Re: For John Clark

[Bruno Marchal]

On 01 Nov 2013, at 15:17, Platonist Guitar Cowboy wrote:
When some bully oversteps the line of decency, then by default any  
discussion ceases to be rational. Then we are left with the choice  
to let it be or denounce the crossing of our personalized line.

With regards to this infinite back and forth, all the insults and  
cul-de-sac arguments, with zero progress on this exchange with  
Julius Caesar, I believe Quentin has every right to say "spammer"  
and "troll".

Quentin's reaction and tone in this regard are more plausible to me  
than the posts of JC. Increasingly so, in fact. PGC

I can't agree more.

I don't understand why Quentin get nervous (once) on Richard, who was  
just slow to see some point, and that happens to any of us, when  
tired, or something (to be nervous, or to be slow).
Keep in mind people in this list lives under different amount of sun!

But it is a sort of relief for me that you, and Quentin (and some  
others) got also the feeling that JC might act as a bullyer or troll- 
like,. That's clear, to *me* with his insulting tone when trying to  
deride any attempt to study something. I am not too well placed to say  
that to Clark, so I think that you and Quentin are ... rather  
courageous to witness this. That can help everybody.

About Roger Clough, his comment are in the topics, yet a bit aside the  
conversations and thread, and a bit self-advertizing and repetitive,  
but I would not qualify him as spam, although he is very near. Also,  
we get his posts in double exemplars!

Stephen Lin was definitely a spam, and, as someone (Telmo?) suggested,  
possibly a bot.

Bruno





On Fri, Nov 1, 2013 at 2:45 PM, Richard Ruquist <yann...@gmail.com>  
wrote:
Telmo, Do you think Quentin should be banned for bullying?


On Fri, Nov 1, 2013 at 9:39 AM, Telmo Menezes  
<te...@telmomenezes.com> wrote:
On Fri, Nov 1, 2013 at 2:29 PM, Quentin Anciaux <allco...@gmail.com>  
wrote:
>
>
>
> 2013/11/1 Telmo Menezes <te...@telmomenezes.com>
>>
>> On Fri, Nov 1, 2013 at 12:14 PM, Richard Ruquist  
<yann...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> > OK. I should have said "suggests intuitively: or "intuitively  
suggests"
>> > rather than merely "suggests that the universe is finite".  
However, your
>> > insult of categorizing me with roger and stephen lin is  
unmerited.
>>
>> And now you propagate the violence to people who have nothing to do
>> with this discussion. As much as I typically disagree with what  
Roger
>> says (and don't understand what Stephan Lin says), I don't like  
this
>> sort of reference. This is just good old-fashioned bullying.
>
>
> It's also true, but these people did everything to deserve that  
sort of
> "bullying", nobody forced these two individuals to spam the list.

I would be ok with banning them for spamming, but I don't think that
anyone deserves bullying.

> Quentin
>>
>>
>> >
>> > On Fri, Nov 1, 2013 at 7:01 AM, Quentin Anciaux <allco...@gmail.com 
>
>> > wrote:
>> >>
>> >> OK... but then you shouldn't have use that as an argument... I  
respect
>> >> intuition, I don't respect using that as an argument.
>> >>
>> >> Quentin
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> 2013/11/1 Richard Ruquist <yann...@gmail.com>
>> >>>
>> >>> Intuition
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> On Fri, Nov 1, 2013 at 5:17 AM, Quentin Anciaux <allco...@gmail.com 
>
>> >>> wrote:
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Le 1 nov. 2013 00:39, "Richard Ruquist" <yann...@gmail.com>  
a écrit :
>> >>>> >
>> >>>> > John, you are not the first that Quentin has categorized  
as a roger
>> >>>> > or
>> >>>> > stephen lin. Richard
>> >>>>
>> >>>> What does suggest that the universe is finite in the fact  
that we've
>> >>>> found a fully formed galaxy 700 millions years after the big  
bang?
>> >>>> Quentin
>> >>>> >
>> >>>> > On Thu, Oct 31, 2013 at 5:19 PM, Quentin Anciaux
>> >>>> > <allco...@gmail.com>
>> >>>> > wrote:
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>> >>
>> >>>> >>
>> >>>> >>
>> >>>> >>
>> >>>> >> 2013/10/31 John Clark <johnkcl...@gmail.com>
>> >>>> >>>
>> >>>> >>> On Thu, Oct 31, 2013 at 2:45 PM, Quentin Anciaux
>> >>>> >>> <allco...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>>> >>>
>> >>>> >>>>> >> As I said before there is a profound difference  
between the
>> >>>> >>>>> >> two. After Everett's thought experiment is over  
only ONE
>> >>>> >>>>> >> person is seen by a
>> >>>> >>>>> >> third party so it's easy to determine who "you" is  
and easy
>> >>>> >>>>> >> to determine if
>> >>>> >>>>> >> predictions about what "you" will see were right or  
wrong,
>> >>>> >>>>> >> but with Bruno's
>> >>>> >>>>> >> thought experiment TWO people can be clearly seen  
that have
>> >>>> >>>>> >> a equal right to
>> >>>> >>>>> >> the title "you" which means that the predictions  
about what
>> >>>> >>>>> >> "you" will see
>> >>>> >>>>> >> are useless. And another difference is that Everett  
was
>> >>>> >>>>> >> talking about
>> >>>> >>>>> >> prediction and probability, and neither has  
anything to do
>> >>>> >>>>> >> with identity or
>> >>>> >>>>> >> a sense of self. [...]  In Everett's case we know  
who "you"
>> >>>> >>>>> >> is, it's the
>> >>>> >>>>> >> only fellow we see. In Bruno's case right now we  
see 2
>> >>>> >>>>> >> people clear as a
>> >>>> >>>>> >> bell and both are called "you" and both saw different
>> >>>> >>>>> >> things, and that makes
>> >>>> >>>>> >> meaningless the question asked yesterday "what is the
>> >>>> >>>>> >> probability "you" will
>> >>>> >>>>> >> see X?".  [...]  The diary is useless because the  
diary was
>> >>>> >>>>> >> written by "you"
>> >>>> >>>>> >> and contains predictions about the further  
adventures of
>> >>>> >>>>> >> "you", but now
>> >>>> >>>>> >> there are 2 (or more) people with the title "you"  
and no way
>> >>>> >>>>> >> to determine
>> >>>> >>>>> >> which one the diary was referring to.  And the  
diary is
>> >>>> >>>>> >> useless because good
>> >>>> >>>>> >> predictions have no more to do with identity or a  
sense of
>> >>>> >>>>> >> self than bad
>> >>>> >>>>> >> predictions.
>> >>>> >>>>
>> >>>> >>>>
>> >>>> >>>> > So are you at last ready to reject MWI...? if you  
don't, you
>> >>>> >>>> > are
>> >>>> >>>> > not consistent
>> >>>> >>>
>> >>>> >>>
>> >>>> >>> The following is a flow diagram of the conversation  
we've been
>> >>>> >>> having on this thread:
>> >>>> >>>
>> >>>> >>
>> >>>> >> No you got it wrong, see previous message for the real  
steps...
>> >>>> >>
>> >>>> >> Anyway, if 've waited too much to put you in the  
boitakon, meet
>> >>>> >> roger
>> >>>> >> and stephen li... you'll never acknowledge you're wrong,  
because
>> >>>> >> you're just
>> >>>> >> a troll.
>> >>>> >>
>> >>>> >> Quentin
>> >>>>
>> >>>> >>
>> >>>> >>>
>> >>>> >>> Step 1: Quentin Anciaux states that John Clark treats  
Everett's
>> >>>> >>> ideas and Bruno's ideas inconsistently.
>> >>>> >>>
>> >>>> >>> Step 2: John Clark points out the ways Everett's ideas  
about
>> >>>> >>> probability and prediction and Bruno's ideas about the  
nature of
>> >>>> >>> self are
>> >>>> >>> fundamentally different.
>> >>>> >>>
>> >>>> >>> Step 3: Quentin Anciaux neither agrees nor disagrees  
with John
>> >>>> >>> Clark's points.
>> >>>> >>>
>> >>>> >>> Step 4: Quentin Anciaux inserts one or more personal  
insults
>> >>>> >>> directed at John Clark.
>> >>>> >>>
>> >>>> >>> Step 5: GOTO step 1.
>> >>>> >>>
>> >>>> >>>    John k Clark
>> >>>> >>>
>> >>>> >>>
>> >>>> >>>
>> >>>> >>>
>> >>>> >>> --
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http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/



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