Re: [FRIAM] Potential Vorticity and the Dynamic Tropopause

2024-05-15 Thread Prof David West
Nick, I hesitate to respond to your post because: 1) my interest in the weather is nominal, although I am bemused that here in St. Paul MN, we had more 50+ degrees in the December-February time frame than below 0 days (almost three times as many). Most unusual. 2) the response I wish to make

Re: [FRIAM] death by ubiquity

2024-03-28 Thread Prof David West
Published a paper couple of years back — IT is not Sustainable. One point was power consumption: known server-farms at that time used more energy per year than the UK. Less than 10% came from renewable sources. Not included were all the “secret” farms in Russia, China, etc., or centers like

Re: [FRIAM] the inequities of uniquity

2024-03-22 Thread Prof David West
this is 'unique' only if you exclude Vedic, Buddhist, Taoist, ... thought. davew On Fri, Mar 22, 2024, at 9:54 AM, Stephen Guerin wrote: > Prompt: > Express a unique concept. Make it as profound as possible > > https://chat.openai.com/share/649bd4ca-f856-451e-83a2-01fc2cfe47fb > > > > On

Re: [FRIAM] The problems of interdisciplinary research

2024-02-12 Thread Prof David West
The notion of search brings to mind two different experiences: 1- traditional "searching" of the library via the card catalog (yes, I know I am old) for relevant inputs; and, 2- the "serendipity of the stacks"—simply looking around me at the books I located via search type 1 to see what was in

Re: [FRIAM] Breaking Bad and Free Will

2024-01-26 Thread Prof David West
Science fiction: *The Traveler*, by John Twelve Hawks is set in a dystopian (near future) 'Big Brother' world of absolute and constant surveillance. The hero, a "Traveler" uses a random number generator to make every action choice, else be eliminated by the evil forces controlling the world.

Re: [FRIAM] sui generis

2024-01-09 Thread Prof David West
Ancient Greek notions of "creativity" lacked any sense of egocentric novelty. To 'create' was to 'remember'. This was grounded in the more general philosophy that denied the possibility of "something-from-nothing." In my Design Thinking book, there is a large section about this and about who

Re: [FRIAM] Democracy & Autocracy

2023-08-15 Thread Prof David West
I am about to get myself in trouble, so important caveats: I do not like Trump, I do not want to see him in office again, and I am happy to apply the adjectives, venal, crude, infantile, hyperbolic, and cunning-but-stupid to him. 1-all of the indictments assert that the words and actions of

Re: [FRIAM] Thursday

2023-07-19 Thread Prof David West
I am going to the Oshkosh Air Show next week. Mathew would be jealous. davew On Tue, Jul 18, 2023, at 7:08 PM, Frank Wimberly wrote: > We're taking grandson Matthew to Colorado Springs to see the WW2 Aircraft > Museum. We leave tomorrow and return Friday. That means I won't be in Santa > Fe

Re: [FRIAM] What is an agent [was: Philosophy and Science}

2023-07-18 Thread Prof David West
teleonomic matter (particles that think) - totally consistent with Vedic / Buddhist cosmology. Even elementary particles are subject to the Law of Karma if they "misbehave"—something very unlikely, but not impossible. davew On Mon, Jul 17, 2023, at 10:27 PM, Roger Critchlow wrote: > > > On

Re: [FRIAM] What is an agent [was: Philosophy and Science}

2023-07-17 Thread Prof David West
Where angels fear to tread, dave rushes in. Question 1) seems, to me, to be nonsensical; or hopelessly anthropocentric; or, unanswerable in any generalized or abstract form. Paraphrasing question 2) — what set of observables (behaviors) must be present before We/I can assert, "*t***hat *thing

Re: [FRIAM] What is an agent [was: Philosophy and Science}

2023-07-15 Thread Prof David West
If you have not read it — I highly recommend The Tree of Knowledge by Humberto Maturana and Francisco Varela. Self organization from simple to complex via a single mechanism. On Fri, Jul 14, 2023, at 7:30 PM, David Eric Smith wrote: > I have had a version of this problem for several years,

Re: [FRIAM] Trees as wind farms.

2023-06-27 Thread Prof David West
I have no problem with "make use of" as trees are sentient. Also, "Trees need wind to blow against them because it causes their root systems to grow deeper, which supports the tree as it grows taller." And, what glen wrote. davew On Tue, Jun 27, 2023, at 11:29 AM, glen wrote: > "make use of"

Re: [FRIAM] Radical Empiricism

2023-06-05 Thread Prof David West
What James is talking about / alluding to: A - Hallucinogens (which he did experience) where the "preconceived notions of theories" are disrupted, and one gropes to make sense of what is apprehended. But, this is only a partial example as multiple perceptual filters, "oh wow the colors, the

Re: [FRIAM] crackpots and privilege

2023-06-02 Thread Prof David West
I have just started reading **The Earth Transformed** by Peter Frankorian. It seems to have some relevance to this discussion as one of its themese is how multiple climate change events in the past shaped human adaptation and evolution. Might provide some interesting ground for what kind of

Re: [FRIAM] crackpots and privilege

2023-05-31 Thread Prof David West
? The idea of a gaggle of toddlers running around hunting and >>> cooking, say, boar for supper is astounding. Even Children of the Corn were >>> older than 2. 8^D >>> >>>> On 5/31/23 06:19, Prof David West wrote: >>>> "the extended juvenile dev

Re: [FRIAM] crackpots and privilege

2023-05-31 Thread Prof David West
"the extended juvenile development of humans," is an artifact of modern industrial society. For "de-domesticated humans" development to, mostly, independent existence was only marginally longer than that of other large mammals. Roughly two years for humans, 18 months for elephants and bears and

Re: [FRIAM] Declaration of Ethics for AI

2023-05-22 Thread Prof David West
I would echo both your amusement and non-positivity. When it comes to AI ethics, I doubt that much improvement over Asimov's Three Laws of Robotics (and the Zero-th Law invented by the Robots themselves) is possible or necessary. davew On Mon, May 22, 2023, at 10:21 AM, Merle Lefkoff wrote:

Re: [FRIAM] Bard and Don Quixote

2023-05-17 Thread Prof David West
My sympathies would be with your friend—until such time as a**_ "clone exactly like her ... behavior, words, or even existence..." _**was demonstrated. "Exactly" is a big word! and I would add "completely." Even on a single dimension, say use of language, the standard of exact and complete is

Re: [FRIAM] Paxton's stages as a dynamical system

2023-05-10 Thread Prof David West
Once upon a time, I was a card carrying (metaphorically) bomb making (literally), persecuted (FBI and CIA in Japan) revolutionary. I was also an acid head, free love, hippy. The "card carrying" part denotes my membership in / participation in a "movement." The Paxton quote you shared — the

Re: [FRIAM] selective optimism

2023-05-09 Thread Prof David West
The opinion of an "advanced layman." I claim the status because my Computer Science MS was in AI. My first professional publication was in *AI Magazine*, then the journal of record for the discipline. I have appeared on panels with Herbert Simon, Marvin Minsky, and Herbert Dreyfus at AI

Re: [FRIAM] AI possibilities

2023-04-06 Thread Prof David West
t; Yes, if a large language model is trained on all works of Mozart and >> contemporary artists like Haydn, it should be able to create a new piece of >> music which sounds almost like Mozart. Finally we can listen to Mozart's >> lost 28th piano concerto or Beethoven's missi

[FRIAM] AI possibilities

2023-04-04 Thread Prof David West
Based on the flood of stories about ChatAI, it appears: - they can 'do' math and 'reason' scientificdally - they can generate essays, term papers, etc. - they can engage in convincing dialog/conversations - as "therapists" - as "girlfriends" (I haven't seen any stories about women

Re: [FRIAM] emergent mind - ai news by ai

2023-03-30 Thread Prof David West
Steve Smith's use of the phrase "arms race" reminded me of John Brunner's *Shockwave Rider *and its underlying premise of the dangers of constant change, 'first the legs race, then the arms race, then the brain race'. (Brunner was inspired by Tofler's book, *Future Shock*.) The book also poses

[FRIAM] AI Musings

2023-03-30 Thread Prof David West
The "AI Pause" made national TV news yesterday (long after those on this list noted and reacted to it) and that made me revisit a theme I have thought about since Newell, Simon, and Shaw created Logic Theorist. Advocates take a caricature (perhaps too strong a word) of human intelligence,

[FRIAM] a little help from my friends

2023-03-30 Thread Prof David West
I am keynoting the International Conference on Code Quality on April 22. It will be speculative and philosophical, but I would like to know "code quality" might mean, is taken for granted to mean, to professional coders. I know what it means for this conference, but would like a broader base

[FRIAM] Stephen Hawkings final theory

2023-03-19 Thread Prof David West
Just pre-ordered Hertog's, *On the Origin of Time*, that presents Stephen Hawking's "final" theory - summarized in the phrase: *"The laws of physics are not set in stone but are born and co-evolve as the universe they govern takes shape." *Should be a great read. davew -. --- - / ...- .- .-..

[FRIAM] WEIRD and STRANGE

2023-03-19 Thread Prof David West
Perhaps Perhaps of interest to the psychologists and ethologists in the group: claim that research is biased (and therefore unreliable to a degree) because the people studied are WEIRD - Western - Educated -Industrialized - Rich - (from) Democratic societies and animals studied are

Re: [FRIAM] parameter tuning

2023-03-08 Thread Prof David West
Wonderful!!! Thanks. Can't wait for my issue of the magazine to arrive. davew On Wed, Mar 8, 2023, at 6:54 AM, glen wrote: > This Is a Philosopher on Drugs > https://www.wired.com/story/this-is-a-philosopher-on-drugs/ > > -- > ꙮ Mɥǝu ǝlǝdɥɐuʇs ɟᴉƃɥʇ' ʇɥǝ ƃɹɐss snɟɟǝɹs˙ ꙮ > > -. --- - / ...- .-

Re: [FRIAM] ChatGPT and William James

2023-03-07 Thread Prof David West
I am sure that none of the respectable members of this list will have encountered this, but Jochen's comment: *"it is additionally trained extensively how to respond ***_correctly_*** by humans" *(emphasis mine of course) means I cannot resist sharing. I just read an amusing ChatGPT

Re: [FRIAM] [EXT] News Alert: Most young men are single. Most young women are not.

2023-02-23 Thread Prof David West
The biggest not-accounted-for cost is human. All those kids in lithium mines earning 12 cents a day. davew On Thu, Feb 23, 2023, at 3:41 AM, Santafe wrote: > There is a skewness in the various analyses of these things (in the > sense of two lines of non-common direction embedded in enough >

Re: [FRIAM] Nick's Categories

2023-02-20 Thread Prof David West
I am hearing echoes of Rubert Sheldrake in your last sentence davew On Mon, Feb 20, 2023, at 8:46 AM, glen wrote: > Despite the ambiguity both Nick and DaveW rely on when they use the > word "dualism", the "psyche" in panpsychism need not be dualist. > Experience monism is a kind of

Re: [FRIAM] Nick's Categories

2023-02-20 Thread Prof David West
niche as any > particular one of Shakespeare’s plays. But to put the question that > way is the only way I know to use language. > > Eric > >> On Feb 18, 2023, at 9:22 AM, Prof David West wrote: >> >> Panpsychism is fundamentally dualist. There is 'Mind" and ther

Re: [FRIAM] Nick's Categories

2023-02-18 Thread Prof David West
Panpsychism is fundamentally dualist. There is 'Mind" and there is 'Matter'. However, neither is found in isolation, Mind is always embedded in Matter and all Matter possesses Mind. This is a proportionate relation: very tiny bits of Matter (string, particle) embed very minute "auras" of

Re: [FRIAM] Nick's Categories

2023-02-17 Thread Prof David West
Yes, I have experienced the "mental life" of the dirt at my feet (or rough equivalent). It is rather boring, given that the amount/degree of "psych" possessed by your average soil molecule is diminutive in the extreme. But the"psych" is there and it can be "sensed/perceived." At somewhat

Re: [FRIAM] Thuram still happening?

2023-02-15 Thread Prof David West
I will be traveling to Wisconsin tomorrow and miss Thuram. 2-cents: a word cloud might be a more useful metaphor than a semantic net, just because of the formalisms employed in the latter. True a cloud lacks explicit links, but such might be lightly sprinkled therein. Did a huge double take at

Re: [FRIAM] Datasets as Experience

2023-02-07 Thread Prof David West
I am curious, but not enough to do some hard research to confirm or deny, but ... Surface appearances suggest, to me, that the large language model AIs seem to focus on syntax and statistical word usage derived from those large datasets. I do not see any evidence in same of semantics (probably

[FRIAM] experience monism

2023-02-04 Thread Prof David West
The eloquence and perspicacity of Professor Thompson has convinced me to become an *Experience* monist. In my naive sophomoric enthusiasm I have set about writing THE definitive work on *Experience*. But I have a few questions ... 1) Is an *Experience* a whole or a composite? I.e., (scent of

Re: [FRIAM] serious AI question

2023-01-30 Thread Prof David West
n, say, a random event where the > humans/artifacts are rationalized later as having been triggered and > been the trigger? > > > On 1/28/23 15:10, Prof David West wrote: >> This is a serious question albeit one in a realm that many would dismiss as >> non-serious

[FRIAM] serious AI question

2023-01-28 Thread Prof David West
This is a serious question albeit one in a realm that many would dismiss as non-serious. First, some background. Rinzai Zen is the "sudden enlightenment" school that asserts the possibility of a single event serving as a 'trigger' that evokes/instills-in-the-mind a state of enlightenment. The

Re: [FRIAM] help with archives

2023-01-20 Thread Prof David West
Thank you very much, Needs revision and updating, but I am glad to have it back. davew On Fri, Jan 20, 2023, at 3:25 PM, glen wrote: > http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/Truth-Hunh-What-is-it-good-for-Absolutely-Nothing-tp7590706.html > > On 1/20/23 14:12, Prof David West wrote: >

Re: [FRIAM] Dope Slap Thread

2023-01-20 Thread Prof David West
Nick wrote: (emphasis mine) *"Even though I might have to admit that the truth will never be found, *I still find that the truth is an aspiration that I cannot live without.* So I think that probably the underlying in Peirce as I see him is that human experience is the result of cognition,

[FRIAM] help with archives

2023-01-20 Thread Prof David West
Pardon my ignorance of something I should know how to do, but have not had reason to do it, and hence my ongoing ignorance. I made a post a long time ago with a title close to, "truth, what is it good for? absolutely nothing" Might someone brighter than me, find it in the archives so I can cut

Re: [FRIAM] NickC channels DaveW

2023-01-19 Thread Prof David West
That's why logic(s) that tolerate inconsistency are so cool > (to me). > > On 1/19/23 07:52, Prof David West wrote: >> My optimism is tempered, and less than Pieters. >> >> /"When we contemplate the shocking derangement of human affairs which now >> prevai

Re: [FRIAM] NickC channels DaveW

2023-01-19 Thread Prof David West
My optimism is tempered, and less than Pieters. *"When we contemplate the shocking derangement of human affairs which now prevails in most civilized countries, including our own, even the best minds are puzzled and uncertain in their attempts to grasp the situation.The world seems to demand a

Re: [FRIAM] NickC channels DaveW

2023-01-17 Thread Prof David West
Apropos of nothing: The human heart has roughly 40,000 neurons and the human gut around 0.1 billion neurons (sensory neurons, neurotransmitters, ganglia, and motor neurons). So the human gut is about 1/5 as smart as Marcus's dog?? davew On Tue, Jan 17, 2023, at 1:08 PM, Marcus Daniels wrote:

Re: [FRIAM] Dope slaps, anyone? Text displaying correctly?

2023-01-16 Thread Prof David West
I do not know and have not read Feferman, so this may be totally off base, but ... glen stated: *Worded one way: Schema are the stable patterns that emerge from the particulars. And the variation of the particulars is circumscribed (bounded, defined) by the schema. * This is a description of

Re: [FRIAM] Fwd: Conference Invitation: Designing Tech for Social Cohesion

2023-01-04 Thread Prof David West
one and fragile containers? > Posthumanism has always been the driver for me. > > *From:* Friam *On Behalf Of *Prof David West > *Sent:* Wednesday, January 4, 2023 3:27 PM > *To:* friam@redfish.com > *Subject:* Re: [FRIAM] Fwd: Conference Invitation: Designing Tech for Social >

Re: [FRIAM] Fwd: Conference Invitation: Designing Tech for Social Cohesion

2023-01-04 Thread Prof David West
Merle, >From the book I am currently finishing: Manifesto Every aspect of human life — how we work, play, live, and love; how we define our relationships with each other and with our environment — have been, and continue to be, shaped by computers and the software that drives them. Those

Re: [FRIAM] technical notes on fusion announcement

2022-12-23 Thread Prof David West
Instead of a cable - maybe Tesla’s unrealized broadcast technology? I don’t remember the details but he was going to send power from Long Island, via the ionosphere, to light the world expo in Paris. Davew On Thu, Dec 22, 2022, at 2:16 PM, Steve Smith wrote: > Following the conception of a

Re: [FRIAM] collective sheepishness

2022-11-22 Thread Prof David West
Not Sheep, but human societies, have done similar things in our collective past. David Graeber's book, the Origin of Everything, details the multiplicity of organizational and governmental forms and poses the question of how did we get stuck in the one we have now. davew On Mon, Nov 21,

[FRIAM] naive question

2022-10-20 Thread Prof David West
Marcus and glen (and others on occasion) have posted frequently on the "algorithmic "equivalent" of [some feature] of consciousness, human emotion, etc. I am always confronted with the question of of "how equivalent?" I am almost certain that they are not saying anything close to absolute

Re: [FRIAM] Is consciousness measurable?

2022-10-18 Thread Prof David West
is not a necessary element of consciousness, but I think a being > without emotion would be at best a pale version of consciousness. > > __-- Russ Abbott > Professor Emeritus, Computer Science > California State University, Los Angeles > > &

Re: [FRIAM] Is consciousness measurable?

2022-10-18 Thread Prof David West
I an concurrently reading, *Nineteen Ways of Looking at Consciousness*, by Patrick House and *Mountain in the Sea*, by Ray Nayler. The latter is fiction. (The former, because it deals with consciousness may also be fiction, but it purports to be neuro-scientific / philosophical.) The novel is

Re: [FRIAM] My Work On Earth Is Not Yet Done

2022-10-18 Thread Prof David West
Colloquially, "in your head" signifies that construct—the self, the consciousness— that you do not accept as a real thing. If one were to be charitable, one might interpret the sentence as "it is not psychosomatic." Reason being pain results in signals in both the body and the brain, so it is

Re: [FRIAM] culinary Complexity question

2022-10-17 Thread Prof David West
A six pack of Sing Ha (18% alcohol) helped me get through my dish of quartered river frogs with ghost peppers last time I was in Thailand. davew On Mon, Oct 17, 2022, at 3:28 AM, Gillian Densmore wrote: > Oh neet. I didn't know their's more than one kind of capsaicin. I wonder if > part of

Re: [FRIAM] hacking neural nets via compiler

2022-10-12 Thread Prof David West
technique. > > > On October 12, 2022 2:38:28 PM PDT, Prof David West > wrote: >> interesting article >> >> davew > -. --- - / ...- .- .-.. .. -.. / -- --- .-. ... . / -.-. --- -.. . > FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv > Fridays 9a-12p Frida

Re: [FRIAM] Automata with FFT

2022-10-03 Thread Prof David West
ilosopical questions. included diagram, but forgot text in previous email. davew On Mon, Oct 3, 2022, at 4:01 PM, Prof David West wrote: > In my personal opinion, I am closer to your conviction than the > academic/objective perspective I presented; at least to the extent of > being ab

Re: [FRIAM] Automata with FFT

2022-10-03 Thread Prof David West
> Hopefully, I could be forgiven for thinking geometry plays a huge role > in at least this take on NO. But I'm starting to see why one might > think it's applicable without metrics. I can't steelman it, yet, > though. 8^D > > On 10/1/22 15:19, Prof David West wrote: >> RE:

Re: [FRIAM] What is the response when bad faith is pervasive and coordinated?

2022-10-01 Thread Prof David West
I have been thinking a lot about the *"public movement to disintegrate society."* It feels like we are in the throes of a country-wide schismogenesis - the process of defining ourselves as what our neighbors are not. We expect differences in culture in different environments/contexts, but

Re: [FRIAM] Automata with FFT

2022-10-01 Thread Prof David West
RE: Alexander and Geometry First, my notion of 'geometry' may be too simplistic and too Euclidean. If so, please point out what I may be overlooking. I did a quick review of Alexander's major works and found few mentions of 'geometry' as I understand the term. One of the major ones was in

Re: [FRIAM] Wolpert - discussion thread placeholder

2022-10-01 Thread Prof David West
continuing in the original thread ... Wolpert question 5: my previous arguing that knowledge and information—but of a different order/kind—and "TRUTH" can be found on an LSD trip seems like a negative answer to Wolpert's Fifth. Yes, we do have access to and can learn to use 'alternate states

Re: [FRIAM] Automata with FFT

2022-09-27 Thread Prof David West
g* from one to >> the other is essentially metaphorical, though the metaphorical source >> domains (e.g. religious, political, sociological... ) are often layered and >> rich in their structure, but definitely more "topological" than "geometric"? >> &

Re: [FRIAM] Automata with FFT

2022-09-26 Thread Prof David West
, *where* or *how* has it gone wrong > in extrapolation? Did Alexander go wrong in his extrapolation? Or did > others [mis]interpret? > > (I've purposefully left the Subject the same because it definitely > relates to Chan's morphology based taxonomy and my argument with my > m

Re: [FRIAM] Automata with FFT

2022-09-26 Thread Prof David West
I am a patterns and Alexander expert. glen's uncertainty / mild antipathy is spot on. Software patterns are an oxymoron. Strong words, but happy to back them up with dozens of papers written/presented and hours of discussion. davew On Mon, Sep 26, 2022, at 6:29 AM, glen wrote: > Very cool!

Re: [FRIAM] Wolpert - discussion thread placeholder

2022-09-15 Thread Prof David West
Just to be clear, I have zero antipathy towards Wolpert or his efforts at steelmanning. I think Wolpert does an excellent job of phrasing as questions what I perceive "Scientists" and "Computationalists" to merely assert as Truth. I have long tilted at that particular windmill and I applaud

Re: [FRIAM] Wolpert - discussion thread placeholder

2022-09-14 Thread Prof David West
Regarding Wolpert's first four questions: In my opinion, all four reflect a kind of arrogance that I have accused Scientists and Mathematicians of many times in the past—an attitude that modern formal and abstract math and science are a kind of ultimate achievement of our species. Any and all

Re: [FRIAM] Floppy disks still live. Sorta

2022-09-14 Thread Prof David West
My very first PC was a Xerox 820 with a cabled IBM selectric as a printer and (2) 8" floppy drives. davew On Wed, Sep 14, 2022, at 9:58 AM, Steve Smith wrote: > When Mary moved here she had a collection of 3.5" floppies with her > early poetry on them...  she wasn't sure what she had and

Re: [FRIAM] Wolpert - discussion thread placeholder

2022-09-11 Thread Prof David West
Wolpert's questions are fantastic. Thanks glen for prompting this discussion. Re: question one about the "chasm with minimal cognitive capabilities necessary ..." I have two major problems with the assumptions behind this question. First, the assumption that Godel, Einstein, and Beethoven

[FRIAM] Wolpert - discussion thread placeholder

2022-09-09 Thread Prof David West
Just wanted to put this here as a placeholder for future conversation as I would like to take up Wolpert's questions even though I am not "miraculous" per glen's invitation. I do need a day to two to read and pose questions /make observations, but others might be ready to chime in with

Re: [FRIAM] signal and noise

2022-09-09 Thread Prof David West
rs. A great example of this > was that "junk" DNA which turned out to be, at least, structural. It > also turned out to be a mind of memory. Junk Schmunk. > > N > > Nick Thompson > thompnicks...@gmail.com > https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/ > &

[FRIAM] signal and noise

2022-09-08 Thread Prof David West
It seems, to me, that several conversations here—AI, hallucinogens, consciousness, participant observation, and epistemology—have a common aspect: a body of "data" and disagreement over which subset should be attended to (Signal) and that which is irrelevant (Noise). Arguments for

Re: [FRIAM] The equations of the mind

2022-09-08 Thread Prof David West
Descartes' "joined and intermingled" view is actually very ancient. The Vedas are the oldest known "philosophical" writings and they put forth the notion that 'Mind' (Purusa) and 'Matter' (Pkrati) are infused from the tiniest atom to large structures. 'Mind' is complex, matter is not, and mind

Re: [FRIAM] more structure-based mind-reading

2022-09-01 Thread Prof David West
>From glen: *"If you want to share values with some arbitrary shmoe, then get >to** * * *work*. Build something or cooperate on a common task. Talking,** * * communicating, is inadequate at best, disinfo at worst."* This is kinda the whole point of _Participant_ Observation at the core

Re: [FRIAM] Augmented Reality

2022-08-23 Thread Prof David West
another, I think relevant/interesting science fiction reference: Neal Stephenson's *Snow Crash*. Not central to the novel, but central to scene settting for much of the action was a concept of a metaverse—a single streeet 32,000 miles long) where the superstructure/infrastructure was paid

Re: [FRIAM] Jack Cowan / Visual Hallucinations and structure of Visual Cortex (was Re: dystopian vision(s))

2022-08-20 Thread Prof David West
e residents were referring to >>>> Ft-Pueblo to reference the (near) continuous development of the I25 >>>> corridor from Ft. Collins to Pueblo. I flew back from Europe into Denver >>>> and drove from my daughter's place in Parker (south-south-Denver) to >>>&g

Re: [FRIAM] dystopian vision(s)

2022-08-18 Thread Prof David West
were I to try to steelman your >>>>> argument, I'd suggest that, yes, the process by which our bodies >>>>> refine/focus/hone-down our attention to a smaller, compressed thing from >>>>> a larger thing (whether the largess is "noise" or not is a

Re: [FRIAM] dystopian vision(s)

2022-08-17 Thread Prof David West
> and expose the Real Reality. > > > The mind may be configured to be a 5G transceiver or CAT scan? > > Marcus > > > *From:* Friam on behalf of Prof David West > > *Sent:* Tuesday, August 16, 2022 6:16 PM > *To:* friam@redfish.com > *Subject:* Re:

Re: [FRIAM] dystopian vision(s)

2022-08-16 Thread Prof David West
vides. Computer-based augmentaiton would provide a hard > limit ... an unavoidable abstraction/subset of reality. > > On 8/15/22 19:04, Prof David West wrote: >> The hallucino-philia (and Buddhist epistemologists) would argue that our >> brains (minds) already fully gra

Re: [FRIAM] "tech" companies suck

2022-08-15 Thread Prof David West
personal anecdote: when I was fifteen, I took a bus trip from Salt Lake City to Boston, New Yorkand the '65 World's Fair (held two years, 64 and 65), DC, then Nauvoo and the Mormon Trail back to SLC. The tour director noted that I bought newspapers at every gas stop and by the third day I was

Re: [FRIAM] "tech" companies suck

2022-08-15 Thread Prof David West
The single most used social media by teens/early adults is Youtu.be 95%. Facebook, in that demographic, is but 32%. davew On Mon, Aug 15, 2022, at 9:14 AM, Gary Schiltz wrote: > Here in Ecuador, group chat is very widespread. Unfortunately (?) it is > mostly through informal WhatsApp groups.

Re: [FRIAM] dystopian vision(s)

2022-08-15 Thread Prof David West
from glen's narrative the following quote: "In summary, depending on how exactly one wants to define the word “simulate”, the concerns of Bostrom, et al., properly formalized, strongly suggest that augmenting our brains can never allow us to fully grasp / cognize / perceive our physical

Re: [FRIAM] Isness: Using Multi-Person VR to Design Peak Mystical-Type Experiences Comparable to Psychedelics

2022-08-08 Thread Prof David West
With VR your 'ordinary senses' are still functional and still sending signals to the brain—hence "simulator sickness" when your inner ears disagree with your eyes. Also, the fact that your brain still has access to "normal" data, it tends to interpolate and interpret the sensory data from the

Re: [FRIAM] AI etiquette, Marijuana research

2022-07-20 Thread Prof David West
I would not consider Asimov's robots to be "flat and empty," but they are an anomaly in that regard. They did, after all, invent the Zeroth Law of Robotics all by themselves. davew On Wed, Jul 20, 2022, at 2:18 PM, David Eric Smith wrote: > I feel like this is yet another reminder that humans,

Re: [FRIAM] thanks for nothing biden

2022-07-07 Thread Prof David West
This summer there was a "cruiser bicycle" gathering here in Vegas. heavy frames, fat tires, lights everywhere, and sound systems. One trike had a large 'trunk'; with a pull out gas grill and a sound system that rivaled those in movie theaters for sheer volume. Most were pure pedal driven but

[FRIAM] book recommendation

2022-07-03 Thread Prof David West
Marc-Uwe Kling, *Qualityland*, a novel. AIs, Amazon on steroids, oligarchies, Facebook ranking, Google search profiles (and Amazon equivalents), everything you WILL want in your future, today!!! -. --- - / ...- .- .-.. .. -.. / -- --- .-. ... . / -.-. --- -.. . FRIAM Applied Complexity Group

Re: [FRIAM] Republicans need to renew themselves (was: self-care)

2022-07-02 Thread Prof David West
David, you are absolutely correct. Seldom is absolutist rhetoric anything other than petulant expression. It's other major use is to shout down contrary speech and prevent the kind of specific and nuanced discussion that both you and I would prefer. It would be so cool to explore the

Re: [FRIAM] Republicans need to renew themselves (was: self-care)

2022-07-02 Thread Prof David West
he general election. So far, it hasn't > seemed to work. > > On Sat, Jul 2, 2022 at 10:33 AM Prof David West wrote: >> __ >> *"The Republicans lost their way. When the Republicans turned into a MAGA >> party, they lost their last sparks of integrity and became a vio

Re: [FRIAM] Republicans need to renew themselves (was: self-care)

2022-07-02 Thread Prof David West
*"The Republicans lost their way. When the Republicans turned into a MAGA party, they lost their last sparks of integrity and became a violent authoritarian cult which worships a conman."* Absurd!! Over 1 million registered democrats switched to registering republican this year, so far. Do

Re: [FRIAM] A* and emulatoin

2022-06-27 Thread Prof David West
Syncretic might be a term of interest here. Usually applied in the area of religion, e.g., the fusion of Vudun and Catholicism, so that Legba is a black saint in his niche in the Catholic cathedral in Havana. My favorite example of syncretism was a nighttime pageant in Rio de Janeiro. A hill

Re: [FRIAM] AOL 3.0!

2022-06-07 Thread Prof David West
I advised the U of M students who created gopher. Also a smalltalk browser that never gained any traction because it was smalltalk and embedded in an image. davew On Tue, Jun 7, 2022, at 11:15 AM, glen wrote: > IDK, I was fond of FTPMail and Gopher. They fit better with the BBS > interfaces I

Re: [FRIAM] Economic Health?

2022-06-07 Thread Prof David West
Nevada casinos have set record profits every month for the past year. Clark county home prices have set new records every month for past year. gas prices are second highest in US (we just passed Hawaii and are second only to California) rents have increased about 5-10% per month since last

Re: [FRIAM] These women might be able to tolerate Friam

2022-06-06 Thread Prof David West
The Metaphysical Animals book is, IMO, a pretty dry biography that removes all the passion and the ardor of both the time period and the philosophical arguments. The actual ideas advanced by the four women (and colleagues) are, again IMO, very important and I find them compelling: on their face

Re: [FRIAM] Peirce, Buddhism, Monism, Behaviorism, oh my!

2022-06-03 Thread Prof David West
sequent experiences are needed? 2? A google? And is reality >> defeasible? Eg if some experience is 'real' to me, then I get some brain >> damage and no longer get repeats, is the now unexperienced experience real? >> >> On May 31, 2022 6:05:40 PM PDT, Nic

Re: [FRIAM] Peirce, Buddhism, Monism, Behaviorism, oh my!

2022-05-31 Thread Prof David West
At the risk of becoming a poster boy for glen's comments about cult maintenance and othering; It is the body and brain that are Illusion, the self Real. The mirage, the rainbow illustrate the emergence of Illusion. Raindrops and neurons are posited as ex post facto "explanations" and "causes"

Re: [FRIAM] quotes and questions

2022-05-15 Thread Prof David West
fficient for the task. davew On Sat, May 14, 2022, at 9:13 PM, Marcus Daniels wrote: > Ok, happy robots in hot tubs doesn’t do it for you. How about some machine > learning generated poems? > > https://sites.research.google/versebyverse/ > > >> On May 14, 2022, at 4

Re: [FRIAM] quotes and questions

2022-05-14 Thread Prof David West
system). If one wants to go further > and say there are some experiences that can’t, in principle, be shared, > that’s fine, but then shut up about it already! There’s nothing to **talk** > about because it is private **and** subjective **and** opaque. > > *From:* Friam *On Behalf

Re: [FRIAM] quotes and questions

2022-05-13 Thread Prof David West
essure and temperature sensitivity. > Have it sit in the tub and use some algorithm to learn the distribution > of the sensors and how relates to the performance of its own motor > system. > >> On May 13, 2022, at 3:36 PM, Prof David West wrote: >> >>

Re: [FRIAM] quotes and questions

2022-05-13 Thread Prof David West
On 5/12/22 13:56, Jon Zingale wrote: > An interesting property of turbulence is that it need not be a statement > about fluids, but rather a property entailed by a system of equations. McGilchrist would assert that the "reality" that is apprehended by the left-brain is precisely that set of

[FRIAM] quotes and questions

2022-05-10 Thread Prof David West
Quotes: *"A thing without oppositions ipso facto does not exist ... existence lies in opposition."* C.S. Peirce. *"It is the hallmark of any deep truth that its negation is also a deep truth." *Neils Bohr. Questions: What is the negation of evolution? Natural Selection? Survival of the

[FRIAM] high school education

2022-05-01 Thread Prof David West
Just completed two weeks as a substitute teacher in a high-school business classes that are offered as advanced placement with the possibility of earning college credit. All of the students did no work, spent every minute of class on cell phones. About 40% added talking, walking about the

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