[Felvtalk] vet jet
Jut checked this out. It is made by Merial and is only for felv vaccine. Check out details on purevax.us.merial.com ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Please add Rosie to CLS
If only all people would neuter/spay their animals, the world would be much better and we would be spared the heartache of dealing with the deaths of our furbabies we have adopted. Can not understand why people refuse to do this and why they just dispose of the unwanted babies by throwing them out for someone else to care for or to be killed by a car or dog or coyote. Heather Clark wrote: > My heart aches for your loss. You gave Rosie, Murphy, and her brothers all > you could. They were safe, loved, and comfortable. Bless you for taking > such good care of them and knowing when to let them cross the bridge. You > will be in my thoughts and prayers. > > Sent from my Verizon Wireless Android > > On Mar 30, 2011 8:15 AM, "2nd Hotmail" wrote: > > It breaks my heart, immensely!!! I am so sorry for your loss! > > Sent from my iPhone > > > On Mar 29, 2011, at 8:09 PM, Alice Flowers > wrote: > > > Rosie passed last... > ___ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Cat Foof
You can also get a horse bedding from Tractor Supply for about the same price. It is corn based and also biodegradeable and cmpostable. . Katy Doyle wrote: > My animals love all of the Blue Buffalo flavors (cats and dog), I'm lucky > because mine are not picky eaters. However, they tend to throw up when they > eat other brands... I can't figure out why. So I've started by mixing Purina > Hairball with the Blue Buffalo to make it stretch longer. > > I'm also going to start to cook up some meat for them as a supplement. :-) > Buddy LOVES roast beef! Weird right? > > Cat litter, I go to Sam's (or Costco, depends on where you live) and get the > 50 lb bag of clay cat litter for $7 and mix it with the "nicer" clumping > litter. It still works great and it stretches the good stuff further. > I don't know anything about reverse mortgages, I just bought my first house > (I'm 23) about a hear ago. Having special needs cats is difficult when money > is tight and I'm just starting out on my own. > > --Katy > > > > On Tue, Mar 29, 2011 at 10:38 PM, wrote: > > > My pride is on Blue Buffalo "DUCK". For some reason, they do not like > > chicken no matter what brand of food. Occassionaly, I get them some > > Mackeral canned for humans and they love it, broth only. Why they don't eat > > the meat I don't know. It seems that the stronge the smell, the better they > > like it. Salmon also turns them off. Turkey is so so. Beef is also so so. > > Saw a food the other day that is buffalo meat, thought I might try it. Do > > know one thing, these healthy foods are breaking the bank. 7 cats go thru 2 > > bags a month (x $33.00 per bag. > > I have found a cheaper source of litter. They like World's Best which is > > made from corn. I can cut cost more by buying horse bedding made from > > coursely ground corn and corn cobs. Doesn't work too good with the > > scoopers, but does the job of stopping odor and clumps well enough. Things > > are getting tight, money wise and am going back to work at 70 as soon as I > > get a job of some kind. SS does not cut it when heating bills go up and > > insurance costs are added in. Has anyone had experience with reverse > > mortgagees? Been thinking about that. At least it would keep the cats and > > I in our home. > > Christiane Biagi wrote: > > > They aren't thrilled w. Turkey but LOVE that Sardines, Shrimp & Crab. We > > > rotate through the different "flavors" cause we wouldn't want the little > > > buggers to get bored with their food-LOL. They finally agreed to all eat > > > some Blue Buffalo Lite dry but it took a bit of doing. They're not > > spoiled > > > or anything! > > > > > > -Original Message- > > > From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org > > > [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Bonnie Hogue > > > Sent: Monday, March 28, 2011 11:25 PM > > > To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org > > > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Cat Foof > > > > > > My cats eat canned "Wellness" but only the salmon and turkey flavor. Go > > > figure. > > > They *Love* "Prarie" chicken dryed catfood. It's pretty good > > > nutrition-wise. And no, it's not made out of 'prarie chickens'... > > > ~Bonnie > > > - Original Message - > > > From: "Christiane Biagi" > > > To: > > > Sent: Monday, March 28, 2011 8:55 AM > > > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Cat Foof > > > > > > > > > > They can be fussy, can't they! LOL My brood eats wellness canned but > > > > when I tried wellness dry as supplement, they turned up their noses. > > > > Have a friend who had a cat that lived to her early 20's--wouldn't eat > > > > anything xcept 9-Lives (which is not the worst food in the world). > > > > > > > > -Original Message- > > > > From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org > > > > [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Jannes > > > > Taylor > > > > Sent: Monday, March 28, 2011 10:41 AM > > > > To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org > > > > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Cat Foof > > > > > > > > I have found that my cats, even Amber my felv cat does not care for > > > > the more "expensive/healthy" food. I fed her that at first and after > > > > she got past her starvation mode,(a time when she was grateful for > > > > anything to eat), she would not eat it as well. I switched to the Meow > > > > Mix shredded with gravy and they all love that. I tried feeding my > > > > other cats the "healthy stuff" as well and they tried to cover it up > > > > like it was a bowel movement..LOL. > > > > > > > > Amber will eat cooked chicken but my other cats won't eat anything but > > > > cat food. > > > > > > > > I aree with supplementing their junk food cat food with real meat if > > > > you can get them to eat it. I am feeding Amber the Fancy Feast brand > > > > as well, but it not really a "healthy" brand... It is not cheap in > > > > price though. > > > > > > > > Jannes > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From: MaiMai
Re: [Felvtalk] Fish for cats
Katy, I found out that some of my cats were allergc to corn, wheat or soy that is in all commercial foods. As soon as I started them on Blue Bufalo, the vomittng topped and the diahrrea almost dissappeared. I will stay with Blue Buffalo, better for them and cheaper than running to the vet trying to treat something caused by the food I feed. Katy Doyle wrote: > Oh wow, thanks for that heads up! > > Of my two cats, only one will eat fish product, Chloe. Buddy will not touch > the fishy stuff. > > --Katy > > On Tue, Mar 29, 2011 at 11:11 PM, wrote: > > > i HAVE ALSO HEARD THAT FISH IN THEIR FOOD CAN BE A POSSIBLE CAUSE OF > > URINARY TRACT PROBLEMS. My Homey was having problems and was not esponding > > to treatment. I got a Chinese herb thing from All Natural online and it did > > the trick. At the same time I read online about fish being a possible > > contributor to the problem and pulled the treats which were loaded with > > fish. So far, no more problems. > > Natalie wrote: > > > I have always wondered why cats like fish.it's not a natural food for > > them, > > > they don't fish... > > > > > > > > > > > > Tuna: > > > > > > Mindy Bough, veterinary technician for the ASPCA Pet Nutrition and > > Science > > > Advisory Service, dishes out the facts on this savory feline fave: > > > > > > "An occasional tuna treat for your cat is generally harmless," says > > Bough. > > > "However, if a large part of the cat's diet consists of tuna--or if the > > cat > > > is fed tuna exclusively--some problems are likely to arise." > > > > > > Tuna does not contain significant amounts of vitamin E, for example, so > > too > > > much of the fish can lead to vitamin E deficiency, resulting in yellow > > fat > > > disease, or steatitis. Symptoms include loss of appetite, fever and > > > hypersensitivity to touch, due to inflammation and necrosis of fat under > > the > > > skin. Felines who are fed too much tuna can develop other nutrient > > > deficiencies, too, because most de-boned fish are lacking in calcium, > > > sodium, iron, copper and several other vitamins. > > > > > > Mercury, frequently present in tuna, also presents a potential danger. > > "At > > > low levels, this may not be a concern," explains Bough, "but if tuna is > > fed > > > nearly exclusively, it could pose significant problems." > > > > > > The bottom line? "I recommend premium commercial food for domestic cats," > > > Bough says. "These foods are formulated to meet all of a cat's dietary > > > needs. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.provet.co.uk/petfacts/healthtips/rawfish.htm > > > > > > Many owners consider fish to be the staple diet of cats - and they > > believe > > > that it is beneficial to feed them an exclusively fish ration. > > > > > > Fish is a good raw ingredient to incorporate into cat foods, but it has > > > certain draw backs. Firstly it does not contain all the nutrients that a > > cat > > > requires and, like meat, it is deficient in calcium with an inverse > > > calcium:phosphorus ratio. Coley (or Saithe) a popular fish with cat > > owners > > > in the UK and the fillet cut contains 15-20 mg calcium per 100g but over > > 200 > > > mg phosphorus per 100g, a Ca:P ratio of 1:10. Cod and other white fish > > are > > > similar. > > > > > > If owners are feeding fish bones should be removed to avoid > > complications. > > > Fish should be cooked to avoid the possibility of disease transmission. > > > > > > "Salmon poisoning" has been recorded in cats which contracted the disease > > > caused by Neorickettsiae spp from eating raw salmon or trout. This > > disease > > > occurs within 2 weeks of the ingestion of infected food and causes the > > > following signs : > > > > > > * Depression > > > * Fever > > > * Lymphadenopathy - swelling of the lymph nodes > > > * Oculonasal discharge > > > * Haematemesis - vomiting blood > > > * Diarrhoea > > > * Death - 90% in untreated cases. > > > > > > Diagnosis is confirmed by finding trematode eggs in faeces samples, or > > > rickettsiae in lymph node samples. > > > > > > Clinical cases of thiamine deficiency are periodically seen by > > veterinarians > > > due to cats being fed fish - as commercially prepared canned food, or as > > > raw fish. Thiamin (vitamin B1) is an essential dietary nutrient for cats. > > > Processing can destroy thiamine in a food, and so reduce the initial > > > concentrations present at canning, and some fish (including herring and > > > carp) contain the thiaminase which will destroy thiamine. > > > > > > Clinical signs of thiamine deficiency include : > > > > > > * Anorexia > > > * Ataxia - 2-3 days later > > > * Vomiting > > > * Convulsions - short > > > * Dilation of the pupils > > > * Ventroflexion of the neck (Chastek's paralysis) > > > > > > Affected patients will die unless treatment is administered (100-250 mg > > > thiamine IV or SC twice daily). In most cases a complete reco
Re: [Felvtalk] Cat Foof
When I as about 6, I got ringworm from a stray kitten and the doctor gave my mother Gentian Violet to put on it. My hair fell out and came back in curlier than the rest of my hair. Natalie wrote: > I have never had ringworm, yet...but that stuff is very dangerous if > overused or not the right dosage. I've heard of kittens and cats dying, and > then the owners blamed the vet...can't tell whose fault it was. > > -Original Message- > From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org > [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Christiane Biagi > Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2011 4:41 PM > To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Cat Foof > > Ringworm can be tricky... Had a kitten who I brought up from a shelter who > had it. Not the worst thing in the world but untreated, it will spread & > harm cat. Vet gave me a liquid to apply & in a few weeks, it cleared up. > There's also a pill medicine that can be used but it does have a bit more > risk. Have a friend who has been using the generic people ringworm paste > for years & says it works fine--a lot cheaper than prescription. Are these > cats that you could apply a lotion on? If so, I can ask what human stuff > she uses & how much.. If not, I can dig around for info on the pills. > > -Original Message- > From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org > [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of MaiMaiPG > Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2011 3:11 PM > To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Cat Foof > > Pine horse bedding works well for a litter. My guys came from a pine > thicket so it works really well with them. 40 pounds for $8 (?). Of course > I change it a lot more often than the clay but I can throw it in a field or > use it as mulch or whatever (turns to sawdust). Sounds like you have the > litter issue down though. Raw (for people who like > it) meat and lightly cooked with lots of juices really extends food and it > is truly good for cats. A neighbor just gave me two large roasts that had > some freezer burnmy friends don't mind. As far as fish including > mackeral and salmonI break teh pieces into something akin to mush and > mix some extra water in...then let it sit for a few minutes or more. The > ferals get more water and eat the fish. > > Glad for the information on Purina Hairball. It is hard to know what ferals > need. Does anyone have experience with ringworm and ferals? > > I don't know if any of these guys are FeLV+ or not. I have refused to have > them tested. They have been together for so long that it just doesn't > matter (re passing the virus on) and I do the very best I can for them > health wise. > > > On Mar 30, 2011, at 8:20 AM, Katy Doyle wrote: > > > My animals love all of the Blue Buffalo flavors (cats and dog), I'm > > lucky because mine are not picky eaters. However, they tend to throw > > up when they eat other brands... I can't figure out why. So I've > > started by mixing Purina Hairball with the Blue Buffalo to make it > > stretch longer. > > > > I'm also going to start to cook up some meat for them as a supplement. > > :-) Buddy LOVES roast beef! Weird right? > > > > Cat litter, I go to Sam's (or Costco, depends on where you live) and > > get the > > 50 lb bag of clay cat litter for $7 and mix it with the "nicer" > > clumping > > litter. It still works great and it stretches the good stuff further. > > I don't know anything about reverse mortgages, I just bought my first > > house (I'm 23) about a hear ago. Having special needs cats is > > difficult when money is tight and I'm just starting out on my own. > > > > --Katy > > > > > > > > On Tue, Mar 29, 2011 at 10:38 PM, wrote: > > > >> My pride is on Blue Buffalo "DUCK". For some reason, they do not > >> like chicken no matter what brand of food. Occassionaly, I get them > >> some Mackeral canned for humans and they love it, broth only. Why > >> they don't eat the meat I don't know. It seems that the stronge the > >> smell, the better they like it. Salmon also turns them off. Turkey > >> is so so. Beef is also so so. > >> Saw a food the other day that is buffalo meat, thought I might try > >> it. Do know one thing, these healthy foods are breaking the bank. 7 > >> cats go thru 2 bags a month (x $33.00 per bag. > >> I have found a cheaper source of litter. They like World's Best > >> which is made from corn. I can cut cost more by buying horse bedding > >> made from coursely ground corn and corn cobs. Doesn't work too good > >> with the scoopers, but does the job of stopping odor and clumps well > >> enough. Things are getting tight, money wise and am going back to > >> work at 70 as soon as I get a job of some kind. SS does not cut it > >> when heating bills go up and insurance costs are added in. Has > >> anyone had experience with reverse mortgagees? Been thinking about > >> that. At least it would keep the cats and I
Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives
Great link, thank you, Lynda! Pam On 4/15/2011 1:59 PM, Lynda Wilson wrote: Pam, I've done a lot of research myself and I asked my vet many questions. Here is a link that was very helpful to me and I had my vet review this in case she had a difference of opinion. This is very accurate information. I think it will answer many of your questions. Here is the link: http://www.wikifaq.com/Feline_Leukemia_FAQ#Is_there_any_risk_in_getting_my_cats_vaccinated.3F I will say that it's not worth the risk getting your other cats infected to socialize Poppy. She will be fine confined, just give her as much attention as possible at least until she has been cleared of the virus (meaning she is not permanently positive for leukemia). Also, I am in the same boat as you. My kitten (Crash) that I fostered, then adopted turned out to be FeLV negative this past Nov. 2010. On March 10, 2011 he had to be put down because he was in very bad shape. He was anemic, had a hear murmur and his oxygen level was next to nothing. He was fine 2 days prior. I actually took him in because he did not have a bowel movement in 2 days (we were treating him for diarrhea) and I just thought his new food was working well. Now my Ragdoll cat is at risk because I did not get him vaccinated against leukemia because he is strictly and indoor cat. So far, he has been negative but will test again on May 9th. I so want to get him another companion. It keeps him active and it's such a joy to watch to kitties play. Had I known that Crash was contagious with leukemia, I would have never exposed my other cat. This disease is fatal, with no cure. But I will say that the vaccine is not 100% (but none of them are) effective at all times, but it's better than not being protected at all. I hope that Poppy's immune system clears the virus. You may also get her siblings tested again to be safe and the mother as well. Good luck! I hope this info helps!! Lynda - Original Message - From: "Pam Norman" To: Sent: Friday, April 15, 2011 1:00 PM Subject: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives I am trying to determine what to do with Poppy both now & when the IFA test results come in. I've been reading & reading & from what I can gather, the old dictums about NEVER havinig positive & negative cats even in the same house has been abandoned. From what I have read, the general sense is that it's fine for positives & negatives to be in the same home, but should be separate so there is no chance of exchanging fluids such as with a bite, but more importantly with mutual grooming. But I know also that some of you have both positives & negatives really living together, not separate. Right? What about if I put Poppy in her condo in the spare bedroom & let me cats visit, so at least she SEES other cats. What is she hisses & spits? Would that have a chance of infecting any of mine who were nosing around her condo? My feeling is that it would. Also how effective is the vaccine these days? I know that some years ago the figure was about 30% so I never had any of my cats vaccinated. Has it been improved? Right now we are still waiting for the IFA test for Poppy. And I guess she needs retesting on that in at least a month. I do NOT want to keep her alone until then. We have a sanctuary for her if she tests IFA positive cause then we know that she is really positive. But the person who runs it tells me that regardless of how she tests on the IFA, she HAS leukemia. Period. And would go in with the positive cats. But my understanding is that if she is IFA negative, she has a chance of fighting it off & putting her in with the positives is giving up. I think she should only go in with the positives if she tests IFA positive. Can anyone help me sort this out? Pam ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives
Bailey was really very healthy until his last year, he started having teeth problems and we had to pull a lot of his teeth, then he was fine for about 6 months and then stopped eating and became very anemic and lethargic and had constant diarrhea. We did the bone marrow aspirate and they found pre cancer cells so we were pretty sure he was developing cancer somewhere but we couldn't find it. We did ultrasounds, bloodwork but nothing was conclusive. He had a feeding tube because he wouldn't eat anything and I could tell he was uncomfortable when he got fed, I asked my vet if he could possibly have pancreatitis but she said his bloodwork didn't bear that out. I wish I had done the pancreatitis test but I didn't and after he passed 6 months later we did a necropsy and he had pancreatic cancer. If I had done that test when I noticed his eating aversion I may have caught it before it turned into cancer ... He never got any special food or meds until he got sick, then I gave him things to try and boost his immune system, but Bailey didn't like getting meds so I did only the bare minimum because stress is the worst thing for positives and getting meds was stressful for him. With the feeding tube it was a lot easier and he got more stuff then. On 4/15/2011 1:30 PM, Lynda Wilson wrote: Belinda, What a relief to hear! I feel you are so lucky because I don't hear very many stories as yours. I have read that 85% of kitties that test positive on the IFA test, don't live past 3 1/2 yrs. I'm so glad that you were able to enjoy Bailey as long as you did! What meds did you have him on? -- Belinda happiness is being owned by cats ... http://BelindaSauro.com http://HostDesign4U.com ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives
I'd love to hear ideas on that one! LOL I have 6 sep dishes & feed in 2 sep rooms... but, the other one's dish always seems to be more attractive for some reason-LOL There are times that I look over & its as though one said, "everyone more one to the right" & they did! And then there's the dog who thinks I've put down 6 dishes of treats for him!!! -Original Message- From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of dlg...@windstream.net Sent: Friday, April 15, 2011 6:12 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives How do you keep feeding bowls seperate? I have 7 and don't have enough rooms to keep them out of each other's bowls. Besides, each one thinks that he other's food is diffeent and better than theirs so the first few minutes of feeding is spent trading bowls just t make sure I get the best food. Sharon Catalan wrote: > Hello Pam, > > My 3 cats have been living together for 10 years now until my boy-cat > was just recently diagnosed with FeLV. He may have contracted it 2 > years ago when he ran outside and got into a fight with another cat. > We had the 2 other girl-cats tested and they're both negative. We had > the 2 other girl-cats vaccinated and currently, they are separated. > Doctor said that they can be together 30days after the 2 other cats > receive their 2nd shot of FeLV vaccination. Also, according to our > doctor, it should be okay for them to be together again as long as > they don't bite/scratch each other or share bodily fluids. Just keep > their feeding stuff completely separate. My cats never fight with > each other although occasionally, the other cat will eat someone's > leftover and I think that is the reason that the 2 others cats never > contracted it considering that the other one had FeLV for quite some time now. > > Sharon > > On Fri, Apr 15, 2011 at 11:00 AM, Pam Norman wrote: > > > I am trying to determine what to do with Poppy both now & when the > > IFA test results come in. I've been reading & reading & from what I > > can gather, the old dictums about NEVER havinig positive & negative > > cats even in the same house has been abandoned. From what I have > > read, the general sense is that it's fine for positives & negatives > > to be in the same home, but should be separate so there is no chance of exchanging fluids such as with a bite, but > > more importantly with mutual grooming. But I know also that some of you > > have both positives & negatives really living together, not separate. Right? > > > > What about if I put Poppy in her condo in the spare bedroom & let me > > cats visit, so at least she SEES other cats. What is she hisses & > > spits? Would that have a chance of infecting any of mine who were > > nosing around her condo? My feeling is that it would. > > > > Also how effective is the vaccine these days? I know that some > > years ago the figure was about 30% so I never had any of my cats > > vaccinated. Has it been improved? > > > > Right now we are still waiting for the IFA test for Poppy. And I > > guess she needs retesting on that in at least a month. I do NOT want > > to keep her alone until then. We have a sanctuary for her if she > > tests IFA positive cause then we know that she is really positive. > > But the person who runs it tells me that regardless of how she tests on the IFA, she HAS leukemia. Period. > > And would go in with the positive cats. But my understanding is > > that if she is IFA negative, she has a chance of fighting it off & > > putting her in with the positives is giving up. I think she should > > only go in with the positives if she tests IFA positive. > > > > Can anyone help me sort this out? > > > > Pam > > > > ___ > > Felvtalk mailing list > > Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org > > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.o > > rg > > > > > > -- > Sharon F Catalan > Cell: (408) 398-5647 > Home: (408) 229-2298 > Carpe Diem! > ___ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives
On that note, Copper and Thomas go into their carriers when they want to be alone or are pissed off. They even close (not latch) the doors. They eat on a bench they started eating on as tiny kittens. Carriers are wonderful if they are safe places. My boys traveled from the day they came out of the pine thicket and, until they got grown, I took them on rides and visited people with them. Carriers are sources of adventure and fun. I have served the boys for almost 3 years and they travel with me to Louisville, to various other places with no troubleno fighting to get them in their carriers or searching for them for hours. They have a dog carriage (big baby carriage with screens and very big all-terrain wheels) to ride around outsidethey love that too. The crate idea is wonderful. Same principle as crate training a dog. Bob came crate trainedhe goes there to rest from the cats, to eat or tell me it is meal time, when he is wet etc. On Apr 15, 2011, at 6:34 PM, Pam Norman wrote: You all have been so helpful on my questions about Poppy I can't believe it! Maybe I can return the favor a bit & help here. Most of my 10 cats eat in their crates. I have them stacked in the kitchen & each cat knows which one is his & they go into them at meal times. Otherwise I too would run out of rooms. I have one who also eats in the bathroom & one who eats in my pc room, but the others all eat in their crates in the kitchen. Sometimes they nap or sleep in them too since they have good connotations. Pam On 4/15/2011 5:12 PM, dlg...@windstream.net wrote: How do you keep feeding bowls seperate? I have 7 and don't have enough rooms to keep them out of each other's bowls. Besides, each one thinks that he other's food is diffeent and better than theirs so the first few minutes of feeding is spent trading bowls just t make sure I get the best food. Sharon Catalan wrote: Hello Pam, My 3 cats have been living together for 10 years now until my boy- cat was just recently diagnosed with FeLV. He may have contracted it 2 years ago when he ran outside and got into a fight with another cat. We had the 2 other girl-cats tested and they're both negative. We had the 2 other girl-cats vaccinated and currently, they are separated. Doctor said that they can be together 30days after the 2 other cats receive their 2nd shot of FeLV vaccination. Also, according to our doctor, it should be okay for them to be together again as long as they don't bite/scratch each other or share bodily fluids. Just keep their feeding stuff completely separate. My cats never fight with each other although occasionally, the other cat will eat someone's leftover and I think that is the reason that the 2 others cats never contracted it considering that the other one had FeLV for quite some time now. Sharon On Fri, Apr 15, 2011 at 11:00 AM, Pam Norman wrote: I am trying to determine what to do with Poppy both now& when the IFA test results come in. I've been reading& reading& from what I can gather, the old dictums about NEVER havinig positive& negative cats even in the same house has been abandoned. From what I have read, the general sense is that it's fine for positives& negatives to be in the same home, but should be separate so there is no chance of exchanging fluids such as with a bite, but more importantly with mutual grooming. But I know also that some of you have both positives& negatives really living together, not separate. Right? What about if I put Poppy in her condo in the spare bedroom& let me cats visit, so at least she SEES other cats. What is she hisses& spits? Would that have a chance of infecting any of mine who were nosing around her condo? My feeling is that it would. Also how effective is the vaccine these days? I know that some years ago the figure was about 30% so I never had any of my cats vaccinated. Has it been improved? Right now we are still waiting for the IFA test for Poppy. And I guess she needs retesting on that in at least a month. I do NOT want to keep her alone until then. We have a sanctuary for her if she tests IFA positive cause then we know that she is really positive. But the person who runs it tells me that regardless of how she tests on the IFA, she HAS leukemia. Period. And would go in with the positive cats. But my understanding is that if she is IFA negative, she has a chance of fighting it off& putting her in with the positives is giving up. I think she should only go in with the positives if she tests IFA positive. Can anyone help me sort this out? Pam ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org -- Sharon F Catalan Cell: (408) 398-5647 Home: (408) 229-2298 Carpe Diem!
Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives
You all have been so helpful on my questions about Poppy I can't believe it! Maybe I can return the favor a bit & help here. Most of my 10 cats eat in their crates. I have them stacked in the kitchen & each cat knows which one is his & they go into them at meal times. Otherwise I too would run out of rooms. I have one who also eats in the bathroom & one who eats in my pc room, but the others all eat in their crates in the kitchen. Sometimes they nap or sleep in them too since they have good connotations. Pam On 4/15/2011 5:12 PM, dlg...@windstream.net wrote: How do you keep feeding bowls seperate? I have 7 and don't have enough rooms to keep them out of each other's bowls. Besides, each one thinks that he other's food is diffeent and better than theirs so the first few minutes of feeding is spent trading bowls just t make sure I get the best food. Sharon Catalan wrote: Hello Pam, My 3 cats have been living together for 10 years now until my boy-cat was just recently diagnosed with FeLV. He may have contracted it 2 years ago when he ran outside and got into a fight with another cat. We had the 2 other girl-cats tested and they're both negative. We had the 2 other girl-cats vaccinated and currently, they are separated. Doctor said that they can be together 30days after the 2 other cats receive their 2nd shot of FeLV vaccination. Also, according to our doctor, it should be okay for them to be together again as long as they don't bite/scratch each other or share bodily fluids. Just keep their feeding stuff completely separate. My cats never fight with each other although occasionally, the other cat will eat someone's leftover and I think that is the reason that the 2 others cats never contracted it considering that the other one had FeLV for quite some time now. Sharon On Fri, Apr 15, 2011 at 11:00 AM, Pam Norman wrote: I am trying to determine what to do with Poppy both now& when the IFA test results come in. I've been reading& reading& from what I can gather, the old dictums about NEVER havinig positive& negative cats even in the same house has been abandoned. From what I have read, the general sense is that it's fine for positives& negatives to be in the same home, but should be separate so there is no chance of exchanging fluids such as with a bite, but more importantly with mutual grooming. But I know also that some of you have both positives& negatives really living together, not separate. Right? What about if I put Poppy in her condo in the spare bedroom& let me cats visit, so at least she SEES other cats. What is she hisses& spits? Would that have a chance of infecting any of mine who were nosing around her condo? My feeling is that it would. Also how effective is the vaccine these days? I know that some years ago the figure was about 30% so I never had any of my cats vaccinated. Has it been improved? Right now we are still waiting for the IFA test for Poppy. And I guess she needs retesting on that in at least a month. I do NOT want to keep her alone until then. We have a sanctuary for her if she tests IFA positive cause then we know that she is really positive. But the person who runs it tells me that regardless of how she tests on the IFA, she HAS leukemia. Period. And would go in with the positive cats. But my understanding is that if she is IFA negative, she has a chance of fighting it off& putting her in with the positives is giving up. I think she should only go in with the positives if she tests IFA positive. Can anyone help me sort this out? Pam ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org -- Sharon F Catalan Cell: (408) 398-5647 Home: (408) 229-2298 Carpe Diem! ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives
First off, if she's neg on IFA I would go with that! Don't know why you wouldn't. Many of us mix pos/neg. I did that by accident when 1 of my cats tested pos 4 1/2 years after she tested neg on snap test. Never been outside so I assume she always had it. My other 3 cats were around her since kittenhood & nobody caught it even though they groomed, ate from same dishes, used same boxes, had the occasionally tussle, et. Got the 3 neg vacc & 5 years later, everybody's fine. My orig neg on the Elissa got me reading & apparently, just as you can get a false neg, you can also get a false pos. I'd go w. IFA which you should get within a day or so after blood is drawn. I'd put her in kitty condo & let her view the sights & sounds of indoor living! -Original Message- From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Pam Norman Sent: Friday, April 15, 2011 2:01 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives I am trying to determine what to do with Poppy both now & when the IFA test results come in. I've been reading & reading & from what I can gather, the old dictums about NEVER havinig positive & negative cats even in the same house has been abandoned. From what I have read, the general sense is that it's fine for positives & negatives to be in the same home, but should be separate so there is no chance of exchanging fluids such as with a bite, but more importantly with mutual grooming. But I know also that some of you have both positives & negatives really living together, not separate. Right? What about if I put Poppy in her condo in the spare bedroom & let me cats visit, so at least she SEES other cats. What is she hisses & spits? Would that have a chance of infecting any of mine who were nosing around her condo? My feeling is that it would. Also how effective is the vaccine these days? I know that some years ago the figure was about 30% so I never had any of my cats vaccinated. Has it been improved? Right now we are still waiting for the IFA test for Poppy. And I guess she needs retesting on that in at least a month. I do NOT want to keep her alone until then. We have a sanctuary for her if she tests IFA positive cause then we know that she is really positive. But the person who runs it tells me that regardless of how she tests on the IFA, she HAS leukemia. Period. And would go in with the positive cats. But my understanding is that if she is IFA negative, she has a chance of fighting it off & putting her in with the positives is giving up. I think she should only go in with the positives if she tests IFA positive. Can anyone help me sort this out? Pam ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives
How do you keep feeding bowls seperate? I have 7 and don't have enough rooms to keep them out of each other's bowls. Besides, each one thinks that he other's food is diffeent and better than theirs so the first few minutes of feeding is spent trading bowls just t make sure I get the best food. Sharon Catalan wrote: > Hello Pam, > > My 3 cats have been living together for 10 years now until my boy-cat was > just recently diagnosed with FeLV. He may have contracted it 2 years ago > when he ran outside and got into a fight with another cat. We had the 2 > other girl-cats tested and they're both negative. We had the 2 other > girl-cats vaccinated and currently, they are separated. Doctor said that > they can be together 30days after the 2 other cats receive their 2nd shot of > FeLV vaccination. Also, according to our doctor, it should be okay for them > to be together again as long as they don't bite/scratch each other or share > bodily fluids. Just keep their feeding stuff completely separate. My cats > never fight with each other although occasionally, the other cat will eat > someone's leftover and I think that is the reason that the 2 others cats > never contracted it considering that the other one had FeLV for quite some > time now. > > Sharon > > On Fri, Apr 15, 2011 at 11:00 AM, Pam Norman wrote: > > > I am trying to determine what to do with Poppy both now & when the IFA test > > results come in. I've been reading & reading & from what I can gather, the > > old dictums about NEVER havinig positive & negative cats even in the same > > house has been abandoned. From what I have read, the general sense is that > > it's fine for positives & negatives to be in the same home, but should be > > separate so there is no chance of exchanging fluids such as with a bite, but > > more importantly with mutual grooming. But I know also that some of you > > have both positives & negatives really living together, not separate. Right? > > > > What about if I put Poppy in her condo in the spare bedroom & let me cats > > visit, so at least she SEES other cats. What is she hisses & spits? Would > > that have a chance of infecting any of mine who were nosing around her > > condo? My feeling is that it would. > > > > Also how effective is the vaccine these days? I know that some years ago > > the figure was about 30% so I never had any of my cats vaccinated. Has it > > been improved? > > > > Right now we are still waiting for the IFA test for Poppy. And I guess she > > needs retesting on that in at least a month. I do NOT want to keep her alone > > until then. We have a sanctuary for her if she tests IFA positive cause > > then we know that she is really positive. But the person who runs it tells > > me that regardless of how she tests on the IFA, she HAS leukemia. Period. > > And would go in with the positive cats. But my understanding is that if > > she is IFA negative, she has a chance of fighting it off & putting her in > > with the positives is giving up. I think she should only go in with the > > positives if she tests IFA positive. > > > > Can anyone help me sort this out? > > > > Pam > > > > ___ > > Felvtalk mailing list > > Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org > > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > > > > -- > Sharon F Catalan > Cell: (408) 398-5647 > Home: (408) 229-2298 > Carpe Diem! > ___ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives
I think that the individual cat's health has a lot to do with their getting it or not. The only precaution I took was to keep my kittens seperate from my positives and negatives until they had gotten their second shots. For good measure, the vet said to wait anoter 2 weeks. They were only 3 month when I got them. Now they are over 1 year and healthy as can be. Only the kittens mutual groom, but they are brother and sister. We have snarls, slaps and screams, but no one has ever bitten anyone .In fact, negatives and positives are all healthy. We do go outside for an hour or two, but most of that time is spent on the deck and lately, we have not had any strays around, just a mountain lion during deer season, but he moved on. He has a large territory so he only shows up around deer season. Then I keep every one in to protect them from the lion and the hunters. Lynda Wilson wrote: > One more note, Crash & my Ragdoll shared everything and groomed one another > constantly since day one. This is why I am so concerned, but I have to > remind myself that my cat is a healthy 2 yr old and Crash was an unhealthy > kitten. > > > - Original Message - > From: "Pam Norman" > To: > Sent: Friday, April 15, 2011 2:24 PM > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives > > > > Lynda, you wrote that Crash was FeLeuk negative last November. Did you > > mean positive? Or had he been positive prior to this? > > > > On 4/15/2011 1:59 PM, Lynda Wilson wrote: > >> Pam, > >> > >> I've done a lot of research myself and I asked my vet many questions. > >> Here is a link that was very helpful to me and I had my vet review this > >> in case she had a difference of opinion. This is very accurate > >> information. I think it will answer many of your questions. Here is the > >> link: > >> http://www.wikifaq.com/Feline_Leukemia_FAQ#Is_there_any_risk_in_getting_my_cats_vaccinated.3F > >> > >> I will say that it's not worth the risk getting your other cats infected > >> to socialize Poppy. She will be fine confined, just give her as much > >> attention as possible at least until she has been cleared of the virus > >> (meaning she is not permanently positive for leukemia). > >> > >> Also, I am in the same boat as you. My kitten (Crash) that I fostered, > >> then adopted turned out to be FeLV negative this past Nov. 2010. On > >> March 10, 2011 he had to be put down because he was in very bad shape. He > >> was anemic, had a hear murmur and his oxygen level was next to nothing. > >> He was fine 2 days prior. I actually took him in because he did not have > >> a bowel movement in 2 days (we were treating him for diarrhea) and I just > >> thought his new food was working well. Now my Ragdoll cat is at risk > >> because I did not get him vaccinated against leukemia because he is > >> strictly and indoor cat. So far, he has been negative but will test again > >> on May 9th. I so want to get him another companion. It keeps him active > >> and it's such a joy to watch to kitties play. Had I known that Crash was > >> contagious with leukemia, I would have never exposed my other cat. This > >> disease is fatal, with no cure. But I will say that the vaccine is not > >> 100% (but none of them are) effective at all times, but it's better than > >> not being protected at all. > >> > >> I hope that Poppy's immune system clears the virus. You may also get her > >> siblings tested again to be safe and the mother as well. > >> > >> Good luck! I hope this info helps!! > >> > >> Lynda > >> > >> > >> > >> - Original Message - From: "Pam Norman" > >> To: > >> Sent: Friday, April 15, 2011 1:00 PM > >> Subject: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives > >> > >> > >>> I am trying to determine what to do with Poppy both now & when the IFA > >>> test results come in. I've been reading & reading & from what I can > >>> gather, the old dictums about NEVER havinig positive & negative cats > >>> even in the same house has been abandoned. From what I have read, the > >>> general sense is that it's fine for positives & negatives to be in the > >>> same home, but should be separate so there is no chance of exchanging > >>> fluids such as with a bite, but more importantly with mutual grooming. > >>> But I know also that some of you have both positives & negatives really > >>> living together, not separate. Right? > >>> > >>> What about if I put Poppy in her condo in the spare bedroom & let me > >>> cats visit, so at least she SEES other cats. What is she hisses & > >>> spits? Would that have a chance of infecting any of mine who were nosing > >>> around her condo? My feeling is that it would. > >>> > >>> Also how effective is the vaccine these days? I know that some years > >>> ago the figure was about 30% so I never had any of my cats vaccinated. > >>> Has it been improved? > >>> > >>> Right now we are still waiting for the IFA test for Poppy. And I guess > >>> s
Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives
Sharon, I have read that some cats can be carriers of FeLV and test negative, but can transmit it to other cats. This is a crazy disease that has so many "if's" that it's confusing. Have you heard of this as well? Lynda - Original Message - From: "Sharon Catalan" To: Sent: Friday, April 15, 2011 3:07 PM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives Hello Pam, Yes, they did share everything for 10 years up until a month ago when we found out that the other one is positive. That is actually the biggest mystery - the 2 other cats never got infected. The doctor did say that we should test them again every 6 months. Sharon On Fri, Apr 15, 2011 at 12:20 PM, Pam Norman wrote: Sharon, What about grooming? I would assume that those cats, having lived together for 10 years, would mutually groom. That's sharing bodily fluids & I would think would be potentially harmful to the negative ones. Pam On 4/15/2011 1:28 PM, Sharon Catalan wrote: Hello Pam, My 3 cats have been living together for 10 years now until my boy-cat was just recently diagnosed with FeLV. He may have contracted it 2 years ago when he ran outside and got into a fight with another cat. We had the 2 other girl-cats tested and they're both negative. We had the 2 other girl-cats vaccinated and currently, they are separated. Doctor said that they can be together 30days after the 2 other cats receive their 2nd shot of FeLV vaccination. Also, according to our doctor, it should be okay for them to be together again as long as they don't bite/scratch each other or share bodily fluids. Just keep their feeding stuff completely separate. My cats never fight with each other although occasionally, the other cat will eat someone's leftover and I think that is the reason that the 2 others cats never contracted it considering that the other one had FeLV for quite some time now. Sharon On Fri, Apr 15, 2011 at 11:00 AM, Pam Norman wrote: I am trying to determine what to do with Poppy both now& when the IFA test results come in. I've been reading& reading& from what I can gather, the old dictums about NEVER havinig positive& negative cats even in the same house has been abandoned. From what I have read, the general sense is that it's fine for positives& negatives to be in the same home, but should be separate so there is no chance of exchanging fluids such as with a bite, but more importantly with mutual grooming. But I know also that some of you have both positives& negatives really living together, not separate. Right? What about if I put Poppy in her condo in the spare bedroom& let me cats visit, so at least she SEES other cats. What is she hisses& spits? Would that have a chance of infecting any of mine who were nosing around her condo? My feeling is that it would. Also how effective is the vaccine these days? I know that some years ago the figure was about 30% so I never had any of my cats vaccinated. Has it been improved? Right now we are still waiting for the IFA test for Poppy. And I guess she needs retesting on that in at least a month. I do NOT want to keep her alone until then. We have a sanctuary for her if she tests IFA positive cause then we know that she is really positive. But the person who runs it tells me that regardless of how she tests on the IFA, she HAS leukemia. Period. And would go in with the positive cats. But my understanding is that if she is IFA negative, she has a chance of fighting it off& putting her in with the positives is giving up. I think she should only go in with the positives if she tests IFA positive. Can anyone help me sort this out? Pam ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org -- Sharon F Catalan Cell: (408) 398-5647 Home: (408) 229-2298 Carpe Diem! ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives
Thanks, Maureen. I will gladly keep everyone updated. I was fortunate to be a part of this "Felv Talk" to read and share one another's experiences. Certainly it's always nice to hear of stories of kitties living with it for many, many years and defy the odds. No feline deserves this disease (or any for that matter!). You're right, he does have a better chance of clearing the virus. I'm hoping he already has. I hate the waiting part. I've read that you can test 28 days from last exposure, some say 90 days and then every 6 mos (what do you agree with?). It would be nice to find more consistency on the internet but I know better than to expect it. My vet said to test him in June, but I could not wait 3 mos from last exposure. I opted to test him every 30 days, then after June is passed and he still tests negative, I will feel he is out of the woods. Let's hope that Poppy's outcome is feline negative as well. Thanks for your input, Maureen! I'm so glad to be part of this "chat." Lynda - Original Message - From: "Maureen Olvey" To: Sent: Friday, April 15, 2011 4:12 PM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives I really hope your Ragdoll will be fine. Honestly, the odds are higer than he'll shake the virus or put it into latentcy. Please keep us posted as you get the final results in. If it turns out he is positive and there is no more doubt about it you could consider getting him a positive playmate. That would be a tough decision because then you could possibly have two cats you love that will not live a full life instead of just one. Course you could have two cats you love that both have FeLV and live forever. Hard to know and it would be hard for me to make that decision but I just wanted to mention it as an option if you 100% positively find out that your ragdoll is positive. Like I said, odds are higher that you won't even have to make that decision so I can't wait to hear good news about the ragdoll being negative. “I am not interested to know whether vivisection produces results that are profitable to the human race or doesn’t….the pain which it inflicts upon unconsenting animals is the basis of my enmity toward it, and it is to me sufficient justification of the enmity without looking further.” – Mark Twain From: longhornf...@verizon.net To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Date: Fri, 15 Apr 2011 15:45:12 -0500 Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives One more note, Crash & my Ragdoll shared everything and groomed one another constantly since day one. This is why I am so concerned, but I have to remind myself that my cat is a healthy 2 yr old and Crash was an unhealthy kitten. - Original Message - From: "Pam Norman" To: Sent: Friday, April 15, 2011 2:24 PM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives > Lynda, you wrote that Crash was FeLeuk negative last November. Did you > mean positive? Or had he been positive prior to this? > > On 4/15/2011 1:59 PM, Lynda Wilson wrote: >> Pam, >> >> I've done a lot of research myself and I asked my vet many questions. >> Here is a link that was very helpful to me and I had my vet review this >> in case she had a difference of opinion. This is very accurate >> information. I think it will answer many of your questions. Here is the >> link: >> http://www.wikifaq.com/Feline_Leukemia_FAQ#Is_there_any_risk_in_getting_my_cats_vaccinated.3F >> >> I will say that it's not worth the risk getting your other cats >> infected >> to socialize Poppy. She will be fine confined, just give her as much >> attention as possible at least until she has been cleared of the virus >> (meaning she is not permanently positive for leukemia). >> >> Also, I am in the same boat as you. My kitten (Crash) that I fostered, >> then adopted turned out to be FeLV negative this past Nov. 2010. On >> March 10, 2011 he had to be put down because he was in very bad shape. >> He >> was anemic, had a hear murmur and his oxygen level was next to nothing. >> He was fine 2 days prior. I actually took him in because he did not >> have >> a bowel movement in 2 days (we were treating him for diarrhea) and I >> just >> thought his new food was working well. Now my Ragdoll cat is at risk >> because I did not get him vaccinated against leukemia because he is >> strictly and indoor cat. So far, he has been negative but will test >> again >> on May 9th. I so want to get him another companion. It keeps him active >> and it's such a joy to watch to kitties play. Had I known that Crash >> was >> contagious with leukemia, I would have never exposed my other cat. This >> disease is fatal, with no cure. But I will say that the vaccine is not >> 100% (but none of them are) effective at all times, but it's better >> than >> not being protected at all. >> >> I hope that Poppy's immune system clears the virus. You may also get >> her >> siblings tested again to be safe and the mother as well
Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives
I really hope your Ragdoll will be fine. Honestly, the odds are higer than he'll shake the virus or put it into latentcy. Please keep us posted as you get the final results in. If it turns out he is positive and there is no more doubt about it you could consider getting him a positive playmate. That would be a tough decision because then you could possibly have two cats you love that will not live a full life instead of just one. Course you could have two cats you love that both have FeLV and live forever. Hard to know and it would be hard for me to make that decision but I just wanted to mention it as an option if you 100% positively find out that your ragdoll is positive. Like I said, odds are higher that you won't even have to make that decision so I can't wait to hear good news about the ragdoll being negative. “I am not interested to know whether vivisection produces results that are profitable to the human race or doesn’t….the pain which it inflicts upon unconsenting animals is the basis of my enmity toward it, and it is to me sufficient justification of the enmity without looking further.” – Mark Twain > From: longhornf...@verizon.net > To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org > Date: Fri, 15 Apr 2011 15:45:12 -0500 > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives > > One more note, Crash & my Ragdoll shared everything and groomed one another > constantly since day one. This is why I am so concerned, but I have to > remind myself that my cat is a healthy 2 yr old and Crash was an unhealthy > kitten. > > > - Original Message - > From: "Pam Norman" > To: > Sent: Friday, April 15, 2011 2:24 PM > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives > > > > Lynda, you wrote that Crash was FeLeuk negative last November. Did you > > mean positive? Or had he been positive prior to this? > > > > On 4/15/2011 1:59 PM, Lynda Wilson wrote: > >> Pam, > >> > >> I've done a lot of research myself and I asked my vet many questions. > >> Here is a link that was very helpful to me and I had my vet review this > >> in case she had a difference of opinion. This is very accurate > >> information. I think it will answer many of your questions. Here is the > >> link: > >> http://www.wikifaq.com/Feline_Leukemia_FAQ#Is_there_any_risk_in_getting_my_cats_vaccinated.3F > >> > >> I will say that it's not worth the risk getting your other cats infected > >> to socialize Poppy. She will be fine confined, just give her as much > >> attention as possible at least until she has been cleared of the virus > >> (meaning she is not permanently positive for leukemia). > >> > >> Also, I am in the same boat as you. My kitten (Crash) that I fostered, > >> then adopted turned out to be FeLV negative this past Nov. 2010. On > >> March 10, 2011 he had to be put down because he was in very bad shape. He > >> was anemic, had a hear murmur and his oxygen level was next to nothing. > >> He was fine 2 days prior. I actually took him in because he did not have > >> a bowel movement in 2 days (we were treating him for diarrhea) and I just > >> thought his new food was working well. Now my Ragdoll cat is at risk > >> because I did not get him vaccinated against leukemia because he is > >> strictly and indoor cat. So far, he has been negative but will test again > >> on May 9th. I so want to get him another companion. It keeps him active > >> and it's such a joy to watch to kitties play. Had I known that Crash was > >> contagious with leukemia, I would have never exposed my other cat. This > >> disease is fatal, with no cure. But I will say that the vaccine is not > >> 100% (but none of them are) effective at all times, but it's better than > >> not being protected at all. > >> > >> I hope that Poppy's immune system clears the virus. You may also get her > >> siblings tested again to be safe and the mother as well. > >> > >> Good luck! I hope this info helps!! > >> > >> Lynda > >> > >> > >> > >> - Original Message - From: "Pam Norman" > >> To: > >> Sent: Friday, April 15, 2011 1:00 PM > >> Subject: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives > >> > >> > >>> I am trying to determine what to do with Poppy both now & when the IFA > >>> test results come in. I've been reading & reading & from what I can > >>> gather, the old dictums about NEVER havinig positive & negative cats > >>> even in the same house has been abandoned. From what I have read, the > >>> general sense is that it's fine for positives & negatives to be in the > >>> same home, but should be separate so there is no chance of exchanging > >>> fluids such as with a bite, but more importantly with mutual grooming. > >>> But I know also that some of you have both positives & negatives really > >>> living together, not separate. Right? > >>> > >>> What about if I put Poppy in her condo in the spare bedroom & let me > >>> cats visit, so at least she SEES other cats. What is she hisses & > >>> spits?
Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives
Pam - I would search the archives on "mixing". I have always mixed my positives & negatives, on the advice of my vet. My negatives are vaccinated & they have never gotten it in 10 years. I do NOT separate in any way. They share everything - food, water, litter, grooming... Beth Don't Litter, Fix Your Critter! www.Furkids.org --- On Fri, 4/15/11, Pam Norman wrote: From: Pam Norman Subject: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Date: Friday, April 15, 2011, 2:00 PM I am trying to determine what to do with Poppy both now & when the IFA test results come in. I've been reading & reading & from what I can gather, the old dictums about NEVER havinig positive & negative cats even in the same house has been abandoned. From what I have read, the general sense is that it's fine for positives & negatives to be in the same home, but should be separate so there is no chance of exchanging fluids such as with a bite, but more importantly with mutual grooming. But I know also that some of you have both positives & negatives really living together, not separate. Right? What about if I put Poppy in her condo in the spare bedroom & let me cats visit, so at least she SEES other cats. What is she hisses & spits? Would that have a chance of infecting any of mine who were nosing around her condo? My feeling is that it would. Also how effective is the vaccine these days? I know that some years ago the figure was about 30% so I never had any of my cats vaccinated. Has it been improved? Right now we are still waiting for the IFA test for Poppy. And I guess she needs retesting on that in at least a month. I do NOT want to keep her alone until then. We have a sanctuary for her if she tests IFA positive cause then we know that she is really positive. But the person who runs it tells me that regardless of how she tests on the IFA, she HAS leukemia. Period. And would go in with the positive cats. But my understanding is that if she is IFA negative, she has a chance of fighting it off & putting her in with the positives is giving up. I think she should only go in with the positives if she tests IFA positive. Can anyone help me sort this out? Pam ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives
I read that too about the 85% that will live a max of 3.5 years. Someone in my feline asthma group said her cat lived until she was 16. Can you believe that? She said the cat lived indoors since a kitten and hadn't mixed with other cats so she assumes that the cat got the disease as a kitten. I thought that was incredible. 11 years is outstanding also. How fortunate you are. Some cats just defy the odds I guess. “I am not interested to know whether vivisection produces results that are profitable to the human race or doesn’t….the pain which it inflicts upon unconsenting animals is the basis of my enmity toward it, and it is to me sufficient justification of the enmity without looking further.” – Mark Twain > From: longhornf...@verizon.net > To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org > Date: Fri, 15 Apr 2011 15:30:51 -0500 > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives > > Belinda, > > What a relief to hear! I feel you are so lucky because I don't hear very > many stories as yours. I have read that 85% of kitties that test positive on > the IFA test, don't live past 3 1/2 yrs. I'm so glad that you were able to > enjoy Bailey as long as you did! What meds did you have him on? > > Lynda > - Original Message - > From: "Belinda Sauro" > To: > Sent: Friday, April 15, 2011 2:29 PM > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives > > > > My Bailey lived with his housemates from the time he was 5 months > > old (tested positive then) until he passed of cancer at age 11 years, they > > slept, ate, groomed and on occasion had little spats, none of his > > vaccinated housemates ever became positive. I had them tested > > intermittently and they were always negative. I lost Bailey in 2006 and > > his remaining housemates are still negative. > > > > -- > > Belinda > > happiness is being owned by cats ... > > > > http://BelindaSauro.com > > http://HostDesign4U.com > > > > > > ___ > > Felvtalk mailing list > > Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org > > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > > > > ___ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives
One more note, Crash & my Ragdoll shared everything and groomed one another constantly since day one. This is why I am so concerned, but I have to remind myself that my cat is a healthy 2 yr old and Crash was an unhealthy kitten. - Original Message - From: "Pam Norman" To: Sent: Friday, April 15, 2011 2:24 PM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives Lynda, you wrote that Crash was FeLeuk negative last November. Did you mean positive? Or had he been positive prior to this? On 4/15/2011 1:59 PM, Lynda Wilson wrote: Pam, I've done a lot of research myself and I asked my vet many questions. Here is a link that was very helpful to me and I had my vet review this in case she had a difference of opinion. This is very accurate information. I think it will answer many of your questions. Here is the link: http://www.wikifaq.com/Feline_Leukemia_FAQ#Is_there_any_risk_in_getting_my_cats_vaccinated.3F I will say that it's not worth the risk getting your other cats infected to socialize Poppy. She will be fine confined, just give her as much attention as possible at least until she has been cleared of the virus (meaning she is not permanently positive for leukemia). Also, I am in the same boat as you. My kitten (Crash) that I fostered, then adopted turned out to be FeLV negative this past Nov. 2010. On March 10, 2011 he had to be put down because he was in very bad shape. He was anemic, had a hear murmur and his oxygen level was next to nothing. He was fine 2 days prior. I actually took him in because he did not have a bowel movement in 2 days (we were treating him for diarrhea) and I just thought his new food was working well. Now my Ragdoll cat is at risk because I did not get him vaccinated against leukemia because he is strictly and indoor cat. So far, he has been negative but will test again on May 9th. I so want to get him another companion. It keeps him active and it's such a joy to watch to kitties play. Had I known that Crash was contagious with leukemia, I would have never exposed my other cat. This disease is fatal, with no cure. But I will say that the vaccine is not 100% (but none of them are) effective at all times, but it's better than not being protected at all. I hope that Poppy's immune system clears the virus. You may also get her siblings tested again to be safe and the mother as well. Good luck! I hope this info helps!! Lynda - Original Message - From: "Pam Norman" To: Sent: Friday, April 15, 2011 1:00 PM Subject: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives I am trying to determine what to do with Poppy both now & when the IFA test results come in. I've been reading & reading & from what I can gather, the old dictums about NEVER havinig positive & negative cats even in the same house has been abandoned. From what I have read, the general sense is that it's fine for positives & negatives to be in the same home, but should be separate so there is no chance of exchanging fluids such as with a bite, but more importantly with mutual grooming. But I know also that some of you have both positives & negatives really living together, not separate. Right? What about if I put Poppy in her condo in the spare bedroom & let me cats visit, so at least she SEES other cats. What is she hisses & spits? Would that have a chance of infecting any of mine who were nosing around her condo? My feeling is that it would. Also how effective is the vaccine these days? I know that some years ago the figure was about 30% so I never had any of my cats vaccinated. Has it been improved? Right now we are still waiting for the IFA test for Poppy. And I guess she needs retesting on that in at least a month. I do NOT want to keep her alone until then. We have a sanctuary for her if she tests IFA positive cause then we know that she is really positive. But the person who runs it tells me that regardless of how she tests on the IFA, she HAS leukemia. Period. And would go in with the positive cats. But my understanding is that if she is IFA negative, she has a chance of fighting it off & putting her in with the positives is giving up. I think she should only go in with the positives if she tests IFA positive. Can anyone help me sort this out? Pam ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_
Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives
I agree with Maureen. The link I provided you with reiterates what she is saying. But I don't know who told you that a neg IFA test still means the cat has FeLV. The test has to be a positive for the cat to be persistently viremic. Like I said, there are so many possibilities with this disease as to how it affects a cat individually. It's all up to their immune system. Adult cats have a greater chance of clearing the virus than a kitten whos immune systems has not been established. Lynda - Original Message - From: "Maureen Olvey" To: Sent: Friday, April 15, 2011 3:11 PM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives Pam, I haven't had a chance to check out this link so it may cover everything I say but I wanted to share what I've learned about FeLV just in case it didn't cover everything. I've read a lot of websites, books and talked with several vets about all this. My understanding is very rudimentary but here's what I've read: If a cat test positive on the IFA test then it has FeLV and is shedding the virus in the saliva and blood. This test looks for the virus in the white blood cells so once the virus has gotten that far it means the immune system wasn't able to extinguish the virus and almost 100 percent chance the cat will always be positive and shedding the virus and can infect other cats. No need to do any further testing. At this point, if the IFA test is negative it can mean a couple of different things. 1) It can mean the ELISA test done in the vet's office was just plain wrong. It's a sensitive test and can easily produce false positives. It should never be solely relied upon as a diagnosis for FeLV. 2) A negative IFA test could also mean that the cat really has gotten the virus, which means the ELISA test was correct, but the virus hasn't reached the white blood cells. If this is the case, the cat still has a chance for the immune system to either extinguish the virus or put it into latentcy. From what I've read about 40% of these cats will extinguish the virus or put it into latentcy. But since all cats don't extinguish the virus if this first IFA test shows negative, to be certain the IFA test should be repeated a few months later. If the cat has actually put the virus into latentcy it means the virus is in the bone marrow but isn't being shed so it is not infective to other cats. However, the virus can be brought out of latentcy even years later if the cat becomes ill or has some other major stressors. But many cats who do initially put the virus into latentcy will later on extinguish the virus so you just never know. The vet book I just read said that the only way to find out if a cat has the virus in the bone marrow, meaning it's dormant/latent, is to do a biopsy of the bone marrow. That means that there really may be lots of cats out there that have contracted FeLV but put it into latentcy and the owner never even knows. The books said only about 10% of exposed cats will put it into latentcy though. So most will either extinguish the virus or become carriers (persistently viremic). So I believe the woman who told you that a negative IFA test still means the cat has FeLV is wrong and myself I wouldn't put her in with positive cats until you know her true status. Or, at least get Poppy vaccinated before putting her in there with positive cats. It does take continued and prolonged exposure for a cat to get the FeLV virus into it's system. Cats who eat after each other only on rare occasions are not likely to spread the virus. My thoughts are that if Poppy is in a cat condo and occasionally hisses at another cat it's not likely that would be enough exposure for the negative cat to get it. Especially if the negative is a healthy adult cat. That's not a guarantee though so you have to decide for yourself about that one. The vaccination has become much more effective. Seems like I read somewhere that it was 90%. I have a friend who has had several FeLV positive cats living with negatives and even a couple FIV positive cats, for many years. She has way more cats than you. All the FeLV negative cats, including the FIV positive cats, get FeLV vaccinations every year and have never gotten FeLV. They all live together, share food and water bowls, etc. She's not the only one with these kinds of results with a house where positive and negatives hangout together. Can't think of anything else right now. It's very confusing though. I have more cats than you and in March a two year old died and we found out she had FeLV even though she tested negative as a kitten. I'm going through the process of re-testing all the other cats right now. I've only gotten 5 tested so far but all 5 have been negative, thank the Lord. Four out of those five lived with the FeLV positive cat for one or two years, have never been vaccinated and still didn't pick up the virus, or were able to exti
Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives
Belinda, What a relief to hear! I feel you are so lucky because I don't hear very many stories as yours. I have read that 85% of kitties that test positive on the IFA test, don't live past 3 1/2 yrs. I'm so glad that you were able to enjoy Bailey as long as you did! What meds did you have him on? Lynda - Original Message - From: "Belinda Sauro" To: Sent: Friday, April 15, 2011 2:29 PM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives My Bailey lived with his housemates from the time he was 5 months old (tested positive then) until he passed of cancer at age 11 years, they slept, ate, groomed and on occasion had little spats, none of his vaccinated housemates ever became positive. I had them tested intermittently and they were always negative. I lost Bailey in 2006 and his remaining housemates are still negative. -- Belinda happiness is being owned by cats ... http://BelindaSauro.com http://HostDesign4U.com ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives
He was actually negative. The Humane Society tested him for it prior to me having him neutered at 5 1/2 mos in Nov (they wanted to neuter him at 12 weeks and I would not allow it, so I had to foster him in order to have it done later). By March, he tests positive for Feline Leukemia. I know that he had a weakened immune system because he had coccidia along with his siblings when he was born. So I was very surprised. The HS said since Crash tested positive then they would have to test his siblings. Now all are 9 mos old (same as Crash was obviously) and all tested negative. So they must have cleared the virus but his system could not. I do hope you found my link helpful. It was helpful to me. This is a very mysterious disease. Some cats can be carriers and test negative but can still infect others. It's crazy! I hope they find a cure for it and soon!! - Original Message - From: "Pam Norman" To: Sent: Friday, April 15, 2011 2:24 PM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives Lynda, you wrote that Crash was FeLeuk negative last November. Did you mean positive? Or had he been positive prior to this? On 4/15/2011 1:59 PM, Lynda Wilson wrote: Pam, I've done a lot of research myself and I asked my vet many questions. Here is a link that was very helpful to me and I had my vet review this in case she had a difference of opinion. This is very accurate information. I think it will answer many of your questions. Here is the link: http://www.wikifaq.com/Feline_Leukemia_FAQ#Is_there_any_risk_in_getting_my_cats_vaccinated.3F I will say that it's not worth the risk getting your other cats infected to socialize Poppy. She will be fine confined, just give her as much attention as possible at least until she has been cleared of the virus (meaning she is not permanently positive for leukemia). Also, I am in the same boat as you. My kitten (Crash) that I fostered, then adopted turned out to be FeLV negative this past Nov. 2010. On March 10, 2011 he had to be put down because he was in very bad shape. He was anemic, had a hear murmur and his oxygen level was next to nothing. He was fine 2 days prior. I actually took him in because he did not have a bowel movement in 2 days (we were treating him for diarrhea) and I just thought his new food was working well. Now my Ragdoll cat is at risk because I did not get him vaccinated against leukemia because he is strictly and indoor cat. So far, he has been negative but will test again on May 9th. I so want to get him another companion. It keeps him active and it's such a joy to watch to kitties play. Had I known that Crash was contagious with leukemia, I would have never exposed my other cat. This disease is fatal, with no cure. But I will say that the vaccine is not 100% (but none of them are) effective at all times, but it's better than not being protected at all. I hope that Poppy's immune system clears the virus. You may also get her siblings tested again to be safe and the mother as well. Good luck! I hope this info helps!! Lynda - Original Message - From: "Pam Norman" To: Sent: Friday, April 15, 2011 1:00 PM Subject: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives I am trying to determine what to do with Poppy both now & when the IFA test results come in. I've been reading & reading & from what I can gather, the old dictums about NEVER havinig positive & negative cats even in the same house has been abandoned. From what I have read, the general sense is that it's fine for positives & negatives to be in the same home, but should be separate so there is no chance of exchanging fluids such as with a bite, but more importantly with mutual grooming. But I know also that some of you have both positives & negatives really living together, not separate. Right? What about if I put Poppy in her condo in the spare bedroom & let me cats visit, so at least she SEES other cats. What is she hisses & spits? Would that have a chance of infecting any of mine who were nosing around her condo? My feeling is that it would. Also how effective is the vaccine these days? I know that some years ago the figure was about 30% so I never had any of my cats vaccinated. Has it been improved? Right now we are still waiting for the IFA test for Poppy. And I guess she needs retesting on that in at least a month. I do NOT want to keep her alone until then. We have a sanctuary for her if she tests IFA positive cause then we know that she is really positive. But the person who runs it tells me that regardless of how she tests on the IFA, she HAS leukemia. Period. And would go in with the positive cats. But my understanding is that if she is IFA negative, she has a chance of fighting it off & putting her in with the positives is giving up. I think she should only go in with the positives if she tests IFA positive. Can anyone help me sort this out? Pam
[Felvtalk] Mixing
I have 1 felv+ and 4 felv-, all living togeather for the last 4 1/2 years. The negatives have been vaccinated, and have never gotten it from my Tigger! They play, sleep and do basically everything togeather!! AND they love eachother's company! ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives
Sounds to me like yet another example of healthy cats being able to fight off the virus or put it into latentcy. “I am not interested to know whether vivisection produces results that are profitable to the human race or doesn’t….the pain which it inflicts upon unconsenting animals is the basis of my enmity toward it, and it is to me sufficient justification of the enmity without looking further.” – Mark Twain > Date: Fri, 15 Apr 2011 13:07:42 -0700 > From: scata...@gmail.com > To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives > > Hello Pam, > Yes, they did share everything for 10 years up until a month ago when we > found out that the other one is positive. That is actually the biggest > mystery - the 2 other cats never got infected. The doctor did say that we > should test them again every 6 months. > > Sharon > > On Fri, Apr 15, 2011 at 12:20 PM, Pam Norman wrote: > > > Sharon, > > > > What about grooming? I would assume that those cats, having lived > > together for 10 years, would mutually groom. That's sharing bodily fluids & > > I would think would be potentially harmful to the negative ones. > > > > Pam > > > > > > On 4/15/2011 1:28 PM, Sharon Catalan wrote: > > > >> Hello Pam, > >> > >> My 3 cats have been living together for 10 years now until my boy-cat was > >> just recently diagnosed with FeLV. He may have contracted it 2 years ago > >> when he ran outside and got into a fight with another cat. We had the 2 > >> other girl-cats tested and they're both negative. We had the 2 other > >> girl-cats vaccinated and currently, they are separated. Doctor said that > >> they can be together 30days after the 2 other cats receive their 2nd shot > >> of > >> FeLV vaccination. Also, according to our doctor, it should be okay for > >> them > >> to be together again as long as they don't bite/scratch each other or > >> share > >> bodily fluids. Just keep their feeding stuff completely separate. My > >> cats > >> never fight with each other although occasionally, the other cat will eat > >> someone's leftover and I think that is the reason that the 2 others cats > >> never contracted it considering that the other one had FeLV for quite some > >> time now. > >> > >> Sharon > >> > >> On Fri, Apr 15, 2011 at 11:00 AM, Pam Norman > >> wrote: > >> > >> I am trying to determine what to do with Poppy both now& when the IFA > >>> test > >>> results come in. I've been reading& reading& from what I can gather, > >>> the > >>> old dictums about NEVER havinig positive& negative cats even in the same > >>> house has been abandoned. From what I have read, the general sense is > >>> that > >>> it's fine for positives& negatives to be in the same home, but should be > >>> separate so there is no chance of exchanging fluids such as with a bite, > >>> but > >>> more importantly with mutual grooming. But I know also that some of you > >>> have both positives& negatives really living together, not separate. > >>> Right? > >>> > >>> What about if I put Poppy in her condo in the spare bedroom& let me cats > >>> visit, so at least she SEES other cats. What is she hisses& spits? > >>> Would > >>> that have a chance of infecting any of mine who were nosing around her > >>> condo? My feeling is that it would. > >>> > >>> Also how effective is the vaccine these days? I know that some years ago > >>> the figure was about 30% so I never had any of my cats vaccinated. Has > >>> it > >>> been improved? > >>> > >>> Right now we are still waiting for the IFA test for Poppy. And I guess > >>> she > >>> needs retesting on that in at least a month. I do NOT want to keep her > >>> alone > >>> until then. We have a sanctuary for her if she tests IFA positive cause > >>> then we know that she is really positive. But the person who runs it > >>> tells > >>> me that regardless of how she tests on the IFA, she HAS leukemia. > >>> Period. > >>> And would go in with the positive cats. But my understanding is that if > >>> she is IFA negative, she has a chance of fighting it off& putting her in > >>> with the positives is giving up. I think she should only go in with the > >>> positives if she tests IFA positive. > >>> > >>> Can anyone help me sort this out? > >>> > >>> Pam > >>> > >>> ___ > >>> Felvtalk mailing list > >>> Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org > >>> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > >>> > >>> > >> > >> ___ > > Felvtalk mailing list > > Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org > > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > > > > -- > Sharon F Catalan > Cell: (408) 398-5647 > Home: (408) 229-2298 > Carpe Diem! > ___ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives
Pam, I haven't had a chance to check out this link so it may cover everything I say but I wanted to share what I've learned about FeLV just in case it didn't cover everything. I've read a lot of websites, books and talked with several vets about all this. My understanding is very rudimentary but here's what I've read: If a cat test positive on the IFA test then it has FeLV and is shedding the virus in the saliva and blood. This test looks for the virus in the white blood cells so once the virus has gotten that far it means the immune system wasn't able to extinguish the virus and almost 100 percent chance the cat will always be positive and shedding the virus and can infect other cats. No need to do any further testing. At this point, if the IFA test is negative it can mean a couple of different things. 1) It can mean the ELISA test done in the vet's office was just plain wrong. It's a sensitive test and can easily produce false positives. It should never be solely relied upon as a diagnosis for FeLV. 2) A negative IFA test could also mean that the cat really has gotten the virus, which means the ELISA test was correct, but the virus hasn't reached the white blood cells. If this is the case, the cat still has a chance for the immune system to either extinguish the virus or put it into latentcy. From what I've read about 40% of these cats will extinguish the virus or put it into latentcy. But since all cats don't extinguish the virus if this first IFA test shows negative, to be certain the IFA test should be repeated a few months later. If the cat has actually put the virus into latentcy it means the virus is in the bone marrow but isn't being shed so it is not infective to other cats. However, the virus can be brought out of latentcy even years later if the cat becomes ill or has some other major stressors. But many cats who do initially put the virus into latentcy will later on extinguish the virus so you just never know. The vet book I just read said that the only way to find out if a cat has the virus in the bone marrow, meaning it's dormant/latent, is to do a biopsy of the bone marrow. That means that there really may be lots of cats out there that have contracted FeLV but put it into latentcy and the owner never even knows. The books said only about 10% of exposed cats will put it into latentcy though. So most will either extinguish the virus or become carriers (persistently viremic). So I believe the woman who told you that a negative IFA test still means the cat has FeLV is wrong and myself I wouldn't put her in with positive cats until you know her true status. Or, at least get Poppy vaccinated before putting her in there with positive cats. It does take continued and prolonged exposure for a cat to get the FeLV virus into it's system. Cats who eat after each other only on rare occasions are not likely to spread the virus. My thoughts are that if Poppy is in a cat condo and occasionally hisses at another cat it's not likely that would be enough exposure for the negative cat to get it. Especially if the negative is a healthy adult cat. That's not a guarantee though so you have to decide for yourself about that one. The vaccination has become much more effective. Seems like I read somewhere that it was 90%. I have a friend who has had several FeLV positive cats living with negatives and even a couple FIV positive cats, for many years. She has way more cats than you. All the FeLV negative cats, including the FIV positive cats, get FeLV vaccinations every year and have never gotten FeLV. They all live together, share food and water bowls, etc. She's not the only one with these kinds of results with a house where positive and negatives hangout together. Can't think of anything else right now. It's very confusing though. I have more cats than you and in March a two year old died and we found out she had FeLV even though she tested negative as a kitten. I'm going through the process of re-testing all the other cats right now. I've only gotten 5 tested so far but all 5 have been negative, thank the Lord. Four out of those five lived with the FeLV positive cat for one or two years, have never been vaccinated and still didn't pick up the virus, or were able to extinguish it. Good luck making the decision. It's tough. It's a fatal virus and you can't play with it but at the same time there's so much misinformation out there and a lot of unecessary pre-cautions or euthanizations are taking place. “I am not interested to know whether vivisection produces results that are profitable to the human race or doesn’t….the pain which it inflicts upon unconsenting animals is the basis of my enmity toward it, and it is to me sufficient justification of the enmity without looking further.” – Mark Twain > From: longhornf...@verizon.net > To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org > Date: Fri, 15 Apr 2011 13:59:38 -
Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives
Hello Pam, Yes, they did share everything for 10 years up until a month ago when we found out that the other one is positive. That is actually the biggest mystery - the 2 other cats never got infected. The doctor did say that we should test them again every 6 months. Sharon On Fri, Apr 15, 2011 at 12:20 PM, Pam Norman wrote: > Sharon, > > What about grooming? I would assume that those cats, having lived > together for 10 years, would mutually groom. That's sharing bodily fluids & > I would think would be potentially harmful to the negative ones. > > Pam > > > On 4/15/2011 1:28 PM, Sharon Catalan wrote: > >> Hello Pam, >> >> My 3 cats have been living together for 10 years now until my boy-cat was >> just recently diagnosed with FeLV. He may have contracted it 2 years ago >> when he ran outside and got into a fight with another cat. We had the 2 >> other girl-cats tested and they're both negative. We had the 2 other >> girl-cats vaccinated and currently, they are separated. Doctor said that >> they can be together 30days after the 2 other cats receive their 2nd shot >> of >> FeLV vaccination. Also, according to our doctor, it should be okay for >> them >> to be together again as long as they don't bite/scratch each other or >> share >> bodily fluids. Just keep their feeding stuff completely separate. My >> cats >> never fight with each other although occasionally, the other cat will eat >> someone's leftover and I think that is the reason that the 2 others cats >> never contracted it considering that the other one had FeLV for quite some >> time now. >> >> Sharon >> >> On Fri, Apr 15, 2011 at 11:00 AM, Pam Norman >> wrote: >> >> I am trying to determine what to do with Poppy both now& when the IFA >>> test >>> results come in. I've been reading& reading& from what I can gather, >>> the >>> old dictums about NEVER havinig positive& negative cats even in the same >>> house has been abandoned. From what I have read, the general sense is >>> that >>> it's fine for positives& negatives to be in the same home, but should be >>> separate so there is no chance of exchanging fluids such as with a bite, >>> but >>> more importantly with mutual grooming. But I know also that some of you >>> have both positives& negatives really living together, not separate. >>> Right? >>> >>> What about if I put Poppy in her condo in the spare bedroom& let me cats >>> visit, so at least she SEES other cats. What is she hisses& spits? >>> Would >>> that have a chance of infecting any of mine who were nosing around her >>> condo? My feeling is that it would. >>> >>> Also how effective is the vaccine these days? I know that some years ago >>> the figure was about 30% so I never had any of my cats vaccinated. Has >>> it >>> been improved? >>> >>> Right now we are still waiting for the IFA test for Poppy. And I guess >>> she >>> needs retesting on that in at least a month. I do NOT want to keep her >>> alone >>> until then. We have a sanctuary for her if she tests IFA positive cause >>> then we know that she is really positive. But the person who runs it >>> tells >>> me that regardless of how she tests on the IFA, she HAS leukemia. >>> Period. >>> And would go in with the positive cats. But my understanding is that if >>> she is IFA negative, she has a chance of fighting it off& putting her in >>> with the positives is giving up. I think she should only go in with the >>> positives if she tests IFA positive. >>> >>> Can anyone help me sort this out? >>> >>> Pam >>> >>> ___ >>> Felvtalk mailing list >>> Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org >>> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >>> >>> >> >> ___ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > -- Sharon F Catalan Cell: (408) 398-5647 Home: (408) 229-2298 Carpe Diem! ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives
My Bailey lived with his housemates from the time he was 5 months old (tested positive then) until he passed of cancer at age 11 years, they slept, ate, groomed and on occasion had little spats, none of his vaccinated housemates ever became positive. I had them tested intermittently and they were always negative. I lost Bailey in 2006 and his remaining housemates are still negative. -- Belinda happiness is being owned by cats ... http://BelindaSauro.com http://HostDesign4U.com ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives
Lynda, you wrote that Crash was FeLeuk negative last November. Did you mean positive? Or had he been positive prior to this? On 4/15/2011 1:59 PM, Lynda Wilson wrote: Pam, I've done a lot of research myself and I asked my vet many questions. Here is a link that was very helpful to me and I had my vet review this in case she had a difference of opinion. This is very accurate information. I think it will answer many of your questions. Here is the link: http://www.wikifaq.com/Feline_Leukemia_FAQ#Is_there_any_risk_in_getting_my_cats_vaccinated.3F I will say that it's not worth the risk getting your other cats infected to socialize Poppy. She will be fine confined, just give her as much attention as possible at least until she has been cleared of the virus (meaning she is not permanently positive for leukemia). Also, I am in the same boat as you. My kitten (Crash) that I fostered, then adopted turned out to be FeLV negative this past Nov. 2010. On March 10, 2011 he had to be put down because he was in very bad shape. He was anemic, had a hear murmur and his oxygen level was next to nothing. He was fine 2 days prior. I actually took him in because he did not have a bowel movement in 2 days (we were treating him for diarrhea) and I just thought his new food was working well. Now my Ragdoll cat is at risk because I did not get him vaccinated against leukemia because he is strictly and indoor cat. So far, he has been negative but will test again on May 9th. I so want to get him another companion. It keeps him active and it's such a joy to watch to kitties play. Had I known that Crash was contagious with leukemia, I would have never exposed my other cat. This disease is fatal, with no cure. But I will say that the vaccine is not 100% (but none of them are) effective at all times, but it's better than not being protected at all. I hope that Poppy's immune system clears the virus. You may also get her siblings tested again to be safe and the mother as well. Good luck! I hope this info helps!! Lynda - Original Message - From: "Pam Norman" To: Sent: Friday, April 15, 2011 1:00 PM Subject: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives I am trying to determine what to do with Poppy both now & when the IFA test results come in. I've been reading & reading & from what I can gather, the old dictums about NEVER havinig positive & negative cats even in the same house has been abandoned. From what I have read, the general sense is that it's fine for positives & negatives to be in the same home, but should be separate so there is no chance of exchanging fluids such as with a bite, but more importantly with mutual grooming. But I know also that some of you have both positives & negatives really living together, not separate. Right? What about if I put Poppy in her condo in the spare bedroom & let me cats visit, so at least she SEES other cats. What is she hisses & spits? Would that have a chance of infecting any of mine who were nosing around her condo? My feeling is that it would. Also how effective is the vaccine these days? I know that some years ago the figure was about 30% so I never had any of my cats vaccinated. Has it been improved? Right now we are still waiting for the IFA test for Poppy. And I guess she needs retesting on that in at least a month. I do NOT want to keep her alone until then. We have a sanctuary for her if she tests IFA positive cause then we know that she is really positive. But the person who runs it tells me that regardless of how she tests on the IFA, she HAS leukemia. Period. And would go in with the positive cats. But my understanding is that if she is IFA negative, she has a chance of fighting it off & putting her in with the positives is giving up. I think she should only go in with the positives if she tests IFA positive. Can anyone help me sort this out? Pam ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives
Sharon, What about grooming? I would assume that those cats, having lived together for 10 years, would mutually groom. That's sharing bodily fluids & I would think would be potentially harmful to the negative ones. Pam On 4/15/2011 1:28 PM, Sharon Catalan wrote: Hello Pam, My 3 cats have been living together for 10 years now until my boy-cat was just recently diagnosed with FeLV. He may have contracted it 2 years ago when he ran outside and got into a fight with another cat. We had the 2 other girl-cats tested and they're both negative. We had the 2 other girl-cats vaccinated and currently, they are separated. Doctor said that they can be together 30days after the 2 other cats receive their 2nd shot of FeLV vaccination. Also, according to our doctor, it should be okay for them to be together again as long as they don't bite/scratch each other or share bodily fluids. Just keep their feeding stuff completely separate. My cats never fight with each other although occasionally, the other cat will eat someone's leftover and I think that is the reason that the 2 others cats never contracted it considering that the other one had FeLV for quite some time now. Sharon On Fri, Apr 15, 2011 at 11:00 AM, Pam Norman wrote: I am trying to determine what to do with Poppy both now& when the IFA test results come in. I've been reading& reading& from what I can gather, the old dictums about NEVER havinig positive& negative cats even in the same house has been abandoned. From what I have read, the general sense is that it's fine for positives& negatives to be in the same home, but should be separate so there is no chance of exchanging fluids such as with a bite, but more importantly with mutual grooming. But I know also that some of you have both positives& negatives really living together, not separate. Right? What about if I put Poppy in her condo in the spare bedroom& let me cats visit, so at least she SEES other cats. What is she hisses& spits? Would that have a chance of infecting any of mine who were nosing around her condo? My feeling is that it would. Also how effective is the vaccine these days? I know that some years ago the figure was about 30% so I never had any of my cats vaccinated. Has it been improved? Right now we are still waiting for the IFA test for Poppy. And I guess she needs retesting on that in at least a month. I do NOT want to keep her alone until then. We have a sanctuary for her if she tests IFA positive cause then we know that she is really positive. But the person who runs it tells me that regardless of how she tests on the IFA, she HAS leukemia. Period. And would go in with the positive cats. But my understanding is that if she is IFA negative, she has a chance of fighting it off& putting her in with the positives is giving up. I think she should only go in with the positives if she tests IFA positive. Can anyone help me sort this out? Pam ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives
Pam, I've done a lot of research myself and I asked my vet many questions. Here is a link that was very helpful to me and I had my vet review this in case she had a difference of opinion. This is very accurate information. I think it will answer many of your questions. Here is the link: http://www.wikifaq.com/Feline_Leukemia_FAQ#Is_there_any_risk_in_getting_my_cats_vaccinated.3F I will say that it's not worth the risk getting your other cats infected to socialize Poppy. She will be fine confined, just give her as much attention as possible at least until she has been cleared of the virus (meaning she is not permanently positive for leukemia). Also, I am in the same boat as you. My kitten (Crash) that I fostered, then adopted turned out to be FeLV negative this past Nov. 2010. On March 10, 2011 he had to be put down because he was in very bad shape. He was anemic, had a hear murmur and his oxygen level was next to nothing. He was fine 2 days prior. I actually took him in because he did not have a bowel movement in 2 days (we were treating him for diarrhea) and I just thought his new food was working well. Now my Ragdoll cat is at risk because I did not get him vaccinated against leukemia because he is strictly and indoor cat. So far, he has been negative but will test again on May 9th. I so want to get him another companion. It keeps him active and it's such a joy to watch to kitties play. Had I known that Crash was contagious with leukemia, I would have never exposed my other cat. This disease is fatal, with no cure. But I will say that the vaccine is not 100% (but none of them are) effective at all times, but it's better than not being protected at all. I hope that Poppy's immune system clears the virus. You may also get her siblings tested again to be safe and the mother as well. Good luck! I hope this info helps!! Lynda - Original Message - From: "Pam Norman" To: Sent: Friday, April 15, 2011 1:00 PM Subject: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives I am trying to determine what to do with Poppy both now & when the IFA test results come in. I've been reading & reading & from what I can gather, the old dictums about NEVER havinig positive & negative cats even in the same house has been abandoned. From what I have read, the general sense is that it's fine for positives & negatives to be in the same home, but should be separate so there is no chance of exchanging fluids such as with a bite, but more importantly with mutual grooming. But I know also that some of you have both positives & negatives really living together, not separate. Right? What about if I put Poppy in her condo in the spare bedroom & let me cats visit, so at least she SEES other cats. What is she hisses & spits? Would that have a chance of infecting any of mine who were nosing around her condo? My feeling is that it would. Also how effective is the vaccine these days? I know that some years ago the figure was about 30% so I never had any of my cats vaccinated. Has it been improved? Right now we are still waiting for the IFA test for Poppy. And I guess she needs retesting on that in at least a month. I do NOT want to keep her alone until then. We have a sanctuary for her if she tests IFA positive cause then we know that she is really positive. But the person who runs it tells me that regardless of how she tests on the IFA, she HAS leukemia. Period. And would go in with the positive cats. But my understanding is that if she is IFA negative, she has a chance of fighting it off & putting her in with the positives is giving up. I think she should only go in with the positives if she tests IFA positive. Can anyone help me sort this out? Pam ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives
Hello Pam, My 3 cats have been living together for 10 years now until my boy-cat was just recently diagnosed with FeLV. He may have contracted it 2 years ago when he ran outside and got into a fight with another cat. We had the 2 other girl-cats tested and they're both negative. We had the 2 other girl-cats vaccinated and currently, they are separated. Doctor said that they can be together 30days after the 2 other cats receive their 2nd shot of FeLV vaccination. Also, according to our doctor, it should be okay for them to be together again as long as they don't bite/scratch each other or share bodily fluids. Just keep their feeding stuff completely separate. My cats never fight with each other although occasionally, the other cat will eat someone's leftover and I think that is the reason that the 2 others cats never contracted it considering that the other one had FeLV for quite some time now. Sharon On Fri, Apr 15, 2011 at 11:00 AM, Pam Norman wrote: > I am trying to determine what to do with Poppy both now & when the IFA test > results come in. I've been reading & reading & from what I can gather, the > old dictums about NEVER havinig positive & negative cats even in the same > house has been abandoned. From what I have read, the general sense is that > it's fine for positives & negatives to be in the same home, but should be > separate so there is no chance of exchanging fluids such as with a bite, but > more importantly with mutual grooming. But I know also that some of you > have both positives & negatives really living together, not separate. Right? > > What about if I put Poppy in her condo in the spare bedroom & let me cats > visit, so at least she SEES other cats. What is she hisses & spits? Would > that have a chance of infecting any of mine who were nosing around her > condo? My feeling is that it would. > > Also how effective is the vaccine these days? I know that some years ago > the figure was about 30% so I never had any of my cats vaccinated. Has it > been improved? > > Right now we are still waiting for the IFA test for Poppy. And I guess she > needs retesting on that in at least a month. I do NOT want to keep her alone > until then. We have a sanctuary for her if she tests IFA positive cause > then we know that she is really positive. But the person who runs it tells > me that regardless of how she tests on the IFA, she HAS leukemia. Period. > And would go in with the positive cats. But my understanding is that if > she is IFA negative, she has a chance of fighting it off & putting her in > with the positives is giving up. I think she should only go in with the > positives if she tests IFA positive. > > Can anyone help me sort this out? > > Pam > > ___ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > -- Sharon F Catalan Cell: (408) 398-5647 Home: (408) 229-2298 Carpe Diem! ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
[Felvtalk] Question re positives & negatives
I am trying to determine what to do with Poppy both now & when the IFA test results come in. I've been reading & reading & from what I can gather, the old dictums about NEVER havinig positive & negative cats even in the same house has been abandoned. From what I have read, the general sense is that it's fine for positives & negatives to be in the same home, but should be separate so there is no chance of exchanging fluids such as with a bite, but more importantly with mutual grooming. But I know also that some of you have both positives & negatives really living together, not separate. Right? What about if I put Poppy in her condo in the spare bedroom & let me cats visit, so at least she SEES other cats. What is she hisses & spits? Would that have a chance of infecting any of mine who were nosing around her condo? My feeling is that it would. Also how effective is the vaccine these days? I know that some years ago the figure was about 30% so I never had any of my cats vaccinated. Has it been improved? Right now we are still waiting for the IFA test for Poppy. And I guess she needs retesting on that in at least a month. I do NOT want to keep her alone until then. We have a sanctuary for her if she tests IFA positive cause then we know that she is really positive. But the person who runs it tells me that regardless of how she tests on the IFA, she HAS leukemia. Period. And would go in with the positive cats. But my understanding is that if she is IFA negative, she has a chance of fighting it off & putting her in with the positives is giving up. I think she should only go in with the positives if she tests IFA positive. Can anyone help me sort this out? Pam ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Poppy
Pam, Also I would like to tell you thank you for helping out Poppy and her mom/siblings. You have a kind heart and all 10 are lucky to have you! Keep us posted on the results. You're doing everything you can. God Bless! Lynda - Original Message - From: "Pam Norman" To: Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2011 9:28 PM Subject: [Felvtalk] Poppy Poppy is a little wild 6 month old kitten just tested & found FeLeuk positive. She was one 3 beautiful white with black kittens trapped on Monday. She is mostly white with a black mask & a black tail with a little white tip. Pale green eyes like those marbles we used to play with as kids. Her mother & siblings all tested negative. We had blood drawn yesterday for the IFA test & are waiting for that to determine what to do. If it's positive, then we will be trying to find a place for this beautiful little girl to live out what she has of her life. If negative, then we will retest at some point & she will join her brother Percy & sister Prissie in being socialized & readied for adoption. At the moment she is in a condo in the back of my car while we wait for the test results. I don't want to bring her into my spare room at this point when the test results are pending as being wild, catching her again right away would be a huge challenge! I have 10 cats of my own in a little house & I know that a FeLeuk cat can safely share a house with negative kitties, provided they are kept separate. I don't want her to be alone, whether she is definitely positive or turns out to be negative & I can't take in any more cats - doctor's orders. Any advice or information would be gratefully received, Pam In Wisconsin ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Poppy
Finger crossed for Poppy! Debbie ~ When the world says, "Give up," hope whispers, "Try it one more time" ~ ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
