Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
What's the advantage of the 250? On Sat, May 16, 2015 at 11:58 AM, Faisal Imtiaz fai...@snappytelecom.net wrote: Agreed, and this is why some of us are eagerly awaiting for the Bitlomat 250...
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
You would if you have 70-100 subs per AP Yeah I know your not supposed to do that... So far for most of the networks I have seen with epmp/ubnt vs pmp over 3-4 years TCO is about the same. This however depends on your deployment. Ubnt/epmp are significantly less expensive in some situations and actually pmp can be the least costing in some as well. It all depends on your situation. If you have free space on strictures that don't require a tower crew to deploy and rent is low per AP then the cost savings with UBNT/epmp is great. If you are paying for tower crews and $3500 a year per sector then pmp may be a better solution. The other situation I think most people don't consider is that something that cost more is worth more. Not necessarily in actual usefull value but in truly monetary sense. How many people actually RMA a nanostation? Not very many it goes in the trash becasue it isn't worth my time to go through the process. Therefor there is not a large market for re-manufactured or used equipment. Therefor resell value isn't very good. Bad resell value makes it harder to get leases and loans on the equipment in some situations. As well as for some companies it shows up on the books better. It can be a detriment as well if you have to pay property taxes on it though. It all depends on your market and installation requirements different products for different needs. On 05/15/2015 09:15 PM, Mathew Howard wrote: I don't know whether there's a significant advantage to PMP over ePMP for residential applictions (since I've never used PMP450), but knowing what is possible with ePMP and UBNT, I don't see how PMP could ever generate enough additional revenue to pay for itself in our market. On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 9:09 PM, Mike Hammett af...@ics-il.net mailto:af...@ics-il.net wrote: I don't consider there to be a significant advantage to PMP over the ePMP for residential applications. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com *From: *Adam Moffett dmmoff...@gmail.com mailto:dmmoff...@gmail.com *To: *af@afmug.com mailto:af@afmug.com *Sent: *Friday, May 15, 2015 8:41:03 PM *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I've always considered mbps to be among the least important concerns on PTMP, well below packet loss, jitter, QoS features, manageability, consistency, and reliability. Which is why I'm not super keen on *any* of the wifi stuff. This seems is like an argument about whether a Pinto is better than a Fiesta. /smug One could say I can sync but I can only get 60 Mbps per sub (*) Another person could say I can't sync but I can get 200+ Mbps per sub (*) (*) under the right conditions Your market and deployment strats will dictate which is more important. Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTS www.spitwspots.com http://www.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 04:56 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote: But no sync. *From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Peter Kranz *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 3:12 PM *To:* af@afmug.com mailto:af@afmug.com *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC AC blows doors on ePMP *Peter Kranz *www.UnwiredLtd.com http://www.unwiredltd.com/ Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 tel:510-868-1614%20x100 Mobile: 510-207- tel:510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com mailto:pkr...@unwiredltd.com *From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Jason McKemie *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 11:21 AM *To:* af@afmug.com mailto:af@afmug.com *Subject:* [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
Faisal, Yes, I am seeing that in almost all of the M5s. I haven't had any reports of it being service affecting. What does it mean? On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 10:07 PM, Faisal Imtiaz fai...@snappytelecom.net wrote: Hi Jeremy, A bit off topic, but can you ssh into a hand full of your Rocket M's, and do a dmesg and see if you get something like this... ath_bstuck_tasklet: stuck beacon; resetting (bmiss count 9) Regards Faisal Imtiaz Snappy Internet Telecom 7266 SW 48 Street Miami, FL 33155 Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: supp...@snappytelecom.net -- *From: *Jeremy jeremysmi...@gmail.com *To: *af@afmug.com *Sent: *Friday, May 15, 2015 10:17:26 PM *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I have 22 towers with over a hundred UBNT APs in a valley 11 miles wide, built over the top of a synced Canopy network. I take about 10 customers a week off of their 450 platform and we are constantly told that the difference is night and day better on our network. Careful spectrum management and proper AP loading wins over sync every time. On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:11 PM, Mathew Howard mhoward...@gmail.com wrote: No, we can't always control that, but if I can at least control it sometimes, I'll take it. On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:48 PM, Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com wrote: And you have the opinion you can control that, constantly, on unlicensed spectrum? *smirk* Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTSwww.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 05:46 PM, Mathew Howard wrote: That's a very good point, regardless of what some customers seem to think, mbps really isn't the most important thing... On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:41 PM, Adam Moffett dmmoff...@gmail.com wrote: I've always considered mbps to be among the least important concerns on PTMP, well below packet loss, jitter, QoS features, manageability, consistency, and reliability. Which is why I'm not super keen on *any* of the wifi stuff. This seems is like an argument about whether a Pinto is better than a Fiesta. /smug One could say I can sync but I can only get 60 Mbps per sub (*) Another person could say I can't sync but I can get 200+ Mbps per sub (*) (*) under the right conditions Your market and deployment strats will dictate which is more important. Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTSwww.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 04:56 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote: But no sync. *From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Peter Kranz *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 3:12 PM *To:* af@afmug.com *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC AC blows doors on ePMP *Peter Kranz *www.UnwiredLtd.com http://www.unwiredltd.com/ Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 Mobile: 510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com *From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Jason McKemie *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 11:21 AM *To:* af@afmug.com *Subject:* [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
Yes, in a holding pattern, like most other mfg at the moment.. Frustrating , Faisal Imtiaz Snappy Internet Telecom 7266 SW 48 Street Miami, FL 33155 Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: supp...@snappytelecom.net - Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com wrote: When they get it working... On 2015-05-16 1:42 pm, Faisal Imtiaz wrote: Drop in replacement for the Rocket M AP side, gps sync (code done by the fellow who worte the canopy gps sync code), and new firmware to convert all of the existing Ubiquiti CPE to work with it Faisal Imtiaz Snappy Internet Telecom 7266 SW 48 Street Miami, FL 33155 Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: supp...@snappytelecom.net - Jason McKemie j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com wrote: What's the advantage of the 250? On Sat, May 16, 2015 at 11:58 AM, Faisal Imtiaz fai...@snappytelecom.net wrote: Agreed, and this is why some of us are eagerly awaiting for the Bitlomat 250... -- josh reynolds :: chief information officer spitwspots :: www.spitwspots.com
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
IIRC, sync. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Jason McKemie j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com To: af@afmug.com Sent: Saturday, May 16, 2015 2:20:28 PM Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC What's the advantage of the 250? On Sat, May 16, 2015 at 11:58 AM, Faisal Imtiaz fai...@snappytelecom.net wrote: Agreed, and this is why some of us are eagerly awaiting for the Bitlomat 250...
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
When they get it working... On 2015-05-16 1:42 pm, Faisal Imtiaz wrote: Drop in replacement for the Rocket M AP side, gps sync (code done by the fellow who worte the canopy gps sync code), and new firmware to convert all of the existing Ubiquiti CPE to work with it Faisal Imtiaz Snappy Internet Telecom 7266 SW 48 Street Miami, FL 33155 Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: supp...@snappytelecom.net - Jason McKemie j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com wrote: What's the advantage of the 250? On Sat, May 16, 2015 at 11:58 AM, Faisal Imtiaz fai...@snappytelecom.net wrote: Agreed, and this is why some of us are eagerly awaiting for the Bitlomat 250... -- josh reynolds :: chief information officer spitwspots :: www.spitwspots.com
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
Bitlomat told me at the end of March that they were planning on giving an update in about 30 days... I haven't heard anything since, but hopefully they'll have something out pretty soon... On May 16, 2015 2:49 PM, Faisal Imtiaz fai...@snappytelecom.net wrote: Yes, in a holding pattern, like most other mfg at the moment.. Frustrating , Faisal Imtiaz Snappy Internet Telecom 7266 SW 48 Street Miami, FL 33155 Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: supp...@snappytelecom.net - Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com wrote: When they get it working... On 2015-05-16 1:42 pm, Faisal Imtiaz wrote: Drop in replacement for the Rocket M AP side, gps sync (code done by the fellow who worte the canopy gps sync code), and new firmware to convert all of the existing Ubiquiti CPE to work with it Faisal Imtiaz Snappy Internet Telecom 7266 SW 48 Street Miami, FL 33155 Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: supp...@snappytelecom.net - Jason McKemie j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com wrote: What's the advantage of the 250? On Sat, May 16, 2015 at 11:58 AM, Faisal Imtiaz fai...@snappytelecom.net wrote: Agreed, and this is why some of us are eagerly awaiting for the Bitlomat 250... -- josh reynolds :: chief information officer spitwspots :: www.spitwspots.com
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
Drop in replacement for the Rocket M AP side, gps sync (code done by the fellow who worte the canopy gps sync code), and new firmware to convert all of the existing Ubiquiti CPE to work with it Faisal Imtiaz Snappy Internet Telecom 7266 SW 48 Street Miami, FL 33155 Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: supp...@snappytelecom.net - Jason McKemie j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com wrote: What's the advantage of the 250? On Sat, May 16, 2015 at 11:58 AM, Faisal Imtiaz fai...@snappytelecom.net wrote: Agreed, and this is why some of us are eagerly awaiting for the Bitlomat 250...
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
There are a lot of us in rural areas that will likely never see 70 subs on a tower, much less per AP. In those areas there is little profit margin, none if using any of the higher priced equipment. Just about every tower I have is ours or has very low rent. It is actually cheaper for me to put up a Rohn 25 than rent space on a tower. I also don't have to deal with a lot of congestion issues you guys see. Squirrels and cows aren't big Internet users, so the 2.4GHz band is fairly clean around here. - Original Message - From: Trey Scarborough To: af@afmug.com Sent: Saturday, May 16, 2015 9:12 AM Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC You would if you have 70-100 subs per AP Yeah I know your not supposed to do that... So far for most of the networks I have seen with epmp/ubnt vs pmp over 3-4 years TCO is about the same. This however depends on your deployment. Ubnt/epmp are significantly less expensive in some situations and actually pmp can be the least costing in some as well. It all depends on your situation. If you have free space on strictures that don't require a tower crew to deploy and rent is low per AP then the cost savings with UBNT/epmp is great. If you are paying for tower crews and $3500 a year per sector then pmp may be a better solution. The other situation I think most people don't consider is that something that cost more is worth more. Not necessarily in actual usefull value but in truly monetary sense. How many people actually RMA a nanostation? Not very many it goes in the trash becasue it isn't worth my time to go through the process. Therefor there is not a large market for re-manufactured or used equipment. Therefor resell value isn't very good. Bad resell value makes it harder to get leases and loans on the equipment in some situations. As well as for some companies it shows up on the books better. It can be a detriment as well if you have to pay property taxes on it though. It all depends on your market and installation requirements different products for different needs. On 05/15/2015 09:15 PM, Mathew Howard wrote: I don't know whether there's a significant advantage to PMP over ePMP for residential applictions (since I've never used PMP450), but knowing what is possible with ePMP and UBNT, I don't see how PMP could ever generate enough additional revenue to pay for itself in our market. On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 9:09 PM, Mike Hammett af...@ics-il.net wrote: I don't consider there to be a significant advantage to PMP over the ePMP for residential applications. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: Adam Moffett dmmoff...@gmail.com To: af@afmug.com Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 8:41:03 PM Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I've always considered mbps to be among the least important concerns on PTMP, well below packet loss, jitter, QoS features, manageability, consistency, and reliability. Which is why I'm not super keen on *any* of the wifi stuff. This seems is like an argument about whether a Pinto is better than a Fiesta. /smug One could say I can sync but I can only get 60 Mbps per sub (*) Another person could say I can't sync but I can get 200+ Mbps per sub (*) (*) under the right conditions Your market and deployment strats will dictate which is more important. Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTS www.spitwspots.comOn 05/15/2015 04:56 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote: But no sync. From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Peter Kranz Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 3:12 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC AC blows doors on ePMP Peter Kranz www.UnwiredLtd.com Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 Mobile: 510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Jason McKemie Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 11:21 AM To: af@afmug.com Subject: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
Make that 4.9 to 6.1 Gino A. Villarini @gvillarini On May 15, 2015, at 9:01 PM, Colin Stanners cstann...@gmail.commailto:cstann...@gmail.com wrote: Pfft, you don't need sync when you have all the spectrum of 5.1-5.4... oh wait. On May 15, 2015 7:56 PM, SmarterBroadband li...@smarterbroadband.commailto:li...@smarterbroadband.com wrote: But no sync. From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.commailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Peter Kranz Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 3:12 PM To: af@afmug.commailto:af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC AC blows doors on ePMP Peter Kranz www.UnwiredLtd.comhttp://www.unwiredltd.com/ Desk: 510-868-1614 x100tel:510-868-1614%20x100 Mobile: 510-207-tel:510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.commailto:pkr...@unwiredltd.com From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Jason McKemie Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 11:21 AM To: af@afmug.commailto:af@afmug.com Subject: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
I have both PMP450 and PMP AC deployments currently.. I’d say PMP AC is performing significantly better at similar customer loadings.. We will see if the PMP450 team can use those software defined radio features to add AC functionality to the PMP450 platform and catch up. -Peter
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
They're the latest products from both companies is the only reason I offered up the comparison. On Friday, May 15, 2015, Faisal Imtiaz fai...@snappytelecom.net wrote: Am I the only one reading this discussion and shaking my head. The comparison of these two is absurd and ridiculous... it reminds me of the discussion of this exact nature when Ubiquiti M products were first available in the market place and folks had conversation very similar Ubiquiti M (802.11n) vs Canopy (802.11 b/g) products ? Ubiquiti AC PTMP is one of the first 802.11ac PTMP system in the market place... A better comparison would be with PTMP systems of the same class... (e.g. Mimosa PTMP, expected later this year, and I would not be surprised at all if Cambium also has a 802.11ac PTMP product in their pipeline.) Didn't Trango also announce / have a shipping PTMP system based on 802.11ac ? Anyone has info on that ? :) Faisal Imtiaz Snappy Internet Telecom 7266 SW 48 Street Miami, FL 33155 Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: supp...@snappytelecom.net -- *From: *Mathew Howard mhoward...@gmail.com javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','mhoward...@gmail.com'); *To: *af af@afmug.com javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','af@afmug.com'); *Sent: *Friday, May 15, 2015 10:23:58 PM *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC Which is where ePMP comes in. you get reasonable cost and sync... which makes good spectrum management a lot easier. On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 9:22 PM, Jeremy jeremysmi...@gmail.com javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','jeremysmi...@gmail.com'); wrote: Perhaps, but at 1000x the cost. On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:21 PM, Adam Moffett dmmoff...@gmail.com javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','dmmoff...@gmail.com'); wrote: I'd suggest with careful spectrum management, proper loading, AND better equipment you'd still be better off. I have 22 towers with over a hundred UBNT APs in a valley 11 miles wide, built over the top of a synced Canopy network. I take about 10 customers a week off of their 450 platform and we are constantly told that the difference is night and day better on our network. Careful spectrum management and proper AP loading wins over sync every time. On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:11 PM, Mathew Howard mhoward...@gmail.com javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','mhoward...@gmail.com'); wrote: No, we can't always control that, but if I can at least control it sometimes, I'll take it. On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:48 PM, Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','j...@spitwspots.com'); wrote: And you have the opinion you can control that, constantly, on unlicensed spectrum? *smirk* Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTSwww.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 05:46 PM, Mathew Howard wrote: That's a very good point, regardless of what some customers seem to think, mbps really isn't the most important thing... On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:41 PM, Adam Moffett dmmoff...@gmail.com javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','dmmoff...@gmail.com'); wrote: I've always considered mbps to be among the least important concerns on PTMP, well below packet loss, jitter, QoS features, manageability, consistency, and reliability. Which is why I'm not super keen on *any* of the wifi stuff. This seems is like an argument about whether a Pinto is better than a Fiesta. /smug One could say I can sync but I can only get 60 Mbps per sub (*) Another person could say I can't sync but I can get 200+ Mbps per sub (*) (*) under the right conditions Your market and deployment strats will dictate which is more important. Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTSwww.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 04:56 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote: But no sync. *From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','af-boun...@afmug.com');] *On Behalf Of *Peter Kranz *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 3:12 PM *To:* af@afmug.com javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','af@afmug.com'); *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC AC blows doors on ePMP *Peter Kranz *www.UnwiredLtd.com http://www.unwiredltd.com/ Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 Mobile: 510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','pkr...@unwiredltd.com'); *From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','af-boun...@afmug.com');] *On Behalf Of *Jason McKemie *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 11:21 AM *To:* af@afmug.com javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','af@afmug.com'); *Subject:* [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
One could then say that it matters more. ;-)
The PMP guys used to say ours is better because only we have sync. They don't
have that advantage anymore. It is better, but it is no long enough better.
-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com
- Original Message -
From: Bill Prince part15...@gmail.com
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 11:50:49 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
When it costs $1200/year per antenna on a tower, I would argue that the cost of
the equipment is not the issue.
bp
part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com
On 5/15/2015 7:22 PM, Jeremy wrote:
Perhaps, but at 1000x the cost.
On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:21 PM, Adam Moffett dmmoff...@gmail.com wrote:
blockquote
I'd suggest with careful spectrum management, proper loading, AND better
equipment you'd still be better off.
blockquote
I have 22 towers with over a hundred UBNT APs in a valley 11 miles wide, built
over the top of a synced Canopy network. I take about 10 customers a week off
of their 450 platform and we are constantly told that the difference is night
and day better on our network. Careful spectrum management and proper AP
loading wins over sync every time.
On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:11 PM, Mathew Howard mhoward...@gmail.com wrote:
blockquote
No, we can't always control that, but if I can at least control it sometimes,
I'll take it.
On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:48 PM, Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com wrote:
blockquote
And you have the opinion you can control that, constantly, on unlicensed
spectrum?
*smirk*
Josh Reynolds
CIO, SPITwSPOTS www.spitwspots.com
On 05/15/2015 05:46 PM, Mathew Howard wrote:
blockquote
That's a very good point, regardless of what some customers seem to think, mbps
really isn't the most important thing...
On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:41 PM, Adam Moffett dmmoff...@gmail.com wrote:
blockquote
I've always considered mbps to be among the least important concerns on PTMP,
well below packet loss, jitter, QoS features, manageability, consistency, and
reliability. Which is why I'm not super keen on *any* of the wifi stuff. This
seems is like an argument about whether a Pinto is better than a Fiesta.
/smug
blockquote
One could say I can sync but I can only get 60 Mbps per sub (*)
Another person could say I can't sync but I can get 200+ Mbps per sub (*)
(*) under the right conditions
Your market and deployment strats will dictate which is more important.
Josh Reynolds
CIO, SPITwSPOTS www.spitwspots.com
On 05/15/2015 04:56 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote:
blockquote
But no sync.
From: Af [ mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com ] On Behalf Of Peter Kranz
Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 3:12 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
AC blows doors on ePMP
Peter Kranz
www.UnwiredLtd.com
Desk: 510-868-1614 x100
Mobile: 510-207-
pkr...@unwiredltd.com
From: Af [ mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com ] On Behalf Of Jason McKemie
Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 11:21 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts
on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have
the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future.
-Jason
/blockquote
/blockquote
/blockquote
/blockquote
/blockquote
/blockquote
/blockquote
/blockquote
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
Yep, that's the case here as well... there are very few places in our area where we could ever get anywhere near 70 customers on an AP. On Sat, May 16, 2015 at 4:56 PM, Glen Waldrop gwl...@cngwireless.net wrote: There are a lot of us in rural areas that will likely never see 70 subs on a tower, much less per AP. In those areas there is little profit margin, none if using any of the higher priced equipment. Just about every tower I have is ours or has very low rent. It is actually cheaper for me to put up a Rohn 25 than rent space on a tower. I also don't have to deal with a lot of congestion issues you guys see. Squirrels and cows aren't big Internet users, so the 2.4GHz band is fairly clean around here. - Original Message - *From:* Trey Scarborough t...@3dsc.co *To:* af@afmug.com *Sent:* Saturday, May 16, 2015 9:12 AM *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC You would if you have 70-100 subs per AP Yeah I know your not supposed to do that... So far for most of the networks I have seen with epmp/ubnt vs pmp over 3-4 years TCO is about the same. This however depends on your deployment. Ubnt/epmp are significantly less expensive in some situations and actually pmp can be the least costing in some as well. It all depends on your situation. If you have free space on strictures that don't require a tower crew to deploy and rent is low per AP then the cost savings with UBNT/epmp is great. If you are paying for tower crews and $3500 a year per sector then pmp may be a better solution. The other situation I think most people don't consider is that something that cost more is worth more. Not necessarily in actual usefull value but in truly monetary sense. How many people actually RMA a nanostation? Not very many it goes in the trash becasue it isn't worth my time to go through the process. Therefor there is not a large market for re-manufactured or used equipment. Therefor resell value isn't very good. Bad resell value makes it harder to get leases and loans on the equipment in some situations. As well as for some companies it shows up on the books better. It can be a detriment as well if you have to pay property taxes on it though. It all depends on your market and installation requirements different products for different needs. On 05/15/2015 09:15 PM, Mathew Howard wrote: I don't know whether there's a significant advantage to PMP over ePMP for residential applictions (since I've never used PMP450), but knowing what is possible with ePMP and UBNT, I don't see how PMP could ever generate enough additional revenue to pay for itself in our market. On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 9:09 PM, Mike Hammett af...@ics-il.net wrote: I don't consider there to be a significant advantage to PMP over the ePMP for residential applications. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- *From: *Adam Moffett dmmoff...@gmail.com *To: *af@afmug.com *Sent: *Friday, May 15, 2015 8:41:03 PM *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I've always considered mbps to be among the least important concerns on PTMP, well below packet loss, jitter, QoS features, manageability, consistency, and reliability. Which is why I'm not super keen on *any* of the wifi stuff. This seems is like an argument about whether a Pinto is better than a Fiesta. /smug One could say I can sync but I can only get 60 Mbps per sub (*) Another person could say I can't sync but I can get 200+ Mbps per sub (*) (*) under the right conditions Your market and deployment strats will dictate which is more important. Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTSwww.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 04:56 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote: But no sync. *From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Peter Kranz *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 3:12 PM *To:* af@afmug.com *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC AC blows doors on ePMP *Peter Kranz*www.UnwiredLtd.com http://www.unwiredltd.com/ Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 Mobile: 510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com *From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Jason McKemie *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 11:21 AM *To:* af@afmug.com *Subject:* [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
AC blows doors on ePMP Peter Kranz www.UnwiredLtd.com http://www.unwiredltd.com/ Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 Mobile: 510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com mailto:pkr...@unwiredltd.com From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Jason McKemie Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 11:21 AM To: af@afmug.com Subject: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
One could say I can sync but I can only get 60 Mbps per sub (*) Another person could say I can't sync but I can get 200+ Mbps per sub (*) (*) under the right conditions Your market and deployment strats will dictate which is more important. Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTS www.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 04:56 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote: But no sync. *From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Peter Kranz *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 3:12 PM *To:* af@afmug.com *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC AC blows doors on ePMP *Peter Kranz *www.UnwiredLtd.com http://www.unwiredltd.com/ Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 Mobile: 510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com mailto:pkr...@unwiredltd.com *From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Jason McKemie *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 11:21 AM *To:* af@afmug.com mailto:af@afmug.com *Subject:* [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
We do pretty well with ~14 APs at some sites on 5GHz, with shield kits and physical separation. Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTS www.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 05:00 PM, Mike Hammett wrote: With only a few APs per tower because of co-channel interference... - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com *From: *Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com *To: *af@afmug.com *Sent: *Friday, May 15, 2015 7:59:14 PM *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC One could say I can sync but I can only get 60 Mbps per sub (*) Another person could say I can't sync but I can get 200+ Mbps per sub (*) (*) under the right conditions Your market and deployment strats will dictate which is more important. Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTS www.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 04:56 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote: But no sync. *From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Peter Kranz *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 3:12 PM *To:* af@afmug.com *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC AC blows doors on ePMP *Peter Kranz *www.UnwiredLtd.com http://www.unwiredltd.com/ Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 Mobile: 510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com mailto:pkr...@unwiredltd.com *From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Jason McKemie *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 11:21 AM *To:* af@afmug.com mailto:af@afmug.com *Subject:* [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
But no sync. From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Peter Kranz Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 3:12 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC AC blows doors on ePMP Peter Kranz www.UnwiredLtd.com http://www.unwiredltd.com/ Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 Mobile: 510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Jason McKemie Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 11:21 AM To: af@afmug.com Subject: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
Helps with adjacent channel like any other filter, not co-channel. Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTS www.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 05:22 PM, Jason McKemie wrote: True, airprism is supposed to help with that, not sure how much it actually does, however. On Friday, May 15, 2015, Mike Hammett af...@ics-il.net mailto:af...@ics-il.net wrote: With only a few APs per tower because of co-channel interference... - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com *From: *Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','j...@spitwspots.com'); *To: *af@afmug.com javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','af@afmug.com'); *Sent: *Friday, May 15, 2015 7:59:14 PM *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC One could say I can sync but I can only get 60 Mbps per sub (*) Another person could say I can't sync but I can get 200+ Mbps per sub (*) (*) under the right conditions Your market and deployment strats will dictate which is more important. Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTS www.spitwspots.com http://www.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 04:56 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote: But no sync. *From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','af-boun...@afmug.com');] *On Behalf Of *Peter Kranz *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 3:12 PM *To:* af@afmug.com javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','af@afmug.com'); *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC AC blows doors on ePMP *Peter Kranz *www.UnwiredLtd.com http://www.unwiredltd.com/ Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 Mobile: 510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','pkr...@unwiredltd.com'); *From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','af-boun...@afmug.com');] *On Behalf Of *Jason McKemie *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 11:21 AM *To:* af@afmug.com javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','af@afmug.com'); *Subject:* [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
True, airprism is supposed to help with that, not sure how much it actually does, however. On Friday, May 15, 2015, Mike Hammett af...@ics-il.net wrote: With only a few APs per tower because of co-channel interference... - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- *From: *Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','j...@spitwspots.com'); *To: *af@afmug.com javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','af@afmug.com'); *Sent: *Friday, May 15, 2015 7:59:14 PM *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC One could say I can sync but I can only get 60 Mbps per sub (*) Another person could say I can't sync but I can get 200+ Mbps per sub (*) (*) under the right conditions Your market and deployment strats will dictate which is more important. Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTSwww.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 04:56 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote: But no sync. *From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','af-boun...@afmug.com');] *On Behalf Of *Peter Kranz *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 3:12 PM *To:* af@afmug.com javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','af@afmug.com'); *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC AC blows doors on ePMP *Peter Kranz *www.UnwiredLtd.com http://www.unwiredltd.com/ Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 Mobile: 510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','pkr...@unwiredltd.com'); *From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','af-boun...@afmug.com');] *On Behalf Of *Jason McKemie *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 11:21 AM *To:* af@afmug.com javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','af@afmug.com'); *Subject:* [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
No, we can't always control that, but if I can at least control it sometimes, I'll take it. On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:48 PM, Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com wrote: And you have the opinion you can control that, constantly, on unlicensed spectrum? *smirk* Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTSwww.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 05:46 PM, Mathew Howard wrote: That's a very good point, regardless of what some customers seem to think, mbps really isn't the most important thing... On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:41 PM, Adam Moffett dmmoff...@gmail.com wrote: I've always considered mbps to be among the least important concerns on PTMP, well below packet loss, jitter, QoS features, manageability, consistency, and reliability. Which is why I'm not super keen on *any* of the wifi stuff. This seems is like an argument about whether a Pinto is better than a Fiesta. /smug One could say I can sync but I can only get 60 Mbps per sub (*) Another person could say I can't sync but I can get 200+ Mbps per sub (*) (*) under the right conditions Your market and deployment strats will dictate which is more important. Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTSwww.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 04:56 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote: But no sync. *From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Peter Kranz *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 3:12 PM *To:* af@afmug.com *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC AC blows doors on ePMP *Peter Kranz *www.UnwiredLtd.com http://www.unwiredltd.com/ Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 510-868-1614%20x100 Mobile: 510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com *From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Jason McKemie *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 11:21 AM *To:* af@afmug.com *Subject:* [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
Which is where ePMP comes in. you get reasonable cost and sync... which makes good spectrum management a lot easier. On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 9:22 PM, Jeremy jeremysmi...@gmail.com wrote: Perhaps, but at 1000x the cost. On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:21 PM, Adam Moffett dmmoff...@gmail.com wrote: I'd suggest with careful spectrum management, proper loading, AND better equipment you'd still be better off. I have 22 towers with over a hundred UBNT APs in a valley 11 miles wide, built over the top of a synced Canopy network. I take about 10 customers a week off of their 450 platform and we are constantly told that the difference is night and day better on our network. Careful spectrum management and proper AP loading wins over sync every time. On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:11 PM, Mathew Howard mhoward...@gmail.com wrote: No, we can't always control that, but if I can at least control it sometimes, I'll take it. On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:48 PM, Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com wrote: And you have the opinion you can control that, constantly, on unlicensed spectrum? *smirk* Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTSwww.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 05:46 PM, Mathew Howard wrote: That's a very good point, regardless of what some customers seem to think, mbps really isn't the most important thing... On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:41 PM, Adam Moffett dmmoff...@gmail.com wrote: I've always considered mbps to be among the least important concerns on PTMP, well below packet loss, jitter, QoS features, manageability, consistency, and reliability. Which is why I'm not super keen on *any* of the wifi stuff. This seems is like an argument about whether a Pinto is better than a Fiesta. /smug One could say I can sync but I can only get 60 Mbps per sub (*) Another person could say I can't sync but I can get 200+ Mbps per sub (*) (*) under the right conditions Your market and deployment strats will dictate which is more important. Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTSwww.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 04:56 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote: But no sync. *From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Peter Kranz *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 3:12 PM *To:* af@afmug.com *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC AC blows doors on ePMP *Peter Kranz *www.UnwiredLtd.com http://www.unwiredltd.com/ Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 510-868-1614%20x100 Mobile: 510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com *From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Jason McKemie *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 11:21 AM *To:* af@afmug.com *Subject:* [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
Perhaps, but at 1000x the cost. On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:21 PM, Adam Moffett dmmoff...@gmail.com wrote: I'd suggest with careful spectrum management, proper loading, AND better equipment you'd still be better off. I have 22 towers with over a hundred UBNT APs in a valley 11 miles wide, built over the top of a synced Canopy network. I take about 10 customers a week off of their 450 platform and we are constantly told that the difference is night and day better on our network. Careful spectrum management and proper AP loading wins over sync every time. On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:11 PM, Mathew Howard mhoward...@gmail.com wrote: No, we can't always control that, but if I can at least control it sometimes, I'll take it. On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:48 PM, Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com wrote: And you have the opinion you can control that, constantly, on unlicensed spectrum? *smirk* Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTSwww.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 05:46 PM, Mathew Howard wrote: That's a very good point, regardless of what some customers seem to think, mbps really isn't the most important thing... On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:41 PM, Adam Moffett dmmoff...@gmail.com wrote: I've always considered mbps to be among the least important concerns on PTMP, well below packet loss, jitter, QoS features, manageability, consistency, and reliability. Which is why I'm not super keen on *any* of the wifi stuff. This seems is like an argument about whether a Pinto is better than a Fiesta. /smug One could say I can sync but I can only get 60 Mbps per sub (*) Another person could say I can't sync but I can get 200+ Mbps per sub (*) (*) under the right conditions Your market and deployment strats will dictate which is more important. Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTSwww.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 04:56 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote: But no sync. *From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Peter Kranz *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 3:12 PM *To:* af@afmug.com *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC AC blows doors on ePMP *Peter Kranz *www.UnwiredLtd.com http://www.unwiredltd.com/ Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 510-868-1614%20x100 Mobile: 510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com *From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Jason McKemie *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 11:21 AM *To:* af@afmug.com *Subject:* [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
Or put another way...if he's using better equipment but doesn't know how to use it, then you'll still win. I have 22 towers with over a hundred UBNT APs in a valley 11 miles wide, built over the top of a synced Canopy network. I take about 10 customers a week off of their 450 platform and we are constantly told that the difference is night and day better on our network. Careful spectrum management and proper AP loading wins over sync every time. On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:11 PM, Mathew Howard mhoward...@gmail.com mailto:mhoward...@gmail.com wrote: No, we can't always control that, but if I can at least control it sometimes, I'll take it. On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:48 PM, Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com mailto:j...@spitwspots.com wrote: And you have the opinion you can control that, constantly, on unlicensed spectrum? *smirk* Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTS www.spitwspots.com http://www.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 05:46 PM, Mathew Howard wrote: That's a very good point, regardless of what some customers seem to think, mbps really isn't the most important thing... On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:41 PM, Adam Moffett dmmoff...@gmail.com mailto:dmmoff...@gmail.com wrote: I've always considered mbps to be among the least important concerns on PTMP, well below packet loss, jitter, QoS features, manageability, consistency, and reliability. Which is why I'm not super keen on *any* of the wifi stuff. This seems is like an argument about whether a Pinto is better than a Fiesta. /smug One could say I can sync but I can only get 60 Mbps per sub (*) Another person could say I can't sync but I can get 200+ Mbps per sub (*) (*) under the right conditions Your market and deployment strats will dictate which is more important. Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTS www.spitwspots.com http://www.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 04:56 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote: But no sync. *From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Peter Kranz *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 3:12 PM *To:* af@afmug.com mailto:af@afmug.com *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC AC blows doors on ePMP *Peter Kranz *www.UnwiredLtd.com http://www.unwiredltd.com/ Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 tel:510-868-1614%20x100 Mobile: 510-207- tel:510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com mailto:pkr...@unwiredltd.com *From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Jason McKemie *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 11:21 AM *To:* af@afmug.com mailto:af@afmug.com *Subject:* [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
Hey...now you're picking on Telrad :) I thought this was about Canopy. Perhaps, but at 1000x the cost. On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:21 PM, Adam Moffett dmmoff...@gmail.com mailto:dmmoff...@gmail.com wrote: I'd suggest with careful spectrum management, proper loading, AND better equipment you'd still be better off. I have 22 towers with over a hundred UBNT APs in a valley 11 miles wide, built over the top of a synced Canopy network. I take about 10 customers a week off of their 450 platform and we are constantly told that the difference is night and day better on our network. Careful spectrum management and proper AP loading wins over sync every time. On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:11 PM, Mathew Howard mhoward...@gmail.com mailto:mhoward...@gmail.com wrote: No, we can't always control that, but if I can at least control it sometimes, I'll take it. On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:48 PM, Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com mailto:j...@spitwspots.com wrote: And you have the opinion you can control that, constantly, on unlicensed spectrum? *smirk* Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTS www.spitwspots.com http://www.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 05:46 PM, Mathew Howard wrote: That's a very good point, regardless of what some customers seem to think, mbps really isn't the most important thing... On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:41 PM, Adam Moffett dmmoff...@gmail.com mailto:dmmoff...@gmail.com wrote: I've always considered mbps to be among the least important concerns on PTMP, well below packet loss, jitter, QoS features, manageability, consistency, and reliability. Which is why I'm not super keen on *any* of the wifi stuff. This seems is like an argument about whether a Pinto is better than a Fiesta. /smug One could say I can sync but I can only get 60 Mbps per sub (*) Another person could say I can't sync but I can get 200+ Mbps per sub (*) (*) under the right conditions Your market and deployment strats will dictate which is more important. Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTS www.spitwspots.com http://www.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 04:56 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote: But no sync. *From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Peter Kranz *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 3:12 PM *To:* af@afmug.com mailto:af@afmug.com *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC AC blows doors on ePMP *Peter Kranz *www.UnwiredLtd.com http://www.unwiredltd.com/ Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 tel:510-868-1614%20x100 Mobile: 510-207- tel:510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com mailto:pkr...@unwiredltd.com *From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Jason McKemie *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 11:21 AM *To:* af@afmug.com mailto:af@afmug.com *Subject:* [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
I'm an employee as opposed to an owner. In that sense I have $0 invested in anything. So it's spoken by someone who formerly worked with PMP100 and PMP450 and wishes the equipment he was working with today did like half the things that Canopy did. Spoken by someone with apparently a huge investment in PMP? - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com *From: *Adam Moffett dmmoff...@gmail.com *To: *af@afmug.com *Sent: *Friday, May 15, 2015 9:04:02 PM *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC Maybe we should each drop an AF5 in front of the other and see who's worse off. I'll race you to the top of the bottom. It's true that nobody can ensure perfect packet loss and jitter under terrible conditions. The wifi junk is still junk when conditions are perfect. See the rest of the items in the list after jitter and packet loss :P Can I drop an AF5 in front of your tower? I promise that your control over packet loss and jitter will go out the fucking window :P Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTS www.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 05:56 PM, Adam Moffett wrote: We will both laugh ourselves to sleep tonight. Each fully knowing that the other is doing it wrong :) And you have the opinion you can control that, constantly, on unlicensed spectrum? *smirk* Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTS www.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 05:46 PM, Mathew Howard wrote: That's a very good point, regardless of what some customers seem to think, mbps really isn't the most important thing... On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:41 PM, Adam Moffett dmmoff...@gmail.com mailto:dmmoff...@gmail.com wrote: I've always considered mbps to be among the least important concerns on PTMP, well below packet loss, jitter, QoS features, manageability, consistency, and reliability. Which is why I'm not super keen on *any* of the wifi stuff. This seems is like an argument about whether a Pinto is better than a Fiesta. /smug One could say I can sync but I can only get 60 Mbps per sub (*) Another person could say I can't sync but I can get 200+ Mbps per sub (*) (*) under the right conditions Your market and deployment strats will dictate which is more important. Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTS www.spitwspots.com http://www.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 04:56 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote: But no sync. *From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Peter Kranz *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 3:12 PM *To:* af@afmug.com mailto:af@afmug.com *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC AC blows doors on ePMP *Peter Kranz *www.UnwiredLtd.com http://www.unwiredltd.com/ Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 tel:510-868-1614%20x100 Mobile: 510-207- tel:510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com mailto:pkr...@unwiredltd.com *From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Jason McKemie *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 11:21 AM *To:* af@afmug.com mailto:af@afmug.com *Subject:* [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
Hi Jeremy, A bit off topic, but can you ssh into a hand full of your Rocket M's, and do a dmesg and see if you get something like this... ath_bstuck_tasklet: stuck beacon; resetting (bmiss count 9) Regards Faisal Imtiaz Snappy Internet Telecom 7266 SW 48 Street Miami, FL 33155 Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: supp...@snappytelecom.net - Original Message - From: Jeremy jeremysmi...@gmail.com To: af@afmug.com Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 10:17:26 PM Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I have 22 towers with over a hundred UBNT APs in a valley 11 miles wide, built over the top of a synced Canopy network. I take about 10 customers a week off of their 450 platform and we are constantly told that the difference is night and day better on our network. Careful spectrum management and proper AP loading wins over sync every time. On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:11 PM, Mathew Howard mhoward...@gmail.com wrote: No, we can't always control that, but if I can at least control it sometimes, I'll take it. On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:48 PM, Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com wrote: And you have the opinion you can control that, constantly, on unlicensed spectrum? *smirk* Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTS www.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 05:46 PM, Mathew Howard wrote: That's a very good point, regardless of what some customers seem to think, mbps really isn't the most important thing... On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:41 PM, Adam Moffett dmmoff...@gmail.com wrote: I've always considered mbps to be among the least important concerns on PTMP, well below packet loss, jitter, QoS features, manageability, consistency, and reliability. Which is why I'm not super keen on *any* of the wifi stuff. This seems is like an argument about whether a Pinto is better than a Fiesta. /smug One could say I can sync but I can only get 60 Mbps per sub (*) Another person could say I can't sync but I can get 200+ Mbps per sub (*) (*) under the right conditions Your market and deployment strats will dictate which is more important. Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTS www.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 04:56 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote: But no sync. From: Af [ mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com ] On Behalf Of Peter Kranz Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 3:12 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC AC blows doors on ePMP Peter Kranz www.UnwiredLtd.com Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 Mobile: 510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com From: Af [ mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com ] On Behalf Of Jason McKemie Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 11:21 AM To: af@afmug.com Subject: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
We will both laugh ourselves to sleep tonight. Each fully knowing that the other is doing it wrong :) And you have the opinion you can control that, constantly, on unlicensed spectrum? *smirk* Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTS www.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 05:46 PM, Mathew Howard wrote: That's a very good point, regardless of what some customers seem to think, mbps really isn't the most important thing... On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:41 PM, Adam Moffett dmmoff...@gmail.com mailto:dmmoff...@gmail.com wrote: I've always considered mbps to be among the least important concerns on PTMP, well below packet loss, jitter, QoS features, manageability, consistency, and reliability. Which is why I'm not super keen on *any* of the wifi stuff. This seems is like an argument about whether a Pinto is better than a Fiesta. /smug One could say I can sync but I can only get 60 Mbps per sub (*) Another person could say I can't sync but I can get 200+ Mbps per sub (*) (*) under the right conditions Your market and deployment strats will dictate which is more important. Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTS www.spitwspots.com http://www.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 04:56 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote: But no sync. *From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Peter Kranz *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 3:12 PM *To:* af@afmug.com mailto:af@afmug.com *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC AC blows doors on ePMP *Peter Kranz *www.UnwiredLtd.com http://www.unwiredltd.com/ Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 tel:510-868-1614%20x100 Mobile: 510-207- tel:510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com mailto:pkr...@unwiredltd.com *From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Jason McKemie *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 11:21 AM *To:* af@afmug.com mailto:af@afmug.com *Subject:* [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
Spoken by someone with apparently a huge investment in PMP? - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Adam Moffett dmmoff...@gmail.com To: af@afmug.com Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 9:04:02 PM Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC Maybe we should each drop an AF5 in front of the other and see who's worse off. I'll race you to the top of the bottom. It's true that nobody can ensure perfect packet loss and jitter under terrible conditions. The wifi junk is still junk when conditions are perfect. See the rest of the items in the list after jitter and packet loss :P Can I drop an AF5 in front of your tower? I promise that your control over packet loss and jitter will go out the fucking window :P Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTS www.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 05:56 PM, Adam Moffett wrote: blockquote We will both laugh ourselves to sleep tonight. Each fully knowing that the other is doing it wrong :) blockquote And you have the opinion you can control that, constantly, on unlicensed spectrum? *smirk* Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTS www.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 05:46 PM, Mathew Howard wrote: blockquote That's a very good point, regardless of what some customers seem to think, mbps really isn't the most important thing... On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:41 PM, Adam Moffett dmmoff...@gmail.com wrote: blockquote I've always considered mbps to be among the least important concerns on PTMP, well below packet loss, jitter, QoS features, manageability, consistency, and reliability. Which is why I'm not super keen on *any* of the wifi stuff. This seems is like an argument about whether a Pinto is better than a Fiesta. /smug blockquote One could say I can sync but I can only get 60 Mbps per sub (*) Another person could say I can't sync but I can get 200+ Mbps per sub (*) (*) under the right conditions Your market and deployment strats will dictate which is more important. Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTS www.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 04:56 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote: blockquote But no sync. From: Af [ mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com ] On Behalf Of Peter Kranz Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 3:12 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC AC blows doors on ePMP Peter Kranz www.UnwiredLtd.com Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 Mobile: 510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com From: Af [ mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com ] On Behalf Of Jason McKemie Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 11:21 AM To: af@afmug.com Subject: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason /blockquote /blockquote /blockquote /blockquote /blockquote /blockquote
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
I don't consider there to be a significant advantage to PMP over the ePMP for residential applications. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Adam Moffett dmmoff...@gmail.com To: af@afmug.com Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 8:41:03 PM Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I've always considered mbps to be among the least important concerns on PTMP, well below packet loss, jitter, QoS features, manageability, consistency, and reliability. Which is why I'm not super keen on *any* of the wifi stuff. This seems is like an argument about whether a Pinto is better than a Fiesta. /smug One could say I can sync but I can only get 60 Mbps per sub (*) Another person could say I can't sync but I can get 200+ Mbps per sub (*) (*) under the right conditions Your market and deployment strats will dictate which is more important. Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTS www.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 04:56 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote: blockquote But no sync. From: Af [ mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com ] On Behalf Of Peter Kranz Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 3:12 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC AC blows doors on ePMP Peter Kranz www.UnwiredLtd.com Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 Mobile: 510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com From: Af [ mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com ] On Behalf Of Jason McKemie Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 11:21 AM To: af@afmug.com Subject: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason /blockquote
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
Am I the only one reading this discussion and shaking my head. The comparison of these two is absurd and ridiculous... it reminds me of the discussion of this exact nature when Ubiquiti M products were first available in the market place and folks had conversation very similar Ubiquiti M (802.11n) vs Canopy (802.11 b/g) products ? Ubiquiti AC PTMP is one of the first 802.11ac PTMP system in the market place... A better comparison would be with PTMP systems of the same class... (e.g. Mimosa PTMP, expected later this year, and I would not be surprised at all if Cambium also has a 802.11ac PTMP product in their pipeline.) Didn't Trango also announce / have a shipping PTMP system based on 802.11ac ? Anyone has info on that ? :) Faisal Imtiaz Snappy Internet Telecom 7266 SW 48 Street Miami, FL 33155 Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: supp...@snappytelecom.net - Original Message - From: Mathew Howard mhoward...@gmail.com To: af af@afmug.com Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 10:23:58 PM Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC Which is where ePMP comes in. you get reasonable cost and sync... which makes good spectrum management a lot easier. On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 9:22 PM, Jeremy jeremysmi...@gmail.com wrote: Perhaps, but at 1000x the cost. On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:21 PM, Adam Moffett dmmoff...@gmail.com wrote: I'd suggest with careful spectrum management, proper loading, AND better equipment you'd still be better off. I have 22 towers with over a hundred UBNT APs in a valley 11 miles wide, built over the top of a synced Canopy network. I take about 10 customers a week off of their 450 platform and we are constantly told that the difference is night and day better on our network. Careful spectrum management and proper AP loading wins over sync every time. On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:11 PM, Mathew Howard mhoward...@gmail.com wrote: No, we can't always control that, but if I can at least control it sometimes, I'll take it. On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:48 PM, Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com wrote: And you have the opinion you can control that, constantly, on unlicensed spectrum? *smirk* Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTS www.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 05:46 PM, Mathew Howard wrote: That's a very good point, regardless of what some customers seem to think, mbps really isn't the most important thing... On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:41 PM, Adam Moffett dmmoff...@gmail.com wrote: I've always considered mbps to be among the least important concerns on PTMP, well below packet loss, jitter, QoS features, manageability, consistency, and reliability. Which is why I'm not super keen on *any* of the wifi stuff. This seems is like an argument about whether a Pinto is better than a Fiesta. /smug One could say I can sync but I can only get 60 Mbps per sub (*) Another person could say I can't sync but I can get 200+ Mbps per sub (*) (*) under the right conditions Your market and deployment strats will dictate which is more important. Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTS www.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 04:56 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote: But no sync. From: Af [ mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com ] On Behalf Of Peter Kranz Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 3:12 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC AC blows doors on ePMP Peter Kranz www.UnwiredLtd.com Desk: 510-868-1614 x100
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
When it costs $1200/year per antenna on a tower, I would argue that the
cost of the equipment is not the issue.
bp
part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com
On 5/15/2015 7:22 PM, Jeremy wrote:
Perhaps, but at 1000x the cost.
On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:21 PM, Adam Moffett dmmoff...@gmail.com
mailto:dmmoff...@gmail.com wrote:
I'd suggest with careful spectrum management, proper loading, AND
better equipment you'd still be better off.
I have 22 towers with over a hundred UBNT APs in a valley 11
miles wide, built over the top of a synced Canopy network. I
take about 10 customers a week off of their 450 platform and we
are constantly told that the difference is night and day better
on our network. Careful spectrum management and proper AP
loading wins over sync every time.
On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:11 PM, Mathew Howard
mhoward...@gmail.com mailto:mhoward...@gmail.com wrote:
No, we can't always control that, but if I can at least
control it sometimes, I'll take it.
On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:48 PM, Josh Reynolds
j...@spitwspots.com mailto:j...@spitwspots.com wrote:
And you have the opinion you can control that,
constantly, on unlicensed spectrum?
*smirk*
Josh Reynolds
CIO, SPITwSPOTS
www.spitwspots.com http://www.spitwspots.com
On 05/15/2015 05:46 PM, Mathew Howard wrote:
That's a very good point, regardless of what some
customers seem to think, mbps really isn't the most
important thing...
On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:41 PM, Adam Moffett
dmmoff...@gmail.com mailto:dmmoff...@gmail.com wrote:
I've always considered mbps to be among the least
important concerns on PTMP, well below packet loss,
jitter, QoS features, manageability, consistency,
and reliability. Which is why I'm not super keen on
*any* of the wifi stuff. This seems is like an
argument about whether a Pinto is better than a Fiesta.
/smug
One could say I can sync but I can only get 60
Mbps per sub (*)
Another person could say I can't sync but I can
get 200+ Mbps per sub (*)
(*) under the right conditions
Your market and deployment strats will dictate
which is more important.
Josh Reynolds
CIO, SPITwSPOTS
www.spitwspots.com http://www.spitwspots.com
On 05/15/2015 04:56 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote:
But no sync.
*From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf
Of *Peter Kranz
*Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 3:12 PM
*To:* af@afmug.com mailto:af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
AC blows doors on ePMP
*Peter Kranz
*www.UnwiredLtd.com http://www.unwiredltd.com/
Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 tel:510-868-1614%20x100
Mobile: 510-207- tel:510-207-
pkr...@unwiredltd.com mailto:pkr...@unwiredltd.com
*From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf
Of *Jason McKemie
*Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 11:21 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com mailto:af@afmug.com
*Subject:* [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison,
but what are other's thoughts on these two
products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC
gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully
they will in the near future.
-Jason
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
Hell I don't need an AF5x to cleanly knock many 5 Ghz radios off the air with a low power video transmitter. I also have a 5Ghz 1 watt amp someone sent me to test. ..it works..so combination is scary. No one has upset me yet.lol. Jaime Solorza On May 15, 2015 7:57 PM, Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com wrote: Can I drop an AF5 in front of your tower? I promise that your control over packet loss and jitter will go out the fucking window :P Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTSwww.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 05:56 PM, Adam Moffett wrote: We will both laugh ourselves to sleep tonight. Each fully knowing that the other is doing it wrong :) And you have the opinion you can control that, constantly, on unlicensed spectrum? *smirk* Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTSwww.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 05:46 PM, Mathew Howard wrote: That's a very good point, regardless of what some customers seem to think, mbps really isn't the most important thing... On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:41 PM, Adam Moffett dmmoff...@gmail.com wrote: I've always considered mbps to be among the least important concerns on PTMP, well below packet loss, jitter, QoS features, manageability, consistency, and reliability. Which is why I'm not super keen on *any* of the wifi stuff. This seems is like an argument about whether a Pinto is better than a Fiesta. /smug One could say I can sync but I can only get 60 Mbps per sub (*) Another person could say I can't sync but I can get 200+ Mbps per sub (*) (*) under the right conditions Your market and deployment strats will dictate which is more important. Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTSwww.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 04:56 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote: But no sync. *From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Peter Kranz *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 3:12 PM *To:* af@afmug.com *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC AC blows doors on ePMP *Peter Kranz *www.UnwiredLtd.com http://www.unwiredltd.com/ Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 510-868-1614%20x100 Mobile: 510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com *From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Jason McKemie *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 11:21 AM *To:* af@afmug.com *Subject:* [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
I'd suggest with careful spectrum management, proper loading, AND better equipment you'd still be better off. I have 22 towers with over a hundred UBNT APs in a valley 11 miles wide, built over the top of a synced Canopy network. I take about 10 customers a week off of their 450 platform and we are constantly told that the difference is night and day better on our network. Careful spectrum management and proper AP loading wins over sync every time. On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:11 PM, Mathew Howard mhoward...@gmail.com mailto:mhoward...@gmail.com wrote: No, we can't always control that, but if I can at least control it sometimes, I'll take it. On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:48 PM, Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com mailto:j...@spitwspots.com wrote: And you have the opinion you can control that, constantly, on unlicensed spectrum? *smirk* Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTS www.spitwspots.com http://www.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 05:46 PM, Mathew Howard wrote: That's a very good point, regardless of what some customers seem to think, mbps really isn't the most important thing... On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:41 PM, Adam Moffett dmmoff...@gmail.com mailto:dmmoff...@gmail.com wrote: I've always considered mbps to be among the least important concerns on PTMP, well below packet loss, jitter, QoS features, manageability, consistency, and reliability. Which is why I'm not super keen on *any* of the wifi stuff. This seems is like an argument about whether a Pinto is better than a Fiesta. /smug One could say I can sync but I can only get 60 Mbps per sub (*) Another person could say I can't sync but I can get 200+ Mbps per sub (*) (*) under the right conditions Your market and deployment strats will dictate which is more important. Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTS www.spitwspots.com http://www.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 04:56 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote: But no sync. *From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Peter Kranz *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 3:12 PM *To:* af@afmug.com mailto:af@afmug.com *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC AC blows doors on ePMP *Peter Kranz *www.UnwiredLtd.com http://www.unwiredltd.com/ Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 tel:510-868-1614%20x100 Mobile: 510-207- tel:510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com mailto:pkr...@unwiredltd.com *From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Jason McKemie *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 11:21 AM *To:* af@afmug.com mailto:af@afmug.com *Subject:* [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
Well, since half of your APs would be on the same rx freq :P Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTS www.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 06:04 PM, Adam Moffett wrote: Maybe we should each drop an AF5 in front of the other and see who's worse off. I'll race you to the top of the bottom. It's true that nobody can ensure perfect packet loss and jitter under terrible conditions. The wifi junk is still junk when conditions are perfect. See the rest of the items in the list after jitter and packet loss :P Can I drop an AF5 in front of your tower? I promise that your control over packet loss and jitter will go out the fucking window :P Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTS www.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 05:56 PM, Adam Moffett wrote: We will both laugh ourselves to sleep tonight. Each fully knowing that the other is doing it wrong :) And you have the opinion you can control that, constantly, on unlicensed spectrum? *smirk* Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTS www.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 05:46 PM, Mathew Howard wrote: That's a very good point, regardless of what some customers seem to think, mbps really isn't the most important thing... On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:41 PM, Adam Moffett dmmoff...@gmail.com mailto:dmmoff...@gmail.com wrote: I've always considered mbps to be among the least important concerns on PTMP, well below packet loss, jitter, QoS features, manageability, consistency, and reliability. Which is why I'm not super keen on *any* of the wifi stuff. This seems is like an argument about whether a Pinto is better than a Fiesta. /smug One could say I can sync but I can only get 60 Mbps per sub (*) Another person could say I can't sync but I can get 200+ Mbps per sub (*) (*) under the right conditions Your market and deployment strats will dictate which is more important. Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTS www.spitwspots.com http://www.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 04:56 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote: But no sync. *From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Peter Kranz *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 3:12 PM *To:* af@afmug.com mailto:af@afmug.com *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC AC blows doors on ePMP *Peter Kranz *www.UnwiredLtd.com http://www.unwiredltd.com/ Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 tel:510-868-1614%20x100 Mobile: 510-207- tel:510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com mailto:pkr...@unwiredltd.com *From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Jason McKemie *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 11:21 AM *To:* af@afmug.com mailto:af@afmug.com *Subject:* [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
No, airPrism is useless for co-channel. It's good for adjacent channel. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Jason McKemie j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com To: af@afmug.com Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 8:22:10 PM Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC True, airprism is supposed to help with that, not sure how much it actually does, however. On Friday, May 15, 2015, Mike Hammett af...@ics-il.net wrote: With only a few APs per tower because of co-channel interference... - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com From: Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com To: af@afmug.com Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 7:59:14 PM Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC One could say I can sync but I can only get 60 Mbps per sub (*) Another person could say I can't sync but I can get 200+ Mbps per sub (*) (*) under the right conditions Your market and deployment strats will dictate which is more important. Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTS www.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 04:56 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote: blockquote But no sync. From: Af [ mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com ] On Behalf Of Peter Kranz Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 3:12 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC AC blows doors on ePMP Peter Kranz www.UnwiredLtd.com Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 Mobile: 510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com From: Af [ mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com ] On Behalf Of Jason McKemie Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 11:21 AM To: af@afmug.com Subject: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason /blockquote
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
Yeah, I overlooked the co-channel part... On Friday, May 15, 2015, Mike Hammett af...@ics-il.net wrote: No, airPrism is useless for co-channel. It's good for adjacent channel. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- *From: *Jason McKemie j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com'); *To: *af@afmug.com javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','af@afmug.com'); *Sent: *Friday, May 15, 2015 8:22:10 PM *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC True, airprism is supposed to help with that, not sure how much it actually does, however. On Friday, May 15, 2015, Mike Hammett af...@ics-il.net javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','af...@ics-il.net'); wrote: With only a few APs per tower because of co-channel interference... - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- *From: *Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com *To: *af@afmug.com *Sent: *Friday, May 15, 2015 7:59:14 PM *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC One could say I can sync but I can only get 60 Mbps per sub (*) Another person could say I can't sync but I can get 200+ Mbps per sub (*) (*) under the right conditions Your market and deployment strats will dictate which is more important. Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTSwww.spitwspots.com On 05/15/2015 04:56 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote: But no sync. *From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Peter Kranz *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 3:12 PM *To:* af@afmug.com *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC AC blows doors on ePMP *Peter Kranz *www.UnwiredLtd.com http://www.unwiredltd.com/ Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 Mobile: 510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com *From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Jason McKemie *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 11:21 AM *To:* af@afmug.com *Subject:* [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
I’m waiting for airHoleTM with patent pending wormhole technology. From: Jason McKemie Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 10:50 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC Yeah, I overlooked the co-channel part... On Friday, May 15, 2015, Mike Hammett af...@ics-il.net wrote: No, airPrism is useless for co-channel. It's good for adjacent channel. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: Jason McKemie javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com'); To: javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','af@afmug.com'); Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 8:22:10 PM Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC True, airprism is supposed to help with that, not sure how much it actually does, however. On Friday, May 15, 2015, Mike Hammett javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','af...@ics-il.net'); wrote: With only a few APs per tower because of co-channel interference... - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com From: Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com To: af@afmug.com Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 7:59:14 PM Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC One could say I can sync but I can only get 60 Mbps per sub (*) Another person could say I can't sync but I can get 200+ Mbps per sub (*) (*) under the right conditions Your market and deployment strats will dictate which is more important. Josh Reynolds CIO, SPITwSPOTS www.spitwspots.comOn 05/15/2015 04:56 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote: But no sync. From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Peter Kranz Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 3:12 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC AC blows doors on ePMP Peter Kranz www.UnwiredLtd.com Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 Mobile: 510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Jason McKemie Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 11:21 AM To: af@afmug.com Subject: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
5150 or DFS? - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com To: af@afmug.com, Jason McKemie j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 1:23:02 PM Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC AC has been getting lower approvals over the past few weeks, check the FCC approvals site. On May 15, 2015 10:20:55 AM AKDT, Jason McKemie j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com wrote: I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason -- Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
This is incorrect. In the past few weeks several products from UBNT have received their lower band certs. Check the FCC approvals by date. On May 15, 2015 10:22:33 AM AKDT, Mike Hammett af...@ics-il.net wrote: ePMP. UBNT hasn't proven themselves able to get DFS or 5150 certification in their AirMax line for any new products in a while. Lots of throughput doesn't mean jack when there's no sync and no usable spectrum. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Jason McKemie j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com To: af@afmug.com Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 1:20:55 PM Subject: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason -- Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
5150 On May 15, 2015 10:23:33 AM AKDT, Mike Hammett af...@ics-il.net wrote: 5150 or DFS? - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com To: af@afmug.com, Jason McKemie j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 1:23:02 PM Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC AC has been getting lower approvals over the past few weeks, check the FCC approvals site. On May 15, 2015 10:20:55 AM AKDT, Jason McKemie j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com wrote: I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason -- Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity. -- Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
I wonder when the firmware update is coming! On 5/15/2015 1:28 PM, Josh Reynolds wrote: 5150 On May 15, 2015 10:23:33 AM AKDT, Mike Hammett af...@ics-il.net wrote: 5150 or DFS? - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com *From: *Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com *To: *af@afmug.com, Jason McKemie j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com *Sent: *Friday, May 15, 2015 1:23:02 PM *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC AC has been getting lower approvals over the past few weeks, check the FCC approvals site. On May 15, 2015 10:20:55 AM AKDT, Jason McKemie j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com wrote: I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason -- Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
Yeah, any new product is dead to me until it has those bands. Coming in the future doesn’t cut it. Even if you intend to operate in upper 5 GHz, typically you need the flexibility to operate in 5150 and DFS for testing/commissioning/transitioning. And “trust me, it will be unlocked in future FW once we get approval” doesn’t cut it. I fell for that years ago with the Trango backhaul that ended up needing a hardware change to pass DFS. After that, seeing is believing. I’m not actually from Missouri, but on this topic, I’m a naturalized citizen. From: Mike Hammett Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 1:23 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC 5150 or DFS? - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com From: Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com To: af@afmug.com, Jason McKemie j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 1:23:02 PM Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC AC has been getting lower approvals over the past few weeks, check the FCC approvals site. On May 15, 2015 10:20:55 AM AKDT, Jason McKemie j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com wrote: I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason -- Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
Agreed. I have no faith in we'll have that feature in Q4 anymore. Yeah, any new product is dead to me until it has those bands. Coming in the future doesn’t cut it. Even if you intend to operate in upper 5 GHz, typically you need the flexibility to operate in 5150 and DFS for testing/commissioning/transitioning. And “trust me, it will be unlocked in future FW once we get approval” doesn’t cut it. I fell for that years ago with the Trango backhaul that ended up needing a hardware change to pass DFS. After that, seeing is believing. I’m not actually from Missouri, but on this topic, I’m a naturalized citizen. *From:* Mike Hammett mailto:af...@ics-il.net *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 1:23 PM *To:* af@afmug.com mailto:af@afmug.com *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC 5150 or DFS? - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com *From: *Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com *To: *af@afmug.com, Jason McKemie j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com *Sent: *Friday, May 15, 2015 1:23:02 PM *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC AC has been getting lower approvals over the past few weeks, check the FCC approvals site. On May 15, 2015 10:20:55 AM AKDT, Jason McKemie j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com wrote: I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason -- Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC
I agree, when Q4 keeps turning into Q4 of some future year, it just doesn't matter anymore... I'm not going to buy anything based on what it might be able to do someday, I'm going to buy what does the job best as it is right now. I can see some cases where Ubiquiti AC may very well be a better choice - even as it is without the lower bands, but overall, I think ePMP is the better product at this point. On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 1:33 PM, Adam Moffett dmmoff...@gmail.com wrote: Agreed. I have no faith in we'll have that feature in Q4 anymore. Yeah, any new product is dead to me until it has those bands. Coming in the future doesn’t cut it. Even if you intend to operate in upper 5 GHz, typically you need the flexibility to operate in 5150 and DFS for testing/commissioning/transitioning. And “trust me, it will be unlocked in future FW once we get approval” doesn’t cut it. I fell for that years ago with the Trango backhaul that ended up needing a hardware change to pass DFS. After that, seeing is believing. I’m not actually from Missouri, but on this topic, I’m a naturalized citizen. *From:* Mike Hammett af...@ics-il.net *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 1:23 PM *To:* af@afmug.com *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC 5150 or DFS? - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- *From: *Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com j...@spitwspots.com *To: *af@afmug.com, Jason McKemie j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com *Sent: *Friday, May 15, 2015 1:23:02 PM *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] ePMP vs Ubiquiti AC AC has been getting lower approvals over the past few weeks, check the FCC approvals site. On May 15, 2015 10:20:55 AM AKDT, Jason McKemie j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com wrote: I know this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but what are other's thoughts on these two products? I'm looking at 5GHz, and I know the AC gear doesn't have the lower 5GHz bands - hopefully they will in the near future. -Jason -- Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
