On Saturday, March 08, 2014 18:09:24 Philip P. Patnode wrote: > To all at SH who enjoy a few beers or more - > > I am a non-drinker with a valid OH driver's license. > > I will be happy to assume the role of *designated driver* and haul your > sorry ass home when/if you drink too much. > > Of course, I will keep your car for at least 24 hours to prevent you from > driving with a morning-after hangover. > > I promise not to make a coffee run to Philadelphia with your car. > > If you need a ride, let me know. > > Philip
Oddly enough, it seems that a lot of folks forget that Akron has working bus service. Its $1.25 for a one-way ticket, $2.50 for a day pass. http://akronmetro.org/metro-fares-passes-pricing.aspx All the routes are on Google Maps as well, which is fantastic for when you don't want to look up the schedules to get from point to point. >From experience, I can say that is a thoroughly liberating feeling to not care about having to drive home drunk or even hung over the next morning. > > On Fri, Mar 7, 2014 at 1:52 PM, Torrie Fischer <[email protected]>wrote: > > On Friday, March 07, 2014 13:44:47 Omar Rassi wrote: > > > I will summarize my points as I won't be able to make the board meeting > > > > or > > > > > this Tuesday's meeting as I'll be blowing stuff up with C4 and det cord > > > that day: > > > > > > * There isnt now nor has ever been a pattern of substance abuse at > > > > Synhak. > > > > > Late night hackers are not being solicited by people looking to buy > > > drugs > > > or alcohol. The community has regulated itself on this matter. If you're > > > concerned about another person, go and talk to them about it. > > > > > > * If the concern is safety, how does this make us more safe and less > > > liable? There are already liability waivers, and safety classes REQUIRED > > > before you can use the machine shop. I'm sure the safety class covers > > > > usage > > > > > while under the influence. > > > > > > * If things do get out of hand on a day, the Akron police downtown > > > > station > > > > > is .4 miles away, WALKING DISTANCE! All this stuff is already against > > > the > > > law and so far, Synhak is known as a law abiding organization. > > > > > > * If we're concerned about illicit drugs and alcohol abuse to formulate > > > policy, then lets go the extra mile, we need an acceptable use policy to > > > get on the computers and internet while at the space since copyright > > > infringement is also illegal and we need ensure Synhak isn't liable for > > > a > > > visitor who downloads a song on our computer and internet connection. > > > > > > * Lastly, if the membership decides that there should be a written > > > > policy, > > > > > that policy must be written by a lawyer and then voted in, if the intent > > > > is > > > > > to protect the organization then it should be done by a legal expert. > > > For > > > that matter, if legal protection is needed, we should keep a lawyer on a > > > retainer for consultation. > > > > its happening > > > > http://i.imgur.com/oVyfzv2.png > > > > > On Fri, Mar 7, 2014 at 1:12 PM, Tomm Smith <[email protected]> > > > > wrote: > > > > Torrie, > > > > No worries. As I am sure the feeling is mutually perceived. The topic > > > > is > > > > > > sort of foundational to a collectivists community so the heat of > > > > emotion > > > > > > is > > > > bound to arise. > > > > > > > > On Fri, Mar 7, 2014 at 1:10 PM, Tomm Smith <[email protected]> > > > > wrote: > > > >> Torrie, > > > >> I understand maintaining the spirit of what the space is and what the > > > >> root desire of the gathering is. However, being a legal > > > >> establishment, > > > >> one > > > >> must abide legal stipulations to ensure that possible neglected > > > > corners > > > > > >> of > > > >> circumstance do not bring a judicial situation that cripples the over > > > > all > > > > > >> community. Legal professionalism and personal hackerdom can co-exist > > > > in > > > > > >> parallel and have no breaks in linearity. The legal paper work and > > > >> guidelines will only establish a certain order of conduct that has > > > > weight > > > > > >> communally, and legal coverage excluding the establishment from any > > > >> mindless fools wrecking the place. Granted said guidelines are not > > > > hoops > > > > > >> and boundaries causing a communistic totalitarian sort of community. > > > > In > > > > > >> short, legal hackerdom does not last very long. > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> Omar, > > > >> I think the primary focus of the introduction of the rules and > > > >> regulations is to be strictly a paperwork thing to have sway in > > > >> court, > > > >> *GIVEN* a situation should arise. I could be wrong on this, it is > > > > simply > > > > > >> my > > > >> take of the primary reason for introducing such proposals. > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> On Fri, Mar 7, 2014 at 12:52 PM, Torrie Fischer < > > > > [email protected] > > > > > >> > wrote: > > > >>> > If its decided that we must have a drug and alcohol policy, > > > >>> > > > >>> Pushing through a board vote without membership discussion doesn't > > > > mean > > > > > >>> "it is > > > >>> decided", FWIW. > > > >>> > > > >>> On Friday, March 07, 2014 12:43:32 Omar Rassi wrote: > > > >>> > Is Synhak on trial for an incident that we now need to defend > > > >>> > ourselves > > > >>> > with policy and paperwork? If its decided that we must have a drug > > > > and > > > > > >>> > alcohol policy, then it should be written by a lawyer and not by > > > >>> > us > > > >>> > > > >>> (unless > > > >>> > > > >>> > a member here has a law degree). > > > >>> > > > > >>> > On Fri, Mar 7, 2014 at 12:41 PM, Omar Rassi <[email protected]> > > > >>> > > > >>> wrote: > > > >>> > > How has Synhak supported drug use? Alcohol is in the fridge and > > > > only > > > > > >>> > > adults consume it. The alcohol is brought in by adults with > > > >>> > > their > > > >>> > > own > > > >>> > > money, not one dime of funds from Synhak's coffers has gone to > > > >>> > > > >>> alcohol. > > > >>> > > > >>> > > Beer brewing is one our supported hacking activities, do we now > > > > need > > > > > >>> to > > > >>> > > > >>> > > have rules on that because people are getting out of control? > > > >>> > > > > > >>> > > On Fri, Mar 7, 2014 at 12:37 PM, Justin Herman < > > > > [email protected]> > > > > > >>> wrote: > > > >>> > >> Omar, > > > >>> > >> > > > >>> > >> Yes the restaurant can be liable IF it can be proven that the > > > >>> > > > >>> restaurant > > > >>> > > > >>> > >> supported this activity. The issue becomes how good is our > > > > defense. > > > > > >>> > >> Justin > > > >>> > >> > > > >>> > >> On Fri, Mar 7, 2014 at 12:34 PM, Omar Rassi < > > > > [email protected]> > > > > > >>> wrote: > > > >>> > >>> So if someone snorts coke in a restaurant bathroom, the > > > > restaurant > > > > > >>> is > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>> liable? Again, I should emphasize, I'm not against the idea, > > > > I'm > > > > > >>> just > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>> against creating more regulation when there already exists the > > > >>> > > > >>> law. It > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>> isn't any of our business what life choices people make. > > > >>> > >>> > > > >>> > >>> On Fri, Mar 7, 2014 at 12:30 PM, Justin Herman < > > > > [email protected] > > > > > >>> >wrote: > > > >>> > >>>> Omar, > > > >>> > >>>> > > > >>> > >>>> Without policy SynHak becomes compliant with legal issues in > > > > the > > > > > >>> space. > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>>> SynHak created the atmosphere for X to occur. Why? Because we > > > >>> > > > >>> wanted to > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>>> not > > > >>> > >>>> have rules is not valid legal defense. ESP since it has now > > > > been > > > > > >>> > >>>> brought up.>>>> > > > >>> > >>>> On Fri, Mar 7, 2014 at 12:27 PM, Omar Rassi > > > >>> > > > >>> <[email protected]>wrote: > > > >>> > >>>>> Personally, I'm not interested in policing the space, I > > > >>> > >>>>> don't > > > >>> > > > >>> come > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>>>> there to keep on eye on other members and visitors. The law > > > >>> > > > >>> doesn't > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>>>> disappear when you walk through the doors so I'm wondering > > > > why > > > > > >>> the > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>>>> organizing needs to apply more paperwork and wording on the > > > >>> > > > >>> subject. > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>>>> On Fri, Mar 7, 2014 at 12:27 PM, Torrie Fischer < > > > >>> > >>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>> [email protected]> wrote: > > > >>> > >>>>>> On Friday, March 07, 2014 12:20:05 Omar Rassi wrote: > > > >>> > >>>>>> > I'm taking this to mean that the liability waiver is not > > > >>> > > > >>> enough > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> anymore. > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > Did something happen at the space recently? I'm not > > > > exactly > > > > > >>> against > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> this > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > idea but so far the majority of people that come to the > > > > space > > > > > >>> and > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > participate have been adults of sound mind. Has this > > > > gotten > > > > > >>> so out > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> of hand > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > that people are no longer able to look out for eachother > > > > or > > > > > >>> > >>>>>> > restrain > > > >>> > >>>>>> > themselves so Synhak Inc. needs to step in and become big > > > >>> > > > >>> brother? > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> Yeah, thats my concern. > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> I thought we were trying to stay away from pre-emptive > > > >>> > >>>>>> rules > > > >>> > > > >>> and were > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> capable > > > >>> > >>>>>> of policing ourselves like adults, or having in person > > > >>> > > > >>> conversations > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> to > > > >>> > >>>>>> address issues instead of slyly bringing up board vote > > > > topics > > > > > >>> that > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> apply to > > > >>> > >>>>>> the whole membership three days before board meetings. > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> I think we need a bylaw amendment that the agenda for a > > > > board > > > > > >>> meeting > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> must be > > > >>> > >>>>>> issued in full with any announcement. > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> Am I allowed to bring issues up minutes before the board > > > >>> > > > >>> meeting? an > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> hour into > > > >>> > >>>>>> it? > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> I think I'll do that. I'll propose that we stop coddling > > > >>> > >>>>>> the > > > >>> > >>>>>> community. > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > On Fri, Mar 7, 2014 at 12:10 PM, Justin Herman < > > > >>> > > > >>> [email protected]> > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> wrote: > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > I think we need to set the option for you to be excused > > > > for > > > > > >>> the > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> day with > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > the possibility of having membership terminated or > > > > banned > > > > > >>> for > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > repeat/egregious behavior. Someone unwilling to > > > > cooperate > > > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > to > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> remove and > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > mitigate the issue and safety is of concern the police > > > >>> > > > >>> should be > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> called. > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > I see a drug and alcohol policy as important as our > > > > safety > > > > > >>> > >>>>>> requirements as > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > it put everyone at risk. Not only can SynHak be held > > > > liable > > > > > >>> but > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> the > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > members > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > and board who allow it to continue can be held liable. > > > >>> > > > >>> Safety is > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> of > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > concern > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > as someone could personally feel they are alright to > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > operate > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> machinery but > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > miss judge they capacity. > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > These are awful concerns and no one likes to think > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > about > > > >>> > > > >>> someone > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> getting > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > hurt BUT without a policy SynHak can't have a leg to > > > > stand > > > > > >>> on. > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > On Fri, Mar 7, 2014 at 11:53 AM, Seeley, Tim > > > > (PSA-Akron) < > > > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > [email protected]> wrote: > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> It might need to say something about what the adult > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> alcohol > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> permitted > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> behavior is. > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> V/R > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> Tim Seeley > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> -----Original Message----- > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> From: [email protected] [mailto: > > > >>> > >>>>>> [email protected]] On > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> Behalf Of Devin Wolfe > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> Sent: Friday, March 07, 2014 11:41 AM > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> To: [email protected] > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> Subject: [SH-Discuss] SYNHAK Drug Policy > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> Hello all, > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> Up until now there has been no formal drug policy at > > > >>> > > > >>> synhak. But > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> with > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> several complaints and concerns raised recently I feel > > > > it > > > > > >>> is > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> time we > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> implement one. As a corporation we jeopardise > > > > ourselves if > > > > > >>> we > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> just turn a > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> blind eye. Plus working around dangerous tools while > > > > under > > > > > >>> the > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> influence > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> is > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> a liability. > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> Here is the wording I plan on submitting to the board: > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> SYNHAK INC. will not condone, endorse, or allow the > > > > use of > > > > > >>> > >>>>>> illegal drugs > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> or related illegal activities including but not > > > > limited to > > > > > >>> > >>>>>> illegal drug > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> use, possession, sale, manufacturing, transfer, > > > > providing > > > > > >>> drugs > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> or > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> alcohol > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> to a minor, or consumption of drugs or alcohol by a > > > > minor, > > > > > >>> as > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> defined and > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> stated in the Ohio Revised Code, any laws or set of > > > > laws > > > > > >>> > >>>>>> pertaining to > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> any > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> location where SYNHAK INC. is at that time conducting > > > >>> > > > >>> business. > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> This > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> pertains but is not limited to agents, > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> representatives, > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> volunteers, > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> members, nonmembers, employees, and contractors. > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> I would like the hear everyone's opinion on this. Also > > > > do > > > > > >>> we > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> need an > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> explicit procedure for discipline or removal if > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> needed? > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> Please do not accuse, slander, or otherwise make this > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> a > > > >>> > > > >>> personal > > > >>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> matter. > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> Keep names out of it. > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> In excellence, > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> Devin Wolfe > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> Sent with AquaMail for Android > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> http://www.aqua-mail.com > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> _______________________________________________ > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> Discuss mailing list > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> [email protected] > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> https://synhak.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> _______________________________________________ > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> Discuss mailing list > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> [email protected] > > > >>> > >>>>>> > >> https://synhak.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > _______________________________________________ > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > Discuss mailing list > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > [email protected] > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > https://synhak.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss > > > >>> > >>>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> _______________________________________________ > > > >>> > >>>>>> Discuss mailing list > > > >>> > >>>>>> [email protected] > > > >>> > >>>>>> https://synhak.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss > > > >>> > >>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>> _______________________________________________ > > > >>> > >>>>> Discuss mailing list > > > >>> > >>>>> [email protected] > > > >>> > >>>>> https://synhak.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss > > > >>> > >>>> > > > >>> > >>>> _______________________________________________ > > > >>> > >>>> Discuss mailing list > > > >>> > >>>> [email protected] > > > >>> > >>>> https://synhak.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss > > > >>> > >>> > > > >>> > >>> _______________________________________________ > > > >>> > >>> Discuss mailing list > > > >>> > >>> [email protected] > > > >>> > >>> https://synhak.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss > > > >>> > >> > > > >>> > >> _______________________________________________ > > > >>> > >> Discuss mailing list > > > >>> > >> [email protected] > > > >>> > >> https://synhak.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss > > > >>> > > > >>> _______________________________________________ > > > >>> Discuss mailing list > > > >>> [email protected] > > > >>> https://synhak.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss > > > >> > > > >> -- > > > >> > > > >> Sincerely, Tomm Smith > > > >> God bless > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > Sincerely, Tomm Smith > > > > God bless > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Discuss mailing list > > > > [email protected] > > > > https://synhak.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Discuss mailing list > > [email protected] > > https://synhak.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss _______________________________________________ Discuss mailing list [email protected] https://synhak.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
