Le ven. 19 juil. 2019 à 13:02, Philip Thrift <[email protected]> a écrit :
> > > On Friday, July 19, 2019 at 5:50:11 AM UTC-5, Quentin Anciaux wrote: >> >> >> >> Le ven. 19 juil. 2019 à 12:18, Philip Thrift <[email protected]> a >> écrit : >> >>> >>> >>> On Friday, July 19, 2019 at 3:52:05 AM UTC-5, telmo wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ... >>>> You insist that nobody has been able to produce a computer without >>>> using matter. I agree. What you refuse to consider is the possibility that >>>> matter is the dream of computations, and not the other way around. Whatever >>>> we are, it seems clear that we are bound to perceive reality as made of >>>> matter, but it doesn't follow that matter is the ultimate reality. This is >>>> just Plato's Cave with modern language. >>>> >>>> Telmo. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> I've been perplexed for 50 years how the idea of immaterialism (that >>> there is something other than matter) came to be. >>> >>> The so-called abstractions - like the definition of the Turing machine >>> you read in a textbook - are just fictions. But fictions can be useful. >>> Maybe there should be a better word for useful fictions. Math is as good as >>> any, for part of that anyway. >>> >>> The old guys, Thales, Democritus, Epicurus, were curious about matter. >>> Where did this bizarre trend towards immaterialism come from? >>> >> >> How is trend to believe there is only matter (what is it ?) came to be ? >> How is the believe in *only matter* not bizarre ? It is as bizarre as >> anything reality is... I don't see materialism as less bizarre than >> anything about the nature of reality... as if we knew what reality was... >> It seems to me it's the people who believe there are some beliefs about >> reality which are *not* bizarre that are bizarre. >> >> Quentin >> >>> >>> *The original sin of philosophy occurred when mathematical and mental >>> (and computational) entities were abstracted away from their material home.* >>> >>> @pphilipthrift >>> >>> > > > > I just don't believe in anything immaterial, or supernatural - like God, > or ghosts. It is a fact a lot of people do. Some just are prone to believe > in the immaterial/supernatural: > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antimaterialism > I understand, but *how* your beliefs are *not* bizarre ? Do you know what reality is ? > > > @philipthrift > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/b206f0be-f161-4d55-b436-f8c8d6c4c482%40googlegroups.com > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/b206f0be-f161-4d55-b436-f8c8d6c4c482%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > -- All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain. (Roy Batty/Rutger Hauer) -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/CAMW2kAoQ%3DLaiC0DwbxQsKtJD%2Bf9R7pt_jEy9wXG6OrB25K6pPg%40mail.gmail.com.
