Re: [RE-wrenches] High altitude off-grid systems

[jerrysgarage01]

WrenchesHere is the math, well the answer at sea level your body has 14.70 PSI 
exerted on it, at 10,000 feet you only have 10.163 PSI, reduced air pressure, 
reduced cooling or heating ability adjusted for standard sea level temp or just 
over 69%.I have done work in Hawaii on the big island up at the summit, it can 
be warm and very thin air, without air to cool no inverter will perform very 
well. I have some SMA, FX and Raidians in warm high altitude locations and 
added extra cooling to compensate for the lack of air. You will hear the 
cooling fans spinning faster, moving less air at higher altitudes.SMA sunny 
island does have a 9k plus operating altitude but de-rates at less the 
7k.JerryPV inspector Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
 Original message From: Jay Pozner  
Date: 4/12/19  10:06 AM  (GMT-08:00) To: RE-wrenches 
 Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] High altitude 
off-grid systems We do a fair amount of systems at "altitude".  Recently we had 
an issue with a Radian system at about 10,000'.  An 8048 inverter screaming 
(fans running hard) with just 2000 watts of load.  I hounded tech support for 
two years, and even after switching power modules, etc in the end the techs 
claim a fairly substantial deration (that I can't quote right now) of inverter 
performance because of cooling issues.  We  ultimately added another inverter 
to the system at the end of last summer.  I hope this season we will see a 
better result.   It makes sense, given the difference in air density, but I do 
scratch my head and wonder why we haven't seen such issues with the older FX's, 
and some of the older legacy systems?I also know that the Midnite classic 
charge controllers seem to run the fans quite hard as well.  I haven't had to 
replace any of the fans, and the controllers are performing great, but wonder 
if that will be an issue in the future.   It would be great if some 
manufactures would give us a quality, competitively priced, equipment that is 
rated for altitude, but I don't think there are that many options out there as 
of now.Jay Pozner(970) 642-5554www.nunatakenergy.comNABCEP Certified PV 
Installer:Cert.#031310-177On Fri, Apr 12, 2019 at 9:17 AM Steve Higgins 
 wrote:Not to add fuel to the fire... and it's been almost 
7 years since I've been with an Inverter manufacturer so here is my .02 
cents...  So again, I hope I'm not overstepping the boundaries of the Wrenches 
list. If I remember correctly the main issue with the high altitude installs 
are some of the components that are used to build the inverter/controllers 
aren't rated to be used at high altitude, one of the main components that have 
this issue is the electrolytic capacitors.    Of course, the specs vary from 
component to component.   I've seen some rated as low as 8000 ft to some as 
rated as high as 30,000 ft.   It really just depends on the part(s) that the 
manufacturer used to build the product. As you gain altitude the temperatures 
and the air pressure decrease, as it was explained to me years ago the problem 
is with the temperature decrease, this will affect the capacitance of the 
capacitor.  The colder temps will reduce the overall capacitance of the 
capacitor, just like it will with a battery. These caps are generally used to 
filter noise from circuits, so when these fail, or the capacitance values fall, 
you don't get the filtering you need and this induces noise into your circuitry 
possibly causing overall failure or worse,  the dreaded intermittent failure.   
Generally, if the inverters/controllers are kept on and warm, you won't have 
too many problems, it's when they are in extremely cold temperatures is when 
you will start having issues.  Hope this helps!   Have a good weekend!   Steve 
Higgins ⋅ Technical Services Manager 
 
 t +1.902.597.4020  m +1.206.790.5840f +1.902.597.8447  e st...@surrette.com 
 
   CONFIDENTIALITY: The information transmitted herein is intended only for the 
addressee and may contain confidential, proprietary and/or privileged material. 
Any unauthorized review, distribution or other use of or the taking of any 
action in reliance upon this information is prohibited. If you receive this 
email in error, please contact the sender and delete or destroy this message 
and all copies.On Fri, Apr 12, 2019 at 7:47 AM  
wrote:Folks: The issue here ulltimately isn’t whether it works or not, it’s if 
it’s WARRANTED.  Some purchasers (in this case the USFS) mandate that all 
equipment be warranted for high altitudes.  And that leaves out several major 
suppliers.  Chris DaumOasis Montana Inc.  From: RE-wrenches 
 On Behalf Of RaySent: Thursday, 
April 11, 2019 10:55 PMTo: re-wrenc...@lists.re-wrenches.orgSubject: Re: 
[RE-wrenches] High altitude off-grid systems We've had some systems at 11,000 
ft plus, for almost 20 years.  We have mixtures of Outback, Midnite, Blue Sky, 
and old Trace equipment.  Never any issues with electronics related to 
altitude.  Actually the 

Re: [RE-wrenches] HV Module Testing

[jerrysgarage01]

Current will pass through so just one hot leg to earth, be carefull not to 
overload the diodes, l have never had an issue but you never know. JerrySent 
from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
 Original message From: drake.chamber...@redwoodalliance.org 
Date: 4/10/19  3:07 PM  (GMT-08:00) To: RE-wrenches 
 Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] HV Module 
Testing That is very helpful. If I do the high voltage test, can I test from 
both positive to the frame and negative to the frame? Thanks,Drake - 
Original Message -From: "RE-wrenches" 
To:"RE-wrenches" 
Cc:Sent:Wed, 10 Apr 2019 10:35:50 
-0700Subject:Re: [RE-wrenches] HV Module TestingDrakeI have performed test for 
manufactures and you must keep the test voltage under the max rated voltage of 
the module, we have a bunch of tests we do but in short, you need to see the 
modules up close, look at the edges and back sheets look for green, brown or 
black spots, you need to do testing both dry first then wet if it is a ground 
fault concern. Most of the time the visual will find the issues but you still 
want to verify what you think you see. Make sure you look at the wiring to and 
from, the combiner box(s) or even the inverter(s).On Wed, Apr 10, 2019 at 8:31 
AM Drake  wrote:

Hello Wrenches, 
We are troubleshooting an array of Orion modules, either 230s or 250s.
The array is showing a ground fault. 
We would like to test these modules with an insulation tester? 
We would like to apply 500 V or 1000 V to each the + and – and test
resistance to ground. 
 
Is this practice safe for individual PV modules? Is there anything I
should be aware of before attempting this?
Thanks,
DrakeDrake ChamberlinAthens Electric LLC
OH License 44810
CO License 3773
NABCEP Certified Solar PV 
740-448-7328http://athens-electric.com/


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Re: [RE-wrenches] Dealing with HOAs.

[jerrysgarage01]

WrenchesYes HOA's might be able to restrict pv under state law depending on 
your state, in Hawaii the rule is multi-family joined over 2 stories  they can 
say no, they can also restrict size to. You need to read the AOAO rules, know 
the state law pertaining  to your particular type of structure. They may be 
wrong but you need to be prepared to go to the board meetings and get answers. 
What state are you in?JerrySent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
 Original message From: Kevin Eigel  
Date: 3/29/19  10:19 AM  (GMT-08:00) To: RE-wrenches 
 Subject: [RE-wrenches] Dealing with HOAs. 
We have a customer whose HOA is disapproving his plans to install all black 
panels on the front (south facing) roof of his house. Does anyone have any 
suggestions about getting this project through. In my opinion, HOAs should not 
be able to stop a solar project.Kevin EigelEcohouse Solar
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Voltage seeking transfer switch

[jerrysgarage01]

Christopher I have used a Cummins 200 amp generator/grid transfer switch, it 
gives the gen start command, we used this so during normal operations we could 
pass through the full load where in backup mode the inverters took overSent 
from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
 Original message From: Christopher Warfel 
 Date: 3/19/19  8:44 AM  (GMT-08:00) To: 
re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Voltage seeking 
transfer switch 
I think you just use an automatic transfer switch similar to
  those used for back up generators.  We are looking at one for
  backing up a community well pump that will transfer to a multimode
  system if the utility drops out. Chris

On 3/19/2019 10:54 AM, Mac Lewis wrote:


  Hello Wrenches,


Does anyone have experience with a 200A outdoor transfer
  switch that will automatically seek voltage?  Meaning that if
  priority voltage source (grid) isn't available and second
  source is available it will switch to it with no external
  communication?  We are trying to do a whole house backup, and
  critical load panel isn't possible.  This may be common, I
  just haven't done it.


Thanks in advance
  
  
  -- 
  






Mac Lewis


"Yo solo sé que no sé nada." -Sócrates
  

  
  
  
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Outback question

[jerrysgarage01]

KristopherEach box has it own set of bussing and breakers, not using a box how 
would you protect the DC inputs and what would you do with the AC outputs, 
bypass, that along with the DC wiring.I have installed 8 Radian in one location 
all with the box under the inverter.JerrySent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy 
smartphone
 Original message From: Kristopher Schmid 
 Date: 3/13/19  10:02 AM  (GMT-08:00) To: RE-wrenches 
 Subject: [RE-wrenches] Outback question Has 
anyone ever done a dual radian installation with only one GSLC?  I can't see 
the need for a second one other than wire routing.  Am i missing 
something?Thanks,KrisShine On!Kris SchmidLegacy Solar, LLC137 West 1st 
AvenueLuck, WI 54853www.legacysolar.com715-653-4295NABCEP Certified PV 
Installation ProfessionalLicensed Wisconsin Master ElectricianBSEE
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Aquion Batteries

[jerrysgarage01]

DarrylYou might want to look at Blue ion, have a bunch installed and they have 
been great "Mars Mission Ready" great, had a customer that survived the Fires 2 
years ago and all the time with no power these batteries kept up.Jerry


Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
 Original message From: Darryl Thayer  
Date: 1/23/19  2:08 PM  (GMT-08:00) To: offgridso...@sti.net, newrewrenches 
 Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Aquion Batteries 
I have used Simphiphy.  Had a problem  over time nearly 2 years the cells were 
what appears to be out of balance.  I think i balanced them by setting the 
charge voltage higher than recomended.  I think the factory has it wrong
On Wed, Jan 23, 2019, 1:39 PM Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/

e-mail  offgridso...@sti.net

text 209 813 0060



> Awhile back, it was mentioned that missmatched cell voltages could be

> corrected with a 6 volt charger attached to each low layer.  I tried this

> on one and it worked.  I have several stacks that have mostly even

> voltages

> with one cell over charged.  Often 8 to 25 volts.  Some showed the high

> voltage layer when under charge but looked normal when static.  Others had

> the high voltage even when static.  Are these layers just totally

> defective

> or could the voltage be bled off somehow down to the average.  Has anyone

> tried this.  I have three  customers with Aquions that are working well

> and

> staying balanced.  This customer has 24 batteries and 13 show this

> problem.

> Capacity of the bank is very poor.  Customer is ready to call lawyer!  Any

> ideas?

> Tump, yes these include the batteries from Maine but also half of his

> original 12 are showing the same problem.

>

> John Blittersdorf.

> CV Wind Service (and Solar)

> 200 West Road

> N Chittenden, VT 05763

> 802-770-8625

>

>

> PS Also any feedback on the Simpliphi batteries would be appreciated.  I

> have just two systems using these so far.   Both small.  2  48 v and 5

> 24v.

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Lg chem

[jerrysgarage01]

You need to check with your distributor because we have been installing for 
many months now, both master and slave batteriesJerry


Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
 Original message From: Kirk Herander  
Date: 12/14/18  6:43 AM  (GMT-08:00) To: re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org 
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Lg chem 

Does anyone know when LG chem batteries for Storedge inverters are going to be 
available? I’ve heard nothing new for months thanks.

Kirk Herander


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Re: [RE-wrenches] Portable Power Centers

[jerrysgarage01]

Peter/WrenchesLook at the Nlue Planet Blue Ion  batteries with the BMU, Thdy 
have a great Product designJerry


Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
 Original message From: Peter Parrish 
 Date: 12/10/18  7:49 AM  (GMT-08:00) To: 
RE-wrenches  Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] 
Portable Power Centers 
Thanks Bill, and everyone else: When I was a CA solar contractor, I designed 
and oversaw the installation of over 20 “grid-tied battery back up systems”. I 
now have an approved application into the Southern California Edison SGIP 
program, spec’ing a 16 kWh and 8 kW “smart” e-storage system. The system will 
use Li-ion batteries (the exact manu and chemistry escapes me right now). I 
don’t quite understand the relative lack of traction regarding Li for small 
scale remote/recreational applications. I understand a little about BMS, enough 
to be dangerous. So perhaps the biggest question I have is why NOT design-in a 
Li battery system as long as it come wrapped with a BSM? Any 
brands/technologies recommended? Also thanks for the info on 36 cell vs. 60 
cell PV modules. If I were to specify a system from scratch (and that is the 
direction I’m heading), I would go with 60 cell modules (even 72 cell modules) 
and a MPPT CC that can handle the voltage and current range. And thanks for the 
recommendation on AC vs DC powered refrigerators. I don’t want to handle the 
service call! Thanks to everyone for their input. Peter Peter T. Parrish
SolarGnosis
1107 Fair Oaks Ave. Ste. 351
South Pasadena, CA 91030
(323) 839-6108
peter.parr...@solargnosis.com From: William Dorsett
Sent: Sunday, December 9, 2018 10:56 PM
To: 'RE-wrenches'
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Portable Power Centers Especially for this group of 
people, who are used to making do with resources as they come, there was a very 
interesting concept article in HomePower, Issue #186, July / August 2018, 
called DayLight Drive by Alexis Zeigler • Living Energy Farm, Louisa, Virginia. 
 
https://www.homepower.com/articles/solar-electricity/equipment-products/mailbox-daylight-drive
 The concept is in minimizing the expense of battery storage by using sun… well 
“DayLight” as it happens. I think the concept is particularly relevant to 
situations like you are describing and in developing countries. But also more 
to us as we look to the role of storage in general. Thanks for the thoughts, 
Alexis.  Bill DorsettFlint Hills Renewable Energy & Efficiency Cooperative, 
Inc.    “Start where you are. Use what you have. Do what you can” Arthur 
Ashe1715 LeavenworthManhattan, KS  66502www.fhreec.org 785/539-1956  Office 
785/564-2583  cellwmdors...@cox.net     From: RE-wrenches 
 On Behalf Of Peter Parrish
Sent: Saturday, December 08, 2018 5:27 PM
To: RE-wrenches 
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Portable Power Centers We are working with Turning Point 
Foundation a 501(c)3 to provide off-grid power for their River Haven project 
which is providing transitional housing for homeless folks in the Ventura CA 
area. The site is truly off-grid and currently uses propane to power three 
refrigerators and cook stoves. There is no space heating for the single 
occupancy rooms as of yet. But that’s another problem. We are looking to 
specify DC refrigerators and PV-powered battery storage for the River Haven 
project. We are looking at the Goal Zero Yeti-3000 system (3000 Whr, 500 full 
discharge cycles, to 80% residual capacity) at a sale price of $2,400 but are 
finding the extra cost of their PV modules quite steep. And looking at other 
36-cell (12 volt) modules, I can’t find anything for less than $1.10/W.  Since 
Goal Zero is looking at the recreational market, I thought that there might be 
other companies with comparable product offerings that are focusing on other 
markets like developing countries. Any advice would be appreciated and you may 
contact us off-line. Peter T. Parrish
SolarGnosis
1107 Fair Oaks Ave. Ste. 351
South Pasadena, CA 91030
(323) 839-6108
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Radian orders hardware problems

[jerrysgarage01]

WrenchesI  have installed several in Hawaii in recent months and more in 
California, l have not had any issues with either out of the box or pre-wired. 
With the Shunts it may have been a batch but missing hardware is just that, 
missing. I will keep an eye out and we will see.Jerry


Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
 Original message From: cwar...@entech-engineering.com Date: 
12/4/18  2:20 AM  (GMT-08:00) To: RE-wrenches 
 Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Radian orders 
hardware problems 

I have only installed two so far on the small island I live on and had none of 
these problems.  We have installed 4048's and I am wondering if these problems 
are with 8048s or 4048s?  Thank you, Chris Warfel
 


On 2018-12-03 14:34, Lones Tuss wrote:


Hello William
Sorry for the issues and troubles. I have forwarded your concerns on to the 
responsible parties. I have requested additional bolts which once I receive 
them I will send them on to you.
Take Care Sir
 


From: RE-wrenches  On Behalf Of 
William Miller
Sent: Saturday, December 1, 2018 1:47 PM
To: RE-wrenches 
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Radian orders hardware problems


 
** [EXTERNAL EMAIL] - Please report any suspicious attachments, links, or 
requests for sensitive information to the Help Desk. ** 


Wrenches:
 
I am reaching out to this group to see if anyone is having the problems we are. 
 At least 50% of the Radian inverters and/or GSLC cabinets we order arrive 
missing some part or piece required to install the inverter.  Sometimes it is 
one or more of the bus bars to connect the main DC breaker to the inverter, 
sometimes it is one of the 8mm nuts required on these bus bars, and the most 
recent order, and on our most recent order, one of the inverters was missing 
the 8mm bolts and washers required to connect the bus bars to the inverter plus 
and minus ports.
 
We have been having this problem for years.  Has anyone else experienced this, 
or is it just me?
 
Also, the shunts provided in the GSLC cabinets are crap.  It used to be the 
shunts had a solid base.  Now the bases are hollow.  We use to see these shunt 
bases cracked almost 100% of the time in shipping because the long, 
cantilevered negative bus bar was entirely supported at one end by the shunt.  
Any modest bump on the GSLC cabinet broke the shunt.  Now we receive them 
intact because Alpha has stopped installing the shunt prior to shipping.  The 
problem persists, however, because if you put the slightest pressure on the 
negative bus bar to align the holes to install the bolts (if they arrive), 
minimal strain in the base of the shunt cracks it.  See the photos below of the 
old versus new style shunt. 
 
Each of these problems slows down an install and creates frustration.  This 
persistent pattern is really not acceptable.
 
Lones, please investigate these problems and let us know if they can be 
rectified.  And please, send me a set of the 8mm bolts.
 
Thank you,
 
William Miller
 

 Lic 773985
millersolar.com
 805-438-5600
 




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Re: [RE-wrenches] Ni-Fe update?

[jerrysgarage01]

WrenchesI have used Iron Edison Batteries and 12 volts is tough but l have had 
no issues at 48, you can set the high side voltage enough to work well. They 
are a very thirsty battery technology but may last for ever. Round trip 
efficiency is 70% at best so a larger array is required and the batteries don't 
like it to cold either.Jerry Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
 Original message From: Ken Schaal  
Date: 11/21/18  11:36 AM  (GMT-08:00) To: RE-wrenches 
 Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Ni-Fe update? 
Hey alexis.Any thoughts regarding these comments about Ni-fi batteries?Ur 
running them DC direct?Hope all is well. KenOn Wed, Nov 21, 2018, 2:25 PM David 
Katz  wrote:
  

  
  
Charge efficiency is really low,  Charging parameters can be hard
  to get right, Voltage is not stable under heavy loads, and they
  are really expensive to boot.  I've never sold them for these
  reasons, but I have replaced some sets that customers were unhappy
  with.  They seem to work OK, only if there are no large surge
  loads, and the battery and array are sized large enough. 
  Unfortunately because of the cost, folks seem to really under size
  them, which only exasperates the above issues.
There's good reasons this old battery chemistry has not been
  widely adopted by the solar industry.  It does have its place, and
  I understand the train industry uses it because A) they have cheap
  on grid charging available, so efficiency doesn't matter, and B)
  they have telecomm type loads with very little surge.

Ray Walters
Remote Solar
303 505-8760
On 11/21/18 10:55 AM,
  d...@foxfire-energy.com wrote:


  
  
Hi Guys, I have a potential customer inquiring about
  installing a pre packaged Iron Edison system.. I recall
  hearing strange stories about Ni-Fe batteries but don't recall
  the specifics. I have done a few searches with mixed results..
  And have friends advising I run like a Rabbit.. Thought I'd
  run it by you folks for an update..
 Thanks, and Happy Turkey Day.


db




  Dan Brown
  Foxfire Energy Corp.
  Renewable Energy Systems
  (802)-483-2564
  www.Foxfire-Energy.com

  
  
  
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Batt Cap AGM

[jerrysgarage01]

AllanI have been involved in off grid since the late 70's, l guess l have 
picked up a thing or two. As batteries age most will require higher voltage to 
reach the same specific gravity and will have a lower voltage under a load. 
This is the result of resistance with in the battery. This battery may still be 
good and just needs a good charge to get it back to a more normal state.The 
entire wire harness from where it leaves the point of charge has it's own 
resistance e, every connection, cable end, wire all of it has resistance and 
measuring  this is not as easy as you may think, you need to put a preset load 
on the bank measure the complete circuit voltage, now do the same under charge, 
measure  each battery note everything and once done with all the seperate banks 
you can see where the higher resistance is. This is why making all the cables 
the same length and same size, l have seen some cables soldered to reduce 
resistance. This in a long round about reason is why fewer bigger banks is 
better then more smaller batteries. I can continue but you should be up to 
speed nowJerrySent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
 Original message From: Sindelar Solar 
 Date: 11/21/18  11:54 AM  (GMT-08:00) To: 
re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Batt Cap AGM 
Jerry,
You write "I'm sure you know this..." but I don't know it. I
  don't think I have heard this before, as you have presented it. 

How do you rotate strings? Where did you learn this? Is there an
  online source that you can provide?
Thanks, Allan

On 11/20/2018 6:21 PM, jerrysgarage01
  wrote:


  
  Wrenches, Drake
  You may consider contacting "Batcap" and bank if they have a
best practice for the battery configuration, this might be it
but at least a starting point. I have had multi string batteries
that seamed to like being rotated through the bank, sounds like
alot of work and it is but this will swap higher resistance
strings for lower ones. I'm sure you know this but each battery
has internal resistance to charge and even discharge so rotating
them reduces the effect and may in time help to improve the
battery life. 
  Jerry
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
Sent from my
  Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
  
  
  
  
 Original message 
From: Drake  
Date: 11/20/18 8:41 AM (GMT-08:00) 
To: RE-wrenches  
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Batt Cap AGM 


  
  Hello Wrenches,
  
  An owner of an existing system has a bank of twenty, 100 AH, 12 V
  Deep
  cycle batteries of the
  Batcap
  
  brand.
  
  The bank is made up of four sets of 5 batteries in parallel to
  produce
  500 AH battery sets at 12 V. These four parallel sets are
  then
  wired  in series to give a 48 V nominal bank. 
  
  The battery voltages vary from around 13 to 15 volts. The bank is
  about 5
  years old. The CEO of Batcap told the system owner that these
  batteries
  have lasted up to 30 years in solar applications, so he has high
  expectations for these batteries being around for a while. 
  
  My first impulse is to rewire the bank in a normal series -
  parallel
  configuration. But there are too many strings to do this without a
  bus
  bar. Besides, the batteries are likely damaged, and rewiring them
  might
  cause the bank to exhibit unsuspected problems. How much money is
  worth
  putting into this bank? $0?
  
  The owner seems like a reliable guy who likely hired the wrong
  installer.
  He could use some help. What would you do in this situation?
  Rewire the
  bank, leave it well enough alone or run for the hills.
  
  Thanks,
  
  Drake 
  
  Drake Chamberlin
  Athens Electric LLC
OH License 44810
CO License 3773
NABCEP Certified Solar PV 
740-448-7328
  http://athens-electric.com/
  
  
  
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-- 
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  


  
Allan Sindelar
  al...@sindelarsolar.com
  NABCEP Certified PV Installation
Professional
New Mexico EE98J Journeyman Electrician

Re: [RE-wrenches] Batt Cap AGM

[jerrysgarage01]

Wrenches, DrakeYou may consider contacting "Batcap" and bank if they have a 
best practice for the battery configuration, this might be it but at least a 
starting point. I have had multi string batteries that seamed to like being 
rotated through the bank, sounds like alot of work and it is but this will swap 
higher resistance strings for lower ones. I'm sure you know this but each 
battery has internal resistance to charge and even discharge so rotating them 
reduces the effect and may in time help to improve the battery life. JerrySent 
from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
 Original message From: Drake 
 Date: 11/20/18  8:41 AM  (GMT-08:00) To: 
RE-wrenches  Subject: [RE-wrenches] Batt Cap 
AGM 
Hello Wrenches,
An owner of an existing system has a bank of twenty, 100 AH, 12 V Deep
cycle batteries of the
Batcap

brand.
The bank is made up of four sets of 5 batteries in parallel to produce
500 AH battery sets at 12 V. These four parallel sets are then
wired  in series to give a 48 V nominal bank. 
The battery voltages vary from around 13 to 15 volts. The bank is about 5
years old. The CEO of Batcap told the system owner that these batteries
have lasted up to 30 years in solar applications, so he has high
expectations for these batteries being around for a while. 
My first impulse is to rewire the bank in a normal series - parallel
configuration. But there are too many strings to do this without a bus
bar. Besides, the batteries are likely damaged, and rewiring them might
cause the bank to exhibit unsuspected problems. How much money is worth
putting into this bank? $0?
The owner seems like a reliable guy who likely hired the wrong installer.
He could use some help. What would you do in this situation? Rewire the
bank, leave it well enough alone or run for the hills.
Thanks,
Drake 
Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
OH License 44810
CO License 3773
NABCEP Certified Solar PV 
740-448-7328
http://athens-electric.com/

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Microfractures

[jerrysgarage01]

AndrewCorrect, its is all about time, temp cycles will all effect modules, 
arial IR testing generally  will not show new fractures.JerrySent from my 
Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
 Original message From: Andrew Truitt  Date: 
11/18/18  8:20 PM  (GMT-08:00) To: RE-wrenches 
 Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Microfractures 
Jerry - Thanks for the input!  No snail trails or burn marks at his point as 
the system has yet to be commissioned.  There will be an aerial IR inspection 
once we're operating and if anything shows up it'll be addressed for sure, but 
my understanding of microfractures is that the effects often don't show up for 
years (save for what can be seen with EL testing). Regards, Andrew Truitt 
www.dr.venturesd: 202.486.7507NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional ID: 
032407-66Colorado Journeyman Electrician License No.: 600132 The content of 
this email is confidential and intended for the recipient specified in message 
only. It is strictly forbidden to share any part of this message with any third 
party, without a written consent of the sender. If you received this message by 
mistake, please reply to this message and follow with its deletion, so that we 
can ensure such a mistake does not occur in the future.On Fri, Nov 16, 2018 at 
5:27 PM Jerry Shafer  wrote:Andrew, WrenchesWhile in 
Hawaii, l had modules that had fractures, some showed up in low performance, 
some did not and l don't recall there being a wobble on the high side. I would 
suggest inspecting what the modules look in question. Most of the time the 
cracks are visable and may look like worm tracks, they will be across the 
modules. Also look for what appears to be cigarette burns, this is trace arcing 
or at least overheating of the trace and they can appear at the interconnecting 
trace or main traces mostly at the change in direction of the trace. I have 
also had bad bypass diode connections have issues effecting performance 
curves.JerryNABCEP InspectorNABCEP InstallerOn Fri, Nov 16, 2018, 12:03 PM 
Andrew Truitt http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Outback sold to PA battery company

[jerrysgarage01]

WrenchesI spoke to a senior manager at Outback at SPI and they said that there 
they are an inverter company and regardless of ownership that would not change. 
At that time it was only a rumor and they may have been down playing the entire 
idea even after l said that they would be.Jerry


Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
 Original message From: Bill Hennessy  
Date: 11/5/18  1:42 PM  (GMT-08:00) To: RE-wrenches 
 Subject: [RE-wrenches] Outback sold to PA 
battery company 
Hi folks, It looks like Outback (owned by Alpha) has been sold to Enersys, who 
has been supplying the Outback-branded batteries for years. 

Anyone have any info as to how this may affect Outback production or support?
https://www.readingeagle.com/money/article/enersys-acquires-alpha-technologies

   EnerSys acquires Alpha Technologies  Deal will allow Bern Township 
company to expand product portfolio.
 Bill Hennessy
Berks Solar, LLC
371 Centennial Rd
Mertztown, PA 19539

o 610 682 4300
c 484 560 4666
NABCEP certified installer
PA contractor #44411
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Enphase tech support

[jerrysgarage01]

WrenchesEnphase now has a call back feature which has greatly improved 
responce1-877-797-4743Have site ID ready when you callJerry


Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone

 Original message 
From: Bill Hennessy  
Date: 6/13/18  8:44 AM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: RE-wrenches  
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Enphase tech support 

roy,

here's the tech support number from the enlighten section. they ask to also 
have your site id ready when you call.
https://enlighten.enphaseenergy.com/support

also, enphase has cut staff and the wait is getting longer.
regards, bill Bill Hennessy
Berks Solar, LLC
371 Centennial Rd
Mertztown, PA 19539

o 610 682 4300
c 484 560 4666
NABCEP certified installer
PA contractor #44411
www.berkssolar.com

   From: Roy Butler 
 To: re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org 
 Sent: Wednesday, June 13, 2018 1:29 PM
 Subject: [RE-wrenches] Enphase tech support
   
Does anyone have contact information for Enphase Tech Support?

Thanks in advance!

-- 
Roy Butler
Four Winds Renewable Energy, LLC
8902 Route 46, Arkport, NY 14807
607-324-9747  www.four-winds-energy.com

Check out the Annual Small Wind Conference
A Gathering of Installers, Manufacturers, Dealers, & Distributors
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Xfmr's job?

[jerrysgarage01]

The Radian has 2, 4k, 240 volt inverters, so its different but the way the 
computer works it makes the same from the load side of thingsJerry


Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone

 Original message 
From: frenergy  
Date: 5/29/18  5:51 PM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org 
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Xfmr's job? 

Hey folks,

             Outback FP2 with Xfrmr shifts power to "other" leg if that 
leg needs more than the one FX can provide, right?  Say, you need 5.5 KW 
on leg 1, the Xfrmr pulls some power from the leg 2 (inverter) to 
support that 5.5KW load on leg 1.

My question (assuming above is accurate) is does the 8048 Radian do the 
same?

Thanks,

Bill

Feather River Solar Electric
Bill Battagin, Owner
4291 Nelson St.
Taylorsville, CA 95983
530.284.7849
CA Lic 874049
www.frenergy.net


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Re: [RE-wrenches] Pika energy equipment

[jerrysgarage01]

I had a meeting with Pika at SPI 2017 it might have been all the other meetings 
but l was not impressed, no technical information on programming or true 
applications but thats just me.Jerry


Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone

 Original message 
From: jay  
Date: 5/13/18  1:21 PM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: RE-wrenches  
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Pika energy equipment 

HI All,

Any of you installing the Pika equipment?  Thoughts and is there retail pricing 
that can be shared?

thanks

jay

peltz power


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Re: [RE-wrenches] Looking for insulated #6 bare standoff

[jerrysgarage01]

Ray I have never (yet) had a wire failure in any of my trackers, l have always 
used PVC flex tubing connected at both ends with a long line that at any given 
point does not move much. I mainly use zomeworks passive sonhle axes trackers 
but have done it the same way with array technologes dual axes unitsJerry


Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone

 Original message 
From: Ray  
Date: 4/19/18  1:05 PM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org 
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Looking for insulated #6 bare standoff 

On tracking arrays,  I have had both solid and stranded copper ground 
wire strain harden and break.  The cyclical motion will slowly work away 
at coarse cables. I've even seen solid #6 break off on just a tilt 
adjustable array. I now use a braided ground strap at least for the rack 
to pole ground connection.  This is the same strap that is used to 
ground generators and other moving electrical equipment.

https://www.delcity.net/store/Ground-Straps/p_818655.h_818654

I isolate it at the connection to the aluminum with a sandwich of 
Stainless fender washers and a 1/4" bolt with toothed lock washer to 
bite into the AL, or it also works well folded in ground Lugs and buss 
bars. You can open up the weave of the braided copper in the middle to 
get the 1/4" bolt through.  I've checked these years later: no 
corrosion, wire not broken off at the connector.

Ray


On 4/19/18 3:48 PM, Dana wrote:
> The bare #8 is an EGC for #10 USE PV wire on the tracker to the array mounted 
> combiner box.
>
> 
> Dana Orzel  Great Solar Works, Inc.
> C - 208.721.7003   d...@solarwork.com
> Idaho Contractor - # 028765 Idaho PV # 028374
> NABCEP # 051112-136   www.solarwork.biz
> "Responsible Technologies for Responsible People since 1988"
>  Please consider the environment before printing this email.
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: RE-wrenches  On Behalf Of 
> Hilton Dier
> Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2018 3:39 PM
> To: re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org
> Subject: [RE-wrenches] Looking for insulated #6 bare standoff
>
> Would #8 meet code? I thought that exposed ground wire had to be #6 minimum.
>
> Hilton Dier III
> Renewable Energy Design
> Missisquoi River Hydro LLC
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Electric Water kWh/ person

[jerrysgarage01]

DrakeWe have used 40 to 80 gallon water heaters mainly the Rheem Marathon 
electric units, we used 15 minutes per person twice a day on the timer, we did 
use 7 day timers to have different start times on the weekends. We had great 
success with that as a base line.Jerry


Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone

 Original message 
From: Darryl Thayer  
Date: 3/14/18  4:14 PM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: RE-wrenches  
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Electric Water kWh/ person 

Sorry to say nothing, but a few years ago I did a study on off grid and on grid 
houses and some had electric resistance water heaters and one with a Heat pump 
water heater.  If I can find the data I will send.  However, it varied a lot 
most the families were for 2 or 3 people  The variation made it seem like my 
study was of little value.  except for the family with a heat pump water heater 
used about 1/4 the electricity of the other.    
On Wed, Mar 14, 2018 at 6:19 PM,   wrote:
Hello Wrenches,

Is there a good way to estimate the power that will be consumed for electric 
water per person per day? We are estimating the amount of power that will be 
used by an all electric duplex, and the water heater amount seems high. The 
current model we have claims 3493 kWh/ year per 26 gallon tank will be 
consumed. With the two units, that would add up to 6986 kWh / year for hot 
water, pushing the system size to humongous for a 1300 ft sq building. 

Does that seem high? There will be a maximum of 2 people per unit. 

The owner is considering going to 115 V units with a 15 gallon tanks. I think 
the smaller tank would help, but it would seem that the amount of hot water 
consumed would be the main issue. 

How can we get a good estimate for a per person energy usage for electric hot 
water? Any other suggestions are welcome.

Thank you,

Drake




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Re: [RE-wrenches] 1/2 HP well pump soft start at 120 VAC

[jerrysgarage01]

WrenchesI think its in the inverter or battery but somewhere before it leaves 
the inverter flickering lights indicates the inverter is seeing the issue up 
close, a 4 k inverter is 33 amps AC but Over 166 from the 24 volt batteries if 
the load if half that with lights and inverter is strugling need to look at the 
battery voltage including cable drop. I have seen this quite a few times over 
the years.Jerry


Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone

 Original message 
From: Darryl Thayer  
Date: 2/9/18  5:25 PM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: RE-wrenches  
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] 1/2 HP well pump soft start at 120 VAC 

Dana my 1/2 HP 240 volt pump draws about < 2 amps, which is maybe 3.3 amps if 
it is 120 volts.  I wonder if the high volt drop is leaving your pump in locked 
rotor for a long time, in which case a soft start will not help.  Perhaps a 
buck-boost transformer  (about 150 watts) boosting 16% would get the pump 
started faster?  Do the wire size and length for calculating volt drop.  then 
use a 3.3 amp soft start.       
On Fri, Feb 9, 2018 at 6:24 PM,   wrote:
Hi Dana,

   We have been using Grundfos SQ-O 1/2 hp, 5 GPM (or they have a 10 GPM

model) soft start pumps for years, with great outcomes. We have sold 60

or so over the years with no returns.



Daryl







> Hey all you solar wise guys,









>

>

>

> I am looking for a recommendation based on your experience, not just data

> sheets for a 120 volt-9.8 amp-1/2HP well pump soft starter. Every time the

> well pump starts the SW4024 groans and the lights flicker.

>

>

>

> There are a lot of units that claim to soft start a ½ HP, but the reality

> is

> that they claim ½ HP but are limited to 3.3 amp+/- output. I asked how

> this

> is and was met with the usual, “gee gosh I am not sure.” I have one in

> hand

> now from ABB that is guilty of this claim.

>

>

>

> Some units claim to meet the spec but then you must limit the wire length

> to

> 30 meters. The well is 150’ from the house & 120 ft deep so a 270’ wire

> run

> with what the well guy threw in 18 years ago. VFW cable [multi strand

> cable]

> is a partial answer but not down in the well.

>

> Somewhere down the road the inverter & the well pump will get replaced but

> for now it is working. The newer 3PH wild AC drives are amazing on a

> Radian

> Inverter. You cannot even tell the well is pumping till it has been for a

> while and the fans kick on.

>

>

>

> Suggestions & directions that have proven reliable for you?

>

> Thanks.

>

>

>

>

>

> 

>

> Dana Orzel                              Great Solar Works, Inc.

>

> C - 208.721.7003                       d...@solarwork.com

>

> Idaho Contractor - # 028765         Idaho PV # 028374

>

> NABCEP # 051112-136                       www.solarwork.biz

> 

>

> "Responsible Technologies for Responsible People since 1988"

>

> P Please consider the environment before printing this email.

>

>

>

>

>

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Outback AC Coupling

[jerrysgarage01]

KirpalWe have used tge solid state contactors but have not been happy with 
there reliability as they ofen have failed in the open position, the old coil 
contactors have been far better over time and seam to cost less. FYI, the solid 
state high amp contactors live longer with a heat sink.Jerry


Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone

 Original message 
From: jry...@dtisolar.com 
Date: 2/5/18  5:28 PM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: RE-wrenches  
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Outback AC Coupling 

We have installed a number of AC coupled systems over the years and believe we 
may have some of the first systems installed.  Several are over 15 years old 
now and represent multiple brands and combinations of inverters.  None of these 
systems relied on frequency shift by battery inverter to force solar inverter 
off line.  So far no problems.
All of these systems utilized a 30 or 60 amp power relay having a 120 vac coil 
controlled by a smaller control relay having a 12 vdc coil directly controlled 
from aux. relay contacts in inverter.  High battery voltage triggered array 
disconnect from secondary breaker panel on output side of battery inverter.  
Only design issues are getting a fail-safe arrangement of the N.O. and N.C. 
relay contacts correct, and program settings to avoid boiling AGM batteries.
Jeff Yago
Sent from my iPad
Jeff Yago DTI Solar. inc.804-457-9566jry...@dtisolar.com
Although no trees were killed in the sending of this email, a largenumber of 
electrons were terribly inconvenienced. 
On Feb 5, 2018, at 10:04 PM, Kirpal  wrote:

Hi Folks.Outback no longer supports AC coupling on their Radian systems.  
My understanding is that it is because of the unreliability of the ROCB (remote 
operated circuit breaker) they were using.  I have heard that they are 
imminently going to release a white paper about AC coupling using a solid state 
relay instead.  I was wondering if any of you have done this?  Do you have any 
advice about the settings for the Auxiliary output settings that control the 
relay?  Looking for programming advice on the mate 3.  I talked to Outback 
today and they said until the white paper is released they won't be giving 
instructions or advice on this capability.  They did tell me not to use the AC 
couple mode already programmed into the mate 3 auxiliary output control. Thanks 
in advance for any advice! On or off list!!Cheers.
Sunny Regards,
Kirpal KhalsaOregon LRT#25
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional
Oregon Solarworks LLC
www.oregonsolarworks.com
541-299-0402

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Re: [RE-wrenches] blue planet batteries

[jerrysgarage01]

JayNo there is no communication between the battery BMS and the inverterJerry


Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone

 Original message 
From: jay  
Date: 1/4/18  8:35 AM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: RE-wrenches  
Subject: [RE-wrenches] blue planet batteries 

While we are talking about batteries,

Does anyone have any experience with the Blueplanet lithium for off grid? 

Do they communicate with the inverter system is a big question?

thx
jay

peltz power
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Re: [RE-wrenches] blue planet batteries

[jerrysgarage01]

JayOur office has done research on quit a gew batteries, the Blue Ion Blue 
Planets battery has been very good in our testing. Feel free to talk off 
listJerry


Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone

 Original message 
From: jay  
Date: 1/4/18  8:35 AM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: RE-wrenches  
Subject: [RE-wrenches] blue planet batteries 

While we are talking about batteries,

Does anyone have any experience with the Blueplanet lithium for off grid? 

Do they communicate with the inverter system is a big question?

thx
jay

peltz power
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Goofy roofing

[jerrysgarage01]

WrenchesTake a look at Fastenall, thats all they doJerry


Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone

 Original message 
From: Glenn Burt  
Date: 6/10/17  9:38 AM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: RE-wrenches , Jerry Caldwell 
 
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Goofy roofing 

Mudge Fasteners.From: penobscotso...@midmaine.com
Sent: ‎6/‎10/‎2017 13:52
To: Jerry Caldwell; RE-wrenches
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Goofy roofing

These guys sell all sizes:

https://www.buyrailings.com/product/hanger-bolt-316-stainless-steel-m8-x-2-each-/5368?gdffi=a1d228a0145c40b2b64b7bf62559eafa=A2FA3E88DA104CFB950485A2F169884A==CNmksPTrs9QCFQpMDQod7S0LYA

Daryl


> Dear Wrenches,
> Can anyone direct me to a source for stainless hanger bolts without going
> through a solar distributor?  I remember around 15 years ago a supplier
> up in the Seattle area, but now cannot find them.  Any help is
> appreciated.
> Cheers,Jerry Caldwell
>
> On Tuesday, May 3, 2016 6:43 AM, August Goers 
> wrote:
>
>
>  

Re: [RE-wrenches] Firestone Metal Roof with S-5

[jerrysgarage01]

WrenchesOur parent company does roofing and works with firestone, l do not know 
of any such rule BUT its safe to have the roofer do that and everyone is 
protected then why not. Remember it all about the customer and if they feel 
happy then we all are happy. But thats just me.Jerry.


Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone

 Original message 
From: Jason Szumlanski  
Date: 3/22/17  12:43 PM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: RE-wrenches  
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Firestone Metal Roof with S-5 

Has anyone run into Firestone brand metal roofing? A local roofer is trying to 
tell my client that the warranty will be void if a solar contractor installs 
S-5 clamps, but they have a different product and if they install it (clamps 
only), it will not void the warranty. For (maybe) obvious reasons I would 
rather not subcontract the clamps to the roofer. He is claiming you must be a 
Firestone approved vendor to keep the warranty intact. I don’t buy it.
​Jason


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Re: [RE-wrenches] AC/DC in Same Trench?

[jerrysgarage01]

WrenchesAs a matter of practice, we always use conduite, never direct burial, 
always copper too, we have had AC and DC in the same trench but with space 
seperating the conduits and have had no issues with noise or JHA. As a safety 
issue we would not risk direct burial of high voltage DC regardless. Jerry


Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone

 Original message 
From: Ray Walters  
Date: 12/28/16  12:00 PM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: RE-wrenches  
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] AC/DC in Same Trench? 


Also, you didn't specify, but AC and DC are specifically allowed in
the same raceway per 300.3(C)(1).  Only If the DC circuits are PV
source or output circuits, then 690.31(B) prevails, which says they
can't share a raceway.  But again, as Chris mentions, this
restriction does not apply to direct burial.  

R.Ray Walters
CTO, Solarray, Inc
Nabcep Certified PV Installer, 
Licensed Master Electrician
Solar Design Engineer
303 505-8760
On 12/28/2016 12:58 PM, Chris Mason
  wrote:



  No problem with same trench, the requirements are
that they are not in the same raceway.
  

On Wed, Dec 28, 2016 at 1:37 PM, Corey
  Shalanski 
  wrote:

  
For some upcoming utility-scale projects our
  design team is wondering about placing direct-bury AC and
  DC circuits in the same trench.
  - Firstly, is this even Code-permissible?
  - Secondly, are there any common sense reasons
(induced voltage/signal interference/etc) for not doing
this?
  

  
  Thanks,
  Corey Shalanski
  Joule Energy
  New Orleans, LA



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-- 


  Chris Mason

  NABCEP Certified Solar PV
  Installer™
  Solar Design Engineer
  Generac Generators Industrial
  technician



  
www.cometsolar.com
264.235.5670
869.662.5670
Skype: netconcepts
  

  
  

  
  

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Re: [RE-wrenches] SB -40 Wi-Fi

[jerrysgarage01]

HowieI here in Hawaii, we are slow to approve new inverters and it takes a very 
long time to get through permits so l can't say much about the SMA -40 
Inverter. Regarding wifi vs hard line, maybe for one unit it would be easy but 
we just installed 27 of the SMA 24K -22 at one location and hard wire is the 
only solution with all the updates and programming we need to do. I do feel a 
display would be a help as " in front of the inverter trouble shooting" is 
better, there is talk about phone apps but just more crap to have to look at in 
the bright light when a built in basic display would be a better solution.On 
the topic of hard to read display lenses, use headlight lense cleaner, makes a 
big difference.Jerry

Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone

 Original message 
From: Chris Mason  
Date: 12/16/16  5:40 AM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: RE-wrenches  
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] SB -40 Wi-Fi 

In the Caribbean, the SMA displays all turn yellow and become opaque. I use the 
bluetooth feature for programming them.I won't miss the useless displays.
On Thu, Dec 15, 2016 at 3:39 PM, William Miller  wrote:
Howie: I have not tried the Wi-Fi capabilities, so I cannot comment on that 
aspect.  What is relevant, however, is the news I received from a reliable 
source that the 40 series inverter will be the last residential inverter 
manufactured by SMA that will have an on-board display.  As evidence of this, 
look in the manual for a 40 series or even a 22 series inverter-  there is no 
description at all of the display functions.  Odd and disappointing.   SMA 
should have a representative on this list.  It may still be Steve Jefferson, 
who is a stand-up guy. SMA, what say you about these communications and display 
questions? Wrenches, if you think having an on-board display is important, 
voice your opinion.  If the Wi-Fi is problematic, this is not a good direction. 
 A lot of my clients are elderly and they are not as adept at computer or 
device based operations. A display is essential in my opinion.  SMA, please 
don’t kill the display. William Miller  
Lic 773985
millersolar.com
805-438-5600 From: RE-wrenches 
[mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Howie Michaelson
Sent: Thursday, December 15, 2016 6:16 AM
To: RE-wrenches 
Subject: [RE-wrenches] SB -40 Wifi I am looking for comments on the viability 
of the Wi-Fi option of the new SB -40 inverters. I noticed some concern here 
about the poor performance of this option and am trying to decide whether to 
use it in the case of a long distance between the inverters and the router.I 
can place a repeater between the inverters and as well as purchase the external 
antenna option from SMA for the inverters, but would like to have an idea ahead 
of buying and installing the 2 antennas if this is likely to work. I do have 
the option of running an Ethernet cable, but it is a long (500' +) and 
difficult pull. Any comments or suggestions would be appreciated.Thanks,Howie
Howie Michaelson
NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer™

Sun Catcher
Renewable Energy Systems Sales and Service
VT Solar Electric Incentive Partner
802-272-0004

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-- 
Chris MasonNABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer™Solar Design EngineerGenerac 
Generators Industrial technician
www.cometsolar.com264.235.5670869.662.5670Skype: netconcepts

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Re: [RE-wrenches] SMA Arc-Fault

[jerrysgarage01]

DaveDid you make your MC Cables, are there any jumpers used, l have seen 
crimped terminals cause faults and over time will overheat and fail open. Just 
a thought.Jerry


Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone

 Original message 
From: Matthew Sirum  
Date: 11/14/16  1:07 AM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org 
Subject: [RE-wrenches]  SMA Arc-Fault 

Greetings Dave,

Have you considered possibly installing a hybrid type transient
voltage surge suppressor (TVSS), to include filters to remove high
frequency EMI/RFI?  Or possible a straight line filter device?  If
this nuisance arc fault issue is still occurring and it may be related
to an AC issue you may be able to get some technical help and advice
from an engineer at one of the TVSS manufacturers such as Total
Protection Solutions, Richmond, VA 800.647.1911 or Surge Suppression
Incorporated, Destin, FL 888.987.8877.  I would also recommend
reaching out for an application engineer in the SPD division at Eaton.
Eaton Technical Resource Center 800.809.2772.  SSI also has a very
experienced field troubleshooting technician they send all around the
country to help contractors with difficult electrical issues... Of
course that would probably cost $1000-$2000 per day.

I avoid using piercing taps and connectors.  I prefer to use service
entrance tap boxes, insulated multi port connectors, or line side
rated power distribution blocks.  I cannot help but wonder if there
may be an actual arc event occurring at one or more of the piercing
taps which is somehow picked up by the DC AFCI.  In commissioning this
system it would be a good idea to use a non-contact IR thermometer
and/or thermal imaging camera/scope to check the piercing taps for
excessive heating while the conductors are energized and carrying peak
currents.

I hope you are successful in resolving this issue soon.  I will
continue to follow the thread.  Hopefully we can all learn something
from this.

Best regards,

MATT

Matthew Sirum
P.O. Box 1227
Greenfield, MA 01302-1227  USA
phone: +1.413.773.0611
email: matthewsi...@gmail.com
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Back-up generator/inverter shut-down relay

[jerrysgarage01]

Wrenches
Does not sound like there is an option to hard wire a shut down switch so here 
is an idea l have used. Program the genny to run at 58 Hz. not yp this will 
keep the inverters ftom starting up. None of the appliances will know but as 
long as the inverter programming does not allow for 58 Hz then it will work
Jerry

Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S™ III, an AT 4G LTE smartphone

 Original message From: Benn Kilburn 
 Date:09/08/2016  7:00 AM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: RE-wrenches  
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Back-up generator/inverter shut-down relay 

Wrenches,
We are installing 2 SolarEdge SE7600A-US inverters in a grid-tied system that 
has a 15kw back-up generator on an auto transfer switch.

The generator is located in a shed about 300' or more away and the feeders to 
the house are underground.
Inverters are located in the house basement mechanial room along with the house 
electrical panelboard.

We are looking for relay options to shut down the inverters when there is a 
power interruption, before the generator kicks in.  This could be a manual 
reset.

What are some options you have seen/used for something like this?

Thanks,

Benn Kilburn 
CSA Certified Solar Photovoltaic Systems Electrician, SkyFire Energy Inc
14515 – 121A Ave NW | Edmonton, AB | T5L 2T2
P: 780-474-8992 | F: 888-405-5843 | www.skyfireenergy.com


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Re: [RE-wrenches] Test procedure for Concorde batteries

[jerrysgarage01]

Wrenches
You can do a carbon pile test but the best way is testing under several 
conditions. Here is an option real easy and maybe faster, put a volt meter on 
each battery under constant charge conditions, higher volts on one battery 
meens high resistance in battery, low volts meens low resistance, either 
extreme can be an issue.  Then let sit for at least an hour with no load and 
check the volts, next put a fixed load on the system, again a volt meter check 
each battery,  here you may find a lower reading then the rest, there is the 
problem, now replace the entire bank not just the single battery. This is an 
easy test and the customer can see it easily too.
Jerry


Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S™ III, an AT 4G LTE smartphone

 Original message From: Gary Bassett 
 Date:09/01/2016  2:51 AM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: "RE-wrenches (re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org)" 
 Subject: [RE-wrenches] Test 
procedure for Concorde batteries 
We have a grid tied battery backup system that uses 8 Sun Xtender 
PVX-2120L batteries, about 9 years old. The grid has been going out frequently 
– about 4 times in the past 3 weeks. When the grid goes out, the battery 
voltage gets too low and shuts the system down pretty quickly. One of the 
times, this happened within 4 hours. We want to test the capacity of the 
batteries and we have a testing procedure from Concorde that seems like it 
would take a lot of time. Is there a quick way to test the battery capacity?
 
Gary
 
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Buck-Boost transformer to mitigate high voltage drop?

[jerrysgarage01]

Wrenches
We have done transformers for issues just like this with good results, the cost 
vs the new wire, conduit and trenching must be done to make sure which 
direction. We have had to use paired mcm 300 to make residentual so run the 
numbers
Jerry


Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S™ III, an AT 4G LTE smartphone

 Original message From: Chris Schaefer 
 Date:08/16/2016  7:53 AM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: RE-wrenches  
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Buck-Boost transformer to mitigate high 
voltage drop? 
Perhaps I missed it but you didn't say what you measured the voltage to 
be at the clients service entrance panel at his house?

Christopher

On Tue, Aug 16, 2016 at 1:40 PM, Mac Lewis  wrote:
Yes, what current did you use to calculate that voltage drop? How big is the PV 
system?


On Aug 16, 2016 11:38 AM, "Chris Mason"  wrote:
How much of the power produced will be self-consumed, how much will be exported?

On Tue, Aug 16, 2016 at 12:16 PM, Howard Arey  wrote:
Good day,

 

I have a potential client that has an existing 1,000 foot run from the meter 
and transformer at the street to the home. This is 4/0 Al and quick calcs show 
the voltage drop at over 12%. He acknowledges that the wire is undersized to 
keep voltage at/about 240 volts (I have not measured directly at the street / 
transformer yet).

 

I know the wire has the necessary ampacity to carry his current service needs 
and to carry amps from the to-be-suggested solar system.

 

My concern is that the voltage drop will change the 240 volts at the 
street/transformer/meter to 211ish (or will I see a higher 268’sh voltage at 
the far house end?) at the house. The inverter will try to synch to this 
voltage but of course this is outside of typical inverter parameters.

 

So, instead of re-running much large wire, does anybody have experience and 
comments about potentially using a buck-boots transformer at the home to get us 
back to 240 volts? This would need to be service entrance sized.

 

Howard “Scot” Arey

Owner, Solar CenTex

254-300-1228

scot.a...@solarcentex.com

 


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-- 
Chris Mason
NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer™
Solar Design Engineer
Generac Generators Industrial technician

www.cometsolar.com
264.235.5670
869.662.5670
Skype: netconcepts

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-- 
Chris Schaefer’s

Tel/Fax 585-229-2083 or Cell 585-748-1870 
5115 South Hill Road ~ Canandaigua New York 14424
www.solarandwindfx.com ~ E-mail: ch...@solarandwindfx.com



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Re: [RE-wrenches] Standing seam metal roof attachments for copper roof

[jerrysgarage01]

Can you use the S-5 brass clamps
Jerry


Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S™ III, an AT 4G LTE smartphone

 Original message From: Daniel Tittmann 
 Date:08/09/2016  10:53 AM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: RE-wrenches  
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Standing seam metal roof attachments for 
copper roof 
We have just found out that a project that we have won the contract on 
had chosen a corten standing seam roof that does not support aluminium clips 
due to copper content and potential corrosion of the clips.  Has anyone found a 
cheaper work around than getting a custom Stainless Steel clamp? 
Thanks
Daniel

Daniel Tittmann 
CTO
Greenwired
www.greenwired.com
dan...@greenwired.com
707-923-2001 (office)
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Enphase Support Non-Responsive

[jerrysgarage01]

Wrenches
We have allot of enphase and ya sometimes it a little hard to get them on the 
line but we always do. I request the re-inbursments, l dont ever see them as 
they end up in the admin office. We have looked at and used a few other 
mico-inverters at customer request but they all seem to go out of business so 
we are sticking to enphase for better or worse.
Jerry


Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S™ III, an AT 4G LTE smartphone

 Original message From: Wayne Irwin 
 Date:08/05/2016  6:58 AM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Subject: Re: 
[RE-wrenches] Enphase Support Non-Responsive 
Maybe just dumb luck, but we almost always have quick phone tech support 
from Enphase and always get reimbursed.

Wayne Irwin
Pure Energy Solar 

Sent from my mobile device 

From: conr...@cape.com
Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2016 12:39:02 -0400
To: re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Enphase Support Non-Responsive

Same thing going on here

Conrad
Cotuit Solar


Conrad Geyser, Principal
Cotuit Solar LLC
508-428-8442

On Fri, Aug 5, 2016 at 9:59 AM, gary easton  wrote:
just a worthless ticket but no action and certainly no timely reimbursement if 
at all.   I would never do business with this company again.

On Fri, Aug 5, 2016 at 9:38 AM,  wrote:
Just to renew this line of conversation, I have been waiting for several
call backs form Enphase, with no results, for the past three weeks. I also
have warranty claims that go back four months+ that have not been
fulfilled. I will not sell any more Enphase, at all, until they resolve
these communication and warranty issues.

Daryl DeJoy
NABCEP Certified PV Installer
Penobscot Solar Design




> It seems like we are talking about inverter and module customer service
> (good and bad) a lot lately.
>
> Has anyone else noticed that Enphase seems to have stopped responding to
> tickets submitted via their website? Hold times are unacceptable, so I
> gave
> up on that, but nobody gets back to you when you try to contact them via
> their web form for weeks, even about an existing RMA or ticket, and they
> no
> longer let you update tickets by email. They are very helpful and
> competent
> if you get them on the phone, but who has time for that?!
>
> I'm also waiting an unacceptable amount of time on a major module
> manufacturer warranty claim right now. I'd love to see Home Power or
> someone do a story on manufacturer responsiveness to dealers. Things are
> generally going down hill it seems.
>
> Jason Szumlanski
> Florida Solar Design Group
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-- 
Gary Easton
Appalachian Renewable Power
Stewart, Ohio 45778
NABCEP Certified Solar PV   
 
T: 740-277-8498
 www.arp-solar.com

“First they ignore you. Then they laugh at you. Then they fight you. Then you 
win.”

~Ghandi


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Re: [RE-wrenches] grundfos SQFlex

[jerrysgarage01]

Wrenches
Make an artificial head by a valve to reduce flow on the outlet side, it might 
increase watt demand. They will voltage compensate so reducing volts will not 
do it. I have to ask why thats a problem anyway, the pump will turn off if the 
level gets to low anyway.
Jerry


Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S™ III, an AT 4G LTE smartphone

 Original message From: jay 
 Date:06/30/2016  2:43 PM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: RE-wrenches  
Subject: [RE-wrenches] grundfos SQFlex 
Hi All,

Any trick methods to keep a SQflex running on AC power at a given flow rate 
that is less than full power?

I’ve got a well that is just on 1 gpm, around 150’ lift.

the sqflex 3-2 will do it, but at 3gpm with full watts, an amazing 265 watts.


thx

jay

peltz power
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Re: [RE-wrenches] getting PV modules up to the roof

[jerrysgarage01]

Wrenches
We got one, takes a long time to set up, it works great but it seams either we 
got a 1 story or a high rise. We also have a crane which is a little costly to 
deploy but sure looks cool. Something else we use up to 3 stories is a sizzer 
truck, the whole box lifts up to the height, picked it up from a military 
auction, was a plane loading truck. Works well for OSHA 
Jerry


Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S™ III, an AT 4G LTE smartphone

 Original message From: Dana Brandt 
 Date:05/26/2016  12:26 PM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: RE-wrenches  
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] getting PV modules up to the roof 

Hi Wrenches,

I'm curious if anyone has updates to this thread 3 years later. What are people 
using to lift modules to the roof? 

I've been looking at ladder hoists online and wondering how well they'd work in 
practice. Any experience or advice?

Thanks,

Dana

Dana Brandt
Ecotech Energy Systems, LLC
www.ecotechenergy.com
d...@ecotechenergy.com
360.318.7646

On Thu, Feb 7, 2013 at 10:44 AM, August Goers  wrote:
Hi Wrenches,

 

I imagine that all of us working in rooftop PV have put some good hard thought 
on the best way to get the modules up to the roof. There are various lifts on 
the market, you can hoist them with ropes manually, or walk them up a ladder 
(sling them over your back). I find that the majority of our competition in the 
Bay Area walks panels up the ladder for residential projects. What is your 
feeling about OSHA compliance of doing this?

 

Best,

 

 

August

415.559.1525


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Re: [RE-wrenches] Mobile solar trailer

[jerrysgarage01]

WrenchesI have built 5 solar event trailers, for contractors, promotors, ect. 
We can talk off line. call if interested 7078882701Jerry


Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE smartphone



 Original message 
From: Chris Schaefer  
Date: 5/9/2016  11:55 AM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: RE-wrenches  
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Mobile solar trailer 

Hey Jason,Sorry to hear that. Any chance you can share a couple of pix so we 
can build it ourselves? What were the trailer dimensions?Thanks,Christopher
On Mon, May 9, 2016 at 5:34 PM, Lones Tuss  wrote:








Hello sir
You might also want to look into

http://www.mobilesolarpower.net/
I hope this helps 
Take Care
 

Lones Tuss
Applications Engineer
OutBack Power Technologies
17825 59th Ave NE, Suite B, Arlington, WA 98223
360.618.4383 Office | 425.213.8794 Cell
www.outbackpower.com

 


From: RE-wrenches [mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org]
On Behalf Of Dave

Sent: Monday, May 09, 2016 1:02 PM

To: 'RE-wrenches'

Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Mobile solar trailer


 
Wrenches,
 
I have a customer looking for a tow behind solar trailer with the following 
specs:
Major features should include
·
120/240Vac output
·
sealed Out Back inverters (because of moist and possibly dusty conditions)
·
approx. 12,000 Watt Hours of rated battery storage.  Thought is that (8) AGM 6v 
250AH batteries would work
·
approx. 1,500W PV Array
 
I am requesting a quote from Patriot Solar (Albion, MI) 
http://patriotsolargroup.com/products/solar-parent/solar-child/solar-trailers-2-4kw/
 
Does anyone know of other trailers that are in this class, new or used? 
Hopefully cost effective units? Something like the tow behinds that Jason 
Szumlanski made at AMP Systems would be appropriate.
 
David Palumbo 
Independent Power LLC
462 Solar Way Drive
Hyde Park, VT 05655
802-371-8678 cell
802-888-4917 home
 




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-- 
Chris Schaefer’s

Tel/Fax
585-229-2083 or Cell 585-748-1870 
5115
South Hill Road ~ Canandaigua New York 14424
www.solarandwindfx.com ~ E-mail: ch...@solarandwindfx.com


Thomas Jefferson,
the author of our great Constitution, once said, "democracy" will
cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give
to those who would not."

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Off-grid generator update?

[jerrysgarage01]

Have you looked at Cummins,  we have have great luck and no programming issues 
but battery charging needs to be added foroff grid
Jerry


Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S™ III, an AT 4G LTE smartphone

 Original message From: Ray Walters 
 Date:04/28/2016  7:28 AM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: RE-wrenches  
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Off-grid generator update? 
FYI,  generally we haven't had cold start issues with propane units, as 
long as the pipe is sized properly ( as mentioned in another recent post) and 
the starter battery is kept fully charged.
This is based on about 20 years experience in the Rockies with temps below 0, 
but not 40 below.  We don't use block heaters, carb heaters, etc.
We currently have been using Generac Ecogen, but not that happy with them. 
Cheap air cooled motor, way too many computer gizmos, no on board charging 
(must have AC power or PV to charge the starting battery)  We even had to call 
customer service to get an authorization code to set up remote start.  This is 
off grid with no internet or cell service; ridiculous.  I hope Generac reps are 
lurking here, because these are really not much better than the crop of stand 
by generators.
 IMO  no off grid generator should have a phantom load, or require cell service 
to commission.  What happened to the old water cooled Kohlers?

R.Ray Walters
CTO, Solarray, Inc
Nabcep Certified PV Installer, 
Licensed Master Electrician
Solar Design Engineer
303 505-8760
On 4/28/2016 11:17 AM, Jeremy Rodriguez wrote:
Check out Gillette generators. Made in Indiana 
12.5 kW w Subaru 

Jeremy Rodriguez 
Solar Installation And Design Expert 
All Solar, Inc.
1463 M St
Penrose Colorado 81240

Sent by Jeremy's iPhone. Sorry for typos and shorthand!

On Apr 28, 2016, at 10:20 AM, Lena Wilensky  wrote:

I did some searches on the list for what folks are doing for off-grid propane 
generators these days, but all the threads I found were from 5-6 yrs ago, so I 
was hoping to get some more current info.

We're looking for about a 10kw+ propane unit (big derate at altitude), and we 
run into 2 main problem areas:

First is the warranty - either there are no units warranteed for off-grid use, 
or there are only a couple of models and the warranty is short (1 year).

Second, and perhaps larger, is all the loads that now come with the "off-grid" 
units.  The computer takes some, but mostly the "cold weather kit" aka carb 
heater must be installed in our climate (to actually start, but also for 
warrantee), and it's set up to be on a thermostat (read: "on all the time from 
Nov-April" here in the mountains).  According to the Kohler tech support it 
takes a steady   50W. We have set up older units to do battery 
charge only during the day, and have the carb heater on a manual switch, but it 
sounds like we can't really get at these circuits anymore since they're all 
pre-configured and pre-wired in the guts of the genset computer.

The Kohler and Onan support folks said both these issues are due to EPA 
considering off-grid use as prime power as opposed to standby, so they are held 
to tougher emissions standards.

Whatever the reasons, we're wondering what people are actually doing these days 
- still the standby units they kind-of warrantee for off-grid? 12RES from 
Kohler and the 13kw unit from Onan?  Generac?  Have folks been going back to 
the smaller gas units from Honda and running them   more?  And how 
are cold climate folks dealing with the heating issue?

Any suggestions appreciated!

Lena Wilensky

www.nunatakenergy.com
970-642-5554
NABCEP Certified PV Installer:
Cert. #R02907-17

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Re: [RE-wrenches] 480 single phase delta

[jerrysgarage01]

What about an SMA Tri Power inverter
Jerry


Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S™ III, an AT 4G LTE smartphone

 Original message From: Chris Mason 
 Date:04/28/2016  8:52 AM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: RE-wrenches  
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] 480 single phase delta 
You will use a 240:480v step up transformer

On Apr 28, 2016 14:17, "jay"  wrote:
HI All,

I have a question from a person wanting to do a intertie on a commercial water 
pumping site with

480v single phase delta configuration.

PV will be in the 10kw range.

Anybody have an idea of what equipment will work for this?



thanks

jay

peltz power
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Inverter/AC pump compatibility question

[jerrysgarage01]

You may want to check the ac voltage with a good "true RMS" meter and see what 
the results are, some (most) new Freq Drives, and soft start drives may have an 
issue with a high RMSJerry


Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE smartphone

 Original message 
From: Roy Butler  
Date: 4/26/2016  4:22 AM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: RE-wrenches  
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Inverter/AC pump compatibility question 


Allan,



I have several customers running the Grundfos SQE series on their
modified square wave inverters.

To be clear, those most recent was about 5 years ago, so perhaps
there's been a design change since then.

Roy Butler
NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer®
NYSERDA eligible PV & wind installer
Four Winds Renewable Energy, LLC
8902 Route 46, Arkport, NY 14807
607-324-9747  www.four-winds-energy.com

Although no trees were killed in the sending of this message, 
a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.



On 4/25/2016 11:15 PM, Allan Sindelar
  wrote:



  
  Wrenches,

  Has anyone powered a Grundfos SQ or SQE series soft-start AC
  submersible pump from a modified square wave inverter?

  I need to run a 1/2 hp 115V AC sub on a 1990-era Heart EMS
  2800-12. The customer likes his equipment so I'm not encouraging
  an inverter upgrade.

  Thank you,

  Allan

  -- 














  Allan Sindelar

al...@sindelarsolar.com

NABCEP Certified PV
  Installation Professional

  NABCEP Certified Technical Sales Professional

  New Mexico EE98J Journeyman Electrician

  Founder (Retired), Positive Energy, Inc.

  505 780-2738 cell

  

  
   

  
  

  
  

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Battery charging problems

[jerrysgarage01]

ChrisA few questionsAre you drawing from both AC legs from the genny, at max of 
2200 watts per leg then the genny should not have an issue but if you upsized 
the batteries and as stated by Mike the fuel delivery system cant keep up 
because the inverter charge load is higher, steady and for long duration. Can 
you load test the genny at 240 and see if the issue happens with out the 
inverter at all.  When we size a propane tank we like to see at least 75 lbs 
per 3 kw genny depending on air temp, bigger when colder, its all about 
available BTU.Jerry


Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE smartphone

 Original message 
From: Mike Kocsmiersky  
Date: 4/26/2016  12:41 AM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: 'RE-wrenches'  
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Battery charging problems 

Chris,
In theory the upgraded batteries should be able to accept a greater current
(or at least max charge current) for a greater length of time than the prior
battery bank.  I once had a propane genset run rough when it was starved for
fuel, due to an undersized upright propane cylinder which could not
evaporate the liquid propane fast enough for the load of the genset.  This
caused the regulator on the genset to have awful difficultly, and usually
would drop the load because it couldn't stabilize.  This doesn't sound like
it would be your problem, if it was running properly before, but perhaps the
longer duration at higher current is creating difficulty for the LPG to
evaporate enough.  May be compounded if the fuel tank was recently
overfilled and doesn't have as much surface area, or if it is way low and
can't maintain pressure.  May want to check the tank size of propane for the
genset.  (I'm assuming this is LPG).



Mike Kocsmiersky
Principal
Phone: 413 883-3144 
Spirit Solar
www.SpiritSolar.net



-Original Message-
From: Chris Daum [mailto:ch...@oasismontana.com] 
Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2016 3:41 PM
To: 'RE-wrenches'
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Battery charging problems

 Dear people:  

I have an off-grid customer who has, in his system, a Magnum MS4448 and 16
of the Rolls S550 batteries, a Kohler generator (and Trimetric meter and
other components).  He upgraded his batteries this past March, and since
he's installed his new batteries, the generator is running 'rough'.  He's at
a great distance from our shop so a local business helps him from time to
time. They believe that the "batteries are too  powerful for the 8.5 kw
generator" and recommended  running it at 50 percent charge control. After 3
hrs run, it seems to help but will mean more run time for his generator (and
hence, use more fuel).  Have you ever heard of anything like this?
Everything ran fund before the battery upgrade.

Thanks for your input!

Best,

Chris Daum
Oasis Montana Inc.
406-777-4309
406-777-0830 fax
www.oasismontana.com





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Re: [RE-wrenches] Optimal 200 or 225 Amp Square D MSP All-in-One meter for CT Clamps

[jerrysgarage01]

Can you get a meter main with only one breaker and then get a distribution 
panel and put all all loads there


Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S™ III, an AT 4G LTE smartphone

 Original message From: Gregory Seelhorst 
 Date:02/17/2016  6:23 AM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: RE-wrenches  
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Optimal 200 or 225 Amp Square D MSP 
All-in-One meter for CT Clamps 
Wrenches -

Does anyone know of a good spec for a 200 or 225A Square D Main Service Panel 
which has feeders between the meter and Main Disconnect and would be ideal for 
150A CT clamps for monitoring whole house consumption?

I'm finding most MSPs have a short, flat bus between the meter and Main 
Disconnect which requires the Rigowski Coil (requiring more expensive and 
unreliable hardware).

Thank you for your help in advance.

Regards,

Greg Seelhorst
NABCEP PV Installation Professional #092907-16


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Re: [RE-wrenches] Battery recommendation WAS: Rolls batteries

[jerrysgarage01]

I have done stuff like this in the past, I would suggest talking to your local 
battery distributors and explain what you are doing they may be able to go to 
bat with there manufactures for you.
Good luck 
Jerry


Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S™ III, an AT 4G LTE smartphone

 Original message From: Allan Sindelar 
 Date:10/22/2015  8:19 AM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: RE-wrenches  
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Battery recommendation WAS: Rolls 
batteries 
I have a related question, please. One of my longtime off grid clients is 
a single woman who maintains a nonprofit sanctuary for about 30 rescue dogs, 
both adoptable and not adoptable (curious? www.bridgingtheworlds.org). With 
that many animals, Beverly seldom leaves her remote land and her support 
and sustenance comes primarily from donations. Her existing system is a 
18-year-old SW4024/Solar Boost SB50, with 800W of old array and eight L16s. 

The L16s were takeouts from another job that I figured had some life left (used 
for two years in another contractor's Sunny Island GTBB system without telling 
the customer that he needed to add water regularly). I gave them to her at no 
cost and they lasted three years but are now dying fast.

At my suggestion she has been running a GoFundMe campaign that has raised 
$2900. I have already told her that I'll do the swapout at no charge. I told 
her that the choice of her next set of batteries would depend on the money she 
raised: we have another 24V set of 820A/hr Rolls that I think has some life 
left, or we can afford 8 L16s, or with the most generous donation total I'll 
order a set of HUPs and they'll last her the rest of her life (or maybe not 
- she's healthy, beautiful and independent at 71 years). 

So, my question: At $3,000 and 24V, what would you sell her? This is bound to 
bring varied opinions, but I want to look beyond what I would select based on 
price and get other Wrenches' suggestions. I'll add that while the array is 
small and old, she lives well on very little energy, and has a TriMetric and a 
backup generator. 

Thank you for your opinions.
Allan

Allan Sindelar
al...@sindelarsolar.com
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional
NABCEP Certified Technical Sales Professional
New Mexico EE98J Journeyman Electrician
Founder (Retired), Positive Energy, Inc.
505 780-2738 cell

 
On 10/22/2015 11:50 AM, penobscotso...@midmaine.com wrote:
As with Tump, we have been using the KS series for over 20 years with
little issue. My own particular caveat is that we have now started to use
Crown as well and are finding them as rugged, easier to move (metal cases
with handles), with built in water miser caps, and a better warranty, and
with great success. I also echo Tumps sentiments with Roy at RAE. We have
been buying from him since our inception in 1988.

Daryl



The 5000 series are what we always recommend and install for my off grid
clients. 2 volt cells are the only way we go. Despite what folks believe,
we find it easier to handle the KS series then the L16.
We have been using them for many years and as with ANY manu, they have and
had issues BUT.. we feel w/ proper system sizing, education of the
client & record keeping we have yet to have an issue w/ warrantee claims.
That being said we have had a long relationship W/Jamie Surrette and his
supplier, Roy Early and his crew at RAE Battery,  one of the best
suppliers in our 27+ years.
On Oct 22, 2015, at 11:15 AM, Kristopher Schmid wrote:

Hi Wrenches,

Anyone using Rolls Surrette batteries?  Happy with them?  Worth the
extra $$$?

Thanks for the feedback,
Kris

--
Shine On!

Kris Schmid
Legacy Solar, LLC
864 Clam Falls Trail
Frederic, WI 54837
www.legacysolar.com
715-653-4295
NABCEP Certified PV Installer
Licensed Wisconsin Master Electrician
BSEE
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t...@swnl.net   www.SWNL.net
Solarwinds Northernlights
   Serving Mid Coast Maine & Northern California
 207-832-7574   Cl. 610-517-8401
  Blair "TUMP" May
     MAINE'S CHARTER 
  NABCEP"Certified PV Installer"

    MAINE'S CHARTER 
  Trace Xantrex "Certified" Dealer / Installer"


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Re: [RE-wrenches] Pg meter reading

[jerrysgarage01]

Well stating that the pg meter is set to only "Sell a maximum amount that is 
less then what the meter is set to" Buy" would be news to me as I have seen 
bootleg systems selling and there was nothing stopping it. I have also seen 
inverter upgrades that increase selling. Back to my question is how big is it 
vs how dig was it.
Jerry


Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S™ III, an AT 4G LTE smartphone

 Original message From: jay 
<jay.pe...@gmail.com> Date:10/11/2015  3:39 PM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: RE-wrenches <re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org> 
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Pg meter reading 
HI Jerry,

Sorry can you be more specific as to what fishy means?

jay


On Oct 11, 2015, at 4:04 PM, jerrysgarage01 <jerrysgarag...@gmail.com> wrote:

Sounds a little fishy to me, is it a big residential or real small

Jerry


Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S™ III, an AT 4G LTE smartphone


 Original message 
From: Jay
Date:10/11/2015 9:13 AM (GMT-10:00)
To: RE-wrenches
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Pg meter reading

I have a client who added some extra solar to an existing permitted approved 
install and didn't tell the utility. 

They don't think they are getting the added amount of $/kWh. 

Pg said that's true that they have to calibrate the meter for maximum sell 
back watts and it's set to low. 

I don't believe it. But anyone have anything to add?

Jay

Peltz power 


Sent from my iPhone
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Pg meter reading

[jerrysgarage01]

Sounds a little fishy to me, is it a big residential or real small

Jerry


Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S™ III, an AT 4G LTE smartphone

 Original message From: Jay 
 Date:10/11/2015  9:13 AM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: RE-wrenches  
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Pg meter reading 
I have a client who added some extra solar to an existing permitted 
approved install and didn't tell the utility. 

They don't think they are getting the added amount of $/kWh. 

Pg said that's true that they have to calibrate the meter for maximum sell 
back watts and it's set to low. 

I don't believe it. But anyone have anything to add?

Jay

Peltz power 


Sent from my iPhone
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Re: [RE-wrenches] AC-coupling Enphase/XW Causes Flickering of Lights

[jerrysgarage01]

WrenchesCheck and confirm that the OB is not set in search, yhis will cause 
issues like this.Jerry


Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE smartphone

 Original message 
From: jay  
Date: 09/21/2015  6:58 AM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: RE-wrenches  
Subject: [RE-wrenches] AC-coupling Enphase/XW Causes Flickering of Lights 

Hi Matt,
I can’t tell you the reason but I had the same problem on my Outback VFX.I 
didn’t put it on a O scope, but sure looked like a 60 cycle flicker to me.  
On my system of 2 enphase, when the loads exceeded the output of the enphase 
the flicker when away.But only 2 isn’t very real world.
In the end it was just a test for me, and it didn’t work.
jay
peltz power
On Sep 21, 2015, at 6:18 AM, Matt Sherald  wrote:
I wired an Enphase string into my critical loads panel at my shop.  I was 
curious to see how it would work as I have customers with Enphase systems that 
occasionally contact me about adding a battery backup system.

Why do the fluorescent lights and LEDs flicker once the grid power is 
dropped.  The flicker seems to start as soon as there is enough sun to 
power up a few of the micros (they don't even have to be making much 
power).

The shop is grid-tied with a XW 4024 for battery backup.  Battery capacity is 
370Ah.

I'd love an explanation as to why this happens and if there is a way to 
mitigate the flicker I would also love to hear it.

Many thanks!
-- 
Matt Sherald
PIMBY Energy, LLC
NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer® 304-704-5943

www.getpimby.blogspot.com
www.getpimby.com




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Re: [RE-wrenches] Ground mount for east-west slope

[jerrysgarage01]

Wrenches
Its been a few years but I have gotten top plates from unirac UL- A racking 
that was tilited give them a call or even have them fab-ed up your self.
Jerry


Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S™ III, an ATT 4G LTE smartphone

div Original message /divdivFrom: frenergy 
frene...@psln.com /divdivDate:08/21/2015  3:31 AM  (GMT-10:00) 
/divdivTo: RE-wrenches re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org 
/divdivSubject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Ground mount for east-west slope 
/divdiv
/divWe recently did a job like this on a 17 degree slope, if it helps...

Bill
Feather River Solar Electric


- Original Message - 
From: William Miller will...@millersolar.com
To: RE-wrenches re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org
Sent: Thursday, August 20, 2015 9:39 PM
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Ground mount for east-west slope


 Friends:

 I am looking for a ground mount racking system that can be installed on a 
 15 degree slope down to the east. I'd like the verticals to be set in 
 concrete or driven vertically with the horizontals to slope at 15 degrees.

 The racking we have used heretofore has required the horizontal members to 
 be horizontal and perpendicular to the verticals. What I am seeking would 
 allow some adjustment of that angle.

 Thanks in advance.

 William


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Re: [RE-wrenches] AC Coupled with Generator

[jerrysgarage01]

Wrenches
The ability for proper charging has always been an issue way back befor ac 
coupling was a thing. Its near an uncontrolled charge and if you tank the 
batteries and shut down that's it no charging from the ac coupling component 
Jerry


Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S™ III, an ATT 4G LTE smartphone

div Original message /divdivFrom: Ray Walters 
r...@solarray.com /divdivDate:08/20/2015  6:56 PM  (GMT-10:00) 
/divdivTo: RE-wrenches re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org 
/divdivSubject: Re: [RE-wrenches] AC Coupled with Generator /divdiv
/divHi Folks;

I've done more research on the whole AC coupled issue, and one flaw I found 
with both the Sunny Island and the Radian is that they can't really do a full 3 
stage charge for the batteries in off grid mode.
They detect that the batteries are full and disconnect the AC coupled GT 
inverters, but this is about as subtle as the very early charge controllers, 
and amounts to 1 stage charging.  This is fine for temporary outages, and when 
the grid comes back, the batteries get a good 3 stage charge.  But these folks 
are really wanting a design that could be taken off grid permanently.   Also as 
you my recall, the GT PV system is Enphase, so we can't use the more 
sophisticated controls that SMA offers for the Sunny boys. 
I hate to say it, but I might be back to a diversion load with PWM controller.  
Not elegant, but we could get 3 stage charging.  
Every time I look at AC coupled setups, I just want to start over with charge 
controllers. 
R.Ray Walters
CTO, Solarray, Inc
Nabcep Certified PV Installer, 
Licensed Master Electrician
Solar Design Engineer
303 505-8760
On 8/17/2015 9:39 PM, Mac Lewis wrote:
Hi Ray,

With that size grid-tied system, you would want to use a battery based 
inverter(s) near the (6.7/0.8) 8000W range.  

The frequency shift of the Sunny Islands will work with kicking out the enphase 
inverters but you wouldn't get the same output ramping that it would offer if 
it was a Sunny Boy grid-tied inverter.  The Sunny Island can effectively solve 
your generator backfeeding because there is a reverse current sensor that will 
disconnect the AC input at whatever level you want, 50 mA is default I think.  
You may need to give the Sunny Island generator start control for this however.

You can read about it here on page 137.

http://files.sma.de/dl/15216/SI4548-6048-US-BE-en-21W.pdf

You'll need to give the Sunny Island a digital signal that tell it whether its 
connected to a generator or a grid as outlined in the manual. 

 This is where the Radian is nice because it has two AC Input terminals.

Sounds like an interesting project.

Good Luck.




On Mon, Aug 17, 2015 at 8:36 PM, Jerry Shafer jerrysgarag...@gmail.com wrote:
I cant see this working well without some battery based inverter
Jerry

On Aug 17, 2015 10:10 AM, Ray Walters r...@solarray.com   
wrote:
HI Esteemed Wrenches:

I am consulting on a system I have never seen, that consists of a 6.7Kw Enphase 
roof mounted system, and 2 backup generators.  Each generator has an automatic 
200 amp transfer switch to back up its own 200 amp panel.  Both 200 amp panels 
are fed by a 400 amp service from the grid.
The Enphase PV backfeeds a subpanel in another building which then is fed by a 
2 pole 60 amp breaker in one of the 200 amp panels.
Currently they are having issues with the generators kicking out because of the 
Enphase inverters.  That part I understand: you can't backfeed a generator, or 
its voltage regulation freaks out.

Now we get to the fun part: they want to create a third critical load subpanel 
with loads selected from both 200 amp panels to be powered by batteries and an 
inverter.
I am considering the Sunny Island since it makes the most sense with its 
ability to signal the Enphase inverters to shut off when the batteries are 
full.  I also see this as a partial solution to the generator issue, since 
normally the Enphase will be connected to the output side of the Sunny Island.  
However, when the generator is used to charge, we will be back to directly 
coupling the generator output to the Enphase.

Here are some possible solutions I'm considering:
1) Use a separate charger for the generator so that it will only feed DC to the 
batteries, and not be AC coupled.
2) convert the PV back to DC with charge controllers, but that would involve 
ditching and adding another conduit run between buildings.
3)  Put the Enphase PV on a relay that would disconnect the PV when charging 
with the generator.
4) Something I haven't thought of that one of you clever folks can suggest..

As always, thanks in advance for all you responses,

-- 
R.Ray Walters
CTO, Solarray, Inc
Nabcep Certified PV Installer,
Licensed Master Electrician
Solar Design Engineer
303 505-8760

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Trojan Batteries

[jerrysgarage01]

Wrenches
This may should a little like a old wives tail but I  used to see the same cell 
and or  artery failure over the years. Its all about resistance so I started 
rotating the batteries, this improved acid levels, life span and capacity.  
Just try it out before you laugh it off. One thought is the moving around is 
the key.
Jerry


Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S™ III, an ATT 4G LTE smartphone

div Original message /divdivFrom: Tom at wagonmaker 
t...@wagonmaker.com /divdivDate:08/12/2015  4:26 PM  (GMT-10:00) 
/divdivTo: RE-wrenches re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org 
/divdivSubject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Trojan Batteries /divdiv
/divWhat size are the banks are are they series/paralleled across the 
terminals?  That can cause one or more cells to fail, generally starting on the 
negative terminal.  The set that failed on me was series/parallel across the 
terminals, old school, and the cell closest to the main negative overheated and 
shorted out, killing that string.  It’s why I went to buss bars.
 
Tom
 
From: Drake
Sent: Wednesday, August 12, 2015 12:03 PM
To: re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Trojan Batteries
 
Hello Wrenches,

I have had a number of customers with Trojan L-16s have problems lately. In 
some cases, I know that the batteries weren't very well cared for, but in no 
case were the batteries totally discharged and let get cold or sit for a long 
time. It doesn't seem that the batteries should have died after a couple of 
years. I could see diminished output and a reduced life. 

One customer who supposedly knows someone with inside information claims that 
Trojan started cutting corners a few years ago to be more competitive on price. 

Has anyone else seen more problems with Trojan Batteries, or heard that the 
company is cutting corners?

Thanks,

Drake 

Athens Electric LLC
OH License 44810
CO License 3773
NABCEP Certified Solar PV 
740-448-7328
http://athens-electric.com/ 

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Re: [RE-wrenches] to flash or not to flash

[jerrysgarage01]

WrenchesWe stay away from anything with a rubber type boot as it will shrink over time in the shade of the array or not. You all night want to look at the sunmodo out of Washington. Have had no leak issues or installation issues, there is no exposed rubber and the flashing is malleable and can be shaped around the roofing materials and does not lift up on the cornersJerrySent via the Samsung Galaxy S™ III, an ATT 4G LTE smartphone Original message From: William Dorsett  Date:08/08/2015  9:51 AM  (GMT-10:00) To: 'RE-wrenches'  Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] to flash or not to flash I agree with Ray on this, but think the neoprene boot here is so badly separated more likely because the house is settling around it. Still it cracked due to UV and would have failed anyway.Bill DorsettManhattan, KSFrom: RE-wrenches [mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Wayne IrwinSent: Friday, August 07, 2015 4:20 PMTo: WrenchesSubject: Re: [RE-wrenches] to flash or not to flashhttp://www.usshingle.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/US-Shingle-Roof-Tune-Up.pngWayne Irwin,PresidentLicense #CVC56695 State Licensed Solar ContractorPure Energy Solar International Inc. wa...@pureenergysolar.com http://PureEnergySolar.comhttp://SolarChargingStation.net352 377-6527 Office352 336-3299 FaxThe Sun Is Always Shining!The content of this message is Pure Energy Solar Confidential. If you are not the intended recipient and have received this message in error, any use or distribution is prohibited. Please notify me immediately by reply e-mail and delete this message from your computer system. Thank you.Date: Fri, 7 Aug 2015 17:11:50 -0400From: kjenergysyst...@gmail.comTo: re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.orgSubject: Re: [RE-wrenches] to flash or not to flashNot that the names of things matter that much but imho "flashing" does require an overlapping of some kind. An Oatey boot for a metal roof is more of a bedded fitting than a flashing. It relies entirely on fasteners and a sealing membrane whereas flashings rely mostly on natural forces like gravity. Perhaps an experienced roofer weigh in on this.Kurt JohnsenOn Fri, Aug 7, 2015 at 3:21 PM, Jason Szumlanski ja...@floridasolardesigngroup.com wrote:"If you place a flat object on top of roofing without an uphill material lapping over the downhill object, you are not flashing. "By that logic, an Oatey boot is not a flashing for a plumbing vent on a metal roof.Just sayin'...Jason SzumlanskiOn Fri, Aug 7, 2015 at 2:19 PM, William Miller william.mil...@millersolar.com wrote:Ray:I have to respectfully disagree with your semantics. A flashing is an overlapping of roofing materials such that gravity will direct rain and melt water off of the roof. This is a universally accepted waterproofing method that does not depend on any sealant material. The concept is as ancient as the first, crude, thatched roof.If you place a flat object on top of roofing without an uphill material lapping over the downhill object, you are not flashing. What you have described is sealant-dependent weatherproofing. Regardless of the quality of the sealant, or lack thereof, I don’t think you can call it a flashed attachment.(The overarching point is a flashed attachment does not depend on a sealant. Any sealant has a finite lifespan. Removing the sealant variable from the equation results in more lasting installation.)Sincerely,William MillerLic 773985millersolar.com805-438-5600From: RE-wrenches [mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Ray WaltersSent: Friday, August 07, 2015 10:34 AMTo: RE-wrenchesSubject: Re: [RE-wrenches] to flash or not to flashMy opinion is that if the L foot has enough surface area it constitutes a flashing, and that large flashings can actually cause more damage to the roof than they prevent.I also agree that an attachement doesn't constitute a penetration. I just finished an install on a metal roof with hundreds of screw holes. We added a few more screw holes, and ours have 20 times the sealant surface area. We did run a 1" conduit through the roof, and since it was an actual penetration, we used a very expensive flexible boot flashing.Personally, I think we need about a 3"x3" or 4" x 4" L foot with a double stick butyl tape on the bottom, and all will be well.I realize that the OP was referring to asphalt, but I will flash other roof types that don't do well with L feet ( like shake).___List sponsored by Redwood AllianceList Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.orgChange listserver email address  settings:http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.orgList-Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/maillist.htmlList rules  etiquette:www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htmCheck out or update participant bios:www.members.re-wrenches.org___List sponsored by 

Re: [RE-wrenches] Using the North Facing Roof

[jerrysgarage01]

WrenchesI see this working south of the tropic of cancer but at 1000 watts per 
meter squared tilted north might work for a month a year but I don't think the 
tax credits were proposed for poor performance module installations. I see 
enphase annual  readings prove the point. Jerry


Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE smartphone

 Original message 
From: Peter Parrish peter.parr...@calsolareng.com 
Date: 07/27/2015  7:21 PM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: 'RE-wrenches' re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org 
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Using the North Facing Roof 

I recently read a short piece that caught me up short, and I quote:

“The fast dropping cost of solar, while a huge boon to the adoption of solar 
PV, has counter-intuitively altered design parameters. No longer is the 
north-facing roof considered unusable because limited application in less-than 
optimal orientations can still show a positive net benefit. Arrays are thus 
designed now with elements or sub-arrays in these locations, increasing overall 
kW installation while reducing the energy production per capacity installed. 
This might have been anticipated based on sheer economic analysis from a users 
perspective, but so long has solar been expensive that these less optimal 
orientations were never seriously considered.” I doubt that the individual who 
wrote this piece came to these conclusions him/herself. Does anyone know of a 
recent article that argued this perspective? Is this an emerging design 
practice? If so, I’d like to know more about it.  -  Peter  Peter T. 
Parrish, Ph.D.President, SolarGnosis1107 Fair Oaks Ave., Suite 351South 
Pasadena, CA 91030(323) 839-6108peter...@pobox.com ___
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Iron Edison Batteries

[jerrysgarage01]

WrenchesI have had good experiences with these batteries and with the same 
issues with the magnum on 12 volts, don't seam to have any issues with my 48 
volt systems. We did double up the cables to reduce the high load (overdriving) 
the radians with no issues. It's just the cost, but it should be the last 
battery you buyJerry


Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE smartphone

 Original message 
From: Jay jay.pe...@gmail.com 
Date: 07/27/2015  4:47 AM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: RE-wrenches re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org 
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Iron Edison Batteries 

Hi dan
I'm curious why you opted for NiFe vs lithium?
JayPeltz power. 




On Jul 26, 2015, at 8:11 PM, Dan Fink danbo...@gmail.com wrote:

I made myself a guinea pig on Iron Edison NiFe cells this year, before I try to 
install them for any customer. I have now about 90 days on them.1.65 volts per 
cell charging is what they want and need. PV controllers MPPT type are fine 
with this. just change the settings (assuming the sun is shining) . 
Inverter/chargers are not fine, at least not my Magnum OMG! over 1.6v per 
cell!! Overvoltage! Shut down!So I have rewired battery bank as recommended by 
Mrf with 9 cells at 1.2v instead of 10 cells. And now with my 10.8v battery 
bank I get surge low voltage wonky waveform hits from the fridge turning on, 
etc. that reboot  the satellite internet, tv etc.My plan is to add another 1kw 
of solar here for an increase of 50% and rely more on the incoming PV that can 
bring it all up to 1.65v per cell rather than the generator that can't do it 
thanks to the inverter firmware. I think my new NiFe batteries will do just 
great in the long run. But their charge/discharge behavior is a continuing 
lesson. And I am SO glad to learn these lessons myself, instead of in front of 
a critical customer. 


Dan FinkBuckville EnergyIREC Certified Instructor™ for: ~ PV Installation 
Professional~ Small Wind InstallerNABCEP / IREC / ISPQ Accredited Continuing 
Education Providers™
970.672.4342

 

On Sun, Jul 26, 2015 at 6:55 PM, jay jay.pe...@gmail.com wrote:
HI Tom,



They are considered 1.2v nominal.



Charge range is up to 1.7v per cell.

For a 24v system usually you pull out 1 cell or 19 cells 19 x 1.7 = 32.3v

For a 48, usually 2 or 3 , or 37-38 cells.



If you use much less, then the voltage swings really low, if you go more the 
voltage is too high for most inverters.

The Iota isn’t going to charge them up fully with that low a voltage.  But I 
don’t know if that version Iota is adjustable, many of the older ones had a 
internal pot you could turn up.



But heck give it a try and play with it.



jay



peltz power









 On Jul 26, 2015, at 4:34 PM, Tom Lane t...@ecs-solar.com wrote:



 I have a friend who has forty ( 40 ) Iron Edison Batteries , he says they are 
 each 1.5 volts and wants to use them for a backup to his aquatics business's 
 . Continuous load 24/7 is only 365 watts with surges to 1200 watts . My guess 
 is that ___# of batteries ( maybe 32 to 36 ? ) can be wire as a 48 volt 
 system ? Any suggestion on charge controllers - Morningstar or MidNite ? . .? 
 A Samplex pure sign wave inverter 2000 watts at 48 volts and an Iota 54 volt 
 battery charger is my guess that it might be the way to power the load - any 
 suggestions  . Anyone have experience with Iron Edison .any suggestions 
 appreciated !  Gator tom PS : any suggested websites ?



 Sent from my iPad

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Re: [RE-wrenches] DC conductor line loss numbers

[jerrysgarage01]

Wrenchesthe VD is 105 VDC into  a charge controller, the engineer is looking 
good at it like it a grid tie running at wide open all the time, he will not 
listen to sugestions, that's the problem I haveJerry


Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE smartphone

 Original message 
From: jarmo.venalai...@schneider-electric.com 
Date: 07/27/2015  5:34 AM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: RE-wrenches re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org 
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] DC conductor line loss numbers 

Hi:



When deciding on voltage drops and otherwise
working out the design of a solar system, one thing that needs careful
attention is to make sure that the array voltage does not drop below a
level at which the inverter cannot produce full power.



This voltage will occur when the inverter
is working at full input current such as a hypothetical 3000 W inverter
which can handle a maximum of 10 Amps of input current to produce its full
rated 3000 Watts (10Amps @ 300 Vdc).  



At any voltage less than 300 Vdc, the
power will be limited by the maximum 10 Amps.  For example at 290
Vdc you get 2.9 kW, 280 Vdc you get 2.8kW, and so on.



Even if the inverter can operate
down to 100 Vdc, you don't want to be anywhere near there, especially not
during the midday hours as that will hurt peak power production, a lot.
 In this case -0.3% loss for every volt below 300Vdc.









Identifying this voltage for a particular
inverter may not however be straightforward due to wide variety of wording
used in specifying ratings.  Wording such as,



1. operating voltage range

2. full power operating voltage range

3. MPPT operating voltage range

4. minimum operating voltage

5. minimum MPPT operating voltage

6. rated operating voltage range

7. Rated MPPT operating voltage range

8. starting voltage

9. nominal operating voltage range

10. maximum input current

11. minimum input voltage

12. minimum DC voltage

13. nominal DC input current

14. maximum operating DC input current

15. maximum continuous operating DC
input current

17.





When looking for the voltage below which
you don't want go, look for the following:



1. The maximum operating input current

2. The minimum MPPT operating voltage



Then make sure the array can produce
at least that much voltage and current when its really hot when the resistance
of all the wires is more than at room temperature.



JARMO

_




Jarmo Venalainen  |  
Schneider Electric   |  Xantrex
Brand  |   CANADA  |   Sales Application
Engineer 

Phone: +604-422-2528  |   Tech Support: 800-670-0707
 |   Mobile: +604-505-0291 

Email: jarmo.venalai...@schneider-electric.com
 |   Site:
www.Xantrex.com  |  
Address: 3700 Gilmore Way, Burnaby, BC V5G4M1 















*** Please consider the environment before printing this e-mail










From:
Glenn Burt glenn.b...@glbcc.com

To:
RE-wrenches re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org,


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Re: [RE-wrenches] SMA 1800u not generating power

[jerrysgarage01]

SMA used to to do repairs but last I heard they no longer have replacement 
parts. I have used the new SMA TL-22 because of the low voltage dc input. If 
you added some additional modules to the B input it might qualify for the tax 
credit (I did say might)
Good luck
Jerry


Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S™ III, an ATT 4G LTE smartphone

div Original message /divdivFrom: Jason Szumlanski 
ja...@floridasolardesigngroup.com /divdivDate:07/24/2015  4:25 AM  
(GMT-10:00) /divdivTo: RE-wrenches re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org 
/divdivSubject: Re: [RE-wrenches] SMA 1800u not generating power /divdiv
/divSomeone contacted me off list and said this company does out of warranty 
SMA repairs:

http://www.shop.solarcowboyzoutlet.com/Inverter-Repair-Service-Inverter-Repair-Service.htm

Looks like there is a risk in how big the repair is, but apparently they are 
willing to talk about the diagnostics before you send it in, and fix minor 
problems for a flat rate.

One bad part about these small systems is that labor to repair or replace 
failed units can easily turn into a cost equivalent to years of energy 
production, not to mention the hardware cost itself... I've only sold a few 
tiny systems over the years, and never really considered this. It makes much 
more financial sense for an owner to replace a failed 5kW inverter when the 
labor is basically the same as a 2kW.

Jason Szumlanski


On Fri, Jul 24, 2015 at 10:04 AM, Sky Sims s...@ecologicalsystems.biz wrote:
This is a known issue. I've come across a bunch of their inverters that have 
had this problem. In addition to seeing this issue on their 1800's I've seen it 
happen on their 2500's as well. Shows a solid green light but isn't putting out 
power. 
The first time I came across this issue they had a refurbishment program, where 
they would rebuild the inverter and send it back with a one year warranty for 
under $400. The refurbishment program was a great program that I hope they 
bring back someday.
The last few times I contacted SMA about one of these defective inverters, they 
said the product was not under warranty and they no longer supported it. Only 
option they gave was to buy a new unit. 

Sky Sims
Ecological Systems


On Jul 24, 2015, at 5:49 AM, Jason Szumlanski 
ja...@floridasolardesigngroup.com wrote:

I am looking at a 1800u from 2004 that has a green light and in mpp mode,  but 
Pac is zero. Grid and DC voltage are good.  No other indication of problems. I 
saw Pac tick up to 2W a couple of times,  but that's it. It's just not 
delivering AC power.

Any thoughts?

Sadly, it doesn't make much financial sense for the owner to replace it with a 
current model, as the replacement cost would take almost 10 years to recover 
with the small BIPV array connected to it. I'm hoping for a field repair option.

Jason Szumlanski

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Re: [RE-wrenches] SMA 1800u not generating power

[jerrysgarage01]

Replacing the wire would be in most cases a simple solution
Jerry


Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S™ III, an ATT 4G LTE smartphone

div Original message /divdivFrom: Glenn Burt 
glenn.b...@glbcc.com /divdivDate:07/24/2015  8:14 AM  (GMT-10:00) 
/divdivTo: RE-wrenches re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org 
/divdivSubject: Re: [RE-wrenches] SMA 1800u not generating power /divdiv
/divHow do you get around the code requirement for the use of PV wire with a 
TL inverter on the existing array?

Sincerely,
Glenn Burt
Sent from my 'smart' phone so please excuse grammar and typos.
From: jerrysgarage01
Sent: ‎7/‎24/‎2015 12:57
To: RE-wrenches
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] SMA 1800u not generating power

SMA used to to do repairs but last I heard they no longer have replacement 
parts. I have used the new SMA TL-22 because of the low voltage dc input. If 
you added some additional modules to the B input it might qualify for the tax 
credit (I did say might)
Good luck
Jerry


Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S™ III, an ATT 4G LTE smartphone


 Original message 
From: Jason Szumlanski
Date:07/24/2015 4:25 AM (GMT-10:00)
To: RE-wrenches
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] SMA 1800u not generating power

Someone contacted me off list and said this company does out of warranty SMA 
repairs:

http://www.shop.solarcowboyzoutlet.com/Inverter-Repair-Service-Inverter-Repair-Service.htm

Looks like there is a risk in how big the repair is, but apparently they are 
willing to talk about the diagnostics before you send it in, and fix minor 
problems for a flat rate.

One bad part about these small systems is that labor to repair or replace 
failed units can easily turn into a cost equivalent to years of energy 
production, not to mention the hardware cost itself... I've only sold a few 
tiny systems over the years, and never really considered this. It makes much 
more financial sense for an owner to replace a failed 5kW inverter when the 
labor is basically the same as a 2kW.

Jason Szumlanski


On Fri, Jul 24, 2015 at 10:04 AM, Sky Sims s...@ecologicalsystems.biz wrote:
This is a known issue. I've come across a bunch of their inverters that have 
had this problem. In addition to seeing this issue on their 1800's I've seen it 
happen on their 2500's as well. Shows a solid green light but isn't putting out 
power. 
The first time I came across this issue they had a refurbishment program, where 
they would rebuild the inverter and send it back with a one year warranty for 
under $400. The refurbishment program was a great program that I hope they 
bring back someday.
The last few times I contacted SMA about one of these defective inverters, they 
said the product was not under warranty and they no longer supported it. Only 
option they gave was to buy a new unit. 

Sky Sims
Ecological Systems


On Jul 24, 2015, at 5:49 AM, Jason Szumlanski 
ja...@floridasolardesigngroup.com wrote:

I am looking at a 1800u from 2004 that has a green light and in mpp mode,  but 
Pac is zero. Grid and DC voltage are good.  No other indication of problems. I 
saw Pac tick up to 2W a couple of times,  but that's it. It's just not 
delivering AC power.

Any thoughts?

Sadly, it doesn't make much financial sense for the owner to replace it with a 
current model, as the replacement cost would take almost 10 years to recover 
with the small BIPV array connected to it. I'm hoping for a field repair option.

Jason Szumlanski

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Slate roof attachment?

[jerrysgarage01]

Completely agree, slate brakes if you look at it wrong and that being said who 
is responsible to remove the modules to replace the tiles for the next  how 
many years Jerry


Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE smartphone

 Original message 
From: August Goers aug...@luminalt.com 
Date: 07/08/2015  11:28 AM  (GMT-10:00) 
To: RE-wrenches re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org 
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Slate roof attachment? 

Hi Lars, Slate is a tough one. We’ve always hired a roofer to work with us on 
slate roofs – they can setup toe boards (if it is steep) and work with our 
installers as we mount stanchions. We’ve used standard cylindrical posts such 
as Unirac standoffs or Pro Solar Fast Jacks and then they flash them with 
copper flashings. They can also replace slates as they break. 

I would never attempt to work on a slate roof without a roofer involved – it is 
simply too fragile. Best, August Luminalt From: RE-wrenches 
[mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Lars Ortegren
Sent: Wednesday, July 08, 2015 2:02 PM
To: re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Slate roof attachment? Wrenches,Anyone out there attach 
to slate roofs? we've had one, that ended with us re-roofing the portion of the 
roof under the array, but I'm wondering if there is a great product out there 
that others have used? Thus far, the only attachment I can find is the PV 
Quickmount shake flashing that even mentions slate.  Ideas?
 -- Lars Örtegren/ President PO Box 480/149 E.Main St
Grass Valley, CA 95945
Phone : (530)274-3671 Fax: (530)274-7518
California C-10 Electrical Contractor #779624    ___
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Battery Bank to Inverter Wiring

[jerrysgarage01]

Wrenches
We always try to minimize in connection cables as well as home run cables to 
the shorted length possible, restating batteries to aid this should always be 
considered as well as positive and negative runs
Jerry


Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S™ III, an ATT 4G LTE smartphone

div Original message /divdivFrom: Ray Walters 
r...@solarray.com /divdivDate:06/29/2015  12:05 PM  (GMT-10:00) 
/divdivTo: RE-wrenches re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org 
/divdivSubject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Battery Bank to Inverter Wiring 
/divdiv
/divThis is fascinating because while I knew the DC cables had an AC  
component, I never realized how much inductance played in the volt drop to the 
inverter.  Thanks for bringing this to our attention Jarmo.  
Which brings up another question based on Benn's question:  isn't the battery 
itself part of the inductive loop?  and would the lead inside and steel cases 
act to increase the inductance?  Should we consider changing battery layouts 
not just to shorten cable lengths, but to counter inductance in the batteries 
themselves?  If needed, we could actually wire the batteries to twist by 
putting every other 2 v cell in the opposite row.  
My guess is that it wouldn't be worth it, but I've been wrong many times...

R.Ray Walters
CTO, Solarray, Inc
Nabcep Certified PV Installer, 
Licensed Master Electrician
Solar Design Engineer
303 505-8760
On 6/29/2015 3:55 PM, Benn Kilburn wrote:
What about when you have the (+) and (-) terminals at opposite ends of a larger 
battery bank?  Sure you can run the conductors side-by-side once they meet up 
on their way to the inverter, but would you consider the distance between the 
end terminals a large loop? 
Ideally the battery string is laid out so the end terminals are close together 
and close to the inverter, but this isn't always the case. 

Benn Kilburn
SkyFire Energy Inc. 
780-906-7807


On Jun 29, 2015, at 10:28 AM, jarmo.venalai...@schneider-electric.com wrote:

Hi: 

From the comments so far, it appears that within the wrenches 
group, good practices are the rule and DC cables are kept side by side, so the 
problem I mentioned hasn't come up much. 

I have seen large loop battery cables a couple of times in solar installs 
myself out on islands way down south.  Also on boats/RV's/motor homes. 

Please keep the cable loop in mind when you do bench tests of inverters, as it 
may screw up the results and make it seem like there is something wrong with 
the inverter.   

JARMO
_
 

Jarmo Venalainen  |   Schneider Electric |  Xantrex 
  Brand  |   CANADA  |   Sales Application Engineer 
Phone: +604-422-2528  |   Tech Support: 800-670-0707  |   Mobile: 
+604-505-0291 
Email: jarmo.venalai...@schneider-electric.com  |   Site: www.Xantrex.com  |   
Address: 3700 Gilmore Way, Burnaby, BC V5G4M1
mime-attachment.gif
mime-attachment.gif   mime-attachment.gif   
mime-attachment.gif   mime-attachment.gif


*** Please consider the environment before printing this e-mail



From:   b...@midnitesolar.com b...@midnitesolar.com 

To: RE-wrenches re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org,
Date:   06/28/2015 10:30 PM
Subject:Re: [RE-wrenches] Battery Bank to Inverter 
Wiring
Sent by:RE-wrenches 
re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org




On 6/28/2015 9:20 AM, Allan Sindelar wrote:
I'm not an EE, but I can't see what difference twisting would make in
the absence of a building/collapsing field as is normal with AC.

It is little known that with the typical inverters that use the heavy power 
transformers,
have a lot of AC 120 Hz (or 100 Hz for 50 Hz systems) current mixed in with 
that DC battery current.

The AC output current reflects back to the input as ripple current.  This is 
why you want to
have at least short as possible Sbattery cable runs AND keep the wires as close 
together as possible.

Twisting the battery cables may help a bit but that is probably overkill.

The problem has to do with inductance in the battery cables. You can use as big 
of cable
as you can fit in to reduce resistance, but that will not help to 
lower the inductance.
The problems you can sometimes have with high inductance is that 
L-C resonance at the
inverter can raise the peak voltages seen at the inverter input terminals and 
can be hard on
the inverter.

Then again,  the high frequency, lighter weight inverters will typically keep 
most of that ripple
inside,  between the DC input and AC output and battery cable inductance will 
not be as much
of a problem on the battery cables.

boB Gudgel




On 6/28/2015 9:20 AM, Allan Sindelar wrote: 
As a matter of course I have always run the positive and negative 
conductors of high-current cable 

Re: [RE-wrenches] SnapNrack

[jerrysgarage01]

Wrenches
For the more traditional roofs we use unitary products but we use the iron ridge


Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S™ III, an ATT 4G LTE smartphone

div Original message /divdivFrom: Dana 
d...@solarwork.com /divdivDate:06/24/2015  12:09 PM  (GMT-10:00) 
/divdivTo: 'RE-wrenches' re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org 
/divdivSubject: Re: [RE-wrenches] SnapNrack /divdiv
/divAfter many years of UniRac we switched to SnapnRack. We have never had to 
wait for product. AEE ships within 48 hours (usually) there are lots of options 
for different roofs and they all seem to work well. Flush mount rail is the 
same for ground mount. We have “custom” over engineered racks at 10,000 ft.el., 
many times that were like doing erector sets on a roof and are so stout that it 
is wonderful. Service has been excellent with question  suggestions. I am sold 
can you tell?
Flush mount is a an easy install too check out their online design  components 
www.snapnrack.com/  
 

Dana Orzel
Great Solar Works, Inc -  NABCEP # 051112-136
E - d...@solarwork.com  - Web - solarwork.com
O - 970.626.5253  C - 208.721.7003
Responsible Technologies for Responsible People since 1988 
P Please consider the environment before printing this email.
 
 
From: RE-wrenches [mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf 
Of Dana Brandt
Sent: Wednesday, June 24, 2015 3:56 PM
To: RE-wrenches
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] SnapNrack
 
Hi Jason,

We've used Unirac for years but have been contemplating Ironridge. I'm curious 
what your experience was and why you went back to Unirac? 

Anyone else have input on best racking systems for flush-mounted residential 
systems on comp roof?

Thanks,

Dana

Dana Brandt
Ecotech Energy Systems, LLC
www.ecotechenergy.com
d...@ecotechenergy.com
360.318.7646
 
On Wed, Feb 5, 2014 at 12:09 PM, Jason Szumlanski ja...@fafcosolar.com wrote:
By Snap N Rack, you mean Sun Run...
 
http://cleantechnica.com/2014/02/05/sunrun-acquires-rec-solars-residential-business-aee-solar-snapnrack-means/
 
I'm curious if these vertical integrators will still make their acquired brands 
available to small dealers through distribution. When SolarCity snatched up 
Zep, I had concerns about being able to service or add onto existing Zep 
systems we installed. That's definitely a concern going forward, and reason to 
perhaps stick with the most compatible racking solutions available. We used 
IronRidge for a while, which is largely compatible with Unirac, but now we're 
back on the Unirac bandwagon. 
 
Interesting times...
 

Jason Szumlanski
​Fafco Solar​
 

 

On Wed, Feb 5, 2014 at 12:45 PM, Max Balchowsky m...@seesolar.com wrote:
We have been using Snap N' Rack for a while, Have lots of installs in Hawaii - 
so far no problems, I like the convenience of the design for snapping in the 
slider nut in mid rail, and also the ability to install the panels flush with 
the end of the rails….
 
Max Balchowsky
Design Engineer
SEE Systems
1048 Irvine Ave Suite 217
Newport Beach, Ca. 92660
760-403-6810
Building a Better Future For The Next Generation
 
From: Allen Frishman amfr...@aeonsolar.com
To: RE-wrenches re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org 
Sent: Wednesday, February 5, 2014 6:17 AM
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] SnapNrack
 
I am curious about the mid clamps on the snapnrack.   The flange that rests on 
top of the solar panel frame is so small ~ 3/16.Anyone experience any 
problems with these failing in a big storm?With solar panel frames not 
being square it is nice to have a little extra to grab - I am always curious as 
to why these clips are made with such a small area to hold the panels down.   
 
All feedback on these clips is appreciated.
Al Frishman
AeonSolar
(917) 699-6641 - cell
(888) 460-2867
www.aeonsolar.com
 
On Jun 1, 2013, at 10:41 AM, Max Balchowsky wrote:


Have installed last three systems (35Kw)with snap n rack.
love it
 
Max Balchowsky
Design Engineer
SEE Systems
1048 Irvine Ave Suite 217
Newport Beach, Ca. 92660
760-403-6810
Building a Better Future For The Next Generation
 
From: Solarguy nt...@1scom.net
To: 'RE-wrenches' re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org 
Sent: Friday, May 31, 2013 10:11 PM
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] SnapNrack
 
The only complaint with the Snapnrack rails is the thin wall can easily be 
distorted. This will allow the nut to drop out of its groove. Love the 
universal end clamps but have learned to assemble every one to check for proper 
fit before getting on the roof.
Jim Duncan
-Original Message-
From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org 
[mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Drake
Sent: Friday, May 31, 2013 7:32 PM
To: re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org
Subject: [RE-wrenches] SnapNrack
 
Hello Wrenches,
 
How would you rate the SnapNrack mounting systems against Unirac and other 
mounting systems?
 
Thanks,
 
Drake