RE: [WISPA] Bounces
I've used Pine...the ad hominem was crack head. :-) -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Butch Evans Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 12:54 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] Bounces I don't know if my email has been bouncing or not, but I've been without email for 2 days (since my server at home, where I run PINE decided to just quit). I'm now running my email on my new Linux machine (brand new laptop), but I may have bounced a few emails. If so, I apologize. Either way, Mac, you were right (sort of). I am trying out Evolution for a short time. If I like it (I don't so far), I will keep it. Otherwise, I will use the old standby (pine). FWIW, your ad hominem attack (as Jeff called it) is forgiven. LOL -- Butch Evans Network Engineering and Security Consulting 573-276-2879 http://www.butchevans.com/ My calendar: http://tinyurl.com/y24ad6 Training Partners: http://tinyurl.com/smfkf Mikrotik Certified Consultant http://www.mikrotik.com/consultants.html ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
installers (was Re: [WISPA] You're all going to lose ( I hope not))
Travis Johnson wrote: And, right now, we have more business than we can keep up with. We did 114 installs last month and could have done 140+ if we could find installers to hire. While we don't do residential and therefore don't share the same concerns mentioned in this thread, the amount of customers we can install each month is limited by our installers; not sales. Has anyone figured out the magic in getting more installers? From our perspective, getting competent installers takes a significant amount of training time on what amounts to non-skill based work. -Matt ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] IPTV
Clint Ricker wrote: If there was a fairly turnkey solution to providing television service over your networks (ie IPTV), would you be interested? We would like to provide business TV services where we would only carry a few channels on an ala carte basis. Specifically, we would like to offer CNN, MSNBC, FOX News, and CNBC. -Matt ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] IPTV
We have (off and on) been looking for the same solution, however we came to a conclusion years ago. Why not just re-sell Direct TV or Dish? Best, Brad -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Matt Liotta Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 7:37 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] IPTV Clint Ricker wrote: If there was a fairly turnkey solution to providing television service over your networks (ie IPTV), would you be interested? We would like to provide business TV services where we would only carry a few channels on an ala carte basis. Specifically, we would like to offer CNN, MSNBC, FOX News, and CNBC. -Matt ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] IPTV
IPTV is also the breaking of the traditional TV mold. You can offer thousands of channels from all kinds of different sources. It doesn't even have to be in the traditional channel format. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Matt Liotta [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 8:09 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] IPTV Brad Belton wrote: We have (off and on) been looking for the same solution, however we came to a conclusion years ago. Why not just re-sell Direct TV or Dish? For a full channel line-up or in residential settings I would agree with you. However, in a MTU the ability to provide channels ala carte to multiple customers using IP provides different economics. -Matt ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] IPTV
Correct, we see the same requests. However, why try re-inventing the wheel when DirecTV already has a solution in place? Every time this issue has popped up the client was more than happy to pay the DirecTV price even if they only wanted CNN or FOX. It just didn't seem to make sense (yet) to put additional load on the IP leg into a building when the service is already available from the roof where we already have rights. Granted a cheaper news/weather only channel lineup would be a benefit, but how much of a benefit? In our experience the client would just as soon have the basics from DirecTV that include the channels they are after and be done with it. Best, Brad -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Matt Liotta Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 8:09 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] IPTV Brad Belton wrote: We have (off and on) been looking for the same solution, however we came to a conclusion years ago. Why not just re-sell Direct TV or Dish? For a full channel line-up or in residential settings I would agree with you. However, in a MTU the ability to provide channels ala carte to multiple customers using IP provides different economics. -Matt ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] IPTV
Agreed, but IMO just not quite ready for prime time . yet. grin Best, Brad -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 8:23 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] IPTV IPTV is also the breaking of the traditional TV mold. You can offer thousands of channels from all kinds of different sources. It doesn't even have to be in the traditional channel format. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Matt Liotta [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 8:09 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] IPTV Brad Belton wrote: We have (off and on) been looking for the same solution, however we came to a conclusion years ago. Why not just re-sell Direct TV or Dish? For a full channel line-up or in residential settings I would agree with you. However, in a MTU the ability to provide channels ala carte to multiple customers using IP provides different economics. -Matt ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] IPTV
Brad Belton wrote: Correct, we see the same requests. However, why try re-inventing the wheel when DirecTV already has a solution in place? Every time this issue has popped up the client was more than happy to pay the DirecTV price even if they only wanted CNN or FOX. Are you reselling DirecTV now? It just didn't seem to make sense (yet) to put additional load on the IP leg into a building when the service is already available from the roof where we already have rights. Yes, but then you are running coax to various tenants and various drops. If it is a business park then you are putting a dish on each building. In our case, we would like to charge them for the channels, but bundle the bandwidth usage into their service just like we do VoIP. As they use more and more bandwidth it gives the customer incentive to upgrade their commit. -Matt ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] IPTV
Not ready for prime time...? There's already several hundred thousand subscribers on IPTV platforms in the US alone, so I'm not sure what you're waiting for... what shortcomings are you seeing? The technology IS being deployed in prime time scenarios already (ATT, which is not known for being adventuresome with technology is the biggest, but not the only domestic example; internationally, it is being deployed much more widely). The main problem that WISPs face is that you may have to do some network overhauls to handle that sort of traffic... When you resell DirectTV (unless they have changed their model since 2005, which is the last I looked at their agreements), it is more of a referral/outsourced installation crew than reselling. It does let you offer triple play to a point, but (again, unless it's changed), you can't do single bill and you can't really generate any reoccuring revenue (which, as a service provider, is where your real profit tends to be) Although you do have increased costs in doing your own in terms of network buildout and so forth, you also effectively (if done right, profitably) subsidize the buildout of a better network It probably is not quite viable for ultra-rural WISPs because of really low densities and so forth. In areas with higher densities (definitely MDU), it is viable and deployable -Clint Ricker Kentnis Technologies On 9/10/07, Brad Belton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Agreed, but IMO just not quite ready for prime time . yet. grin Best, Brad -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 8:23 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] IPTV IPTV is also the breaking of the traditional TV mold. You can offer thousands of channels from all kinds of different sources. It doesn't even have to be in the traditional channel format. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Matt Liotta [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 8:09 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] IPTV Brad Belton wrote: We have (off and on) been looking for the same solution, however we came to a conclusion years ago. Why not just re-sell Direct TV or Dish? For a full channel line-up or in residential settings I would agree with you. However, in a MTU the ability to provide channels ala carte to multiple customers using IP provides different economics. -Matt ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
Re: [WISPA] IPTV
Matt, I'm understanding from you that if there was a good way to do this, you'd definitely be interested? Is anyone else out there potentially interested? This is an area that I've been working in for quite a while now, and the technology is there and deployable. There are two main obstacles, however. 1. Getting programming 2. Upfront costs of deployment (video headend infrastructures are not cheap...) Both of those are not really issues, but do require a bit of scale I'm working on a good platform to be able to do this on a centralized level that can then support multiple, smaller service providers. I'm interested in seeing if this is of interest to a large enough userbase through WISPs to make it worth the effort in building in support for those customers... -Clint Ricker On 9/10/07, Matt Liotta [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Brad Belton wrote: Correct, we see the same requests. However, why try re-inventing the wheel when DirecTV already has a solution in place? Every time this issue has popped up the client was more than happy to pay the DirecTV price even if they only wanted CNN or FOX. Are you reselling DirecTV now? It just didn't seem to make sense (yet) to put additional load on the IP leg into a building when the service is already available from the roof where we already have rights. Yes, but then you are running coax to various tenants and various drops. If it is a business park then you are putting a dish on each building. In our case, we would like to charge them for the channels, but bundle the bandwidth usage into their service just like we do VoIP. As they use more and more bandwidth it gives the customer incentive to upgrade their commit. -Matt ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] IPTV
I guess most of us would want to know what would be required of us (infrastructure wise) to be able to do this kind of service. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Clint Ricker [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 9:36 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] IPTV Matt, I'm understanding from you that if there was a good way to do this, you'd definitely be interested? Is anyone else out there potentially interested? This is an area that I've been working in for quite a while now, and the technology is there and deployable. There are two main obstacles, however. 1. Getting programming 2. Upfront costs of deployment (video headend infrastructures are not cheap...) Both of those are not really issues, but do require a bit of scale I'm working on a good platform to be able to do this on a centralized level that can then support multiple, smaller service providers. I'm interested in seeing if this is of interest to a large enough userbase through WISPs to make it worth the effort in building in support for those customers... -Clint Ricker On 9/10/07, Matt Liotta [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Brad Belton wrote: Correct, we see the same requests. However, why try re-inventing the wheel when DirecTV already has a solution in place? Every time this issue has popped up the client was more than happy to pay the DirecTV price even if they only wanted CNN or FOX. Are you reselling DirecTV now? It just didn't seem to make sense (yet) to put additional load on the IP leg into a building when the service is already available from the roof where we already have rights. Yes, but then you are running coax to various tenants and various drops. If it is a business park then you are putting a dish on each building. In our case, we would like to charge them for the channels, but bundle the bandwidth usage into their service just like we do VoIP. As they use more and more bandwidth it gives the customer incentive to upgrade their commit. -Matt ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] IPTV
Clint Ricker wrote: Matt, I'm understanding from you that if there was a good way to do this, you'd definitely be interested? Is anyone else out there potentially interested? This is an area that I've been working in for quite a while now, and the technology is there and deployable. There are two main obstacles, however. 1. Getting programming 2. Upfront costs of deployment (video headend infrastructures are not cheap...) The first obstacle is by far the biggest one. The head-end infrastructure is really not that bad. In fact, in our case where we only want 4 channels it is pretty cheap. Both of those are not really issues, but do require a bit of scale I'm working on a good platform to be able to do this on a centralized level that can then support multiple, smaller service providers. I'm interested in seeing if this is of interest to a large enough userbase through WISPs to make it worth the effort in building in support for those customers... We are ready for the solution should it present itself. We have our own fiber backbone that we operate at 10gig currently. Further, we are multicast enabled and have all the traffic separation technologies needed as part of providing our existing VoIP service. Again, just waiting on the solution to present itself. -Matt ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] IPTV
I'd be interested. I've checked a few, and so far have been unable to find a solution with programming that allows you to broadcast wirelessly due to license agreements. Not to mention one channel is approximately 4megs, and HD is 20megs, at TV quality anyway. These two things are large technical hurdles, especially for WISPs. 3 TVs in the home on different channels? 12megs. There are a few turnkey solutions deploying for small businesses now, with break-evens set around a 1000 customer base, that will allow ala-carte to a point. The ala-carte programming is foiled by the networks and their contracts, not necessarily the cable/aggregate companies. If you get 1 channel from a company, they want to serve all their channels to you (You can't get HBO without HBO2, HBO-West, HBO-Family, etc.). That is setup in the carrier agreements with whomever is brokering the aggregate deals. I agree with your #2 below, yep! If you come up with something, please hit me up with the info as we would definitely be interested. Brandon -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Clint Ricker Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 8:37 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] IPTV Matt, I'm understanding from you that if there was a good way to do this, you'd definitely be interested? Is anyone else out there potentially interested? This is an area that I've been working in for quite a while now, and the technology is there and deployable. There are two main obstacles, however. 1. Getting programming 2. Upfront costs of deployment (video headend infrastructures are not cheap...) Both of those are not really issues, but do require a bit of scale I'm working on a good platform to be able to do this on a centralized level that can then support multiple, smaller service providers. I'm interested in seeing if this is of interest to a large enough userbase through WISPs to make it worth the effort in building in support for those customers... -Clint Ricker On 9/10/07, Matt Liotta [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Brad Belton wrote: Correct, we see the same requests. However, why try re-inventing the wheel when DirecTV already has a solution in place? Every time this issue has popped up the client was more than happy to pay the DirecTV price even if they only wanted CNN or FOX. Are you reselling DirecTV now? It just didn't seem to make sense (yet) to put additional load on the IP leg into a building when the service is already available from the roof where we already have rights. Yes, but then you are running coax to various tenants and various drops. If it is a business park then you are putting a dish on each building. In our case, we would like to charge them for the channels, but bundle the bandwidth usage into their service just like we do VoIP. As they use more and more bandwidth it gives the customer incentive to upgrade their commit. -Matt ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at
Re: [WISPA] IPTV
MPEG-4 systems can provide much better bitrates. Most of DirecTV's HD is in MPEG-4. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Brandon Brownlee [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 10:04 AM Subject: RE: [WISPA] IPTV I'd be interested. I've checked a few, and so far have been unable to find a solution with programming that allows you to broadcast wirelessly due to license agreements. Not to mention one channel is approximately 4megs, and HD is 20megs, at TV quality anyway. These two things are large technical hurdles, especially for WISPs. 3 TVs in the home on different channels? 12megs. There are a few turnkey solutions deploying for small businesses now, with break-evens set around a 1000 customer base, that will allow ala-carte to a point. The ala-carte programming is foiled by the networks and their contracts, not necessarily the cable/aggregate companies. If you get 1 channel from a company, they want to serve all their channels to you (You can't get HBO without HBO2, HBO-West, HBO-Family, etc.). That is setup in the carrier agreements with whomever is brokering the aggregate deals. I agree with your #2 below, yep! If you come up with something, please hit me up with the info as we would definitely be interested. Brandon -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Clint Ricker Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 8:37 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] IPTV Matt, I'm understanding from you that if there was a good way to do this, you'd definitely be interested? Is anyone else out there potentially interested? This is an area that I've been working in for quite a while now, and the technology is there and deployable. There are two main obstacles, however. 1. Getting programming 2. Upfront costs of deployment (video headend infrastructures are not cheap...) Both of those are not really issues, but do require a bit of scale I'm working on a good platform to be able to do this on a centralized level that can then support multiple, smaller service providers. I'm interested in seeing if this is of interest to a large enough userbase through WISPs to make it worth the effort in building in support for those customers... -Clint Ricker On 9/10/07, Matt Liotta [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Brad Belton wrote: Correct, we see the same requests. However, why try re-inventing the wheel when DirecTV already has a solution in place? Every time this issue has popped up the client was more than happy to pay the DirecTV price even if they only wanted CNN or FOX. Are you reselling DirecTV now? It just didn't seem to make sense (yet) to put additional load on the IP leg into a building when the service is already available from the roof where we already have rights. Yes, but then you are running coax to various tenants and various drops. If it is a business park then you are putting a dish on each building. In our case, we would like to charge them for the channels, but bundle the bandwidth usage into their service just like we do VoIP. As they use more and more bandwidth it gives the customer incentive to upgrade their commit. -Matt ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] IPTV
How much better? Chuck Profito 209-988-7388 CV-ACCESS, INC [EMAIL PROTECTED] Providing High Speed Broadband to Rural Central California -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 8:14 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] IPTV MPEG-4 systems can provide much better bitrates. Most of DirecTV's HD is in MPEG-4. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Brandon Brownlee [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 10:04 AM Subject: RE: [WISPA] IPTV I'd be interested. I've checked a few, and so far have been unable to find a solution with programming that allows you to broadcast wirelessly due to license agreements. Not to mention one channel is approximately 4megs, and HD is 20megs, at TV quality anyway. These two things are large technical hurdles, especially for WISPs. 3 TVs in the home on different channels? 12megs. There are a few turnkey solutions deploying for small businesses now, with break-evens set around a 1000 customer base, that will allow ala-carte to a point. The ala-carte programming is foiled by the networks and their contracts, not necessarily the cable/aggregate companies. If you get 1 channel from a company, they want to serve all their channels to you (You can't get HBO without HBO2, HBO-West, HBO-Family, etc.). That is setup in the carrier agreements with whomever is brokering the aggregate deals. I agree with your #2 below, yep! If you come up with something, please hit me up with the info as we would definitely be interested. Brandon -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Clint Ricker Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 8:37 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] IPTV Matt, I'm understanding from you that if there was a good way to do this, you'd definitely be interested? Is anyone else out there potentially interested? This is an area that I've been working in for quite a while now, and the technology is there and deployable. There are two main obstacles, however. 1. Getting programming 2. Upfront costs of deployment (video headend infrastructures are not cheap...) Both of those are not really issues, but do require a bit of scale I'm working on a good platform to be able to do this on a centralized level that can then support multiple, smaller service providers. I'm interested in seeing if this is of interest to a large enough userbase through WISPs to make it worth the effort in building in support for those customers... -Clint Ricker On 9/10/07, Matt Liotta [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Brad Belton wrote: Correct, we see the same requests. However, why try re-inventing the wheel when DirecTV already has a solution in place? Every time this issue has popped up the client was more than happy to pay the DirecTV price even if they only wanted CNN or FOX. Are you reselling DirecTV now? It just didn't seem to make sense (yet) to put additional load on the IP leg into a building when the service is already available from the roof where we already have rights. Yes, but then you are running coax to various tenants and various drops. If it is a business park then you are putting a dish on each building. In our case, we would like to charge them for the channels, but bundle the bandwidth usage into their service just like we do VoIP. As they use more and more bandwidth it gives the customer incentive to upgrade their commit. -Matt -- -- ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- -- ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at
Re: [WISPA] You're all going to lose ( I hope not)
Forrest, I didn't mean to be offensive in my email, or imply that you are doing anything bad with your billing/usage model. I was just stating my opinion concerning the increased usage of bandwidth by customers and the WISP industry in general. I'm pretty sure that everyone agrees that bandwidth usage will always go up, just like processor speed and memory requirements and we as an industry need to be ready to deal with it. The telcos and the cable providers seem to be doing a better job of it right now mostly because the medium that they have supports better upload speeds that most WISP infrastructure can. While we would all like to have customers that pay for our fastest packages so they can check their email at blazingly fast speeds the reality is that just like any over subscription model, we subsidize the higher end users with the lower end users. All I'm saying is that we are going to see the lower end users raising the bar with uploads to youtube, flickr, jumpcut and other sites that require larger uploading. And as the users age, the p2p kiddies of today become the customers of tomorrow and while they may not be as interested in downloading every episode of south park any more they are growing up in a culture that expects more bandwidth. Sam Tetherow Sandhills Wireless Forrest W. Christian wrote: Sam Tetherow wrote: As ISPs in general I think we are going to have to be able to provide for this type of traffic. P2P is not all illegal movies. If we want to be providers for our community we need to be able to provide for the bandwidth hungry applications as well. I want to be clear... The limits I was talking about are in the tens of GByte/month range. 2Mb/s continous for days. I don't care whether it's P2P or a Web Server, or 100 Audio streams or Open Source .iso's being shared by Bittorrent. The Residential service we provide for $55/month is supposed to be intermittent, not 2Mb/s continuous. If someone wants 2Mb/s continous I'm more than happy to charge them $250/month for it. A typical customer on the $55/month service can download 2-3 full length, DVD quality, no additional compression movies without me even blinking an eye. Start sucking (or pushing) 2Mb/s continuous, then I get a little irritated. To me, the loss of a 2Mb/s continous customer is actually a good thing. 2Mb/s continuous is almost impossible to provide at $55/month in my neck of the woods. Any provider he goes to is going to cost them more money than they are charging them. How much are *you* paying for your upstream? -forrest ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ a href=http://mail.shwisp.net/spam/dspam.cgi?template=historyuser=tetherowretrain=spamsignatureID=16,46e4d101183331336712104;!DSPAM:16,46e4d101183331336712104!/a ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] IPTV
I've heard of 768 kb SD and HD under 5 megs, though I forget how far under 5 megs. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: CHUCK PROFITO [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 10:22 AM Subject: RE: [WISPA] IPTV How much better? Chuck Profito 209-988-7388 CV-ACCESS, INC [EMAIL PROTECTED] Providing High Speed Broadband to Rural Central California -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 8:14 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] IPTV MPEG-4 systems can provide much better bitrates. Most of DirecTV's HD is in MPEG-4. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Brandon Brownlee [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 10:04 AM Subject: RE: [WISPA] IPTV I'd be interested. I've checked a few, and so far have been unable to find a solution with programming that allows you to broadcast wirelessly due to license agreements. Not to mention one channel is approximately 4megs, and HD is 20megs, at TV quality anyway. These two things are large technical hurdles, especially for WISPs. 3 TVs in the home on different channels? 12megs. There are a few turnkey solutions deploying for small businesses now, with break-evens set around a 1000 customer base, that will allow ala-carte to a point. The ala-carte programming is foiled by the networks and their contracts, not necessarily the cable/aggregate companies. If you get 1 channel from a company, they want to serve all their channels to you (You can't get HBO without HBO2, HBO-West, HBO-Family, etc.). That is setup in the carrier agreements with whomever is brokering the aggregate deals. I agree with your #2 below, yep! If you come up with something, please hit me up with the info as we would definitely be interested. Brandon -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Clint Ricker Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 8:37 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] IPTV Matt, I'm understanding from you that if there was a good way to do this, you'd definitely be interested? Is anyone else out there potentially interested? This is an area that I've been working in for quite a while now, and the technology is there and deployable. There are two main obstacles, however. 1. Getting programming 2. Upfront costs of deployment (video headend infrastructures are not cheap...) Both of those are not really issues, but do require a bit of scale I'm working on a good platform to be able to do this on a centralized level that can then support multiple, smaller service providers. I'm interested in seeing if this is of interest to a large enough userbase through WISPs to make it worth the effort in building in support for those customers... -Clint Ricker On 9/10/07, Matt Liotta [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Brad Belton wrote: Correct, we see the same requests. However, why try re-inventing the wheel when DirecTV already has a solution in place? Every time this issue has popped up the client was more than happy to pay the DirecTV price even if they only wanted CNN or FOX. Are you reselling DirecTV now? It just didn't seem to make sense (yet) to put additional load on the IP leg into a building when the service is already available from the roof where we already have rights. Yes, but then you are running coax to various tenants and various drops. If it is a business park then you are putting a dish on each building. In our case, we would like to charge them for the channels, but bundle the bandwidth usage into their service just like we do VoIP. As they use more and more bandwidth it gives the customer incentive to upgrade their commit. -Matt -- -- ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- -- ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall
Re: [WISPA] IPTV
My research show that the main cost is the STB more so then the head end. VLS makes a pretty decent head-end depending on what you want to serve out. I had setup VLS with access to current IPTV stations as well as HD stored media. The streaming was very simple to to, albeit network intensive. I would be very interested in learning more about the purposed solution On 9/10/07, Mike Hammett [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I've heard of 768 kb SD and HD under 5 megs, though I forget how far under 5 megs. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: CHUCK PROFITO [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 10:22 AM Subject: RE: [WISPA] IPTV How much better? Chuck Profito 209-988-7388 CV-ACCESS, INC [EMAIL PROTECTED] Providing High Speed Broadband to Rural Central California -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 8:14 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] IPTV MPEG-4 systems can provide much better bitrates. Most of DirecTV's HD is in MPEG-4. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Brandon Brownlee [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 10:04 AM Subject: RE: [WISPA] IPTV I'd be interested. I've checked a few, and so far have been unable to find a solution with programming that allows you to broadcast wirelessly due to license agreements. Not to mention one channel is approximately 4megs, and HD is 20megs, at TV quality anyway. These two things are large technical hurdles, especially for WISPs. 3 TVs in the home on different channels? 12megs. There are a few turnkey solutions deploying for small businesses now, with break-evens set around a 1000 customer base, that will allow ala-carte to a point. The ala-carte programming is foiled by the networks and their contracts, not necessarily the cable/aggregate companies. If you get 1 channel from a company, they want to serve all their channels to you (You can't get HBO without HBO2, HBO-West, HBO-Family, etc.). That is setup in the carrier agreements with whomever is brokering the aggregate deals. I agree with your #2 below, yep! If you come up with something, please hit me up with the info as we would definitely be interested. Brandon -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Clint Ricker Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 8:37 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] IPTV Matt, I'm understanding from you that if there was a good way to do this, you'd definitely be interested? Is anyone else out there potentially interested? This is an area that I've been working in for quite a while now, and the technology is there and deployable. There are two main obstacles, however. 1. Getting programming 2. Upfront costs of deployment (video headend infrastructures are not cheap...) Both of those are not really issues, but do require a bit of scale I'm working on a good platform to be able to do this on a centralized level that can then support multiple, smaller service providers. I'm interested in seeing if this is of interest to a large enough userbase through WISPs to make it worth the effort in building in support for those customers... -Clint Ricker On 9/10/07, Matt Liotta [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Brad Belton wrote: Correct, we see the same requests. However, why try re-inventing the wheel when DirecTV already has a solution in place? Every time this issue has popped up the client was more than happy to pay the DirecTV price even if they only wanted CNN or FOX. Are you reselling DirecTV now? It just didn't seem to make sense (yet) to put additional load on the IP leg into a building when the service is already available from the roof where we already have rights. Yes, but then you are running coax to various tenants and various drops. If it is a business park then you are putting a dish on each building. In our case, we would like to charge them for the channels, but bundle the bandwidth usage into their service just like we do VoIP. As they use more and more bandwidth it gives the customer incentive to upgrade their commit. -Matt -- -- ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at
[WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
I was a WISP in the late 90s and early 00s. Some of you may know me. It's good to see many familiar faces still here. In recent years, I have pursued new interests but I keep thinking back on my experiences as a WISP. I had a lot of good times back then. I'm thinking about creeping back into the WISP business. After I sold in 2004, I followed a new trend in wireless in the press called muni wireless promoted by manufacturers such as Strix and Tropos. This concept has taken some major blows in the press this month: http://wifinetnews.com/archives/007869.htmlhttp://wifinetnews.com/archives/007869.html http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20521155/ http://web20.telecomtv.com/pages/?newsid=41788id=e9381817-0593-417a-8639-c4c53e2a2a10view=newshttp://web20.telecomtv.com/pages/?ne...2a10view=news http://www.unstrung.com/document.asp...ng_sitedefault http://www.alleyinsider.com/2007/08/as-earthlink-el.htmlhttp://www.alleyinsider.com/2007/08/...thlink-el.html http://www.computerworld.com/blogs/node/6120 This hits close to home because the company who bought my WISP (ShreveNet) boasted being the largest WISP with the largest muni WIFI network in the nation in Tempe AZ (NeoReach aka Kite aka MobilePro) which sold these properties recently to Gobility. (Big Yawn).. http://www.bbwexchange.com/wireless_isp/http://www.bbwexchange.com/wireless_isp/ I'm certainly am not posting this thread to defend or even discuss the somewhat failed muni wireless concept. Some say it was a failure because of the model rather than technology, caused by giving away free service to the anchor tenant (the city) and so forth. Whatever... I couldn't care less about the past or Earthlink or Google, or MobilePro or huge muni wifi networks. However I am fascinated by the mesh technology in general, especially after witnessing the old Nokia collapsible bridged mesh networks of the 90s. LOL, a lot has changed since then. I often wonder how Dave Peterson and Ultramesh/locustworld turned out. Once upon a time, he sold product to a WISP near me in Vivian LA to build the first mesh network in the US. He ended up with some heavy debt. Also I knew of a WISP in Leesville LA using Wave Wireless (Speedcom) mesh gear with pretty good technical results, that is, for a single radio system. I'm thinking more along the lines of multiple radio systems. I am brainstorming a new WISP model and I am seeking feedback and advice. The concept goes something like this. The muni network model touted in the press had many flaws as I see it. Coming into an urban market after DSL and Cable has to be a steep uphill climb. Yet in 2007 there are still rural areas with no high speed solution in sight, particularly in the wooded Southeast where the old wireless models don't always work. I posted the following statistics to the wireless boards nearly a decade ago as the results of my first 2.4GHz network. In my area (Shreveport LA) 65 out of 100 business surveys came back positive (35 negative) for LOS. This was made possible by multistory buildings and large parking lots (lack of trees) Yet for residential service, only 5 came back positive while 95 came back negative. Clearly there is a tree issue in many residential parts of the country. This is the market that has few if any options as many keep hoping for DSL and cablemodem. Chainsaw jokes grow old fast around here. Traditionally the tools for Foliar NLOS have been (a) the use of low frequency spectrum to penetrate through the offending object, and (b) route around the offending object by hopping around it, (c) increase the power to try and punch through the offending objects. Add to these maybe OFDM to use multipath interference to our advantage but I see that as an Urban solution (reflections off buildings) more than a foliar solution (reflections off trees) The 700mw SR9 combined with a cheap SBCs and appropriate TCP routing protocols appears to go a long way to make new things possible. Please imagine a muni wireless mesh network that utilizes 900MHz cards instead of 5.8 and 2.4 cards. Instead of nodes being 1000 feet apart atop light poles, they are now spread 1 or 2 miles apart. Instead of it taking 15 or 20 nodes to cover one square mile, perhaps one node could cover 1 to 4 square miles. Could this be a solution for wooded areas with low to moderate population densities? In other words, do you know anyone who has ever built a mesh network using SR9s and SBCs with multiple radios to achieve redundancy and ubiquitous coverage for small towns in the Southeast? And using no towers by the way, LOL? As I see it, the SR9 has 4 non-overlapping channels at 5MHz each. Thats all I need. (I think) No hub and spoke POPs off towers, please. Been there done that. I don't think I could take that anymore. I'm not a climber and don't wish to hire any climbers unless it is for aggregate backhaul PtP which is fine. This post has nothing
Re: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
Wow, I think the last time I saw this guy was WISPCON-Dallas... the first one if there was more than one. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Allen Marsalis [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: wireless@wispa.org Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 11:16 AM Subject: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks I was a WISP in the late 90s and early 00s. Some of you may know me. It's good to see many familiar faces still here. In recent years, I have pursued new interests but I keep thinking back on my experiences as a WISP. I had a lot of good times back then. I'm thinking about creeping back into the WISP business. After I sold in 2004, I followed a new trend in wireless in the press called muni wireless promoted by manufacturers such as Strix and Tropos. This concept has taken some major blows in the press this month: http://wifinetnews.com/archives/007869.htmlhttp://wifinetnews.com/archives/007869.html http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20521155/ http://web20.telecomtv.com/pages/?newsid=41788id=e9381817-0593-417a-8639-c4c53e2a2a10view=newshttp://web20.telecomtv.com/pages/?ne...2a10view=news http://www.unstrung.com/document.asp...ng_sitedefault http://www.alleyinsider.com/2007/08/as-earthlink-el.htmlhttp://www.alleyinsider.com/2007/08/...thlink-el.html http://www.computerworld.com/blogs/node/6120 This hits close to home because the company who bought my WISP (ShreveNet) boasted being the largest WISP with the largest muni WIFI network in the nation in Tempe AZ (NeoReach aka Kite aka MobilePro) which sold these properties recently to Gobility. (Big Yawn).. http://www.bbwexchange.com/wireless_isp/http://www.bbwexchange.com/wireless_isp/ I'm certainly am not posting this thread to defend or even discuss the somewhat failed muni wireless concept. Some say it was a failure because of the model rather than technology, caused by giving away free service to the anchor tenant (the city) and so forth. Whatever... I couldn't care less about the past or Earthlink or Google, or MobilePro or huge muni wifi networks. However I am fascinated by the mesh technology in general, especially after witnessing the old Nokia collapsible bridged mesh networks of the 90s. LOL, a lot has changed since then. I often wonder how Dave Peterson and Ultramesh/locustworld turned out. Once upon a time, he sold product to a WISP near me in Vivian LA to build the first mesh network in the US. He ended up with some heavy debt. Also I knew of a WISP in Leesville LA using Wave Wireless (Speedcom) mesh gear with pretty good technical results, that is, for a single radio system. I'm thinking more along the lines of multiple radio systems. I am brainstorming a new WISP model and I am seeking feedback and advice. The concept goes something like this. The muni network model touted in the press had many flaws as I see it. Coming into an urban market after DSL and Cable has to be a steep uphill climb. Yet in 2007 there are still rural areas with no high speed solution in sight, particularly in the wooded Southeast where the old wireless models don't always work. I posted the following statistics to the wireless boards nearly a decade ago as the results of my first 2.4GHz network. In my area (Shreveport LA) 65 out of 100 business surveys came back positive (35 negative) for LOS. This was made possible by multistory buildings and large parking lots (lack of trees) Yet for residential service, only 5 came back positive while 95 came back negative. Clearly there is a tree issue in many residential parts of the country. This is the market that has few if any options as many keep hoping for DSL and cablemodem. Chainsaw jokes grow old fast around here. Traditionally the tools for Foliar NLOS have been (a) the use of low frequency spectrum to penetrate through the offending object, and (b) route around the offending object by hopping around it, (c) increase the power to try and punch through the offending objects. Add to these maybe OFDM to use multipath interference to our advantage but I see that as an Urban solution (reflections off buildings) more than a foliar solution (reflections off trees) The 700mw SR9 combined with a cheap SBCs and appropriate TCP routing protocols appears to go a long way to make new things possible. Please imagine a muni wireless mesh network that utilizes 900MHz cards instead of 5.8 and 2.4 cards. Instead of nodes being 1000 feet apart atop light poles, they are now spread 1 or 2 miles apart. Instead of it taking 15 or 20 nodes to cover one square mile, perhaps one node could cover 1 to 4 square miles. Could this be a solution for wooded areas with low to moderate population densities? In other words, do you know anyone who has ever built a mesh network using SR9s and SBCs with multiple radios to achieve redundancy and ubiquitous coverage for small towns in the Southeast? And using no
Re: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
OMG! I guess you dont love me anymore because you dont return my emails :-( Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -Original Message- From: Allen Marsalis [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2007 11:16:57 To:wireless@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks I was a WISP in the late 90s and early 00s. Some of you may know me. It's good to see many familiar faces still here. In recent years, I have pursued new interests but I keep thinking back on my experiences as a WISP. I had a lot of good times back then. I'm thinking about creeping back into the WISP business. After I sold in 2004, I followed a new trend in wireless in the press called muni wireless promoted by manufacturers such as Strix and Tropos. This concept has taken some major blows in the press this month: http://wifinetnews.com/archives/007869.htmlhttp://wifinetnews.com/archives/007869.html http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20521155/ http://web20.telecomtv.com/pages/?newsid=41788id=e9381817-0593-417a-8639-c4c53e2a2a10view=newshttp://web20.telecomtv.com/pages/?ne...2a10view=news http://www.unstrung.com/document.asp...ng_sitedefault http://www.alleyinsider.com/2007/08/as-earthlink-el.htmlhttp://www.alleyinsider.com/2007/08/...thlink-el.html http://www.computerworld.com/blogs/node/6120 This hits close to home because the company who bought my WISP (ShreveNet) boasted being the largest WISP with the largest muni WIFI network in the nation in Tempe AZ (NeoReach aka Kite aka MobilePro) which sold these properties recently to Gobility. (Big Yawn).. http://www.bbwexchange.com/wireless_isp/http://www.bbwexchange.com/wireless_isp/ I'm certainly am not posting this thread to defend or even discuss the somewhat failed muni wireless concept. Some say it was a failure because of the model rather than technology, caused by giving away free service to the anchor tenant (the city) and so forth. Whatever... I couldn't care less about the past or Earthlink or Google, or MobilePro or huge muni wifi networks. However I am fascinated by the mesh technology in general, especially after witnessing the old Nokia collapsible bridged mesh networks of the 90s. LOL, a lot has changed since then. I often wonder how Dave Peterson and Ultramesh/locustworld turned out. Once upon a time, he sold product to a WISP near me in Vivian LA to build the first mesh network in the US. He ended up with some heavy debt. Also I knew of a WISP in Leesville LA using Wave Wireless (Speedcom) mesh gear with pretty good technical results, that is, for a single radio system. I'm thinking more along the lines of multiple radio systems. I am brainstorming a new WISP model and I am seeking feedback and advice. The concept goes something like this. The muni network model touted in the press had many flaws as I see it. Coming into an urban market after DSL and Cable has to be a steep uphill climb. Yet in 2007 there are still rural areas with no high speed solution in sight, particularly in the wooded Southeast where the old wireless models don't always work. I posted the following statistics to the wireless boards nearly a decade ago as the results of my first 2.4GHz network. In my area (Shreveport LA) 65 out of 100 business surveys came back positive (35 negative) for LOS. This was made possible by multistory buildings and large parking lots (lack of trees) Yet for residential service, only 5 came back positive while 95 came back negative. Clearly there is a tree issue in many residential parts of the country. This is the market that has few if any options as many keep hoping for DSL and cablemodem. Chainsaw jokes grow old fast around here. Traditionally the tools for Foliar NLOS have been (a) the use of low frequency spectrum to penetrate through the offending object, and (b) route around the offending object by hopping around it, (c) increase the power to try and punch through the offending objects. Add to these maybe OFDM to use multipath interference to our advantage but I see that as an Urban solution (reflections off buildings) more than a foliar solution (reflections off trees) The 700mw SR9 combined with a cheap SBCs and appropriate TCP routing protocols appears to go a long way to make new things possible. Please imagine a muni wireless mesh network that utilizes 900MHz cards instead of 5.8 and 2.4 cards. Instead of nodes being 1000 feet apart atop light poles, they are now spread 1 or 2 miles apart. Instead of it taking 15 or 20 nodes to cover one square mile, perhaps one node could cover 1 to 4 square miles. Could this be a solution for wooded areas with low to moderate population densities? In other words, do you know anyone who has ever built a mesh network using SR9s and SBCs with multiple radios to achieve redundancy and ubiquitous coverage for small towns in the Southeast? And using no towers by the way, LOL? As I see it, the SR9 has 4
Re: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
YeahThat was him And yes..it was the first one. Because I was at the second one ( I think) and he banged in sick for the show (or something...) :-) -B- Mike Hammett wrote: Wow, I think the last time I saw this guy was WISPCON-Dallas... the first one if there was more than one. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Allen Marsalis [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: wireless@wispa.org Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 11:16 AM Subject: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks I was a WISP in the late 90s and early 00s. Some of you may know me. It's good to see many familiar faces still here. In recent years, I have pursued new interests but I keep thinking back on my experiences as a WISP. I had a lot of good times back then. I'm thinking about creeping back into the WISP business. After I sold in 2004, I followed a new trend in wireless in the press called muni wireless promoted by manufacturers such as Strix and Tropos. This concept has taken some major blows in the press this month: http://wifinetnews.com/archives/007869.htmlhttp://wifinetnews.com/archives/007869.html http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20521155/ http://web20.telecomtv.com/pages/?newsid=41788id=e9381817-0593-417a-8639-c4c53e2a2a10view=newshttp://web20.telecomtv.com/pages/?ne...2a10view=news http://www.unstrung.com/document.asp...ng_sitedefault http://www.alleyinsider.com/2007/08/as-earthlink-el.htmlhttp://www.alleyinsider.com/2007/08/...thlink-el.html http://www.computerworld.com/blogs/node/6120 This hits close to home because the company who bought my WISP (ShreveNet) boasted being the largest WISP with the largest muni WIFI network in the nation in Tempe AZ (NeoReach aka Kite aka MobilePro) which sold these properties recently to Gobility. (Big Yawn).. http://www.bbwexchange.com/wireless_isp/http://www.bbwexchange.com/wireless_isp/ I'm certainly am not posting this thread to defend or even discuss the somewhat failed muni wireless concept. Some say it was a failure because of the model rather than technology, caused by giving away free service to the anchor tenant (the city) and so forth. Whatever... I couldn't care less about the past or Earthlink or Google, or MobilePro or huge muni wifi networks. However I am fascinated by the mesh technology in general, especially after witnessing the old Nokia collapsible bridged mesh networks of the 90s. LOL, a lot has changed since then. I often wonder how Dave Peterson and Ultramesh/locustworld turned out. Once upon a time, he sold product to a WISP near me in Vivian LA to build the first mesh network in the US. He ended up with some heavy debt. Also I knew of a WISP in Leesville LA using Wave Wireless (Speedcom) mesh gear with pretty good technical results, that is, for a single radio system. I'm thinking more along the lines of multiple radio systems. I am brainstorming a new WISP model and I am seeking feedback and advice. The concept goes something like this. The muni network model touted in the press had many flaws as I see it. Coming into an urban market after DSL and Cable has to be a steep uphill climb. Yet in 2007 there are still rural areas with no high speed solution in sight, particularly in the wooded Southeast where the old wireless models don't always work. I posted the following statistics to the wireless boards nearly a decade ago as the results of my first 2.4GHz network. In my area (Shreveport LA) 65 out of 100 business surveys came back positive (35 negative) for LOS. This was made possible by multistory buildings and large parking lots (lack of trees) Yet for residential service, only 5 came back positive while 95 came back negative. Clearly there is a tree issue in many residential parts of the country. This is the market that has few if any options as many keep hoping for DSL and cablemodem. Chainsaw jokes grow old fast around here. Traditionally the tools for Foliar NLOS have been (a) the use of low frequency spectrum to penetrate through the offending object, and (b) route around the offending object by hopping around it, (c) increase the power to try and punch through the offending objects. Add to these maybe OFDM to use multipath interference to our advantage but I see that as an Urban solution (reflections off buildings) more than a foliar solution (reflections off trees) The 700mw SR9 combined with a cheap SBCs and appropriate TCP routing protocols appears to go a long way to make new things possible. Please imagine a muni wireless mesh network that utilizes 900MHz cards instead of 5.8 and 2.4 cards. Instead of nodes being 1000 feet apart atop light poles, they are now spread 1 or 2 miles apart. Instead of it taking 15 or 20 nodes to cover one square mile, perhaps one node could cover 1 to 4 square miles. Could this be a solution for wooded areas with low to moderate population densities? In
RE: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
Wow! Im witnessing the return of a pioneer! Welcome back Gino A. Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. tel 787.273.4143 fax 787.273.4145 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Allen Marsalis Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 12:17 PM To: wireless@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks I was a WISP in the late 90s and early 00s. Some of you may know me. It's good to see many familiar faces still here. In recent years, I have pursued new interests but I keep thinking back on my experiences as a WISP. I had a lot of good times back then. I'm thinking about creeping back into the WISP business. After I sold in 2004, I followed a new trend in wireless in the press called muni wireless promoted by manufacturers such as Strix and Tropos. This concept has taken some major blows in the press this month: http://wifinetnews.com/archives/007869.htmlhttp://wifinetnews.com/arch ives/007869.html http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20521155/ http://web20.telecomtv.com/pages/?newsid=41788id=e9381817-0593-417a-86 39-c4c53e2a2a10view=newshttp://web20.telecomtv.com/pages/?ne...2a10vi ew=news http://www.unstrung.com/document.asp...ng_sitedefault http://www.alleyinsider.com/2007/08/as-earthlink-el.htmlhttp://www.all eyinsider.com/2007/08/...thlink-el.html http://www.computerworld.com/blogs/node/6120 This hits close to home because the company who bought my WISP (ShreveNet) boasted being the largest WISP with the largest muni WIFI network in the nation in Tempe AZ (NeoReach aka Kite aka MobilePro) which sold these properties recently to Gobility. (Big Yawn).. http://www.bbwexchange.com/wireless_isp/http://www.bbwexchange.com/wir eless_isp/ I'm certainly am not posting this thread to defend or even discuss the somewhat failed muni wireless concept. Some say it was a failure because of the model rather than technology, caused by giving away free service to the anchor tenant (the city) and so forth. Whatever... I couldn't care less about the past or Earthlink or Google, or MobilePro or huge muni wifi networks. However I am fascinated by the mesh technology in general, especially after witnessing the old Nokia collapsible bridged mesh networks of the 90s. LOL, a lot has changed since then. I often wonder how Dave Peterson and Ultramesh/locustworld turned out. Once upon a time, he sold product to a WISP near me in Vivian LA to build the first mesh network in the US. He ended up with some heavy debt. Also I knew of a WISP in Leesville LA using Wave Wireless (Speedcom) mesh gear with pretty good technical results, that is, for a single radio system. I'm thinking more along the lines of multiple radio systems. I am brainstorming a new WISP model and I am seeking feedback and advice. The concept goes something like this. The muni network model touted in the press had many flaws as I see it. Coming into an urban market after DSL and Cable has to be a steep uphill climb. Yet in 2007 there are still rural areas with no high speed solution in sight, particularly in the wooded Southeast where the old wireless models don't always work. I posted the following statistics to the wireless boards nearly a decade ago as the results of my first 2.4GHz network. In my area (Shreveport LA) 65 out of 100 business surveys came back positive (35 negative) for LOS. This was made possible by multistory buildings and large parking lots (lack of trees) Yet for residential service, only 5 came back positive while 95 came back negative. Clearly there is a tree issue in many residential parts of the country. This is the market that has few if any options as many keep hoping for DSL and cablemodem. Chainsaw jokes grow old fast around here. Traditionally the tools for Foliar NLOS have been (a) the use of low frequency spectrum to penetrate through the offending object, and (b) route around the offending object by hopping around it, (c) increase the power to try and punch through the offending objects. Add to these maybe OFDM to use multipath interference to our advantage but I see that as an Urban solution (reflections off buildings) more than a foliar solution (reflections off trees) The 700mw SR9 combined with a cheap SBCs and appropriate TCP routing protocols appears to go a long way to make new things possible. Please imagine a muni wireless mesh network that utilizes 900MHz cards instead of 5.8 and 2.4 cards. Instead of nodes being 1000 feet apart atop light poles, they are now spread 1 or 2 miles apart. Instead of it taking 15 or 20 nodes to cover one square mile, perhaps one node could cover 1 to 4 square miles. Could this be a solution for wooded areas with low to moderate population densities? In other words, do you know anyone who has ever built a mesh network using SR9s and SBCs with multiple radios to achieve redundancy and ubiquitous coverage for small towns in the
RE: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
You 900 idea souns interesting, but youll need a 900 muni client and/or 900 pcmcia card for customers Gino A. Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. tel 787.273.4143 fax 787.273.4145 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Allen Marsalis Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 12:17 PM To: wireless@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks I was a WISP in the late 90s and early 00s. Some of you may know me. It's good to see many familiar faces still here. In recent years, I have pursued new interests but I keep thinking back on my experiences as a WISP. I had a lot of good times back then. I'm thinking about creeping back into the WISP business. After I sold in 2004, I followed a new trend in wireless in the press called muni wireless promoted by manufacturers such as Strix and Tropos. This concept has taken some major blows in the press this month: http://wifinetnews.com/archives/007869.htmlhttp://wifinetnews.com/arch ives/007869.html http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20521155/ http://web20.telecomtv.com/pages/?newsid=41788id=e9381817-0593-417a-86 39-c4c53e2a2a10view=newshttp://web20.telecomtv.com/pages/?ne...2a10vi ew=news http://www.unstrung.com/document.asp...ng_sitedefault http://www.alleyinsider.com/2007/08/as-earthlink-el.htmlhttp://www.all eyinsider.com/2007/08/...thlink-el.html http://www.computerworld.com/blogs/node/6120 This hits close to home because the company who bought my WISP (ShreveNet) boasted being the largest WISP with the largest muni WIFI network in the nation in Tempe AZ (NeoReach aka Kite aka MobilePro) which sold these properties recently to Gobility. (Big Yawn).. http://www.bbwexchange.com/wireless_isp/http://www.bbwexchange.com/wir eless_isp/ I'm certainly am not posting this thread to defend or even discuss the somewhat failed muni wireless concept. Some say it was a failure because of the model rather than technology, caused by giving away free service to the anchor tenant (the city) and so forth. Whatever... I couldn't care less about the past or Earthlink or Google, or MobilePro or huge muni wifi networks. However I am fascinated by the mesh technology in general, especially after witnessing the old Nokia collapsible bridged mesh networks of the 90s. LOL, a lot has changed since then. I often wonder how Dave Peterson and Ultramesh/locustworld turned out. Once upon a time, he sold product to a WISP near me in Vivian LA to build the first mesh network in the US. He ended up with some heavy debt. Also I knew of a WISP in Leesville LA using Wave Wireless (Speedcom) mesh gear with pretty good technical results, that is, for a single radio system. I'm thinking more along the lines of multiple radio systems. I am brainstorming a new WISP model and I am seeking feedback and advice. The concept goes something like this. The muni network model touted in the press had many flaws as I see it. Coming into an urban market after DSL and Cable has to be a steep uphill climb. Yet in 2007 there are still rural areas with no high speed solution in sight, particularly in the wooded Southeast where the old wireless models don't always work. I posted the following statistics to the wireless boards nearly a decade ago as the results of my first 2.4GHz network. In my area (Shreveport LA) 65 out of 100 business surveys came back positive (35 negative) for LOS. This was made possible by multistory buildings and large parking lots (lack of trees) Yet for residential service, only 5 came back positive while 95 came back negative. Clearly there is a tree issue in many residential parts of the country. This is the market that has few if any options as many keep hoping for DSL and cablemodem. Chainsaw jokes grow old fast around here. Traditionally the tools for Foliar NLOS have been (a) the use of low frequency spectrum to penetrate through the offending object, and (b) route around the offending object by hopping around it, (c) increase the power to try and punch through the offending objects. Add to these maybe OFDM to use multipath interference to our advantage but I see that as an Urban solution (reflections off buildings) more than a foliar solution (reflections off trees) The 700mw SR9 combined with a cheap SBCs and appropriate TCP routing protocols appears to go a long way to make new things possible. Please imagine a muni wireless mesh network that utilizes 900MHz cards instead of 5.8 and 2.4 cards. Instead of nodes being 1000 feet apart atop light poles, they are now spread 1 or 2 miles apart. Instead of it taking 15 or 20 nodes to cover one square mile, perhaps one node could cover 1 to 4 square miles. Could this be a solution for wooded areas with low to moderate population densities? In other words, do you know anyone who has ever built a mesh network using SR9s and SBCs with multiple radios to achieve redundancy and
Re: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
At 11:29 AM 9/10/2007, you wrote: Wow, I think the last time I saw this guy was WISPCON-Dallas... the first one if there was more than one. That was me. There is only one me, that's for sure. :)Dallas WISPCON was my last convention. Allen ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
At 11:42 AM 9/10/2007, Bob Moldashel wrote: YeahThat was him And yes..it was the first one. Because I was at the second one ( I think) and he banged in sick for the show (or something...) Bob I remember missing you in Chicago but not Dallas. If I ever knew you were in Dallas, I'd be there just to meet you face to face for the first time. Allen ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
At 11:42 AM 9/10/2007, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: OMG! I guess you dont love me anymore because you dont return my emails :-( I do love you Bob and I'm truly sorry about that. Around '04 I used to spend about 4 to 6 hours a day on email and my new boss put an end to all that. After I quit, I bounced around between many email addresses and fell into an email funk. My old shreve.net address seems to be working now so I dusted it off to give it a try. Last month I accidently wiped out my bandwise account.. Not making excuses, its my fault. I tried to call you a few weeks ago to chat but dropped the ball again. I've made many mistakes lately. But I just can't stop thinking about wireless! ;) Allen ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
At 11:49 AM 9/10/2007, you wrote: You 900 idea souns interesting, but youll need a 900 muni client and/or 900 pcmcia card for customers Thanks much for the reply Gino. My idea is like muni wireless in that there really is no CPE per se. With muni wifi, each node is on top of a light pole or building. With my idea, I would place a pole in the yard (or rooftop) of select customers to form the NLOS mesh. Each box would have at least two 900MHz cards plus one wifi card for the customer to access using a laptop (or desktop with cheap wifi adapter). Like with muni wifi, I would own all the rooftop and poletop outdoor gear. But in a sense you are correct. In fact it would be more like two 900 cards per customer if you are not at the edge of the mesh. I'm able to get 0.1 miles of NLOS using wifi so in theory, next door neighbors may not need any 900 (not be a node in the mesh) One goal is to reduce the need for towers. A climber fell to his death here only a few months ago, and I can't afford expensive tower space and climbers anyway. I'd rather put that capital in to more gear to grow the mesh organically. I take it that nobody has ever built a 900MHz NLOS mesh network before. Which is not a good sign to me. That's a sign that my idea probably won't work. Allen ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
Allen: Metricom did. Thanks, Steve On 9/10/07, Allen Marsalis [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: snip I take it that nobody has ever built a 900MHz NLOS mesh network before. Which is not a good sign to me. That's a sign that my idea probably won't work. Allen -- Steve Stroh 425-939-0076 | [EMAIL PROTECTED] | www.stevestroh.com ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
So does this mean that you now agree with me that little wireless cards can be used for wireless broadband? George :) Allen Marsalis wrote: At 11:49 AM 9/10/2007, you wrote: You 900 idea souns interesting, but youll need a 900 muni client and/or 900 pcmcia card for customers ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
At 12:56 PM 9/10/2007, Steve Stroh wrote: Allen: Metricom did. Thanks, Steve Thanks for the reply Steve. Can you share if they were able to make it work or not? Any info would be greatly appreciated. Allen ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
Alan, There is a second manufacture of 900 Mini-Pci cards which is Zcomax. The two (ubnt and Zcomax don't talk because of different center frequencies. Zcomax is what Tranzeo is using in there 900 products, so this may be a good way to go, with the ability to have pre-manufactured client radios. What I have found with any Atheros card running 5Mhz channels, is that if you scan from another, you will see the first card transmitting on a channel about 20mhz away. This transmit is about 20dB less than the primary, but still prevalently there. I think you could see some issues because of this, and I wonder what frequency that ends up being when the 900 card is a re-badge of 2.4. To explain this better, channel 6 on 2.4 is 906 on the ubiquity cards I believe. If I then scan and see a signature at 2457, what frequency is that on the 900 conversion? It is probably in the high 800 range by my estimate. There are definitely some issues there. Also, I have seen better connections with Motorola 900 than with the put togethers. I do think your idea is something worth while, and I've thought about something similar myself. I am also familiar with the Muni-market, and the downfalls, and the good ideas of it. If you remember me, you know I worked for one of them. In fact, I worked under you I believe!! Good to see you back. Joel White NexGenAccess Inc. www.nexgenaccess.com 740-513-4122 NexGenAccess Inc. http://www.nexgenaccess.com -- Original Message --- From: Gino Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Mon, 10 Sep 2007 12:49:35 -0400 Subject: RE: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks You 900 idea souns interesting, but youll need a 900 muni client and/or 900 pcmcia card for customers Gino A. Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. tel 787.273.4143 fax 787.273.4145 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Allen Marsalis Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 12:17 PM To: wireless@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks I was a WISP in the late 90s and early 00s. Some of you may know me. It's good to see many familiar faces still here. In recent years, I have pursued new interests but I keep thinking back on my experiences as a WISP. I had a lot of good times back then. I'm thinking about creeping back into the WISP business. After I sold in 2004, I followed a new trend in wireless in the press called muni wireless promoted by manufacturers such as Strix and Tropos. This concept has taken some major blows in the press this month: http://wifinetnews.com/archives/007869.htmlhttp://wifinetnews.com/arch ives/007869.html http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20521155/ http://web20.telecomtv.com/pages/?newsid=41788id=e9381817-0593- 417a-86 39-c4c53e2a2a10view=newshttp://web20.telecomtv.com/pages/?ne...2a10vi ew=news http://www.unstrung.com/document.asp...ng_sitedefault http://www.alleyinsider.com/2007/08/as-earthlink-el.htmlhttp://www.all eyinsider.com/2007/08/...thlink-el.html http://www.computerworld.com/blogs/node/6120 This hits close to home because the company who bought my WISP (ShreveNet) boasted being the largest WISP with the largest muni WIFI network in the nation in Tempe AZ (NeoReach aka Kite aka MobilePro) which sold these properties recently to Gobility. (Big Yawn).. http://www.bbwexchange.com/wireless_isp/http://www.bbwexchange.com/wir eless_isp/ I'm certainly am not posting this thread to defend or even discuss the somewhat failed muni wireless concept. Some say it was a failure because of the model rather than technology, caused by giving away free service to the anchor tenant (the city) and so forth. Whatever... I couldn't care less about the past or Earthlink or Google, or MobilePro or huge muni wifi networks. However I am fascinated by the mesh technology in general, especially after witnessing the old Nokia collapsible bridged mesh networks of the 90s. LOL, a lot has changed since then. I often wonder how Dave Peterson and Ultramesh/locustworld turned out. Once upon a time, he sold product to a WISP near me in Vivian LA to build the first mesh network in the US. He ended up with some heavy debt. Also I knew of a WISP in Leesville LA using Wave Wireless (Speedcom) mesh gear with pretty good technical results, that is, for a single radio system. I'm thinking more along the lines of multiple radio systems. I am brainstorming a new WISP model and I am seeking feedback and advice. The concept goes something like this. The muni network model touted in the press had many flaws as I see it. Coming into an urban market after DSL and Cable has to be a steep uphill climb. Yet in 2007 there are still rural areas with no high speed solution in sight, particularly in the wooded Southeast where the old wireless models don't always work. I posted the
Re: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
Allen Marsalis wrote: I take it that nobody has ever built a 900MHz NLOS mesh network before. Which is not a good sign to me. That's a sign that my idea probably won't work. I'd be very skeptical just because of what I lovingly call the Tropos Effect. Obviously, all these nodes eventually have to come back to... somewhere that has a big bad Internet connection. Your office, a central tower, whatever. If you're near that tower, you don't have much of a problem, as your laptop is talking to a node that's talking directly to that point of origin. If you're a few blocks away, where your laptop talks to a node that's two or three hops away, there's cumulative bandwidth loss and added latency, and just more things that can go wrong generally. Your proposal gets rid of the worst part of how Tropos does things. They use the same radio both for inter-node communication and for customers, same SSID, same everything; by using separate radios for backhaul and customer access, you're already coming out ahead. There will still be added overhead and latency, the more nodes you have to go through, and the folks at the farthest reaches of the network won't have as good an experience as the folks close to your point of origin. I'm a bit skeptical. The expense of 900MHz gear, and the sheer number of units you'd need to for a wide coverage area, makes this seem like a really difficult idea to pull off. Nevertheless, I wish you luck, if you do choose to deploy something like that. David Smith MVN.net ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
At 01:02 PM 9/10/2007, George Rogato wrote: So does this mean that you now agree with me that little wireless cards can be used for wireless broadband? George :) Yes George I do. In fact I used pcmcia cards back in '03 and '04 at ShreveNet for residential pops with good results after we got the bugs out. I'm sure there was a time I felt differently about cards. Sorry if I ever gave you a hard time about it. Allen ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
Metricom was one of the ones that we were uninstalling in Tempe. i.e. out of business. I don't know if that was technical issues or management or a combo of both. Joel White NexGenAccess Inc. www.nexgenaccess.com 740-513-4122 NexGenAccess Inc. http://www.nexgenaccess.com -- Original Message --- From: Allen Marsalis [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Mon, 10 Sep 2007 13:05:20 -0500 Subject: Re: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks At 12:56 PM 9/10/2007, Steve Stroh wrote: Allen: Metricom did. Thanks, Steve Thanks for the reply Steve. Can you share if they were able to make it work or not? Any info would be greatly appreciated. Allen ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- End of Original Message --- ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
Wow thanks for the info Joel. I bought a couple of SR9's last week and I'm experimenting now. I might need a 900MHz range spectrum analyzer for this one. :) Re: In fact, I worked under you I believe!! LOL, well sort of. There was no budget, so my job was pretty weird while it lasted. Bruce S. sniped my position which I always thought was a good thing given the circumstances surrounding the death spiral toxic financing deals. Doesn't look like he was able to save the day with his muni wifi program. Did you move to Tempe? Are you back in Ohio? I should probably call Paul this week and see what's happening. I hope he isn't too depressed over the deal like I am (or was) :) Allen At 01:05 PM 9/10/2007, Joel White wrote: Alan, There is a second manufacture of 900 Mini-Pci cards which is Zcomax. The two (ubnt and Zcomax don't talk because of different center frequencies. Zcomax is what Tranzeo is using in there 900 products, so this may be a good way to go, with the ability to have pre-manufactured client radios. What I have found with any Atheros card running 5Mhz channels, is that if you scan from another, you will see the first card transmitting on a channel about 20mhz away. This transmit is about 20dB less than the primary, but still prevalently there. I think you could see some issues because of this, and I wonder what frequency that ends up being when the 900 card is a re-badge of 2.4. To explain this better, channel 6 on 2.4 is 906 on the ubiquity cards I believe. If I then scan and see a signature at 2457, what frequency is that on the 900 conversion? It is probably in the high 800 range by my estimate. There are definitely some issues there. Also, I have seen better connections with Motorola 900 than with the put togethers. I do think your idea is something worth while, and I've thought about something similar myself. I am also familiar with the Muni-market, and the downfalls, and the good ideas of it. If you remember me, you know I worked for one of them. In fact, I worked under you I believe!! Good to see you back. Joel White NexGenAccess Inc. www.nexgenaccess.com 740-513-4122 NexGenAccess Inc. http://www.nexgenaccess.com -- Original Message --- From: Gino Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Mon, 10 Sep 2007 12:49:35 -0400 Subject: RE: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks You 900 idea souns interesting, but youll need a 900 muni client and/or 900 pcmcia card for customers Gino A. Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. tel 787.273.4143 fax 787.273.4145 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Allen Marsalis Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 12:17 PM To: wireless@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks I was a WISP in the late 90s and early 00s. Some of you may know me. It's good to see many familiar faces still here. In recent years, I have pursued new interests but I keep thinking back on my experiences as a WISP. I had a lot of good times back then. I'm thinking about creeping back into the WISP business. After I sold in 2004, I followed a new trend in wireless in the press called muni wireless promoted by manufacturers such as Strix and Tropos. This concept has taken some major blows in the press this month: http://wifinetnews.com/archives/007869.htmlhttp://wifinetnews.com/arch ives/007869.html http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20521155/ http://web20.telecomtv.com/pages/?newsid=41788id=e9381817-0593-http://web20.telecomtv.com/pages/?newsid=41788id=e9381817-0593- 417a-86 39-c4c53e2a2a10view=newshttp://web20.telecomtv.com/pages/?ne...2a10vi ew=news http://www.unstrung.com/document.asp...ng_sitedefault http://www.alleyinsider.com/2007/08/as-earthlink-el.htmlhttp://www.all eyinsider.com/2007/08/...thlink-el.html http://www.computerworld.com/blogs/node/6120 This hits close to home because the company who bought my WISP (ShreveNet) boasted being the largest WISP with the largest muni WIFI network in the nation in Tempe AZ (NeoReach aka Kite aka MobilePro) which sold these properties recently to Gobility. (Big Yawn).. http://www.bbwexchange.com/wireless_isp/http://www.bbwexchange.com/wir eless_isp/ I'm certainly am not posting this thread to defend or even discuss the somewhat failed muni wireless concept. Some say it was a failure because of the model rather than technology, caused by giving away free service to the anchor tenant (the city) and so forth. Whatever... I couldn't care less about the past or Earthlink or Google, or MobilePro or huge muni wifi networks. However I am fascinated by the mesh technology in general, especially after witnessing the old Nokia collapsible bridged mesh networks of the 90s. LOL, a lot has changed since then. I often wonder how Dave Peterson and Ultramesh/locustworld turned out. Once upon a time, he sold product to
Re: [WISPA] You're all going to lose ( I hope not)
Sam Tetherow wrote: Forrest, I didn't mean to be offensive in my email, or imply that you are doing anything bad with your billing/usage model. I was just stating my opinion concerning the increased usage of bandwidth by customers and the WISP industry in general. If I came accross defensive, I apologize.. That wasn't my intent. I just wanted to clarify that, in general, we're trying to rid ourselves of exactly the same people that the cable companies are ridding themselves of - those which expect a full bore pipe for less than it costs us to purchase the bandwidth. I'm pretty sure that everyone agrees that bandwidth usage will always go up, just like processor speed and memory requirements and we as an industry need to be ready to deal with it. The telcos and the cable providers seem to be doing a better job of it right now mostly because the medium that they have supports better upload speeds that most WISP infrastructure can. We provide symmetrical service to our customers. 2Mb/s down and up... show me a typical Cable or DSL provider who can do that. In fact, most cable plants are severely limited in the upload direction just because of how the return path is configured (it all lives below channel 2). -forrest ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] IPTV
I would like to look at the bandwidth per channel your system would use. Around here there are multiple tv's per household, and very few are ever on the same channel. That is where I see the issue, even at 1 meg per feed X 3 STB's kills my 900Mhz Canopy AP. Mike Bushard, Jr Wisper Wireless Solutions, LLC 320-256-WISP (9477) 320-256-9478 Fax -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Clint Ricker Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 9:31 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] IPTV Not ready for prime time...? There's already several hundred thousand subscribers on IPTV platforms in the US alone, so I'm not sure what you're waiting for... what shortcomings are you seeing? The technology IS being deployed in prime time scenarios already (ATT, which is not known for being adventuresome with technology is the biggest, but not the only domestic example; internationally, it is being deployed much more widely). The main problem that WISPs face is that you may have to do some network overhauls to handle that sort of traffic... When you resell DirectTV (unless they have changed their model since 2005, which is the last I looked at their agreements), it is more of a referral/outsourced installation crew than reselling. It does let you offer triple play to a point, but (again, unless it's changed), you can't do single bill and you can't really generate any reoccuring revenue (which, as a service provider, is where your real profit tends to be) Although you do have increased costs in doing your own in terms of network buildout and so forth, you also effectively (if done right, profitably) subsidize the buildout of a better network It probably is not quite viable for ultra-rural WISPs because of really low densities and so forth. In areas with higher densities (definitely MDU), it is viable and deployable -Clint Ricker Kentnis Technologies On 9/10/07, Brad Belton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Agreed, but IMO just not quite ready for prime time . yet. grin Best, Brad -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 8:23 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] IPTV IPTV is also the breaking of the traditional TV mold. You can offer thousands of channels from all kinds of different sources. It doesn't even have to be in the traditional channel format. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Matt Liotta [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 8:09 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] IPTV Brad Belton wrote: We have (off and on) been looking for the same solution, however we came to a conclusion years ago. Why not just re-sell Direct TV or Dish? For a full channel line-up or in residential settings I would agree with you. However, in a MTU the ability to provide channels ala carte to multiple customers using IP provides different economics. -Matt ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall
Re: [WISPA] You're all going to lose ( I hope not)
We provide symmetrical service to our customers. 2Mb/s down and up... show me a typical Cable or DSL provider who can do that. In fact, most cable plants are severely limited in the upload direction just because of how the return path is configured (it all lives below channel 2). You can on cable, but it is much costlier in terms of equipment and bandwidth usage (but is done for some business class connections over HFC). Still, for a residential customer, does it really matter? Personally, I'd take a 1Mb/s symetrical over a 10Mb/s down, 384Kb/s up, but I'm quite atypical on my network usage. For most customers, asymetrical is perfectly fine, especially for residential... -Clint Ricker Kentnis Technologies ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] OT: rural WISP testers needed
Hi folks, We are looking for a handful of WISPs to do some product testing on an entirely new WISP multipoint product line from Alvarion. You need not be a current Alvarion WISP (and this is not intended for those with BreezeACCESS VL networks). The line is intended for the most cost sensitive markets, especially on the residential side. No big strings attached, but testers would be required to provide detailed feedback on performance as well as overall value. I am looking for testers who are in deep rural areas and I am interested in a sampling which could include U.S., Canada and the Caribbean. Please contact me OFFLIST, but only if you are serious. I can't offer more detail on the product in this mail, but the whole WISP market will know about it in short order. Again, please reach out offlist. Patrick Leary AVP, Alvarion, Inc. o: 650.314.2628 c: 760.580.0080 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit Alvarion at WiMAX World Chicago, September 25-27 Booth #409 This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(84). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses. ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
I'm glad your still around the industry Allen, every one in a while someone says, Where's Allen M? Makes us wonder. Myself, I would only look at 900 as a temporary frequency to use. Maybe a couple years, more in the very rural areas and less urban wise. Too many others are using 900 or starting to use it. Electric and water companies for meter reading, walmart and other bigbox for id and our portable phones still use 900 even when their 2.4 or 5.8. So if building something out and realizing it has a short time span works. Then 900 is workable. George Allen Marsalis wrote: At 01:02 PM 9/10/2007, George Rogato wrote: So does this mean that you now agree with me that little wireless cards can be used for wireless broadband? George :) Yes George I do. In fact I used pcmcia cards back in '03 and '04 at ShreveNet for residential pops with good results after we got the bugs out. I'm sure there was a time I felt differently about cards. Sorry if I ever gave you a hard time about it. Allen ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] You're all going to lose ( I hope not)
Forrest W Christian wrote: we're trying to rid ourselves of exactly the same people that the cable companies are ridding themselves of - those which expect a full bore pipe for less than it costs us to purchase the bandwidth. I just had a guy who wanted to sign up but wanted to define what speeds I was going to give him and what exactly he was expecting. He said, when I buy a 3 meg connection I expect 3 megs all the time. I asked him if he thought 3 megs all the time meant that when he hit the speed test button, that it was going to come back every single time at 3 megs or if he meant 3megs all-the-time constantly consuming bandwidth at 3megs a second. He chose 3megs all-the-time constantly consuming bandwidth at 3megs a second. And he wanted a public ip address and no ports blocked. So I asked him if he thought it was feasible for me to buy bandwidth at $60+ per meg on a dedicated internet connection and then sell him 3x $60 for $40.00 per month and then to boot buy him a public ip and configure my routers to his specification. How long will I stay in business doing that. We argued a bit about bit caps and consumer broadband connection verses dedicated business class connectivity. I kept my cool and was even keel, the guy was getting pissed and disagreeing the deeper I got into explaining what I was going to be providing and he was going to be buying. Finally I sent him on his way to google and told him he should search out comcast and bit caps and give me a call back when he thinks he can operate on my network with my terms of service. The guy called back, apologized and explained he misunderstood and and he expected to pay what he should be paying and would give me a call back when he was ready. I hooked him up a couple weeks ago and we're both happy. He knows the rules. He even offered to pay more for his public ip. I didn't and generally don't charge extra for ip addresses. And he knows to be reasonable about usage. Heck I could care less if he used 50 gigs every now and then, but not all-the-time Now how to explain it to the rest of the market place is going to be the hard thing. George ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
Allen, It sounds as if you might be proposing this for a suburban or even tree filled urban environment. One problem you might run into is clear spectrum in 900MHz. I've use Trango gear out in rural areas, where it works OK. I've only done a few scans in the city (East Lansing and Lansing, specifically). Both of those scans were so depressing I never tried making any links with 900 in town. All the channels were what the Trango manual calls unsuitable. I have a few of the SR9 cards and am just starting to work with them. I read somewhere that Trango (for example) rejects interference better than the SR9. No personal experience one way or another yet. My new rule of thumb with Trango is that I can go 2 miles. This is with AP's at 80 - 130' AGL, pretty flat ground, but quite a few trees. However, I have been struggling to make a link that is only one mile, unfortunately the path follows a heavily wooded riverbed. So you just never know. I think I've solved this connection by relaying off the house next door (tenth of a mile closer, but with an open field for 1/4 mile toward the AP). But I did notice that there is heavy noise at the relay house in what Trango calls channel 2. Noise level about -67. No idea what is doing that. You might consider a modified mesh structure that uses 2.4 or 5GHz (or even 900 after testing) to those few LOS houses, then something like Meraki mesh to connect close neighbors. Otherwise, I think your idea is great, if you could get clear spectrum. :-) On September 10, at 12:16 PM September 10, Allen Marsalis wrote: Please imagine a muni wireless mesh network that utilizes 900MHz cards instead of 5.8 and 2.4 cards. Instead of nodes being 1000 feet apart atop light poles, they are now spread 1 or 2 miles apart. Instead of it taking 15 or 20 nodes to cover one square mile, perhaps one node could cover 1 to 4 square miles. Could this be a solution for wooded areas with low to moderate population densities? In other words, do you know anyone who has ever built a mesh network using SR9s and SBCs with multiple radios to achieve redundancy and ubiquitous coverage for small towns in the Southeast? And using no towers by the way, LOL? As I see it, the SR9 has 4 non-overlapping channels at 5MHz each. Thats all I need. (I think) ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] OT: rural WISP testers needed
So a bunch of you are asking for a bit more detail in order to know if you might be interested. So I can add the following in the way of analogy. If BreezeACCESS VL is a Lexus, the new line would like a Corolla -- still from Alvarion so the expected quality will be there, just not all the bells and whistles that VL brings. It does have a few unique features like one CPE for all 5 GHz bands (yes, Brad Belton, you heard it right :) ; you select whether to make the CPE 5.3, 5.4 or 5.8 GHz. So that's a big plus on the operations side. And though still riding the same roads, it would not share the same infrastructure. Patrick Leary AVP, Market Development Alvarion, Inc. o: 650.314.2628 c: 760.580.0080 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit Alvarion at WiMAX World Chicago, September 25-27 Booth #409 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Patrick Leary Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 12:53 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] OT: rural WISP testers needed Hi folks, We are looking for a handful of WISPs to do some product testing on an entirely new WISP multipoint product line from Alvarion. You need not be a current Alvarion WISP (and this is not intended for those with BreezeACCESS VL networks). The line is intended for the most cost sensitive markets, especially on the residential side. No big strings attached, but testers would be required to provide detailed feedback on performance as well as overall value. I am looking for testers who are in deep rural areas and I am interested in a sampling which could include U.S., Canada and the Caribbean. Please contact me OFFLIST, but only if you are serious. I can't offer more detail on the product in this mail, but the whole WISP market will know about it in short order. Again, please reach out offlist. Patrick Leary AVP, Alvarion, Inc. o: 650.314.2628 c: 760.580.0080 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit Alvarion at WiMAX World Chicago, September 25-27 Booth #409 This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(84). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses. ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(190). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(43). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(84). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses. ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA
Re: [WISPA] You're all going to lose ( I hope not)
Not to be overly provocative here, but why are you paying $60/meg? You're a trade organization...make deals with each other, share your upstream peers, buy in bulk, and get your $60/meg to $30/meg, $20/meg, or even lower... -Clint Ricker Kentnis Technologies On 9/10/07, George Rogato [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Forrest W Christian wrote: we're trying to rid ourselves of exactly the same people that the cable companies are ridding themselves of - those which expect a full bore pipe for less than it costs us to purchase the bandwidth. I just had a guy who wanted to sign up but wanted to define what speeds I was going to give him and what exactly he was expecting. He said, when I buy a 3 meg connection I expect 3 megs all the time. I asked him if he thought 3 megs all the time meant that when he hit the speed test button, that it was going to come back every single time at 3 megs or if he meant 3megs all-the-time constantly consuming bandwidth at 3megs a second. He chose 3megs all-the-time constantly consuming bandwidth at 3megs a second. And he wanted a public ip address and no ports blocked. So I asked him if he thought it was feasible for me to buy bandwidth at $60+ per meg on a dedicated internet connection and then sell him 3x $60 for $40.00 per month and then to boot buy him a public ip and configure my routers to his specification. How long will I stay in business doing that. We argued a bit about bit caps and consumer broadband connection verses dedicated business class connectivity. I kept my cool and was even keel, the guy was getting pissed and disagreeing the deeper I got into explaining what I was going to be providing and he was going to be buying. Finally I sent him on his way to google and told him he should search out comcast and bit caps and give me a call back when he thinks he can operate on my network with my terms of service. The guy called back, apologized and explained he misunderstood and and he expected to pay what he should be paying and would give me a call back when he was ready. I hooked him up a couple weeks ago and we're both happy. He knows the rules. He even offered to pay more for his public ip. I didn't and generally don't charge extra for ip addresses. And he knows to be reasonable about usage. Heck I could care less if he used 50 gigs every now and then, but not all-the-time Now how to explain it to the rest of the market place is going to be the hard thing. George ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] You're all going to lose ( I hope not)
I'm paying $150, but I only have 1. ;-) Getting together on purchases of things never really seems to get anywhere. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Clint Ricker [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 4:18 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] You're all going to lose ( I hope not) Not to be overly provocative here, but why are you paying $60/meg? You're a trade organization...make deals with each other, share your upstream peers, buy in bulk, and get your $60/meg to $30/meg, $20/meg, or even lower... -Clint Ricker Kentnis Technologies On 9/10/07, George Rogato [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Forrest W Christian wrote: we're trying to rid ourselves of exactly the same people that the cable companies are ridding themselves of - those which expect a full bore pipe for less than it costs us to purchase the bandwidth. I just had a guy who wanted to sign up but wanted to define what speeds I was going to give him and what exactly he was expecting. He said, when I buy a 3 meg connection I expect 3 megs all the time. I asked him if he thought 3 megs all the time meant that when he hit the speed test button, that it was going to come back every single time at 3 megs or if he meant 3megs all-the-time constantly consuming bandwidth at 3megs a second. He chose 3megs all-the-time constantly consuming bandwidth at 3megs a second. And he wanted a public ip address and no ports blocked. So I asked him if he thought it was feasible for me to buy bandwidth at $60+ per meg on a dedicated internet connection and then sell him 3x $60 for $40.00 per month and then to boot buy him a public ip and configure my routers to his specification. How long will I stay in business doing that. We argued a bit about bit caps and consumer broadband connection verses dedicated business class connectivity. I kept my cool and was even keel, the guy was getting pissed and disagreeing the deeper I got into explaining what I was going to be providing and he was going to be buying. Finally I sent him on his way to google and told him he should search out comcast and bit caps and give me a call back when he thinks he can operate on my network with my terms of service. The guy called back, apologized and explained he misunderstood and and he expected to pay what he should be paying and would give me a call back when he was ready. I hooked him up a couple weeks ago and we're both happy. He knows the rules. He even offered to pay more for his public ip. I didn't and generally don't charge extra for ip addresses. And he knows to be reasonable about usage. Heck I could care less if he used 50 gigs every now and then, but not all-the-time Now how to explain it to the rest of the market place is going to be the hard thing. George ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php **
Re: [WISPA] You're all going to lose ( I hope not)
Mike Hammett wrote: I'm paying $150, but I only have 1. ;-) Getting together on purchases of things never really seems to get anywhere. The reason one side has to be the vendor and the other side the customer. Nobody seems to want to be the customer of their peer. -Matt ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] You're all going to lose ( I hope not)
I can't speak for anyone else, but I'm paying $85/meg but over half that cost is in transport which I can't do anything about. And before you tell me to bring it in wirelessly I suggest you do a google map on Valentine Nebraska ;) The last time I checked I was significantly cheaper than anywhere within 250 miles. Sam Tetherow Sandhills Wireless Clint Ricker wrote: Not to be overly provocative here, but why are you paying $60/meg? You're a trade organization...make deals with each other, share your upstream peers, buy in bulk, and get your $60/meg to $30/meg, $20/meg, or even lower... -Clint Ricker Kentnis Technologies On 9/10/07, George Rogato [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Forrest W Christian wrote: we're trying to rid ourselves of exactly the same people that the cable companies are ridding themselves of - those which expect a full bore pipe for less than it costs us to purchase the bandwidth. I just had a guy who wanted to sign up but wanted to define what speeds I was going to give him and what exactly he was expecting. He said, when I buy a 3 meg connection I expect 3 megs all the time. I asked him if he thought 3 megs all the time meant that when he hit the speed test button, that it was going to come back every single time at 3 megs or if he meant 3megs all-the-time constantly consuming bandwidth at 3megs a second. He chose 3megs all-the-time constantly consuming bandwidth at 3megs a second. And he wanted a public ip address and no ports blocked. So I asked him if he thought it was feasible for me to buy bandwidth at $60+ per meg on a dedicated internet connection and then sell him 3x $60 for $40.00 per month and then to boot buy him a public ip and configure my routers to his specification. How long will I stay in business doing that. We argued a bit about bit caps and consumer broadband connection verses dedicated business class connectivity. I kept my cool and was even keel, the guy was getting pissed and disagreeing the deeper I got into explaining what I was going to be providing and he was going to be buying. Finally I sent him on his way to google and told him he should search out comcast and bit caps and give me a call back when he thinks he can operate on my network with my terms of service. The guy called back, apologized and explained he misunderstood and and he expected to pay what he should be paying and would give me a call back when he was ready. I hooked him up a couple weeks ago and we're both happy. He knows the rules. He even offered to pay more for his public ip. I didn't and generally don't charge extra for ip addresses. And he knows to be reasonable about usage. Heck I could care less if he used 50 gigs every now and then, but not all-the-time Now how to explain it to the rest of the market place is going to be the hard thing. George ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ a href=http://mail.shwisp.net/spam/dspam.cgi?template=historyuser=tetherowretrain=spamsignatureID=16,46e5b6c0229681286817381;!DSPAM:16,46e5b6c0229681286817381!/a ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** **
[WISPA] Laptop
I need a new one. Anyone got a laptop that works outside well? I can't see the screen on my dell very well. Brian ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] You're all going to lose ( I hope not)
Yeah...I know... been there, done that. The cable companies and the bells compete with each other over millions of dollars of business, and yet can somehow release similtaneous FCC filings, press releases, position papers, and so forth. Most independents don't compete with each other, and yet can't work out deals to reduce their overhead (some out there do this and do this quite well) Matt's post about no one wanting to be the customer is right on as to the reason...but it's a shame. There are some that do this and save thousands or more a monthPride can be expensive... just a thought. On 9/10/07, Mike Hammett [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm paying $150, but I only have 1. ;-) Getting together on purchases of things never really seems to get anywhere. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Clint Ricker [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 4:18 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] You're all going to lose ( I hope not) Not to be overly provocative here, but why are you paying $60/meg? You're a trade organization...make deals with each other, share your upstream peers, buy in bulk, and get your $60/meg to $30/meg, $20/meg, or even lower... -Clint Ricker Kentnis Technologies On 9/10/07, George Rogato [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Forrest W Christian wrote: we're trying to rid ourselves of exactly the same people that the cable companies are ridding themselves of - those which expect a full bore pipe for less than it costs us to purchase the bandwidth. I just had a guy who wanted to sign up but wanted to define what speeds I was going to give him and what exactly he was expecting. He said, when I buy a 3 meg connection I expect 3 megs all the time. I asked him if he thought 3 megs all the time meant that when he hit the speed test button, that it was going to come back every single time at 3 megs or if he meant 3megs all-the-time constantly consuming bandwidth at 3megs a second. He chose 3megs all-the-time constantly consuming bandwidth at 3megs a second. And he wanted a public ip address and no ports blocked. So I asked him if he thought it was feasible for me to buy bandwidth at $60+ per meg on a dedicated internet connection and then sell him 3x $60 for $40.00 per month and then to boot buy him a public ip and configure my routers to his specification. How long will I stay in business doing that. We argued a bit about bit caps and consumer broadband connection verses dedicated business class connectivity. I kept my cool and was even keel, the guy was getting pissed and disagreeing the deeper I got into explaining what I was going to be providing and he was going to be buying. Finally I sent him on his way to google and told him he should search out comcast and bit caps and give me a call back when he thinks he can operate on my network with my terms of service. The guy called back, apologized and explained he misunderstood and and he expected to pay what he should be paying and would give me a call back when he was ready. I hooked him up a couple weeks ago and we're both happy. He knows the rules. He even offered to pay more for his public ip. I didn't and generally don't charge extra for ip addresses. And he knows to be reasonable about usage. Heck I could care less if he used 50 gigs every now and then, but not all-the-time Now how to explain it to the rest of the market place is going to be the hard thing. George ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php **
Re: [WISPA] You're all going to lose ( I hope not)
That doesn't work really well because of the various WISPs around the entire country. Our biggest expense isn't the actual bandwidth (that's usually around $20/meg)... it's the cost of the transport from the closest NOC. For us, that transport is at least 200 miles. Travis Microserv Clint Ricker wrote: Not to be overly provocative here, but why are you paying $60/meg? You're a trade organization...make deals with each other, share your upstream peers, buy in bulk, and get your $60/meg to $30/meg, $20/meg, or even lower... -Clint Ricker Kentnis Technologies On 9/10/07, George Rogato [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Forrest W Christian wrote: we're trying to rid ourselves of exactly the same people that the cable companies are ridding themselves of - those which expect a full bore pipe for less than it costs us to purchase the bandwidth. I just had a guy who wanted to sign up but wanted to define what speeds I was going to give him and what exactly he was expecting. He said, when I buy a 3 meg connection I expect 3 megs all the time. I asked him if he thought 3 megs all the time meant that when he hit the speed test button, that it was going to come back every single time at 3 megs or if he meant 3megs all-the-time constantly consuming bandwidth at 3megs a second. He chose 3megs all-the-time constantly consuming bandwidth at 3megs a second. And he wanted a public ip address and no ports blocked. So I asked him if he thought it was feasible for me to buy bandwidth at $60+ per meg on a dedicated internet connection and then sell him 3x $60 for $40.00 per month and then to boot buy him a public ip and configure my routers to his specification. How long will I stay in business doing that. We argued a bit about bit caps and consumer broadband connection verses dedicated business class connectivity. I kept my cool and was even keel, the guy was getting pissed and disagreeing the deeper I got into explaining what I was going to be providing and he was going to be buying. Finally I sent him on his way to google and told him he should search out comcast and bit caps and give me a call back when he thinks he can operate on my network with my terms of service. The guy called back, apologized and explained he misunderstood and and he expected to pay what he should be paying and would give me a call back when he was ready. I hooked him up a couple weeks ago and we're both happy. He knows the rules. He even offered to pay more for his public ip. I didn't and generally don't charge extra for ip addresses. And he knows to be reasonable about usage. Heck I could care less if he used 50 gigs every now and then, but not all-the-time Now how to explain it to the rest of the market place is going to be the hard thing. George ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today!
RE: [WISPA] IPTV
Good point regarding added value to the IP service we are offering. VoIP has added a certain stickiness for us already. If we had IPTV to bundle in as well it could only help. Best, Brad -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Matt Liotta Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 8:43 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] IPTV Brad Belton wrote: Correct, we see the same requests. However, why try re-inventing the wheel when DirecTV already has a solution in place? Every time this issue has popped up the client was more than happy to pay the DirecTV price even if they only wanted CNN or FOX. Are you reselling DirecTV now? It just didn't seem to make sense (yet) to put additional load on the IP leg into a building when the service is already available from the roof where we already have rights. Yes, but then you are running coax to various tenants and various drops. If it is a business park then you are putting a dish on each building. In our case, we would like to charge them for the channels, but bundle the bandwidth usage into their service just like we do VoIP. As they use more and more bandwidth it gives the customer incentive to upgrade their commit. -Matt ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] IPTV
Please expand a bit more on your offering. Inquiring minds want to know. Best, Brad -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Clint Ricker Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 9:31 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] IPTV Not ready for prime time...? There's already several hundred thousand subscribers on IPTV platforms in the US alone, so I'm not sure what you're waiting for... what shortcomings are you seeing? The technology IS being deployed in prime time scenarios already (ATT, which is not known for being adventuresome with technology is the biggest, but not the only domestic example; internationally, it is being deployed much more widely). The main problem that WISPs face is that you may have to do some network overhauls to handle that sort of traffic... When you resell DirectTV (unless they have changed their model since 2005, which is the last I looked at their agreements), it is more of a referral/outsourced installation crew than reselling. It does let you offer triple play to a point, but (again, unless it's changed), you can't do single bill and you can't really generate any reoccuring revenue (which, as a service provider, is where your real profit tends to be) Although you do have increased costs in doing your own in terms of network buildout and so forth, you also effectively (if done right, profitably) subsidize the buildout of a better network It probably is not quite viable for ultra-rural WISPs because of really low densities and so forth. In areas with higher densities (definitely MDU), it is viable and deployable -Clint Ricker Kentnis Technologies On 9/10/07, Brad Belton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Agreed, but IMO just not quite ready for prime time . yet. grin Best, Brad -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 8:23 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] IPTV IPTV is also the breaking of the traditional TV mold. You can offer thousands of channels from all kinds of different sources. It doesn't even have to be in the traditional channel format. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Matt Liotta [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 8:09 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] IPTV Brad Belton wrote: We have (off and on) been looking for the same solution, however we came to a conclusion years ago. Why not just re-sell Direct TV or Dish? For a full channel line-up or in residential settings I would agree with you. However, in a MTU the ability to provide channels ala carte to multiple customers using IP provides different economics. -Matt ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php **
Re: [WISPA] Looking for cheap RAS
I assume you mean a 3Com Total Control, Cisco 5300, or Ascend. My personal favorite is the 3Com as I have worked with these units for over 10 years and they are reliable. check ebay.. most of the time the shipping cost more than the unit. On 9/9/07, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Anyone have a good source or do it yourselfa Tnx Bob Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] You're all going to lose ( I hope not)
Clint Ricker wrote: Not to be overly provocative here, but why are you paying $60/meg? You're a trade organization...make deals with each other, share your upstream peers, buy in bulk, and get your $60/meg to $30/meg, $20/meg, or even lower... -Clint Ricker Kentnis Technologies Hmmm, How much should I be paying? ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
Allen: Metricom's long out of business, but technologically, they made it work (albeit at ~28 Kbps, and later ~128 Kbps). One of the key things they did to make it work at 902-928 MHz is to use FHSS and small channel sizes rather than fixed, wide channels as all the current 902-928 MHz BWIA gear (except Alvarion's BreezeNet [?]. The earlier version did both mesh and access using 902-928 MHz. The newer version used 2.3 and 2.4 GHz for the mesh (backhaul) and 902-928 MHz for access only. Thanks, Steve On 9/10/07, Allen Marsalis [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thanks for the reply Steve. Can you share if they were able to make it work or not? Any info would be greatly appreciated. Allen -- Steve Stroh 425-939-0076 | [EMAIL PROTECTED] | www.stevestroh.com ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Looking for cheap RAS
I've got some Patton Electronic 24 port 56k ras's. They all worked great when I moved to outsourced modems. Make me an offer. George Zack Kneisley wrote: I assume you mean a 3Com Total Control, Cisco 5300, or Ascend. My personal favorite is the 3Com as I have worked with these units for over 10 years and they are reliable. check ebay.. most of the time the shipping cost more than the unit. On 9/9/07, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Anyone have a good source or do it yourselfa Tnx Bob Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
Thank you David for your thoughts on this. I too am a bit skeptical. :) Which is why I decided to ask for comments from you guys. There is the additional issue of mesh routing protocols but I think (and I mean think) I may have that covered if the physical stuff worked out ok. It's just the whole concept might fall flat for a dozen reasons. I'm trying to figure out how many nodes I would need to deploy in a real world test, but I also want to think this out before getting that far and spend a bunch of money. The idea may be so bad that testing is unwarranted. But hey, there must be at least 8 people left in the country without broadband, and I want to give it to them! ;) Allen At 01:05 PM 9/10/2007, David E. Smith wrote: Allen Marsalis wrote: I take it that nobody has ever built a 900MHz NLOS mesh network before. Which is not a good sign to me. That's a sign that my idea probably won't work. I'd be very skeptical just because of what I lovingly call the Tropos Effect. Obviously, all these nodes eventually have to come back to... somewhere that has a big bad Internet connection. Your office, a central tower, whatever. If you're near that tower, you don't have much of a problem, as your laptop is talking to a node that's talking directly to that point of origin. If you're a few blocks away, where your laptop talks to a node that's two or three hops away, there's cumulative bandwidth loss and added latency, and just more things that can go wrong generally. Your proposal gets rid of the worst part of how Tropos does things. They use the same radio both for inter-node communication and for customers, same SSID, same everything; by using separate radios for backhaul and customer access, you're already coming out ahead. There will still be added overhead and latency, the more nodes you have to go through, and the folks at the farthest reaches of the network won't have as good an experience as the folks close to your point of origin. I'm a bit skeptical. The expense of 900MHz gear, and the sheer number of units you'd need to for a wide coverage area, makes this seem like a really difficult idea to pull off. Nevertheless, I wish you luck, if you do choose to deploy something like that. David Smith MVN.net ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: rural WISP testers needed
Patrick, What do you have for more information. I would be interested in it. I just need to run it past Phil and Dave. Thanks, Ryan Patrick Leary wrote: Hi folks, We are looking for a handful of WISPs to do some product testing on an entirely new WISP multipoint product line from Alvarion. You need not be a current Alvarion WISP (and this is not intended for those with BreezeACCESS VL networks). The line is intended for the most cost sensitive markets, especially on the residential side. No big strings attached, but testers would be required to provide detailed feedback on performance as well as overall value. I am looking for testers who are in deep rural areas and I am interested in a sampling which could include U.S., Canada and the Caribbean. Please contact me OFFLIST, but only if you are serious. I can't offer more detail on the product in this mail, but the whole WISP market will know about it in short order. Again, please reach out offlist. Patrick Leary AVP, Alvarion, Inc. o: 650.314.2628 c: 760.580.0080 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit Alvarion at WiMAX World Chicago, September 25-27 Booth #409 This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(84). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses. ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
Thanks George. Sounds like wise advice to me considering all the things happening within the industry in recent years. Google is petitioning the FCC for nationwide prime spectrum? I'm short a few billion it seems.. Even if my idea is technically doable, then I must go find the right markets which is a challenge all in itself. I sometimes see data centers and there aren't many dialup customers left and lots of empty modems. How Netzero can still afford to run ads I do not know. Allen At 03:23 PM 9/10/2007, George Rogato wrote: I'm glad your still around the industry Allen, every one in a while someone says, Where's Allen M? Makes us wonder. Myself, I would only look at 900 as a temporary frequency to use. Maybe a couple years, more in the very rural areas and less urban wise. Too many others are using 900 or starting to use it. Electric and water companies for meter reading, walmart and other bigbox for id and our portable phones still use 900 even when their 2.4 or 5.8. So if building something out and realizing it has a short time span works. Then 900 is workable. George ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
At 04:00 PM 9/10/2007, John Valenti wrote: Allen, It sounds as if you might be proposing this for a suburban or even tree filled urban environment. One problem you might run into is clear spectrum in 900MHz. I've use Trango gear out in rural areas, where it works OK. I've only done a few scans in the city (East Lansing and Lansing, specifically). Both of those scans were so depressing I never tried making any links with 900 in town. All the channels were what the Trango manual calls unsuitable. Point noted. My testing thus far has been at my house which is in an remote community a couple miles outside of town. Results may and probably will vary and I get closer to town, but I'm not wanting to compete with cable or DSL. I was hoping to find some still under served small towns that would appreciate my services.. I have a few of the SR9 cards and am just starting to work with them. I read somewhere that Trango (for example) rejects interference better than the SR9. No personal experience one way or another yet. I saw were Ubiquiti has cavity filters but I have no idea what they cost or how well they work. I had one Trango 900 POP years ago and it worked well. But 6 sectors ain't happening. (I had only a few customers off one sector) But I'm really thinking in terms of multiple radio systems (SBC's) for a number of reasons. My new rule of thumb with Trango is that I can go 2 miles. I recall a little bit better for me. But the spectrum may have been really clear. I didn't have a 900MHz option for my cheap spectrum analyzer. I sold my company not long after hanging that gear. You might consider a modified mesh structure that uses 2.4 or 5GHz (or even 900 after testing) to those few LOS houses, then something like Meraki mesh to connect close neighbors. Nodding, I have thought in terms of large outter mesh with an inner micro mesh structure that isn't intended to go very deep (lots of hops) But out in the boonies, I'm not sure 2.4/5.8 is going to get me very far when houses might be a quarter or half mile apart. (or more) If I did have a tower in the area, perhaps breaks in the mesh could be patched with a new homerun shot if you follow me. Thanks for the feedback Allen ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
At 05:12 PM 9/10/2007, you wrote: Allen: Metricom's long out of business, but technologically, they made it work (albeit at ~28 Kbps, and later ~128 Kbps). One of the key things they did to make it work at 902-928 MHz is to use FHSS and small channel sizes rather than fixed, wide channels as all the current 902-928 MHz BWIA gear (except Alvarion's BreezeNet [?]. I clearly see your point as an old FHSS guy. hehehe LOL, between you and me, I would never have waxed so philosophically over this idea had it not been for the muni-wifi movement with its limited non-overlapping channels. Multiple radio systems got me interested in meshing a while back. I guess I'm not the only one, but my market is definitely not city wifi like Strix. The earlier version did both mesh and access using 902-928 MHz. The newer version used 2.3 and 2.4 GHz for the mesh (backhaul) and 902-928 MHz for access only. Gotcha, many thanks for responding to me Steve. I think there is something to be learned under every new stone, and even some old stones long forgotten my most... I barely remember Metricom and packet radio. Hmmm I just saw a HughesNet commercial. The one with the pretty lady in a green dress. I assume GEO satellite service still stinks to high heaven?? I nearly forgot about those guys... I once knew Avi Freedman when he was into some satellite stuff and learned enough not to be too scared of the sat guys who have their own unique set of expensive problems. Allen ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] IPTV
Brad, Here's what I'm looking at, and what would generally be involved... I do a lot of work with cable / video, and, having previously worked in the independent ISP industry, I'm familiar with both worlds. One of the major problems that I see that independents face is that they are trying to build networks getting about 1/2 to 1/3 of the revenue of the competition--when your competition gets $120 per customer instead of your $40 (or whatever), it's hard to build a competitive network and continually stay ahead of the technology curve. Many don't and others just take smaller profit margins or try to leverage other services (like computer support, etc...). Still, it's a harder position to be in. I've started some discussions about getting content. It's really a matter of #s--very few of you have enough subscribers to get very far; but, if I get enough people interested (I'm talking to some rural telco's that want to get into this so that's coming along), then I should be able to push that through, according to the conversations that I've been having. Initially, support for WISPs would be fairly limited to either MDU-setups and limited business programming (like what Matt's looking for). This is because wireless is a VERY challenging medium to deal with since it is basically broadcast and doesn't offer much capacity to boot (so, the worse of cable HFC and DSL in one package). It is also because content providers are particular about protecting their content, and that...is a challenge since wireless does not necessarily have the best reputation (kinda funny for an industry built around RF and satellite). Still, bandwidth for wireless gear is getting better, compression is getting better, and, given the right wireless gear and network design, it is definitely possible to deliver a good IPTV service to customers. Clint Ricker -Kentnis Technologies On 9/10/07, Brad Belton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Please expand a bit more on your offering. Inquiring minds want to know. Best, Brad -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Clint Ricker Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 9:31 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] IPTV Not ready for prime time...? There's already several hundred thousand subscribers on IPTV platforms in the US alone, so I'm not sure what you're waiting for... what shortcomings are you seeing? The technology IS being deployed in prime time scenarios already (ATT, which is not known for being adventuresome with technology is the biggest, but not the only domestic example; internationally, it is being deployed much more widely). The main problem that WISPs face is that you may have to do some network overhauls to handle that sort of traffic... When you resell DirectTV (unless they have changed their model since 2005, which is the last I looked at their agreements), it is more of a referral/outsourced installation crew than reselling. It does let you offer triple play to a point, but (again, unless it's changed), you can't do single bill and you can't really generate any reoccuring revenue (which, as a service provider, is where your real profit tends to be) Although you do have increased costs in doing your own in terms of network buildout and so forth, you also effectively (if done right, profitably) subsidize the buildout of a better network It probably is not quite viable for ultra-rural WISPs because of really low densities and so forth. In areas with higher densities (definitely MDU), it is viable and deployable -Clint Ricker Kentnis Technologies On 9/10/07, Brad Belton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Agreed, but IMO just not quite ready for prime time . yet. grin Best, Brad -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 8:23 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] IPTV IPTV is also the breaking of the traditional TV mold. You can offer thousands of channels from all kinds of different sources. It doesn't even have to be in the traditional channel format. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Matt Liotta [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 8:09 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] IPTV Brad Belton wrote: We have (off and on) been looking for the same solution, however we came to a conclusion years ago. Why not just re-sell Direct TV or Dish? For a full channel line-up or in residential settings I would agree with you. However, in a MTU the ability to provide channels ala carte to multiple customers using IP provides different economics. -Matt ** Join us at the WISPA
Re: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
Allen: While progress in satellite communications can be measured in 5 year increments - to design, fund, and launch them... technological progress DOES come, and has. Spot beams are now a standard feature on all new satellites, and it's beginning to make a big difference. Watch to see what happens with WildBlue over the next year as they bring their built-for-purpose satellite online, as opposed to using one big, continent-spanning transponder technology. Thanks, Steve On 9/10/07, Allen Marsalis [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I clearly see your point as an old FHSS guy. hehehe LOL, between you and me, I would never have waxed so philosophically over this idea had it not been for the muni-wifi movement with its limited non-overlapping channels. Multiple radio systems got me interested in meshing a while back. I guess I'm not the only one, but my market is definitely not city wifi like Strix. Gotcha, many thanks for responding to me Steve. I think there is something to be learned under every new stone, and even some old stones long forgotten my most... I barely remember Metricom and packet radio. Hmmm I just saw a HughesNet commercial. The one with the pretty lady in a green dress. I assume GEO satellite service still stinks to high heaven?? I nearly forgot about those guys... I once knew Avi Freedman when he was into some satellite stuff and learned enough not to be too scared of the sat guys who have their own unique set of expensive problems. Allen -- Steve Stroh 425-939-0076 | [EMAIL PROTECTED] | www.stevestroh.com ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
Allen, great to see you pop up on the list again. You've been missed. Patrick Leary AVP, Market Development Alvarion, Inc. o: 650.314.2628 c: 760.580.0080 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit Alvarion at WiMAX World Chicago, September 25-27 Booth #409 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Allen Marsalis Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 3:28 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks Thank you David for your thoughts on this. I too am a bit skeptical. :) Which is why I decided to ask for comments from you guys. There is the additional issue of mesh routing protocols but I think (and I mean think) I may have that covered if the physical stuff worked out ok. It's just the whole concept might fall flat for a dozen reasons. I'm trying to figure out how many nodes I would need to deploy in a real world test, but I also want to think this out before getting that far and spend a bunch of money. The idea may be so bad that testing is unwarranted. But hey, there must be at least 8 people left in the country without broadband, and I want to give it to them! ;) Allen At 01:05 PM 9/10/2007, David E. Smith wrote: Allen Marsalis wrote: I take it that nobody has ever built a 900MHz NLOS mesh network before. Which is not a good sign to me. That's a sign that my idea probably won't work. I'd be very skeptical just because of what I lovingly call the Tropos Effect. Obviously, all these nodes eventually have to come back to... somewhere that has a big bad Internet connection. Your office, a central tower, whatever. If you're near that tower, you don't have much of a problem, as your laptop is talking to a node that's talking directly to that point of origin. If you're a few blocks away, where your laptop talks to a node that's two or three hops away, there's cumulative bandwidth loss and added latency, and just more things that can go wrong generally. Your proposal gets rid of the worst part of how Tropos does things. They use the same radio both for inter-node communication and for customers, same SSID, same everything; by using separate radios for backhaul and customer access, you're already coming out ahead. There will still be added overhead and latency, the more nodes you have to go through, and the folks at the farthest reaches of the network won't have as good an experience as the folks close to your point of origin. I'm a bit skeptical. The expense of 900MHz gear, and the sheer number of units you'd need to for a wide coverage area, makes this seem like a really difficult idea to pull off. Nevertheless, I wish you luck, if you do choose to deploy something like that. David Smith MVN.net ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(190). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(43). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(84). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses. ** Join us at the
RE: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
At 06:37 PM 9/10/2007, Patrick Leary wrote: Allen, great to see you pop up on the list again. You've been missed. Thanks Patrick. I trust all is going well with you. I hear you are now vice president. Great job! (I mean that both ways. You do a great job and have a great job) :) Our kids are all growing up! Your daughter must be what about 7 now. Am I close? Mine is 9 and still wears her oversized Mikrotik and Trango T-shirts! :ducking: LOL, She's still waiting for her Breezecom t-shirt.. ;) Allen ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] FW: Launch of LoKT Telecom/Internet Blog- www.ispcleclaw.com
I have added a link to Kris Twomey's new Blog to the WISPA homepage. Judging from today’s post, we need to keep our eye open for an upcoming NPRM on possible use of 2155-2175 mHz. See excerpt below: “The FCC refused to grant M2Z's request for a (basically free) national license in the 2155-2175 MHz spectrum range. Instead, the FCC will open a formal rulemaking seeking comments on proposed uses of the spectrum. The spectrum could be sold at auction, or possibly opened to unlicensed use.” Subject: Launch of LoKT Telecom/Internet Blog- www.ispcleclaw.com First I'd like to thank everybody who's been emailing asking what happened to the LoKT newsletter. I was surprised how many people enjoyed it. After much thought and some procrastination, I decided to officially retire the newsletter. In it's place, I have just launched a blog at www.ispcleclaw.com. My hope is that the blog format will allow for more timely delivery of information than the monthly newsletter did. I'm just starting, so if anybody has any thoughts about what would make the blog more helpful, please let me know before I get stuck in my ways. Kris -- __ Kristopher E. Twomey Telecom/Internet Law Regulatory Consulting www.lokt.net No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.485 / Virus Database: 269.13.13/998 - Release Date: 9/10/2007 8:48 AM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.485 / Virus Database: 269.13.13/998 - Release Date: 9/10/2007 8:48 AM ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
Isn't WildBlue actually leasing a HughesNet/DirecWay satellite? Thus sprach a HughesNet installer, anyway. On 9/10/07, Steve Stroh [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Allen: While progress in satellite communications can be measured in 5 year increments - to design, fund, and launch them... technological progress DOES come, and has. Spot beams are now a standard feature on all new satellites, and it's beginning to make a big difference. Watch to see what happens with WildBlue over the next year as they bring their built-for-purpose satellite online, as opposed to using one big, continent-spanning transponder technology. Best, -- Dylan Oliver Primaverity, LLC ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
Not so. Just look up the opening bid for your CMA.. On 9/10/07, Allen Marsalis [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thanks George. Sounds like wise advice to me considering all the things happening within the industry in recent years. Google is petitioning the FCC for nationwide prime spectrum? I'm short a few billion it seems.. Even if my idea is technically doable, then I must go find the right markets which is a challenge all in itself. I sometimes see data centers and there aren't many dialup customers left and lots of empty modems. How Netzero can still afford to run ads I do not know. Allen At 03:23 PM 9/10/2007, George Rogato wrote: I'm glad your still around the industry Allen, every one in a while someone says, Where's Allen M? Makes us wonder. Myself, I would only look at 900 as a temporary frequency to use. Maybe a couple years, more in the very rural areas and less urban wise. Too many others are using 900 or starting to use it. Electric and water companies for meter reading, walmart and other bigbox for id and our portable phones still use 900 even when their 2.4 or 5.8. So if building something out and realizing it has a short time span works. Then 900 is workable. George ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Dylan Oliver Primaverity, LLC ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
LOL. My girls are 6.5 and 4 now. They don't care much what the shirt says so long as it has something sparkly on it. :) And I have plenty of old BreezeCOM shirts still. Patrick -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Allen Marsalis Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 5:26 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: RE: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks At 06:37 PM 9/10/2007, Patrick Leary wrote: Allen, great to see you pop up on the list again. You've been missed. Thanks Patrick. I trust all is going well with you. I hear you are now vice president. Great job! (I mean that both ways. You do a great job and have a great job) :) Our kids are all growing up! Your daughter must be what about 7 now. Am I close? Mine is 9 and still wears her oversized Mikrotik and Trango T-shirts! :ducking: LOL, She's still waiting for her Breezecom t-shirt.. ;) Allen ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(190). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(42). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(84). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses. ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
I'll bet they prefer the Motorola Canopy T-shirts! ;-) ... ducking! Gino A. Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. tel 787.273.4143 fax 787.273.4145 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Patrick Leary Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 9:33 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: RE: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks LOL. My girls are 6.5 and 4 now. They don't care much what the shirt says so long as it has something sparkly on it. :) And I have plenty of old BreezeCOM shirts still. Patrick -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Allen Marsalis Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 5:26 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: RE: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks At 06:37 PM 9/10/2007, Patrick Leary wrote: Allen, great to see you pop up on the list again. You've been missed. Thanks Patrick. I trust all is going well with you. I hear you are now vice president. Great job! (I mean that both ways. You do a great job and have a great job) :) Our kids are all growing up! Your daughter must be what about 7 now. Am I close? Mine is 9 and still wears her oversized Mikrotik and Trango T-shirts! :ducking: LOL, She's still waiting for her Breezecom t-shirt.. ;) Allen ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(190). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(42). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(84). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses. ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
Re: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
Does anyone have some to send down? - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Gino Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 8:35 PM Subject: RE: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks I'll bet they prefer the Motorola Canopy T-shirts! ;-) ... ducking! Gino A. Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. tel 787.273.4143 fax 787.273.4145 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Patrick Leary Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 9:33 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: RE: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks LOL. My girls are 6.5 and 4 now. They don't care much what the shirt says so long as it has something sparkly on it. :) And I have plenty of old BreezeCOM shirts still. Patrick -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Allen Marsalis Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 5:26 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: RE: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks At 06:37 PM 9/10/2007, Patrick Leary wrote: Allen, great to see you pop up on the list again. You've been missed. Thanks Patrick. I trust all is going well with you. I hear you are now vice president. Great job! (I mean that both ways. You do a great job and have a great job) :) Our kids are all growing up! Your daughter must be what about 7 now. Am I close? Mine is 9 and still wears her oversized Mikrotik and Trango T-shirts! :ducking: LOL, She's still waiting for her Breezecom t-shirt.. ;) Allen ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(190). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(42). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(84). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses. ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register
RE: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
Talk to your local sales rep... Mike Bushard, Jr Wisper Wireless Solutions, LLC 320-256-WISP (9477) 320-256-9478 Fax -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 8:40 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks Does anyone have some to send down? - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Gino Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 8:35 PM Subject: RE: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks I'll bet they prefer the Motorola Canopy T-shirts! ;-) ... ducking! Gino A. Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. tel 787.273.4143 fax 787.273.4145 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Patrick Leary Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 9:33 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: RE: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks LOL. My girls are 6.5 and 4 now. They don't care much what the shirt says so long as it has something sparkly on it. :) And I have plenty of old BreezeCOM shirts still. Patrick -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Allen Marsalis Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 5:26 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: RE: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks At 06:37 PM 9/10/2007, Patrick Leary wrote: Allen, great to see you pop up on the list again. You've been missed. Thanks Patrick. I trust all is going well with you. I hear you are now vice president. Great job! (I mean that both ways. You do a great job and have a great job) :) Our kids are all growing up! Your daughter must be what about 7 now. Am I close? Mine is 9 and still wears her oversized Mikrotik and Trango T-shirts! :ducking: LOL, She's still waiting for her Breezecom t-shirt.. ;) Allen ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(190). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(42). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(84). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses. ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
Dylan: WildBlue is leasing satellite transponders for their current service, but I don't think they have anything to do with Hughes. Thanks, Steve On 9/10/07, Dylan Oliver [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Isn't WildBlue actually leasing a HughesNet/DirecWay satellite? Thus sprach a HughesNet installer, anyway. Best, -- Dylan Oliver Primaverity, LLC -- Steve Stroh 425-939-0076 | [EMAIL PROTECTED] | www.stevestroh.com ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
I'm proud to say no Canopy shirts in this house Gino! I can't afford them. (major ducking) :) Allen At 08:35 PM 9/10/2007, Gino Villarini wrote: I'll bet they prefer the Motorola Canopy T-shirts! ;-) ... ducking! ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
I was only about a half year off. Not bad for an old man. :) I'm not sure I remember your youngest though. A belated congratulations to you! I know you are proud of them both. My son is now a freshman in high school and has outgrown me already. Homecoming is this Saturday. Wow how time flies. My daughter is 9 and in a few more years, she might be taller than me as well.. Yeah got one of those old BreezeCom shirts in XXL? That is, if they aren't collectors items by now... ;) Allen At 08:32 PM 9/10/2007, Patrick Leary wrote: LOL. My girls are 6.5 and 4 now. They don't care much what the shirt says so long as it has something sparkly on it. :) And I have plenty of old BreezeCOM shirts still. Patrick ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Thoughts on 900MHz mesh networks
On Mon, 10 Sep 2007, Allen Marsalis wrote: I was a WISP in the late 90s and early 00s. Some of you may know me. It's good to see many familiar faces still here. In recent years, I have pursued new interests but I keep thinking back on my experiences as a WISP. I had a lot of good times back then. I'm thinking about creeping back into the WISP business. WOW! It is GOOD to hear from you again! For the newbs among us, Allen was a WISP/ISP and one of the many folks who helped MANY people back in the late 90s/early 2000. Hopefully, we can get him to hang around for a while (at least 'til cajun christmas time). :-) -- Butch Evans Network Engineering and Security Consulting 573-276-2879 http://www.butchevans.com/ My calendar: http://tinyurl.com/y24ad6 Training Partners: http://tinyurl.com/smfkf Mikrotik Certified Consultant http://www.mikrotik.com/consultants.html ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Laptop
The Lenovo x61 is supposed to be pretty good - I just can't make myself spend that kind of money. On 9/10/07, Brian Rohrbacher [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I need a new one. Anyone got a laptop that works outside well? I can't see the screen on my dell very well. Brian ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/