Except for the fact that there are probably many Latter-day Saints who are
just as likely going terrestrial as well.
Stacy.
At 04:51 PM 12/05/2002 -0900, you wrote:
After much pondering, Paul Osborne favored us with:
I look at it this way:
There are two kinds of Christians; those who have
Gary Smith favored us with:
No, it isn't a straw man. It is exactly my point. Just where does a
mortal being draw the line between what is a 'true' Christian and what
isn't? Your definition keeps shifting on me. You said it was someone who
fully followed Christ and his living prophets.
Nope.
Gary Smith wrote:
So, until you get your eating habit under control, you aren't following
the DC, and this means you aren't a true Christian because you aren't
following the prophets? I definitely wouldn't be considered one under
your definition, either, since there are many things I struggle
After much pondering, Gary Smith favored us with:
So, until you get your eating habit under control, you aren't following
the DC, and this means you aren't a true Christian because you aren't
following the prophets? I definitely wouldn't be considered one under
your definition, either, since
At 08:37 12/5/2002 -0900, BLT scares us all:
--- Mark Gregson ---
Joseph Smith had the vision in 1836 in the Kirtland temple. In the
vision he saw his father, mother and Alvin in the celestial kingdom.
However, his father and mother were still alive when Joseph Smith had the
vision. Therefore,
There can be no real and true Christianity, even with good works, unless
we are deeply and personally committed to the reality of Jesus Christ as
the Only Begotten Son of the Father, who bought us, who purchased us in
the great act of atonement.
Spencer W. Kimball, The SaviorThe Center of Our
After much pondering, Gary Smith favored us with:
You are thinking of the short mortal term we live in. All will bow the
knee and profess Christ as Lord. The majority of them will eventually
accept Christ, and though they may not merit the Celestial Kingdom, they
still will accept the gospel
At 09:49 12/5/2002 -0900, BLT wondered :
For years we referred to those outside the Church as gentiles. Then
that word wasn't good enough, so we stated saying nonmember. Even that
term is considered too politically incorrect. So what do we call them today?
Lost
Till the ever helpful
I look at it this way:
There are two kinds of Christians; those who have the fullness and those
who don't.
Celestial Christians = Latter-day Saints
Terrestrial Christians = Baptists, Catholics, and the rest
In this way we can believe our General Authorities when they refer to
other churches as
Perhaps we need two different definitions: Christ-like, and Christian?
John W. Redelfs wrote:
After much pondering, Mark Gregson favored us with:
What do we know about being a true Christian? Not much, really, because
God has never revealed any definition for true Christian. He has given
potential converts. :-)
Elmer L. Fairbank wrote:
At 09:49 12/5/2002 -0900, BLT wondered :
For years we referred to those outside the Church as gentiles. Then
that word wasn't good enough, so we stated saying nonmember. Even that
term is considered too politically incorrect. So what do we
After much pondering, Paul Osborne favored us with:
I look at it this way:
There are two kinds of Christians; those who have the fullness and those
who don't.
Celestial Christians = Latter-day Saints
Terrestrial Christians = Baptists, Catholics, and the rest
In this way we can believe our
Some of my best friends do these things!
Jon
John W. Redelfs wrote:
After much pondering, Stacy Smith favored us with:
To add to this perspective, how many people who claim to be true
Christians:
1. Visit the sick.
2. Visit people in prison.
3. When they have a feast they invite the
Stacy Smith wrote:
To add to this perspective, how many people who claim to be true
Christians:
1. Visit the sick.
Regularly. Of course, some of them weren't sick before I arrived.
2. Visit people in prison.
I visit people in political office and members of the Southern Baptist
After much pondering, Stacy Smith favored us with:
If we only go by that definition, then those living up to the only light
they know and following Christ all the way to the best of their ability
cannot be considered Christians. I think I'd have a problem with
that. Can they go to the
After much pondering, Stacy Smith favored us with:
To add to this perspective, how many people who claim to be true Christians:
1. Visit the sick.
2. Visit people in prison.
3. When they have a feast they invite the halt, lame and the blind.
I have met many saints who do these things.
After much pondering, Gary Smith favored us with:
Maybe someday I can become a true Christian in John's definition. Until
then, I'm glad that Christ accepts me with all the shades of gray and
excess baggage I carry with me.
You are already a true Christian by my definition. You follow Christ,
After much pondering, Gary Smith favored us with:
So, before any of us less than perfect people try to proclaim such a
strong statement as some have given, how about defining just which one of
these definitions you are using. Otherwise, you are painting with a very
broad brush against those who
After much pondering, Gary Smith favored us with:
I recall Joseph Smith having a vision (could it be in DC 137?), where he
sees his non-baptized brother Alvin in the Celestial Kingdom. Alvin is
obviously considered a 'true Christian' even though he has not yet been
baptized.
Alvin was was most
I honestly don't know. I believe baptism is required -- this is what we are
taught. But I don't claim to know all of God's ways, just that He is just and He
is merciful. Whatever that might end up meaning. I'm also reminded not to be too
judgemental by the parable of the labourers who were hired
John, our BLT said (but without so many sideways carrots as appear in
this reply - but that's because I can't get Zion to appear in my e-mail
box and have to use this clunky reply system on Topica. Rant, rave. Oh
- where was I?):
I agree that many members of the Church are not true
read and explain
the hundreds of segments that say they are wrong. but that, of course, is
the NM in me.
Jon
- Original Message -
From: Chet [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sunday, December 01, 2002 11:45 AM
Subject: RE: [ZION] True Christians
John, our BLT said
After much pondering, Jon Spencer favored us with:
If someone (a) takes on the name of Christ, and (b) keeps His commandments
which he has given them, then that person IMVHO is a true Christian.
The first thing a person must do to qualify as a true Christian is to
believe in him. Then he must
I think what John's trying to say, if I may be so presumptuous, is that the
principle is clear. It is the judgement at the individual level that we are
cautioned about. I believe my grandmother, who passed away in April at 96 to have
been one of the most Christian people I ever knew, yet she never
To add to this perspective, how many people who claim to be true Christians:
1. Visit the sick.
2. Visit people in prison.
3. When they have a feast they invite the halt, lame and the blind.
Stacy.
At 05:56 AM 12/02/2002 -0900, you wrote:
After much pondering, Jon Spencer favored us with:
If we only go by that definition, then those living up to the only light
they know and following Christ all the way to the best of their ability
cannot be considered Christians. I think I'd have a problem with
that. Can they go to the celestial kingdom? Maybe, in some cases. Can
they
I agree with JWR in so much as a true Christian must be a baptized member
of the church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and have a testimony
given by the Holy Ghost.
Paul O
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Unfortunately, however, many members of the Church are not true Christians,
and many members of other Churches are (which, of course, is not
unfortunate - the only unfortunate thing is that they are not in the true
Church).
Jon
John W. Redelfs wrote:
There are two kinds of Christianity in the
After much pondering, Jon Spencer favored us with:
Unfortunately, however, many members of the Church are not true Christians,
and many members of other Churches are (which, of course, is not
unfortunate - the only unfortunate thing is that they are not in the true
Church).
I agree that many
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