On 2/11/2015 10:09 PM, Jason Resch wrote:
On Wed, Feb 11, 2015 at 10:59 PM, meekerdb <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:On 2/11/2015 10:48 AM, LizR wrote:On 12 February 2015 at 04:46, Jason Resch <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: On Wed, Feb 11, 2015 at 4:15 AM, LizR <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: On 11 February 2015 at 20:57, Jason Resch <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: On Wed, Feb 11, 2015 at 1:44 AM, LizR <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: On 11 February 2015 at 18:29, meekerdb <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: On 2/10/2015 5:47 PM, Jason Resch wrote:On Tue, Feb 10, 2015 at 5:57 PM, LizR <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: I call this the Cyberman (or Mr Spock) problem. The Cybermen in Doctor Who are logical and unemotional, yet they wish to convert the rest of the world to be like them. Why? Without emotion they have no reason to do that, or anything else. (Likewise Mr Spock, except as we know he only repressed his emotions.) I'm not sure whether emotions are necessary to have goals. Then again, perhaps they are.The 'big' emotions like fear, rage, lust probably aren't, but values, feelings that this is preferred to that, are. I don't see how one could have an opinion on whether one should do anything without emotions being involved. So do you believe the Mars Rover is motivated to explore by its emotions? I don't believe it is motivated at all, in the sense that a conscious being is. Then couldn't the cybermen be like the Mars Rover? or vice-versa, could a Mars Rover be programmed with the goal of the cybermen yet not have emotions? No I think the cybermen are intended to be conscious, and emotions are what evolved to make conscious beings do stuff that was necessary to their survival.Do you think that consciousness is necessary for emotion? Certainly snails and insects react to things in their environment in order to enhance their survival. Is that emotion? I think it is, but maybe it's just a question of semantics? Are they conscious or merely aware? How is consciousness different from awareness?
I don't think there's any agreed on definition of these terms, but what I propose is that consciousness includes self-awareness, i.e. that the organism has a world-model in which it has a particular place or function relative to other things. Awareness is a lesser level of consciousness in which the organism reacts to events the environment in a way to realize some goals, such as growth and reproduction.
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