Reinier, How about you come to the forum with something constructive to say instead of bashing what everyone else is saying? Seriously, people would like to find a path through this mess and have something they can definitively say when their boss starts asking questions. All you have done is voiced a lot of disappointment and angst. I mentioned OpenJDK as an option and there is some concern from Neal Gafter that there might be problems there too.
If you have a better idea, please share it for all of us to read. Sorry, but I take offense at people who just go around bashing what others say when they have nothing to contribute. - Robert On Fri, Sep 3, 2010 at 5:16 AM, Reinier Zwitserloot <[email protected]>wrote: > You're taking something Neal says as gospel? > > He's might be a professional troll, paid by microsoft to sow confusion > in the ranks. > > This is a copy of the OSS (the precursor of the CIA)'s manual on > casual sabotage in the field. It has a section on sabotaging > businesses. Neal pretty much covered everything in that on various > java language mailing lists. I don't know if he's merely a pedantic > stickler, or actively trying to sabotage java. Just saying. > > http://www.slideshare.net/pastinson/u-oss-simple-sabotage-sm > > On Sep 2, 7:31 pm, dario <[email protected]> wrote: > > Apparently not. > > > > From Neal Gafter's recent blog posting: > > > > "...even though I am a contributor to openjdk7, I do not have a > > license to Oracle's patents that are necessarily infringed by the use > > of the openjdk7 source base. This is a very confusing position for the > > organizer of an open-source effort to take." > > > > http://gafter.blogspot.com/2010/08/couple-of-comments-on-defender-met... > > > > -Dario > > > > On Aug 31, 10:29 am, Jan Goyvaerts <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Is OpenJDK independent from Oracle ? > > > > > On Tue, Aug 31, 2010 at 16:24, Robert Casto <[email protected]> > wrote: > > > > I very much like where this thread is headed. > > > > > > Having viable options with Java that Oracle can not touch sounds like > a win > > > > for the community. There is a lot of value in those libraries that > can be > > > > leveraged by a developer. That makes them productive and of benefit > to a > > > > company. If all we have to do is change the underlying VM to > something that > > > > is safe from Oracle, then so be it. I'm sure that VM would get a lot > more > > > > attention from the community to make it great for production use. > > > > > > On Tue, Aug 31, 2010 at 8:43 AM, Kevin Wright < > [email protected]>wrote: > > > > > >> Funny really, in OS design the small core, big libs approach has > long been > > > >> preferred. > > > > > >> The windows NT MicroKernel dates back to 1993 > > > >> The original Unix Kernel, 1973 > > > > > >> In programming languages, it's not so clear-cut. LISP dates back to > 1958, > > > >> and even then you could define your own control constructs within > the > > > >> language - the actual spec is VERY small. > > > > > >> C++ and derivatives (including Java, C#) broke from this, with > > > >> higher-level constructs such as `for`, `switch` and `while` being > deeply > > > >> embedded at the library level and in the VM. Clojure, Scala and F# > are once > > > >> again pulling the pendulum back again to the small kernel, big libs > idea > > > >> (working with the VM as necessary), and LLVM is doing the same sort > of thing > > > >> at a lower level. For example, tail-call optimisation against the > JVM is > > > >> currently achieved through a technique known as "trampolining" ( > > > >>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tail_recursion#Implementation_methods) > > > > > >> So perhaps with the shifting trends in languages, a lighter weight > VM > > > >> really is the right way to go, especially if VMKit & co. can be used > to > > > >> allow us to get at all those juicy open-source libs... > > > > > >> On 31 August 2010 13:25, Miroslav Pokorny < > [email protected]>wrote: > > > > > >>> The reason Java became the most popular platform on the planet is > because > > > >>> of all the oss libraries. Nothing out there beats or even comes > close in > > > >>> comparison. Good luck with such a richness of choice and quality in > dotnet > > > >>> land. Maybe java is not quite as fancy as c# but in the end we are > all most > > > >>> of the time just the guy who adds glue between one library and > something > > > >>> else. Maybe Java is a bit more verbose or not as elegant...but in > the end > > > >>> that does not matter, because what we lose in elegance and language > features > > > >>> is more than offseted by magnitudes with oss. > > > > > >>> -- > > > >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups > > > >>> "The Java Posse" group. > > > >>> To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. > > > >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > > >>> [email protected]<javaposse%[email protected]> > <javaposse%2bunsubscr...@googlegroups .com> > > > >>> . > > > >>> For more options, visit this group at > > > >>>http://groups.google.com/group/javaposse?hl=en. > > > > > >> -- > > > >> Kevin Wright > > > > > >> mail/google talk: [email protected] > > > >> wave: [email protected] > > > >> skype: kev.lee.wright > > > >> twitter: @thecoda > > > > > >> -- > > > >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups > > > >> "The Java Posse" group. > > > >> To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. > > > >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > > >> [email protected]<javaposse%[email protected]> > <javaposse%2bunsubscr...@googlegroups .com> > > > >> . > > > >> For more options, visit this group at > > > >>http://groups.google.com/group/javaposse?hl=en. > > > > > > -- > > > > Robert Casto > > > >www.robertcasto.com > > > > > > -- > > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups > > > > "The Java Posse" group. > > > > To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > > > [email protected]<javaposse%[email protected]> > <javaposse%2bunsubscr...@googlegroups .com> > > > > . > > > > For more options, visit this group at > > > >http://groups.google.com/group/javaposse?hl=en. > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "The Java Posse" group. > To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > [email protected]<javaposse%[email protected]> > . > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/javaposse?hl=en. > > -- Robert Casto www.robertcasto.com -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "The Java Posse" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected]. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/javaposse?hl=en.
