It seemed to mean:
A solution to solving a problem is gaining momentum, and we hear:
wait, let's do it this way, it's better
which prevents the original idea from being implemented, and the tendency
is for the energy which was pushing a solution forward switches to debate.
I've
The talk in this and similar threads keeps bringing to mind an idea I
explored when thinking of wiki pages (known as 'topics' in twiki
parlance, would be 'node' in Leo) --
http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Codev/AreWebsTopics#Everything_New_Is_Old
I get glimpses of a big idea lurking below the
is there a safe way to re-establish the links with the remaining 5 @shadow
files
or should I just start over and not use @path?
Figured out one way: open work.leo in a text editor and seach-replace
@shadow with @shadow y:\scripts\. Whew, Let's raise a glass for
plain text human readable
...this is the kind of floundering I live for... a prerequisite for
creativity is the ability to live with confusion and uncertainty with
calm excitement instead of fear.
Please don't let me distract you from the ongoing big idea
discussions. I just wanted to say that it is phrases like this,
Hello,
The comment marker for dos/windows batch files is broken. There needs
to be a space inserted after REM, so instead of r...@+leo-ver=4 use
REM @+leo-ver=4. Else the following result:
C:\r...@+leo-ver=4
'r...@+leo-ver' is not recognized as an internal or external
command, operable
Edward K. Ream wrote:
I like to listen to classical music while I program. A great way to
do this is by setting up classical music stations on Pandora:
http://www.pandora.com/
Just select a classical composer or piece of music. My favorite at
present is based on a piano piece from
I just tweaked conf.py a bit to enable pdf generation.
...
http://vvtools.googlecode.com/files/Leodocumentation.pdf
Many thanks Ville!
--matt
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Hello,
I've run into a situation where a cloned @shadow node under two
different @path headings is lost and no longer updated (only one of
the external derived files is up to date). Bug report including the
.leo and the derived files at
https://bugs.launchpad.net/leo-editor/+bug/370601
cheers,
You should not use clones if you intend that two separate external files are
the result.
Oh.
Can you explain why you are doing what you are doing?
I write my scripts on a local folder which is an svn working copy, and
then mirror the ones that are developed enough to use to a network
Actually, you don't - anyone with launchpad account can create and
push their own branches under leo-editor. You need to be in
leo-editor-team to push to trunk, though.
True, but I don't think Edward or anyone else is looking to be in
charge of merging things from other branches into the
Every good 3 letter program needs a recursive acronym, yes? In that
fine tradition, here are some ideas for Leo:
LEO - Leo Enlivens Outlines
LEO - Leo Enfolds Objects
LEO - Leo Elucidates Obfuscation
LEO - Leo Entraps Obstacles
LEO - Leo Engages Occlusions
LEO - Leo Encircles
An interesting question. I think government should *use* open source
software, which will inevitably evolve into contributing to it because
sooner or later you have to fix it yourself. There's that itch which
seems to bug only you. (which is not to say floss isn't being used in
government now,
Does anyone know how to make a file read-only just using Python? I've
looked in vain.
According to
http://techarttiki.blogspot.com/2008/08/read-only-windows-files-with-python.html
it can be done like so:
-
import os, stat
myFile = r'C:\stuff\grail.txt'
fileAtt =
Thank you for coming back to review this issue, just like you said you
would, when there are so many other interesting things to work on.
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Perhaps your pattern of working is suboptimal, you if explicitly
switch between tree and body modes.
I always start moving around the tree by pressing alt + arrow, then
either keep the alt key down or release it, depending how I feel like
;-). Then, I return to body pane by pressing enter.
I don't really see a point in Chapter 3 Editing body text, it could
be replaced by Body editing is like in most mainstream text editors.
Where body editing deviates from that (it still does with some
commands), it should be treated as bug, not documented, IMHO ;-).
...continuing on the
When you press Enter after entering the replacement text, Leo should find
and highlight the search text.
confirmed, this is what I see.
If you want to replace and find the next occurrence, press ALT- (alt +
minus)
When I press (alt + minus) the focus moves to the tree and collapses
the
So sorry, was doing from memory: It's Ctrl-Minus, not Alt-Minus
aaah, that makes all the difference in the world! thanks :)
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...some thinking out loud from a user perspective, in response to the
quoted phrases below but perhaps only related by association.
What is the status of easily configured right click menus?
Can I associate a command with a rclick menu item?
The best Menu (or Mouse) to Keyboard assignment
Leo 4.6.1 final is now available
Thank you Edward, Ville and everyone else who contributes to keeping
leo a vibrant project. Your efforts are appreciated. :)
Tip for windows users who don't want to change their shortcuts with
every release, and still retain the release number on extracted
Hello,
I could use some help understanding best practices when using Leo with
source code control. I've read
http://webpages.charter.net/edreamleo/FAQ.html#how-should-i-use-leo-with-bzr-git-hg-svn-cvs
but I'm still confused.
I think it says don't checkin .leo files, checkin the derived files
If you have foo_1,2...5.py as @thin / @auto nodes, the master .leo
file flows from them. I don't think you need to ignore the .leo file,
just don't check it in that often.
ok
the other information in the leo file which doesn't go into the
scripts? (comments, brainstorming, etc.) are they
thanks everyone for revealing the why behind the this you shouldn't try.
-matt
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A python package manager application ran across my screen yesterday,
on the portable pythomn group. Perhaps it may prove helpful in
building an easier install method for leo (it purports to handle
depencies): http://www.preisshare.net/pythonpkgmgr/
cheers,
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-matt
The impact of this inconvenient would be nearly removed if users
trying to install leo on Windows would read the Installing section
of the Leo's documentation:
Installing Qt on Windows¶
...
I've installed Leo several times on windows, yet this morning still
took me a few minutes to find the
I'm having trouble with the directions at
http://webpages.charter.net/edreamleo/install.html#installing-leo-on-windows.
For step 5 I'm not sure what it means by setting up a short-cut
“Target = C:Python25pythonw.exe “C:Python25Libsite-
packagesleolaunchLeo.py” Start in = D:code ”. Target
...looks like I erred on the side of brevity when penned those
instructions up, and then line-breaks and backslashes were discarded
when converted to Sphinx docs.
I've posted a pretty print version at
http://www.uttara.ca/blog/install/installing-leo-editor-on-windows
which should make the
Thanks for the story Edward. It helps :)
During that conversation I realized that I could use
the MORE outliner as a prototype for a “literate outliner.”
And all this time I thought the 'more' the leo docs referred to was
the less is more type (http://www.gnu.org/software/less/), and
pondered
Leo-Editor's Sourceforge files are getting a bit long in the tooth.
For clarity, Bernie is saying the program itself is up to date on
sourceforge but the extra examples and plugins are not. Also
http://sourceforge.net/projects/leo/support says the best place to get
help is the SF forum, which
I've also been thinking of providing vi-like tree
movement/manipulation where you's never need ctrl key when tree has
focus (i would insert, u,d,l,r moves nodes, x cuts, v pastes, h edits
headline...)
yes please. My pinky finger get's quite sore after a day on the
keyboard and anything to
It seems as if this distribution has broken tkinter support.
I thought tkinter is no longer required? or is gui=tk different from
tkinter (I'm trying to use qt anyway)?
I tried a similar though not duplicate environment on another machine
and got a little further. Leo starts and runs but there
Hello,
I'm getting started learning how to use ipython and leo. I've
installed both and enabled the ipy plugin, but get this message in the
console when I alt-shift-I:
ipy_leo.py extension not available - upgrade your IPython!
I've got IPython 0.10 [on Py 2.5.2], Leo 4.7-beta-1 on
Yeah, USER env var is enough for leoid and Linux often has it set.
Windows has %USERNAME%
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New versions of leo should strip those characters on write, it was
probably saved with old version of leo.
Cases like this make me lose my faith in xml bit by bit.
I have some preliminary sketches in my head for using either sqlite or
zip files as tnode storage. This would also help small
Of course I am. Kuhn's work in no way implies that science is full of
hoaxes. It acknowledges that science is done by human beings, and science
must compensate for our human failings.
A great audio series which involves this theme is How To Think About Science,
Leo **simply must** provide
much better graphics and text-formatting capabilities in body text.
yes please! :)
perhaps there is possible synchrony between this development thrust
and the one re: delegating all editing functions to external apps(?)
-matt
Install Leo. Get Leo’s .zip file from
http://sourceforge.net/projects/leo/
You can unpack the .zip file anywhere, including Python’s site-
packages folder, for example, C:Python25Libsite-packages
The backslashes are being stripped from the web docs. That should be
I don't consider myself a Leo newbie :-) but I think they're
unsightly. Not so bad in an expanded tree of code, where there tends
to be just one at the top of the tree, but things like:
@thin blah.js
@thin some.css
@thin other.css
@auto import.c
@shadow foo.py
@shadow bar.py
I agree.
One possible optimization might be making one-letter aliases for
popular types (@f for @thin - because @thin is the new @file, and @a
for auto).
I don't think this is enough different to warrant the pain, especially
since it can not be uniform (not all types can be reduced to one or
two
If any work is done on an ftp feature/plugin. Please keep a weather
eye to using sftp/scp as well.
thanks,
-matt
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I am having more problems getting leo to work. Here is the process
that I followed and the results. Can anyone see my problem?
You might also try the 4.7beta exe installer which is a bit smarter
(http://sourceforge.net/projects/leo/files/Leo/4.7%20beta-1/LeoSetup-4.7-beta-1.exe/download)
It looks like you have to be invited to be a google wave tester.
http://wave.google.com/help/wave/closed.html
Any google wave testers out there who can invite me?
I have a dozen invitations to give out. Still need one? anyone else?
-matt
PyQt seemed to install correctly and I used the version for Python31.
Installed 4.7b and directed to Python31/Lib/site-packages/.
Iin shortcut, 4.7b was looking for Python25 which I did change targets to
Python31 which I installed.
I'm not sure Leo works with Python v3, it definitely does
-- Forwarded message --
From: Matt Wilkie map...@gmail.com
Date: Sun, Nov 1, 2009 at 7:49 AM
Subject: Re: Pls invite me to be a google wave tester :-)
Okay, you've all been added to the list. This is the intro blurb:
Google Wave is more fun when you have others to wave with, so
Thanks. Afaik, nobody has invited me yet.
Okay, you have now. No idea how long it takes.
Pulpy: I've waiting on a couple of people, but if there's no response
tommorrow one is yours.
cheers,
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If you buy a laptop, you can try holding it slightly off the ground
(by putting it on books/whatever) to improve cooling.
I use a piece of wall board cut to size, wider than tall so I have
room to put a book (or mouse) to one side. Also helps with the local
warming effect. :)
Most laptops
Since everyone here will soon be getting a wave account
In that case if there are any invites available I could use one please.
Done!
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In that case if there are any invites available I could use one
please.
Doesn't need to be too soon, I'm off to Utah for a Honeymoon.
Done, and that takes care of my last one. Enjoy your honeymoon. I
wouldn't be surprised if it still hasn't gone through by the time you
get back.
cheers,
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I've just been given another 30 invites. Speak up if you need one. :)
-matt
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Thanks for this Edward. It is inspiring.
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To the elevator pitch (and they lend themselves to demonstration): For
me the pivotal reasons to try Leo were/are:
* Ability to edit external text files, in place, with others not using
Leo, invisibly.
* Comments adjacent to externals, that move with externals, yet (can
be) invisible to the
* Organize any way you like, in many trees, without copying.
...and without sacrificing original structure.
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I would like one. My email is taitnguyen...@gmail.com.
Thank you very much.
done and you're welcome :)
-matt
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Invitation sent. That was the last one I got for this round- hopefully
others here will be getting theirs soon.
I still have a dozen invites.
-matt
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Any invites left? Dang, I would love one...
done. :)
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I sent one out for you Raj I still have a few to spare.
cheers,
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After almost 6 months of intense work, Leo 4.7 is here. Leo 4.7 final
fixes all known bugs in Leo.
Yay! clapclapclapclapclapclap
You may download Leo at:
http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=3458package_id=29106
The default download is for 4.7 release candidate 1 (from a
4. I read your post, and thought, again, I really need to try these unit test
things.
...and I'm thinking, I really need to *learn* what these unit test
thingies are. Being a fledging developer, barely into kindergarten, it
all sounds wonderful, but still might as well be martian to me. :)
The default download is for 4.7 release candidate 1 (from a windows 7
machine and Firefox browser), though 4.7. final can be selected from
the all files list.
also true from winxp,
and the installer didn't find my python 2.6 installed to D:\python26
and used C:\ anyway. The only thing I
hello,
A google search for leo guide user editor led me to
http://personalpages.tds.net/~edream/front.html while the main site,
http://webpages.charter.net/edreamleo/front.html, was not in the top
30 hits at all. I knew the information for the former was outdated
because it didn't have the
It might be sufficient to grab a daily snapshot from
http://www.greygreen.org/leo/, unpack somewhere, and 2x-click on
launchLeo.py. You may need to create a batch file or shortcut as
described here:
http://webpages.charter.net/edreamleo/install.html#running-leo
cheers,
-matt
On Wed, Mar 31,
Well, that was obvious. Thanks!. Now my next related question, I have
a LeoSettings.leo file but no myLeoSettings.leo file anywhere. Any
idea why not?
You have to create one yourself - if it exists it is read, but Leo doesn't
create it by default. On a unix system it should be
But I don't have access to the old page.
A week ago I hunted down a few contact links (and it really was a
hunt!) and requested the pages be taken down, with reference to this
thread. I didn't hear back from anybody but when I checked today the
pages are 403, access forbidden. So the right
You can get half of what you want with ctrl+shift+s - i.e. have this
in body text:
foo
blah
blah
Select all that and press ctrl+shift+s. It creates section foo
and moves the text there.
I didn't know about this either, thanks!
Is there a similar key combo that works for any block
The doc section on Outlines[1] starts off talking about autocompletion
and calltips , which I think is out of place. The same section
contains sub headings which are not bolded or otherwise marked to
stand out from the text proper.
Wherever it finally lives, the autocomplete section should
I'm not sure how I did it, but somehow I broke undo. Below is the
error I get with each press of [ctrl-Z]. After this error the syntax
colouring turns off until I switch to another node. Before this
happened I was experimenting with the keyboard controls described in
in page
http://webpages.charter.net/edreamleo/directives.html#overview-the-9-ways-of-accessing-external-files
under '@auto' the link to '@auto reference' should be
http://webpages.charter.net/edreamleo/directives.html#auto
further down, under 'Overview: summary of directives' the definition
for
wow, that was fast, thanks.
:)
-matt
On Tue, May 4, 2010 at 7:30 AM, Edward K. Ream edream...@gmail.com wrote:
An interesting puzzle. If you like, I can add a guard to the code
that crashed. Like this:
Done at rev 3069 of the trunk.
EKR
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Do folks want me to post the generated .pdf somewhere? Where?
Yes. Post wherever is most convenient. Here, or in Leo's wiki, or
some other place.
a suggestion: http://groups.google.com/group/leo-editor/files
-matt
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I can do this too on linux, the trick is to have the mouse cursor in
that small toolbar hashed area (the cursor will change its shape, then
you'll know you can click and drag).
works me on Windows7 also.
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Re: visibility of sentinels
I too have a tendency to think of them as garbage, or at least a
nuisance, on those occasions when I'm using other tools to look at the
files. Every editor worth it's salt has syntax coloring dictionaries
and those dictionaries are often submitted or maintained by
I've tried to learn and dropped a couple of Eclipse-based projects as
Eclipse just too heavy weight for the kind of stuff I do. I don't
bring this into the discussion to discourage you or anyone else from
leonizing it of course! just raising the point that one of Leo's
attractive features is
hello,
I'm trying to get started with the active_path plugin and am confused.
I don't to slurp in the contents of .svn, .leo_shadow directories and
so on. Plugins active_path About has some words about setting
auto-load/ignore keywords but is not clear on where these settings are
supposed to
ahh, found it: 'Help [my]leoSettings.py @settings plugins
active_path plugin', complete with examples. However it doesn't seem
to work. I added .svn to @data active_path_ignore node body, as
below, exited and restarted all Leo windows and when I Recursive Load
a path the .svn directories are
Here is a posting about Leo's MVC architecture:
http://groups.google.com/group/leo-editor/browse_thread/thread/6b77a59a3a5c7cbb
...
BTW, there seems to be a bug in google groups:
Bug indeed. I can't find that thread AT ALL by searching for mvc!
I get 13 results[0], one of which is the same
Searching google groups is busted.
while google proper is not,
http://www.google.ca/search?q=leo-editor+mvc shows Re: Leo's MVC
architecture as hits #2 and #3 --- from mail-archive.com no less.
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sorry to hijack an important thread, please follow up re: google
groups search in a new one.
-matt
On Tue, May 11, 2010 at 10:33 PM, Matt Wilkie map...@gmail.com wrote:
Searching google groups is busted.
while google proper is not,
http://www.google.ca/search?q=leo-editor+mvc shows Re: Leo's
Searching google groups is busted.
while google proper is not,
http://www.google.ca/search?q=leo-editor+mvc shows Re: Leo's MVC
architecture as hits #2 and #3 --- from mail-archive.com no less.
Is Google-groups just not including subjects when it searches itself?
It's more than that,
It's confusing that the landing page for leo at launchpad[1] says the
current release is 4.6rc1 yet 4.7.1-final is out.
[1] https://launchpad.net/leo-editor
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... It will be *much* easier to understand and adapt
the code than to rewrite it from scratch.
Seems like a good moment to link to an essay by Joel Spolsky on
Things you should never do wherein he makes a strong argument
Netscape made the SINGLE WORST STRATEGIC MISTAKE that any software
company
I agree. Absent the gnx's, sentinels would look like Emacs
outline-mode comments.
Minor comment in terms of readability, I find it easier to read and
count dashes or pluses than asterisks. Stars are more dense.
#...@!5 ++ 1-1
1-1
#...@!6 +++ 2-1
2-1
#...@!7 3-1
For the same reason I
I think Matt meant more dense as in closer to contiguous black blocks and
harder to visually separate and count.
yes, this is what I meant. thank you for the extra clarification.
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As near as I can tell, this old thread from Sep2009 is the clearest
discussion on how search and replace in Leo is supposed to work. Yet
when I followed the directions no text was changed. Anyway, after some
bumping around in the dark I finally discovered the complete recipe,
which I think should
You can change find settings using keystrokes:
- Ctrl-F opens the find panel.
- Alt-Ctrl-W toggles the Whole Word option.
The underlined characters in the find remind you of the keystrokes
that toggle the search options.
thanks for that.
hmmm,, [alt-ctrl-w] has no effect for me, or at
The present scheme works best if you never use the mouse, so that
focus never goes to the find panel.
...except one can't change the current options without using the panel.
Feel free to report a bug: something like not enough key bindings in
the find panel.
right-o:
Is there a way to have Leo run the script when I double click the
node?
slap it in a node, then press [Ctrl-B]
(or Edit Execute script)
:)
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Hi Edward, Go and don't look back, except in those moments when
that's the appropriate thing to do for your own mind. While not
something we look forward to, those moments when the fundamental
intransience of our existence is brought into high relief are great
opportunities for touching reality.
Hello all,
I'm trying to use Leo to manage the same external file in multiple
locations: e.g. single Leo source node, duplicate external files. What
I want to do is have my editing files on the local machine which is
checked into subversion. The scripts which have passed muster and are
actually
Hello world,
Here is handy little button for windows users. Create node with the
headline @button CMD here, save and reopen Leo.
QQQ
@
Open a windows cmd.exe prompt in the path of the currently selected node.
A mapped drive letter will be created for a UNC path.
Adapted from:
Ideas for improvement:
- Generalize for other environments, sh on Linux, (zsh on Mac?)
- add a keyboard shortcut so you don't have to mouse.
-matt
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Thanks you for the clarification and alternate approach Stephen.
...With recent versions (e.g. 4.7.1) of Leo, if the
same node is contained in multiple @thin external files, then the last
file read wins, but Leo will create a node labeled Recovered nodes
which contains the multiple versions
the description for multifile sounds like a perfect fit for what I'm
doing,
(http://webpages.charter.net/edreamleo/plugins.html?highlight=multifile#multifile-py),
but it seems to have no effect on Windows. I'm not even sure it's
active although I've enabled it in myLeoSettings.
How does one go
This is helpful info that should be summarized somewhere for easy
reference. I was going to take a crack it but got stuck on where to
put it. Is the wiki the best place? or perhaps Launchpad Answers?
-matt
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Wonderful idea!
Imo, this line should appear at the start of the file, right after the
#...@+leo line.
I would put it at the end of the file so that people using line wrap
don't have to scroll past a bunch of noise to get to the human data.
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Proofreading much appreciated!
I believe the chapter to be misnamed. It is more properly the
Directive Reference Guide
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Help build a GIS specific Stack Overflow:
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This is great feedback!
3. Step 6 of the Windows install steps looks like this:
ftype LeoFile=C:\Python26\pythonw.exe “C:\Python26\Lib\site-packages
\leo\launchLeo.py” “%1” assoc .leo=LeoFile
The problem is the assoc .leo=LeoFile should be typed on a line by
itself.
I've reported this
Hello,
For the first time I'm trying to use Leo from bzr. I checked out the
trunk branch a few weeks ago but haven't done more than edit a couple
of nodes since then. Today I pulled all updates to r3169 and now when
I start Leo I get an error:
hook failed: open2, function onCreate at 0x03B0ADB0,
Absence of
documentation, or old/poor
documentation is a hassle.
Yes.
And is perhaps the most consistent and most often true critique of
open source projects of all stripes and generations (and a good many
proprietary systems too). In short, documentation is hard, good docs
doubly so. It's
1. I can't/wont' improve documentation in general. I have to know
what it is you want to know. Why not just ask? I typically answer
question in a timely fashion, and my answers could form the basis of
documentation that targets just your concerns.
yes, this is very true. Thank you (and
Simply put, there are too many websites. Too many places to look for
documentation, a.k.a help. Too many places to find out what's
happening and where Leo might, or might not, be going. Prune them all
except one I say. Or burn the field and plant a new one.
All of the existing services Leo is
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