Please note that we are not putting the content into public domain by using it, public domain means nobody owns the content, but the copyright still belongs to Valve. Just as mod as your mod belongs to you. It's the same laws that makes it legal to post screenshots of HL2 and make comics with GMod.
Of course the content will be available on the Internet when you release a mod, but it still depends on products purchased from Valve in order to function. I agree with what Jed just said, and think this should be the end of the discussion, unless anyone has new information to contribute with. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Julian Moschüring" <[email protected]> To: "Discussion of Half-Life Programming" <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, May 14, 2009 4:39 PM Subject: Re: [hlcoders] Game Content >I don't think "fair use" will work here because we are speaking about > content that was bought for money and which you want to put into public > domain. Even for educational purposes you will not be allowed to use the > content in public without permission from valve. > > Jonas 'Sortie' Termansen schrieb: >> I just read the Steam Subscriber Agreement ( >> http://store.steampowered.com/subscriber_agreement/ ) and it said nothing >> about .GCF files or using unmounted content. However, it defines "Steam >> Software" as "software and other content and updates", and restricts you >> from >> >> "with regard to the SDK, you may not, in whole or in part, copy, >> photocopy, >> reproduce, translate, reverse engineer, derive source code, modify, >> disassemble, decompile, create derivative works based on, or remove any >> proprietary notices or labels from the Steam Software or any software >> accessed via Steam" >> >> Other agreements with Valve might apply, which I have forgotten about, or >> didn't read because they shouldn't cover copyright, such as the Steam >> Online >> Conduct ruleset, or the Valve Privacy Policy. >> >> The definition of Steam Software is unclear, and doesn't specify whether >> it >> includes the specific game content or not, but if it doesn't, the game >> content is fully covered by US Copyright Laws. Again, thus it could >> qualify >> as Fair Use (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fair_use for more >> information) >> because the works are non-comerical, only uses a bit of Valve's work CS:S >> as >> a whole, (educational purposes can apply to GuildHall mods for instance), >> and that a mod using a CS:S model will not harm or limit Valve's >> marketing >> or sales. >> >> Again, I have seen quite a few mods that utilizes content extracted from >> the >> .gcf files, such as TF2 or CS:S content, but I am yet to hear Valve >> complain >> about such usage. Note that Valve Employees probably will not respond to >> any >> questions regarding this, as they are not allowed to act officially for >> Valve without permission. If you really care, do mail the copyright >> department of Valve and ask. Of course, using a lot of CS:S content (such >> as >> binaries and maps) is not fair use, as it will be an illegal copy of the >> game (perhaps even stand-alone.) >> >> In conclusion, the Steam Subscriber Agreement doesn't directly prohibit >> you >> from extract and shipping content from the .GCF files, and if you do it >> carefully, it could count as Fair Use, and people on this list states >> that >> Valve doesn't care (which doesn't make it legal). I don't recommend doing >> so >> though, because it's questionably legal, but it's your decision. >> >> - Sortie >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Olly" <[email protected]> >> To: "Discussion of Half-Life Programming" >> <[email protected]> >> Sent: Thursday, May 14, 2009 3:58 PM >> Subject: Re: [hlcoders] Game Content >> >> >> >>> If its in the EULA (which I think it is) that says that you cannot use >>> unmounted content. Then you just shouldn't unless you have consent from >>> Valve. >>> Downloading music is illigal, and that's just copying data. I also >>> wouldn't >>> make any money from doing so. >>> >>> Emailing them would have been a much easier/accurate way to get an >>> answer. >>> >>> 2009/5/14 Saul Rennison <[email protected]> >>> >>> >>>> If it is actually illegal Valve will confront you and politely ask you >>>> to >>>> remove the copyrighted content, then when you do everything's OK. No >>>> trouble! >>>> >>>> 2009/5/14 Jonas 'Sortie' Termansen <[email protected]> >>>> >>>> >>>>> Technically, you are not stealing from Valve by making a copy of their >>>>> works, if they don't lose anything, which the clause that you only use >>>>> a >>>>> small portion of their content includes, because the content cannot >>>>> substitute CS:S, and then it won't affect their sales, thus it can >>>>> >>>> quality >>>> >>>>> as Fair Use under the US Copyright laws. But it's still untested in >>>>> >>>> court, >>>> >>>>> and will vary on a case basis, and I am not an US copyright expert. >>>>> The >>>>> same >>>>> argument goes for editing the content. Again, note that I don't >>>>> recommend >>>>> doing this, but if it's legal due to Fair Use, and you only use small >>>>> amounts of content, it will be much faster for the mod to load the >>>>> >>>> content >>>> >>>>> from its own folder, instead of adding another search path, which >>>>> >>>> increases >>>> >>>>> loadtimes. >>>>> >>>>> Oh and be careful when mounting .GCFs from code and not the >>>>> gameinfo.txt, >>>>> >>>> I >>>> >>>>> had some experience that some people couldn't launch the mod >>>>> >>>> successfully, >>>> >>>>> even if they had the .GCF I was mounting. Might be fixed though, but >>>>> >>>> still. >>>> >>>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>> From: "Julian Moschüring" <[email protected]> >>>>> To: "Discussion of Half-Life Programming" < >>>>> >>>> [email protected] >>>> >>>>> Sent: Thursday, May 14, 2009 2:57 PM >>>>> Subject: Re: [hlcoders] Game Content >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> "-You only included small amounts of Valve's copyrighted works" >>>>>> Nice reasoning, so if I go into a shop and only steal eg a part of a >>>>>> computer thats okay? :-) >>>>>> >>>>>> I think you should mount the CS:S content because you have to make >>>>>> sure >>>>>> the users who use your mod own the right to have the models you >>>>>> >>>> provide. >>>> >>>>>> Legally you are not even allowed to ship the modified model. To do it >>>>>> totally right you would have to extract the gcf during install and >>>>>> >>>> modify >>>> >>>>>> the original model... but, as Jonas said, I don't think valve will >>>>>> complain about this. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Jonas 'Sortie' Termansen schrieb: >>>>>> >>>>>>> My personal expierence is that you can use CS:S Content in your mod. >>>>>>> >>>> The >>>> >>>>>>> 100% legal way is to mount CS:S content but that requires CS:S to be >>>>>>> installed and owned by everyone who own your mod. Then if you modify >>>>>>> a >>>>>>> few >>>>>>> models, you can simply make some replacements in your own mod folder >>>>>>> >>>>> that >>>>> >>>>>>> will override the CS:S content. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> If you want a more questionable method that allows everyone to play >>>>>>> >>>> your >>>> >>>>>>> mod >>>>>>> (and faster because you don't have to mount another .gcf file or >>>>>>> two), >>>>>>> you >>>>>>> can simply extract the few models you wish to edit and their >>>>>>> >>>> materials, >>>> >>>>>>> and >>>>>>> put them in your mod's folder. This way you don't depend on any >>>>>>> extra >>>>>>> .gcf >>>>>>> files or that people have CS:S installed. This should work fine for >>>>>>> >>>>> small >>>>> >>>>>>> amounts of content. While untested in court, it could qualify for >>>>>>> Fair >>>>>>> Use >>>>>>> because: >>>>>>> - You only included small amounts of Valve's copyrighted works >>>>>>> - The content required at least one of Valve's products >>>>>>> - The content used doesn't include the whole CS:S and doesn't limit >>>>>>> Valve's >>>>>>> sales, because the content isn't CS:S >>>>>>> - You do not earn any money from their works >>>>>>> - (You edited their works to some degree) >>>>>>> - (I have never heard of Valve having any complaints about this, as >>>>>>> >>>> long >>>> >>>>>>> as >>>>>>> the above is true, despite the EULA probably saying otherwise) >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Again, whether it's legal or advised to extract and ship the >>>>>>> contents >>>>>>> >>>> of >>>> >>>>>>> a >>>>>>> GCF file, the perfectly safe but annoying way of doing it is >>>>>>> mounting >>>>>>> >>>>> the >>>>> >>>>>>> CSS GCF file, but the way you do it is up to you. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>>>> From: "Yaakov Smith" <[email protected]> >>>>>>> To: "'Discussion of Half-Life Programming'" >>>>>>> <[email protected]> >>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, May 14, 2009 12:09 PM >>>>>>> Subject: [hlcoders] Game Content >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Example: I want to mess with CS:S models and include modifications >>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>> said models in my mod. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Could I legally do that, but mount the CS:S content to cover the >>>>>>>> >>>> legal >>>> >>>>>>>> aspect? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list >>>>>>>> >>>> archives, >>>> >>>>>>>> please visit: >>>>>>>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list >>>>>>> archives, >>>>>>> please visit: >>>>>>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list >>>>>> archives, >>>>>> please visit: >>>>>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, >>>>> please visit: >>>>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> -- >>>> Thanks, >>>> - Saul. >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, >>>> please visit: >>>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> -- >>> Sent from Olly's SEGA Game Gear >>> _______________________________________________ >>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, >>> please visit: >>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, >> please visit: >> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders >> >> > > > _______________________________________________ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders > > _______________________________________________ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
