Re: [TruthTalk] John 16:13 fg. - Perhaps it's focus is WHO not so much WHAT

[Judy Taylor]

On Sat, 2 Apr 2005 18:32:07 -0600 "Caroline Wong" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: So in the garden it would have been quite difficult for A&E to know that the serpent had said something different from God?   Judy, you've hit it on the head!! A&E knew only good but not evil.   ATST they knew God as their Creator and that they were to OBEY Him, even Eve knew enough to get it a bit twisted.   They have never been lied to before. They've never been deceived. They would rather doubt what they heard than doubt another creature of God. And what did the serpent look like? We're conditioned to be wary of them. But was he more beautiful and approachable in the garden? After the serpent spoke to Eve, Eve looked at the fruit and saw that it was pleasing to the eye, good for food and desirable for gaining knowledge. Adam was beside her the whole time and he didn't see anything wrong until it was too late.   Adam knew; only Eve was deceived. Yes he was there with her and he "knowingly" made that choice and is held responsible. It is "By one man that sin entered the world"   They didn't learn fear, shame and caution until after. We're post-fall so we know to be wary of Satan's voice. And also we've been told that he is skilled in deception. If you've watched magicians at work or listened to condo salesmen, you know that the best of us can be fooled some of the time.   We are raised with the voice of the enemy and in His system. It is the Lord's way we must learn and His voice we must be trained to hear.    What is the tree of life IYO and where does one find it since mankind has been driven from the garden?   It is Jesus Christ. One of his great "I Am" statements in John is that he is the bread of life. John also spoke of his as "eternal life". When we have him, we have life and we have it in abundance.   So how do we eat of this "bread" - is it as tradition teaches - the wafer that a priest transforms during the Mass?   What if it's the old flesh nature that we are supposed to have reckoned dead trying to come alive again that is shouting Nooooooooo?  The demons are always working on trying to raise that up again.    Then it must be dealt with. Suppression and denial is like trying to keep balloons under water. It's far simpler to just prick them. A lot of people like to tell us that our emotions do not matter. They believe that if we know truth, then we will feel the right way. That's simply not true. We should not follow our emotions but our emotions do tells us when something is wrong. But we're not very good at understanding what our emotions are saying and so can be mislead. Suppose someone is depressed and has suicidal thoughts. Telling him that suicide will send him to hell may help a little. Telling him that God loves him and he should not feel this way may help a little. So would changing his brain chemistry with medication. But shouldn't we also try to figure out why he feels the way he does?    That would depend on whether or not we believe that we can offer more than the "world" out there.    Why would one assume that Terry or any of those who are not into the "Christ event" would be ignoring these things which is in effect staying in the prison house of unforgiveness with that strongman in charge as though the Holy Spirit were mute.    We speak convincingly of what we have experienced. Those who have been forgiven much can speak convincingly about forgiveness. Those who have been loved extravagantly can speak convincingly about extravagant love.   So does this put Terry on the "negative" side.  Have you read his testimony?   What do you call "striving to enter His rest" Caroline - and how does one accomplish this?  Those who perished in the wilderness didn't make it did they?  How can we be sure that our outcome is different?  Don't forget that this warning is in the New Testament and was written  - after the "Christ event".....   How indeed? If you reread Hebrews 4, it is saying that God has offered us rest but some will rebel against it and refuse to enter. The writer's advice to us is not to harden our hearts when we hear God's voice telling us to enter. It is by faith that we enter his rest. We don't earn the right to come in as if we're co-saviours. The invitation is open.   Read again .. It is by obedience that we enter His rest and this is why the "striving".  Our old flesh does not like this at all. We love to do our own thing and have our ticket to heaven punched by holding to some grand theology that will get us in. The ppl who died in the wilderness died because they grumbled, complained, and were disatisfied with God's provision. Today we have the same thing going on only we are deceived enough to believe we can have the world and heaven too.