Michael,

I suggest you google a couple dozen pages using the search:

"dust to dust rebuked"

and see what you think after you have read *real* science

instead of quotes and allegations of conditions that existed

in the 1970's applied to Toyota Prius (which definitely did not

exist back then) to just mention a random "fact".

 

Success getting a perspective in the complex material,

so often mis-represented that it almost seems fact.

Cor van de Water
Chief Scientist
Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
<http://www.proxim.com> 
Email: cwa...@proxim.com Private: http://www.cvandewater.info
<http://www.cvandewater.infom> 
Skype: cor_van_de_water Tel: +1 408 383 7626

________________________________

From: Michael Ross [mailto:michael.e.r...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Monday, May 26, 2014 9:10 AM
To: Cor van de Water; Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Solar roadways.

 

Hello Cor,

 

I have seen a "dust to dust" comparison of the inputs necessary to
"have" a particular mdoel of car.

 

They were as absolutely thorough as they could be.  Like giving the
Scion xB credit for not like to be painted an repaired over its life by
virtue of the people that would own it - as compared to say a Hummer
which - due to its profligate attitude will be pampered with much
washing, and definitely repaired to concours condition for many low
mileage years.

 

Interesting and not surprising to many EV types, the Prius was found
slightly less environmentally favorable than said Hummer.

 

The Scions also got credit for their sales effort that did not support
much dealer effort, being mostly an online, no haggle experience (made
it hard to get attention when you went to a dealer looking at them).

 

Despite your complaint of bean counting, there is more to the energy
debt cause by a product than its mere manufacture.

 

 

 

On Mon, May 26, 2014 at 3:11 AM, Cor van de Water via EV
<ev@lists.evdl.org> wrote:

Michael,

Of course - but the energy balance is just a theoretical concept,

a beancounter's satisfaction if you will of checking that the

two sides of a scale balance out - with exact specified quantities

on each side of the scale, no matter whether that is practical.

It is also a means to get a feeling when you install a solar system,

how much energy it needs to produce before it has earned back

the energy that went into making it.

Something to feel-good about when naysayers claim that you are

generating a net loss with all those high-energy-content panels

on the roof - so it is also used to support the claim that after

some 1-2 years, the panels have generated more energy than

they ever costed, so it is not a net-energy-loss as some claim.

Whatever your inclination - there is a whole world out there that

is not accounted for when considering narrow definitions, so for

a lot of practical applications, this is moot.

Most people look at the money and see that their system

generates money after approx 7 years. So they are happy and

whoever says "but it is an energy sink" gets the reply:

and what is your car? Both and energy and money sink.

At least the solar panels are generating money (and energy)...



Cor van de Water
Chief Scientist
Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
<http://www.proxim.com>
Email: cwa...@proxim.com Private: http://www.cvandewater.info
<http://www.cvandewater.infom>
Skype: cor_van_de_water Tel: +1 408 383 7626
<tel:%2B1%20408%20383%207626> 

________________________________

From: Michael Ross [mailto:michael.e.r...@gmail.com]
Sent: Sunday, May 25, 2014 12:33 PM
To: Cor van de Water; Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Solar roadways.



Thank you Cor,



This is just me experimenting with the ideas....



Can we really disregard the energy cost of all those other items making
up the totla cost?



I guess can see leaving out profit (which is sort an excess since
everyone involved already put food on the table, got medical care, and
so on. The people drawing the profit may not have undertaken the PV at
all without the promise of profit, so maybe that too is part of the cost
- energy wise, but it isn't clearly so); but the energy to transport the
panels afterward, to market them, to shuffle salesmen and installers
around, the energy cost of the inverters, disconnects wiring, lights and
heating in the installers physical plant.  Wouldn't all these be
foregone if the panels were never made?

-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL:
<http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20140526/fa50
a08f/attachment.htm>
_______________________________________________
UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org
For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA
(http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)





 

-- 

Put this question to yourself: should I use everyone else to attain
happiness, or should I help others gain happiness?  

Dalai Lama 

 

Tell me what it is you plan to do

With your one wild and precious life?

Mary Oliver, "The summer day."

 

To invent, you need a good imagination and a pile of junk.

Thomas A. Edison
<http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/t/thomasaed125362.html> 

 

A public-opinion poll is no substitute for thought.

Warren Buffet

 

Michael E. Ross

(919) 550-2430 Land

(919) 576-0824 <https://www.google.com/voice/b/0?pli=1#phones>  Google
Phone

(919) 631-1451 Cell
(919) 513-0418 Desk

michael.e.r...@gmail.com

<mailto:michael.e.r...@gmail.com> 



-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: 
<http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20140526/bc641862/attachment.htm>
_______________________________________________
UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org
For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA 
(http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)

Reply via email to