yes KG...well said... to thy self be true...merle
At least as many interpretations as there are interpreters!
There is another interpretation that understands the more ancient
meanings of/associations with symbols of the 'cross', a 'death'
upon it, lying in a 'cave', a 'rebirth' or 'resurrection' and such
- that is in harmony/complimentary with Buddha's story/teachings
on awakening.
Religious teachings are rarely written on one level/in one voice.
More often they are anagogic - intended to speak differently to
different people as they are able to hear. Practically/Rationally,
Metaphorically/Mystically, Revelatory/as living realization - this
allow all the voices to be heard as one.
If you have ever re-read something and seen a new meaning or
something profound in it you had not in the past, you have
experienced how this operates. This itself an insight into mind
that sees it so, revealed to be seeing it so. There is a lot of
this in Zen writings (and much humor too - appearing to operate on
similarly different levels - some not immediately obvious or funny
to all), though many Zen expressions appear so simple it is
perhaps even easier to miss than when wrapped in complex allegory.
An amazing thing this sort of expression, written or spoken,
though for some that sort of harmonic voice is their only true
voice. Always more than meets the eye and ear.
When in doubt (and more so if you feel certain), have an 'all of
the above' openness without attaching to any particular
interpretation. No need to believe or disbelieve. Just look for
yourself. Receiving and remembering stories, recognizing them as
stories, realizing all as aspects of this experiencing...
KG
On 9/11/2012 12:56 PM, William Rintala wrote:
>As I understand it Bill! there are at least 2 extremely different
>interpretations of Christ and his cross. Catholacism saiys that Christ
>suffered and died on the cros for our sins. Their image of Christ has him
>nailed to the cross. I was raised as a Lutheran/ Protestant and they don't
>say that. What we were taught was that Christ died and was buried. He rose
>from the dead 3 days later and ascended into heaven as proof that all who
>believe in him will have everlasting life. Their image is of an empty cross
>and their call at Easter is "Christ has risen" to which the appropriate
>response is "He has risen indeed".
>
Bill
>
>
>
>
>Find what makes your heart sing…and do it!
>
>
>
>
>
>________________________________
> From: Bill! <[email protected]>
>To: [email protected]
>Sent: Tue, September 11, 2012 5:14:51 AM
>Subject: Re: [Zen] He Who Is Without Sin...
>
>
>Merle,
>
>Play 'Drop the Biblical Quote and Then Run Away
and Hide'.
>
>My question to you was "According to
Christianity what was the 'purpose' or
'achievement' of Jesus' life (and death)?"
>
>I'll give you a hint. It has to do with 'sin'.
>
>Tag! You're it! ...Bill!
>
>--- In [email protected], Merle Lester <merlewiitpom@...> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> Â play what.?..i did not know it was a
game...merle
>>
>>
>> Â
>> Merle,
>>
>> Was that an answer to my question, or just
a 'I don't want to play anymore'?
>>
>> ...Bill!
>>
>> --- In [email protected], Merle Lester <merlewiitpom@> wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >  hail mary!...merle
>> > ÂÂ
>> > Merle,
>> >
>> > Yes! A sinless human.
>> >
>> > I thought you knew something about the
'mental model' of Christianity.
>> > According to Christianity what was the
'purpose' or 'achievement' of Jesus' life (and
death)? That's the whole point of Christianity!
>> >
>> > ...Bill!
>> >
>> > --- In [email protected], Merle Lester <merlewiitpom@> wrote:
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >  jesus bill then you are
a bloody saint!...a sinless human being..lordy
be... what an achievement!..merle
>> > > ÂÂÂ
>> > > Merle,
>> > >
>> > > I never said I was the 'second
Christ'. I said 'I was without sin'. I was YOU
that suggested I was the 'second coming'...
>> > >
>> > > ...Bill!
>> > >
>> > > --- In [email protected], Merle Lester <merlewiitpom@> wrote:
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > ÃÆ'‚ hang on
bill... you said you were the second christ..did
i mis judge you?..merle
>> > > > ÃÆ'‚ÂÂÂ
>> > > > Merle,
>> > > >
>> > > > There is only ONE 'Christ' -
like there is only ONE 'Buddha' and only ONE
'Buddha Nature'.
>> > > >
>> > > > Just FYI...Bill!
>> > > >
>> > > > --- In [email protected], Merle Lester <merlewiitpom@> wrote:
>> > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > > >
ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ well
said KG...is romney thinking he is the second
christ?... merle
>> > > > >
ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ÂÂÂ
>> > > > > We all are "the second
coming of Christ [not of Jesus - but of
"Christ"].ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ÂÂÂ
Teaching point to realization. We all have/are
the potential to realize this - for this to be
realized - all have/are Buddha nature - to
awaken to (call it what you like). That's the
point of the teachings. Otherwise why come to
teach the 'first' time? Applies to equally
Jesus' or Buddha's story.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > The whole 'give a man a
fish/teach a man to fish' schtick.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > Surely you have always
realized this?! *L*
>> > > > >
>> > > > > KG
>> > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > > > On 9/10/2012 8:49 AM,
Merle Lester wrote:
>> > > > >
>> > > > >
ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ÂÂÂ
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >
>> > > > >
>ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ christ
we have found him..bill is the second
coming!...merle
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >
>> > > > >
>ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ÂÂÂ
>> > > > > >Merle,
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >In one of your
posts a long time ago and far,
>> > > > > far away (that means I
couldn't find it) you
>> > > > > castigated me for
stating that Christians and
>> > > > > Muslims did bad things
during the Crusades in
>> > > > > the name of their
religions. You used a quote
>> > > > > of Jesus from the Bible
and I think it was:
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >"Let him who is
without sin among you be the
>> > > > > first to throw a
stone... - John 8:7 (English
>> > > > > Standard Version)
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >I have already
stated in an early post (an
>> > > > > even longer time ago
and further away) that I
>> > > > > considered myself
pretty knowledgeable about
>> > > > > Christianity and very
knowledgeable about the
>> > > > > teaching of Jesus. I
didn't respond to this
>> > > > > part of your post at
that time because I
>> > > > > didn't consider this
quote really relevant to
>> > > > > our discussion, but I
would like to respond
>> > > > > now.
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >I am without sin so
would be eligible to throw
>> > > > > stones if and when the
situation calls for
>> > > > > that.
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >...Bill!
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > >
>> > >
>> >
>>
>
>
