Joe, GET A LIFE.

We're pickies, we don't need to understand XML, or whatever,
so long as
we can do what's required of us. Yeah, we could learn XML,
if required.
I guarantee I could write a proggie to do just about
anything, interface
with anything, natively "bond" with any database... With
Pick-style
products.

Yes, Oracle can do things fast - only it takes yonks to
develop, has to
live within limitations, costs a bomb, requires big process
power.

Hell, even AS400 can do things, that's why they were built.

It's just that mine can do ANY thing, no limitations, very
little
processing power (R83 on a single 286), costs? What costs?

-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Behalf Of Joe Eugene
Sent: 29 March 2004 06:27
To: U2 Users Discussion List
Subject: RE: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing



We have UV doing everything on the BackEnd, we also have
MSSQL Server to
Support Data Warehousing... Why 2 Databases Systems?
Cause UV Cant support Data Warehousing?
Doesn't this eventually introduce Disparate Systems?

> U2, for example, has support for Java connectivity, XML,
and I believe

> they either have or are working on Web Services support

Its funny you say the above, UV/PICK Guys in our Team didn't
even
understand the basics of XML.. leave alone XPath, XQuery
etc. These
Technologies are NATIVELY Supported in ORACLE/DB2 Etc.

e.g. We pull XML Reports from our Vendors Real Time. I have
to parse
through the XML and give UV/PICK Guys a FLAT TEXT File...
cause either
UV Cannot handle the storage and Retrival of XML Data Using
XPath/XQuery
Techniques.

Yes, we use DataStage to pull data out of UV Into MSSQL
SERVER... For
what? Why cant UV handle of the DB Job?

As for Performance...UV Does NOT Perform Well in a OLTP
Environment,
SIMPLE:
IF UV did Perform Well...Today's Fortune 500 would depend on
UV and
UV/PICK would have been in the TOP 3 OF DataBases.

Joe Eugene





> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On
> Behalf Of David T. Meeks
> Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 9:37 AM
> To: U2 Users Discussion List
> Subject: RE: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
>
> While one could make the argument that Pick has not
embraced emerging
> technologies as rapidly as the 'Big Three', it HAS done
so.
>
> U2, for example, has support for Java connectivity, XML,
and I believe

> they either have or are working on Web Services support (I
know, for
example,
> that
> the DSEngine in DataStage has support for Web Services).
>
> One could argue the need or purpose of supporting certain
technologies,
> and
> the level of support currently within the products, but to
say that
there
> is
> "little/no" support is a bit uninformed.
>
> The U2 products ARE supported in certain "Integration"
software.  I
> wouldn't typically consider SAP/PeopleSoft "integration"
software.
> They are Enterprise
> Software Suites, but not geared particularly at
'integration'.
>
> However, given that SAP and PeopleSoft OEM the DataStage
product sets
> for both of their "integration" products (SAP's BW,
PeopleSoft's EPM,
> JDEdwards stuff as well), and given DataStage works very
well with
both U2
> products, this point is actually wrong.  People who have
SAP or
PeopleSoft
> solutions CAN, very easily, integrate their U2 data
to/from those
> environments.
>
> As to 'efficiency', one can measure that in a variety of
different
> dimensions.  From a memory/disk
space/footprint/administrative
> overhead
dimensions,
> the
> U2 database products are VERY efficient.
>
> Finally, as to being "slow", again this depends on the
measurement
> criteria being used.  From the perspective of concurrent
user access
> and the performance
> of application style DB usage (largely input/output,
multiple
concurrent
> users, etc..),
> the U2 products stand up very well to the mainstream guys.
For
support of
> VLDB,
> highly transactional query-based usage models, and the
like, it does
not.
>
> Trying to make the U2 products into what they are not is
wrong.  They
are
> not the
> panacea for every database requirement.  However, for
certain
problems,
> especially
> those for which it was designed (embedded database for
application
> development), it is very efficient.
>
> Dave
>
> At 10:24 PM 3/28/2004 -0500, you wrote:
> >PICK is LEGACY Technology and does NOT Support alot of
advanced level

> >computing we have today. I belive PICK is Similiar to
Legacy
DB2
> >that used ISAM type of DataBases Access. Even IBM has
moved DB2 (Now
UDB)
> >to a completly relational architecture.
> >
> >I belive some of the below are good reasons to Migrate to
MainStream
> >(Top 3 - DB2/Oracle/MSSQL etc) Databases.
> >
> >1. UV has Little/NO support for Emerging
Technologies(XML/XQuery/XSLT/WML
> etc)
> >2. UV is Not supported in Most Integration Enterprise
Software
> >(SAP/PeopleSoft)
> >3. UV is Not efficient compared to highly evolved
databases(DB2/Oracle)
> >4. UV Folks seem to use PICK, which is Not Compatible
with many of
> >    of the Current Advanced Technologies and Techniques.
> >5. UV is very SLOW, TOO Procedural and Not the right tool
for
> >     an OLTP Environment.
> >
> >It would be nice if IBM provided a Package to convert all
UV Stuff to

> >IBM DB2 and perhaps provide some kinda code converter to
convert all
> >pick stuff to DB2 Stored Procs or Java Native Compiled
Procedures.
> >I belive this would be ideal and would help corportations
intergrate
> >systems easily.
> >
> >Joe Eugene
> >
> >
> >
> >________________________________
> >
> >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] on behalf of Phil
Walker
> >Sent: Sun 3/28/2004 7:59 PM
> >To: U2 Users Discussion List
> >Subject: RE: The lists are closing
> >
> >
> >
> >David,
> >
> >As the list is closing this is probably not off topic -
so I will
> comment.
> >
> >I believe PICK has been around since the mid to late
1960's, whereas
> Oracle
> >and the SQL relation model has been around only since the
mid to late
> 1970's
> >early 1980's if you are talking about Oracle etc.
> >
> >I may be wrong.
> >
> >Phil Walker
> >+64 21 336294
> >[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >infocusp limited
> >\\ PO Box 77032, Auckland New Zealand \
www.infocusp.co.nz
> >DISCLAIMER:  This electronic message together with any
attachments is

> >confidential.  If you are not the intended recipient, do
not copy,
> disclose
> >or use the contents in any way. Please also advise us by
return
e-mail
> that
> >you have received the message and then please destroy.
infocusp
limited
> is
> >not responsible for any changes made to this message and
/ or any
> >attachments after sending by infocusp limited. We use
virus scanning
> >software but exclude all liability for viruses or
anything similar in
> this
> >email or any attachment
> >
> >-----Original Message-----
> >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >Behalf Of Logan, David (SST - Adelaide)
> >Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 12:36 PM
> >To: U2 Users Discussion List
> >Subject: RE: The lists are closing
> >
> >Best of luck Jeff, however I will point out the obvious,
what is your

> >definition of modern? I would have thought the good old
"relational
> >databases" have been around since before pick anyway? 8-)
> >
> >Regards
> >
> >David Logan
> >Database Administrator
> >HP Managed Services
> >139 Frome Street,
> >Adelaide 5000
> >Australia
> >
> >+61 8 8408 4273
> >+61 417 268 665
> >
> >
> >
> >-----Original Message-----
> >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >On Behalf Of Jeff Ritchie
> >Sent: Monday, 29 March 2004 8:03 AM
> >To: U2 Users Discussion List
> >Subject: RE: The lists are closing
> >
> >
> >Thanks for the memories Cliff :)
> >
> >Sorry to hear the lists are closing, but what the heck
time and tide,

> >work committments etc.
> >
> >As some one who is shortly to be ex mv, and moving into
the more
modern
> >technologies l will decline the offer to join, but wish
the site all
the
> >best.
> >
> >Cheers,
> >Jeff
> >
> >-----Original Message-----
> >From: Moderator [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >Sent: Saturday, 27 March 2004 7:14 PM
> >To: U2 Users Discussion List; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >Subject: The lists are closing
> >
> >
> >Dear Friends:
> >
> >After 10+ years of either hosting or supporting the
info-prime,
> >info-unidata, info-vmark, info-informix, and u2-users etc
lists, I
have
> >decided to shut down the list server.
> >
> >u2-users and u2-community will cease to exist as of 1
April 2004. IBM
is
> >
> >officially supporting the efforts of the new U2UG.org
group. (Yes. I
am
> >a member of the establishing Board of that group. So this
is not a
> >"coup" or Sour Grapes!) If you check out the forums that
have been
set
> >up, I think you will will see that they cover everything
anyone has
> >asked for over the years in this group.
> >
> >I *really* want to encourage ALL of you to come over the
the
> >www.u2ug.org site and support this effort. This is
*exactly* what
many
> >of you on this list have wanted over the years. If Not
Now, When?
> >
> >Almost ten years on my Watch. How many years before that
on Mike
> >O'Rear's Watch? In the Net World, this has been a Hell of
a good run.
(I
> >
> >just couldn't resist tripping the Net Nanny filters one
last time
<very
> >evil grin>)
> >
> >I'll see all of you on the other media, ok?
> >
> >--
> >
> >Regards,
> >
> >Clif
> >
> >~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> >W. Clifton Oliver, CCP
> >CLIFTON OLIVER & ASSOCIATES
> >Tel: +1 619 460 5678    Web: www.oliver.com
> >~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> >
> >--
> >u2-users mailing list
> >[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
> >--
> >u2-users mailing list
> >[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
> >--
> >u2-users mailing list
> >[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
> >
> >
> >--
> >u2-users mailing list
> >[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
> >
> >
> >
> >--
> >u2-users mailing list
> >[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
>
>
============================================================
============
> David T. Meeks                     || "All my life I'm
taken by
surprise
> Architect, Technology Office       || I'm someone's waste
of time
> Ascential Software                 ||  Now I walk a
balanced line
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]   ||  and step into
tomorrow" - IQ
>
============================================================
============
> --
> u2-users mailing list
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