EDIT: I will reconsider my vote if someone explains how the latter
(lower the bar and remain in ASF) is MORE
harmful to the project than the former (lower the bar and leave ASF)

// Sorry, mixing up left and right, as usual

On Thu, 8 Apr 2021 at 18:10, Andrei Sekretenko <asekrete...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Sorry guys, let me try to fail this vote.
> -1 (binding)
> To continue any development (including maintenance), the entry bar for
> the people allowed to merge code and participate in project decisions
> has to be lowered, this way or another.
> I do not see how the approach "let's move the project out of ASF and
> lower the bar there" benefits the _future_ of the project, compared to
> lowering the committer bar while remaining in ASF.
> (I will reconsider my vote if someone explains how the latter is less
> harmful to the project than the former)
> To me, the elimination of the ASF reporting overhead is quite
> marginal, compared to the added overhead of:
>  - potential for future trademark hurdles (which can scare any
> potential contribution there might be)
>  - the need to immediately switch CI and issue tracker
>  - the old JIRA going read-only (yes, this should be counted as a
> separate concern)
> and so on
> I'm not saying that Mesos should stick to the ASF-provided
> infrastructure forever, but this is a different story.
> There are a number of things in Mesos that require major overhaul to
> lower the contribution overhead; in the new conditions, this might be
> one of them.
> Getting current (and potential future) contributors unstuck and
> relieving Vinod from the duties of heading the project (given that he
> wants to step down from being the PMC chair) is something we should do
> ASAP, however I doubt that moving into Attic is the right way to do
> that.
> I do not feel especially optimistic about the future prospects of the
> project, but IMO moving to Attic makes them even worse.
> ---
> Talking about what I personally can/want/cannot do:
>  - I do not see myself actively contributing (=adding new features and
> submitting solutions to address technical debt) to the project in the
> foreseeable future
>  - I will not be surprised if I will need to contribute some minor but
> critical bugfix in the nearest few months; for example, if someone
> exposes a major vulnerability in Mesos, I will probably have to work
> on that, and work on that quickly
>  - I'm ready to provide technical mentoring (and, hopefully,
> reasonably quick reviews) in areas I'm familiar with (this,
> unfortunately, excludes most of the inner workings of the agent, for
> example)
>  - I can provide mentoring and code reviews in areas I'm less familiar
> with, but do not expect quick feedback from me there, as meaningfully
> reviewing an unfamiliar code can be 2 to 100 times slower
>  - Despite having an opinion on where Mesos should not go, some
> understanding of the project's past mistakes, and some ideas on what
> it should drop, I have absolutely no idea where Mesos should go.
> Best,
> Andrei
> On Thu, 8 Apr 2021 at 17:50, Benjamin Bannier <bbann...@apache.org> wrote:
> >
> > Hi Shane,
> >
> > >> FWIW, I'm one of those people who said they were interested, and I
> > >> still voted to move it to the attic (even though my vote is non
> > >> binding as I'm not a committer).
> > >
> > >That's great!  One of the questions I have for the project is: why
> > >haven't they made you a committer yet?  (That's a question for the PMC,
> > >not for you, really, but it's one I'm betting the Board would be curious
> > >to hear about).
> >
> > I fear the problem is less that contributors haven't been voted in as
> > committers, but IMO that unfortunately the project has seen hardly any
> > contributions of bigger patches from the community in the last couple of
> > years, (I know we merged patches from Charles, but when some people
> > voiced interested here that's the first at least I heard of them). This
> > makes me pessimistic regarding a handover which medium term can improve
> > the situation.
> >
> > I summarized some issues I saw in an earlier thread (yes, this discussion
> > has been going on since Feb 2021), and I think the issues were only if
> > at all marginally related to committership,
> > https://lists.apache.org/thread.html/r4bccbf048a9bcde3f0bb66d5e2c57f585296e1f5e2769486413b2758%40%3Cdev.mesos.apache.org%3E
> > .
> >
> >
> > Cheers,
> >
> > Benjamin

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