___
From: AJN <[2]arthurjn...@verizon.net>
Sent: Saturday, October 29, 2016 5:24 PM
To: [3]praelu...@hotmail.com; [4]lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Subject: Re: [LUTE] Re: Poulton #73 [was] dedillo
Ron Andrico wrote:
"There seems to
be a tendency to attrib
From the archives...
___
___
From: Ron Andrico <[1]praelu...@hotmail.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 4, 2007 10:38 AM
To: Are Vidar Boye Hansen; G.R. Crona
Cc: [2]lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Subject: RE: [LUTE] Re: Poulton #73 [was] dedillo
Dea
ember 4, 2007 10:38 AM
To: Are Vidar Boye Hansen; G.R. Crona
Cc: [2]lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Subject: RE: [LUTE] Re: Poulton #73 [was] dedillo
Dear Are:
Diana Poulton attributed the piece (with reservation) to Dowland based
on the fact that it contains several of Dowland's typical dev
For what it's worth, continuing down the six-string guitar path, William Foden
devoted a large section of the second volume of his guitar method (1921) to
diverse tremolo techniques, including the wagging-finger, dedillo-like tremolo
demonstrated by Dimitris in the linked video. In addition
No indeed; in my humble opinion, one doesn't encounter such musical but
idiosyncratic lute music until Kapsperger.
Tom
Date: Thu, 28 May 2015 00:03:42 +0200
To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
From: r.ba...@gmx.de
Subject: [LUTE] Milan Fantasia 12 with dedillo
[1]https
That. Is. Amazing.
Mathias
-Original Message-
From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On
Behalf Of
Bruno Figueiredo
Sent: Thursday, May 28, 2015 7:53 PM
To: List LUTELIST
Subject: [LUTE] Re: Milan Fantasia 12 with dedillo
A student of mine just sent
A student of mine just sent me this
video:A [1]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lv7fr-uOgxM
Pretty cool use of dedillo and very effective if you have nails, of
course.
2015-05-28 5:54 GMT-03:00 Martin Shepherd [2]mar...@luteshop.co.uk:
Thanks for another interesting
Thanks for another interesting performance, Robert.
I agree Milan is unique - it's almost like having a record of how he
improvised.
M
On 28/05/2015 00:03, Robert Barto wrote:
[1]https://youtu.be/hilComFz8mM
By the way, I think I presented the first dedillo vs. figueta
comparison
[1]https://youtu.be/hilComFz8mM
By the way, I think I presented the first dedillo vs. figueta
comparison a bit too soon. I've only been trying dedillo for a few
months in my spare time and have been doing figueta on and off for more
years than I'd care to mention. While comparing
It's interesting to compare the two and thanks for putting them both against
the music. Personally, I like your playing without the dedillo as the run
becomes a little clearer and fits better with the nature of the rest of the
piece.
I'm not sure of purpose of dedillo in Milan's approach
Here are two versions of Milan's Fantasy #10. One with dedillo and one
with figueta (p-i thumb under)(Fantasies 10, 11 and 12 are the
introductory dedillo pieces if I understand correctly.)
There is actually not that much dedillo in this piece. It seems to be
an exercise
/05/2015 23:18, Robert Barto wrote:
[1]https://youtu.be/Cn6fmQXP2Pc
Here is a first attempt at dedillo with one of the Milan Fantasies.
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Mastering the dedillo
http://www.ralphmaier.com/index_files/Page318.htm
http://www.ralphmaier.com/index_files/Page318.htm
--
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http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
videos of dedillo here:
https://youtu.be/Oe0TYyR8TM4
and here from a few months ago in a more thumb out phase:
https://youtu.be/6565xf2yQbA
Please let me know if they are of any use and how they could be
better. (I'm just using my phone camera.)
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Hi Martin,
I'm not sure how clearly one can see on the videos, but i think I mainly
just move the finger leaving the last joint fairly loose. In some
situations the thumb can be planted, but sometimes one has to land on
the thumb to come back up, and then it has to be free.
Both thumb out
Thanks for your interest and kind responses.
I'm playing on a viola da mano (60cm) by Richard Fletcher with a capo on
the second fret. (I have a smaller one on order.)
I have a few test videos of dedillo here:
https://youtu.be/Oe0TYyR8TM4
and here from a few months ago in a more thumb out
[1]https://youtu.be/Cn6fmQXP2Pc
Here is a first attempt at dedillo with one of the Milan Fantasies.
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Very convincing. Just very good, period. Better than I could ever do
dedillo. Can you tell us about your vihuela- or whatever your instrument is?
Dan
On 5/18/2015 2:18 PM, Robert Barto wrote:
[1]https://youtu.be/Cn6fmQXP2Pc
Here is a first attempt at dedillo with one of the Milan
and
the integrity of bridges to soundboard connections.
Dedillo? Tried it, don't like it; I'm with Fuenllana on that one. I
still await a convincing performance.
Dan
__
From: Edward Martine...@gamutstrings.com
To: Martin
as translations of Capirola and Piccinini)
Dan
__
From: Martin Shepherd mar...@luteshop.co.uk
To: Lute List lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Friday, August 19, 2011 12:49:47 AM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: [Le_luth] Dedillo
Well
...the way the 7 course vihuela players did it was strictly mental- by
tuning the 4th course down from f to e, and just thinking of it as G
instrument with a high treble course...
I have personally done this in situations requiring a D bass lute,
(lute duets/ensemble, bass singers,
.
- Original Message -
From: dwinh...@comcast.net
To: Martin Shepherd mar...@luteshop.co.uk
Cc: Lute List lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Friday, August 19, 2011 12:04 PM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: [Le_luth] Dedillo
...the way the 7 course vihuela players did it was strictly mental- by
tuning
still about $25. Quite a bargain.
- Original Message - From: dwinh...@comcast.net
To: Martin Shepherd mar...@luteshop.co.uk
Cc: Lute List lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Friday, August 19, 2011 12:04 PM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: [Le_luth] Dedillo
...the way the 7 course vihuela players did
.
- Original Message - From: dwinh...@comcast.net
To: Martin Shepherd mar...@luteshop.co.uk
Cc: Lute List lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Friday, August 19, 2011 12:04 PM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: [Le_luth] Dedillo
...the way the 7 course vihuela players did it was strictly
mental- by
tuning
@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Friday, August 19, 2011 12:04 PM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: [Le_luth] Dedillo
...the way the 7 course vihuela players did it was strictly
mental- by
tuning the 4th course down from f to e, and just thinking of it as
G
instrument with a high treble course...
I have
I can't resist passing this on - fascinating stuff.
M
Original Message
Subject: [Le_luth] Dedillo
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2011 14:08:41 +0200
From: Sauvage Valery [1]sauvag...@orange.fr
Reply-To: [2]le_l...@yahoogroupes.fr
To: [3]le_l
Thanks for posting this, Martin! Ralph Maier certainly gives us
something to contemplate.
Many of us play the vihuela, but very few, if any, play the dedillo
stroke. I have dabbled a bit with it, but not made a serious study
of it, and Maier makes a great case for making another attempt
On Aug 19, 2011, at 4:50 AM, Martin Shepherd wrote:
I can't resist passing this on - fascinating stuff.
Many thanks for doing so!
Ed Durbrow
Saitama, Japan
[1]http://www.musicianspage.com/musicians/9688/
[2]http://www9.plala.or.jp/edurbrow/
--
References
1.
I remember seeing a concert of Inamura in 1980 in which he used dedillo
on cadential trills in Dowland to great effect. All of us other
lutenists were shaking our heads wondering how this guy got such great
tone.
Ed Durbrow
Saitama, Japan
[1]http://www.musicianspage.com
with the laws of
physics being what they are; vis-a-vis the breaking point of gut and
the integrity of bridges to soundboard connections.
Dedillo? Tried it, don't like it; I'm with Fuenllana on that one. I
still await a convincing performance.
Dan
Dear Goeran and All,
I agree with Ron that this piece needs major surgery, and the editors of
CLMJD have sometimes made things worse rather than better. My copy of
Poulton is covered in pencil annotations, which I can't really do
justice to in a list, but these are the main features:
It is
and at the same time be a great
learning experience for the lute world at large.
Expectantly!
G.
- Original Message -
From: Martin Shepherd [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Tuesday, November 06, 2007 10:43 AM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: Poulton #73 [was] dedillo
Dear Goeran and All,
I
The beginning of this clip focuses on Carlos Paredes' right hand.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=gKnO_RwGhss
On Nov 2, 2007, at 11:38 AM, Ed Durbrow wrote:
Yes, I got your reply yesterday. Very interesting. Did you see my
response? It went like this:
Thanks Doc,
Ah ha! So the interesting
a site devoted to Carlos Paredes with other views of his technique:
http://www.cidadevirtual.pt/cdl/carlosparedes.html
To get on or off this list see list information at
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- Original Message -
From: Ron Andrico [EMAIL PROTECTED]
and the fact that the piece really needs reconstruction does not help the
matter.
Needs reconstruction It lacks a rhythmic sign in ms. 4 and a chord at
the end of ms. 20 in the facsimile, I would hardly call that needs
Needs reconstruction It lacks a rhythmic sign in ms. 4 and a
chord at the end of ms. 20 in the facsimile, I would hardly call
that needs reconstruction!
Everyone is, of course, free to determine their own needs, but for
most people things like big 4-3 cadences that resolve on the 4th
@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Sunday, November 04, 2007 11:38 AM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: Poulton #73 [was] dedillo
Dear Are:
Diana Poulton attributed the piece (with reservation) to Dowland based on
the fact that it contains several of Dowland's typical devices; the
ascending scale passages with a repeated first note
@cs.dartmouth.edu From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [LUTE] Re: Poulton
#73 [was] dedillo
Does any of you know why this piece is attributed to Dowland? It is a
great piece, but to me it doesn't sound like a Dowland piece... Are
_
Boo!!Scare
-
From: Ron Andrico [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Are Vidar Boye Hansen
[EMAIL PROTECTED]; G.R. Crona
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Sunday, November 04, 2007 5:38 AM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: Poulton #73 [was] dedillo
Dear Are:
Diana Poulton attributed the piece (with reservation
Fiorentino (Rome, 1563), and nearly everything
from the Siena ms. My opinion.
Best,
Ron Andrico
http://www.mignarda.com
Date: Sun, 4 Nov 2007 16:01:46 -0500 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] CC:
lute@cs.dartmouth.edu From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [LUTE] Re: Poulton
#73 [was] dedillo I am
@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 4:38 PM
Subject: RE: [LUTE] Poulton #73 [was] dedillo
To All:
I haven't been following this thread too closely but in case anyone is
interested, we have posted a pdf of my performing edition of Poulton 73 on our
web site for download. You can
PS. #73 has an identical beginning as 2 of Molinaro's fantasias.
Neither remarkable nor much of a coincidence.
The first three or four notes are a formula known in Italy as, if I
recall correctly, the canzona francese. Pieces based on it were
common--Giovanni Gabrieli was
ha,
did you noticed: PoD has a marker on the 7th bar!
i need one too!
:-)
w.
Original-Nachricht
Datum: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 08:22:46 +0100
Von: Gernot Hilger [EMAIL PROTECTED]
An: Ed Durbrow [EMAIL PROTECTED]
CC: LuteNet list lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Betreff: [LUTE] Re: dedillo
Zitat von Ed Durbrow [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
Could someone please post the URL so I could watch this? Thank you.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=G23_pcCZkZg
To get on or off this list see list information at
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On Nov 1, 2007, at 7:53 PM, Doc Rossi wrote:
I think I misunderstood your question earlier. They use the flesh
side of the nail for the strong beat - the stroke towards the body.
Thanks Doc,
Ah ha! So the interesting point would be where they change to and
from it, how they negotiate going
Oh thanks Gernot. That one. I thought you all were talking about a
new one.
On Nov 2, 2007, at 4:22 PM, Gernot Hilger wrote:
Zitat von Ed Durbrow [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
Could someone please post the URL so I could watch this? Thank you.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=G23_pcCZkZg
Ed Durbrow
hearing Paul O'Dette talk about it but don't think I followed his
changes slavishly.
Ron Andrico
http://www.mignarda.com
Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 12:44:36 +0100 To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu From: [EMAIL
PROTECTED] Subject: [LUTE] Poulton #73 [was] dedillo @[EMAIL
PROTECTED] On 01.11.2007
Hi Ed,
I think I misunderstood your question earlier. They use the flesh
side of the nail for the strong beat - the stroke towards the body.
Doc
On Oct 31, 2007, at 2:10 PM, Ed Durbrow wrote:
On Oct 31, 2007, at 1:49 PM, Doc Rossi wrote:
I've seen people play dedilho before, but never to
Hi Ed,
I think I misunderstood your question earlier. They use the flesh
side of the nail for the strong beat - the stroke towards the body.
Doc
On Oct 31, 2007, at 2:10 PM, Ed Durbrow wrote:
On Oct 31, 2007, at 1:49 PM, Doc Rossi wrote:
I've seen people play dedilho before, but never to
I recently watched a YouTube clip with PO'D, from some
instructional TV
program, where he played the Poulton #73 (Molinaro-dubious-very-fine)
Fantasia with dedillo in the final show-off. I thought that was
cool, as I
play it differently.
Let me gently suggest that you watch the video
Bob is right, different thing
- Original Message -
From: Robert Clair [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Lute List lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Thursday, November 01, 2007 12:41 PM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: dedillo
I recently watched a YouTube clip with PO'D, from some
instructional TV
program
The video looks very much like dedillo, but the sound tells us
otherwise. Bass and treble are merely alternating as are the thumb and
index. If it were dedillo we'd notice more than one treble note per
bass note.
Is the piece really attributed to Molinaro?
g
On 01.11.2007, at 12:41
.
I'll check the video again tomorrow on a faster machine than the one I've
got at home. I believe the finish _could_ be played using dedillo though?
B.R.
G.
- Original Message -
From: Gernot Hilger [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Lute List lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Thursday, November 01, 2007
PS. #73 has an identical beginning as 2 of Molinaro's fantasias.
- Original Message -
From: Gernot Hilger [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Lute List lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Thursday, November 01, 2007 10:49 PM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: dedillo
The video looks very much like dedillo, but the sound
Really? Would you mind to tell us which ones? I've been very curious about
this fantasia (I'm playing it at the moment). I have a recording by
P.Odetteand it sounds a little different from Poulton's edition.
Regards.
2007/11/1, G. Crona [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
PS. #73 has an identical beginning
PS. #73 has an identical beginning as 2 of Molinaro's fantasias.
Neither remarkable nor much of a coincidence.
The first three or four notes are a formula known in Italy as, if I
recall correctly, the canzona francese. Pieces based on it were
common--Giovanni Gabrieli was particularly fond
Could someone please post the URL so I could watch this? Thank you.
On Nov 1, 2007, at 6:57 AM, G. Crona wrote:
I recently watched a YouTube clip with PO´D, from some
instructional TV
program, where he played the Poulton #73 (Molinaro-dubious-very-fine)
Fantasia with dedillo in the final
On Oct 31, 2007, at 1:49 PM, Doc Rossi wrote:
I've seen people play dedilho before, but never to such an advanced
degree as in Portugal.
Did they use the flesh side or nail side for the strong beat in
Portugal?
TIA
Ed Durbrow
Saitama, Japan
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
I recently watched a YouTube clip with PO´D, from some instructional TV
program, where he played the Poulton #73 (Molinaro-dubious-very-fine)
Fantasia with dedillo in the final show-off. I thought that was cool, as I
play it differently. (cf. also Cat Stevens - thumb - index - raking. You
really
guitar and the uke?
Jocelyn
From: John Griffiths [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tue 10/30/2007 8:41 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [VIHUELA] Re: dedillo
My two-penneth worth is that we have two main ways of learning about
dedillo from contemporary practice. One is from the variety
] Re: dedillo
My two-penneth worth is that we have two main ways of learning about
dedillo from contemporary practice. One is from the variety of
techniques used in vihuela/guitarra-derivatives in Latin America,
such as the charango and various others. The second is the Portuguese
guitar that has
Stewart McCoy wrote:
Dante Rosati has suggested that to play dedillo the right-hand thumb
should support the index finger, as if there were a plectrum in
between.
FWD:
From: G.R. Crona [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Subject: Re: Narvaez and 4c technique
Date: 15 February 2002
would like to know more
about how the chap in the Mexican restaurant used his finger. For
example, was he playing thumb-inside or thumb-outside?
Dante Rosati has suggested that to play dedillo the right-hand thumb
should support the index finger, as if there were a plectrum in
between. I once
, dedillo, mentioned in the early
19th century
literature of the Spanish classical guitar.) When the up and down stroke of the
index is
played in rapid succesion to emphasize one note it is called trinado which
comes from the
verb trinar which means to waiver. This embellishment technique
Dear all,
just a small addition to the talk of dedillo:
A. Lawrence-King uses every now and then the dedillo in playing the
harp. The effect - soundwise and also show-wise (is there such a word?)
- is very good!
Harpists on the lute list, is that common in harp playing?
Arto
To get
this be Mudarra's dos dedos, which he uses for ascending
scales, while saving dedillo up for the descending scales? It
seems a bit of a coincidence that these terms are used alongside
each other in the Portuguese tutorbook.
Best wishes,
Stewart McCoy.
- Original Message -
From: Bernd Haegemann
as in proven wrong or debunked as in yelled at?
- bill
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
it's difficult for me to see the details properly
but
following david hockney's secret knowledge
expose on
the painterly use of prisms and mirrors,
Hockney's expose has already been debunked, many
Dear Garry,
You have made an interesting observation. I would like to know more
about how the chap in the Mexican restaurant used his finger. For
example, was he playing thumb-inside or thumb-outside?
Dante Rosati has suggested that to play dedillo the right-hand thumb
should support the index
it's difficult for me to see the details properly but
following david hockney's secret knowledge expose on
the painterly use of prisms and mirrors,
Hockney's expose has already been debunked, many times over.
RT
http://polyhymnion.org
This is an interesting point. I have never heard anyone perform the
dedillo successfully, with the exception of Ronn McFarlane, who (if my
memory serves me correctly) used it on some Milan pieces in an older solo
CD of his.
Other than that, I know of nobody who now uses it.
When I was in Basel
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