DM: I am suggesting we say public/private for the simple distinction
as to what can be observed or is observed in common and what is
not. What the content of my cupboard happens to be may only be known
to me. Or what my opionion of George Bush is may be private and not
public. I amsimply suggesting we don't start thinking or describing this
as about two separate esseneces called subjects and objects. 

[Krimel]
This is helpful to me in understand what the big brouhaha is all about. What
you describe above is not at all how I see this issue regardless of what
terms are applied. For example, the contents of your cupboard are private to
you because currently only you can see them. They are not in principle
inaccessible to me. I am referring to the fact that my hand is publicly
observable by both of us and yet my perception of my hand is unique to me. I
know about the unpleasant sensation of the hang nail on my ring finger. You
know only about my slovenly grooming habits. 

If my hand were severed, then I would have the same relationship to it that
any other observer would have. Until such time my perception of my hand is
radically different.

By private events or subjectivity I mean the events unique to my nervous
system. If I were to peer into your cupboard then we would share certain
aspects of that experience in common we could reach certain intersubjective
agreements about the contents. There is a degree of overlap and this shared
subset I would term objective or public. There remain of course elements of
the experience that are unique to each of us and can not be shared; my
emotional response to your choice of cuisine, your satisfaction in the
orderly arrangement of the canned goods.

Private knowledge or subjective awareness is precisely the bit of knowledge
acquired by the color expert Mary in Frank Jackson's famous thought
experiment.

[DM]
Patterns or SQ can move between these different spheresof experience. I can
dream up a design for a house privately in my thoughts and it can
become publicif I build it. The secret password to get into the bank
vaught nay be sent to me by email, but once I have read it and destroyed
the email the password is private to my mind (or brain if you can read
it off my brain structure with the right can of probe, this may not ever
be possible though). So I am not saying what you suggested. 

[Krimel]
Again your design and your password are currently private and can in
principle be made public. Not so your pride in the creativity of your design
or your smugness at needing a bank vault. I will decline to comment on your
confidence that anything sent via e-mail can be considered in any sense
private.

[DM]
SQ is seen on all levels, the levels interact, and SQ is more or less
universal or local. If we have levels we do not need to have two
distinct essences, as Pirsig implies, that would see levels one and two as
objective and material, and three and four as subjective and non-material.
There is though something here that the MOQ misses about local and
less local SQ, private-individual and public-common.

[Krimel]
Pirsig's conception works to the extent that he is claims that change and
stasis are common to both forms of understanding, subjective and objective.
This makes the study of the interplay of flux and constancy primary in
either realm. This is also true of "levels" however they are conceived. 



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