healing http://us.click.yahoo.com/lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/UlWolB/TM ~- To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shempmcgurk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, MDixon6569@ wrote: In a message dated 4/14/06 1:11:55 P.M. Central Daylight Time, peterklutz@ writes: Perhaps the only way for the West to stand up to Islamist violence and still preserve the values of the West is to embrace Christ's teaching to turn the other cheek. Otherwise, the terrorists win. This has already been tried, by the US since the Iranian revolution. Didn't the Dalai Lama turn the other cheek? Might have done something for him personally but what did it do to Tibet? Precisely. The DL's turn the other cheek philosophy of non-violence led to a horrible bit of ultra-violence, as Little Alex would say, didn't it? If you check the original story by Jesus,the context was someone trying to *goad* you into violence. If a world leader such as the DL is intent upon being sweet and lovable but yet wants to prevent holocausts being visited upon his people, I would suggest he adopt that axiom that lovable American Teddy Bear gave us: Speak softly but carry a big stick. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with hope and healing http://us.click.yahoo.com/lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/UlWolB/TM ~- To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, MDixon6569@ wrote: In a message dated 4/14/06 1:58:33 P.M. Central Daylight Time, jflanegi@ writes: Then after the Iranian revolution, we cozied up to Saddam and gave him whatever he wanted militarily, including poison gas, to use against Iran. Please, go into detail on this. I like the whatever he wanted militarily, including poison gas part best. When Saddam broke away from the USSR by attacking Iran (another Soviet Client State in the Middle East), he left an opportunity for the US to exert greater influence in the region, so we turned a blind eye to his use of WMDs and Congress changed the law to allow dual-use chemicals to be sold to him. The CIA even went so far as to claim that it was the Iranians who gassed the Kurds to keep Iraq off the shit-lists as a terrorist nation. We also made sure that he had access to soviet-compatible ammo from our allies. We sold him very few weapons directly because all of his stuff was soviet-made, but we made sure he had access to replacement parts and ammo. We even tried to get him to buy from Israel, but he refused. Later on, the Soviets realized their mistake and repaired relations with him. ..which brings us to the first Guld War. A rarely mentioned hard fact about this war is that what was fought was a war between Soviet arms and tactics and US arms and tactics. If Moscow had any illusions about world domination having been lost, this was the final proof to them that their volontary disbanding of their social experiment was a true blessing. Unless something happens with Iran, they may become the next testing ground.. President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad in a recent statement: The Zionist regime is a rotten, dried tree that will be eliminated by one storm. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, peterklutz [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig sparaig@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, MDixon6569@ wrote: In a message dated 4/14/06 1:58:33 P.M. Central Daylight Time, jflanegi@ writes: Then after the Iranian revolution, we cozied up to Saddam and gave him whatever he wanted militarily, including poison gas, to use against Iran. Please, go into detail on this. I like the whatever he wanted militarily, including poison gas part best. When Saddam broke away from the USSR by attacking Iran (another Soviet Client State in the Middle East), he left an opportunity for the US to exert greater influence in the region, so we turned a blind eye to his use of WMDs and Congress changed the law to allow dual- use chemicals to be sold to him. The CIA even went so far as to claim that it was the Iranians who gassed the Kurds to keep Iraq off the shit-lists as a terrorist nation. We also made sure that he had access to soviet-compatible ammo from our allies. We sold him very few weapons directly because all of his stuff was soviet-made, but we made sure he had access to replacement parts and ammo. We even tried to get him to buy from Israel, but he refused. Later on, the Soviets realized their mistake and repaired relations with him. ..which brings us to the first Guld War. A rarely mentioned hard fact about this war is that what was fought was a war between Soviet arms and tactics and US arms and tactics. If Moscow had any illusions about world domination having been lost, this was the final proof to them that their volontary disbanding of their social experiment was a true blessing. Unless something happens with Iran, they may become the next testing ground.. President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad in a recent statement: The Zionist regime is a rotten, dried tree that will be eliminated by one storm. Israel should beable to withstand any conventional attack, but at what cost? No-one survives a nuclear exchange unscathed. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- authfriend wrote: Jews today don't celebrate the slaughter of the Egyptian children, they celebrate their escape from bondage and attempted genocide. Thanks. Point taken. And it's not as if Yahweh didn't escalate the pressure gradually, giving Pharaoh lots of chances to release the Jews before the Egyptian body count got very high. I guess I was just feeling sensitive. After the first Gulf War, Americans were reveling in our victory and the end of the conflict. My brother Steve couldn't join in the fun, though. He couldn't forget that some 100,000 Iraqis had been killed in a matter of days. But I can't expect the world to be as sensitive as my brother. And what did sensitivity do for him? He drank himself to death by age 48. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- sparaig wrote: If you check the original story by Jesus,the context was someone trying to *goad* you into violence. Um, I checked it and got this: You have heard that it was said, An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth. But I say to you, Do not resist one who is evil. But if any one strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also; and if any one would sue you and take your coat, let him have your cloak as well; and if any one forces you to go one mile, go with him two miles. Matthew 5.38-41 See similar teachings from other religions at http://tinyurl.com/n2ovc Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with hope and healing http://us.click.yahoo.com/lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/UlWolB/TM ~- To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- sparaig wrote: --- peterklutz wrote: President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad in a recent statement: The Zionist regime is a rotten, dried tree that will be eliminated by one storm. Israel should beable to withstand any conventional attack, but at what cost? No-one survives a nuclear exchange unscathed. Apparently one big reason the U.S. is coming down so hard on Iran is that if we don't do it, Israel will, and then the world of Islam will *really* be pissed. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with hope and healing http://us.click.yahoo.com/lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/UlWolB/TM ~- To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Gillam [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- authfriend wrote: Jews today don't celebrate the slaughter of the Egyptian children, they celebrate their escape from bondage and attempted genocide. Thanks. Point taken. And it's not as if Yahweh didn't escalate the pressure gradually, giving Pharaoh lots of chances to release the Jews before the Egyptian body count got very high. I guess I was just feeling sensitive. After the first Gulf War, Americans were reveling in our victory and the end of the conflict. My brother Steve couldn't join in the fun, though. He couldn't forget that some 100,000 Iraqis had been killed in a matter of days. But I can't expect the world to be as sensitive as my brother. And what did sensitivity do for him? He drank himself to death by age 48. I'm so sorry to hear it. What a curse war is. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Gillam [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- sparaig wrote: --- peterklutz wrote: President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad in a recent statement: The Zionist regime is a rotten, dried tree that will be eliminated by one storm. Israel should beable to withstand any conventional attack, but at what cost? No-one survives a nuclear exchange unscathed. Apparently one big reason the U.S. is coming down so hard on Iran is that if we don't do it, Israel will, and then the world of Islam will *really* be pissed. Except that I've been reading that Israel doesn't think Iran is that much of a threat to it. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Gillam [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- sparaig wrote: If you check the original story by Jesus,the context was someone trying to *goad* you into violence. Um, I checked it and got this: You have heard that it was said, An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth. But I say to you, Do not resist one who is evil. But if any one strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also; and if any one would sue you and take your coat, let him have your cloak as well; and if any one forces you to go one mile, go with him two miles. Matthew 5.38-41 See similar teachings from other religions at http://tinyurl.com/n2ovc He doesn't say anything about letting yourself be truely harmed either. Cheek slaps, clothes and a little extra exercise might not mean what everyone thinks it does... JohnY To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- jyouells2000 wrote: You have heard that it was said, An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth. But I say to you, Do not resist one who is evil. But if any one strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also; and if any one would sue you and take your coat, let him have your cloak as well; and if any one forces you to go one mile, go with him two miles. Matthew 5.38-41 He doesn't say anything about letting yourself be truely harmed either. Cheek slaps, clothes and a little extra exercise might not mean what everyone thinks it does... Hey, I like that interpretation. Forbearance and forgiveness only apply to slapping, the taking of clothing and forced marches of one mile. In all other slights, Christians are free to kick ass. Oh yeah, and to crucifiction. Jesus asked forgiveness of those who crucified him. Otherwise, somebody messes with you, put him down. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- authfriend wrote: --- Gillam wrote: Apparently one big reason the U.S. is coming down so hard on Iran is that if we don't do it, Israel will, and then the world of Islam will *really* be pissed. Except that I've been reading that Israel doesn't think Iran is that much of a threat to it. I got my impression from Seymour Hersch's article in this week's New Yorker. Two excerpts: Meir Dagan, the head of Mossad, Israel's intelligence agency, told the Knesset last December that Iran is one to two years away, at the latest, from having enriched uranium. From that point, the completion of their nuclear weapon is simply a technical matter. A key ally with an important voice in the debate is Israel, whose leadership has warned for years that it viewed any attempt by Iran to begin enriching uranium as a point of no return. I was told by several officials that the White House's interest in preventing an Israeli attack on a Muslim country, which would provoke a backlash across the region, was a factor in its decision to begin the current operational planning. In a speech in Cleveland on March 20th, President Bush depicted Ahmadinejad's hostility toward Israel as a serious threat. It's a threat to world peace. He added, I made it clear, I'll make it clear again, that we will use military might to protect our ally Israel. See http://tinyurl.com/hyfsf To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies - correction
--- Gillam wrote: Jesus asked forgiveness of those who crucified him. Should read, Jesus asked his Father to forgive the crucifiers. Of course, that may have been a specific instance, and not universally applicable. Jesus could be fickle. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Heresies
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Gillam [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- jyouells2000 wrote: You have heard that it was said, An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth. But I say to you, Do not resist one who is evil. But if any one strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also; and if any one would sue you and take your coat, let him have your cloak as well; and if any one forces you to go one mile, go with him two miles. Matthew 5.38-41 He doesn't say anything about letting yourself be truely harmed either. Cheek slaps, clothes and a little extra exercise might not mean what everyone thinks it does... Hey, I like that interpretation. Forbearance and forgiveness only apply to slapping, the taking of clothing and forced marches of one mile. In all other slights, Christians are free to kick ass. Oh yeah, and to crucifiction. Jesus asked forgiveness of those who crucified him. Otherwise, somebody messes with you, put him down. Yeah, now you got it. Because if we know one thing for sure, Jesus was totally litteral. No symbolism, no parables, no metaphors. What you hear is what you get. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with hope and healing http://us.click.yahoo.com/lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/UlWolB/TM ~- To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
