Re: [Flightgear-devel] fgdata merge request 91:Animated Jetways

2011-06-05 Thread Ryan M
On Fri, 2011-06-03 at 12:38 +, Martin Spott wrote:
 I'm feeling slightly uneasy with the current state because people don't
 get any jetways at all if they disable the flag in order to preserve
 performance.  Personally I'd prefer a solution which keeps static
 jetways and just disables the animation if people feel like the need
 to.

That sounds like a good idea. But it _might_ still cause FPS impacts.
Will have to run some tests later.

On Fri, 2011-06-03 at 12:38 +, Martin Spott wrote:
 While I'm at it, I'd like to point to another, presumably more severe
 issue: The elevation of every of the animated jetways is hardcoded into
 the respective 'ICAO.jetway.xml' files.  Now take into account that
 ground elevation is subject to change with almost _every_ rebuild of
 the corresponding region and airfield surface 
 From my perspective this calls for a more considerate solution.

The only solution I can think of is to remove the elevation setting and
use Nasal to calculate the elevation for each jetway's
longitude/latitude. The only problem with that is that the calculations
would take into account the terminal buildings, which would cause
jetways appearing on top of the terminal roofs.

...however, I just had another idea. Making the elevations _relative_ to
the terrain instead of absolute. That means the current definition files
will have to be changed, but I can automate that with a script easily
enough. That also means I have to update my FG 2.0.0 version.


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[Flightgear-devel] Terrain engine

2011-06-05 Thread Michael Sgier
Salut Frederic
  what happened to the terrain engine, that you show at youtube? Could 
we get that into fgfs sometimes?
Regards Michael

--- On Sat, 6/4/11, Frederic Bouvier fredfgf...@free.fr wrote:

From: Frederic Bouvier fredfgf...@free.fr
Subject: Re: [Flightgear-devel] Please insert disk into drive F:
To: bre...@gmail.com, FlightGear developers discussions 
flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
Date: Saturday, June 4, 2011, 3:28 PM


- ThorstenB a écrit :

 It's generally a bad idea to use absolute paths in model files (even
 if it's unix paths - and there's loads of /home/username/... in our
 model), since you can never be sure if it's working for anyone except
 the original author (see above). But only the Windows paths are known
 to have ugly side effects - so please at least avoid these...

The problem is that the Blender AC exporter generates these absolute path.
In the PLIB days, the loader simply ignored the path to just take the 
simple name.

-Fred

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Object distance fading color

2011-06-05 Thread Erik Hofman
On Fri, 2011-06-03 at 10:36 +0300, thorsten.i.renk  jyu.fi wrote:
 I was toying with the idea to model diffuse high-altitude haze by coloring
 the skydome as a function of altitude, i.e. paint the zenith a bit more
 hazy without touching the horizon and remove that effect again as you get
 above the haze layer - I believe that might create a better impression of
 such diffuse layers than placing texture sheets into the scene.

Code for this has now been pushed to GIT.

There is now a new property /rendering/scene/overcast ranging from 0.0
(normal behavior) to 1.0 (complete overcast).

Erik


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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Object distance fading color

2011-06-05 Thread Erik Hofman
On Sun, 2011-06-05 at 10:26 +0200, Erik Hofman wrote:
 On Fri, 2011-06-03 at 10:36 +0300, thorsten.i.renk  jyu.fi wrote:
  I was toying with the idea to model diffuse high-altitude haze by coloring
  the skydome as a function of altitude, i.e. paint the zenith a bit more
  hazy without touching the horizon and remove that effect again as you get
  above the haze layer - I believe that might create a better impression of
  such diffuse layers than placing texture sheets into the scene.
 
 Code for this has now been pushed to GIT.
 
 There is now a new property /rendering/scene/overcast ranging from 0.0
 (normal behavior) to 1.0 (complete overcast).

Come to think of it, this might not be exactly what you're looking for
but it could be useful to render overcast without an extreme amount of
cloud vertices.

Need to dig deeper to only affect the zenith of the skydome since that's
handled elsewhere.

Erik


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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Please insert disk into drive F:

2011-06-05 Thread Slavutinsky Victor
 -Fred

Little bit other topic.

Hi Frederic, I have two questions for You.

1) Can Your terrain engine be added in FG?
2) Can it be fast enough for orbital flight with visibility ~500km and
speed ~3km/h, ~8km/sec?

Victor


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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Please insert disk into drive F:

2011-06-05 Thread Erik Hofman
On Sun, 2011-06-05 at 13:07 +0400, Slavutinsky Victor wrote:
  -Fred
 
 Little bit other topic.
 
 Hi Frederic, I have two questions for You.
 
 1) Can Your terrain engine be added in FG?
 2) Can it be fast enough for orbital flight with visibility ~500km and
 speed ~3km/h, ~8km/sec?

There might be some more questions involved:
3) Is it an accurate representation of the world or a procedural terrain
engine.
4) Are you willing to /and/ able to release it under the terms of the
GPL.

Erik


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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Object distance fading color

2011-06-05 Thread ThorstenB
On 05.06.2011 10:26, Erik Hofman wrote:
 There is now a new property /rendering/scene/overcast ranging from 0.0
 (normal behavior) to 1.0 (complete overcast).

Just wondering: we have /sim/rendering, which contains a long list of 
properties - including properties for clouds and precipitation. And we 
have /rendering which contains the scene/dome properties only. Is there 
a specific reasons these are separate?

cheers,
Thorsten

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Please insert disk into drive F:

2011-06-05 Thread Heiko Schulz

 Finally, I found 3 affected global models in fgdata. Martin, can you fix
 these please (needs to go to the scenery database):
 Models/Transport/ICE3middlecar.ac
 Models/Transport/ICE3middlecar2.ac

  these had been directly committed to CVS by one of those overly
clever committers who are known to be ignorant, by tradition, of every
general consistency rule. Life could be so easy, if 

And before someone shouts at me:
I was the author of the 3d-models- but the mentioned paths had been changed 
after I sent them to Vivian Meazza for including them into CVS. 
Not my fault, especially as I never had any right to directly commit things to 
CVS/GIT.

Thanks to Thorsten B. for finding the cause of that problem and fixing it.


Heiko

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[Flightgear-devel] FlightGear used in brain-control programm

2011-06-05 Thread Gijs de Rooy

Interesting use of FlightGear!
http://www.northeastern.edu/news/stories/2011/05/braincontrol.html  
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Please insert disk into drive F:

2011-06-05 Thread Martin Spott
Erik Hofman wrote:
 [...]

0) Does it meet the technical requirements for being used in
   FlightGear ?

Martin.
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] fgdata merge request 91:Animated Jetways

2011-06-05 Thread Durk Talsma
Hi All,

After having discussed this issue with Martin privately, we have come to the 
conclusion that it is in the best interest of FlightGear to back out parts of 
this commit, and wait for an improved version. I had accepted the merge 
request, after I had concluded that Martin's original objections had been 
resolved, but that appears not to be the case. 

I want to stress that we do see merit to the current patch, but note that there 
currently are still technical issues that need to be addressed before it is 
ready. To be more specific, the parts that I will remove are the Models/Jetways 
directory as well as the nasal files related to this system. I'm happy to 
accept a merge request where the issues addressed by Martin have been addressed.

Cheers,
Durk

On 05 Jun 2011, at 08:04, Ryan M wrote:

 On Fri, 2011-06-03 at 12:38 +, Martin Spott wrote:
 I'm feeling slightly uneasy with the current state because people don't
 get any jetways at all if they disable the flag in order to preserve
 performance.  Personally I'd prefer a solution which keeps static
 jetways and just disables the animation if people feel like the need
 to.
 
 That sounds like a good idea. But it _might_ still cause FPS impacts.
 Will have to run some tests later.
 
 On Fri, 2011-06-03 at 12:38 +, Martin Spott wrote:
 While I'm at it, I'd like to point to another, presumably more severe
 issue: The elevation of every of the animated jetways is hardcoded into
 the respective 'ICAO.jetway.xml' files.  Now take into account that
 ground elevation is subject to change with almost _every_ rebuild of
 the corresponding region and airfield surface 
 From my perspective this calls for a more considerate solution.
 
 The only solution I can think of is to remove the elevation setting and
 use Nasal to calculate the elevation for each jetway's
 longitude/latitude. The only problem with that is that the calculations
 would take into account the terminal buildings, which would cause
 jetways appearing on top of the terminal roofs.
 
 ...however, I just had another idea. Making the elevations _relative_ to
 the terrain instead of absolute. That means the current definition files
 will have to be changed, but I can automate that with a script easily
 enough. That also means I have to update my FG 2.0.0 version.
 
 
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Terrain engine

2011-06-05 Thread Frederic Bouvier
Le 05/06/2011 09:34, Michael Sgier a écrit :
 Salut Frederic
   what happened to the terrain engine, that you show at youtube? Could
 we get that into fgfs sometimes?
 Regards Michael

 On Sun, 2011-06-05 at 13:07 +0400, Slavutinsky Victor wrote:
   -Fred
  
  Little bit other topic.
  
  Hi Frederic, I have two questions for You.
  
  1) Can Your terrain engine be added in FG?
  2) Can it be fast enough for orbital flight with visibility ~500km and
  speed ~3km/h, ~8km/sec?
 There might be some more questions involved:
 3) Is it an accurate representation of the world or a procedural terrain
 engine.
 4) Are you willing to /and/ able to release it under the terms of the
 GPL.

My terrain engine is not ready and this project stalled another time
because of lack of
time on a long period. The code has nothing to do with FG except it uses
few classes
from SimGear, and the graphic engine is OSG. The file format is totally
different and
includes a precomputed LOD scheme (ROAM 2 for who's interested). It is
pictured in
this video : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7WYH27KyUBk
I let you juge if it could work for space flight.

The data used in the most recent videos are from the Custom Scenery
project and
the elevations are from SRTM. So it is real world data with the
potential to add some
procedurally generated small details to enhance detail levels at close
distance.

There is nothing that could prevent to release it under the GPL, but in
the light of
recent events (read FPS) I am not fond of releasing something that
couldn't be used
directly, but just stolen very easily. I am ok to think about some
restricted access
to the sources to known (core) developpers that are willing to
contribute to make
it usable and then included to the core if it pass the smell test.

Main current issues are :
1. realtime engine needs to be re-done using latest OSG DB features
2. atmospheric model (Bruneton's) produce artefacts for spheroidal earth
3. artefacts in shapefile clipping (something to do with the cylindrical
nature of longitudes)

 0) Does it meet the technical requirements for being used in
FlightGear ?
I'll let you elaborate on this topic before I could answer.

Regards,
-Fred

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Terrain engine

2011-06-05 Thread Martin Spott
Hi Frederic,

Frederic Bouvier wrote:

 0) Does it meet the technical requirements for being used in
FlightGear ?
 I'll let you elaborate on this topic before I could answer.

My comment was addressing those who are judging over the usability just
from watching a video on YouTube  :-)

Best regards,
Martin.
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Terrain engine

2011-06-05 Thread Slavutinsky Victor
 I'll let you elaborate on this topic before I could answer.

Frederic, thank You for answer. It seems what it's become more or less
clear now.

I think it's reasonable to test osgEarth at least to compare speed,
exactness, and including possibilities then. If Your engine is
completely different osg based product than FG then difference between
it and osgEarth engine, which other completely different osg based
product, including is mostly virtual. 

My opinion what's better to use things by near side, but only in case
it's better or equal to things on far. If it's hard to use then it seems
better to choose what's faster and easier in including.

As I heard, osgEarth already works as engine in some sim products. Do
not know if it have ROAM possibilities or some problems though. It would
be nice if some core level developer could look deeper into it. Dunno if
I could tell competent even if I would have time to test it myself.

Victor


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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Please insert disk into drive F:

2011-06-05 Thread Vivian Meazza


 From: Martin Spott [mailto:martin.sp...@mgras.net]
 Sent: 05 June 2011 15:35
 To: flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
 Subject: Re: [Flightgear-devel] Please insert disk into drive F:
 
 Erik Hofman wrote:
  [...]
 
 0) Does it meet the technical requirements for being used in
FlightGear ?
 
   Martin.

Could we please stop hijacking threads?

(and I know Martin wasn't the first offender)


Vivian



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Re: [Flightgear-devel] fgdata merge request 91:Animated Jetways

2011-06-05 Thread Ryan M
On Sun, 2011-06-05 at 16:40 +0200, Durk Talsma wrote:
 Hi All,
 
 After having discussed this issue with Martin privately, we have come to the 
 conclusion that it is in the best interest of FlightGear to back out parts of 
 this commit, and wait for an improved version. I had accepted the merge 
 request, after I had concluded that Martin's original objections had been 
 resolved, but that appears not to be the case. 

Very well. Should I still attempt my proposed amendments?


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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Please insert disk into drive F:

2011-06-05 Thread Vivian Meazza
Heiko Schulz wrote

 
 
  Finally, I found 3 affected global models in fgdata. Martin, can you
 fix
  these please (needs to go to the scenery database):
  Models/Transport/ICE3middlecar.ac
  Models/Transport/ICE3middlecar2.ac
 
   these had been directly committed to CVS by one of those overly
 clever committers who are known to be ignorant, by tradition, of every
 general consistency rule. Life could be so easy, if 
 
 And before someone shouts at me:
 I was the author of the 3d-models- but the mentioned paths had been
 changed after I sent them to Vivian Meazza for including them into CVS.
 Not my fault, especially as I never had any right to directly commit
 things to CVS/GIT.
 
 Thanks to Thorsten B. for finding the cause of that problem and fixing it.
 
 

I will hold my hand up for the D: stuff. There seems to have been a
technical issue with the CVS client I was using at the time using absolute
paths - but now one seems to have noticed up to now. However, I don't and
never have had a F: drive.

And while Martin is making snide remarks - nothing was done without
discussing it with Jon Stockill first. I thought that he was running the
database - obviously he isn't and the discussions were meaningless. Pity no
one has told Jon. 

Vivian





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Re: [Flightgear-devel] fgdata merge request 91:Animated Jetways

2011-06-05 Thread Durk Talsma

On 05 Jun 2011, at 20:13, Ryan M wrote:

 On Sun, 2011-06-05 at 16:40 +0200, Durk Talsma wrote:
 Hi All,
 
 After having discussed this issue with Martin privately, we have come to the 
 conclusion that it is in the best interest of FlightGear to back out parts 
 of this commit, and wait for an improved version. I had accepted the merge 
 request, after I had concluded that Martin's original objections had been 
 resolved, but that appears not to be the case. 
 
 Very well. Should I still attempt my proposed amendments?
 

Yes please. As indicated, I like the idea, and my impression is that the the 
general consensus is like that. That said, we are uncomfortable with some 
aspects of the current implementation. So, please consider the removal 
temporary until we had ironed out these issue.

Cheers,
Durk
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Please insert disk into drive F:

2011-06-05 Thread Slavutinsky Victor
 Could we please stop hijacking threads?
 
 (and I know Martin wasn't the first offender)

Do not know. If You ask me then I never had started any fight and would
not do that here for sure. It's so hard to tell who offends who in non
directive communications what attempts to do so only spoil common air
without any productive result.

My interest here is clear, I had made FG GPL craft what had get a lot of
my time as most complicated FG craft until now, and it still not so
funny to user due to current FG limitations which me personally can not
push far. I do not mean to offend someone, only trying to find people
who could help me to do so.

So I highly agree with You, stopping of offense is best option.

Victor


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[Flightgear-devel] Nasal submodules / local weather

2011-06-05 Thread ThorstenB
Hi Thorsten ( all),

some time ago I had added an option to introduce Nasal submodules, or,
to be more exact, to introduce Nasal modules using fgdata/Nasal/...
subdirectories and add an option to load such modules on demand only
(using a single enable/disable property per module).

This has several advantages:
* Nasal files can be grouped neatly instead of all scripts being mixed
up in a single fgdata/Nasal directory. Grouping makes a lot of sense for
modules consisting of several scripts - local weather is the best
example.
* Guaranteed loading sequence. Submodules are loaded _after_ the main
fgdata/Nasal scripts, so they can rely on all fgdata/Nasal content to be
already present. No more need for awkward listener callbacks, just to
make sure that basic props or gui modules are available.
* Finally, users have the option to disable loading modules.
Unfortunately, just loading scripts (code/data) into memory already
causes certain _run-time_ performance effects - even if the Nasal code
was never executed (so even when all listeners/timers were disabled).

Admittedly, I'm concerned that the rising number of complex Nasal
modules degrades the simulation performance for everyone. Having an
option to disable modules completely seems a good idea, so everyone can
choose for himself. And when something is not even loaded, it's
naturally guaranteed that it cannot have any performance effects at all.

I'd like to use the local weather module as a good example here. I'm
planning to do the same with a few other modules (tutorial.nas,
jetways*.nas, maybe multiplayer, and the new Nasal Boeing CDU).

I've done some tests with a local weather submodule and it seems fine.
Few modifications are required - mainly affects the init handlers (need
to listen to a different signal) and some GUI aspects (add an option to
enable/load the Nasal module, enable/disable menu items). I've attached
the changes. Before applying the patch, move the existing weather
scripts into a new subdirectory Nasal/local_weather:

# create new subdirectory local_weather
mkdir fgdata/Nasal/local_weather

# move existing files to new directory
mv fgdata/Nasal/compat_layer.nas fgdata/Nasal/local_weather/.
mv fgdata/Nasal/weather_dynamics.nas fgdata/Nasal/local_weather/.
mv fgdata/Nasal/weather_tiles.nas fgdata/Nasal/local_weather/.
mv fgdata/Nasal/local_weather.nas fgdata/Nasal/local_weather/.
mv fgdata/Nasal/weather_tile_management.nas fgdata/Nasal/local_weather/.

# apply patch (attached)
cd fgdata  patch -p1  local_weather.patch

I'd like to push the change to fgdata before the release. Please test if
you're happy with these changes - or let me know if you saw issues.

cheers,
Thorsten

diff --git a/Nasal/local_weather/compat_layer.nas b/Nasal/local_weather/compat_layer.nas
index 0fbd8e4..4605aed 100644
--- a/Nasal/local_weather/compat_layer.nas
+++ b/Nasal/local_weather/compat_layer.nas
@@ -67,8 +67,19 @@
 # The compatibility layer is currently work in progress and will be extended as new Nasal 
 # APIs are being added to FlightGear.
 
+var weather_dynamics = nil;
+var weather_tile_management = nil;
+var compat_layer = nil;
+var weather_tiles = nil;
+
+
+_setlistener(/nasal/local_weather/loaded, func { 
+
+compat_layer = local_weather;
+weather_dynamics = local_weather;
+weather_tile_management = local_weather;
+weather_tiles = local_weather;
 
-_setlistener(/sim/signals/nasal-dir-initialized, func { 
 
 var result = yes;
 
diff --git a/Nasal/local_weather/local_weather.nas b/Nasal/local_weather/local_weather.nas
index 52c7a2f..eecb95a 100644
--- a/Nasal/local_weather/local_weather.nas
+++ b/Nasal/local_weather/local_weather.nas
@@ -4414,10 +4414,18 @@ setprop(lw~tiles/tile-counter,0);
 
 setprop(lwi~ipoint-number,0);
 
+var updateMenu = func {
+	var isEnabled = getprop(/nasal/local_weather/enabled);
+	gui.menuEnable(local_weather, isEnabled);
+	gui.menuEnable(local_weather_tiles, isEnabled);
+}
+
+_setlistener(/nasal/local_weather/enabled, updateMenu);
 
 # wait for Nasal to be available and do what is in startup()
 
-_setlistener(/sim/signals/nasal-dir-initialized, func {
+_setlistener(/nasal/local_weather/loaded, func {
+	updateMenu();
 	startup();
 });
 
diff --git a/gui/dialogs/local_weather_config.xml b/gui/dialogs/local_weather_config.xml
index 5826cff..f72bb54 100644
--- a/gui/dialogs/local_weather_config.xml
+++ b/gui/dialogs/local_weather_config.xml
@@ -6,10 +6,22 @@
 
  namelocal_weather_config/name
  width400/width
- height400/height
+ height440/height
  modalfalse/modal
 
 
+checkbox
+   x5/x
+   y400/y
+   width15/width
+   height15/height
+   labelEnable local weather module/label
+   property/nasal/local_weather/enabled/property
+   binding
+commanddialog-apply/command
+   /binding
+/checkbox
+
 text
   x5/x
   y370/y
diff --git a/gui/menubar.xml b/gui/menubar.xml
index bbaa69a..fba2618 100644
--- a/gui/menubar.xml
+++ b/gui/menubar.xml
@@ -329,14 +329,8 @@
 
 		item
 			labelLocal Weather/label
-			binding
-

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Object distance fading color

2011-06-05 Thread Erik Hofman
On Sun, 2011-06-05 at 14:34 +0200, ThorstenB wrote:
 On 05.06.2011 10:26, Erik Hofman wrote:
  There is now a new property /rendering/scene/overcast ranging from 0.0
  (normal behavior) to 1.0 (complete overcast).
 
 Just wondering: we have /sim/rendering, which contains a long list of 
 properties - including properties for clouds and precipitation. And we 
 have /rendering which contains the scene/dome properties only. Is there 
 a specific reasons these are separate?

Not that I know of, but I was always under the impression
that /sim/rendering was honored once at startup only.

Erik


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Re: [Flightgear-devel] fgdata merge request 91:Animated Jetways

2011-06-05 Thread Martin Spott
Durk Talsma wrote:
 On 05 Jun 2011, at 20:13, Ryan M wrote:

 Very well. Should I still attempt my proposed amendments?
 
 
 Yes please.

Adding to Durks statement(s), I'd like to express my particular
appreciation to the idea of applying relative elevations - this
approach is quite similar to the elevation offset we're maintaining
for certain shared object positions in the Scenemodels repository.

Cheers,
Martin.
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[Flightgear-devel] fgfs log files with qt process

2011-06-05 Thread HB-GRAL
Hi all

I am trying to to write fgfs stderr output to a file. This is no problem 
when I use redirection like  logifle.log in a shell of course, but - 
unfortunately - this can not be passed as argument with qt by 
startDetached process, which I use with fgx launcher and which is static.

I am not able to add such a option to fgfs. Is there someone who can 
help me and add such log/debug file output option to fgfs?

Thanks for your response, Yves

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[Flightgear-devel] Today's Git - MSVC9 build error

2011-06-05 Thread Vivian Meazza
Today's Git fails to build on MSVC9 with the following error:

src\Main\main.cxx(624) : error C2017: illegal escape sequence

this is caused by an errant space at the end line # 624. I have some other
work in train - if no one gets there first, I'll include a fix in that.

Vivian



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Re: [Flightgear-devel] FlightGear used in brain-control programm

2011-06-05 Thread Curtis Olson
On Sun, Jun 5, 2011 at 8:20 AM, Gijs de Rooy wrote:

 Interesting use of FlightGear!

http://www.northeastern.edu/news/stories/2011/05/http://www.northeastern.edu/news/stories/2011/05/braincontrol.html
braincontrol.htmlhttp://www.northeastern.edu/news/stories/2011/05/braincontrol.html

Cool project!  Thanks for sharing the link.  I wonder if we could get
someone from the team to write a 2-3 paragraph newletter article with a
picture or two?

Curt.
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] gnome 3 ?

2011-06-05 Thread Curtis Olson
This weekend I took the plunge and upgraded my main desktop machine to
Fedora 15 + Gnome 3.  Out of the gate I hit some serious culture shock, but
I'm starting to get the hang of the new gnome interface and it's growing on
me quickly.

There are many good reviews posted online explaining the new gnome 3
interface, but I figured I'd post my own thoughts too:

http://gallinazo.flightgear.org/technology/fedora-15-and-gnome-3/

FlightGear seems to compile and run pretty much exactly as before with
Fedora 14, so no complaints there.  So far so good ... !

Curt.


On Fri, Jun 3, 2011 at 3:24 AM, Chris Baines wrote:

 I use Gnome 3 and FlightGear and it works well. I do like the Shell,
 and after a while it does grow on you.

 The main problem I think is that people logically think that as Gnome
 3 is released the Shell is completed, where that is far from the
 truth, much of the work is still to be done.

 As you point out its hard to configure and might not be as intuitive
 as it could be but it looks like an alright base to work from.

 On 3 June 2011 08:54, Stefan Seifert n...@detonation.org wrote:
  On Friday 03 June 2011 06:10:24 Curtis Olson wrote:
 
  Looks like the linux desktop folks have stopped chasing windows and are
 now
  chasing mac?   Quote from an online review: gnome 3 gives you any color
  theme you like ... if you like black.
 
  s/linux desktop/Gnome/
  There's still KDE and all the lighter desktops available which do not
 force
  anything on you.
 
  And according to a phoronix comparison, the KDE window manager seems most
 of
  the time to be the one affecting performance the least. And if that's
 still too
  much, deactivating desktop effects is just a shortcut away.
 
 
 http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=articleitem=linux_desktop_managers1num=1
 
  Stefan
 
 
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