On Saturday, November 10, 2018 at 1:11:01 AM UTC, Brent wrote:
>
>
>
> On 11/9/2018 4:51 PM, Bruce Kellett wrote:
>
> From: Brent Meeker <meek...@verizon.net <javascript:>>
>
>
> You're dodging my point.  The "issue" of how we have subjective experience 
> only seems to be an issue because in comparison to the "objective" 
> experience of matter where we can trace long, mathematically define causal 
> chains down to...a Lagrangian and coupling constants or something similar, 
> which is long enough and esoteric enough that almost everyone loses 
> interest along the way.  But some people (like Vic) are going to say, "But 
> where does the Langrangian and coupling constants come from?"  and "Why a 
> Lagrangian anyway?" My point is that when we can give a similarly deep and 
> detailed account of why you think of an elephant when reading this, then 
> nobody will worry about "the hard problem of consciousness"; just like they 
> don't worry about "the hard problems of matter" like where that Lagrangian 
> comes from or why a complex Hilbert space.
>
>
> Why can't I worry about those things? Where does the Lagrangian come from? 
> And why use a complex Hilbert space? I don't think this is the underlying 
> reason for saying that the "hard problem" of consciousness dissolves on 
> solving the engineering problems. Solving the engineering problems will 
> enable us to produce a fully conscious AI -- but will we then know how it 
> works? We will certainly know where it came from.....
>
>
> I just meant those as current examples.  Suppose you find that Lagrangians 
> come from POVI, as Vic proposed.  Then one can ask, "Why POVI?"  Vic 
> implied it was a choice, but that didn't explain why is an available 
> choice. 
>

*I thought he did explain it, or at least he offered a provisional 
explanation; namely, if the laws of physics were not POVI, they wouldn't 
exist. We couldn't do physics. AG*

So I think both the problem of consciousness and the problem of matter are 
> both "hard"; the problem of matter seems "easy" because we've come a long 
> way in 400yrs of solving the engineering problems of matter.
>
> Brent
>

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"Everything List" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/everything-list.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

Reply via email to