Joe, I thought my response struck a perfect balance between serious and comic! Guess all those years of watching M*A*S*H didn't pay off.
I hear what yor're saying *but* I don't necessarily agree with the idea that being exposed to some truths lessens the impact, or ability, to sudden awakening. Usually when we think we've 'got it' we get our arses kicked by a break thru and the realisation there's a whole lot more (or more accurately, less) to what we previously believed. Mike --- In [email protected], "Joe" <desert_woodworker@...> wrote: > > Mike, > > Now, now. Don't take it too seriously. Or too comically. ;-) > > "Ours is a middle-way". > > And, ...no guilt! > > I find in general that your heart is gilt-edged. > > Like so many here. > > You're right that in this age of publishing and dissemination by so many > means, and co-option and commercialization, much cross-talk and chatter can > lower the signal-to-noise ratio of the orthodox line, before a practitioner > has a "good connection", say with a teacher and sangha. I think it even > happens at Zen centers sometimes. > > In Zen history, though, there's always been an injunction against "Speaking > too plainly" (you can look this up): No one wants to reduce the surprise and > impact of the sudden awakening that awaits a natural dawning in any dedicated > and persistent practitioner. Lots or even a little of philosophical > mechanics and machinations in the head, BY one's head, can even _prevent_ a > natural opening from happening, sometimes. > > I mean, jeez, even movie reviews have "spoiler-alert" taggings. > > The Zen tradition in its "teaching" does not "give much away". The reason is > NOT that it's just not *un-useful*; but, it is harmful. > > Harmful within the natural program of Zen training; in THOSE environs. Of > the Sudden School. > > After awakening, the student can clarify a lot of stuff with the teacher, if > desired, and a lot of this has to do with expression of what has dawned. > That's why and how practice usually changes for folks after awakening. But, > I won't "speak too plainly". > > NOT that there are "SECRETS!", you understand! > > It's just out of respect and compassion that *We do not want to be Spoilers*. > > (sorry to have said too much about this). > > But now, in a forum, we're expected to talk about things. And to read. > > --Joe > > > "mike" <uerusuboyo@> wrote: > > > > Joe, > > > > Well, I guess ignorance of the law is no defence, so guilty as charged. I > > will in partial defence tho say that in this day and age it is unlikely > > that a beginning practioner can be shielded from the plethora of books on > > Zen and other schools of Buddhism. I don't believe that what I said was > > even that heretical and would lead Shepardspie down the wrong path (the > > right path if it leads him to Vipassana) ; ) I am, however, grossly > > negligent in not suggesting he (or she - it's my belief that shepards pies > > are gender neutral) seek out a Zen centre and teacher. I throw myself at > > your mercy, m'lud. > ------------------------------------ Current Book Discussion: any Zen book that you recently have read or are reading! Talk about it today!Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/ <*> Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional <*> To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/join (Yahoo! ID required) <*> To change settings via email: [email protected] [email protected] <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [email protected] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
