Excuses, excuses, excuses, piled on more excuses for using methods
which produce no reliable conclusions, for taking shortcuts around
things so simple teenagers can do them, and not diligently working to
disprove claims. How sad. I suppose you don't think you need bother
with calibration
Is the 1MW container on its way to US?
Sending something like that can take weeks.
They must have packed everything and sent. The end of october is near.
mic
Horace, your 15 years of experience has it's limits because you have never
seen Rossi like setup before. You should not rely on that, because it might
fail you.
I am amazed why do you have so much difficulties to admit that there is a
correlation between steam production rate (i.e. pressure) and
Peter, thanks for this idea. This superheating process to eliminate
corrosive agents might be plausible with Rossi. Therefore we might not be
able to trust thermometer as a reliable pressure sensor, if it is not placed
under the liquid water level. But we need to find other means to measure
About multiple e-kittens in a box, question 2) from the exchange below on JONP:
Andrea Rossi
September 16th, 2011 at 4:23 AM
Dear Alessandro Casali:
1- I prefer not to give this info, for security reasons
2- multiple
3- see 1
4- yes
5- longer
6- will need drive time to time
7- everything upgrades
Hi,
On 20-9-2011 9:43, Michele Comitini wrote:
Is the 1MW container on its way to US?
Sending something like that can take weeks.
They must have packed everything and sent. The end of october is near.
mic
I was wondering about this too.
Rossi had to adjust his original plans to ship the
And what did he put on the customs declaration form?
1) Water heater?
2) eLion?
3) Nuclear Reactor?
Some of these might raise an eyebrow, eh? ;-)
T
Accordling this radio interview the answer is YES
Matt Lewan says has been told so by Rossi
http://radio.rcdc.it/archives/fusione-fredda-rossifocardi-assemblata-a-bologna-la-centrale-da-1mw-86847/
About security I would suggest Rossi to put a chair, some food and drink in
the container and
On 11-09-20 02:48 AM, Horace Heffner wrote:
Excuses, excuses, excuses, piled on more excuses for using methods
which produce no reliable conclusions, for taking shortcuts around
things so simple teenagers can do them, and not diligently working to
disprove claims. How sad. I suppose you
Pulses cause significant skin effect because their Fourier components consist
of high frequency harmonics.
- Original Message -
From: Mark Iverson-ZeroPoint
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Monday, September 19, 2011 11:08 PM
Subject: RE: [Vo]:Debunking Steorn Orbo
From:
One does not have to measure that it is open to the atmosphere since that is
a valid datum. It is no assumption. Assuming it is under pressure is
worthless. You did not observe pressure. What experience would you be
talking about? Its incredible to me that there would be any significant
Susan Gipp susan.g...@gmail.com wrote:
did you have the chance to ask DoE about Rossi's e-cat ? He claimed in his
paper that DoE saw a succesfull demostration back in 2009 !
I did not communicate with the DoE. Someone else did, and they sent me a
copy of the response. As you see, it is a
Joe, could you please explain why the water is ejected at such a high
velocity instead of just dribbling out of the tap?
On Sep 20, 2011, at 4:55 AM, Joe Catania wrote:
One does not have to measure that it is open to the atmosphere
since that is a valid datum. It is no assumption. Assuming
On Sep 20, 2011, at 12:13 AM, Jouni Valkonen wrote:
I was done commenting on your posts, but I see you want me to comment
more.
Horace, your 15 years of experience has it's limits because you
have never seen Rossi like setup before. You should not rely on
that, because it might fail
Am 20.09.2011 00:21, schrieb Joe Catania:
Ok, Peter. What I'm saying is I've run into this kind of thing before.
There was an electrical engineering professor on TheEEStory.com blog
who thought a patent was invalid and falsified because it showed a
fuse blowing at a current that (if it were
I don't know the last time you inverted a gallon jug of water but the water
does not come dribbling out. Since its open to the atmosphere it won't
dribble. Or if air can infiltrate from the bottom it won't dribble. I'm not
saying the overlying water dosen't give it pressure. We also don't know
At 01:41 AM 9/20/2011, Michele Comitini wrote:
About multiple e-kittens in a box, question 2) from the exchange
below on JONP:
Alessandro Casali
The 27MW e-cats are single core or do they have multiple cores?
Andrea Rossi
2- multiple
I missed that one! Now I really, really don't know how to
2011/9/20 Horace Heffner hheff...@mtaonline.net:
I am amazed why do you have so much difficulties to admit that there is a
correlation between steam production rate (i.e. pressure) and enthalpy? Do
you discard it only because you were unable to come up with the idea
yourself?
There is a
On Sep 20, 2011, at 8:41 AM, Joe Catania wrote:
I don't know the last time you inverted a gallon jug of water but
the water does not come dribbling out.
Of course it does. I didn't say dripping. The water flows from a
gallon container in an unsteady stream. It doesn't spray out at high
Greetings Vortex,
Not sure if this effect is useful for
the new hydrogen cold fusion- LENR.
http://www.physorg.com/news/2011-09-method-inexpensive-carbon-materials-hydrogen.html
Ron Kita, Chiralex
On Sep 20, 2011, at 8:41 AM, Joe Catania wrote:
I don't know the last time you inverted a gallon jug of water but
the water does not come dribbling out. Since its open to the
atmosphere it won't dribble. Or if air can infiltrate from the
bottom it won't dribble. I'm not saying the
On Sep 20, 2011, at 9:01 AM, Jouni Valkonen wrote:
2011/9/20 Horace Heffner hheff...@mtaonline.net:
I am amazed why do you have so much difficulties to admit that
there is a
correlation between steam production rate (i.e. pressure) and
enthalpy? Do
you discard it only because you were
My comment was specifically referring to the input side of the PLCs where
power in is standard AC.
As far as the frequency components present on the PWM side, it depends on
the risetime of the pulse.
The PWM signal from the PLC is most likely a squarewave, but at a relatively
modest
Yes a sealed galon bottle may dribble if a hole is poked but if its vented
at the top you should get a steady stream. Or if air enters through the
bottom you don't get a dribble! I scan't confirm high velocity flow in the
video. Since you can't tell me the rate of flow out the valve we have
On Sep 20, 2011, at 10:14 AM, Peter Heckert wrote:
Am 20.09.2011 19:49, schrieb Horace Heffner:
I think my conclusion was good: None of this indicates for sure
whether Rossi has anything of value or not. Maybe he does. The
continued failure to obtain independent high quality input and
On Sep 20, 2011, at 10:36 AM, Joe Catania wrote:
Yes a sealed galon bottle may dribble if a hole is poked but if its
vented at the top you should get a steady stream. Or if air enters
through the bottom you don't get a dribble! I scan't confirm high
velocity flow in the video. Since you
Am 20.09.2011 20:38, schrieb Horace Heffner:
On Sep 20, 2011, at 10:14 AM, Peter Heckert wrote:
In all demonstrations, January demo, Essen Kulander demo, 3 Ny Teknik
demos, the electrical input energy was not enough to heat the water
to 100° Celsius. (I dont know aout the Krivit demo)
There
2011/9/20 Horace Heffner hheff...@mtaonline.net:
I am familiar with multivariate regression analysis.
It is of comparatively little use when there are missing
critical variables.
Therefore you must MEASURE the critical variables. ALL of them. This
much I require common sense.
Your approach
Am 20.09.2011 21:31, schrieb Jouni Valkonen:
But I have several times told to Horace if he bothered to look up the
report and see the data by himself, but he have refused to even look
the data available. This kind of attitude is very sad from him. –Jouni
Maybe not everybody has the time. I
They state there is an auxillary heater.
- Original Message -
From: Peter Heckert peter.heck...@arcor.de
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2011 3:24 PM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Calulations for 1 MW plant.
Am 20.09.2011 20:38, schrieb Horace Heffner:
On Sep 20, 2011, at
The point is that a gallon empties very quickly even though not vented at
the top. The sound it makes is immaterial and is most like caused by the
water hitting the barrel. I don't know why you feel the water is under
inordinate pressure. The E-CAt is open to the atmosphere unless Lewan seals
Really?
- Original Message -
From: Peter Heckert peter.heck...@arcor.de
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2011 2:14 PM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Calulations for 1 MW plant.
Am 20.09.2011 19:49, schrieb Horace Heffner:
I think my conclusion was good: None of this indicates
From Jed-Storms;
Jed, just so you are clear in your understanding, the response
by the DOE has NO relationship to what the person who wrote the
reply letter believes. He wrote the OFFICIAL policy of the organization.
The official policy determines how the organization will respond to
Am 20.09.2011 21:51, schrieb Joe Catania:
They state there is an auxillary heater.
Yes but they examined all cables and even lifted the devices to see
whats below and I think this extra heater was connected to the blue
control box where they measured the input current. If not, then they
Still I'm not convinced that those tests you mentioned weren't exactly like
the September test. Why shouldn't they be?
- Original Message -
From: Peter Heckert peter.heck...@arcor.de
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2011 4:10 PM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Calulations for 1 MW
'Inexhaustible' Source of Hydrogen May Be Unlocked by Salt Water, Engineers Say
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/09/110919151317.htm
Am 20.09.2011 22:19, schrieb Joe Catania:
Still I'm not convinced that those tests you mentioned weren't exactly
like the September test. Why shouldn't they be?
I dont want to convince anybody. I still have doubts myself.
Im just pointing to remarkable aspects that was mostly overseen in
Horace:
The first thing I thought of when Joe used the word dribble was that he
had not seen the video where they opened the water inlet valve on the bottom
and a VERY strong stream of liquid water and steam came out! To refer to
that as a dribble, is clearly the wrong adjective... forceful
On Tue, Sep 20, 2011 at 2:46 PM, Horace Heffner hheff...@mtaonline.net wrote:
Sigh. Look at the video! Do you hear a gurgle gurgle gurgle or a high
powered woos? The water is obviously under high pressure. The couple
atmospheres pressure estimate by others does not seem off. You need a
On Tue, Sep 20, 2011 at 4:50 PM, Terry Blanton hohlr...@gmail.com wrote:
On Tue, Sep 20, 2011 at 2:46 PM, Horace Heffner hheff...@mtaonline.net
wrote:
Sigh. Look at the video! Do you hear a gurgle gurgle gurgle or a high
powered woos? The water is obviously under high pressure. The
2011/9/20 Peter Heckert peter.heck...@arcor.de:
I have never understood why do they treat the water and steam system as a
secret. Why dont they open up the chimney to look inside. With this big 80
kg box my doubts are even increased.
Least thing what Rossi wants in this phase that people
On Tue, Sep 20, 2011 at 4:54 PM, Terry Blanton hohlr...@gmail.com wrote:
On Tue, Sep 20, 2011 at 4:50 PM, Terry Blanton hohlr...@gmail.com wrote:
On Tue, Sep 20, 2011 at 2:46 PM, Horace Heffner hheff...@mtaonline.net
wrote:
Sigh. Look at the video! Do you hear a gurgle gurgle gurgle or a
The screaming does not indicate high pressure. It could be a whistle effect
as bubbles of steam are forming in the outlet. Why not experiment and see
how fast a container drains through an outlet the size of the E-Cat's?
- Original Message -
From: Terry Blanton hohlr...@gmail.com
To:
To ay the matter to rest I was not the one to use the word dribble. It was
HH.
- Original Message -
From: Mark Iverson-ZeroPoint zeropo...@charter.net
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2011 4:41 PM
Subject: RE: [Vo]:Calulations for 1 MW plant.
Horace:
The first
That wasn't me. I've never posted to that site. But so what? Is that the
best you can do?
- Original Message -
From: Terry Blanton hohlr...@gmail.com
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2011 4:54 PM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Calulations for 1 MW plant.
On Tue, Sep 20, 2011 at
At 12:49 PM 9/20/2011, Joe Catania wrote:
The point is that a gallon
empties very quickly even though not vented at the top. The sound it
makes is immaterial and is most like caused by the water hitting the
barrel. I don't know why you feel the water is under inordinate pressure.
The E-CAt is
What are the 2 extra wires(22) for ?
Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2011 22:10:34 +0200
From: peter.heck...@arcor.de
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Calulations for 1 MW plant.
Am 20.09.2011 21:51, schrieb Joe Catania:
They state there is an auxillary heater.
Yes but they examined
Am 20.09.2011 22:55, schrieb Jouni Valkonen:
2011/9/20 Peter Heckertpeter.heck...@arcor.de:
I have never understood why do they treat the water and steam system as a
secret. Why dont they open up the chimney to look inside. With this big 80
kg box my doubts are even increased.
Least thing
On Sep 20, 2011, at 11:51 AM, Joe Catania wrote:
They state there is an auxillary heater.
Yes,the Essen reports states: At the end of the horizontal section
there is an auxiliary electric heater to initialize the burning and
also to act as a safety if the heat evolution should get out of
I have just lost about 50% (left side) of my left eye. It may be a
retinal detachment. It seems to be coming back. I may not respond for
a bit.
Best regards,
Horace Heffner
http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/
On Sep 20, 2011, at 11:43 AM, Peter Heckert wrote:
[snip]
A proven COP of 2 is more important than a doubtful COP of 6.
[snip]
Best regards,
Peter
So very true.
Best regards,
Horace Heffner
http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/
At 02:24 PM 9/20/2011, Horace Heffner wrote:
I have just lost about 50% (left side) of my left eye. It may be a
retinal detachment. It seems to be coming back. I may not respond for
a bit.
Sorry to hear that good luck!
+1 good luck
2011/9/20 Alan J Fletcher a...@well.com:
At 02:24 PM 9/20/2011, Horace Heffner wrote:
I have just lost about 50% (left side) of my left eye. It may be a
retinal detachment. It seems to be coming back. I may not respond for
a bit.
Sorry to hear that good luck!
Horace,
Needless to say... call your doctor or optometrist right away.
Could be a number of serious issues. Migraine, retinal detachment, mini-stroke.
Don't wait.
Regards
Steven Vincent Johnson
www.OrionWorks.com
www.zazzle.com/orionworks
Clearly your calculations are a bit off. The running time on video is more like
1:20, still greater than drain time for 2 atm, showing there is less than 2atm
pressure. But since we don't know for how long the draining continues we dont
know how much less. Since the E-Cat is open to atmosphere
Best wishes for you!
Am 20.09.2011 23:24, schrieb Horace Heffner:
I have just lost about 50% (left side) of my left eye. It may be a
retinal detachment. It seems to be coming back. I may not respond for
a bit.
Best regards,
Horace Heffner
http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/
Take some aspirin and see a doctor.
- Original Message -
From: OrionWorks - Steven V Johnson svj.orionwo...@gmail.com
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2011 5:30 PM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:stopping
Horace,
Needless to say... call your doctor or optometrist right away.
Alan, excellent work again. Considering Akira's temperature graph, we
can take that draining took about 5-7 min. In the beginning pressure
was 210 kPa or 122°C. But it is needed to take into consideration,
that valve was opened slowly. In the end of video, valve was only half
open.
At 02:33 PM 9/20/2011, Joe Catania wrote:
http://lenr.qumbu.com/rossi_ecat_sep11_f.php
I seem to have broken my file ... back soon!
At 02:56 PM 9/20/2011, Alan J Fletcher wrote:
At 02:33 PM 9/20/2011, Joe
Catania wrote:
http://lenr.qumbu.com/rossi_ecat_sep11_f.php
I seem to have broken my file ... back soon!
It's back ... I added a table of draining time vs tap radius, and
corrected the video time.
I'm still open to
BTW you should run those time-to-drain numbers again. The outlet looks like its
about 2cm in diameter. The sound seems to be mostly water impacting on the side
of the pail.
- Original Message -
From: Alan J Fletcher
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2011
At 02:33 PM 9/20/2011, Joe Catania wrote:
Clearly your
calculations are a bit off. The running time on video is more like 1:20,
still greater than drain time for 2 atm, showing there is less than 2atm
pressure. But since we don't know for how long the draining continues we
dont know how much
At 03:36 PM 9/20/2011, Joe Catania wrote:
BTW you should run
those time-to-drain numbers again. The outlet looks like its about 2cm in
diameter. The sound seems to be mostly water impacting on the side of the
pail.
Tank height 25
Radius 0.20Time 1 Bar 44.94 minTime 2 Bar 3.52 min
Radius 0.30Time
A 5-7 min draining time is completely consistent with 1 atm (ie no
additional pressure). That represents a flow of ~50ml/s or a velocity of
~15cm/s which is ~ 1/66 of the velocity obtained from dropping for 1 sec in
a gravity field. Since mgh=1/2mv^2, h= 1/2 (.15m/s)^2 /10ms^-2 or h=0.1125cm
I can't agree w/ a diameter of 1 cm.
- Original Message -
From: Alan J Fletcher
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2011 6:49 PM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Calculations for 1 MW plant. + Time to Drain the eCat
At 02:33 PM 9/20/2011, Joe Catania wrote:
Clearly
But look at the size of the orifice in the video.
- Original Message -
From: Alan J Fletcher
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2011 6:54 PM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Calculations for 1 MW plant. + Time to Drain the eCat
At 03:36 PM 9/20/2011, Joe Catania wrote:
Have it your way. Still there is little pressure necessary.
- Original Message -
From: Alan J Fletcher
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2011 7:18 PM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Calculations for 1 MW plant. + Time to Drain the eCat
At 04:00 PM 9/20/2011, Joe
Standard pipes use inches as unit of measure.
Should be one in the table:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nominal_Pipe_Size
mic
2011/9/21 Joe Catania zrosumg...@aol.com:
Have it your way. Still there is little pressure necessary.
- Original Message -
From: Alan J Fletcher
To:
Hi,
On 21-9-2011 1:25, Michele Comitini wrote:
Standard pipes use inches as unit of measure.
Should be one in the table:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nominal_Pipe_Size
Not always according the following page:
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nennweite
It says:
Bei Kupferrohren wird der
At 04:19 PM 9/20/2011, Joe Catania wrote:
Have it your way.
We can't see inside the tap (or know what type it is), or if it's only
partly open -- it is probably more constricted than the outlet.
Still there is
little pressure necessary.
I put up the full table at :
Alan wrote:
We can't see inside the tap (or know what type it is), or if it's only
partly open.
By the looks of the orange handle on the valve, I'd say that this is the
type of valve that uses only a 90degree turn of the handle to go from full
shut to full open (ball valve). When the handle
At 05:31 PM 9/20/2011, Mark Iverson-ZeroPoint wrote:
Alan wrote:
We can't see inside the tap (or know what type it is), or if it's
only partly open
By the looks of the orange handle on the valve, Id say that this is the
type of valve that uses only a 90degree turn of the handle to go from
Ouch -- that sounds pretty scary. Best of luck, Horace!!
I hope you have a quick and complete recovery!
On 11-09-20 05:24 PM, Horace Heffner wrote:
I have just lost about 50% (left side) of my left eye. It may be a
retinal detachment. It seems to be coming back. I may not respond for
a
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