On Saturday, November 10, 2018 at 1:11:01 AM UTC, Brent wrote: > > > > On 11/9/2018 4:51 PM, Bruce Kellett wrote: > > From: Brent Meeker <[email protected] <javascript:>> > > > You're dodging my point. The "issue" of how we have subjective experience > only seems to be an issue because in comparison to the "objective" > experience of matter where we can trace long, mathematically define causal > chains down to...a Lagrangian and coupling constants or something similar, > which is long enough and esoteric enough that almost everyone loses > interest along the way. But some people (like Vic) are going to say, "But > where does the Langrangian and coupling constants come from?" and "Why a > Lagrangian anyway?" My point is that when we can give a similarly deep and > detailed account of why you think of an elephant when reading this, then > nobody will worry about "the hard problem of consciousness"; just like they > don't worry about "the hard problems of matter" like where that Lagrangian > comes from or why a complex Hilbert space. > > > Why can't I worry about those things? Where does the Lagrangian come from? > And why use a complex Hilbert space? I don't think this is the underlying > reason for saying that the "hard problem" of consciousness dissolves on > solving the engineering problems. Solving the engineering problems will > enable us to produce a fully conscious AI -- but will we then know how it > works? We will certainly know where it came from..... > > > I just meant those as current examples. Suppose you find that Lagrangians > come from POVI, as Vic proposed. Then one can ask, "Why POVI?" Vic > implied it was a choice, but that didn't explain why is an available > choice. >
*I thought he did explain it, or at least he offered a provisional explanation; namely, if the laws of physics were not POVI, they wouldn't exist. We couldn't do physics. AG* So I think both the problem of consciousness and the problem of matter are > both "hard"; the problem of matter seems "easy" because we've come a long > way in 400yrs of solving the engineering problems of matter. > > Brent > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
