Re: [RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

On 10/06/2015 07:38 AM, Dave Brandt wrote: I recently tore part of the weld an in the direction that would have been from putting it up into the riding position. I have used them on several bikes and I had one directly mounted to the kickstand plate on my Saga. On my last tour I noticed some

Re: [RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

I keep my bikes pretty spotless and I was considering an Appaloosa when they come out. Now it helps me make my mind up to swap the parts over and donate the frame. Hopefully it is superficial but I won't trust it and if it does need repair I would need to get it repainted, making that frame

Re: [RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

I recently tore part of the weld an in the direction that would have been from putting it up into the riding position. I have used them on several bikes and I had one directly mounted to the kickstand plate on my Saga. On my last tour I noticed some fender rub that I have never had before. When

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

Apparently when Riv is temporarily out of items it is pulling the item page altogether with plans to return when merchandise is back in stock. At least that was the consensus when I recently started a thread on the missing MUSA Pants ad. Given the double leg kickstands come from Switzerland,

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

That would make sense. But a fellow RBWer made hay about laughing at my No More MUSA Pants thread claiming they will be back in stock later. On Monday, October 5, 2015 at 4:08:01 PM UTC-5, cyclot...@gmail.com wrote: > > I don't know... King Iris cages are currently out of stock, and still are

Re: [RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

Couldn't tell you that one! :-) On Mon, Oct 5, 2015 at 6:21 PM, Matthew J wrote: > That would make sense. But a fellow RBWer made hay about laughing at my No > More MUSA Pants thread claiming they will be back in stock later. > > > On Monday, October 5, 2015 at 4:08:01 PM

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

I don't know... King Iris cages are currently out of stock, and still are shown on the site. They only say out of stock when you attempt to put one in your cart. On Monday, October 5, 2015 at 1:49:19 PM UTC-7, Matthew J wrote: > > Apparently when Riv is temporarily out of items it is pulling

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

It looks like the double legger is no longer available through Riv's web site. Not out of stock but non-existent. Did I miss something? On Thursday, August 20, 2015 at 6:51:02 PM UTC-7, Will @ Riv wrote: > > Basically it's this, and I'm sorry we've been unclear about it: We have > two

Re: [RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

Well I may have one to sell if you really want one. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

I double checked my Hillborne after reading this thread. I hadn't caught that warning when I replaced my single with a double and this thread made me nervous. Mine is a 2012 and has the u-section plate that Tim referred to. It is the thinner metal but the u-section seats the kickstand

Re: [RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

On Saturday, August 15, 2015 at 12:29:42 PM UTC-7, Patrick Moore wrote: Frankly, having tried Pletscher and VO 2-leg stands, as well as the usual Greenfeld bb stand, I've found left rear dropout stands most effective at holding up a bike under assymetrical rear loads, even with 20 lb in

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

Upon visual inspection of my 2012 Sam Hillborne and my wife's 2012 Betty Foy, both Taiwanese built, both appear to have the unstout plate. Not a term I ever thought would ever be associated with anything Rivendell. Before removing my single legged kickstand, I experimented this week and

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

My Father-in-law had that kinda kickstand back in China. I don't think I'd like the weight of that kstand either. China's got great ideas for baby seats and umbrella holders, too. But in Canton China, seems like people are just cruising to work/school. Nobody cares about average speeds and I

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

This web special Cheviot's description bears mention of a stout plate. So I guess there's more than one plate in use across the Riv model range? The message indicates reassures that DL kickstands are safe to use, so maybe they are not danger absolute after all.

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

I front-load my bike, so simulated a rear load and yeah, I can imagine the angled forces that could affect the plate. Under a front load, though, everything's pretty level and stacked. Also, I agree with the OP; I bought my Pletcher at Riv's recommendation, but haven't found it to be wildly

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

That's the same spot I've seen two other (heavily-used, but not old) Surlys crack. Drive-side, just behind the chainstay bridge. Both replaced under warranty without a lot of grief. In a related note, Chainstays seem to be where heavily-used bikes die (eventually). It is a highly-stressed

Re: [RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

Top plated double has caused no problems with my unstout plated Waterfordborne Sam, glad I didn't have a short bolt handy at the time I was installing it. I removed it anyways. So far I don't miss it, and having it gone has given me the idea I should seek more stumps to jump when

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

Basically it's this, and I'm sorry we've been unclear about it: We have two kickstand plates, a stout one with almost a quarter inch thick steel and a lighter one that is about as thick as a nickel. Most recent Taiwanese frames have the stout plates, and most Waterford-built frames have the

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

I've had a double leg attached to the plate on my Sam Hillborne since 2012. It's been on and off a few times with no damage noted. Granted, I do not heavily load the bike for touring. I run a trunk sack in the rear with maybe 5 pounds at the most. This does cause the bike to rest on the

Re: [RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

My story is exactly as yours except 4 years on my carelessly overloaded Sam H with the same kickstand setup.  So I'm nervous too.  Tim Petersen On Saturday, August 15, 2015 3:27 PM, Kainalu kaiviers...@gmail.com wrote: I use the top plated double legger on my Hillborne and have

Re: [RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

My Sammy has a plate bent into a shallow U which captures the head of the kickstand which prevents rotation under load. Sent from my iPhone On Aug 16, 2015, at 11:02 AM, Lungimsam john11.2...@gmail.com wrote: 1. Perhaps integration is the key. A bike that has a kickstand built into the

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

update: took mine off the 1 yr old hunqapillar which is almost exclusively used for loaded touring (though mostly front loaded). the kickstand plate is definitely not flat like it used to be, but the edges seem to be attached to the chainstays fine. happy i removed it before it started

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

Wonder if single leggers do this to frames, too. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

What about a double-legger for strictly front-loading, i.e., on a porteur? If the main carrying weight of the bike is on the front, and the front wheel is always supporting it by virtue of never leaving the ground, would a plate-mounted kickstand that elevates the rear wheel and only supports

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

This has been an interesting discussion. I am wondering if Riv's preferences for large seat bags exerabates the kickstand problems. Large seat bags put cargo weight high and slightly behind the kickstand strut (when parked), so that the kickstand strut doesn't directly support the weight.

Re: [RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

Minh, Exactly what I did on Sam and the Boulder. Gone. Not missing them. ~Tom On Sunday, August 16, 2015 at 1:18:14 PM UTC-7, Minh wrote: Hmm I think it's time to lighten my Sam and take off the kickstand. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW

RE: [RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: [RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk The purpose of a kickstand plate is to support a kickstand. Evidently experience has shown them that it won't properly support a 2-legged kickstand. Using the built-in plate is fine -- I'm pretty sure I'm using a built

Re: [RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

A velcro legband also makes an excellent parking brake, wrapped tight around the brakelever An Arno Strap or Irish strap makes an excellent Flopper Stopper wrapped tight around the downtube and front wheel On Monday, August 17, 2015 at 10:06:02 AM UTC-7, Montclair BobbyB wrote: Patrick:

Re: [RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

Patrick: Flickstand does 2 things: keeps the wheel from rotating or steering (flopping). If you can get a rubber band to do both I would be dually impressed... Bobby maybe I don't know rubber bands Birmingham -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW

Re: [RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

Of *Steve Palincsar *Sent:* Friday, August 14, 2015 9:10 PM *To:* rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com *Subject:* Re: [RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk The purpose of a kickstand plate is to support a kickstand. Evidently experience has shown them that it won't properly support a 2

Re: [RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

On Monday, August 17, 2015 at 1:06:02 PM UTC-4, Montclair BobbyB wrote: Patrick: Flickstand does 2 things: keeps the wheel from rotating or steering (flopping). If you can get a rubber band to do both I would be dually impressed... Bobby maybe I don't know rubber bands Birmingham To

Re: [RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

Sorry!!! but something like an old toe clip works better than a Kickstand: Should read Flickstand. Stupid auto correct -Mike -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

Drew, So sorry to learn if your experience. A cautionary tale for us all. Matt, Interestly, after warning against sandwich clamping kickstands, Surly recommends a double legged as preferable to single: We recommend the use of two leg kickstands such as the Pletscher. Such a design helps reduce

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

Shawn, have you contacted Riv about this? What was their response? On Friday, August 14, 2015 at 7:37:58 PM UTC-4, shawn m. wrote: I sure wish they'd posted that warning about the double-leggers not using the kickstand plate BEFORE my double-legger ruined the kickstand plate on my

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

1. Perhaps integration is the key. A bike that has a kickstand built into the frame in such a way that it doesn't damage anything to have the kickstand used with or without the bike loaded up to 100 lbs. Since this means tourers, I don't think the consumers would mind a built in k-stand since

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

On Sunday, August 16, 2015 at 11:02:01 AM UTC-5, Lungimsam wrote: 2. Freddie Hoffman rides Waterfords with a 100lb load on his bike, if I remember right. I wonder what he does for kickstands. I've been using a click stand http://www.click-stand.com/ since removing the Pletscher and like it.

Re: [RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

Well if you guys would stop riding off with the two letters open for usual effect... -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to

Re: [RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

Actually, I e read that the chai stay bridge doesn't have a structural function. Sent from my iPhone On Aug 16, 2015, at 1:55 PM, 'hangtownmatt' via RBW Owners Bunch rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com wrote: Here are my latest thoughts: We are looking at this wrong. Although damage

Re: [RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

I've never been impressed with the stability of any chain stay/plate located kickstands, especially their tendency to have the fixing bolt loosen over time. Knowing that it could destroy a frame in some way makes me double down on this feeling. -J On Sunday, August 16, 2015 at 5:03:18 PM

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

Here are my latest thoughts: We are looking at this wrong. Although damage could happen from overloading and/or falling over when the kickstand is deployed, I think the real issue is simply the weight of the double-legger itself. It weighs 25.6 oz, whereas, the single only 9.2 oz. The

Re: [RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

Hmm I think it's time to lighten my Sam and take off the kickstand. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

Here is Surly's position on kickstands for their most robust touring frame: http://surlybikes.com/info_hole/spew/kickstands_on_long_haul_truckers Kind of interesting, Matt -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To unsubscribe

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

I meant to say, also, that it had never fallen over while on the kickstand. On Saturday, August 15, 2015 at 8:49:35 PM UTC-7, shawn m. wrote: I used a Pletscher double-legger on my Hunqapillar. This bike is my daily rider, commuter, go everywhere bike; touring, camping, all of it. It was

Re: [RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

Double kicker coming off wife's Glorius in 3... 2... On Sat, Aug 15, 2015 at 8:53 PM, shawn m. smula...@gmail.com wrote: I meant to say, also, that it had never fallen over while on the kickstand. On Saturday, August 15, 2015 at 8:49:35 PM UTC-7, shawn m. wrote: I used a Pletscher

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

I used a Pletscher double-legger on my Hunqapillar. This bike is my daily rider, commuter, go everywhere bike; touring, camping, all of it. It was mounted directly to the kickstand plate with the shorty bolt I got from Rivendell. After a friend's partner was left permanently disabled by a

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

Here is a Surly LHT with a cracked chainstay right about where a kickstand plate on a Rivendell would be mounted. Granted this bike does have some miles and has been on the road a while, but he doesn't use a kickstand and judging from his experience I'd say your lucky if all that happens is

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

I suppose my thinking and now disappointment came from the idea that a kickstand plate negated crushing or over flexing chainstays. That it solved that problem. I agree with patrick, that I don't know what the purpose of a kickstand plate is, if you can't put a dbl leg one one it. Presumably

Re: [RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

I guess we're all going to have to wait until someone from Rivendell explains the cautionary note. On 08/15/2015 12:33 AM, 'hangtownmatt' via RBW Owners Bunch wrote: I would think a single legger would inflict more twisting than a double legger. On Friday, August 14, 2015 at 6:30:53 PM

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

In what way are the plates deforming? Bent or bulged up or something? Interested to know more. Is it a matter of Riv bikes having their plates enhanced to be made more resiliant to heavier stresses then? Would a thicker reinforcement be their solution to this? KJ On Friday, August 14, 2015

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

My 68 cm Bombadil didn't like having a two-leg stand attached to the plate. It was never that stable, the stand kept coming loose and the plate ended up deformed. On the other hand my better half has one attached to the plate on her 54 cm Homer and it's fine (four years, no problems). There is

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

Yes, Surly does say not to use one. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group,

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

My often loaded Atlantis has a deformed kickstand plate due to the double-legger but the never loaded with more than a few pounds Betty Foy plate is still like new after a couple of years of DL kickstand usage. Seems like sound advice they've added to the site; had I been advised likewise my

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

I have an unused plestcher double legger if anyone wants to experiment... -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to

Re: [RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

Frankly, having tried Pletscher and VO 2-leg stands, as well as the usual Greenfeld bb stand, I've found left rear dropout stands most effective at holding up a bike under assymetrical rear loads, even with 20 lb in the pannier on the stand-side and none on the opposite. That said, I remember

Re: [RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

I use the top plated double legger on my Hillborne and have been carelessly overloading it for 3+ years. No problems ever but I should have a closer look (not having examined the chainstays since I installed the kickstand I'm a bit nervous to, I'll let you know...) -Kai -- You received this

Re: [RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

Patrick, I think you may be referring to the Ursus Jumbo. I tried it, it was OK but it kept coming loose. Anyway, I'm with you on the left rear dropout stands, as I said—I found it much better particularly when loading up a stuffed saddlesack large. -- You received this message because you

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

Drew, sorry to read about your problem and your frustration. I'm not sure I can answer your precise question, but We have the two legged kickstand on our tandem, which weighs well over 40lbs. It works fine, unless one leg hits land that is much softer than the other. I haven't even

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

hey steve, here are the photos i was referencing that show the kickstand attached directly to the plate, which is what it seems they are saying not to do... on the same page

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

I sure wish they'd posted that warning about the double-leggers not using the kickstand plate BEFORE my double-legger ruined the kickstand plate on my hunqapillar! Grr. Now, I don't have a kickstand at all... On Friday, August 14, 2015 at 2:44:00 PM UTC-7, drew wrote: so, i havent been

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

Sounds very vexing, sorry it happened to you. Could you explain in more detail what the double-legger did to the kickstand plate on your Hunqapillar? On Friday, August 14, 2015 at 4:37:58 PM UTC-7, shawn m. wrote: I sure wish they'd posted that warning about the double-leggers not using the

Re: [RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

The purpose of a kickstand plate is to support a kickstand. Evidently experience has shown them that it won't properly support a 2-legged kickstand. Using the built-in plate is fine -- I'm pretty sure I'm using a built-in plate with a 2-legged kick stand on my Kogswell P/R Porteur -- but I

Re: [RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

If a kickstand plate won't support a 2-leg kickstand, it is badly designed. I installed a VO 2-leg stand on my briefly owned Sam Hill, and saw no problem or intimation of a problem; have others used 2-legs on Sam Hills? On Fri, Aug 14, 2015 at 7:09 PM, Steve Palincsar palin...@his.com wrote:

[RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

Last time I checked Surly's website they specifically said NOT to use kickstands on their chainstays. On Friday, August 14, 2015 at 6:35:58 PM UTC-7, WETH wrote: Drew, I use one on my Surly LHT with sandwich-no kickstand plate on an LHT. It has supported a good 50lbs of weight with no

Re: [RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

I would think a single legger would inflict more twisting than a double legger. On Friday, August 14, 2015 at 6:30:53 PM UTC-7, Steve Palincsar wrote: I'll bet it has to do with twisting forces if and when the bike falls over with a load. As Shawn said, I sure wish they'd posted that

Re: [RBW] Re: Double leg Kickstands... lets talk

I'll bet it has to do with twisting forces if and when the bike falls over with a load. As Shawn said, I sure wish they'd posted that warning about the double-leggers not using the kickstand plate BEFORE my double-legger ruined the kickstand plate on my hunqapillar! Grr. Now, I don't have a