Hi Joe, Thanks for the post. We can describe two forms of evolution for the purposes of this discussion. The first would be gradual as presented by sq differentiation. The second is jump or quantum evolution. In biological parlance this is when enough mutations have accrued that a final synergistic mutation creates a fundamental transformation in species. In MoQ this could be represented by the levels.
So, the first may have an understandable correlation between MoQ and biology, the second is more difficult. I have some ideas on this, but I will open this up to the floor. Regards, Mark On Aug 30, 2011, at 11:49 AM, Joseph Maurer <[email protected]> wrote: > Hi Mark, > > Math cannot logically describe evolution, something new existing differently > from something old. I suggest the logic in MOQ is an indefinable logic of > levels in existence beyond a logic for physical existence since it requires > a metaphysical DQ/SQ logic. Math has limitations in logic and metaphysics > is not an outmoded discipline. > > I read you saying the same thing, and we seem to be on the same page in > describing reality in evolution, physics and metaphysics. > > Joe > > > On 8/30/11 7:09 AM, "118" <[email protected]> wrote: > >> Hi Joe, >> The easiest way to understand this is to put the equation to words as I did >> for 2/0. Two times zero can be read as What do you have if you double >> nothing? >> >> Math is a language. It has a shorthand notation for reasons of manipulation. >> Due to this simplification, it has a much more narrow application than words. >> For example, words can convey the sense of fear, whereas math cannot. So >> math >> is a very specialized language albeit limited to those things that abide by >> measurement. >> >> Mark >> >> On Aug 28, 2011, at 7:24 PM, Joseph Maurer <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> Hi Mark, >>> >>> How can you add, subract, multiply 1 by 0, and not divide 1 by 0? A >>> failure in rigorous logic? >>> >>> Joe >>> >>> >>> On 8/28/11 5:36 PM, "118" <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>>> Joe, Joe, Joe, >>>> >>>> How is your math these days? When an error is returned for an >>>> equation like 2/0, it means "Return to sender", or "Earth to Joe", or >>>> "What are you asking?". 2/0 asks "how many times does nothing fit >>>> into two?". So tell me Joe, how many times can you fit nothing into >>>> two if you are so fond of asking the question? This would be like >>>> asking how many times does Integrity fit into Beautiful?. Don't you >>>> think this would result in an error message from the calculator of >>>> MoQ? >>>> >>>> Typically evolution is described by mathematics. I am referring to >>>> the Evolution that is a theory in biology. It is all math based. You >>>> know level of adaptation, predator/prey equations, life span. All >>>> math! Darwin put a lot of species together in a linear (math) way. >>>> But, you do not need to apologize because you are obviously talking >>>> about a different sort of Evolution. If you explain what you mean by >>>> Evolution, I can respond with a rational post along those lines. >>>> >>>> When I state that "Mathematics is a form of Metaphysics", I mean >>>> simply this: Math is used to describe reality in the same way that MoQ >>>> is used to describe reality. There is no difference and each is an >>>> equally valid method for such a description. There is nothing more >>>> real about mathematics than there is for MoQ, both are static >>>> descriptions, and yes, they approach reality in different ways. >>>> Perhaps you are of the mind that somehow Math is true whereas MoQ is >>>> conjecture. If so, I would have to suggest that you stop bowing down >>>> to the religion of Scientism and see it for what it is. This is not >>>> to demean science; I am in love with science and make a good living >>>> using it. Science describes reality like a blue print describes a >>>> house. The blueprint is not the house, science is not reality. >>>> >>>> By way of metaphor, let me ask you this: Let's say you enter into a >>>> very good restaurant and a waiter gives you a menu. You ask the >>>> waiter what he would suggest for a meal. The waiter takes one of the >>>> pages of the menu and puts salt on it and suggests you eat it. >>>> Wouldn't you think that is kind of strange? Of course the menu is not >>>> the food, just like a map of Ecuador is not the country. In the same >>>> way, math is not reality, and physics is not either. They are all >>>> descriptions, all analogies. MoQ is the analogy we are working with. >>>> To make it work we need to use rhetoric and a great variety of >>>> descriptions and definitions, yes, DEFINITIONS. Else-wise we will >>>> just be acting silly. >>>> >>>> Cheers, >>>> Mark >>>> >>>> On Thu, Aug 25, 2011 at 12:07 PM, Joseph Maurer <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>> Hi Mark, >>>>> >>>>> The reply highlights the difference between language and math. Math as a >>>>> precise language seems to ignore analogy and metaphor procreation. >>>>> Division >>>>> by 0 in math returns an error message, no creation. The question I was >>>>> asking is can evolution be described in mathematics. If the answer is >>>>> yes, >>>>> my apologies. If, no, then metaphysics with analogy and metaphor is the >>>>> proper discipline to discuss evolution beyond mathematical physics. >>>>> >>>>> I have not studied extensive mathematical levels, I am operating on the >>>>> insight that metaphysics, and physics, do not share a common definition >>>>> for >>>>> the reality of evolution. "Math is a form of metaphysics." >>>>> >>>>> I'm no good at tic-tac-toe. No room for disagreement except a fistfight. >>>>> >>>>> On 8/24/11 4:31 PM, "118" <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Hi Joe the Undefined Wizard, >>>>>> >>>>>> Is this a trick question? Or are you playing tic-tac-toe? >>>>>> >>>>>> By the way, are you ignoring my last email to you or are you still >>>>>> digesting it (burp)? >>>>>> >>>>>> Mark, the Undefined Satan. >>>>>> >>>>>> On Wed, Aug 24, 2011 at 10:30 AM, Joseph Maurer <[email protected]> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> Hi Mark and all, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> DQ/SQ. X/0. Are they both metaphysical formulations? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On 8/23/11 9:42 PM, "118" <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Math is a form of metaphysics. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list >>>>>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >>>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >>>>>>> Archives: >>>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >>>>>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html >>>>>>> >>>>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list >>>>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >>>>>> Archives: >>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >>>>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list >>>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >>>>> Archives: >>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >>>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html >>>>> >>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list >>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >>>> Archives: >>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html >>> >>> >>> Moq_Discuss mailing list >>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >>> Archives: >>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html >> Moq_Discuss mailing list >> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >> Archives: >> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >> http://moq.org/md/archives.html > > > Moq_Discuss mailing list > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > Archives: > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > http://moq.org/md/archives.html Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org/md/archives.html
