On Tue, Apr 23, 2013 at 11:21 PM, John Mikes <jami...@gmail.com> wrote:
> And what good does it do to   H A V E  nations? Starting wars? Looking down
> on every other nation? Exploiting strangers/foreigners?
> Nationalism is a pest in the human world.
> You are right saying that it is - sort of - a religious aberration, closely
> connected with religion itself. So the proposition may be true.
> Could anyone LIST the benefits of 'national' existence/feeling?
> (Forget about the secondaries: mother tongue, folk-music, lit, etc.)
> JM

Well said John!
Just like religions, nations are an artefact from an era when there
wasn't anything better to scaffold civilisation. They are becoming
especially ridiculous in the Internet age.

I would tolerate them better if you could migrate freely and chose the
one you like the most (in terms of laws, for example). Then they would
have to compete for citizens, and politicians would have a harder time
getting away with the sort of shenanigans they do nowadays --
criminalisation of victimless behaviours, legislation on the private
sphere, unreasonable wars, humiliation in name of safety and so on.
The concept of "others" is very important to enslave the masses.

Telmo.

>
>
> On Mon, Apr 22, 2013 at 5:39 PM, Alberto G. Corona <agocor...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>>
>> This is like economic laws. If we talk about short and long term effects
>> mixed, there is nothing that can be understood.
>>
>>   In the short time, a crisis trigger humans to enhance social capital by
>> adhering to the common values (which are ever religious of some kind) This
>> enhances mutual help and a decrease of conflcts due to discrepancy of
>> individualistic goals. It is a sort of emergency mode.
>>
>> In the long term, by the same reasons, a group of people that loose its
>> common religious values loose the informal mechanisms of coordination and is
>> going to death, since these values (that  are ultimately religious) are much
>> more important and are the foundation of the formal ones.
>>
>>
>> 2013/4/22 Telmo Menezes <te...@telmomenezes.com>
>>>
>>> On the other hand, belief in god seems to correlate with economic
>>> collapse:
>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Europe_belief_in_god.svg
>>>
>>> On Mon, Apr 22, 2013 at 8:50 PM, Roger Clough <rclo...@verizon.net>
>>> wrote:
>>> > Former KGB Agent explains: The destruction of America from within
>>> >
>>> > Nations die when they lose their religion.
>>> >
>>> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ABWlyt2ldKw
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > Dr. Roger Clough NIST (ret.) 4/22/2013
>>> > http://team.academia.edu/RogerClough
>>> >
>>> > Dr. Roger Clough NIST (ret.) 4/22/2013
>>> > http://team.academia.edu/RogerClough
>>> >
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>>
>>
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