Edgar, I know this post is to Mike but it touches on a point I'd like to bring up also.
I don't think you misunderstand what I post and I know you don't agree with many of the things I post, but you often times seem to completely misread or at least misinterpret what I do post. In fact sometimes you seem to attribute things to me that I did not say. And very often you draw conclusions based on what you think I say that are not at all what I believe. Strange, so I just thought I'd mention it. ...Bill! --- In [email protected], Edgar Owen <edgarowen@...> wrote: > > Mike, > > Your understanding of my posts is incorrect. I do not "disparage" authentic > teachers. I say that teachers can be helpful but are not necessary. > > Like Joe you are arguing with the demons in your head, not what I actually > said because you don't understand what I actually said and continue to read > your own meaning into it.... > > That indicates a delusional irrational mind. > > Work on your rational understanding. Right thought is also a necessary part > of realization because without Right Thought you continually live in a world > of delusion as evidence by your failure to understand what I've actually > said. Until that delusion is clarified with right thought there can be no > realization.... > > Edgar > > > On May 20, 2013, at 6:57 AM, Edgar Owen wrote: > > > Mike, > > > > > > At least you remember some of my remarks. Now if you could only understand > > them too! > > :-) > > > > Edgar > > > > > > > > On May 20, 2013, at 3:38 AM, uerusuboyo@... wrote: > > > >> > >> Edgar, > >> > >> It's only a pleasure for you while you interpret what is being said as > >> supporting your theories. As soon as there is a contradiction JM will be > >> just another "comic book" Zen fantasist. Who can forget your previous > >> disparaging remarks regarding teachers and transmission? - things that are > >> obviously at the heart of JM's Ch'an. > >> > >> Mike > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> Sent from Yahoo! Mail for iPad > >> > >> From: Edgar Owen <edgarowen@...>; > >> To: <[email protected]>; > >> Subject: Re: [Zen] Re: What is Enlightenment? > >> Sent: Sun, May 19, 2013 4:15:20 PM > >> > >> > >> JM, > >> > >> > >> Exactly. There is only one reality, and that includes ALL of its > >> manifestations in the various interpretations of various humans. But there > >> is only one universal life force (what I call ontological energy and some > >> call Tao or Buddha Nature), and there is only one true wisdom and that is > >> its realization... > >> > >> It's a pleasure to have a teacher with true understanding back on the > >> group! > >> > >> Edgar > >> > >> > >> > >> On May 19, 2013, at 9:59 AM, 覺å¦ç²¾æ ï¼JMJMï¼ wrote: > >> > >>> > >>> Hi Bill, > >>> > >>> You always insisted that there are differences in zen, Zen, Chan. I can > >>> accept all of that, because all of that is inclusive in Chan. They are > >>> all description of the same one fundamental thing, the universal life > >>> force and wisdom and all of its manifestations. > >>> > >>> JM > >>> > >>> > >>> On 5/19/2013 6:52 AM, Bill! wrote: > >>>> > >>>> JMJM and Edgar, > >>>> > >>>> I don't know about Chan, but zen is a human practice that assists in > >>>> balancing the interplay between Human Nature and Buddha Nature. I went > >>>> on to describe it in more detail in a recent post. > >>>> > >>>> It is not everything. It is a practice. There are human activities that > >>>> are not part of that practice. > >>>> > >>>> ...Bill! > >>>> > >>>> --- In [email protected], Edgar Owen <edgarowen@> wrote: > >>>> > > >>>> > JMJM, > >>>> > > >>>> > That's my understanding too. That's how I use the word though I > >>>> > usually refer to it as Zen. > >>>> > > >>>> > It's not something confined to any sect, temple or teacher though it > >>>> > may be recognized and taught therein. > >>>> > > >>>> > Chan or Zen is just a name for the fundamental reality of the world. > >>>> > But the name is not the reality, it just references the reality... > >>>> > > >>>> > Edgar > >>>> > > >>>> > > >>>> > > >>>> > On May 19, 2013, at 9:08 AM, 覺å¦â¢Ã§Â²Â¾Ã¦ËŽ > >>>> > ï¼ËJMJMï¼Ⱐwrote: > >>>> > > >>>> > > Hi Mike, > >>>> > > > >>>> > > Chan is the absolute and most fundamental dharma. Chan is the > >>>> > > essence of all and everything. > >>>> > > Chan can be expressed with any kind of word or no word at all. > >>>> > > > >>>> > > JM > >>>> > > > >>>> > > On 5/19/2013 1:00 AM, uerusuboyo@ wrote: > >>>> > >> > >>>> > >> Would it be fair to say that Cha'n still retains more of its > >>>> > >> original Indian Mahayana flavour than Japanese Zen? At least in > >>>> > >> it's outward expression, if not in its stories. I can almost smell > >>>> > >> the incense from here! ( meant respectfully). > >>>> > >> > >>>> > >> With cheeks together, on a chair, > >>>> > >> > >>>> > >> Mike > >>>> > >> > >>>> > >> > >>>> > >> Sent from Yahoo! Mail for iPad > >>>> > >> > >>>> > >> From: Joe <desert_woodworker@>; > >>>> > >> To: <[email protected]>; > >>>> > >> Subject: [Zen] Re: What is Enlightenment? > >>>> > >> Sent: Sun, May 19, 2013 5:26:17 AM > >>>> > >> > >>>> > >> > >>>> > >> JMJM, > >>>> > >> > >>>> > >> Well done. Well expressed. Be well. Please take good care. > >>>> > >> > >>>> > >> Hands together, and with bow, > >>>> > >> > >>>> > >> --Joe > >>>> > >> > >>>> > >> > <chan.jmjm@> wrote: > >>>> > >> > > >>>> > >> > Everything we truly seek belongs to heart, i.e. peace, happiness, > >>>> > >> > etc. > >>>> > >> > > >>>> > >> > Enhance the sensitivity of our heart. Accept all as is. Surpass > >>>> > >> > the realm of desire, form and formlessness. Sync with the > >>>> > >> > universal wisdom through our heart is the key to enlightenment. > >>>> > >> > > >>>> > >> > with palms together, > >>>> > >> > jm > >>>> > >> > >>>> > > > >>>> > > > >>>> > > > >>>> > > >>>> > >>> > >>> > >> > >> > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ Current Book Discussion: any Zen book that you recently have read or are reading! Talk about it today!Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/ <*> Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional <*> To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/join (Yahoo! ID required) <*> To change settings via email: [email protected] [email protected] <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [email protected] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
