Re: How would you all as full fledged professionals handle this?

[Chris Smart]

LOL that's brilliant!

At 09:57 PM 7/25/2017, you wrote:
My dad was a simple man, but one thing he always said, stuck with 
me, and I've found it to be true. "Son, some people just don't know 
that they just don't know. And you can't do anything about that."


On Jul 25, 2017, at 7:48 PM, Christopher-Mark Gilland 
<<mailto:clgillan...@gmail.com>clgillan...@gmail.com> wrote:


Oh, believe me, Karen, I have toldem, but he just keeps insisting 
that he's actually better than anyone's giving him credit. I'm not 
the first person to tell him areas to improve.


I think you guys are right. This guy's just probably not worth my 
effort any further. I'm sorry to say.


Anyway, I appreciate you all's advice, really, I do!
---
Christopher Gilland
Co-founder of Genuine Safe Haven Ministries

<http://www.gshministry.org>http://www.gshministry.org
(980) 500-9575
- Original Message -
From: <mailto:klewel...@shellworld.net>Karen Lewellen
To: <mailto:ptaccess@googlegroups.com>ptaccess@googlegroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2017 12:42 PM
Subject: Re: How would you all as full fledged professionals handle this?

I see, My hope was to give you an opening like...would you want  this
artist to hear  what you just recorded?
Clearly he has no grasp of marketing either smiles.
Kevin makes a valid point.
Is there any reason why, if he is not paying you, that you must answer at
all?
Better still, if he is a real friend, why you cannot say,
Look You are my friend and I want to help you as a friend.  I like you
personally, but this stuff is not of quality, here is why.
He honestly might not be able to hear what you can, if he has trouble with
pitch.
Still, if he is serious about his craft, then he  must be prepared to grow.
Kare


On Mon, 24 Jul 2017, Christopher-Mark Gilland wrote:

> I actually asked him that, and he said he doesn't want to be 
like anyone. He says there are too many impersonators. He said I 
don't want to sound like them, and frankly, anyone trying to do 
music like someone else is a cheating ripoff. His words word per 
word, not mine.

> ---
> Christopher Gilland
> Co-founder of Genuine Safe Haven Ministries
>
> <http://www.gshministry.org>http://www.gshministry.org
> (980) 500-9575
>  - Original Message -
>  From: Karen Lewellen
>  To: <mailto:ptaccess@googlegroups.com>ptaccess@googlegroups.com
>  Sent: Monday, July 24, 2017 9:10 PM
>  Subject: Re: How would you all as full fledged professionals handle this?
>
>
>  Hi Chris,
>  You are an honorable friend being considerate of his feelings.
>  I have a question.  who does this person admire professionally?  What
>  singer  does he want to  become, who influences his work, if 
you understand

>  me?
>  I ask because you may be able to give direction, or frankness, without
>  insulting  him as a person.  focus on his art, not  him, does that make
>  sense?
>  Will share more after you answer.
>  Karen
>
>
>  On Mon, 24 Jul 2017, Christopher-Mark Gilland wrote:
>
>  > OK, so I have a friend who sent me a track he had recorded. 
Granted, he did it in Reaper not PT, but that's kind of not exactly the point.

>  >
>  > He wanted my opinion on his mix, etc.
>  >
>  > First off, the guy is almost 2 whole steps off key. I know, 
as I know very well the song that he recorded. This isn't him 
using improvization. It's more truely him being off the correct 
note or anything there close.

>  >
>  > Secondly, his vocals clipped horribly. With no processing or 
anything, the meters are showing him at positive 9.3DB.

>  >
>  > On his reverb, he ran both the wet, and the dry mix at 100%, 
so he sounds like he's in the grand cannyon. Plus, he's got major 
major headphone bleedover, so bad, I almost can make out each note 
individually from the karaoke track he used.

>  >
>  > When he hits the higher notes, he's singing from his throat, 
I can tell, as he's straining badly, and literally almost shouting.

>  >
>  > On the compressor, he used a 8/1 with the attack as fast as 
the compressor plug would let him, and the attack as slow as it 
would. Then, he set the threshold at negative 14DB, which 
obviously means he's squashing the living shit out of things! 
Worse is, he not only did this on his vocal, but he then 
reduplicated it on the master fader as well. Aaa, my aching! ears!

>  >
>  > Finally, he turned up all frequencies around 60HZ by about 5 DB.
>  >
>  > When I told him this needed a lot of work, being he wanted my 
honest opinion, he says he cannot hear the things I'm talking 
about nor how it negatively effected the mix.

>  >
>  > This guy's been through a lot of emotional psychological 
trauma, which so've I, so I know how it feels. I don't wanna tell 
him this sounds like utter F***ing shit, but, th

Re: How would you all as full fledged professionals handle this?

[Christopher-Mark Gilland]

Wow, in the weirdest way, that is quite profound wisdom, when you think about 
it!
---
Christopher Gilland
Co-founder of Genuine Safe Haven Ministries

http://www.gshministry.org
(980) 500-9575
  - Original Message - 
  From: Shawn Brock 
  To: ptaccess@googlegroups.com 
  Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2017 9:57 PM
  Subject: Re: How would you all as full fledged professionals handle this?


  My dad was a simple man, but one thing he always said, stuck with me, and 
I've found it to be true. "Son, some people just don't know that they just 
don't know. And you can't do anything about that." 

  On Jul 25, 2017, at 7:48 PM, Christopher-Mark Gilland <clgillan...@gmail.com> 
wrote:


Oh, believe me, Karen, I have toldem, but he just keeps insisting that he's 
actually better than anyone's giving him credit. I'm not the first person to 
tell him areas to improve.

I think you guys are right. This guy's just probably not worth my effort 
any further. I'm sorry to say.

Anyway, I appreciate you all's advice, really, I do!
---
Christopher Gilland
Co-founder of Genuine Safe Haven Ministries

http://www.gshministry.org
(980) 500-9575
  - Original Message - 
  From: Karen Lewellen 
  To: ptaccess@googlegroups.com 
  Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2017 12:42 PM
      Subject: Re: How would you all as full fledged professionals handle this?


  I see, My hope was to give you an opening like...would you want  this 
  artist to hear  what you just recorded?
  Clearly he has no grasp of marketing either smiles.
  Kevin makes a valid point.
  Is there any reason why, if he is not paying you, that you must answer at 
  all?
  Better still, if he is a real friend, why you cannot say,
  Look You are my friend and I want to help you as a friend.  I like you 
  personally, but this stuff is not of quality, here is why.
  He honestly might not be able to hear what you can, if he has trouble 
with 
  pitch.
  Still, if he is serious about his craft, then he  must be prepared to 
grow.
  Kare


  On Mon, 24 Jul 2017, Christopher-Mark Gilland wrote:

  > I actually asked him that, and he said he doesn't want to be like 
anyone. He says there are too many impersonators. He said I don't want to sound 
like them, and frankly, anyone trying to do music like someone else is a 
cheating ripoff. His words word per word, not mine.
  > ---
  > Christopher Gilland
  > Co-founder of Genuine Safe Haven Ministries
  >
  > http://www.gshministry.org
  > (980) 500-9575
  >  - Original Message -
  >  From: Karen Lewellen
  >  To: ptaccess@googlegroups.com
  >  Sent: Monday, July 24, 2017 9:10 PM
  >  Subject: Re: How would you all as full fledged professionals handle 
this?
  >
  >
  >  Hi Chris,
  >  You are an honorable friend being considerate of his feelings.
  >  I have a question.  who does this person admire professionally?  What
  >  singer  does he want to  become, who influences his work, if you 
understand
  >  me?
  >  I ask because you may be able to give direction, or frankness, without
  >  insulting  him as a person.  focus on his art, not  him, does that make
  >  sense?
  >  Will share more after you answer.
  >  Karen
  >
  >
  >  On Mon, 24 Jul 2017, Christopher-Mark Gilland wrote:
  >
  >  > OK, so I have a friend who sent me a track he had recorded. Granted, 
he did it in Reaper not PT, but that's kind of not exactly the point.
  >  >
  >  > He wanted my opinion on his mix, etc.
  >  >
  >  > First off, the guy is almost 2 whole steps off key. I know, as I 
know very well the song that he recorded. This isn't him using improvization. 
It's more truely him being off the correct note or anything there close.
  >  >
  >  > Secondly, his vocals clipped horribly. With no processing or 
anything, the meters are showing him at positive 9.3DB.
  >  >
  >  > On his reverb, he ran both the wet, and the dry mix at 100%, so he 
sounds like he's in the grand cannyon. Plus, he's got major major headphone 
bleedover, so bad, I almost can make out each note individually from the 
karaoke track he used.
  >  >
  >  > When he hits the higher notes, he's singing from his throat, I can 
tell, as he's straining badly, and literally almost shouting.
  >  >
  >  > On the compressor, he used a 8/1 with the attack as fast as the 
compressor plug would let him, and the attack as slow as it would. Then, he set 
the threshold at negative 14DB, which obviously means he's squashing the living 
shit out of things! Worse is, he not only did this on his vocal, but he then 
reduplicated it on the master f

Re: How would you all as full fledged professionals handle this?

[Shawn Brock]

My dad was a simple man, but one thing he always said, stuck with me, and I've 
found it to be true. "Son, some people just don't know that they just don't 
know. And you can't do anything about that." 

> On Jul 25, 2017, at 7:48 PM, Christopher-Mark Gilland <clgillan...@gmail.com> 
> wrote:
> 
> Oh, believe me, Karen, I have toldem, but he just keeps insisting that he's 
> actually better than anyone's giving him credit. I'm not the first person to 
> tell him areas to improve.
>  
> I think you guys are right. This guy's just probably not worth my effort any 
> further. I'm sorry to say.
>  
> Anyway, I appreciate you all's advice, really, I do!
> ---
> Christopher Gilland
> Co-founder of Genuine Safe Haven Ministries
>  
> http://www.gshministry.org
> (980) 500-9575
> - Original Message -
> From: Karen Lewellen
> To: ptaccess@googlegroups.com
> Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2017 12:42 PM
> Subject: Re: How would you all as full fledged professionals handle this?
> 
> I see, My hope was to give you an opening like...would you want  this 
> artist to hear  what you just recorded?
> Clearly he has no grasp of marketing either smiles.
> Kevin makes a valid point.
> Is there any reason why, if he is not paying you, that you must answer at 
> all?
> Better still, if he is a real friend, why you cannot say,
> Look You are my friend and I want to help you as a friend.  I like you 
> personally, but this stuff is not of quality, here is why.
> He honestly might not be able to hear what you can, if he has trouble with 
> pitch.
> Still, if he is serious about his craft, then he  must be prepared to grow.
> Kare
> 
> 
> On Mon, 24 Jul 2017, Christopher-Mark Gilland wrote:
> 
> > I actually asked him that, and he said he doesn't want to be like anyone. 
> > He says there are too many impersonators. He said I don't want to sound 
> > like them, and frankly, anyone trying to do music like someone else is a 
> > cheating ripoff. His words word per word, not mine.
> > ---
> > Christopher Gilland
> > Co-founder of Genuine Safe Haven Ministries
> >
> > http://www.gshministry.org
> > (980) 500-9575
> >  - Original Message -
> >  From: Karen Lewellen
> >  To: ptaccess@googlegroups.com
> >  Sent: Monday, July 24, 2017 9:10 PM
> >  Subject: Re: How would you all as full fledged professionals handle this?
> >
> >
> >  Hi Chris,
> >  You are an honorable friend being considerate of his feelings.
> >  I have a question.  who does this person admire professionally?  What
> >  singer  does he want to  become, who influences his work, if you understand
> >  me?
> >  I ask because you may be able to give direction, or frankness, without
> >  insulting  him as a person.  focus on his art, not  him, does that make
> >  sense?
> >  Will share more after you answer.
> >  Karen
> >
> >
> >  On Mon, 24 Jul 2017, Christopher-Mark Gilland wrote:
> >
> >  > OK, so I have a friend who sent me a track he had recorded. Granted, he 
> > did it in Reaper not PT, but that's kind of not exactly the point.
> >  >
> >  > He wanted my opinion on his mix, etc.
> >  >
> >  > First off, the guy is almost 2 whole steps off key. I know, as I know 
> > very well the song that he recorded. This isn't him using improvization. 
> > It's more truely him being off the correct note or anything there close.
> >  >
> >  > Secondly, his vocals clipped horribly. With no processing or anything, 
> > the meters are showing him at positive 9.3DB.
> >  >
> >  > On his reverb, he ran both the wet, and the dry mix at 100%, so he 
> > sounds like he's in the grand cannyon. Plus, he's got major major headphone 
> > bleedover, so bad, I almost can make out each note individually from the 
> > karaoke track he used.
> >  >
> >  > When he hits the higher notes, he's singing from his throat, I can tell, 
> > as he's straining badly, and literally almost shouting.
> >  >
> >  > On the compressor, he used a 8/1 with the attack as fast as the 
> > compressor plug would let him, and the attack as slow as it would. Then, he 
> > set the threshold at negative 14DB, which obviously means he's squashing 
> > the living shit out of things! Worse is, he not only did this on his vocal, 
> > but he then reduplicated it on the master fader as well. Aaa, my aching! 
> > ears!
> >  >
> >  > Finally, he turned up all frequencies around 60HZ by about 5 DB.
> >  >
> >  > When I told him this needed a lot of work, being he wanted my honest 
&

Re: How would you all as full fledged professionals handle this?

[Christopher-Mark Gilland]

Oh, believe me, Karen, I have toldem, but he just keeps insisting that he's 
actually better than anyone's giving him credit. I'm not the first person to 
tell him areas to improve.

I think you guys are right. This guy's just probably not worth my effort any 
further. I'm sorry to say.

Anyway, I appreciate you all's advice, really, I do!
---
Christopher Gilland
Co-founder of Genuine Safe Haven Ministries

http://www.gshministry.org
(980) 500-9575
  - Original Message - 
  From: Karen Lewellen 
  To: ptaccess@googlegroups.com 
  Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2017 12:42 PM
  Subject: Re: How would you all as full fledged professionals handle this?


  I see, My hope was to give you an opening like...would you want  this 
  artist to hear  what you just recorded?
  Clearly he has no grasp of marketing either smiles.
  Kevin makes a valid point.
  Is there any reason why, if he is not paying you, that you must answer at 
  all?
  Better still, if he is a real friend, why you cannot say,
  Look You are my friend and I want to help you as a friend.  I like you 
  personally, but this stuff is not of quality, here is why.
  He honestly might not be able to hear what you can, if he has trouble with 
  pitch.
  Still, if he is serious about his craft, then he  must be prepared to grow.
  Kare


  On Mon, 24 Jul 2017, Christopher-Mark Gilland wrote:

  > I actually asked him that, and he said he doesn't want to be like anyone. 
He says there are too many impersonators. He said I don't want to sound like 
them, and frankly, anyone trying to do music like someone else is a cheating 
ripoff. His words word per word, not mine.
  > ---
  > Christopher Gilland
  > Co-founder of Genuine Safe Haven Ministries
  >
  > http://www.gshministry.org
  > (980) 500-9575
  >  - Original Message -
  >  From: Karen Lewellen
  >  To: ptaccess@googlegroups.com
  >  Sent: Monday, July 24, 2017 9:10 PM
  >  Subject: Re: How would you all as full fledged professionals handle this?
  >
  >
  >  Hi Chris,
  >  You are an honorable friend being considerate of his feelings.
  >  I have a question.  who does this person admire professionally?  What
  >  singer  does he want to  become, who influences his work, if you understand
  >  me?
  >  I ask because you may be able to give direction, or frankness, without
  >  insulting  him as a person.  focus on his art, not  him, does that make
  >  sense?
  >  Will share more after you answer.
  >  Karen
  >
  >
  >  On Mon, 24 Jul 2017, Christopher-Mark Gilland wrote:
  >
  >  > OK, so I have a friend who sent me a track he had recorded. Granted, he 
did it in Reaper not PT, but that's kind of not exactly the point.
  >  >
  >  > He wanted my opinion on his mix, etc.
  >  >
  >  > First off, the guy is almost 2 whole steps off key. I know, as I know 
very well the song that he recorded. This isn't him using improvization. It's 
more truely him being off the correct note or anything there close.
  >  >
  >  > Secondly, his vocals clipped horribly. With no processing or anything, 
the meters are showing him at positive 9.3DB.
  >  >
  >  > On his reverb, he ran both the wet, and the dry mix at 100%, so he 
sounds like he's in the grand cannyon. Plus, he's got major major headphone 
bleedover, so bad, I almost can make out each note individually from the 
karaoke track he used.
  >  >
  >  > When he hits the higher notes, he's singing from his throat, I can tell, 
as he's straining badly, and literally almost shouting.
  >  >
  >  > On the compressor, he used a 8/1 with the attack as fast as the 
compressor plug would let him, and the attack as slow as it would. Then, he set 
the threshold at negative 14DB, which obviously means he's squashing the living 
shit out of things! Worse is, he not only did this on his vocal, but he then 
reduplicated it on the master fader as well. Aaa, my aching! ears!
  >  >
  >  > Finally, he turned up all frequencies around 60HZ by about 5 DB.
  >  >
  >  > When I told him this needed a lot of work, being he wanted my honest 
opinion, he says he cannot hear the things I'm talking about nor how it 
negatively effected the mix.
  >  >
  >  > This guy's been through a lot of emotional psychological trauma, which 
so've I, so I know how it feels. I don't wanna tell him this sounds like utter 
F***ing shit, but, that said, this is about the 5th song he's sent me like 
this. I just don't think he's cut out for a vocalist let alone a producer. OK, 
who 'em I to judge! I know, I know, I'm not the greatest myself, but at least I 
listen and try taking advice when people give it, hince why I've improved as 
much over the years as I have. This guy simply won't take any advice I nor 
anyone else give him. He didn't pay me to listen, he just asked me as a frien

Re: How would you all as full fledged professionals handle this?

[Karen Lewellen]

I see, My hope was to give you an opening like...would you want  this 
artist to hear  what you just recorded?

Clearly he has no grasp of marketing either smiles.
Kevin makes a valid point.
Is there any reason why, if he is not paying you, that you must answer at 
all?

Better still, if he is a real friend, why you cannot say,
Look You are my friend and I want to help you as a friend.  I like you 
personally, but this stuff is not of quality, here is why.
He honestly might not be able to hear what you can, if he has trouble with 
pitch.

Still, if he is serious about his craft, then he  must be prepared to grow.
Kare


On Mon, 24 Jul 2017, Christopher-Mark Gilland wrote:


I actually asked him that, and he said he doesn't want to be like anyone. He 
says there are too many impersonators. He said I don't want to sound like them, 
and frankly, anyone trying to do music like someone else is a cheating ripoff. 
His words word per word, not mine.
---
Christopher Gilland
Co-founder of Genuine Safe Haven Ministries

http://www.gshministry.org
(980) 500-9575
 - Original Message -
 From: Karen Lewellen
 To: ptaccess@googlegroups.com
 Sent: Monday, July 24, 2017 9:10 PM
 Subject: Re: How would you all as full fledged professionals handle this?


 Hi Chris,
 You are an honorable friend being considerate of his feelings.
 I have a question.  who does this person admire professionally?  What
 singer  does he want to  become, who influences his work, if you understand
 me?
 I ask because you may be able to give direction, or frankness, without
 insulting  him as a person.  focus on his art, not  him, does that make
 sense?
 Will share more after you answer.
 Karen


 On Mon, 24 Jul 2017, Christopher-Mark Gilland wrote:

 > OK, so I have a friend who sent me a track he had recorded. Granted, he did 
it in Reaper not PT, but that's kind of not exactly the point.
 >
 > He wanted my opinion on his mix, etc.
 >
 > First off, the guy is almost 2 whole steps off key. I know, as I know very 
well the song that he recorded. This isn't him using improvization. It's more 
truely him being off the correct note or anything there close.
 >
 > Secondly, his vocals clipped horribly. With no processing or anything, the 
meters are showing him at positive 9.3DB.
 >
 > On his reverb, he ran both the wet, and the dry mix at 100%, so he sounds 
like he's in the grand cannyon. Plus, he's got major major headphone bleedover, so 
bad, I almost can make out each note individually from the karaoke track he used.
 >
 > When he hits the higher notes, he's singing from his throat, I can tell, as 
he's straining badly, and literally almost shouting.
 >
 > On the compressor, he used a 8/1 with the attack as fast as the compressor 
plug would let him, and the attack as slow as it would. Then, he set the threshold 
at negative 14DB, which obviously means he's squashing the living shit out of 
things! Worse is, he not only did this on his vocal, but he then reduplicated it 
on the master fader as well. Aaa, my aching! ears!
 >
 > Finally, he turned up all frequencies around 60HZ by about 5 DB.
 >
 > When I told him this needed a lot of work, being he wanted my honest 
opinion, he says he cannot hear the things I'm talking about nor how it negatively 
effected the mix.
 >
 > This guy's been through a lot of emotional psychological trauma, which so've 
I, so I know how it feels. I don't wanna tell him this sounds like utter F***ing 
shit, but, that said, this is about the 5th song he's sent me like this. I just 
don't think he's cut out for a vocalist let alone a producer. OK, who 'em I to 
judge! I know, I know, I'm not the greatest myself, but at least I listen and try 
taking advice when people give it, hince why I've improved as much over the years 
as I have. This guy simply won't take any advice I nor anyone else give him. He 
didn't pay me to listen, he just asked me as a friend to tell him. He's not 
expecting me to do this as him being a client.
 >
 > So, client or not, what's the best way with love, mind you, to more politely 
say, Jane Doe? You absolutely suck!
 >
 > Surely some of you all have had vocalists or musicians who you listenned to, 
who you had to turn down the job from as they just weren't seen as fit for it. 
They just didn't have what it would take.
 >
 > How do you let those guys off easy, without being a nasty Simon Cowell the 
second? My christian morrals won't let me lie, but if I say what I really think, 
it's gonna break his heart! I can't do that to such a dear friend! I just can't! 
What do I do!
 >
 > Chris.
 >
 > --
 > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Pro 
Tools Accessibility" group.
 > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
email to ptaccess+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
 > For more options, visit https://groups.google

Re: How would you all as full fledged professionals handle this?

[TheOreoMonster]

Well if he is Shooting for originality, Congratulate him as it sounds like he’s 
achieved it. And let him be if he is truly happy turning out stuff like that. 
However, “Originality” “Creative Control” “Record deal” “Hall of Fame” are all 
self important buzzwords that get thrown around, but at the end of the day its 
the music business, not the music friends. There for if anyone wants to be 
successful, they will have to think and treat their music like a  business at 
some point and that is regardless of  whether or not you have a “record Deal” 
or are “completely independent”. “Originality” and “Creative Control” are 
great, but business is also about having product that others are interested in; 
after all I bet no one here can name one successful business that has a product 
no one buys. So if no one is interested in your product, … I mean your music, 
no matter how Original, or how cookie cutter  it is, then there is no success, 
If there is no success, there is no Hall of Fame. 

> On Jul 25, 2017, at 6:47 AM, Jes <jessm...@samobile.net> wrote:
> 
> Chris, anybody that tells you they will get a place in the record Hall of 
> Fame in three months has no idea what they are talking about. 99% of artists 
> are not famous, nor are they rich, they literally are starving. These days, 
> music alone does not provide enough money to put food on the table. I have 
> heard people say exactly the same thing, that they will get a place in the 
> record business. They won't. Nine times out of 10, I guarantee you they will 
> fail to achieve their goals. Am I right, guys? They are doing this for the 
> wrong reason. It is not advantageous these days to have a record deal anyway 
> as a lot of the time, you lose creative control of your product. Labels are 
> only interested in you making money for them, and if you can't do that, they 
> will drop you. If anybody wants to correct me on any of these points, feel 
> free to do so..
> 
> On Jul 24, 2017, at 10:39 PM, Christopher-Mark Gilland <clgillan...@gmail.com 
> <mailto:clgillan...@gmail.com>> wrote:
> 
>> And that's just it. He doesn't! wanna do this for fun. He keeps swearing 
>> he's gonna get a place in the record hall of fame. I'm not using that term 
>> figuratively. He's literally made me that swear that by this time in 3 
>> months, he thinks he'll be there.
>>  
>> He's just very very stubborn. I don't wanna be rude about it, but... and 
>> BTW, no, he's not on this list, so, we're safe, and I know that for a fact.
>> ---
>> Christopher Gilland
>> Co-founder of Genuine Safe Haven Ministries
>>  
>> http://www.gshministry.org <http://www.gshministry.org/>
>> (980) 500-9575
>> - Original Message -
>> From: TheOreoMonster <mailto:monkeypushe...@gmail.com>
>> To: ptaccess@googlegroups.com <mailto:ptaccess@googlegroups.com>
>> Sent: Monday, July 24, 2017 9:37 PM
>> Subject: Re: How would you all as full fledged professionals handle this?
>> 
>> I’d say point out the things you did here, without being negative or saying 
>> you suck. Something like your vocals are off key and that they should 
>> consider collaborating with vocalist. You can also explain that to your more 
>> experienced ears it sounds over compressed and muddy or etc. No need to get 
>> into the technical details you got into in your email as it sounds like he 
>> isn’t to a experience level with productions  where that would mean much to 
>> him yet. The thing is if they are doing this for fun and to keep themselves 
>> busy, then its up to them if they work on getting better or not. If they 
>> wants to get to a point where they wants to do this professionally however, 
>> then they’d need to  consider more experienced opinions at some point. 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Jul 24, 2017, at 6:36 PM, Christopher-Mark Gilland 
>>> <clgillan...@gmail.com <mailto:clgillan...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> OK, so I have a friend who sent me a track he had recorded. Granted, he did 
>>> it in Reaper not PT, but that's kind of not exactly the point.
>>>  
>>> He wanted my opinion on his mix, etc.
>>>  
>>> First off, the guy is almost 2 whole steps off key. I know, as I know very 
>>> well the song that he recorded. This isn't him using improvization. It's 
>>> more truely him being off the correct note or anything there close.
>>>  
>>> Secondly, his vocals clipped horribly. With no processing or anything, the 
>>> meters are showing him at positive 9.3DB.
>>>  
>>> On his reverb, he ran both the wet, and the dry mix at 100%, so he sounds 
>>> like he's in the grand

Re: How would you all as full fledged professionals handle this?

[Chris Smart]

he sounds deluded, about his abilities, and about his chances of making it.

At 10:39 PM 7/24/2017, you wrote:
And that's just it. He doesn't! wanna do this 
for fun. He keeps swearing he's gonna get a 
place in the record hall of fame. I'm not using 
that term figuratively. He's literally made me 
that swear that by this time in 3 months, he thinks he'll be there.


He's just very very stubborn. I don't wanna be 
rude about it, but... and BTW, no, he's not on 
this list, so, we're safe, and I know that for a fact.

---
Christopher Gilland
Co-founder of Genuine Safe Haven Ministries

<http://www.gshministry.org>http://www.gshministry.org
(980) 500-9575
- Original Message -
From: <mailto:monkeypushe...@gmail.com>TheOreoMonster
To: <mailto:ptaccess@googlegroups.com>ptaccess@googlegroups.com
Sent: Monday, July 24, 2017 9:37 PM
Subject: Re: How would you all as full fledged professionals handle this?

I’d say point out the things you did here, 
without being negative or saying you suck. 
Something like your vocals are off key and that 
they should consider collaborating with 
vocalist. You can also explain that to your more 
experienced ears it sounds over compressed and 
muddy or etc. No need to get into the technical 
details you got into in your email as it sounds 
like he isn’t to a experience level with 
productions  where that would mean much to him 
yet. The thing is if they are doing this for fun 
and to keep themselves busy, then its up to them 
if they work on getting better or not. If they 
wants to get to a point where they wants to do 
this professionally however, then they’d need 
to  consider more experienced opinions at some point.



On Jul 24, 2017, at 6:36 PM, Christopher-Mark 
Gilland <<mailto:clgillan...@gmail.com>clgillan...@gmail.com> wrote:


OK, so I have a friend who sent me a track he 
had recorded. Granted, he did it in Reaper not 
PT, but that's kind of not exactly the point.


He wanted my opinion on his mix, etc.

First off, the guy is almost 2 whole steps off 
key. I know, as I know very well the song that 
he recorded. This isn't him using 
improvization. It's more truely him being off 
the correct note or anything there close.


Secondly, his vocals clipped horribly. With no 
processing or anything, the meters are showing him at positive 9.3DB.


On his reverb, he ran both the wet, and the dry 
mix at 100%, so he sounds like he's in the 
grand cannyon. Plus, he's got major major 
headphone bleedover, so bad, I almost can make 
out each note individually from the karaoke track he used.


When he hits the higher notes, he's singing 
from his throat, I can tell, as he's straining 
badly, and literally almost shouting.


On the compressor, he used a 8/1 with the 
attack as fast as the compressor plug would let 
him, and the attack as slow as it would. Then, 
he set the threshold at negative 14DB, which 
obviously means he's squashing the living shit 
out of things! Worse is, he not only did this 
on his vocal, but he then reduplicated it on 
the master fader as well. Aaa, my aching! ears!


Finally, he turned up all frequencies around 60HZ by about 5 DB.

When I told him this needed a lot of work, 
being he wanted my honest opinion, he says he 
cannot hear the things I'm talking about nor 
how it negatively effected the mix.


This guy's been through a lot of emotional 
psychological trauma, which so've I, so I know 
how it feels. I don't wanna tell him this 
sounds like utter F***ing shit, but, that said, 
this is about the 5th song he's sent me like 
this. I just don't think he's cut out for a 
vocalist let alone a producer. OK, who 'em I to 
judge! I know, I know, I'm not the greatest 
myself, but at least I listen and try taking 
advice when people give it, hince why I've 
improved as much over the years as I have. This 
guy simply won't take any advice I nor anyone 
else give him. He didn't pay me to listen, he 
just asked me as a friend to tell him. He's not 
expecting me to do this as him being a client.


So, client or not, what's the best way with 
love, mind you, to more politely say, Jane Doe? You absolutely suck!


Surely some of you all have had vocalists or 
musicians who you listenned to, who you had to 
turn down the job from as they just weren't 
seen as fit for it. They just didn't have what it would take.


How do you let those guys off easy, without 
being a nasty Simon Cowell the second? My 
christian morrals won't let me lie, but if I 
say what I really think, it's gonna break his 
heart! I can't do that to such a dear friend! I just can't! What do I do!


Chris.

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Re: How would you all as full fledged professionals handle this?

[Jes]

Chris, anybody that tells you they will get a place in the record Hall of Fame 
in three months has no idea what they are talking about. 99% of artists are not 
famous, nor are they rich, they literally are starving. These days, music alone 
does not provide enough money to put food on the table. I have heard people say 
exactly the same thing, that they will get a place in the record business. They 
won't. Nine times out of 10, I guarantee you they will fail to achieve their 
goals. Am I right, guys? They are doing this for the wrong reason. It is not 
advantageous these days to have a record deal anyway as a lot of the time, you 
lose creative control of your product. Labels are only interested in you making 
money for them, and if you can't do that, they will drop you. If anybody wants 
to correct me on any of these points, feel free to do so..

> On Jul 24, 2017, at 10:39 PM, Christopher-Mark Gilland 
> <clgillan...@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> And that's just it. He doesn't! wanna do this for fun. He keeps swearing he's 
> gonna get a place in the record hall of fame. I'm not using that term 
> figuratively. He's literally made me that swear that by this time in 3 
> months, he thinks he'll be there.
>  
> He's just very very stubborn. I don't wanna be rude  about it, but... and 
> BTW, no, he's not on this list, so, we're safe, and I know that for a fact.
> ---
> Christopher Gilland
> Co-founder of Genuine Safe Haven Ministries
>  
> http://www.gshministry.org
> (980) 500-9575
> - Original Message -
> From: TheOreoMonster
> To: ptaccess@googlegroups.com
> Sent: Monday, July 24, 2017 9:37 PM
> Subject: Re: How would you all as full fledged professionals handle this?
> 
> I’d say point out the things you did here, without being negative or saying 
> you suck. Something like your vocals are off key and that they should 
> consider collaborating with vocalist. You can also explain that to your more 
> experienced ears it sounds over compressed and muddy or etc. No need to get 
> into the technical details you got into in your email as it sounds like he 
> isn’t to a experience level with productions  where that would mean much to 
> him yet. The thing is if they are doing this for fun and to keep themselves 
> busy, then its up to them if they work on getting better or not. If they 
> wants to get to a point where they wants to do this professionally however, 
> then they’d need to  consider more experienced opinions at some point. 
> 
> 
>> On Jul 24, 2017, at 6:36 PM, Christopher-Mark Gilland 
>> <clgillan...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> 
>> OK, so I have a friend who sent me a track he had recorded. Granted, he did 
>> it in Reaper not PT, but that's kind of not exactly the point.
>>  
>> He wanted my opinion on his mix, etc.
>>  
>> First off, the guy is almost 2 whole steps off key. I know, as I know very 
>> well the song that he recorded. This isn't him using improvization. It's 
>> more truely him being off the correct note or anything there close.
>>  
>> Secondly, his vocals clipped horribly. With no processing or anything, the 
>> meters are showing him at positive 9.3DB.
>>  
>> On his reverb, he ran both the wet, and the dry mix at 100%, so he sounds 
>> like he's in the grand cannyon. Plus, he's got major major headphone 
>> bleedover, so bad, I almost can make out each note individually from the 
>> karaoke track he used.
>>  
>> When he hits the higher notes, he's singing from his throat, I can tell, as 
>> he's straining badly, and literally almost shouting.
>>  
>> On the compressor, he used a 8/1 with the attack as fast as the compressor 
>> plug would let him, and the attack as slow as it would. Then, he set the 
>> threshold at negative 14DB, which obviously means he's squashing the living 
>> shit out of things! Worse is, he not only did this on his vocal, but he then 
>> reduplicated it on the master fader as well. Aaa, my aching! ears!
>>  
>> Finally, he turned up all frequencies around 60HZ by about 5 DB.
>>  
>> When I told him this needed a lot of work, being he wanted my honest 
>> opinion, he says he cannot hear the things I'm talking about nor how it 
>> negatively effected the mix.
>>  
>> This guy's been through a lot of emotional psychological trauma, which so've 
>> I, so I know how it feels. I don't wanna tell him this sounds like utter 
>> F***ing shit, but, that said, this is about the 5th song he's sent me like 
>> this. I just don't think he's cut out for a vocalist let alone a producer. 
>> OK, who 'em I to judge! I know, I know, I'm not the greatest myself, but at 
>> least I listen and try taking advice wh

Re: How would you all as full fledged professionals handle this?

[Christopher-Mark Gilland]

And that's just it. He doesn't! wanna do this for fun. He keeps swearing he's 
gonna get a place in the record hall of fame. I'm not using that term 
figuratively. He's literally made me that swear that by this time in 3 months, 
he thinks he'll be there.

He's just very very stubborn. I don't wanna be rude about it, but... and BTW, 
no, he's not on this list, so, we're safe, and I know that for a fact.
---
Christopher Gilland
Co-founder of Genuine Safe Haven Ministries

http://www.gshministry.org
(980) 500-9575
  - Original Message - 
  From: TheOreoMonster 
  To: ptaccess@googlegroups.com 
  Sent: Monday, July 24, 2017 9:37 PM
  Subject: Re: How would you all as full fledged professionals handle this?


  I’d say point out the things you did here, without being negative or saying 
you suck. Something like your vocals are off key and that they should consider 
collaborating with vocalist. You can also explain that to your more experienced 
ears it sounds over compressed and muddy or etc. No need to get into the 
technical details you got into in your email as it sounds like he isn’t to a 
experience level with productions  where that would mean much to him yet. The 
thing is if they are doing this for fun and to keep themselves busy, then its 
up to them if they work on getting better or not. If they wants to get to a 
point where they wants to do this professionally however, then they’d need to  
consider more experienced opinions at some point. 




On Jul 24, 2017, at 6:36 PM, Christopher-Mark Gilland 
<clgillan...@gmail.com> wrote:


OK, so I have a friend who sent me a track he had recorded. Granted, he did 
it in Reaper not PT, but that's kind of not exactly the point.

He wanted my opinion on his mix, etc.

First off, the guy is almost 2 whole steps off key. I know, as I know very 
well the song that he recorded. This isn't him using improvization. It's more 
truely him being off the correct note or anything there close.

Secondly, his vocals clipped horribly. With no processing or anything, the 
meters are showing him at positive 9.3DB.

On his reverb, he ran both the wet, and the dry mix at 100%, so he sounds 
like he's in the grand cannyon. Plus, he's got major major headphone bleedover, 
so bad, I almost can make out each note individually from the karaoke track he 
used.

When he hits the higher notes, he's singing from his throat, I can tell, as 
he's straining badly, and literally almost shouting.

On the compressor, he used a 8/1 with the attack as fast as the compressor 
plug would let him, and the attack as slow as it would. Then, he set the 
threshold at negative 14DB, which obviously means he's squashing the living 
shit out of things! Worse is, he not only did this on his vocal, but he then 
reduplicated it on the master fader as well. Aaa, my aching! ears!

Finally, he turned up all frequencies around 60HZ by about 5 DB.

When I told him this needed a lot of work, being he wanted my honest 
opinion, he says he cannot hear the things I'm talking about nor how it 
negatively effected the mix.

This guy's been through a lot of emotional psychological trauma, which 
so've I, so I know how it feels. I don't wanna tell him this sounds like utter 
F***ing shit, but, that said, this is about the 5th song he's sent me like 
this. I just don't think he's cut out for a vocalist let alone a producer. OK, 
who 'em I to judge! I know, I know, I'm not the greatest myself, but at least I 
listen and try taking advice when people give it, hince why I've improved as 
much over the years as I have. This guy simply won't take any advice I nor 
anyone else give him. He didn't pay me to listen, he just asked me as a friend 
to tell him. He's not expecting me to do this as him being a client.

So, client or not, what's the best way with love, mind you, to more 
politely say, Jane Doe? You absolutely suck!

Surely some of you all have had vocalists or musicians who you listenned 
to, who you had to turn down the job from as they just weren't seen as fit for 
it. They just didn't have what it would take.

How do you let those guys off easy, without being a nasty Simon Cowell the 
second? My christian morrals won't let me lie, but if I say what I really 
think, it's gonna break his heart! I can't do that to such a dear friend! I 
just can't! What do I do!

Chris.


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  -- 
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  For

Re: How would you all as full fledged professionals handle this?

[Christopher-Mark Gilland]

I actually asked him that, and he said he doesn't want to be like anyone. He 
says there are too many impersonators. He said I don't want to sound like them, 
and frankly, anyone trying to do music like someone else is a cheating ripoff. 
His words word per word, not mine.
---
Christopher Gilland
Co-founder of Genuine Safe Haven Ministries

http://www.gshministry.org
(980) 500-9575
  - Original Message - 
  From: Karen Lewellen 
  To: ptaccess@googlegroups.com 
  Sent: Monday, July 24, 2017 9:10 PM
  Subject: Re: How would you all as full fledged professionals handle this?


  Hi Chris,
  You are an honorable friend being considerate of his feelings.
  I have a question.  who does this person admire professionally?  What 
  singer  does he want to  become, who influences his work, if you understand 
  me?
  I ask because you may be able to give direction, or frankness, without 
  insulting  him as a person.  focus on his art, not  him, does that make 
  sense?
  Will share more after you answer.
  Karen


  On Mon, 24 Jul 2017, Christopher-Mark Gilland wrote:

  > OK, so I have a friend who sent me a track he had recorded. Granted, he did 
it in Reaper not PT, but that's kind of not exactly the point.
  >
  > He wanted my opinion on his mix, etc.
  >
  > First off, the guy is almost 2 whole steps off key. I know, as I know very 
well the song that he recorded. This isn't him using improvization. It's more 
truely him being off the correct note or anything there close.
  >
  > Secondly, his vocals clipped horribly. With no processing or anything, the 
meters are showing him at positive 9.3DB.
  >
  > On his reverb, he ran both the wet, and the dry mix at 100%, so he sounds 
like he's in the grand cannyon. Plus, he's got major major headphone bleedover, 
so bad, I almost can make out each note individually from the karaoke track he 
used.
  >
  > When he hits the higher notes, he's singing from his throat, I can tell, as 
he's straining badly, and literally almost shouting.
  >
  > On the compressor, he used a 8/1 with the attack as fast as the compressor 
plug would let him, and the attack as slow as it would. Then, he set the 
threshold at negative 14DB, which obviously means he's squashing the living 
shit out of things! Worse is, he not only did this on his vocal, but he then 
reduplicated it on the master fader as well. Aaa, my aching! ears!
  >
  > Finally, he turned up all frequencies around 60HZ by about 5 DB.
  >
  > When I told him this needed a lot of work, being he wanted my honest 
opinion, he says he cannot hear the things I'm talking about nor how it 
negatively effected the mix.
  >
  > This guy's been through a lot of emotional psychological trauma, which 
so've I, so I know how it feels. I don't wanna tell him this sounds like utter 
F***ing shit, but, that said, this is about the 5th song he's sent me like 
this. I just don't think he's cut out for a vocalist let alone a producer. OK, 
who 'em I to judge! I know, I know, I'm not the greatest myself, but at least I 
listen and try taking advice when people give it, hince why I've improved as 
much over the years as I have. This guy simply won't take any advice I nor 
anyone else give him. He didn't pay me to listen, he just asked me as a friend 
to tell him. He's not expecting me to do this as him being a client.
  >
  > So, client or not, what's the best way with love, mind you, to more 
politely say, Jane Doe? You absolutely suck!
  >
  > Surely some of you all have had vocalists or musicians who you listenned 
to, who you had to turn down the job from as they just weren't seen as fit for 
it. They just didn't have what it would take.
  >
  > How do you let those guys off easy, without being a nasty Simon Cowell the 
second? My christian morrals won't let me lie, but if I say what I really 
think, it's gonna break his heart! I can't do that to such a dear friend! I 
just can't! What do I do!
  >
  > Chris.
  >
  > -- 
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email to ptaccess+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
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Re: How would you all as full fledged professionals handle this?

[TheOreoMonster]

I’d say point out the things you did here, without being negative or saying you 
suck. Something like your vocals are off key and that they should consider 
collaborating with vocalist. You can also explain that to your more experienced 
ears it sounds over compressed and muddy or etc. No need to get into the 
technical details you got into in your email as it sounds like he isn’t to a 
experience level with productions  where that would mean much to him yet. The 
thing is if they are doing this for fun and to keep themselves busy, then its 
up to them if they work on getting better or not. If they wants to get to a 
point where they wants to do this professionally however, then they’d need to  
consider more experienced opinions at some point. 


> On Jul 24, 2017, at 6:36 PM, Christopher-Mark Gilland  
> wrote:
> 
> OK, so I have a friend who sent me a track he had recorded. Granted, he did 
> it in Reaper not PT, but that's kind of not exactly the point.
>  
> He wanted my opinion on his mix, etc.
>  
> First off, the guy is almost 2 whole steps off key. I know, as I know very 
> well the song that he recorded. This isn't him using improvization. It's more 
> truely him being off the correct note or anything there close.
>  
> Secondly, his vocals clipped horribly. With no processing or anything, the 
> meters are showing him at positive 9.3DB.
>  
> On his reverb, he ran both the wet, and the dry mix at 100%, so he sounds 
> like he's in the grand cannyon. Plus, he's got major major headphone 
> bleedover, so bad, I almost can make out each note individually from the 
> karaoke track he used.
>  
> When he hits the higher notes, he's singing from his throat, I can tell, as 
> he's straining badly, and literally almost shouting.
>  
> On the compressor, he used a 8/1 with the attack as fast as the compressor 
> plug would let him, and the attack as slow as it would. Then, he set the 
> threshold at negative 14DB, which obviously means he's squashing the living 
> shit out of things! Worse is, he not only did this on his vocal, but he then 
> reduplicated it on the master fader as well. Aaa, my aching! ears!
>  
> Finally, he turned up all frequencies around 60HZ by about 5 DB.
>  
> When I told him this needed a lot of work, being he wanted my honest opinion, 
> he says he cannot hear the things I'm talking about nor how it negatively 
> effected the mix.
>  
> This guy's been through a lot of emotional psychological trauma, which so've 
> I, so I know how it feels. I don't wanna tell him this sounds like utter 
> F***ing shit, but, that said, this is about the 5th song he's sent me like 
> this. I just don't think he's cut out for a vocalist let alone a producer. 
> OK, who 'em I to judge! I know, I know, I'm not the greatest myself, but at 
> least I listen and try taking advice when people give it, hince why I've 
> improved as much over the years as I have. This guy simply won't take any 
> advice I nor anyone else give him. He didn't pay me to listen, he just asked 
> me as a friend to tell him. He's not expecting me to do this as him being a 
> client.
>  
> So, client or not, what's the best way with love, mind you, to more politely 
> say, Jane Doe? You absolutely suck!
>  
> Surely some of you all have had vocalists or musicians who you listenned to, 
> who you had to turn down the job from as they just weren't seen as fit for 
> it. They just didn't have what it would take.
>  
> How do you let those guys off easy, without being a nasty Simon Cowell the 
> second? My christian morrals won't let me lie, but if I say what I really 
> think, it's gonna break his heart! I can't do that to such a dear friend! I 
> just can't! What do I do!
>  
> Chris.
> 
> -- 
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> "Pro Tools Accessibility" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
> email to ptaccess+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com 
> .
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> .

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RE: How would you all as full fledged professionals handle this?

[Chris Smart]

be honest with him and put him out of his misery. LOL either that, 
or suggest that he try out for American Idol if it runs again, so we 
can all hear him in the early auditions.








"There are two means of refuge from the miseries of life: music and 
cats." - Albert Schweitzer 


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Re: How would you all as full fledged professionals handle this?

[Karen Lewellen]

Hi Chris,
You are an honorable friend being considerate of his feelings.
I have a question.  who does this person admire professionally?  What 
singer  does he want to  become, who influences his work, if you understand 
me?
I ask because you may be able to give direction, or frankness, without 
insulting  him as a person.  focus on his art, not  him, does that make 
sense?

Will share more after you answer.
Karen


On Mon, 24 Jul 2017, Christopher-Mark Gilland wrote:


OK, so I have a friend who sent me a track he had recorded. Granted, he did it 
in Reaper not PT, but that's kind of not exactly the point.

He wanted my opinion on his mix, etc.

First off, the guy is almost 2 whole steps off key. I know, as I know very well 
the song that he recorded. This isn't him using improvization. It's more truely 
him being off the correct note or anything there close.

Secondly, his vocals clipped horribly. With no processing or anything, the 
meters are showing him at positive 9.3DB.

On his reverb, he ran both the wet, and the dry mix at 100%, so he sounds like 
he's in the grand cannyon. Plus, he's got major major headphone bleedover, so 
bad, I almost can make out each note individually from the karaoke track he 
used.

When he hits the higher notes, he's singing from his throat, I can tell, as 
he's straining badly, and literally almost shouting.

On the compressor, he used a 8/1 with the attack as fast as the compressor plug 
would let him, and the attack as slow as it would. Then, he set the threshold 
at negative 14DB, which obviously means he's squashing the living shit out of 
things! Worse is, he not only did this on his vocal, but he then reduplicated 
it on the master fader as well. Aaa, my aching! ears!

Finally, he turned up all frequencies around 60HZ by about 5 DB.

When I told him this needed a lot of work, being he wanted my honest opinion, 
he says he cannot hear the things I'm talking about nor how it negatively 
effected the mix.

This guy's been through a lot of emotional psychological trauma, which so've I, 
so I know how it feels. I don't wanna tell him this sounds like utter F***ing 
shit, but, that said, this is about the 5th song he's sent me like this. I just 
don't think he's cut out for a vocalist let alone a producer. OK, who 'em I to 
judge! I know, I know, I'm not the greatest myself, but at least I listen and 
try taking advice when people give it, hince why I've improved as much over the 
years as I have. This guy simply won't take any advice I nor anyone else give 
him. He didn't pay me to listen, he just asked me as a friend to tell him. He's 
not expecting me to do this as him being a client.

So, client or not, what's the best way with love, mind you, to more politely 
say, Jane Doe? You absolutely suck!

Surely some of you all have had vocalists or musicians who you listenned to, 
who you had to turn down the job from as they just weren't seen as fit for it. 
They just didn't have what it would take.

How do you let those guys off easy, without being a nasty Simon Cowell the 
second? My christian morrals won't let me lie, but if I say what I really 
think, it's gonna break his heart! I can't do that to such a dear friend! I 
just can't! What do I do!

Chris.

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Re: How would you all as full fledged professionals handle this?

[Jes]

Agreed. Or you could act like you never heard the track.
There really is no easy way to tell somebody they are not cut out for a job, 
especially one in music. So you got to give it straight. If you don't, trust 
me, a somebody will.

> On Jul 24, 2017, at 7:11 PM, Kevin Reeves  wrote:
> 
> I would stop working with him altogether. I would just say that due to 
> artistic differences or whatever, it's not a good collaborative relationship. 
> I personally don't have time to change diapers or deal with emotional issues 
> when it comes to business like this.
> It's nothing personal, it's just business. Your time is valuable. It should 
> be spent making music, not trying to smooth over bruised egos.   
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Jul 24, 2017, at 6:36 PM, Christopher-Mark Gilland 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> OK, so I have a friend who sent me a track he had recorded. Granted, he did 
>> it in Reaper not PT, but that's kind of not exactly the point.
>>  
>> He wanted my opinion on his mix, etc.
>>  
>> First off, the guy is almost 2 whole steps off key. I know, as I know very 
>> well the song that he recorded. This isn't him using improvization. It's 
>> more truely him being off the correct note or anything there close.
>>  
>> Secondly, his vocals clipped horribly. With no processing or anything, the 
>> meters are showing him at positive 9.3DB.
>>  
>> On his reverb, he ran both the wet, and the dry mix at 100%, so he sounds 
>> like he's in the grand cannyon. Plus, he's got major major headphone 
>> bleedover, so bad, I almost can make out each note individually from the 
>> karaoke track he used.
>>  
>> When he hits the higher notes, he's singing from his throat, I can tell, as 
>> he's straining badly, and literally almost shouting.
>>  
>> On the compressor, he used a 8/1 with the attack as fast as the compressor 
>> plug would let him, and the attack as slow as it would. Then, he set the 
>> threshold at negative 14DB, which obviously means he's squashing the living 
>> shit out of things! Worse is, he not only did this on his vocal, but he then 
>> reduplicated it on the master fader as well. Aaa, my aching! ears!
>>  
>> Finally, he turned up all frequencies around 60HZ  by about 5 DB.
>>  
>> When I told him this needed a lot of work, being he wanted my honest 
>> opinion, he says he cannot hear the things I'm talking about nor how it 
>> negatively effected the mix.
>>  
>> This guy's been through a lot of emotional psychological trauma, which so've 
>> I, so I know how it feels. I don't wanna tell him this sounds like utter 
>> F***ing shit, but, that said, this is about the 5th song he's sent me like 
>> this. I just don't think he's cut out for a vocalist let alone a producer. 
>> OK, who 'em I to judge! I know, I know, I'm not the greatest myself, but at 
>> least I listen and try taking advice when people give it, hince why I've 
>> improved as much over the years as I have. This guy simply won't take any 
>> advice I nor anyone else give him. He didn't pay me to listen, he just asked 
>> me as a friend to tell him. He's not expecting me to do this as him being a 
>> client.
>>  
>> So, client or not, what's the best way with love, mind you, to more politely 
>> say, Jane Doe? You absolutely suck!
>>  
>> Surely some of you all have had vocalists or musicians who you listenned to, 
>> who you had to turn down the job from as they just weren't seen as fit for 
>> it. They just didn't have what it would take.
>>  
>> How do you let those guys off easy, without being a nasty Simon Cowell the 
>> second? My christian morrals won't let me lie, but if I say what I really 
>> think, it's gonna break his heart! I can't do that to such a dear friend! I 
>> just can't! What do I do!
>>  
>> Chris.
>> -- 
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>> "Pro Tools Accessibility" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>> email to ptaccess+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
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Re: How would you all as full fledged professionals handle this?

[Kevin Reeves]

I would stop working with him altogether. I would just say that due to artistic 
differences or whatever, it's not a good collaborative relationship. I 
personally don't have time to change diapers or deal with emotional issues when 
it comes to business like this.
It's nothing personal, it's just business. Your time is valuable. It should be 
spent making music, not trying to smooth over bruised egos.   

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jul 24, 2017, at 6:36 PM, Christopher-Mark Gilland  
> wrote:
> 
> OK, so I have a friend who sent me a track he had recorded. Granted, he did 
> it in Reaper not PT, but that's kind of not exactly the point.
>  
> He wanted my opinion on his mix, etc.
>  
> First off, the guy is almost 2 whole steps off key. I know, as I know very 
> well the song that he recorded. This isn't him using  improvization. It's 
> more truely him being off the correct note or anything there close.
>  
> Secondly, his vocals clipped horribly. With no processing or anything, the 
> meters are showing him at positive 9.3DB.
>  
> On his reverb, he ran both the wet, and the dry mix at 100%, so he sounds 
> like he's in the grand cannyon. Plus, he's got major major headphone 
> bleedover, so bad, I almost can make out each note individually from the 
> karaoke track he used.
>  
> When he hits the higher notes, he's singing from his throat, I can tell, as 
> he's straining badly, and literally almost shouting.
>  
> On the compressor, he used a 8/1 with the attack as fast as the compressor 
> plug would let him, and the attack as slow as it would. Then, he set the 
> threshold at negative 14DB, which obviously means he's squashing the living 
> shit out of things! Worse is, he not only did this on his vocal, but he then 
> reduplicated it on the master fader as well. Aaa, my aching! ears!
>  
> Finally, he turned up all frequencies around 60HZ by about 5 DB.
>  
> When I told him this needed a lot of work, being he wanted my honest opinion, 
> he says he cannot hear the things I'm talking about nor how it negatively 
> effected the mix.
>  
> This guy's been through a lot of emotional  psychological trauma, which so've 
> I, so I know how it feels. I don't wanna tell him this sounds like utter 
> F***ing shit, but, that said, this is about the 5th song he's sent me like 
> this. I just don't think he's cut out for a vocalist let alone a producer. 
> OK, who 'em I to judge! I know, I know, I'm not the greatest myself, but at 
> least I listen and try taking advice when people give it, hince why I've 
> improved as much over the years as I have. This guy simply won't take any 
> advice I nor anyone else give him. He didn't pay me to listen, he just asked 
> me as a friend to tell him. He's not expecting me to do this as him being a 
> client.
>  
> So, client or not, what's the best way with love, mind you, to more politely 
> say, Jane Doe? You absolutely suck!
>  
> Surely some of you all have had vocalists or musicians who you listenned to, 
> who you had to turn down the job from as they just weren't seen as fit for 
> it. They just didn't have what it would take.
>  
> How do you let those guys off easy, without being a nasty Simon Cowell the 
> second? My christian morrals won't let me lie, but if I say what I really 
> think, it's gonna break his heart! I can't do that to such a dear friend! I 
> just can't! What do I do!
>  
> Chris.
> -- 
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> "Pro Tools Accessibility" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
> email to ptaccess+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
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