Hey Rigsy, Meh! Don't bother me none mate.
I will say that I simply do not belife that mankind has 'created' a religion for the sole porpose of control, perhaps we will see some in the future and perhaps we can level that charge at the Scientologist door, even then I think it is more about making money than control. I will admit that many have used and continues to do so, religoin of any ilke to control, but that is far differant from the oringinators intended porpouse. Yep I really do belive that all religoin can get one to God. Evil people we have in plenty, and I think there is a lot of differance between the an original goal and an userption. Like My Blair, taking us to war in the search of WMD, use of the public has forever been a gameplan of the powerfull, and any tool and every tool will they use. You say we cannot discount the human reasons that religoins have existed, I would say we cannot discount the human propensity to twist things for our own ends. On Feb 27, 5:24 am, rigsy03 <[email protected]> wrote: > I wish no disrespect to your beliefs but there have been thousands of > religions during man's history- many claiming absolute truth about God/ > gods. I do not believe all faiths lead to holiness/God as there have > been too many cruel/evil religions. We cannot discount the human > reasons that religions have existed: cohesion of a group, control of > behavior, a spur to conquest, an opiate and so on. A kind, loving > atheist is also holy in humanistic terms. Religions change or break > away to adapt to changing social/economic realities- that would be > understood by Darwin, I believe. > > On Feb 25, 7:20 am, "[email protected]" <[email protected]> > wrote: > > > > > Hahah Rigsy. > > > Sikhi in a nut shell is this. > > > There is but one absolute truth and it is God. > > > We are not seprerated from God, but live in the dualistic belife that > > we are, to realise this one only needs to keep God in the forefront of > > the mind at all times.(Which is why we chant vaherguru - or wonderous > > God(losely translated)) > > > By doing this one eventualy becomes God conciose, rather than man > > conciouse(Manmukh) and thus their actions become what I suppose we can > > call 'good' > > > So there is no call to doing good as doing good comes as a natural > > occourance of trying to become God conciouse(Gurmukh) > > > You should then be able to infer much from the above, perhaps not the > > least being, there is no heaven nor hell, as there is no one true > > faith, all faiths may 'lead' to God. > > > On Feb 25, 12:11 pm, rigsy03 <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > I am impressed by what I read of Sikhism. After a couple of books at > > > home, I turned to Wikipedia. I remembered about the Golden Temple and > > > some other events but they were historical or news items. > > > > I, too, am a "slow adapter". > > > > I felt badly about jumping from the particular to the universal > > > regarding some personal experiences for there were positives as well > > > as negatives. It reminded me I still feel hurt and anger over some > > > matters and will try harder to pray for understanding. Maybe God > > > needed my attention! :-) Just kidding... > > > > On Feb 23, 9:18 am, "[email protected]" <[email protected]> > > > wrote: > > > > > Hey Rigsy, > > > > > There is nowt to forgive my friend. > > > > > Ignorance is not a sin rather a nateural state. We are all ignorant > > > > about many things, untill we take the time to learn, and part of the > > > > learning is in the asking. > > > > > Realiseing all the time that when we speak in part or on the whole > > > > about religious belifes we are not dealing in emprical fact but > > > > beliefe. Some of which we can apply logical thought to, some.... well > > > > not so much. Then I'll say it is my belife that the soul inhabites > > > > the body upon conception, or perhaps it is always present, rather as > > > > RP suggest as part of the pervadidness of God? > > > > > All of us are redemable, in the eys of God if not in the eyes of each > > > > other. > > > > > I'm a lover of nature(if this is indeed the context which you mean?) > > > > it's hard not to be coming from the Pagan background that I do. I'm > > > > also an admirerer of a certin Mr Darwin, and believe in an absolute > > > > sense that we arived here via the process of evolution. > > > > > So humanity is not somehow seperate from nature but very much a part > > > > of it. Indeed with our abilities it is clear to see how much sway we > > > > have over the lives of the other animals that we share this planet > > > > with. > > > > > As to Sikhi, ahh I'm not a good Sikh. Only really because Sikhi agrees > > > > with many of my personal belifes about God and Gods plan. > > > > > On Feb 23, 2:43 pm, rigsy03 <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > Thank you for your reply and am thinking about it... > > > > > > I think this brings up the question of potential and actuality. (Does > > > > > the fetus have a soul, for instance. Does an evil person retain the > > > > > possibility of redemption- how does this relate to religious and civil > > > > > laws? Etc.) > > > > > > Yes- I just get my hopes up and then...HIstory is indeed a dance back > > > > > and forth but so is an individual life. We are certainly living in > > > > > "interesting times" (Chinese wish that can be taken two ways.) > > > > > > My "man" just cleared another large snowfall- I think we are up to 72" > > > > > and may hit 90" by the end of March. So my spirit is curious but my > > > > > mind is distracted. :-) > > > > > > How does Nature figure into your beliefs? I admit I am quite ignorant > > > > > about the Sikh faith and tend to limit it to Punjab and turbans. > > > > > Please forgive my poor education- thus far. > > > > > > On Feb 23, 5:01 am, "[email protected]" <[email protected]> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > Hey RP, > > > > > > > Yeah I get what you are saying. > > > > > > > I see a disctiction though. > > > > > > > I belive that before anything existed there was only God. That is > > > > > > before the creation, before matter ther was only God, God in spirt. > > > > > > God created the creation from Gods self. That is God created matter > > > > > > from spirt, so yes I too belive that there exists not one iota of > > > > > > matter that does not contian the spirit of God. > > > > > > > It goes back to my original question though what is Soul? > > > > > > > Is soul simply spirit? > > > > > > > No, too much relgious dogma says that only humans can reach God, or > > > > > > if > > > > > > you like only humans have soul. So what is the portion of God or > > > > > > the > > > > > > propertie of God that is all pervading? Flour my freind. > > > > > > > All bread (matter) containes the spirt (flour) of God but not all > > > > > > bread (matter) containes the soul(yeast) of God. Humans are levend > > > > > > bread, all else is unlevend. > > > > > > > I say this because, as I have said too much dogma says it is so. > > > > > > As a > > > > > > religous man, I must place some of my belife structure on some > > > > > > religious dogma. > > > > > > > On Feb 23, 10:37 am, RP Singh <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > There is not an atom of matter that doesn't contain the Spirit , > > > > > > > rather everything and everyone is upheld by the spirit. Hence the > > > > > > > basis of all whether animate or inanimate is the soul or the > > > > > > > Spirit. > > > > > > > > On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 8:26 PM, [email protected] > > > > > > > > <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > Hey Rigsy, > > > > > > > > > The point of my baking anology was to differantciat between > > > > > > > > Soul and > > > > > > > > Matter. Yes indeed other raising agents are to be found, and > > > > > > > > yes > > > > > > > > indeed some prefer unlevend bread. Bread is still bread made > > > > > > > > out of > > > > > > > > some form of flour. > > > > > > > > > Sticking to this then in answer to your questions. > > > > > > > > > If the yeast is the soul and the flour the matter we can easily > > > > > > > > see > > > > > > > > that not all matter containes soul, although it is still > > > > > > > > thought of as > > > > > > > > the same thing. > > > > > > > > > Evilness stems not from the yeast but from the flour. That is > > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > from the spirt of God but the minds of mankind. > > > > > > > > > I am both a theists and a humanist, I see no contradiction in > > > > > > > > this. > > > > > > > > So yes humanity has progressed for good or ill. How do I > > > > > > > > measure it? > > > > > > > > Probably like you do, in many ways. How we treat the worst off > > > > > > > > amongst us, and our elderly, what levels of technolgy we have > > > > > > > > and how > > > > > > > > it is used, our philosophis and where they lead us both > > > > > > > > theistic and > > > > > > > > secular, as I say many differant ways. > > > > > > > > > Hahah yes it does seem that religous dogma clouds rationality, > > > > > > > > sometimes, for some people, but I would argue that it is strict > > > > > > > > adhereance without questioning the worth of such dogma is to > > > > > > > > blame, > > > > > > > > rather than dogma itself. > > > > > > > > > History shows us circles, for those who wish to look. It seems > > > > > > > > we > > > > > > > > move forward, and then the same old shit happens, and around we > > > > > > > > go > > > > > > > > again. > > > > > > > > > On Feb 22, 1:43 pm, rigsy03 <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > >> Animals can have personalities. People can have a herd > > > > > > > >> mentality > > > > > > > >> lacking intelligence, individualism and uniqueness. > > > > > > > > >> Is the soul from a creator? How do you explain evil- do you > > > > > > > >> admit > > > > > > > >> there are evil souls/forces? Is the soul/creator split between > > > > > > > >> good > > > > > > > >> and evil? (This was a heresy of the Early Church but a > > > > > > > >> doctrine of > > > > > > > >> Zoroastrianism.) > > > > > > > > >> Baking powder and soda also create a rise in flour. Some peole > > > > > > > >> prefer > > > > > > > >> flat breads. :-) > > > > > > > > >> Civilization might progress on the basis of other criteria- > > > > > > > >> there was > > > > > > > >> a book/program about germs and steel but I forget the author > > > > > > > >> and exact > > > > > > > >> title. How do you measure the progress of the human race- or, > > > > > > > >> do you > > > > > > > >> see progress or merely an illusion created by the Industrial > > > > > > > >> Revolution and technology and into whose hands/minds is this > > > > > > > >> progress > > > > > > > >> steered? Or does religious dogma suspend critical thinking in > > > > > > > >> order > > > > > > > >> to unify/pacify the populace into a common belief system? Same > > > > > > > >> with > > > > > > > >> political/economic theories. > > > > > > > > >> How has all this "been working" for the human race according to > > > > > > > >> history? > > > > > > > > >> On Feb 22, 4:40 am, "[email protected]" > > > > > > > >> <[email protected]> > > > > > > > >> wrote: > > > > > > > > >> > Hah yes I agree that it does appear a little contradictory. > > > > > > > > >> > Let me attempt to explian it this way. > > > > > > > > >> > You are a uniqeue individual, differant from me, and indeed > > > > > > > >> > every > > > > > > > >> > other human on the planet. What is the root of this? > > > > > > > > >> > It is > > ... > > read more »- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text -
