On 03 Jan 2015, at 23:39, meekerdb wrote:
On 1/3/2015 7:47 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote:
On 03 Jan 2015, at 09:28, 'Chris de Morsella' via Everything List
wrote:
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]
] On Behalf Of Bruno Marchal
Sent: Thursday, January 01, 2015 3:36 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Democracy
On 31 Dec 2014, at 20:12, 'Chris de Morsella' via Everything List
wrote:
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]
] On Behalf Of Bruno Marchal
Sent: Tuesday, December 30, 2014 5:34 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Democracy
On 30 Dec 2014, at 01:38, 'Chris de Morsella' via Everything List
wrote:
----- Forwarded Message -----
From: Alberto G. Corona <[email protected]>
To: everything-list <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, December 29, 2014 10:27 AM
Subject: Re: Democracy
>>The Soviet union can be formally considered a "democracy". There
is nothing external or formal that may distinguish a democracy
from any other regime. Since every modern state has the same
elements. All of them use the momenclature of the age. The word
democracy is the most overused world in this century togeter with
"scientific".
No word comes close to matching the overuse of the word "god"
however.
Yes, ... and no.
For the greeks "God" was just a pointer to the truth we are
searching, through theories and observation. It led to math and
physics, + inquiry about which one is more fundamental, and what
might still be beyond math and physics. That use of God remains in
some language expression, like when we say "only God knows", which
means "I don't know".
But that is how the word was used in the Hellenistic period; I was
referring to modern usage that has associated it with a
monotheistic value system.
I think monotheism is only the "personal" view of the monism of the
parmenides one.
I think that the theology of the christians and jews reflect the
monism of those who believe in an unifying truth. The fairy tales
is a pedagogical popularization, who get wrong when the religion is
(too much) mixed with politics.
But it necessarily is mixed with politics, it's main function is
political because the "unifying truths" are the cultural
proscriptions about behavior and values.
Not in the parmenides. Somehow in the Republic, but I guess you talk
only of the christians (ah, you confirm this in your reply to PGC).
But that is the problem, and yes Plato, and even Plotinus, who tried
to create a city Platonopoly, wre wrong on this, as Plotinus was
already aware in the ennead (that it could go in the falling soul
direction).
Religion can influence politics, but without saying so, privately. We
just don't mix the temporal and the atemporal, even if each individual
can be inspired by his religious cogitation and medictation or
experiences. If not it is a blasphem, which in Plato theology can be
translate into "argument per-authority" (indeed the worst one).
God is the law-giver; he's the tyrant writ large who sees all,
judges all, and rewards and punishes all.
OK, you definitely talk about post roman religion. That was wrong, and
that is why I suggest we backtrack to Plato and Plotinus, refined and
corrected by the universal machine. It should be obvious that one we
do theology as a science, we have to abandon wishful thinking and any
ethical consideration in the assumption. We can only *hope* that
Einstein was right: God might be subtle but not malicious.
The truths of mathematics and physics and biology are of little
relevance. His "truths" are about procreation and war and ethics
and loyalty to the tribe.
For the Roman, and I'm afraid, also for Mohammed, probably due to the
circumstances. Before, "his truth" was the theorem of mathematics,
well, almost.
>>Which comes from the ONE of the greeks, mixed with the Jewish
legend. Well, if you forget the superstition, it has some
important relation. Monotheism is a reflexion of parmenides or
Plotinus monism.
Perhaps you are referring to the Jewish mystic concept of the
sephiroth kether (kether means crown in Hebrew) it is that which
is manifest yet cannot be named; the first divine emanation out of
pure abstract space… that is without form or definition yet which
fills and animates all things…. The divine spark so to speak.
I think so.
A few examples “a God fearing” man (or woman) is upstanding, moral
and considered (by other god-fearers at least) to be superior to
those who do not fear god;
But this "fearing of God" is a mystery to me. God should be good.
Only the devil should be feared. (between us).
Unless you are the devil.
The devil is in hell, but not among the tortured, as he is the
torturer. You know, the daemons are very happy in hell. It is their
home. They thank God for that. (I put myself in the post roman type of
religion which are inconsistent with computationalism: so you need to
add a brick of salt here).
Unless you don't want to obey God's orders to stone adulterers and
conquer unbelievers and tithe to the priests.
Brent
"You can safely assume you've created God in your own image when it
turns out that God hates all the same people you do."
- Anne Lamott
Good point.
Of course today we know that God has created the cat in his own image,
and that he created the humans to serve the cats, and to give them
shelter, heat, cough, sofa, music, milk, cat-food and bags of legal
catnip. All we can hope is becoming a cat in the next life.
Bruno
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