Hi Jean-Sebastien,
"Final note : If there was unlimited time I would use only Realsoft because
everything is there. And I have to admit that the render quality is the
best. Realsoft is the only software with that much potential right of the
box."
Yip - again - thoroughly agree.
A Question - seeming you use MESSIAH - Would it be a good partner app with
Realsoft, particularly to take care of the Character Animation? Once you
have all your Models done with RS and Shade etc, is Messiah the app you use
to composite the lot and final render? From RS to Messiah is it OBJ? How
much would it help if you had a full import / export tie in with Realsoft
from / to Messiah - mesh, bones, the lot?
Cheers
Aidan
At 17:14 05/05/2006, you wrote:
I should not have said that, because I have never used RS Profesionaly.
In fact since I bought it 2 years ago. I never really used it. Only for SDS
modeling.
In my opinion it's not the feature the problem, it's the fact that everytime
you want to do something with it, you nedd to read 20 pages of the manual
and you have to do many test before it actually work.
And most of the functions already there are not working properly : Bones and
IK, Views are hard to configure, Loading and saving a scene is difficult,
Displacement mapping is too slow, UV mapping is really difficult etc.
I found trought the years that all 3D app really sucks.
There is no exception.
So this is my current workflow :
-Model SDS with Realsoft www.realsoft.com
-Model everything else with Shade8 www.e-frontier.com
-Do the UV mapping with UVMapperPro http://www.uvmapper.com/
-Use Gimp for the texture
-Vue4 and VistaPro for landscapes and trees
-Everything is rendered and animated with ProjectMessiahWorkstation
www.projectmessiah.com
What a waist of time and money, but it pays (even with all this messy
conversion It is faster like that).
I can't use Realsoft for photorealistic project because there is no "one
click everything is perfect (fast and beatiful)" GI solution within
Realsoft.
As for character animation Realsoft IK is really weird, It dosen't react as
supposed to.
And when you try to animate a character with RS : every time you move a bone
you risk destroying your object, pose and animation.
To make Realsoft a viable complete sofware it is simple :
-Make the current feature work. (make the basic function work)
-Stop making too many useless WOW features.
-Improve the UI and workflow
-And finally implement a easy to use and fast GI solution (MontéCarlo with
blur for example)
-Easy to use material editor (node or else)
-And my final wish : a user interface that is like any other application ->
ready to use from the start.
Time is money.
Final note : If there was unlimited time I would use only Realsoft because
everything is there. And I have to admit that the render quality is the
best. Realsoft is the only sofware with that much potential right of the
box. Even If I don't fully use it (I never tried the version 5.5 yet (only 3
houres)) But I will buy the next version. Because I believe in Realsoft.
Faith and I like to think that Realsoft has and is still pionnering 3DCG.
So if you stay close to realsoft you stay close to the latest technology and
new innovations.
Jean-Sebastien Perron
www.neuroworld.ca
-----Message d'origine-----
De : [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] De la part de Aidan O Driscoll
Envoyé : Friday, May 05, 2006 10:52 AM
À : [email protected]
Objet : Re: Realsoft Character Animation - Has RS been outstripped by
BLENDER ..
Hi Jason and lads,
Yes Jason - I concur with all you have said. It would indeed be lovely to
have infinite hours to sit down and more or less stop motion a character
anim in RS, but that is a luxury not too many of us have. The foot slippage
and the constructor objects [ drag etc ] are a big problem - not working
properly. A characters reaction to the environment. Knees bend NO the feet
should not go through the floor. Yes, you could key frame this problem OUT,
but time is the issue once more and frustration.
I still say that alot of this Char Anim stuff could be resolved in the
short term by having better Import/Export to/from other apps. For example
out and back from Motionbuilder via FBX OR the same with Project MESSIAH.
The latter would be better now as it is at a good price point $299. Since
Autodesk took over Alias - MB Standard is gone and MB Pro is now £2000 or
so.
BUT - I am told that RS wants to be an all in one - one stop shop type app
with no dependence on outside 3rd party apps. Interesting philosophy and
much praise for same. But a philosophy that could have people waiting for
features for a long time. Good import / export would help big time AND also
attract more users as they come to RS from those other niche apps like
Messiah and Zbrush and .....
An RS / Messiah bundle - Messiah as a plugin - at a good price point. Why
not?
Another point discussed at the IRC relevant to this topic is RS'es I/O for
gaming/modding or lack of - indeed a topic close to some peoples hearts I
would say. Look at Caligari - they went and created a Game Version of there
Truespace app and called it Gamespace. Good Marketing? Also Softimage have
a free version of XSI for gamers to use for modding.
I have no doubt that as RS moves on all these things will be featured AND
RS will be a top one stop app, but for the moment is their any harm in
having it talk a bit better to the outside world by way of improved import
/ export?
Anyways,
Keep this topic going, Interesting
Cheers
Aidan
At 15:08 05/05/2006, you wrote:
>3d has not made us lazy, because you are comparing a production workflow to
>stop frame animation without considering evolution. You cannot compare the
>two as they are completely different approaches with completely different
>results.
>
>Yes you are right in that if time was infinite, we could indeed create most
>things with R3d, however the world is moving on and when there are other 3D
>apps making, for example, animating characters more easily, we will of
>course levitate to those apps.
>
>If you are a hobbyist, then this is of less concern more a frustration, but
>if you have to make a living and your client wants it yesterday you are
>going to need a more productive workflow if there is one available.
>
>For example try and make a convincing walk cycle with realsoft. You can do
>it two ways. key frame posing or morphing hierarchal skeleton targets.
>While a basic cycle can be achieved relatively quickly, it will not be good
>enough without further tweaking to time the foot to floor motions
correctly.
>Currently with either system, too many in-between key frames have to be
>created to prevent slippage and floor penetration. Even using the
>constructor objects does not work correctly. Ok now make your human
>skeleton do a somersault..try it and you will see what I mean... its hard
>and frustrating, simple as that.
>
>Stop frame animation has its simple limitations which are expected from the
>outset, but 3D has had many developments that give us tools to create and
>animate in intuitive methods. There is a feeling amongst many that the
>Realsoft tools need an update to keep in line with what the rest of the
>industry is doing.
>
>Hopefully v6 will address a lot of these issues, but until we get a list of
>the new tools, we will just have to wait.
>
>Regards
>
>Jason
>
>
>
>
>
>Jean-Seastien Perron wrote :
>
>
> > Can it be made with RS... of course yes.
> >
> > Final Fantasy The movie could have been made with povray (text editor)
> > alone.
> >
> > It'not about the sofware, It's never been. It's about the guy behind the
> > computer (or the software).
> >
> > If the animation system is not good enough, do it frame by frame.
> > You can model anything with a point by point technique.
> > Basic morph and Basic bones (or not) can give a great result.
> >
> > The feature of a software should never be a problem.
> > Animate clothing by hand if you need to, do particles by hand, do physic
>by
> > hand.
> > I think that 3D CG has made us LAZY.
> > Compare to what classic animation studio could do with only pen/paper
and
>a
> > camera.
> > Compare to what has been done with stop motion.
> >
> > I think Realsoft is packed with so much features
> > That the user reflex is always to think if there is an button that will
do
> > it automaticly.
> >
> > In my experience, the time it takes to find out how a feature works, it
is
> > the time it takes to do it manually.
> >
> > Jean-Sebastien Perron
> > www.neuroworld.ca
> >
> >
> > -----Message d'origine-----
> > De : [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] De la part de Wolfram Schwenzer
> > Envoyé : Thursday, May 04, 2006 6:16 PM
> > À : [email protected]
> > Objet : Re: Realsoft Character Animation - Has RS been outstripped by
> > BLENDER ..
> >
> > Aidan O Driscoll wrote:
> > > Hi Guys,
> > >
> > > I have been keeping an eye on the following:
> > >
> > > http://orange.blender.org/
> > >
> > > This is a full 3D Movie called "Elephant Dreams" made completely in
> > > BLENDER. It is now complete [ 7 months or so ] and has been shown in
> > > Theatres already. It is now available under the Creative Commons
license
> > > as a Double DVD including all the Models and Scenes for anyone to
remake
> > > the movie differently.
> > >
> > > SO - to make such a movie - Has Blender now out stripped Realsoft for
> > > Animation and Character Animation? As can be seen the film has a
number
> > > of complete animated Characters.
> > Yeah, but not only in the character anim area but also in the game
> > business:
> > there's a toolkit & some (very basic) examples on a CD delivered with a
> > book
> > showing some tricks of the trade. Members of this mailing list who
> > complained
> > 'bout missing support of these features in Realsoft should have a look
> > at the blender internet pages. Blender also features Python scripting
> > (which IMHO is superior to the Javascript support of Realsoft) and VRML
> > export (do you listen Arjo ?) though only for Version 1.0. (but you
> > don't have to pay for that ;-) ....)
> >
> > Wolfram
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
