Chris wanted to show the normalcy of the Occupy protesters. America and norms is not really what you automatically associate, not in the land which prides itself for its freedom of individual rights and expressions. But then Chris once mentioned that his upbringing was not American. I hear young people coming back from the U.S. being shocked over the amount of really fat people in America. CSI and Hollywood has not prepared them for so much freedom of un-normalcy.
On Sun, Oct 9, 2011 at 7:05 AM, Allan H <[email protected]> wrote: > I would like to know what an american upbringing is... personally I was > raised on a farm and had to milk the cows by hand morning and night 7 days a > week.. Didn't mind i was faster than a machine and it is easier to clean a > milking buck than a milking machine,, we only had 7 cows when I started > milking (My Dad bought the farm when I was 8 and my russian neighbor taught > me how to milk quickly... (",) > > Not all americans are fat.. generalities generally do not work.. the > extremely fat people are really not very likely to get involved in anything > no matter which country they are in. > Allan > > On Sat, Oct 8, 2011 at 9:59 PM, gabbydott <[email protected]> wrote: > >> Yes, Allan, I remember you mentioned that before. The feeling of shock >> must have been a reaction to your American upbringing. The tabula rasa myth >> was an imported myth or so, no? >> >> >> On Fri, Oct 7, 2011 at 6:54 AM, Allan H <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> Gabby you should look into those who signed the American declaration of >>> independence as for the Bill of Right is was copied almost verbatim of the >>> Dutch ill of rights written a hundred years earlier.. You can imagine my >>> shock when I found that out.. >>> Allan >>> >>> On Fri, Oct 7, 2011 at 6:43 AM, Chris Jenkins < >>> [email protected]> wrote: >>> >>>> Gabby, I hope you approve. I tried my best to follow rule #10: >>>> >>>> >>>> https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.10150334273466494.348470.722681493&l=b50118df79&type=1 >>>> >>>> >>>> On Fri, Oct 7, 2011 at 12:30 AM, Chris Jenkins < >>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Actually, we all brought garbage bags, and cleaned up after ourselves. >>>>> As for finding a job, I've been on the market for over 18 months, with a >>>>> solid, industry professional resume, and have found nothing. Meanwhile, >>>>> many >>>>> of my former colleagues have joined my ranks. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Fri, Oct 7, 2011 at 12:19 AM, [email protected] >>>>> <[email protected]>wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> The biased media and comics have been trashing conservatives and >>>>>> ridiculing the Tea Party and various candidiates so you have to expect >>>>>> some payback. >>>>>> >>>>>> How do these protestors expect to find a job or stay in school if they >>>>>> spend all their time protesting? Who will pay for the clean-up? What >>>>>> business would risk hiring these people? >>>>>> >>>>>> Most loot is not easily transported. :-) >>>>>> >>>>>> On Oct 6, 9:40 pm, Don Johnson <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>>> > I scanned it and agree, a bit bullshitty but one must admire the >>>>>> hopeful >>>>>> > tone the writer emits. So the Occupiers are all about coming >>>>>> together if not >>>>>> > completely cogent on their reasons for doing so. Where the Tea >>>>>> Party, to me, >>>>>> > has mostly been about tax and spending cuts Tthe Occupiers seem, >>>>>> again to >>>>>> > me(it's a shame it's still so unclear) to be all about political >>>>>> corporate >>>>>> > favoritism. I would hesitate to label the 99%ers as Class Warriors >>>>>> although >>>>>> > many of their organizers seem to have this at the top of their >>>>>> agenda. >>>>>> > >>>>>> > I'm disappointed in the rhetoric from Conservative mouthpieces like >>>>>> Limbaugh >>>>>> > that are trashing the movement. Ridiculing the protestors and so >>>>>> forth. It >>>>>> > would make more sense to recognize that there are those that are >>>>>> having some >>>>>> > tough times and try to help educate those disaffected folks on the >>>>>> real >>>>>> > problems which isn't rich people per se. It's bad government. By >>>>>> both >>>>>> > Republicans and Democrats. In a nutshell, too much wasteful spending >>>>>> and not >>>>>> > enough pin-pointed economic stimulus spending. >>>>>> > >>>>>> > Thanks for the link to the Boston Group Arch I'll probably read it >>>>>> again >>>>>> > soon. These economist make sense but the real problem is going to be >>>>>> coming >>>>>> > up with something everyone can swallow. We sure don't need our very >>>>>> own >>>>>> > Reign Of Terror. Nobody wants to give in here. If I was rich I'd be >>>>>> tired of >>>>>> > being called the bad guy all the time unless I really was the bad >>>>>> guy in >>>>>> > which case I wouldn't care a fig. I'd take my loot and go somewhere >>>>>> else. >>>>>> > God help us all. >>>>>> > >>>>>> > dj >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > On Thu, Oct 6, 2011 at 12:02 PM, archytas <[email protected]> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> > > There's a take on Occupy Wall Street at >>>>>> > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2011/10/matt-stoller-the-anti-politics. >>>>>> .. >>>>>> > > - that sounds like Allan - a bit bullshitty (sorry Al - not you) >>>>>> Chris >>>>>> > > but an interesting take. >>>>>> > >>>>>> > > I can't stand any standard politics now. It's madness. >>>>>> > >>>>>> > > On Oct 6, 8:36 am, Allan H <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>>> > > > I think there is where the problem lies,, several decades ago >>>>>> the >>>>>> > > > revolution was bassed off ideology differences (the Little Red >>>>>> Book) >>>>>> > > this >>>>>> > > > really was not a valid reason.. >>>>>> > >>>>>> > > > today I see >>>>>> > > >>>>>> http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2011/10/matt-stoller-the-anti-politics...differentworld,, >>>>>> especially in the US also to a >>>>>> > > > lesser extent Europe.. in the US there are other problems there >>>>>> are >>>>>> > > > existing undergrounds outside of police intelligence,, there >>>>>> are massive >>>>>> > > > amounts of weapons out of site and out of mind and other than >>>>>> the owner >>>>>> > > no >>>>>> > > > one knows about them.. Even I still have guns and I no longer >>>>>> live >>>>>> > > there.. >>>>>> > >>>>>> > > > The US is extremely Large,, there is also a large community of >>>>>> motor >>>>>> > > homes >>>>>> > > > which have the ability move and potentially lower the cost of >>>>>> living.. >>>>>> > > > and organize.. the police are not unsympathetic either as they >>>>>> often >>>>>> > > times >>>>>> > > > in the same or similar situation.. >>>>>> > >>>>>> > > > I do believe co-op-s will become more plentiful, underground >>>>>> work will >>>>>> > > > become more prevalent.. it will change,, I think the start is >>>>>> in >>>>>> > > > eliminating the political corruption that is so embedded.. >>>>>> > > > sigh >>>>>> > > > Allan >>>>>> > >>>>>> > > > I hate change .. but greed is so wide spread.. a tremendous >>>>>> lose >>>>>> > > > of spirituality ,, but fundamentalism may have some perks in >>>>>> the end,, >>>>>> > >>>>>> > > > On Thu, Oct 6, 2011 at 5:59 AM, Chris Jenkins < >>>>>> > > [email protected]>wrote: >>>>>> > >>>>>> > > > > I see BoA as an infinitely powerful entity, and can't imagine >>>>>> the >>>>>> > > behemoth >>>>>> > > > > falling. >>>>>> > > > > On Oct 5, 2011 10:18 PM, "archytas" <[email protected]> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> > > > > > Pruning ain't the metaphor I'd choose Chris. Dexia Bank has >>>>>> just gone >>>>>> > > > > > belly-up - it was 'worth' more than Belgium's GDP. The >>>>>> 'money' in the >>>>>> > > > > > banking scam is at factors of ten in comparison with the >>>>>> world of >>>>>> > > real >>>>>> > > > > > work. My view is that it's in the way of capitalism and >>>>>> democracy. >>>>>> > > > > > The informed guess is they've been lending to crooks on a >>>>>> scale >>>>>> > > vastly >>>>>> > > > > > bigger than the barrel-loads of dollars gone in Iraq and >>>>>> Afghanistan >>>>>> > > > > > without securing any 'mineral rights'. The kleft stick is >>>>>> that they >>>>>> > > > > > can only make money through the same old scams, so whatever >>>>>> we put >>>>>> > > > > > back in (and I mean we) just does it all over again. In an >>>>>> > > > > > oversimplified way, much of the debt is like you owing me $2 >>>>>> million, >>>>>> > > > > > Don owing 'Francois' $5 million, me owing Molly (etc.) in an >>>>>> equation >>>>>> > > > > > in which, if we cancelled out we're all solvent and I owe >>>>>> Orn a beer >>>>>> > > > > > he won'r drink. What goes in the cancelling is the banks - >>>>>> the debts >>>>>> > > > > > are so networked it's almost like the $2 million you owe me >>>>>> is >>>>>> > > > > > balanced by $1.99 million I owe to people who owe you. I've >>>>>> been >>>>>> > > > > > teaching the EU figures if anyone is interested (they just >>>>>> tell this >>>>>> > > > > > story between EU countries). >>>>>> > >>>>>> > > > > > We've finally seen some reporting here. A Wall Street guy >>>>>> came on and >>>>>> > > > > > said he was amazed more people weren't protesting as he >>>>>> thought true >>>>>> > > > > > unemployment was at 15% - which is what I reckon here. The >>>>>> real issue >>>>>> > > > > > to me is jobs and wages. A key figure for me is that the >>>>>> bottom 50% >>>>>> > > > > > back in 1980 had 14% of liquid assets (cash more or less) >>>>>> and that's >>>>>> > > > > > down to 1% now. Wages have fallen. The debt problem starts >>>>>> around >>>>>> > > > > > 1965 and it's similar in form to similar ones around gold >>>>>> rushes in >>>>>> > > > > > history. Most people I've seen on television or met in >>>>>> Manchester >>>>>> > > > > > don't know much of the economics but are sick of the lack of >>>>>> > > > > > opportunity. >>>>>> > >>>>>> > > > > > I was left a house when my cousin died and had to drop the >>>>>> price by a >>>>>> > > > > > fifth to sell. There's no decent unskilled or engineering >>>>>> work around >>>>>> > > > > > here and jobs are being lost at some rate. Just up the road >>>>>> we have >>>>>> > > > > > 64 years of UK energy supply as shale gas about to be >>>>>> exploited. I >>>>>> > > > > > worked on the survey 25 years back. You'd think we'd have a >>>>>> plan >>>>>> > > > > > around this but there isn't one. >>>>>> > >>>>>> > > > > > Political blather is just about getting the economy moving, >>>>>> our >>>>>> > > people >>>>>> > > > > > working. It's all dross. Interestingly, our Republicans >>>>>> couldn't >>>>>> > > > > > even fill the seats for the Prime Minister's speech. He's >>>>>> not a half- >>>>>> > > > > > wit like Palin but he's claiming his government has dealt >>>>>> with the >>>>>> > > > > > banks - yet two of the one's we bailed out are still making >>>>>> the kinds >>>>>> > > > > > of losses they were before 2008. One of them,HBOS, was >>>>>> running a >>>>>> > > > > > criminal scam that closed many small companies and is not >>>>>> cooperating >>>>>> > > > > > with the limited police enquiries. >>>>>> > >>>>>> > > > > > I don't think most people know how bad it all is yet. The >>>>>> collapse of >>>>>> > > > > > Soc. Gen. and Bank of America should do it - B o A could >>>>>> even end up >>>>>> > > > > > Chinese. There are underlying questions on how we get fed if >>>>>> it all >>>>>> > > > > > collapses - after all, we're still growing the food. >>>>>> > >>>>>> > > > > > On Oct 5, 9:43 pm, Allan H <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>>> > > > > >> Great time to live,, revolution is always exciting. Maybe >>>>>> if the >>>>>> > > > > bankers >>>>>> > > > > >> and stock market wake up. >>>>>> > >>>>>> > > > > >> Do corporations still agree obey the laws of the state and >>>>>> the >>>>>> > > United >>>>>> > > > > >> state.. and if they don't do they lose their corporate >>>>>> skirt >>>>>> > > > > >> Allan >>>>>> > > > > >> On Oct 5, 2011 7:37 PM, "Chris Jenkins" < >>>>>> > > [email protected]> >>>>>> > > > > wrote: >>>>>> > >>>>>> > > > > >> > Citizens United was one of the worst rulings in the >>>>>> entire history >>>>>> > > of >>>>>> > > > > the >>>>>> > > > > >> > Supreme Court. >>>>>> > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citizens_United_v._Federal_Election_Comm >>>>>> . >>>>>> > > > > .. >>>>>> > >>>>>> > > > > >> > Restricting unions while empowering corporations in >>>>>> political >>>>>> > > speech >>>>>> > > > > is one >>>>>> > > > > >> > of the root problems that Occupy hopes to address. >>>>>> > >>>>>> > > > > >> > On Wed, Oct 5, 2011 at 1:17 PM, ornamentalmind < >>>>>> > > > > [email protected] >>>>>> > > > > >> > > wrote: >>>>>> > >>>>>> > > > > >> >> It looks like the unions are entering into the fray. No >>>>>> doubt >>>>>> > > this >>>>>> > > > > >> >> will accelerate the attacks on them… such as the >>>>>> proposals to >>>>>> > > greatly >>>>>> > > > > >> >> limit and/or not allow political contributions. Perhaps >>>>>> if they >>>>>> > > > > >> >> incorporated…. >>>>>> > >>>>>> > > > > >>>>>> http://www.democracynow.org/2011/10/5/as_unions_students_join_occupy_ >>>>>> . >>>>>> > > .. >>>>>> > >>>>>> > > > > >> >> On Oct 5, 8:02 am, Chris Jenkins < >>>>>> [email protected]> >>>>>> > > wrote: >>>>>> > > > > >> >> > And thus the need for education. CDO Swaps and other >>>>>> bits of >>>>>> > > > > banking >>>>>> > > > > >> >> > nastiness that prune money from the system while >>>>>> contributing >>>>>> > > > > nothing to >>>>>> > > > > >> >> it >>>>>> > > > > >> >> > are part of the problem. >>>>>> > >>>>>> > > > > >> >> > On Tue, Oct 4, 2011 at 7:35 PM, archytas < >>>>>> [email protected]> >>>>>> > > > > wrote: >>>>>> > > > > >> >> > > We have Occupy here too - a few tent cities so far - >>>>>> people >>>>>> > > also >>>>>> > > > > >> >> > > making the point they ain't left-wing loonies. I >>>>>> went to the >>>>>> > > > > >> >> > > Manchester one yesterday to ask a few people 'why'? >>>>>> I'm not >>>>>> > > sure >>>>>> > > > > >> >> > > heard much that was accurate. Might have a look at >>>>>> Greece >>>>>> > > nearer >>>>>> > > > > >> >> > > Xmas. Most peopleI met yesterday didn't know what >>>>>> > > collateral- >>>>>> > > > > >> >> > > derivative fractional banking was. >>>>>> > >>>>>> > > > > >> >> > > On Oct 4, 2:40 pm, Chris Jenkins < >>>>>> [email protected] >>>>>> > >>>>>> > > > > wrote: >>>>>> > > > > >> >> > > > Well then, reckon we should all grab shovels, yes? >>>>>> > > > > >> >> > > > On Oct 4, 2011 9:03 AM, "archytas" < >>>>>> [email protected]> >>>>>> > > wrote: >>>>>> > >>>>>> > > > > >> >> > > > > I guess my picture of normal, Chris, would be of >>>>>> an >>>>>> > > ostrich >>>>>> > > > > with >>>>>> > > > > >> >> its >>>>>> > > > > >> >> > > > > head in the sand - these being the people not >>>>>> doing >>>>>> > > > > occupation. >>>>>> > >>>>>> > > > > >> >> > > > > On Oct 4, 8:41 am, Allan H < >>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>>> > > > > >> >> > > > >> It is good to see you again Chris and Don.. >>>>>> > >>>>>> > > > > >> >> > > > >> I was thinking (I know a rare event) last night >>>>>> only to >>>>>> > > have >>>>>> > > > > the >>>>>> > > > > >> >> topic >>>>>> > > > > >> >> > > > >> return this morning.. >>>>>> > >>>>>> > > > > >> >> > > > >> After watching all the demonstrations some >>>>>> thing emerged >>>>>> > > > > that >>>>>> > > > > >> >> does not >>>>>> > > > > >> >> > > > make >>>>>> > > > > >> >> > > > >> sense to me nor do I understand. maybe some one >>>>>> can >>>>>> > > > > straighten me >>>>>> > >>>>>> > ... >>>>>> > >>>>>> > read more »- Hide quoted text - >>>>>> > >>>>>> > - Show quoted text - >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> ( >>> ) >>> |_D Allan >>> >>> Life is for moral, ethical and truthful living. >>> >>> >>> >> > > > -- > ( > ) > |_D Allan > > Life is for moral, ethical and truthful living. > > >
