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Today's topics: * Democracy vs freedom of individual - 1 messages, 1 author http://groups.google.com/group/BM_discussion/browse_thread/thread/ba9080965904407e * IMP :: Chapter coordination and Financial Management - 1 messages, 1 author http://groups.google.com/group/BM_discussion/browse_thread/thread/af030714639cbb88 * Fwd: [BM_Delhi] Meeting minutes for 30Apr2006 - 1 messages, 1 author http://groups.google.com/group/BM_discussion/browse_thread/thread/b15a188fbd6af6c6 * RTI application to H.R. Ministry on Reservation - Suggestions invited - 1 messages, 1 author http://groups.google.com/group/BM_discussion/browse_thread/thread/6c2ecf2bf2f1e04b ============================================================================== TOPIC: Democracy vs freedom of individual http://groups.google.com/group/BM_discussion/browse_thread/thread/ba9080965904407e ============================================================================== == 1 of 1 == Date: Sun, May 7 2006 9:13 am From: "vivek claire" > > > ** > *Democracy Versus Freedom* > > *Democracies have ever been spectacles of turbulence and conflict; have > ever been found incompatible with personal security or the rights of > property; and have in general been as short in their lives as they have been > violent in their deaths. * > > ~James Madison, fourth president of the United States > and primary Framer of the U.S. Constitution > > Politicians and major media constantly tell us that oppressed peoples > crave democracy, and that only a democratic world will be free and peaceful. > Now President Bush has launched a campaign to bring freedom and democracy to > the world. > > But are freedom and democracy the same thing? And will democracy imposed > by force guarantee peace? > *Democracy, collectivism, and individualism* > > Consider the meanings of three key political concepts: > > 1. > > Democracy: that form of government in which sovereign power resides > in the people as a whole, and is exercised either directly by them or by > officers elected by them. > 2. > > Collectivism: a politico-economic system in which the means of > production and the distribution of goods and services are controlled by the > collective, that is, the society or state considered as a group e.g., > Nazi Germany and Communist China. > 3. > > Individualism: the social theory which advocates the free and > independent action of the individual person, as opposed to collectivist > methods of organization and state interference. > > In fact, democracy is much closer to collectivism than it is to > individualism. Like collectivism, democracy places essential political power > with the group, rather than with the individual person thus making > everyone's freedom subject to the passions of the mob or those with the most > power. > *What is democracy?* > > Throughout the world, democracy is as often a cover for tyranny as it is a > protection for liberty. Many countries call themselves democracies and have > regular elections, yet systematically oppress their own people. > > For example, Stalinist North Korea calls itself the Democratic People's > Republic of Korea and communist China calls itself the People's Republic of > China. Like the old Soviet Union, they have regular elections, elected > legislatures, and even some choice of candidates. > > However, its all a fraud. Voting is mandatory The only party allowed to > run candidates is the Communist Party. Legislatures rubber-stamp the decrees > of party bosses. And anyone who objects strongly or tries to set up another > party ends up dead or in a slave labor camp. > > Many countries in Africa, Asia, and Latin America also now have > multi-party democracies but little freedom. Vote fraud is massive, > opposition candidates are often beaten or murdered by government thugs, and > a small elite controls all power. Citizens have little freedom, but lots of > poverty. > > What of Western democracies? Things are better, but far from free of > corruption, fraud, and manipulation of voters. > > Even in the United States, more and more people report their votes are not > being counted. Electronic voting makes fraud easy (and nearly undetectable). > Congressional districts are gerrymandered to guarantee that one party always > wins. Third parties, such as the Libertarians and Greens, face virtually > insurmountable obstacles, including oppressive ballot-access and > campaign-finance laws. Only Republicans and Democrats are allowed in most > televised political debates. And third-party election results are often not > even reported by the media. > > Whatever its virtues, democracy is not freedom. As the 19th-century French > philosopher Alexis de Tocqueville warned in his classic *Democracy in > America,* a democracy can be just as tyrannical as a dictatorship once the > voters decide to vote themselves money from the treasury > > Democracy is a method of deciding who shall rule. It does not determine > the morality of the resulting government. At best, democracy means that > government has popular support. But popular support is no guarantee that > government will protect your freedom. > > In a democracy, if most voters support freedom of speech, press, religion, > association, and enterprise, their elected government will probably respect > such freedoms. > > But if voters prefer that governments impose a welfare state and > confiscatory taxes, ban unapproved drugs, impose censorship, imprison > critics, seize the property of unpopular groups, torture prisoners, and > draft the young, a democratic government will probably grant those wishes > also. > *Conceived in liberty, not in democracy* > > America's Founders were well aware of the evils of pure democracy and > wisely made the United States a limited constitutional republic in which > individual rights were strongly protected. > > The word democracy does not appear either in the Declaration of > Independence or in the U.S. Constitution. Instead, Article IV, Section 4 > of the Constitution guarantees to every State in this Union a Republican > Form of Government. > > The difference between a constitutional republic and a democracy is the > difference between liberty and slavery. As Ira Glasser, former director of > the American Civil Liberties Union, explains, > > Even in a democracy the majority must be limited in order to guarantee > individual rights and personal autonomy. > > If whites have more votes than blacks, they cannot be allowed to deny > blacks their constitutional rights. If men have more political power than > women, that cannot permit them to deny women certain individual rights. > Winning an election should not permit the victors to assemble their votes > and enact laws or govern in a way that strips those who lose of their > liberty. > *Electoral versus substantive rights* > > To understand why democracy does not guarantee freedom, it is essential to > distinguish between electoral and substantive rights. > > Electoral rights define your ability to participate in the election of > some government officials. > > Electoral rights give you some say in who governs. They do not guarantee > that elected officials will respect your freedom. > > Substantive rights are the ability to control your own life and property. > They are the core elements of freedom. > > Your substantive rights include your: (1) right to life, liberty, and > property; (2) freedom of speech and press; (3) right to trial by jury; (4) > freedom to travel; (5) freedom of religion; (6) freedom to educate your > children as you see fit; (7) right to own and run your own business; (8) > right to defend yourself, including the right to own guns; and (9) right not > to be spied on by government. > > The Declaration of Independence expresses this vision well: > > We hold these Truths to be self-evident; that all Men are created equal, > that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that > among these are Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness.... > > *Democracy is no guarantee of peace* > > Just as democracy is no guarantee of freedom, neither is it a guarantee of > peace. > > It is true that the relatively free democratic states are less likely to > fight each other. > > But democratically elected regimes frequently attack weak nondemocracies. > > As Ivan Eland explains in *The Empire Has No > Clothes<http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0945999984/qid=1146586741/sr=2-1/ref=pd_bbs_b_2_1/103-9969215-0616638?/lewrockwell/> > ,* The three greatest imperial powers of the nineteenth and twentieth > centuries France, Great Britain, and the United States were democracies. > > Indeed, in the 20th century, the United States attacked more countries > than any other nation. Since the end of World War II, the United States has > engaged in more than 200 armed conflicts, killing hundreds of thousands of > civilians waging wars or military actions in Korea, Vietnam, Panama, > Grenada, Colombia, Haiti, Iraq, Afghanistan, Serbia, and Bosnia. In nearly > all of these conflicts, there was no threat to the United States > > It is clear from the history of Britain, France, Germany, and the United > States, that democracy is no guarantee of peace. > *Is democracy necessary for freedom?* > > While democracy doesnt guarantee either freedom or peace, there are many > historical examples of societies that didnt have either elections or > legislatures, but in which people's rights were strongly protected. > > Examples include the American colonies before the Revolutionary War ... > the American West in the 19th century, where violence was one-tenth of what > it is in large U.S . cities today .. many cantons in Switzerland today, > which have little government ... and the nations of Andorra and Monaco. > > In fact, for centuries much of the world had law and order without > legislatures or elected rulers. Instead they had what might be called > free-market justice provided by traveling judges adjudicating disputes, with > decisions enforced by local communities and sheriffs. > > This nonelectoral legal system (explained in the book, *The Enterprise of > Law<http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0936488301/qid=1146586788/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_1/103-9969215-0616638?/lewrockwell/> > ,* by Bruce L. Benson) created what is today known as the common law > thousands of collected decisions that provide the basis for law in America, > Europe, and much of the free world. > *The path to freedom and peace* > > Throughout the world, thugs and despots some democratically elected, and > some not solemnly give lip-service to democracy and freedom, while doing > everything in their power to destroy them. > > To have a free and peaceful world, we must create societies in which the > inalienable rights of the individual person are again respected, and the > powers of government are strictly limited. > > That means ending confiscation of property without trial, secret arrests, > imprisonment without conviction, and torture of prisoners. It means > abolishing sovereign-immunity laws, which exempt government agents from > legal responsibility when they kidnap, steal, torture, or murder. > > It means creating truly independent citizens grand juries with the power > to investigate and indict corrupt government officials and police. > > And it means ceasing government spying on its own citizens and ending > foreign invasions to impose democracy by force. > > No, democracy is not the same as liberty. All too often, building > democracy has been used as a justification for destroying freedom. > > To achieve a free and peaceful world, we must restore freedom and > individual liberty, not democracy. > ============================================================================== TOPIC: IMP :: Chapter coordination and Financial Management http://groups.google.com/group/BM_discussion/browse_thread/thread/af030714639cbb88 ============================================================================== == 1 of 1 == Date: Sun, May 7 2006 11:25 am From: "Moderator BharatUdayMission" Dear Brothers and Sisters, We praise good work done by different chapters and we saw some new rising chapters like BM Delhi and Jaipur in recent past. Its all due to efforts of all of us who worked and planned and utilized less bandwidth of resources/time. Admin Team promise that Finance ( less important resource )will never be a bottle neck for any chapter and any project. So let us plan and do things with free mind. We have two important announcements: 1. We developed chapter coordination draft and it should be followed by every chapter. Later we will go according to our constitution which will be drafted soon. http://bharatudaymission.org/htm/chapter_new.htm 2. Please follow the financial rules given in http://bharatudaymission.org/htm/chapter_new.htm 3. Please mail us email id and phone numbers of 2-5 active members as we are making a central database for better coordination. We once again thank to all of us for our efforts INDIA : The Rise of a Great Nation. Regards, Moderators. -- "We have only one Passion The Rise of a Great Nation." www.bharatudaymission.org ============================================================================== TOPIC: Fwd: [BM_Delhi] Meeting minutes for 30Apr2006 http://groups.google.com/group/BM_discussion/browse_thread/thread/b15a188fbd6af6c6 ============================================================================== == 1 of 1 == Date: Sun, May 7 2006 11:48 am From: "Ram Ji Tripathi" ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Krishanu Bhattacharjee <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Date: May 6, 2006 6:59 PM Subject: [BM_Delhi] Meeting minutes for 30Apr2006 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hello Everyone, DELHI CHAPTER MEETING MINUTES 1.Meeting on : 30 April, 2006 2.Time : 10 A.M To 12:30 P.M 3.Venue : India Gate. *Participants*: Aastha, Rajendra, Avinash, Gaurav Ahuja, Amit Kumar, Robin Malik, Soumendra Nath Roy, Jatin Ahuja, Rakesh Agarwal, Deepak Kumar, Krishanu, Ramji Tripathi, Sanjukta Chandra, Shantanu Chowdhury, Sudhir Gandoma, Ashish Kumar Roy, Soma Roy, Milan, Prashant Verma, Uday Gosain, Vikas Arora *4. Agenda:* *Main Agenda: POA Finalization for May July Work of BM_Delhi* Introduction Bank A/C & Fund Generation Possibilities Awaaz (Corruption Control Forum): POA of work using RTI Nirmaan (Education and Career forum): POA of work regarding primary and value added education Pragati (Community services forum): POA of work regarding Water management and Health & Hygiene campaign in Delhi Propagation Activities Discussion and POA of proceeding on Reservation issue *5. Discussion that took: * New members were introduced. General Discussion on various local and national issues took place. People from other NGOs such as *NyayBhoomi,* *Asha for Education* and *Humanitarian Movement* were present. Discussion on activities of our and these organizations took place and possibilities of joint action were discussed regarding various issues in our agenda. All the members gave active suggestion. Fees for April from rest of the members were collected by Aastha (Financial Coordinator). List of active members is increasing. That's s good sign. Discussion took place on fund generation possibilities. *From May to July, we will work on these 6 issues.* *1. Reservation:* We will support all democratic association in Delhi who are working on this issue. Mr. Rakesh Agarwal of NyayBhoomi along with other members of BM such as Mr.Vikas Arora, Soumendra Nath Roy, Robin Malik, Ashish Kumar Roy and some others are using RTI to generate all information regarding reservation and we are also preparing a solution model regarding this issue along with other organizations in Delhi. Robin is in continuous touch with all other organizations. As soon as other members of BM_Delhi are free from examinations, more members will be joining this work. *2. Primary Education: *Students from IIT Delhi who are members of BM_Delhi will very soon start the operations of Pragya School as soon as their exams are over. Krishanu will be coordinating with Mr. Uday Gosain of Asha for Education for various projects of activity based primary education of BM in pipeline. Very soon details will be posted in the group as soon as talks are successful and POA is finalized after discussion. *3. Water Management:* Discussion is going on regarding two aspects, using RTI to generate information regarding water crisis and creating awareness among people of Delhi to save water. POA will be finalized soon and details will be posted in the group. *4. Health and Hygiene:* As soon as our members are free from exams we will start planning and communicating with RWAs and Slum authorities and probably from July we will start workshops and awareness campaigns in all over Delhi regarding this issue. 5. Rajendra Ram of IIT Delhi along with other members of DU will be working on *propagation and prospect of increasing our support in Delhi University and other colleges of Delhi * 6. *Coordinating with all BM chapters and committees to formulate constitution of BM.* * *Details will be posted in the group after discussion among coordinators and moderators. Krishanu Desh Ke Liye kuch bhi This is Our mission. ------------------------------ Yahoo! Messenger with Voice.<http://us.rd.yahoo.com/mail_us/taglines/postman3/*http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=39666/*http://messenger.yahoo.com>PC-to-Phone calls for ridiculously low rates. Join --> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/BM_Delhi/ Lets change india.... join hands to change the face of india by changing the people who represent it... Join --> http://www.bharatudaymission.org SPONSORED LINKS Party ideas<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Party+ideas&w1=Party+ideas&w2=Birthday+party+ideas&w3=College+in+delhi&c=3&s=65&.sig=jVgbGY1OGu2Ue_TLzkGU9A> Birthday party ideas<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Birthday+party+ideas&w1=Party+ideas&w2=Birthday+party+ideas&w3=College+in+delhi&c=3&s=65&.sig=5IRvM1UBOOC988N4-sJ59Q> College in delhi<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=College+in+delhi&w1=Party+ideas&w2=Birthday+party+ideas&w3=College+in+delhi&c=3&s=65&.sig=FWiRn0jWNYDxG6UYdbypnw> ------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS - Visit your group "BM_Delhi <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/BM_Delhi>" on the web. - To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED]<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> - Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service<http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . ------------------------------ -- truly yours, ram B. Tech, Computer Sc. & Engg.; IITK. Mobile No.: 91-9818777299 "It may not always be easy, convenient, or politically correct to stand for truth and right, but it is the right thing to do. Always." -- M. Russell Ballard Spirit of Nationalism http://bharatudaymission.org ============================================================================== TOPIC: RTI application to H.R. Ministry on Reservation - Suggestions invited http://groups.google.com/group/BM_discussion/browse_thread/thread/6c2ecf2bf2f1e04b ============================================================================== == 1 of 1 == Date: Sun, May 7 2006 11:51 am From: "Moderator BharatUdayMission" SUGGESTIONS INVITED FOR THE FOLLOWING RTI APPLICATION. ================================= This application pertains to the policy of reservation in educational institutions for people from backward castes, classes and categories or those people who avail or are entitled to avail benefits of reservation under any category whatsoever in education institutions, and also pertains to the recent proposal of the government to bring amendment(s) for a change in the percentage of such reserved seats in education institutions. *IN RESPECT OF UPPER CASTES, PLEASE PROVIDE ME THE FOLLOWING INFORMATION:* 1. What is the number of people below poverty line? 2. What is the average income of the families in rural areas? 3. What percentage of such people are illiterate? 4. What percentage of such people are matriculate or lower? 5. What percentage of such people are graduate? 6. What percentage of such people are post-graduate or higher? 7. Please provide broad statistical details of the occupation of the main earning member of a family. 8. What percentage of the students who receive financial support (e.g., need based scholarships) to pursue their education belong to the upper castes? 9. Percentage of candidates from upper castes who had to leave or had to be expelled for poor academic performance. *IN RESPECT OF RESERVED CATEGORIES, PLEASE PROVIDE ME THE FOLLOWING INFORMATION:* 1. How many families have received the benefit of reservation for more than one generation? 2. Out of the people availing benefits under reservation, what percentage belong to the first generation to avail such benefits. In other words, what percentage of people are availing the benefit whose either of the parents have not availed such benefits. 3. What percentage belong to the second generation to avail such benefits? 4. What percentage belong to the third generation to avail such benefits? 5. What is the percentage of reserved category students who do not receive any financial support from the government to pursue their studies? 6. What are the performance statistics of the reserved category students after admission? 7. Percentage of such candidates who are in the top 10% of the academic performers of their respect institutions. 8. Percentage of candidates of the total number of reserved category candidates who had to leave or had to be expelled for poor academic performance. 9. For every state, please provide caste-wise details for OBC candidates who have availed the benefits of reservation in government jobs in the last 40 years. For each caste, please tell me the number of class 1 officers, class 2 officers, gazetted officers, and so on at the time of their appointment in a government job. *OTHER QUESTIONS* 1. What is the number of Schedule Caste, Scheduled Tribes, Other Backward Castes, and Upper Caste members in Lok Sabha? Please provide a list separately for each of these categories. 2. What is the number of Schedule Caste, Scheduled Tribes, Other Backward Castes, and Upper Caste members in Rajya Sabha? Please provide a list separately for each of these categories. 3. What is the number of Schedule Caste, Scheduled Tribes, Other Backward Castes, and Upper Caste members in Vidhan Sabha of each of the 28 states? Please provide a list separately for each of these categories state-wise. 4. What is the number of Schedule Caste, Scheduled Tribes, Other Backward Castes, and Upper Caste members in Vidhan Parishad of each of the states where the Vidhan Parishad exists? Please provide a list separately for each of these categories state-wise. 5. What is the number of Schedule Caste, Scheduled Tribes, Other Backward Castes, and Upper Caste members who are presently Governors of various states? 6. What is the percentage of the backward classes among Muslims, Sikhs, Christians and other major religions who would be benefited after the reservation bill has been passed? 7. Is there any provision to ensure that only the best people pursue disciplines critical to human life and humanity? E.g., Medicine, Surgery, Atomic research etc. 8. What is the rationale behind having caste based reservation in colleges and jobs when there is reservation based on economic status in schools? Please provide the relevant questions and answers raised in the parliament in this regard in the last 20 years. 9. Why is giving vocational training not given priority if the focus is to bring about economic prosperity among weaker sections? 10. How do you remove caste-based differences if reservations are themselves based on caste? -- "We have only one Passion The Rise of a Great Nation." www.bharatudaymission.org ============================================================================== You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "BM_discussion" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] or visit http://groups.google.com/group/BM_discussion To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To change the way you get mail from this group, visit: http://groups.google.com/group/BM_discussion/subscribe To report abuse, send email explaining the problem to [EMAIL PROTECTED] ============================================================================== Google Groups: http://groups.google.com
