It is really interesting to follow all the different views and for me personally, there are seveal aspects that seems to ring true. They are:
1. While I think Carol has a point in pointing out the gender specific word "Master", there are several thoughts I have I would like to share: On Mon, Jul 26, 2010 at 9:21 AM, Sebastian Panakal < [email protected]> wrote: > I am watching the variety of ideas, interesting discussions and the > enjoying thrill of being in WE community. Let there be more. I have not made > up my mind yet... > > > On Mon, Jul 26, 2010 at 4:26 PM, Randy Fisher <[email protected]> wrote: > >> Hi All, >> >> I am pleased to see the diversity and breadth of discussion - and many new >> voices. >> >> It is a credit to our mutual efforts, that WikiEducator and OER are >> reaching more and more people, and providing opportunities for substantive >> discourse and content creation, and sharing. >> >> Bravo! >> >> - Randy >> >> >> On Mon, Jul 26, 2010 at 5:15 AM, minh mcCloy <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> *I have often used the criteria of novice, apprentice, journeyman, >>> master with k-6 kids in the context of skill acquisition. Not once has >>> either the master or journeyMAN been an issue with the kids- they don't see >>> it. Sometimes however a visiting adult will impose their acquired prejudice >>> on the kids & insist on discussing/commenting on the practice. It induces a >>> lot of shrugging in the kids as the attempt to see what issue is there.* >>> * >>> * >>> *It is my feminism that makes me want claim words that are useful or >>> stylish or quaint or incongruous for general use. On the other hand I have a >>> real fondness for the word aviatrix - so singular, so little opportunity to >>> use it. But if I could aviate I think I would call myself an aviatrix :D - & >>> thus declare my mastery of the skies - me & Amelia Erheart.* >>> * >>> * >>> *:)* >>> *minh >>> * >>> >>> On Mon, Jul 26, 2010 at 6:45 PM, MALLAMIBRO <[email protected]>wrote: >>> >>>> Hi All, >>>> With due respect to all the female members of WE, i feel the >>>> WikiMaster conveys the intended meaning for that level of attainment. >>>> Ibrahim Oyekanmi >>>> >>>> On 7/25/10, Wayne Mackintosh <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> > Hi Carol, >>>> > >>>> > Yes, -- the way we do this is in WikiEducator is through the process >>>> of a >>>> > "Community Workgroup" --- There is a policy which guides the >>>> establishment >>>> > of workgroups and the procedures for decisions which have a community >>>> wide >>>> > impact. >>>> > >>>> > See: >>>> http://wikieducator.org/Workgroup:WikiEducator_Workgroups/Guidelines >>>> > >>>> > Clearly there is community interest relating to the nomenclature of >>>> the >>>> > WIkimaster typology and given that there is already an existing >>>> workgroup, >>>> > this would be the best vehicle to take a community decision and plan >>>> for the >>>> > implementation. Work would be done transparently in the wiki with >>>> regular >>>> > updates on the community list. In this way -- anyone with a >>>> substantive >>>> > interest in the topic will be free to add their views and help shape >>>> and >>>> > implement any decisions which are taken. >>>> > >>>> > This is an issue falling within the ambit of an "operational >>>> guideline" and >>>> > would not require "approval" from Council to be implemented -- which >>>> is the >>>> > reason Council approved the policy for workgroups - -that is a process >>>> for >>>> > the community to take decisions. >>>> > >>>> > Next step is to get the nomenclature question into the charter for >>>> this >>>> > workgroup and move forward. >>>> > >>>> > Cheers >>>> > Wayne >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > On 26 July 2010 12:14, Carol <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> > >>>> >> Interesting discussion. Is there any way Wayne to put this out to the >>>> >> whole WikiEducator community so we get a wide range of views? >>>> >> >>>> >> Cheers Carol >>>> >> >>>> >> On Jul 26, 5:17 am, Alison Snieckus <[email protected]> >>>> wrote: >>>> >> > Hi all, >>>> >> > >>>> >> > I'm OK with the nomenclature as is. As Jan and others have >>>> indicated, by >>>> >> > using the term "master" as we do, even recognizing that our intent >>>> >> > refers >>>> >> to >>>> >> > the idea of mastery, we continue the process of changing its >>>> meaning to >>>> >> > include women. I like the idea of "reclaiming" language to suit our >>>> >> current >>>> >> > needs. As far as I can tell, there are no identified "wikimasters". >>>> >> > >>>> >> > It is more important to me that both men and women are sufficiently >>>> >> > represented in the upper certification levels. >>>> >> > >>>> >> > I added a note with a link to this discussion on the >>>> >> > Workgroup:Wikimaster_criteria< >>>> >> http://wikieducator.org/Workgroup:Wikimaster_criteria>page >>>> >> > on WE. >>>> >> > >>>> >> > Good discussion, >>>> >> > Alisonhttp://wikieducator.org/User:ASnieckus >>>> >> > >>>> >> > 2010/7/25 ESPHIT Andrés Aurelio Alarcón Tique <[email protected]> >>>> >> > >>>> >> > > Hellow every body >>>> >> > > I have also the feeling that there is no matters than affect >>>> people >>>> >> using >>>> >> > > generic names regarding our genders, some of name come from >>>> history >>>> >> > > and >>>> >> > > customes >>>> >> > > In spanish there names had been lateley reformed to be also >>>> female, >>>> >> > > but >>>> >> > > they don´t sounds good I´ll prefer the used name. in english is >>>> easy >>>> >> > > to >>>> >> use >>>> >> > > generic names without think in genders >>>> >> > >>>> >> > > Best Regards >>>> >> > > Andres Aurelio >>>> >> > >>>> >> > > 2010/7/25 Jan Visser <[email protected]> >>>> >> > >>>> >> > > Hi Minh and Carol, >>>> >> > >>>> >> > >> Yes, Minh, that’s exactly my point. It’s by using the terms >>>> across >>>> >> > >> the >>>> >> > >> genders that those connotations start changing. Terms like >>>> director, >>>> >> > >> minister, secretary, doctor, nurse, president, engineer, farmer, >>>> >> > >> entrepreneur, author, technician and many more are used across >>>> the >>>> >> genders. >>>> >> > >> In my own culture of origin there are male midwives who refuse >>>> to be >>>> >> called >>>> >> > >> anything but midwife (because of the nice ring – the Dutch >>>> >> > >> translation >>>> >> of >>>> >> > >> midwife connotes wisdom) even though a perfectly acceptable >>>> gender >>>> >> neutral >>>> >> > >> term also exists. In the past such terms as the ones cited may >>>> have >>>> >> had >>>> >> > >> strong gender connotations, but the more we progress beyond the >>>> >> divisions of >>>> >> > >> the past, the more those terms lose those connoted irrelevant >>>> >> meanings. We >>>> >> > >> are now way beyond the Middle Ages, a period in the history of >>>> Europe >>>> >> that >>>> >> > >> wasn’t as bad as often depicted. As we and our communities and >>>> >> societies >>>> >> > >> evolve throughout the ages, so do our languages. Flexibility is >>>> what >>>> >> allows >>>> >> > >> it to happen. >>>> >> > >>>> >> > >> Jan >>>> >> > >>>> >> > >> ------------------------------ >>>> >> > >>>> >> > >> *From:* [email protected] [mailto: >>>> >> > >> [email protected]] *On Behalf Of *minh mcCloy >>>> >> > >> *Sent:* Sunday, July 25, 2010 12:54 PM >>>> >> > >> *To:* [email protected] >>>> >> > >> *Subject:* Re: [WikiEducator] Re: Nomenclature for WikiMaster >>>> >> > >>>> >> > >> *Why can't master be rounded up & be just gently morphed into a >>>> word >>>> >> > >> that connotes any & all genders. English does meaning shifts all >>>> the >>>> >> time to >>>> >> > >> - it is part of its power & delight.* >>>> >> > >>>> >> > >> *Why abandon 'master' to a gendered ghetto? What will you do >>>> with >>>> >> > >> 'masterpiece" -gurupiece, superpersonpiece?* >>>> >> > >>>> >> > >> *We could embrace 'master' exhibit flexibility.* >>>> >> > >>>> >> > >> *wikimaster has a nice ring to it* >>>> >> > >>>> >> > >> *:) >>>> >> > >> minh* >>>> >> > >>>> >> > >> On Sun, Jul 25, 2010 at 8:27 PM, Carol < >>>> [email protected]> >>>> >> > >> wrote: >>>> >> > >>>> >> > >> Hi Jan >>>> >> > >>>> >> > >> Interesting that you raise the issue that a woman could take >>>> over on >>>> >> > >> the death of her husband. Not of any consolation for those not >>>> >> > >> wishing >>>> >> > >> to be married who who might have liked to be a member of the >>>> guild in >>>> >> > >> their own right not as a replacement for a dead husband. Pls >>>> don't >>>> >> > >> think I am having a go just wanting to add to the debate here. >>>> >> > >>>> >> > >> There have been many feminists myself amongst them who would >>>> have >>>> >> > >> willingly been awarded something other than Master for a degree, >>>> but >>>> >> > >> fighting academia is almost impossible in these matters. Heck I >>>> >> > >> couldn't even submit my thesis on CD back in 1999, now of course >>>> they >>>> >> > >> are digitising everything :) The irony is not lost on me. I hope >>>> one >>>> >> > >> day my female colleague will be able to be awarded something not >>>> >> > >> entitled Master. >>>> >> > >>>> >> > >> Everyone - What other terms are there we could use? I am sure my >>>> list >>>> >> > >> of suggestions is only the tip of the iceberg. >>>> >> > >>>> >> > >> Carol >>>> >> > >>>> >> > >> -- >>>> >> > >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the >>>> Google >>>> >> > >> Groups "WikiEducator" group. >>>> >> > >> To visit wikieducator:http://www.wikieducator.org >>>> >> > >> To visit the discussion forum: >>>> >> > >>http://groups.google.com/group/wikieducator >>>> >> > >> To post to this group, send email to >>>> [email protected] >>>> >> > >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>> >> > >> [email protected] >>>> >> > >>>> >> > >> -- >>>> >> > >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the >>>> Google >>>> >> > >> Groups "WikiEducator" group. >>>> >> > >> To visit wikieducator:http://www.wikieducator.org >>>> >> > >> To visit the discussion forum: >>>> >> > >>http://groups.google.com/group/wikieducator >>>> >> > >> To post to this group, send email to >>>> [email protected] >>>> >> > >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>> >> > >> [email protected] >>>> >> > >>>> >> > >> -- >>>> >> > >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the >>>> Google >>>> >> > >> Groups "WikiEducator" group. >>>> >> > >> To visit wikieducator:http://www.wikieducator.org >>>> >> > >> To visit the discussion forum: >>>> >> > >>http://groups.google.com/group/wikieducator >>>> >> > >> To post to this group, send email to >>>> [email protected] >>>> >> > >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>> >> > >> [email protected] >>>> >> > >>>> >> > > -- >>>> >> > > "Busca solución a requerimientos tecnológicos, ESPHIT, le puede >>>> >> > > ayudar, >>>> >> > > CONSULTENOS" >>>> >> > > ELECTRONIC SERVICES & PRODUCTS OF HIGH TECHNOLOGY >>>> >> > > Consultoría, Soluciónes Llave en Mano >>>> Tecnología-Seguridad-Aprendizaje >>>> >> > > Autonomo >>>> >> > > [email protected], [email protected], [email protected] >>>> >> > > NOTICIA DE CONFIDENCIALIDAD >>>> >> > > Este mensaje contiene información confidencial y se encuentra >>>> >> > > protegido >>>> >> por >>>> >> > > la Ley. 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Si vous n'êtes >>>> pas >>>> >> > > le >>>> >> > > destinataire prévu, vous devriez supprimer ce message. >>>> >> > >>>> >> > > -- >>>> >> > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the >>>> Google >>>> >> > > Groups "WikiEducator" group. >>>> >> > > To visit wikieducator:http://www.wikieducator.org >>>> >> > > To visit the discussion forum: >>>> >> http://groups.google.com/group/wikieducator >>>> >> > > To post to this group, send email to >>>> [email protected] >>>> >> > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>> >> > > [email protected] >>>> >> >>>> >> -- >>>> >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> >> Groups "WikiEducator" group. >>>> >> To visit wikieducator: http://www.wikieducator.org >>>> >> To visit the discussion forum: >>>> http://groups.google.com/group/wikieducator >>>> >> To post to this group, send email to [email protected] >>>> >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>> >> [email protected] >>>> >> >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > -- >>>> > Wayne Mackintosh, Ph.D. >>>> > Director OER Foundation: www.oerfoundation.org >>>> > Director, International Centre for Open Education, >>>> > Otago Polytechnic, New Zealand. >>>> > Founder and Community Council Member, Wikieducator, >>>> www.wikieducator.org >>>> > Mobile +64 21 2436 380 >>>> > User Page: http://wikieducator.org/User:Mackiwg >>>> > Skype: WGMNZ1 >>>> > Twitter: OERFoundation, Mackiwg >>>> > >>>> > -- >>>> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> > Groups "WikiEducator" group. >>>> > To visit wikieducator: http://www.wikieducator.org >>>> > To visit the discussion forum: >>>> http://groups.google.com/group/wikieducator >>>> > To post to this group, send email to [email protected] >>>> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>> > [email protected] >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Chief Executive Officer, >>>> Mallamibro Information Technology Academy >>>> P O Box 13145 >>>> Kano G P O, Kano State, >>>> Nigeria >>>> Tel: +234-808-227-7575; +234-702-581-8401 >>>> Homepage: http://www.mallamibro.webs.com >>>> Wikieducator Page: http://www.wikieducator.org/User:Mallamibro >>>> Email: [email protected] >>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "WikiEducator" group. >>>> To visit wikieducator: http://www.wikieducator.org >>>> To visit the discussion forum: >>>> http://groups.google.com/group/wikieducator >>>> To post to this group, send email to [email protected] >>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>> [email protected] >>>> >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "WikiEducator" group. >>> To visit wikieducator: http://www.wikieducator.org >>> To visit the discussion forum: >>> http://groups.google.com/group/wikieducator >>> To post to this group, send email to [email protected] >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> [email protected] >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> ________________ >> Randy Fisher, MA, OMD >> Senior Consultant, OD/Change Management, E-Learning, Collaboration & >> Performance >> Intersol Group, Canada >> >> Senior Consultant, Organization & Capacity Development >> International Centre for Open Education / OER Foundation, New Zealand >> >> Elected Member, WikiEducator Community Council, www.wikieducator.org >> +1 613.722.5577 (EST) >> Skype: wikirandy >> >> >> - Stakeholder/Community Engagement & Project Implementation >> - Change & Transition Management >> - E-Learning, Online Collaboration & Learning Communities >> - Coaching & Facilitation >> - My Bio: http://www.communitybuildingexpert.com >> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >> Groups "WikiEducator" group. >> To visit wikieducator: http://www.wikieducator.org >> To visit the discussion forum: >> http://groups.google.com/group/wikieducator >> To post to this group, send email to [email protected] >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> [email protected] >> > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups "WikiEducator" group. > To visit wikieducator: http://www.wikieducator.org > To visit the discussion forum: http://groups.google.com/group/wikieducator > To post to this group, send email to [email protected] > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > [email protected] > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "WikiEducator" group. 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