I am just starting to read about microbial electrolysis.  it is interesting
- make H2 from #2 poo and water.  I have no idea if it can scale to the
sort of needs of transportation.  It is even exothermic so it could
generate some sort of thermal energy as a byproduct.

It is still not going to be as efficient as PV to batteries, but it has
merit on the surface - what better thing to do with waste water?

Of course once you have H2 you have to confront the inefficiency of fuel
cells to make power (maybe 40% currently for static industrial power
generation and less for a mobile application).

Straight electrolysis is a bad idea, a non-starter

There is a serious paper linked here:
https://www.google.com/search?q=microbial+electrolysis+cell+review&rlz=1C1CHFX_enUS481US481&oq=MICROBIAL+ELECTROLYSIS+CELL&aqs=chrome.1.69i57j0l5.4724j0j7&sourceid=chrome&es_sm=93&ie=UTF-8


On Mon, Jul 28, 2014 at 9:33 PM, Cor van de Water via EV <ev@lists.evdl.org>
wrote:

> All data I have seen till now shows that emissions go up with the
> indroduction of H2, due to the low efficiency well-to-wheels of creating
> H2.
> So, it is considered not just a very difficult energy carrier, but also
> inefficient, besides being very costly in roll out.
> If you have data to the contrary, I am interested in vetting it (since
> it is easy to mislead with cherry-picked info). My mind is open, I tend
> to decide
> based on data. Fan-boy? Not so much.
> Got a link for that GREET model?
>
> Cor van de Water
> Chief Scientist
> Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
> Email: cwa...@proxim.com Private: http://www.cvandewater.info
> Skype: cor_van_de_water Tel: +1 408 383 7626
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Mark Abramowitz [mailto:ma...@enviropolicy.com]
> Sent: Monday, July 28, 2014 6:27 PM
> To: Cor van de Water; Electric Vehicle Discussion List
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Tesla might Supercharge EVs to regain 400mi in 15min
> for7 credits
>
> You are horribly mistaken if you believe that FCEVs increase current
> emissions of either criteria or GHGs. Again, check the results from the
> GREET model.
>
> Every responsible agency that I work with locally believe that you
> CANNOT meet public health standards or GHG goals without both BEVs and
> FCEVs.
>
> We need a 60%+ decrease in NOx emissions to meet current standards,
> which data indicates are inadequate, and we expect will be tightened
> further.
>
> In a short time, most purchased autos will need to be ZEVs. That means
> that people like Peri, who has identified range issues as necessitating
> his own ICE in addition to a BEV, will need to forget the ICE. For some,
> that will mean BEVs, for some FCEVs, for some hybrids, and (IMO),
> combinations of those as technology progresses.
>
> We need ZEVs of all flavors.
>
> Sorry for your pain, but it's all self-induced as well as hindering
> efforts of those that know what they're doing. The fanboy stuff isn't
> productive for those of us doing real work.
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> > On Jul 28, 2014, at 5:30 PM, Cor van de Water via EV
> <ev@lists.evdl.org> wrote:
> >
> > Mark,
> > If I am mistaken and you do have an interest in the environment,
> > then your words and your actions are in conflict.
> > The fact that you are not just promoting Hydrogen but even lobby to
> > get legislation that makes it a requirement and the environment be
> > damned by the associated increase in CO2 output, makes this all the
> > more painful.
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> > Cor van de Water
> > Chief Scientist
> > Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
> > Email: cwa...@proxim.com Private: http://www.cvandewater.info
> > Skype: cor_van_de_water Tel: +1 408 383 7626
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Mark Abramowitz [mailto:ma...@enviropolicy.com]
> > Sent: Monday, July 28, 2014 8:23 AM
> > To: Cor van de Water; Electric Vehicle Discussion List
> > Subject: Re: [EVDL] Tesla might Supercharge EVs to regain 400mi in
> 15min
> > for7 credits
> >
> > Thank you for falsely stating stating my interest and what I care
> about.
> >
> > Sent from my iPhone
> >
> >>> On Jul 28, 2014, at 12:05 AM, Cor van de Water via EV
> >> <ev@lists.evdl.org> wrote:
> >>
> >> Bill,
> >>
> >> Mark has no interest whether it is simpler to use Hydrogen or not.
> >> He even does not care that the use of Hydrogen will increase the
> > amount
> >> of CO2 being burned (so, it is a disaster for the environment).
> >> He is promoting Hydrogen - that is all. Look up his profile and you
> > will
> >> understand.
> >>
> >> I urge all members of this forum to once again adhere to the earlier
> >> decision to avoid Hydrogen as a topic, because it is.... explosive.
> >>
> >> Cor van de Water
> >> Chief Scientist
> >> Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
> >> Email: cwa...@proxim.com Private: http://www.cvandewater.info
> >> Skype: cor_van_de_water Tel: +1 408 383 7626
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: EV [mailto:ev-boun...@lists.evdl.org] On Behalf Of Bill
> Woodcock
> >> via EV
> >> Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2014 10:58 AM
> >> To: Mark Abramowitz
> >> Cc: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
> >> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Tesla might Supercharge EVs to regain 400mi in
> > 15min
> >> for7 credits
> >>
> >>
> >> On Jul 27, 2014, at 10:39 AM, Mark Abramowitz
> <ma...@enviropolicy.com>
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >>> I've seen an animation of such a device for natural gas dispensing,
> >> and am told it could just as easily be done for hydrogen.
> >>
> >> How does that address what I said?  I've seen animations of the
> >> Incredible Hulk, that doesn't support the proposition that it could
> >> "just as easily be done for X."
> >>
> >>> But we know that whatever is being talked about... trip to the moon,
> >> world peace, cold fusion... you will be certain that it is "simpler,
> >> cheaper, and easier than hydrogen."
> >>
> >> So, prove me wrong.  What is it about hydrogen that you think is
> > easier
> >> to move than electrons?
> >>
> >>                               -Bill
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
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