I agree, but your second point implies that you mount, in this case, the CS:S content, which was the question which started this thread. :-) Perhaps one of the main reason someone plays your mod is that the models are so great. If you don't mount the CS:S content you would take money from valve because if you had mounted it some people would have bought CS:S to play your mod... mmh
I would mount the content and publish the mod with the model. You could also check if the content is mountable and if not use some standard model instead of the CS:S ones. Jed schrieb: > I think the great questions are: > > Is it hurting them? > Is it worth them taking legal action? > > As has been pointed out, if you are just borrowing a few low-key (i.e > not character/player) models such as props you're not really giving > away the whole CSS game nor are you really damaging sales. > > Secondly, if borrowing a few models helps you get your free mod out > the door, it might well prompt a player to purchase say the Orange Box > to be able to play your mod - $$$ for Valve. > > Thirdly, the legal costs of taking any modder to task for borrowing a > few props for his Source mod is going to be far in excess of their > market value. > > >From my experience of dealing with Valve first hand I like to think > their a level headed bunch of chaps and their attitude is that if > you're not "taking the piss" with borrowed/reworked content or using > it outside of a Source mod then it's acceptable. Of course that's my > opinion and not fact. > > Then again I think it's a sad reflection on the litigious society of > today if a few modders would be stomped on from trying to learn and > innovate for fear of legal repercussion. > > - Jed > > > > > 2009/5/14 Jonas 'Sortie' Termansen <hlcod...@maxsi.dk>: > >> Technically, you are not stealing from Valve by making a copy of their >> works, if they don't lose anything, which the clause that you only use a >> small portion of their content includes, because the content cannot >> substitute CS:S, and then it won't affect their sales, thus it can quality >> as Fair Use under the US Copyright laws. But it's still untested in court, >> and will vary on a case basis, and I am not an US copyright expert. The same >> argument goes for editing the content. Again, note that I don't recommend >> doing this, but if it's legal due to Fair Use, and you only use small >> amounts of content, it will be much faster for the mod to load the content >> from its own folder, instead of adding another search path, which increases >> loadtimes. >> >> Oh and be careful when mounting .GCFs from code and not the gameinfo.txt, I >> had some experience that some people couldn't launch the mod successfully, >> even if they had the .GCF I was mounting. Might be fixed though, but still. >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Julian Moschüring" <ar...@gmx.com> >> To: "Discussion of Half-Life Programming" <hlcoders@list.valvesoftware.com> >> Sent: Thursday, May 14, 2009 2:57 PM >> Subject: Re: [hlcoders] Game Content >> >> >> >>> "-You only included small amounts of Valve's copyrighted works" >>> Nice reasoning, so if I go into a shop and only steal eg a part of a >>> computer thats okay? :-) >>> >>> I think you should mount the CS:S content because you have to make sure >>> the users who use your mod own the right to have the models you provide. >>> Legally you are not even allowed to ship the modified model. To do it >>> totally right you would have to extract the gcf during install and modify >>> the original model... but, as Jonas said, I don't think valve will >>> complain about this. >>> >>> >>> Jonas 'Sortie' Termansen schrieb: >>> >>>> My personal expierence is that you can use CS:S Content in your mod. The >>>> 100% legal way is to mount CS:S content but that requires CS:S to be >>>> installed and owned by everyone who own your mod. Then if you modify a >>>> few >>>> models, you can simply make some replacements in your own mod folder that >>>> will override the CS:S content. >>>> >>>> If you want a more questionable method that allows everyone to play your >>>> mod >>>> (and faster because you don't have to mount another .gcf file or two), >>>> you >>>> can simply extract the few models you wish to edit and their materials, >>>> and >>>> put them in your mod's folder. This way you don't depend on any extra >>>> .gcf >>>> files or that people have CS:S installed. This should work fine for small >>>> amounts of content. While untested in court, it could qualify for Fair >>>> Use >>>> because: >>>> - You only included small amounts of Valve's copyrighted works >>>> - The content required at least one of Valve's products >>>> - The content used doesn't include the whole CS:S and doesn't limit >>>> Valve's >>>> sales, because the content isn't CS:S >>>> - You do not earn any money from their works >>>> - (You edited their works to some degree) >>>> - (I have never heard of Valve having any complaints about this, as long >>>> as >>>> the above is true, despite the EULA probably saying otherwise) >>>> >>>> Again, whether it's legal or advised to extract and ship the contents of >>>> a >>>> GCF file, the perfectly safe but annoying way of doing it is mounting the >>>> CSS GCF file, but the way you do it is up to you. >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: "Yaakov Smith" <m4ngr...@gmail.com> >>>> To: "'Discussion of Half-Life Programming'" >>>> <hlcoders@list.valvesoftware.com> >>>> Sent: Thursday, May 14, 2009 12:09 PM >>>> Subject: [hlcoders] Game Content >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> Example: I want to mess with CS:S models and include modifications of >>>>> the >>>>> said models in my mod. >>>>> >>>>> Could I legally do that, but mount the CS:S content to cover the legal >>>>> aspect? >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, >>>>> please visit: >>>>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, >>>> please visit: >>>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders >>>> >>>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, >>> please visit: >>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders >>> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, >> please visit: >> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders >> >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please > visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders > _______________________________________________ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
