DIS: Re: BUS: (@various) if I've got my math right...

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 05/06/2022 a las 11:47, Kerim Aydin via agora-business escribió:


I pay a set of 2 win cards to gain 3 winsomes in my possession.

I Take Over the Economy.

-G.

[If my math is right, I've got exactly 48 and Jason (i.e. the OP) has 28.]





Congrats, G.! You've earned this one.

--
Trigon

Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone

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I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: BUS: Re: OFF: [Treasuror] First Victory Auction of March 2022

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 04/04/2022 a las 00:41, Kerim Aydin via agora-business escribió:



On 4/3/2022 5:36 PM, Trigon via agora-business wrote:

El 04/04/2022 a las 00:20, Kerim Aydin via agora-business escribió:


On 4/3/2022 2:53 PM, Trigon via agora-business wrote:

El 03/04/2022 a las 18:36, Kerim Aydin via agora-business escribió:


On 4/2/2022 11:43 PM, Trigon via agora-business wrote:

Kerim Aydin via agora-business escribió:

On 3/31/2022 9:21 AM, secretsnail9 via agora-business wrote:

On Mar 31, 2022, at 10:34 AM, Kerim Aydin via agora-business wrote:
On 3/30/2022 5:34 PM, secretsnail9 via agora-business wrote:

On Mar 30, 2022, at 5:24 PM, Kerim Aydin via agora-business wrote:

On 3/29/2022 6:48 PM, secretsnail9 via agora-business wrote:

On Mar 29, 2022, at 8:19 PM, Kerim Aydin via agora-business wrote:
On 3/29/2022 2:55 PM, secretsnail9 via agora-business wrote:

On Mar 29, 2022, at 2:16 PM, Kerim Aydin via agora-business wrote:
On 3/26/2022 6:21 PM, secretsnail9 via agora-business wrote:
On Sat, Mar 26, 2022 at 7:33 PM Jason Cobb via agora-business wrote:


I bid 15999 coins on the six win card lot.

I bid 16100 coins on the above mentioned lot. (Of 6 win cards)

I bid 17011 coins on the lot of 6 win cards in this auction.

I bid 17021 coins on the lot that had 17011 coins bid on it above.

I bid 18000 coins on that lot.

On that lot, I bid 18301 coins.

On that lot I bid 18,750 coins.

I bid 19002 coins on that lot.

I bid 20001 coins on that lot.

I bid 20102 coins on that there lot.

I bid 21000 coins on that lot.

I bid 22000 coins on this lot.


I bid 22500 on this lot.

I bid 24000 coins on this lot.


I bid 26000 coins on this lot.


I bid 28000 coins on this lot.


I bid 3 coins on this lot.

--
Trigon

Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
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I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: BUS: humble agoran farmer does this just in case

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 03/04/2022 a las 09:35, Madrid via agora-business escribió:

  Be X my amount of blots, I perform the following X times:

If I have 1 BBG, I then I pay 1 BBG to expunge 1 blot.


As mentioned in my previous message, you had no blot-b-gones at this 
point. This message did nothing.


--
Trigon

Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone

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I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: BUS: humble agoran farmer does the blot things

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 01/04/2022 a las 12:59, Madrid via agora-business escribió:

  I do the following if I have 4 Justice Cards: {I cash in a set of 4
Justice Cards to gain 10 Blot-be-gones}

I do the following if I have 3 Justice Cards: {I cash in a set of 3 Justice
Cards to gain 6 Blot-be-gones}

I do the following if I have at least as many blot-be-gones as my amount of
blots: {I pay X blot-be-gones to expunge X blots from myself, where X is my
current amount of blots}

If I have at least 1 blot-be-gone, I do the following: {I transfer 1
blot-be-gone to Aspen}


Dear Agora, please never write a message like this. This makes me 
cross-check so many documents for no good reason.


For the record, it seems that Madrid had seven blots at this point and 
eight BBGs. Aspen received the last one.


--
Trigon

Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone

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I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: OFF: [Herald] HIGH SCORES - Mar 23, 2022 - "Sadly Changeless Official Report" Edition

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 23/03/2022 a las 16:16, nix via agora-official escribió:

Scores as of March 23, 2022

PLACE   NAMESCORE   CHANGE
-   -   --
1st SSN  047
2nd G.   016
3rd JSN  013
4th NIX  005
5th ASP  004
5th AIS  004

All other scores are zero.

Aspen = ASP;  G. = G.;  Jason = JSN;  ais523 = AIS;  nix = NIX;
secretsnail = SSN;

If you'd like to change your three letter name, please let the Herald
know.

List of Recent Changes
--

--
nix
Herald



This is a message noting that this week's edition's acronym spells out 
SCORE.


--
Trigon

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I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: OFF: [Treasuror] First Victory Auction of March 2022

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 26/03/2022 a las 18:52, Trigon via agora-official escribió:
I, Trigon, the Treasuror of Agora Nomic, being authorized by Rule 2654, 
do hereby initiate a Victory Auction.


The first lot is six Win Cards owned by the Lost and Found.

The second lot is one new Win Card.

The currency for this auction shall be the coin.

The procedure for this auction shall be a Selective-Bid Auction, as 
described by the Treasuror's Auction Regulations, which can be found in 
the ACORN at the following link:


<https://mailman.agoranomic.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/agora-official/2022-March/015720.html> 





G.'s intent reminded me about this. I decided to start it by myself 
because I can get it started quicker and because I would really, really 
like to not use the old regulations.


--
Trigon

Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone

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I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: OFF: [Treasuror] Weekly Report 400

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 20/03/2022 a las 23:26, Trigon via agora-official escribió:


   FORBES FOUR HUNDRED
   or   
    TREASUROR'S WEEKLY REPORT



Woo, one hundred reports!

In other news, PLEASE check this one for errors. The likelihood that I 
messed this one up are staggeringly high, so if ANYTHING doesn't look 
right, it is very likely inaccurate. I've had a very tiring weekend, so 
I'm very much not at my best.


Thank you.

--
Trigon

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I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: OFF: [Stonemason] Billboard Rock Chart - 16 Mar 2022

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 16/03/2022 a las 22:05, Jason Cobb via agora-official escribió:

Hot Potato gain 8 coins if transferred to a player who has not
owned the stone since the last time Agora owned it.
Escape risk: immune if wielded 3 or more times
since the last collection notice, else 100%.


Surely this should read "8 boatloads of coins"

--
Trigon

Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

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I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: BUS: [Treasuror] [Auction Regulations] No more invisible time limits

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 28/02/2022 a las 07:33, Trigon via agora-business escribió:
I intend with 2 Agoran consent to make the following changes to the 
Auction Regulations:


In Regulation AM0, do all of the following:

(1) remove the paragraph beginning "RETRIEVAL".

(2) remove the paragraph beginning "RESOLUTION".

(3) change:
   DISTRIBUTION: In a timely fashion after the retrieval period for an
   auction ends, that auction's auctioneer CAN and SHALL, for each 
awardee
   in that auction, destroy the amount to be paid from the inventory 
of that
   awardee and transfer to that player (or create in eir possession 
if the
   item is new) the set of assets associated with the lot e won. 
Failing to
   create or transfer items as described in this paragraph 
constitutes the

   Class 3 Crime of Auction Abandonment.

     to:
   DISTRIBUTION: To distribute lots in an auction is to:
     * publish a reasonably accurate full history of bids on the 
auction and

   withdrawals from the auction, and
     * for each awardee in that auction, revoke the amount to be 
paid from
   that awardee and transfer to that player (or grant em if the 
item is

   new) the set of assets associated with the lot e won.

   The Auctioneer for an auction CAN, by announcement within 
fourteen days

   after the bidding period for an auction ends, and SHALL, in a timely
   fashion after that same point, distribute lots. The message in 
which e

   does so is the "resolution message" for that auction.

(4) replace "retrieval period" with "bidding period" wherever it appears.



To give some context to those who don't hold auctions, the current 
system requires an auctioneer to check in at some point in a small time 
window after four days have passed since the last activity in the 
auction. This has led to a lot of really unfortunate situations for 
auctioneers as it's difficult to remember such an obscure interval even 
exists. This proposal gets rid of that.


It also allows the auctioneer more flexibility with regard to when they 
distribute lots.


All in all, this should make running an auction less logistically intense.

--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: BUS: Re: OFF: [Treasuror] First Victory Auction of February 2022

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 28/02/2022 a las 06:15, Jason Cobb via agora-business escribió:

I bid 2000 coins on the win card.


I bid 2100 coins on the win card.

--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Herald] Call for Peer Reviewers: "Duck Thesis" by Trigon

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 16/02/2022 a las 01:35, nix via agora-discussion escribió:

But a lot of it is
Infinite specific. I think it would be my preference to have an abridged
version that focuses on the bits relevant to the conclusions, but I'm
not going to oppose this thesis based on only that.


This argument bears resemblance to what ais523 also said about the 
conclusions being detatched from a good proportion of the story. I think 
I'll work to finalize my conclusions section and then, once that's done, 
cull parts from the essay which are less relevant to Agora.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
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I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Herald] Call for Peer Reviewers: "Duck Thesis" by Trigon

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 16/02/2022 a las 03:05, ais523 via agora-discussion escribió:

The thesis that was submitted basically has two parts. One is a history
of a particular round of Infinite Nomic, which contains a huge amount
of detail. The other is a set of conclusions, which are more
perfunctory. This combination strikes me as being very awkward for a
thesis, because it makes it harder to see how the conclusions are
supported.


This reading is pretty accurate. I thought I mentioned somewhere -- but 
I may not have -- that the historical essay portion was originally the 
purpose behind writing the document. I wanted to create a time capsule 
for the Infinite Nomic community. Round 9 was a particularly memorable 
time for a lot of us and I wanted to make sure no one lost that memory.


It was not until about halfway through the first drafts that I thought 
about submitting this as a thesis. The document being probably several 
thousand words of narrative at that point, I figured it probably merited 
a degree based simply on how much effort had gone into the project. When 
I brought the question on Discord the Herald and others were quick to 
inform me that a historical essay would probably not merit any 
non-Artistic degree and that if I intended for it to go through 
scholarly channels it had to have some applicability to Nomic as a whole 
and included some context useful for Agorans. It's for this reason the 
analysis section and introduction to Infinite Nomic exists at all: I had 
to make the history applicable to a wider audience.


This is not to say that I saw this as an easy opportunity to get a cheap 
degree -- I fully intended to do all I could to actually earn the title 
by providing genuine insight with my analysis section. Now, that section 
is clearly very far from comprehensive and could probably stand some 
additions, but I wasn't sure which other broad topics to touch on with 
analysis. I assumed that's what peer reviews are for, right?



I think the thesis that this work "wants" to be is as some pieces of
game design advice for nomics, illustrated using incidents that arose
when the advice wasn't followed. (For example, "it's common for there
to be scams based on players deregistering and immediately
reregistering, so you need to either pay attention to these or to limit
how often players can do it", or "it's helpful to ensure that any
hypothetical scam that could be used to break the game can also be used
to win the game, encouraging scammers to pick the less destructive
option".)


This is certainly the kind of discussion I wanted to bring with my 
analysis, though perhaps I did not communicate it so directly. I suppose 
I was aiming more for an encyclopedia of nomic design issues and what 
has/could have been done to solve them rather than a guidebook for 
aspiring nomic gamerunners.



Given that all the examples are drawn from a specific round
of Infinite Nomic, it's thus a lot less comprehensive than it could be.


This would be another great idea for a thesis, but it arguably does not 
fit within the scope of this one which, again, originally sprung up from 
a historical essay focused on one particular round.



In short, I think what's currently written is a long historical
document that's been kind-of shoehorned into being a thesis, and
although it serves its purpose as a history well, there's still a lot
of scope to make it more fitting for the purpose of being a thesis.
Despite there being lots of room for improvement, it might nonetheless
be good enough as it is, though. I'd be onboard with either giving this
a lesser degree, or reworking it to be more analysis heavy and less
fact-heavy in order to make it worthy of a higher degree.


Again, I do intend to put in all the necessary work to make this thesis 
merit the patent title it is to be awarded. Having read your criticisms 
I find myself agreeing that what I have now isn't really fit for that. 
At the same time, the way you propose I effect changes to make this 
happen would go against some of the designs I originally had in writing 
the document, perhaps requiring a significant rewrite to make it 
accomplish this. I trust you understand my hesitance to do that.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
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I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Mad Engineer weekly random rule selection

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 14/02/2022 a las 05:31, ais523 via agora-discussion escribió:

On Mon, 2022-02-14 at 06:29 +0100, nethack4.org dicebot via agora-
business wrote:

The dice roll was: 4
This is R105, Rule Changes.


For reference:
{{{
 [snip]
}}}

IIRC, last time this rule came up (under a previous Device-like rule),
it was very hard to find something appropriate, but the rule has grown
since, and there are now a lot of options. Maybe there's something
interesting out there?



---
s/rule/device/

The new device has power equal to the minimum of
the power specified by the enacting instrument, defaulting to
one if the enacting instrument does not specify or if it
specifies a power less than 0.1, and the maximum power
permitted by other devices.


Does this create a new device with power 1? That could be fun.

---
s/rule/device/

Any ambiguity in the specification of a device change causes that
change to be void and without effect.


Seems like this could lead to funny consequences if we ever flip the 
device again.


---
s/variation/device/

An inconsequential device
in the quotation of an existing rule does not constitute ambiguity
for the purposes of this rule, but any other device does.


I don't even know what this does but any consequential devices 
apparently constitute ambiguities.


---
s/rule/device/

This device provides the only mechanism by which devices can be
created, modified, or destroyed, or by which an entity can become
a device or cease to be a device.


This probably doesn't fail due to precedence because the other rule 
concerning devices is powered the same as this one.


---
s/rule/device/

A device change is any effect that falls into the above classes.


s/change/device

A rule device is any effect that falls into the above classes.


s/class/device

A rule change is any effect that falls into the above devices.


Any time "the above" is mentioned in this rule that can cause some 
really interesting effects. Any of these would be a fun experiment


--
Trigon

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I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Mad Engineer weekly random rule selection

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 07/02/2022 a las 00:09, ais523 via agora-discussion escribió:

On Mon, 2022-02-07 at 01:04 +0100, nethack4.org dicebot via agora-
business wrote:

The dice roll was: 134
This is R2641, Wielding Stones.


For reference:
{{{
   Except as otherwise specified by the rules, the owner of a stone
   CAN wield it by announcement specifying any values needed to
   interpret the stone's effects.
   
   If a stone has a frequency, then it is IMPOSSIBLE to wield that

   stone if it has been previously wielded in the same Agoran time
   interval as indicated by its frequency (e.g. if its frequency is
   daily, if it has been wielded in the same Agoran day).
   
   When a stone is wielded, the Rule defining that stone applies the

   effects in that stone's scroll.
}}}

Any suggestions?



s/stone/device/

   Except as otherwise specified by the rules, the owner of a *device*
   CAN wield it by announcement specifying any values needed to
   interpret the *device*'s effects.


s/rule/device/

   Except as otherwise specified by the *devices*, the owner of a stone
   CAN wield it by announcement specifying any values needed to
   interpret the stone's effects.


s/stone/device/

   When a *device* is wielded, the Rule defining that *device* applies the
   effects in that stone's scroll.
s/scroll/device/>When a stone is wielded, the Rule defining that 
stone applies the

   effects in that stone's *device*.

--
Trigon

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I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: [Obstructive Pooling] Deposit

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 29/01/2022 a las 20:36, Jason Cobb via agora-business escribió:

On 1/29/22 14:12, Falsifian via agora-discussion wrote:

On Sun, Jan 23, 2022 at 05:35:11PM -0500, Jason Cobb via agora-business wrote:

I transfer all of my victory cards and winsomes to Falsifian for the
sole purpose of depositing them in Obstructive Pooling.

--
Jason Cobb

What's a victory card?



If I have any win cards, I transfer all of my win cards to Falsifian for
the sole purpose of depositing them in Obstructive Pooling.



I'm going to say that the first one didn't work. This will be reflected 
in my upcoming report. Feel free to CoE/CFJ.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

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I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: BUS: (@treasuror, @stonemason) stone and focus

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 29/01/2022 a las 18:56, Falsifian via agora-business escribió:

On Mon, Jan 24, 2022 at 12:18:17PM -0500, ATMunn via agora-business wrote:

On 1/23/2022 17:33, Jason Cobb via agora-business wrote:

On 1/23/22 15:28, Kerim Aydin via agora-business wrote:

I grant myself a legislative card (focus).

I wield the wealth stone.

-G.



I grant myself a winsome persuant to my focus.



As do I.


Me too. (Disclaimer: might fail; I don't remember if I already did.)



It does indeed fail. You did this on the third.

--
Trigon

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<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
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I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: BUS: Re: blotting for purpose

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 23/01/2022 a las 22:49, Kerim Aydin via agora-business escribió:


On 1/23/2022 2:45 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote:

I levy a fine of 1 blot on Trigon (by paying a fee of 2 BBG) because e
might be close to winning.

-G.


I, again, levy a fine of 1 blot on Trigon (by paying a fee of 2 BBG)
because e might be close to winning.  -G.





Rude.

--
Trigon

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I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

Re: DIS: Re: (@Tailor, Treasuror) Re: BUS: (@referee) cold hands

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 23/01/2022 a las 21:37, ais523 via agora-discussion escribió:

On Sun, 2022-01-23 at 21:33 +, Trigon via agora-discussion wrote:

Apologies, but I do not understand why I was tagged here. Am I
missing something I need to record?


It was a mistake – sorry for the false alarm. I was under the false
impression that you tracked Blots, and tagged for that reason, but of
course you don't.



No, I really appreciate it! Tagging makes my job a lot easier and I 
appreciate your attempts. Just wanted to make sure I wasn't missing 
anything.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: (@Tailor, Treasuror) Re: BUS: (@referee) cold hands

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 23/01/2022 a las 20:12, ais523 via agora-business escribió:

On Sun, 2022-01-23 at 12:01 -0800, Kerim Aydin via agora-business
wrote:

On 1/13/2022 1:16 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote:

As Prime Minister I appoint Aspen to the office of Speaker.
Congratulations!


I point a finger at myself for failure to perform the above task in a
timely fashion after the requirement arose (as per R103).  I note that
in this case I CANNOT temporarily deputize for the Arbitor to resolve
this, as I am the perp (R2478).


I remind others that I am unable to resolve this.


I temporarily deputise for the Arbitor (the finger was pointed by the
Referee) to impose a CHoJ on G. for this violation, levying a fine of 1
blot. This was not a time-critical violation, was self-reported, and
was fixed by the perp emself, so only a minimal fine is appropriate.

I award myself Cyan Glitter.



Apologies, but I do not understand why I was tagged here. Am I missing 
something I need to record?


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Mad Engineer weekly random rule selection

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 10/01/2022 a las 00:09, ais523 via agora-discussion escribió:

On Mon, 2022-01-10 at 01:05 +0100, nethack4.org dicebot via agora-
business wrote:

The dice roll was: 120
This is R2621, VP Wins.


For reference:
{{{
 If a player has at least 20 more Winsomes than any other player, e
 CAN Take Over the Economy by announcement, provided no person has
 won the game by doing so in the past 30 days.
   
 When a player takes over the economy, e wins the game. Four days

 after such a win occurs, all Cards and all Products are destroyed.
 Then, the winds change, following which each active player gains 1
 card of each type and eir grant (if any).
}}}

Any suggestions?

I note that the first three sentences with "player" → "device" would
allow the device to win every 30 days (as long as there's only one
device and it isn't a player), which seems like the sort of thing an
Agoran device might do, but it'd likely get a little repetitive after a
while. (I guess we could switch it off.) So perhaps we'd want to go for
something else.



Suggestions:

(1) Economy -> device


  If a player has at least 20 more Winsomes than any other player, e
  CAN Take Over the device by announcement, provided no person has
  won the game by doing so in the past 30 day.

(2) win -> device


  Four days after such a device occurs, all Cards and all Products are >
   destroyed.


(3) wind -> device


Then, the devices change, following which each active player gains 1
card of each type and eir grant (if any).


These last two don't seem like they'd do anything, but they might 
depending on what comes before it.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: BUS: [DoV] Dawn of a New Day

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 03/01/2022 a las 02:10, Aspen via agora-business escribió:

Last year, there were a few days that held great personal significance
for me. As of the 13th of September, I had been a player for five
years. Just over a month later, on the 21st of October, I had been
your Promotor for five years as well.

Now, as I watch the winter holiday end and a new year begin in Agora
for the fifth time, I feel something coming over me. I have
accomplished a lot in Agora. I like it here. My fellow players are
pretty cool. The moment these happy thoughts cross my mind, I feel the
inexorable power of my spirit lifting me upward.

I award myself a white ribbon.

I Raise a Banner.

-Aspen



Congratulations, Aspen! A Laudable accomplishment indeed.

--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Mad Engineer weekly random rule selection

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 06/12/2021 a las 18:51, ais523 via agora-discussion escribió:

On Mon, 2021-12-06 at 19:48 +0100, nethack4.org dicebot via agora-
business wrote:

The dice roll was: 39
This is R2125, Regulated Actions.


For reference:
{{{
   An action is regulated if: (1) the Rules limit, allow, enable, or
   permit its performance; (2) the Rules describe the circumstances
   under which the action would succeed or fail; or (3) the action
   would, as part of its effect, modify information for which some
   player is required to be a recordkeepor.
   
   A Regulated Action CAN only be performed as described by the

   Rules, and only using the methods explicitly specified in the
   Rules for performing the given action. The Rules SHALL NOT be
   interpreted so as to proscribe unregulated actions.
}}}

Any suggestions?

An action is regulated if: (1) the devices limit, allow, enable, or 
permit its performance; (2) the devices describe the circumstances under 
which the action would succeed or fail; or (3) the action would, as part 
of its effect, modify information for which some player is required to 
be a recordkeepor.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Mad Engineer weekly random rule selection

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 29/11/2021 a las 07:19, ais523 via agora-discussion escribió:

On Mon, 2021-11-29 at 08:17 +0100, nethack4.org dicebot via agora-
business wrote:

The dice roll was: 92
This is R2528, Voting Methods.


For reference:
{{{
   Each Agoran decision has a voting method, which must be
   AI-majority, instant runoff, or first-past-the-post. The voting
   method is that specified by the authorizing authority, or
   first-past-the-post by default.
   
   Each Agoran decision has a set of valid options (the choices that

   the voters are being asked to select from) and valid votes (the
   ways in which the voters can express their opinion or lack
   thereof. For AI-majority decisions, the valid options are FOR and
   AGAINST; for other decisions, the valid options are defined by
   other rules.
   
   The valid votes on an Agoran decision are:
   
   1. PRESENT;
   
   2. The valid conditional votes, as defined by rules of power at

  least that of this rule; and
   
   3. For an instant runoff decision, the ordered lists of entities.
   
   4. For any other decision, the valid options.

}}}

Any suggestions?



Not much that seems too impactful, but here are some random ideas:

"Each Agoran decision has a voting device, which must be AI-majority, 
instant runoff, or first-past-the-post."


"Each Agoran device has a voting method, which must be AI-majority, 
instant runoff, or first-past-the-post."


"Each Agoran decision has a set of valid options (the choices that the 
devices are being asked to select from) and valid votes (the ways in 
which the devices can express their opinion or lack thereof."


"Each Agoran device has a set of valid options (the choices that the 
voters are being asked to select from) and valid votes (the ways in 
which the voters can express their opinion or lack thereof."


"The valid devices on an Agoran decision are:
 1. PRESENT;
 2. The valid conditional devices, as defined by rules of power at least
that of this rule; and
 3. For an instant runoff decision, the ordered lists of entities.
 4. For any other decision, the valid options."

"The valid votes on an Agoran device are:
 1. PRESENT;
 2. The valid conditional votes, as defined by rules of power at least
that of this rule; and
 3. For an instant runoff device, the ordered lists of entities.
 4. For any other device, the valid options."

--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Mad Engineer weekly random rule selection

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 15/11/2021 a las 15:02, ais523 via agora-discussion escribió:

On Mon, 2021-11-15 at 16:00 +0100, nethack4.org dicebot via agora-
business wrote:

Lots of nice short sentences here, so it may well be possible to come
up with something that works quite well.



Suggestions:

(1) funny, but may take a lot of upkeep from officers

When an open device's judge is unassigned, the Arbitor CAN assign any
eligible player to be its judge by announcement, and SHALL do so in a > timely 
fashion after it becomes an open and unassigned device.


(2) similar appeal, but less upkeep

If a device has no judge assigned, then any player eligible to judge > that 
device CAN assign it to emself without 3 objections.


either of these could lead to fun CFJs.

--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: BUS: Re: OFF: [Treasuror] [Weekly Report] Forbes 416

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 01/11/2021 a las 15:44, Kerim Aydin via agora-business escribió:


On 10/31/2021 4:40 PM, Trigon via agora-official wrote:

 Player(+a)  cn wcjclcvcwsbgpdvt
   ==  ==                



   Telna0 1 2 0 1 0 0 1 0


CoE on cards/products:  Telna is not a player so doesn't have this stuff.



Accepted. I never recorded that bit of Telna's message for some reason. 
It is now fixed in my local copy.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: OFF: [Stonemason] November Stone Auction

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 07/11/2021 a las 22:30, Jason Cobb via agora-official escribió:

I initiate a tone auction


I bid 1 coin on E-flat and 1 coin on C.

--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

Re: DIS: Zulip Testing

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 03/11/2021 a las 05:00, Jason Cobb via agora-discussion escribió:

I've set up a self-hosted zulip server for testing. I've never run or
used zulip before, so I can't guarantee that it will be stable and I
can't guarantee that I won't have to wipe the whole thing (though I'll
try hard not to, now that there's a little bit of actual stuff on it).

There is, of course, a nomic on there already. Feel free to join and
mess around.

Invite link:
https://agora-zulip.randomcat.org/join/irl2lks6o7ndf7wgux3uf45j/



For anyone unfamiliar, Zulip is a Free and Open Source chat system that 
I've had my eyes on for years as a potential nomic platform. It has 
strong message threading support, to the extent that it feels like a 
hybrid between mailing list and instant messenger. I think it's a really 
awesome idea and am elated to have a chance to play around with it, so 
definitely join up if you're at all interested.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: is this thing on

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

This is a test message. I just sent my Treasuror weekly and would like 
to see if any of the lists are working for me.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Mad Engineer weekly random rule selection

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 11/10/2021 a las 00:15, ais523 via agora-discussion escribió:

   For each type of Ribbon,  Ribbon Ownership is a secured
   negative boolean person switch, tracked by the Tailor in eir
   monthly report.


"For each type of Device,  Device Ownership is a secured negative 
boolean person switch, tracked by the Tailor in eir monthly report."


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Promotor] Distribution of Proposals 8607-8629

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 04/10/2021 a las 05:10, Ørjan Johansen via agora-discussion escribió:

On Sun, 3 Oct 2021, Aspen via agora-official wrote:


//
ID: 8625
Title: giving the gift of an amendment
Adoption index: 1.0
Author: Trigon
Co-author(s):


[ COMMENT: Introduces a new term of art so that we don't have to worry
  about messing up the wording for giving a birthday gift again. ]

Amend Rule 2585 "Birthday Gifts" by replacing:

 During a player's Agoran Birthday and the 7 days following, each
 other player CAN once grant em X boatloads of coins by
 announcement, where X is 3 if it is actually the day of the
 player's birthday, and 2 otherwise.

with:

 During a player's Agoran Birthday and the 7 days following, each
 other player CAN once give that player a birthday gift, granting
 em 3 boatloads of coins if it is actually the day of the player's
 birthday, or 2 otherwise.


This seems to have dropped an essential "by announcement".

Greetings,
Ørjan.


Crap. This is my error, not Aspen's. I remember that someone brought it 
up at some point after I submitted my proposal and that I just never got 
around to fixing it. But yeah, that's pretty clearly broken. Sincerest 
apologies.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: BUS: Re: OFF: CFJs 3929 and 3930 Assigned to Jason [attn. Tailor] (attn Treasuror)

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 03/10/2021 a las 20:36, Edward Murphy via agora-official escribió:

I wrote:


Jason wrote:


Judgement in CFJ 3929:
I award myself blue glitter.


I award 6 BoC (156 coins) to Jason.


Judgement in CFJ 3930:
I award myself blue glitter.


I award another 6 BoC (156 coins) to Jason.


If these were ineffective due to using the old UoF, then I award 6 BoC
(186 coins) to Jason, then another 6 BoC (186 coins) to Jason.


They were not. Writing the raw number of coins is behind a SHOULD. It's 
simply a convenience thing for the Treasuror, though my code handles the 
real calculations these days.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: BUS: Re: Benbot? travels in! (Reply)

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 03/10/2021 a las 16:52, BenjaminFrancis Rodriguez via agora-business 
escribió:

On Sun, Oct 3, 2021 at 9:39 AM 
wrote:



--

Message: 7
Date: Sun, 3 Oct 2021 09:39:25 -0400
From: BenjaminFrancis Rodriguez 
To: "agora-busin...@agoranomic.org" 
Subject: BUS: Benbot? travels in!
Message-ID:
 <
caaqah+89n3jza8imcco8a-by1q1e-7gcfi72yvgav_3mmif...@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"

This email declares (soon to be) player Benbot? intention to join the game
under Alias Benbot?



The question marks are supposed to be Squared (Asci) Symbols.



I received them as squared symbols. It might just be an issue with your 
client.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

[Proto-Proposal] Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Re: OFF: CFJs 3929 and 3930 Assigned to Jason

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 27/09/2021 a las 15:52, Kerim Aydin via agora-discussion escribió:


On 9/23/2021 10:00 PM, Jason Cobb via agora-business wrote:

However, Rule 2140 is not the only Rule that governs how lower-powered
Rules affect higher-powered Rules. Rule 217's second paragraph states
when lower-powered definitions may affect higher-powered Rules.


I don't think it's correct to call Rule 1769 the "definition" of the term
holiday for R217 purposes.  Words like "holiday" aren't chosen randomly as
a term of art, they mean something.

In common language, a holiday is a special time period during which
special legal rules may apply.  Rule 1769 nonexclusively declares a couple
time periods to be holidays and (also nonexclusively) describes some
particular Agoran legal rules for holidays. That doesn't make it the
"definition" of a holiday, but rather wholly supports the common usage.

A lower-powered rule couldn't override this high-level common usage (by
declaring a person to be a holiday for example, out of keeping with the
common definition) but it's wholly in keeping with that R1769 usage, and
not at all "in conflict", to declare additional time periods to be holidays.

-G.



Seeing as this has been the dominating topic of conversation on the 
discord for days, we deserve a proper resolution.


---
Proto: Defining Holidays

Amend Rule 1769 "Holidays" by prepending the following paragraph:

An Agoran Holiday (or simply a Holiday) is a time period defined as such 
by the rules.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Mad Engineer weekly random rule selection

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 27/09/2021 a las 00:15, ais523 via agora-discussion escribió:

Any suggestions?


"The device SHOULD attempt to deregister players who meet this condition."

I really hoped this rule would hold the key to making the device a 
person. I don't think any one sentence from it could be construed to do 
so, however.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: OFF: [Treasuror] Buoyancy Notification: September 2021

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 25/09/2021 a las 18:42, Trigon via agora-official escribió:

===[ AUTOMATED MESSAGE ]===

This is a message from the Treasuror's Inflation-Generating
Observation Network (TRIGON).

The Total Buoyancy has just been changed to:

=> 6

This makes the Unit of Flotation:

=> 27

Please plan accordingly.



Please ignore this. I just changed the OS on the Raspberry Pi that is 
sending these messages. I was trying to get my SMTP client to work, and 
I forgot to update the "To" header so that it wouldn't send to the 
lists. Sincerest apologies


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Mad Engineer weekly random rule selection

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 20/09/2021 a las 00:20, ais523 via agora-discussion escribió:

On Mon, 2021-09-20 at 02:17 +0200, nethack4.org dicebot wrote:

The dice roll was: 34
This is R1789, Cantus Cygneus.


For reference:
{{{
   Whenever a Player feels that e has been treated so egregiously by
   the Agoran community that e can no longer abide to be a part of
   it, e may submit a document to the Registrar, clearly labeled a
   Cantus Cygneus, detailing eir grievances and expressing eir
   reproach for those who e feels have treated em so badly.
   
   In a timely fashion after receiving a Cantus Cygneus, the

   Registrar shall publish this document along with a Writ of
   Fugiendae Agorae Grandissima Exprobratione, commanding the Player
   to be deregistered. The Registrar shall note the method of
   deregistration for that Player in subsequent Registrar monthly
   Reports.
   
   The Player is deregistered as of the posting of the Writ, and the

   notation in the Registrar's monthly report will ensure that,
   henceforth, all may know said Player deregistered in a Writ of
   FAGE.
}}}

Any ideas?



The Registrar shall note the method of deregistration for that Player in 
subsequent Registrar *device* Reports.


Not the best but it might force the Registrar also track the device, 
which would be funny.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: BUS: Use Them Or Lose Them (@Referee)

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 19/09/2021 a las 04:51, Jason Cobb via agora-business escribió:

On 9/19/21 00:31, Trigon via agora-business wrote:

I'm pretty sure that my expunging didn't work earlier because R. Lee
failed to actually blot me. So I should have one more blot-be-gone. If I
do, I spend it to expunge a blot from myself.



This fails. The economic reset occurred before you sent this message.



Dang it, the timer I was using to count down to the reset started 
counting up and I thought is still had time. Oh well.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: [Proto] Re: BUS: Happy Birthday to me!

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 16/09/2021 a las 18:28, Trigon escribió:

El 16/09/2021 a las 18:10, Jason Cobb via agora-business escribió:

On 9/16/21 09:06, Jason Cobb wrote:

On 9/16/21 04:42, Aspen via agora-business wrote:

I am honored to have completed my fifth year as a player, as my Agoran
birthday was a few days ago, on the 13th. I'm glad to be part of this
amazing game and hope to be a player for many more years to come.

-Aspen


Happy birthday!

I cause Aspen to receive 3 boatloads of coins.



This failed.


Happy birthday!

I cause Aspen to receive 2 boatloads of coins.


I grant Aspen 2 boatloads of coins. Happy birthday!



This is clearly not ideal. Proto-proposal:

---
Title: giving the gift of an amendment
Author: Trigon
Coauthors:
AI: 1

[ COMMENT: Introduces a new term of art so that we don't have to worry
  about messing up the wording for giving a birthday gift again. ]

Amend Rule 2585 "Birthday Gifts" by replacing:

  During a player's Agoran Birthday and the 7 days following, each
  other player CAN once grant em X boatloads of coins by
  announcement, where X is 3 if it is actually the day of the
  player's birthday, and 2 otherwise.

with:

  During a player's Agoran Birthday and the 7 days following, each
  other player CAN once give that player a birthday gift, granting
  em 3 boatloads of coins if it is actually the day of the player's
  birthday, or 2 otherwise.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Stonemason] September Stone Auction Resolution

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 13/09/2021 a las 18:22, ais523 via agora-discussion escribió:

On Mon, 2021-09-13 at 09:55 -0400, Jason Cobb via agora-official wrote:

This auction was a selective-bid auction. The awardees are as
follows:

[Power Stone] -> Jason for 600 coins
[Wealth Stone]-> ais523 for 656 coins
[Concentration Stone] -> Jason for 600 coins


Just to confirm, because I don't have much experience with Agoran
auctions: I will be given the Wealth Stone automatically some time in
the next few days, as long as I hold onto the coins to pay for it, with
no action necessary by myself; but I don't have it yet?



That is accurate, yes. Specifically, Jason can effect said changes 
starting seven days after the last bid or withdrawal.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Mad Engineer] Weekly Rule: Rule 2493/8 (Regulations)

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 08/09/2021 a las 17:28, ais523 via agora-discussion escribió:

On Wed, 2021-09-08 at 17:19 +, Trigon via agora-discussion wrote:

That being said, my suggestions are:


A regulation CAN be enacted, amended, and repealed as specified by
its parent [device].

[snip]

By default, a [device] CAN, with 2 Agoran consent, enact, amend, or
repeal a regulation for which e is the Promulgator.


Now that I think of it, this is probably just a weaker version of
the above, requiring a specific method, though arguably more legally
defensible.


Speaking from experience: the latter version here is much better. The
former would most likely either do nothing or allow the creation of
arbitrary regularions, which would in turn most likely either do
nothing or lead to a dictatorship scam.

In a Monster-style rule, the most powerful effects effectively do
nothing, because you can't link them up to things without risking them
becoming overpowered. So limitations like Agoran Consent are the sort
of thing you really want to snag while they're available.


Extremely valid points. I hadn't considered that, but it is important to 
note.



(As a side note, the Device becoming a person is likely to be almost
inevitable, unless it self-destructs early. It has the sort of allure
that you can't keep the Agoran public away from once it becomes
possible.)


We've discussed ways to do this on discord as well. I agree that it's 
got to happen at some point.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: OFF: [Mad Engineer] Weekly Rule: Rule 2493/8 (Regulations)

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 08/09/2021 a las 16:02, Kerim Aydin via agora-official escribió:


The Mad Engineer pick of the week (see botspam on Discord for the die
roll).  Soliciting suggestions for the Device (in DIS or in discord).  If
your suggestion is used I will give you 1 BoC.

Rule 2493/8 (Power=3)
Regulations

   A regulation is an textual entity defined as such by this rule,
   and under the authority of an person, known as its Promulgator. A
   regulation must be authorized by a rule (its parent rule) in order
   to exist. It has only the effect that rule explicitly gives it.

   A regulation CAN be enacted, amended, and repealed as specified by
   its parent rule. By default, a person CAN, with 2 Agoran consent,
   enact, amend, or repeal a regulation for which e is the
   Promulgator. Regulations are tracked by the Rulekeepor as part of
   eir weekly and monthly reports in a fashion similar to rules.



The real trick here is somehow granting players the ability to 
promulgate regulations using the device. I don't think we can get all 
the way there yet, but with some luck we'll be able to worry about what 
we don't put in this rule another time.


That being said, my suggestions are:


A regulation CAN be enacted, amended, and repealed as specified by its parent 
[device].
In this case, for the device to be able to do anything we need to get it 
to "specify" regulation changes, which shouldn't be too difficult -- 
only as difficult as a person specifying the text of a proposal. I think 
that this plus some future method to act on behalf of the device should 
cover our bases.



By default, a [device] CAN, with 2 Agoran consent, enact, amend, or repeal a 
regulation for which e is the Promulgator.


Now that I think of it, this is probably just a weaker version of the 
above, requiring a specific method, though arguably more legally defensible.


There is the admittedly rather large hurdle that regulation promulgators 
must be persons. In order to have device regulations using either of my 
suggestions, we need to make the device a person and enable players to 
somehow act on behalf of the device to specify or intend regulation changes.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: BUS: [Assessor] Resolution of Proposals 8596-8601 (attn Treasuror)

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

El 08/09/2021 a las 00:24, Edward Murphy via agora-business escribió:

Jason wrote:

The following sponsored adopted proposals have the highest popularity 
(1.000): 8599 (by G.), 8600 (by G.), 8601 (by Murphy).


I gain a Legislative Card (may be too late, trying anyway in case not.


)

It did not work. The window was seven days from 30 August; that period 
ended on 6 September.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Trading with Trigon [attn. Treasuror, Referee]

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 01/09/2021 13:05, ATMunn via agora-discussion wrote:

On 9/1/2021 00:00, Aspen via agora-discussion wrote:

On Tue, Aug 31, 2021 at 8:57 PM Trigon via agora-business <
agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:


On 01/09/2021 03:55, Trigon wrote:

On 01/09/2021 02:46, Trigon wrote:

On 01/09/2021 02:43, Aspen via agora-business wrote:

I grant the Library the following promise:

{
Cashing condition: if this promise is cached, by the end of the
message in
which this promise is cashed, the bearer will have transferred 5
blot-b-gones to me.

I transfer two justice cards to the bearer.
}

-Aspen



I cash this promise.

I pay a set of four Justice Cards to create in my possession a set of
ten Blot-B-Gones.

I transfer five Blot-B-Gones to Aspen and thank em for doing business
with me.



Ineffective. I did not have the promise, the library did.

I transfer the quoted promise from the library to myself, then I cash
that promise, pay a set of 4jc to get 10bg, and transfer 5bg to Aspen.



And while I'm here, I expunge one blot from myself by destroying a
blot-b-gone.





--
Trigon



Flagging for the Referee.

Also, I expunge two blots from myself, destroying a blot-b-gone for each.

-Aspen



NttPF.



I don't know what you mean. It hit the a-b archive.

https://mailman.agoranomic.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/agora-business/2021-September/047363.html

--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: BUS: Poll: Ruleset Receiving

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 31/08/2021 02:39, Jason Cobb via agora-business wrote:

Has anybody been not receiving rulesets? Telna says on Discord that e
has only been receiving ACORNs.



For everyone not following this story, the rulesets were just landing in 
Telna's spam folder. No need to worry about this anymore.


But for the record, I have been receiving them.

--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: [Proto-Proposal] A way to limit the ways we can act

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

---
Title: pledge(2)
Author: Trigon
Coauthors:
AI: 3

[ COMMENT: The gist of this idea is that players can choose for some
  part of their messages which actions should succeed and which actions
  should fail. Hopefully, this would be integrated gracefully into the
  rest of the rules, but that's a lot of SHALLs to sort through to
  decide which should be scoped actions. Comments can be found
  throughout. ]

Enact a new Power=3 rule entitled "Scopes" with text:

  Players CAN take actions in a specific scope. When a player does
  so, e must either clearly and unambiguously describe a list of
  allowed actions or a list of prohibited actions for that scope, or
  e must refer to a source which clearly and unambiguously defines
  such a list. E must also clearly and unambiguously specify when e
  begins acting in that scope and when e finishes acting in that
  scope.

  Actions within a scope which are prohibited or not allowed are
  blocked actions, while actions which are allowed or not prohibited
  are unblocked actions.

[ COMMENT: I'm not sure what I think of this terminology. ]

  When a player is acting within a specific scope, if an action
  which would otherwise succeed is blocked within that scope, then
  that action instead fails.

  If, when taking actions within a scope, the performing player
  allows indirection, actions whose end results are solely to
  initiate one or more unblocked actions within that scope succeed
  as well.

  If, when taking actions within a scope, the performing player
  prohibits partial successes, if one action within the scope
  would fail, then all actions within the scope fail.

  If, when taking actions within a scope, the performing player
  allows acting on behalf, then acting on behalf to perform an
  unblocked action within that scope succeeds as well.

[ COMMENT: There's got to be a way to phrase these scope modifiers
  better, right? ]

  The following scopes are defined:

[ COMMENT: These are just random suggestions , though I think they are
  useful. Feel free to suggest more. ]

  * Global scope: all actions are allowed in this scope.

[ COMMENT: This should also allow players to say something like "I act
  in the global scope, disallowing partial success, to do the following:
  {...}" instead of "If all the following succeed I do this: {...}".
  I think that it's elegant, if a bit wordy. Suggestions for better
  terminology for scopes are welcome. ]

  * Transaction scope: when acting in this scope, only transfers of
assets are allowed.
  * Economic scope: when acting in this scope, creation,
destruction, and transfers of assets are allowed.
  * Official scope: for a specified office, only actions mandated by
the rules for that office succeed.

[ COMMENT: This is a rather broad specification, but it might allow us
  to write something like "When the rules say an Officer CAN do
  something, then e does so in that Office's scope", though whether we
  want to is another question. ]

[ COMMENT: So what do you think? I like the idea, but executing actions
  within a scope is wordy. As is the proposed rule. With no comments,
  it's still over 40 lines long. Suggestions to make either more
  succinct are very welcome. ]

--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: [Treasuror] [Proto-Auction Regulations] various fixes

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

I intend to apply the following, with 2 Agoran consent, as a single 
amendment to Regulation AM0:


---

[ Comment: Makes the post-auction phase a lot more convenient for all
  involved. ]

In AM0, replace the paragraph beginning "DISTRIBUTION:" with the
following two paragraphs:

  RESOLUTION: The auctioneer for an auction SHALL, during that
  auction's retrieval period, create a public message (henceforth
  the "resolution message") that contains a full history of bids on
  the auction and withdrawals from the auction. It must also clearly
  indicate who each awardee would be if all players were funded, as
  well as the lot each one would recieve. Failing to publish a
  resolution message constitutes the Class 3 Crime of Auction
  Negligence.

  DISTRIBUTION: In a timely fashion after the retrieval period for
  an auction ends, that auction's auctioneer CAN and SHALL, for each
  awardee in that auction, destroy the amount to be paid from the
  inventory of that awardee and transfer to that player (or create
  in eir possession if the item is new) the set of assets associated
  with the lot e won. Failing to create or transfer items as
  described in this paragraph constitutes the Class 3 Crime of
  Auction Abandonment.

[ Comment: Fixes an issue introduced in the last round of amendments
  which removed the requirement to specify an amount of currency in a
  bid. It is almost certainly meaningless because all the regulations
  dealing with what the bid means specify "that bid's amount," so any
  bids not specifying an amount of currency don't really mean anything.
  If that doesn't protect us, the good faith clause does. ]

In that same regulation, replace the text of the paragraph beginning 
"BIDDING:" with:


  BIDDING: Players CAN place a bid on an auction in its bidding
  period by creating a public message (henceforth a "bid message")
  specifying an amount of that auction's currency. Players CAN
  withdraw from an open auction by announcement.

--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Re: OFF: CFJ 3924 Assigned to Cuddlebeam [@Cuddlebeam]

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 15/08/2021 22:34, Edward Murphy via agora-business wrote:

Cuddlebeam wrote:


I also claim Blue Glitter.


I award 7 boatloads of coins (154 coins) to Cuddlebeam.


Cuddlebeam's glitter claim failed. It would have worked if e had claimed 
the ribbon after eir first judgement of the case and then claimed the 
glitter after eir second judgement, so the quoted actions fail.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: [Treasuror] [Proto-Auction Regulations] various fixes

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

Submitting these in 24 hours if I don't receive any comments.

---

[ Comment: Makes the post-auction phase a lot more convenient for all
  involved. ]

In AM0, replace the paragraph beginning "DISTRIBUTION:" with the
following two paragraphs:

  RESOLUTION: The auctioneer for an auction SHALL, during that
  auction's retrieval period, create a public message (henceforth
  the "resolution message") that contains a full history of bids on
  the auction and withdrawals from the auction. It must also clearly
  indicate who each awardee would be if all players were funded, as
  well as the lot each one would recieve. Failing to publish a
  resolution message constitutes the Class 3 Crime of Auction
  Negligence.

  DISTRIBUTION: In a timely fashion after the retrieval period for
  an auction ends, that auction's auctioneer CAN and SHALL, for each
  awardee in that auction, destroy the amount to be paid from the
  inventory of that awardee and transfer to that player (or create
  in eir possession if the item is new) the set of assets associated
  with the lot e won. Failing to create or transfer items as
  described in this paragraph constitutes the Class 3 Crime of
  Auction Abandonment.

[ Comment: Fixes an issue introduced in the last round of amendments
  which removed the requirement to specify an amount of currency in a
  bid. It is almost certainly meaningless because all the regulations
  dealing with what the bid means specify "that bid's amount," so any
  bids not specifying an amount of currency don't really mean anything.
  If that doesn't protect us, the good faith clause does. ]

In that same regulation, replace the text of the paragraph beginning 
"BIDDING:" with:


  BIDDING: Players CAN place a bid on an auction in its bidding
  period by creating a public message (henceforth a "bid message")
  specifying an amount of that auction's currency. Players CAN
  withdraw from an open auction by announcement.

--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>
<https://agoranomic.org/AgoraQuest>

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: BUS: [SNOCS] @Treasuror @ATMunn @omd Victory Exchange

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 08/08/2021 20:32, Falsifian via agora-business wrote:

I consent to and join the SNOCS contract (Simple, No-Opportunity-Cost
sets). (I think I was already a member.)

I Pool Cards, by doing all of the following:

{

I nominate the following four cards:
- Two of my Victory Cards.
- One of ATMunn's Victory Cards.
- One of omd's Victory Cards.

I act on behalf of ATMunn and then omd to transfer 1 Victory Card from
each of them to myself.

I pay a set of four Victory Cards to gain 10 Victory Points.

I transfer two Victory Points to ATMunn and two Victory Points to omd.
I transfer four Victory Points to myself (meaning: I do nothing).

Using AgoraBot's !rng, I have determined that the two remaining Victory
Points shall moth go to me.

I transfer two VPs to myself (meaning: I do nothing).

}



Regrettably, this failed. Per CFJ 3924's judgement, the original victory 
card grant was INEFFECTIVE, thus at the time this action was attempted 
you did not have two victory cards to nominate. I sincerely apologize 
for the errors.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

Re: DIS: testing

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 09/08/2021 05:40, Sarah S. via agora-discussion wrote:

"hahaha yes" - sickos



I object.

--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Re: OFF: [Treasuror] [Victory Auction] Resolution of July 2021 VA 2

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 06/08/2021 22:44, Trigon via agora-discussion wrote:

On 06/08/2021 22:37, ais523 via agora-business wrote:

Gratuitous arguments: By rule 2577, you can gratuitously revoke coins
from yourself (because "revoke" is a synonym for "destroy in the
possession of", and coins are destructible). Regulation AM0 has a "CAN
and SHALL" for destroying the payment and creating/transferring the
purchased asset – the creation is only possible if done simultaneously
with a destruction of the correct size. So this case hinges on whether
the correct interpretation of the message in question is as a
correctly-sized revoke combined with a gratuitous destruction of
additional coins, or not.


Fortunately for the judge, it's a little more clear-cut. It *would* 
hinge on that if I had correctly specified that I was transferring the 
Justice Card from the Lost and Found to myself; instead, I treated it as 
if it were new. Unless there is some clause allowing me to grant myself 
a justice card, we don't have to go down this line of inquiry.

Rule 478 requires actions by announcement to specify the action that's
being taken, clearly and unambiguously. I don't think this message can
reasonably be interpreted as specifying the action of "discard 578
coins" to that standard – and doing so would be required in order for
it to succeed – so I think the whole thing fails.


I'm inclined to agree with you on this point, however.



That is to say, I'm inclined to agree with this reasoning.

--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: BUS: Re: OFF: [Treasuror] [Victory Auction] Resolution of July 2021 VA 2

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 06/08/2021 22:37, ais523 via agora-business wrote:

Gratuitous arguments: By rule 2577, you can gratuitously revoke coins
from yourself (because "revoke" is a synonym for "destroy in the
possession of", and coins are destructible). Regulation AM0 has a "CAN
and SHALL" for destroying the payment and creating/transferring the
purchased asset – the creation is only possible if done simultaneously
with a destruction of the correct size. So this case hinges on whether
the correct interpretation of the message in question is as a
correctly-sized revoke combined with a gratuitous destruction of
additional coins, or not.


Fortunately for the judge, it's a little more clear-cut. It *would* 
hinge on that if I had correctly specified that I was transferring the 
Justice Card from the Lost and Found to myself; instead, I treated it as 
if it were new. Unless there is some clause allowing me to grant myself 
a justice card, we don't have to go down this line of inquiry.

Rule 478 requires actions by announcement to specify the action that's
being taken, clearly and unambiguously. I don't think this message can
reasonably be interpreted as specifying the action of "discard 578
coins" to that standard – and doing so would be required in order for
it to succeed – so I think the whole thing fails.


I'm inclined to agree with you on this point, however.

--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Proto-Auction Regulation Fix (was: Resolution of July 2021 VA 2)

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 06/08/2021 22:17, Trigon via agora-business wrote:
CFJ: The quoted message is a distribution message as outlined in 
Regulation AM0.


ARGUMENTS: This may not be a distribution message because of a textual 
error: I intended to award myself a new justice card for a price 578 
coins greater that what I bid on it. What, if anything, did this message 
do? Did it fail as it did not meet the criteria for a distribution 
message? Did the distribution message succeed and I just violated the 
"SHALL destroy and transfer" bit?


EVIDENCE:

Ambiguous quoted text:


Trigon wins the second lot for 50cn.

...

If all of the following succeed I do them:
{ I revoke from Trigon 628cn. I grant em one justice card. }


Relevant part of AM0:

   DISTRIBUTION: The auctioneer for an auction CAN and SHALL, within
   seven days of the ending of that auction's retrieval period,
   create a public message (henceforth the "distribution message")
   that contains a full history of bids on the auction and
   withdrawals from the auction. It must also clearly indicate each
   awardee and the lot e recieves. In this message, the auctioneer
   CAN and SHALL destroy the amount to be paid from the inventory
   each awardee and transfer to that player (or create in eir
   possession if the item is new) the set of assets associated with
   the lot e won. Failing to publish a distribution message
   constitutes the Class 3 Crime of Auction Abandonment.



I think that the solution to making sure something like this doesn't 
happen again is to split the parts of the message up. This also has the 
advantage of letting people into the loop earlier about who should be 
preparing to receive the lots.


-

In AM0, replace the paragraph beginning "DISTRIBUTION:" with the
following two paragraphs:

  RESOLUTION: The auctioneer for an auction SHALL, during that
  auction's retrieval period, create a public message (henceforth
  the "resolution message") that contains a full history of bids on
  the auction and withdrawals from the auction. It must also clearly
  indicate who each awardee would be if all players were funded, as
  well as the lot each one would recieve. Failing to publish a
  resolution message constitutes the Class 3 Crime of Auction
  Negligence.

  DISTRIBUTION: In a timely fashion after the retrieval period for
  an auction ends, that auction's auctioneer CAN and SHALL, for each
  awardee in that auction, destroy the amount to be paid from the
  inventory of that awardee and transfer to that player (or create
  in eir possession if the item is new) the set of assets associated
  with the lot e won.

--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: BUS: [proposal] decimation

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 06/08/2021 03:44, Ned Strange via agora-business wrote:

There are too many coins. let's delete some. This will do nothing but u
know aesthetics.

I create and pend the following proposal by using a pendant

Title: decimation times 9
Ai 1
Text
Create a power 1 rule called "temporary inflation reduction" with the text
"At the end of the month this rule was adopted, each entity's coin balance
is divided by 10, rounded to the nearest whole number. This rule then
automatically repeals itself."



This neglects the buoyancy variables. They'll still be at their normal 
values until the start of the next month. If this passes, this will be 
the equivalent of 220 current coins per boatload. That will destabilize 
everything.


Furthermore, if there are any auctions going on when this passes, we 
will all have bid far over what we intended. There isn't really an easy 
way to counteract that if there are no special cases, other than to all 
agree to bid using new values and potentially screw someone over who 
isn't in on the plan. I'd prefer to give auction bids a special case if 
we want to pass this.


Also, I remember back when we were hashing out this system, we mentioned 
including special cases for specific contracts whose values are 
contingent on exact values in coins. Perhaps we should also discuss that 
before this goes up for vote.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: [Proto-Contract] The Protector of Stones

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

This is an idea for a contract allowing me to auction off usages of the 
Protection Stone. It's a bit unwieldy (hah) and I'm also fine to work 
out smaller temporary deals by private means.


{{{
Any player can join this contract. Players CANNOT leave this contract
during auction time.

The owner of the Protection Stone is known as the Protector. The
Protector CAN, during free time, amend this contract with notice.

Protection shards are a class of untracked, nontransferrable assets,
ownable only by players. At the end of each Agoran month all protection
shards are destroyed.

The Protector CAN, during free time, start an auction for a new
protection shard. The Protector CAN distribute prizes for such an
auction if it is within the final day of the Agoran month, regardless of
the definition of the auction method e chooses. Parties to this contract
consent to acting on behalf for transferral of assets pertaining to this
type of auction.

The owner of a protection shard CAN destroy it to act on behalf of the
Protector to wield the Protection Stone, specifying all required
parameters.

It is free time while there are no auctions ongoing which were started
by this contract. It is auction time when it is not free time.
}}}

--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

Re: BUS: Re: DIS: Re: BAK: Trying to get on board

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 02/08/2021 19:46, Kerim Aydin via agora-discussion wrote:

"Recommend against" might be too general.  Selling might be a good
strategy depending on your goals (e.g. whether you're trying to win this
time versus selling for coins to hold, and use the coins to win next time).


I think the point was that selling to anyone else would probably be 
preferable to selling to Cuddlebeam.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

Re: BUS: Re: DIS: Re: BAK: Trying to get on board

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 30/07/2021 19:04, Cuddle Beam via agora-business wrote:

  I grant myself a Victory Point.
I act on behalf of Cuddlybanana to grant myself a Victory Point.


Fails. You've already done both of those this month.

--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: BUS: New Rule: Onboarding of Newly Activated Players

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

I think I like the direction you're going with this. With a bit of 
workshopping, I would definitely vote FOR it. For now, though, allow me 
to make some comments.


On 27/07/2021 16:30, D. Wet via agora-business wrote:
I propose to create a new Rule in the Agoran commmunity to be adopted 
according to the current rule adoption procedure. The Rule is:


Onboarding of Newly Activated Players

1. Newly Activated Players MUST be requested to take their first Action 
in a timely fashion after being switched to Active.


You use a "MUST" here. This means that it would become a crime to join 
the game and fail to post for a week (Rule 2152). I would contend that 
this has the opposite effect to what you probably intended: it would 
demoralize new players instead of encouraging them to become more active.


2. Players that are Active less than one month MUST actively be educated 
when their Action is IMPOSSIBLE within the current Ruleset.


I'm not sure this is the best way to phrase this. Again, MUST means that 
it is a rules violation to fail to do the specified action. My best 
interpretation of the wording as-is would probably mean that any player 
who fails to explain the error, including the new player emself, would 
be susceptible to punishment. I am unsure as to what could be done 
instead, but throwing everyone under the bus at once rubs me the wrong 
way, especially since there is a financial incentive for pointing out 
the most crimes in a week (Rule 2478, last paragraph).


3. The education in referred to in 2. MUST contain references to N 
specific Rules numbers as to why their Action is ILLEGAL within the 
current Ruleset. N is at least 1 and at most 3 and NEED NOT to lead to a 
POSSIBLE Action when taken into account during the next try to act.


Any particular reason for capping the number of cited rules at three? If 
it's just to not give the new player too much text to crawl through then 
that's fine; I'd just like to know.


Let me reiterate that I do like this idea. Agora, however, is very picky 
about how rules are phrased, so picking each others' proposals apart is 
a step of the drafting process. Excited to see where this goes!


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

Re: DIS: Suggested Auction Amendment [attn. Treasuror]

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 12/07/2021 21:23, Jason Cobb via agora-discussion wrote:

On 7/12/21 5:13 PM, Trigon via agora-discussion wrote:

I'm not sure your amendment does anything to help here. All it allows is
for different players to submit bids of equal amount as long as they're
on different lots in a selective-bid auction. The bids are still given
out to the Nth active bid, which is the part that is broken, at least to
my understanding.


Yes, that's the purpose of this. Two bidders should be able to have the
same bid on different lots, so that bids aren't accidentally invalid
(this happened in the giant stone auction a few months ago). I forgot
about the other breakage; both things should be fixed.



Noted.

Put a revision out with the universal equal-bid prohibition fixed and 
I'll intend your fix and mine all in one group.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

Re: DIS: Suggested Auction Amendment [attn. Treasuror]

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 12/07/2021 20:49, Jason Cobb via agora-discussion wrote:

This fixes a quirk of selective-bidding auction where each bid amount
can only be claimed by a single person. That's fine in normal auctions,
but in a selective-bid auction, it means Alice can bid 5 coins on lot X
and lot Y, but Alice can't bid 5 coins on lot X while Bob bids 5 coins
on lot Y.


Amend Regulation AM0 by, as a single amendment:
{

In the paragraph beginning "BIDDING:", deleting "specifying a number of
the auction's currency as eir bid not equal to the bid of another player"

After that paragraph, inserting the following paragraph:
{

EXCLUSIVITY: Bids are grouped into classes. Unless otherwise specified,
all bids are in a single class. A bid CANNOT be made if, in the class it
would be in, another bid already exists with the bid amount as the
hypothetical bid.

}

}

Amend Regulation AM5 by inserting the following as a new list item after
the one starting with "Bidding messages": "One bid class exists for each
lot, with bids falling into the class for the specified lot."



I'm not sure your amendment does anything to help here. All it allows is 
for different players to submit bids of equal amount as long as they're 
on different lots in a selective-bid auction. The bids are still given 
out to the Nth active bid, which is the part that is broken, at least to 
my understanding.


Also, the new paragraph could be construed as a universal prohibition 
against submitting a bid amount that anyone has ever submitted before. 
An "on that auction" or two in the new paragraph would probably cover that.


...actually, I just checked and the current regulation text fails to 
specify this as well. Not sure if that changes anything at this point, 
but we may as well fix that while we're here too.


I did know about this issue, but I kind of forgot about it. I intended a 
fix back in June, but I never resolved it, even though I think I could 
have (it had 1 support from Jason and 0 objections).


https://mailman.agoranomic.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/agora-business/2021-June/046698.html

--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: [Proto-Contract] Speaking of ways to circumvent withdrawal...

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

The following is a proto-contract allowing someone (potentially
withdrawn) to bid on behalf of some other party so that they can
continue as if nothing happened. It's complex legalese and this is
basically my first draft, so I'd love to hear criticisms.

And just so we're clear, I probably won't be implementing this. It's
mostly a thought experiment at this point.

==

There can be at most two parties to this contract. The person who
created this contract is the bidder" and the other member is the proxy.
This contract has a target auction, which is the First Victory Auction
of July 2021.

If there is no proxy, then any player CAN join the contract, and in the
same message transfer from the bidder to emself 100 coins. Attempts to
join this contract when there is a proxy is INEFFECTIVE.

This contract authorizes the bidder to act on behalf of the proxy to bid
on the target auction, provided that the bidder has enough of the target
auction's currency to pay for the lot should the proxy win it. It also
authorizes the bidder to act on behalf of the proxy to withdraw from the
target auction.

During the target auction's retrieval phase, if the proxy would be an
awardee of the auction if funded, then the bidder SHALL transfer a
number of coins to the proxy equal to the amount to be paid by the proxy
for the auction if funded.

After the prizes are distributed for the target auction, if the proxy
recieved a lot, then the bidder CAN act on eir behalf to transfer the
items associated with that lot from the proxy to emself. If the proxy
did not recieve a lot, then the bidder CAN act on eir behalf to transfer
their bid back to emself.

The proxy SHALL NOT transfer or destroy anything the bidder has
transferred to them for the purposes of bidding; nor SHALL e transfer or
destroy anything e recieved as a lot from the target auction.

Neither party can leave this contract until:

* the proxy is withdrawn from the target auction, OR
* the target auction has finished, the proxy did not receive any lots,
  and the bidder has recieved eir bid back, OR
* the target auction has finished, the proxy received a number of lots,
  and the bidder has transferred eir lots from the proxy.

--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: BUS: Re: OFF: Re: [Treasuror] [Victory Auction] First Victory Auction of July 2021

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 12/07/2021 19:15, Jason Cobb via agora-business wrote:

On 7/2/21 8:14 PM, Rebecca Lee via agora-business wrote:

I bid 105



I bid 150 coins in the ongoing Victory Auction.



I think an explanation of the state of this auction is in order.

I accidentally started this as a Forward Auction, meaning that the 
person who bid the second highest would receive the legislative card. 
This isn't great, but it does work if anyone who bid too high withdraws 
before they are compelled to pay win card prices for a legislative card.


Players caught onto this and were bidding lower in order to receive the 
legislative card before any competition started for the win card.


Fast forward a little bit and the three people competing for the victory 
card were ATMunn with  coins, Falsifian with 1100 coins, and me with 
950 coins. When there were 14 hours left in the auction I privately 
contacted Falsifian to inform em to either bid or withraw so that e 
wouldn't pay 1100 coins for a legislative card. E did so, and I followed 
suit.


As it turns out, ATMunn only bid  because it was a funny number, so 
e withdrew as well. This would allow the players who had been competing 
for second place to get the victory card for a little more than a 
hundred coins, which is far less than it is worth in this economy.


I exhort you, if you are even kind of interested in the victory subgame, 
please bid. You will likely never see this low of a going price and this 
little competition (Falsifian, ATMunn, and I cannot rejoin the auction 
since withdrawing is permanent).


If you're not into the subgame itself, Falsifian has a deal out to pay 
1000 coins for one victory card (there are a few layers of indirection, 
but I'm sure Falsifian would be willing to explain to you how to redeem 
them).


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: OFF: [ADoP] Election updates

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 11/07/2021 20:40, Edward Murphy via agora-official wrote:

I initiate an Agoran decision to select the winner of the election for
Registrar.

   * The Vote Collector is the ADoP (me).

   * The valid options are ATMunn, Gaelan, and anyone else who becomes a
     candidate before voting ends.

   * The voting method is instant runoff.


I believe Aspen already started an election for Referee, right before 
resigning. E did so in this message:


https://mailman.agoranomic.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/agora-business/2021-July/046948.html

--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: BUS: Re: OFF: [Treasuror] [Weekly Report] Forbes 434

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 05/07/2021 00:16, Rebecca Lee via agora-business wrote:

On Mon, Jul 5, 2021 at 9:10 AM Trigon via agora-official <
agora-offic...@agoranomic.org> wrote:



  FORBES FOUR HUNDRED THIRTY-FOUR
   or   
 TREASUROR'S WEEKLY REPORT


Reports available online at: <https://agoranomic.org/Treasuror/reports>

DATES OF PUBLICATION  (contains no data)


(all times and dates in UTC)

Date of previous original report: 27 June 2021
Date of first report this week:   4 July 2021


NOTES ON REPORT   (contains no data)


* Find my report drafts on Discord or IRC.
* As always, please check the general accuracy of this report.


BUOYANCY (self-ratifies)


Buoyancy Target:   47101
Total Buoyancy:47101
Unit of Flotation: 19


ASSET BALANCES   (self-ratifies)


 Player(+a)  cn wcjclcvcwpbgpdxv
   ==  ==                
   R. Lee 635 1 0 0 0 0 0 3 0



COE: I have 2 pendants not 3 (I already used one to pend a proposal,
although I just said 'i pend it' so I can see why you missed it)



I deny this CoE. As we discovered soon after this message was sent, R. 
Lee's pending failed.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Proposal

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 03/07/2021 03:45, Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion wrote:

On Sat, Jul 3, 2021 at 1:30 PM OatmealSurprise via agora-business <
agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:


I (Mask) hereby propose the following:
"""
Reduce, Reuse, Recycle
On successful repeal of a rule, the player who proposed the repeal gains 2
Pendants.
"""



  A proposal needs to specify what it's doing, like creating a new rule,
amending an existing rule etc. So this proposal should say "create a new
rule called 'Reduce Reuse Recycle' with the following text". Also, any new
rule should have a power (a number between 1 and 4 that determines whether
it overrules other rules). This rule could probably be power 1. Also,
proposals should have a title and an adoption index (they don't have to,
but all of them tend to). Adoption index is a complicated concept, but
basically it's 1 if you're doing anything at power 1, 2 if you're doing
anything at power 2, and 3 for anything at power 3. Power is that weird
number that appears in brackets after each rule's title. A rule that does
things at a higher power needs more votes.


These are all good points about procedure. As for the content, I have 
some criticisms.


Imagine, for instance, a proposal which reads as follows:

"Enact a rule with parameters [...]. Repeal that rule. Enact another 
rule. Repeal that rule."


What we have here is an infinite pendant generator scheme. There needs 
to be some kind of timeout for this mechanic to do anything.


Even if this were fixed, I'm not sure I would vote FOR this proposal. Is 
repealing rules a goal we should be working towards? I would argue that, 
in most cases, it probably isn't. This rule would encourage players to 
merge several different rules into one. I'm concerned about what this 
would do for readability.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Buoyancy Notification: July 2021

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

===[ AUTOMATED MESSAGE ]===

This is a message from the Treasuror's Inflation-Generating
Observation Network (TRIGON).

The Total Buoyancy has just been changed to:

=> 47101

This makes the Unit of Flotation:

=> 19

Please plan accordingly.

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Contract & Promise Cleanup

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 26/06/2021 02:36, Gaelan Steele via agora-discussion wrote:>

Did we ever learn what these did?


I lost the hashed text for these contracts so it's impossible to say for 
certain but using the four-letter identifiers and rough memories:

On 6/18/2021 11:50 AM, ATMunn wrote:

I intend, without 2 objections, to terminate the contract "Contract No. 1: 
GIFT".


I think this one was a free card from me to the other participant.


I intend, without 2 objections, to terminate the contract "Contract No. 2: 
POEM".


This one would require me to write a poem (maybe a limerick?) in honor 
of everyone who joined the contract and could pay me five coins.



I intend, without 2 objections, to terminate the contract "Contract No. 5: 
DECK".


I'm less sure of myself here but I think this one would make me swap a 
random card that I had with someone else's.



I intend, without 2 objections, to terminate the contract "Contract No. 6: 
BOON".


All I can say about this one was that it was going to be the most 
prestigious contract and also the most expensive.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: OFF: [Assessor] Resolution of Proposals 8574-8592

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 23/06/2021 14:03, Jason Cobb via agora-official wrote:

RESOLUTION OF PROPOSALS 8574-8593
=

IDTitle  Result
-
8574  mending the quill  ADOPTED


I award myself Orange Glitter


8578  Auction limitation ADOPTED
8579  AI voting method clarification v2  ADOPTED
8580  Strength Buying Separation v2  ADOPTED


I award myself Lime Glitter

8589  Secret proposal A  REJECTED
8590  Secret proposal B  ADOPTED
8591  Secret proposal C  REJECTED
8592  Secret proposal D  REJECTED


lol


The following sponsored adopted proposals have the highest popularity (1.000): 
8574 (by Trigon).


I gain one legislative card

--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: OFF: [ADoP] Floating salaries (attn Treasuror)

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 20/06/2021 22:57, Trigon wrote:

On 20/06/2021 22:39, Edward Murphy via agora-official wrote:
I award salaries as follows (BoC = boatload of coins, whatever that is 
nowadays):


Sun, 13 Jun 2021 23:19:44 +  Trigon publishes the Treasuror's 
weekly report

   * 15 BoC
Sun, 13 Jun 2021 21:06:18 -0400  Jason assessed Proposals 8561-72
   * 15 BoC
Mon, 14 Jun 2021 15:19:35 +  nix publishes the Ministor's monthly 
report

   * 5 BoC
Tue, 15 Jun 2021 00:11:00 -0700  Aris published the proposal pool
   * 15 BoC
Tue, 15 Jun 2021 21:45:33 +  nix publishes the Herald's monthly 
report

   * 10 BoC
Tue, 15 Jun 2021 18:05:26 -0400  Jason publishes the Stonemason's 
weekly report

   * 5 BoC
Wed, 16 Jun 2021 17:53:30 -0400  ATMunn publishes the Notary's weekly 
report

   * 10 BoC
Thu, 17 Jun 2021 13:07:06 +1000  R. Lee published the Referee's weekly 
report

   * 10 BoC
Fri, 18 Jun 2021 18:40:36 -0400  Jason published the Short Logical 
Ruleset

   * 15 BoC
Fri, 18 Jun 2021 18:41:13 -0400  Jason published the Full Logical Ruleset
   * 15 BoC


I would like to humbly request that the H. ADoP inform me in advance if 
e decides to change the formatting of these messages. To save myself 
some time I wrote a script written that parses the previous award format 
into the language that the Treasuror automation interprets. Receiving 
something like this with 20 minutes to spare before the Agoran week was 
up gave me a panic attack.




Oops, apologies for posting this to OFF.

--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: BUS: [@Treasuror] 3-way pool

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 17/06/2021 13:43, Jason Cobb via agora-business wrote:

On 6/17/21 9:42 AM, Trigon via agora-business wrote:

I transfer one legislative card to Jason as well.

--
Trigón
No clue why my signature won't work on my phone



I perform the following actions if and only if they all succeed:

{

I pay a set of 4 justice cards to receive 10 blot-be-gones.

I transfer 3 blot-be-gones to ATMunn.

I transfer 3 blot-be-gones to Trigon.

}



These failed since Jason had three justice cards at the time. E would 
have had four if i had transferred a justice card instead of a 
legislative card in the double-quoted message. May the H. Referee note 
that ATMunn's and my expungements following this message were 
INEFFECTIVE due to lack of BBGs.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

Re: DIS: [Proto] Ribbons are not switches

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 17/06/2021 05:30, Gaelan Steele via agora-discussion wrote:



On Jun 16, 2021, at 10:05 PM, Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion 
 wrote:

Ribbons being switches is very dumb. Read this sentence and weep: "For each
type of Ribbon,  Ribbon Ownership is a secured negative boolean
person switch, tracked by the Tailor in eir monthly report.". It makes
ribbons seem very complicated but actually they're really simple.


I'd argue that ribbons are actually a lot more like switches than assets:
- You either have one or you don't
- You can't have multiple of a ribbon
- You can't transfer ribbons

They're obviously not a perfect fit for either, so you have to do a bit
of shoehorning either way, but I think switches are a simpler mapping
than assets are.

Gaelan


Ribbons are currently tied to the switch system because it is seen as a 
stable way to do things. Assets have been repealed since ribbons were 
enacted but switches haven't. My personal opinion is that it isn't a 
great fit for either and would probably be more enduring as just 
property of persons, though there may be issues in making that look elegant.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: BUS: Re: OFF: [Referee] Investigation of Trigon

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 17/06/2021 04:15, Rebecca Lee via agora-official wrote:

On Thu, Jun 17, 2021 at 2:08 PM Telna via agora-business <
agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:

*sigh*
I Point my Finger at Trigon for not tracking the Unit of Flotation in
eir weekly report for the week beginning June 7th as directed by Rule
2635 "Floating Rate Fleet".
I Point my Finger at Trigon for not tracking the Unit of Flotation in
eir weekly report for the week beginning May 31st as directed by Rule
2635 "Floating Rate Fleet".



I hereby investigate both of these finger pointings.

Trigon did indeed violate rule 2635 (implemented in rule 2143) by failing
to track this information in documents that purported to be Treasuror's
reports. E did so in both weeks, which are within the statute of
limitations (the deadline for the week of May 31 expired 12 days ago on
June 6).

I impose the Cold Hand of Justice on Trigon for not tracking the Unit of
Flotation for the week of May 31st. Although there's no Class of crime here
I find it exceedingly similar to the Class-2 crime of Tardiness. The crime
is inadvertent and appears to be a simple lack of knowledge of exactly what
e had to track (Trigon has generally done a great job of officer accuracy
and timeliness). I impose a 1 blot fine on Trigon.

I impose the Cold Hand of Justice on Trigon for not tracking the Unit of
Flotation for the week of June 7th. I levy a 1 blot fine on Trigon, see
above.



Actually, the Unit of Flotation is tracked in the Treasuror's weekly 
report. Admittedly, it's not next to the Total Buoyancy, as one might 
expect, but it is in there, in the History section, at the beginning of 
each month:


*** Tue 1 June 2021 
...
[00:00]   RELEVELING: TB=35779, UF=14. 


This might not be enough, however, since this is the History section's 
header:



RECENT HISTORY(does not self-ratify)



The labels on the right side have always been intended to be 
informational; however, I admit that it's not one hundred percent clear 
what these do legally.


I accept that I should put these things in a better location, and I 
apologize for the elision of the information. I will include it in 
future reports. In my defense, the bit requiring that I track the UF is 
in a weird place.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: BUS: [@Referee] What is the Unit of Flotation?

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 16/06/2021 03:34, Telna via agora-business wrote:
I Point my Finger at Trigon for not tracking the Unit of Flotation in 
eir weekly report as directed by Rule 2635 "Floating Rate Fleet".


Is failure to track something actually a punishable crime? It seems like 
it should be, but I don't see anywhere that defines a crime for it.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: BUS: Cool stuff and things.

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 10/06/2021 18:21, BigBobBingo ! via agora-business wrote:

I transfer to Cuddlebeam 1 Victory Card.



This failed. Joe, not being active at the time of the economic reset, 
did not receive new cards. This did not affect Cuddlebeam paying a set 
of cards a few days later since Cuddlebeam owned more win cards than 
were required for that to take place.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: BUS: Pend if you got 'em (attn Promotor, Treasuror)

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 6/6/21 7:45 PM, Edward Murphy via agora-business wrote:

For each of the following proposals, I submit it and pay one (1) pendant
to pend it. (These are my remaining protos from this year's RTRW.)


I count six proposals in this message, and only four pendants in your 
possession. The last two pendings failed, unless you can tell me where 
you cashed some legislative cards this week.



Proposal: Clarify switches
(AI = 3)
Proposal: Effective deference
(AI = 3)
Proposal: Clarify variable voting period
(AI = 3)
Proposal: Clarify deputisation
(AI = 3) 
Proposal: Clarify nomination period

(AI = 2)
Proposal: Clarify stone retrieval
(AI = 2)

--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: [@Herald] Silver Quill 2017: Revelations

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

ilman.agoranomic.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/agora-official/2021-April/014816.html
[3] 
https://mailman.agoranomic.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/agora-official/2018-July/012515.html
[4] 
https://mailman.agoranomic.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/agora-business/2018-July/038742.html
[5] 
https://mailman.agoranomic.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/agora-official/2018-June/012449.html
[6] 
https://mailman.agoranomic.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/agora-official/2018-July/012491.html
[7] 
https://mailman.agoranomic.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/agora-official/2018-September/012571.html
[8] 
https://mailman.agoranomic.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/agora-official/2017-July/011653.html
[9] 
https://mailman.agoranomic.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/agora-business/2016-November/034268.html
[10] 
https://mailman.agoranomic.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/agora-business/2016-November/034322.html
[11] 
https://mailman.agoranomic.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/agora-official/2016-November/011295.html
[12] 
https://mailman.agoranomic.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/agora-discussion/2020-May/057868.html


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

Re: DIS: Buoyancy Notification: June 2021

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 6/1/21 12:01 AM, Trigon via agora-discussion wrote:

===[ AUTOMATED MESSAGE ]===

This is a message from the Treasuror's Inflation-Generating
Observation Network (TRIGON).

The Total Buoyancy has just been changed to:

=> 35799

This makes the Unit of Flotation:

=> 15

Please plan accordingly.



Well, this is awkward. These numbers are incorrect. My automatic system 
just so happens to be looking at outdated information. Here are the real 
values:


Total Buoyancy:34495
Unit of Flotation: 14

--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Buoyancy Notification: June 2021

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

===[ AUTOMATED MESSAGE ]===

This is a message from the Treasuror's Inflation-Generating
Observation Network (TRIGON).

The Total Buoyancy has just been changed to:

=> 35799

This makes the Unit of Flotation:

=> 15

Please plan accordingly.

DIS: Re: BUS: [CFJ] Re: OFF: [Treasuror] [Victory Auction] Resolution of April 2021 VA1

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 5/16/21 2:00 PM, Falsifian via agora-business wrote:

I call two CFJs, and suggest that they be linked:

CFJ: With the above-quoted message, Trigon revoked 400 Coins from
Falsifian.

CFJ: With the above-quoted message, Trigon created one Victory Card in
Falsifian's possession.

[snip]

Arguments for the second CFJ:

 If the first CFJ is TRUE, I see no reason the second shouldn't be
 TRUE too. The auction rules make it clear that the auctioneer can
 do this if the auction method allows it, and the auction method is
 clear.

 If the first CFJ is FALSE because the auction regulation can't
 empower Trigon to revoke assets, then I think it comes down to the
 interpretation of the following sentence from the draft regulation:

In this message, the auctioneer CAN and SHALL destroy the amount
to be paid from the inventory each awardee and transfer to that
player (or create in eir possession if the item is new) the set
of assets associated with the lot e won.

 The form is: "the auctioneer CAN and SHALL do A and B". But if
 we've established they can't do A, then they can't do A and B.

 This is a bit ambiguous. Maybe the sentence has no effect since the
 regulation is trying to empower the auctioneer to do something (A
 and B together) that they can't. Or maybe it should be read as
 authorizing the auctioneer to do A and also B.

 However, even under the second interpretation, I still think it
 would be FALSE, because R2545 requires the auction method to be
 "generally recognizable ... as a fair, equitable, and timely
 [method]". Winning just by being the last person to state a bigger
 meaningless number than the last person, when a casual reading of
 the the regulations wouldn't make it clear that's the goal, doesn't
 seem fair.



Gratuitous arguments: the definition of an auction is "a way for 
entities to give away specified assets (items), grouped into lots, in 
exchange for a currency" (Rule 2545/3 ¶1). My inclination here is to say 
that, should the first CFJ about whether a lot was transferred be judged 
FALSE, what I have done here fails to meet the criteria to be considered 
an auction as it is not a way to exchange currency for lots, implying a 
judgement of FALSE.



Arguments for FALSE for the first CFJ:

Note that the auction began before the regulations were amended. This
may affect interpretation of the clause: "For the purposes of
interpreting auction definitions, such methods are treated as if they
are defined in this rule.", which seems to refer specifically to
auction regulations.

Even if we do consider the new regulation text to have been in force, I
still think it should be FALSE. I think the following quotes from the
recent thread "[Treasuror] [Auction Regulations Proto] Rough Draft for
Redesign" summarise my position (I also included Trigon's reply).



Gratuitous arguments: I have picked through the wording of Rule 2545/3 
and I have more evidence now than what was quoted, and it lies in Rule 
2545/3 ¶2, which I present, somewhat abbreviated.


  When the rules authorize a person (the auctioneer) to conduct an
  auction, e CAN do so by any wholly public method that ... under
  common definitions and terms used in auctions, as a fair,
  equitable, and timely means of ... enabling the appropriate
  exchange of goods.

This is where I believe my logic falls apart, but I would really like my 
auctions to work, so attempt to bear with me.


When the rules authorize a person to conduct an auction, we know by ¶1 
that that authorizes em to oversee a means of exchanging currency for 
lots. This implies that any method that the auctioneer chooses that 
allows an equitable auction process has authorization to facilitate such 
a transfer by extension of the authorization to perform the auction at 
all. Otherwise it would not be an auction by ¶1.


On the other hand, perhaps similar logic could lead one to conclude that 
the rules never authorize any player to begin an auction under auction 
regulations that fail to allow a method to transfer or destroy coins 
from awardees, in which case what I just have done was never was an 
auction in the first place.



Rule 2545/3 (Power=2)
Auctions

  An auction is a way for entities to give away specified assets
  (items), grouped into lots, in exchange for a currency. A lot is a
  non-empty list of items to be transferred to a single recipient
  (an auction winner).

  When the rules authorize a person (the auctioneer) to conduct an
  auction, e CAN do so by any wholly public method that would be
  generally recognizable, as specified by the auctioneer at the
  start of the auction, and under common definitions and terms used
  in auctions, as a fair, equitable,

DIS: Re: BUS: Re: OFF: [Treasuror] [Weekly Report] Forbes 446

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

I just checked my sent folder and as much as it pains me to report it I may 
have completely forgotten to set the BT these past few weeks. I could have 
sworn that I have been sending these messages after the weekly reports, but 
apparently not. Sincerest apologies for this. This having happened I will 
probably remember to actually send it this week.

May 7, 2021 12:29:37 Falsifian via agora-business 
:

> On Sun, Apr 25, 2021 at 07:46:58PM +0000, Trigon via agora-official wrote:
>> 
>>  FORBES FOUR HUNDRED FORTY-SIX
>>    or   
>>    TREASUROR'S WEEKLY REPORT
>> 
>> 
>> Reports available online in  and HTML formats at:
>> <https://agoranomic.org/Treasuror/reports>
>> 
>> DATES OF PUBLICATION  (contains no data)
>> 
>> 
>> (all times and dates in UTC)
>> 
>> Date of previous original report:  16 April 2021
>> Date of first report this week:    25 April 2021
> 
> [snip]
>> BUOYANCY (self-ratifies)
>> 
>> 
>> Total Buoyancy : 25000
>> Buoyancy Target: 28418
> 
> I think this report has self-ratified by now, but if it hadn't, what
> would cause the Buoyancy Target to have this value?
> 
> Is including it in the report meant to count as the Treasuror setting
> it "by announcement" as allowed by R2634?
> 
> -- 
> Falsifian

DIS: Re: OFF: [ADoP] Floating salaries (attn Treasuror)

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 5/2/21 9:57 PM, Edward Murphy via agora-official wrote:

I grant boatloads of coins to players as follows:

(weekly)

5 BoC - Sun, Apr 25 2021 (17:11:43) - Murphy published the ADoP's weekly 
report
15 BoC - Sun, Apr 25 2021 (19:46:58) - Trigon published the Treasuror's 
weekly report
5 BoC - Sun, Apr 25 2021 (20:32:58) - Aris published the Registrar's 
weekly report

15 BoC - Sun, Apr 25 2021 (21:35:40) - Aris published the proposal pool
10 BoC - Wed, Apr 28 2021 (08:29:37) - Gaelan published the Referee's 
weekly report
10 BoC - Fri, Apr 30 2021 (15:16:58) - ATMunn published the Notary's 
weekly report
5 BoC - Sat, May 01 2021 (19:09:22) - Jason published the Stonemason's 
weekly report
5 BoC - Sun, May 02 2021 (21:54:06) - Murphy published the Tailor's 
weekly report


(monthly)

5 BoC - Sun, May 02 2021 (21:55:34) - Murphy published the Tailor's 
monthly report


The Unit of Flotation is currently 10, thus these expand to:
  *  5 boatloads of coins -> 50 coins
  * 10 boatloads of coins -> 100 coins
  * 15 boatloads of coins -> 150 coins


All transfers in this message failed too due to the automatic change in UoF.

--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: BUS: [@Tailor] Re: OFF: [ADoP] 2020 Employee of the Year award (attn Herald)

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 5/2/21 9:46 PM, Edward Murphy via agora-official wrote:

Trigon wrote:


On 5/1/21 2:04 AM, Edward Murphy via agora-official wrote:

With support from ATMunn, Aris, and Jason, and no objections, I award
the Patent Title '2020 Employee of the Year' to Trigon.


I thank the Agoran public for this support. I am grateful that you 
have found my services meritorious. I hope to continue being an 
officer for years to come.


I claim Violet Glitter.


I award 11 boatloads = 110 coins to Trigon.


Unfortunately, this failed. A boatload is equal to twelve coins since 
the beginning of the month due to the new automated Total Buoyancy 
switch flipping rules.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

Re: DIS: [Treasuror] [Auction Regulations Proto] Rough Draft for Redesign

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 5/2/21 4:09 PM, Falsifian via agora-discussion wrote:

   DISTRIBUTION: The auctioneer for an auction CAN and SHALL, within
   seven days of the ending of that auction's retrieval period,
   create a public message (henceforth the "distribution message")
   that contains a full history of bids on the auction and
   withdrawals from the auction. It must also clearly indicate each
   awardee and the lot e recieves. In this message, the auctioneer
   CAN and SHALL destroy the amount to be paid from the inventory
   each awardee and transfer to that player (or create in eir
   possession if the item is new) the set of assets associated with
   the lot e won. Failing to publish a distribution message
   constitutes the Class 3 Crime of Auction Abandonment.


Can an auction regulation give the auctioneer the power to destroy
assets, as this text purports to do?

As far as I can tell the only power this regulation has is that it adds
some definitions. R2565 grants the auctioneer the power to "transfer
said items as necessary..." but I think that's referring to the goods
being auctioned off.



It is quite possible that this does not work; however, if it does the 
best rebuttal is found in R2545¶4:



  The Treasuror is the promulgator for regulations that define
  specific auction methods (i.e. "the default auction method") and
  SHOULD do in order to aid trade and commerce.  *For the purposes of
  interpreting auction definitions, such methods are treated as if
  they are defined in this rule.*


As the section on distribution authorizes the auctioneer to destroy the 
assets and it is considered part of Rule 2545.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Buoyancy Notification: May 2021

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

===[ AUTOMATED MESSAGE ]===

This is a message from the Treasuror's Inflation-Generating
Observation Network (TRIGON).

The Total Buoyancy has just been changed to:

=> 28418

This makes the Unit of Flotation:

=> 12

Please plan accordingly.

DIS: [Treasuror] [Auction Regulations Proto] Rough Draft for Redesign

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

 * The retrieval period for a sealed-bid auction lasts for seven
days.
  * Each player SHALL reveal eir bid amount on a sealed-bid auction
while the auction is in its retrieval period. Failing to do so
is the Class 2 Crime of Potential Faking.
  * The termination message need not indicate any bids for which the
amount bid is not known.
  * The Nth awardee of a sealed-bid auction is the player whose bid
is the Nth-highest active bid in that auction.


Regulation AM3/0
Second-price Auctions

  Second-price auctions function like forward auctions except:

  * The amount to be paid by the Nth awardee is the amount of the
auction's currency specified by the (N-1)th highest active bid
on that auction or the lowest active bid if such a value does
not exist.


Regulation AM4/0
Nonwinning-price Auctions

  Nonwinning-price auctions function like forward auctions except:

  * The amount to by paid by all awardees is the amount of the
auction's currency specified by the highest active bid on that
auction not placed by an awardee or the lowest active bid if
such a value does not exist.


Regulation AM5/0
Selective-bid Auctions

  Selective-bit auctions function like generalized auctions except:

  * Bidding messages on a selective-bid auction must also specify a
lot that is preferred.
  * The Nth awardee of a selective-bid auction is the player who
placed the highest active bid whose preferred bid is the Nth
lot.

----

--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: Re: OFF: [Obstructive Pooling Accountant] 10 Decireports

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 4/12/21 8:56 PM, Falsifian via agora-official wrote:

I become the Accountant for the Obstructive Pooling contract, publish
the below report, then cease being the Accountant.


Events:
2021-02-06 15:15  nix deposits 1 Victory Card: +25
2021-02-07 16:05  nix deposits 1 Victory Card: +25
2021-04-12 00:03  Jason deposits 1 Victory Card: +25

Decipoint balances:
Jason  25
nix50




Unofficial CoE on this report: I believe that Jason's transfer failed. 
See my second to previous email for details.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

Re: DIS: (no subject)

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 4/9/21 11:11 PM, reuben.sta...@gmail.com wrote:

sorry but i need to do more email testing



It *looks* like it worked on my end but I would like to know if this 
shows up as a reply to a previous testing message. Object to this 
message if it looks incorrect on your end. This will help me with future 
experiments.


Thanks!

--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

Re: DIS: (no subject)

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

sorry but i need to do more email testing

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: [RWO Intent] 25000 coins

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 4/8/21 11:53 PM, Gaelan Steele via agora-discussion wrote:

Er, my mail client says Jason objected on April 2, 10 PM PDT in a message to 
BUS.


On Apr 8, 2021, at 4:51 PM, Trigon via agora-business 
 wrote:

On 4/2/21 11:07 PM, Reuben Staley via agora-business wrote:

RWO might not work, but this is important enough to try.
I intend to ratify the following document, without objection:
"The Lost and Found Department owns 2282 coins"
As it stands right now, the Treasuror's report draft indicate that the number 
of coins is 24954, and that the unit of flotation based on this would be 
9.9816. My goal is to make this a round number because it's so tantalizingly 
close. I see this as not a rules-mandated but a moral obligation to the Agoran 
community.


Having recieved no objection, I do so. Monthly report inbound.

--
Trigon

¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this




I believe that e was objecting to a non-action sent in a reply to my 
original message from Aris.


--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

Re: DIS: [Treasuror] [@All Players] Auction Regulation Wishlists (was Re: BUS: Timing leniency amendments)

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 3/28/21 11:14 PM, Reuben Staley via agora-discussion wrote:
To everyone this time: please discuss your wishlist for the auction 
regulations. I think we all have had run-ins with frustrating elements 
of them and I hope to make them more ideal. I would prefer this 
discussion not to devolve into suggestions for more auction types.




I have a sequence of polls for the Agoran public concerning auction 
rules. These are inspired by some discord conversations that I have had 
today. Please answer them giving the current regulations a once-over. 
Your responses will help me redraft the auction regulations.


(1) Do you like the current auction framework in concept?
(1a) Do you feel like it is too complicated by design?
(1b) Are there any glaring functional issues (other than the obvious)?

(2) Do you think that the current auction regulations are easy to read?
(2a) What parts do not make sense?
(2b) Are there any instances of confusing terminology or phrasing?

(3) Do you value the extensibility that the current regulations provide?
(3a) Which auction methods should we keep if we decide to simplify?

(4) Should auction awardees be required to claim lots by themselves?
(4a) If not, should they be rewarded automatically?
(4b) By the auctioneer?
(4c) By some other method?

(5) Do the ending conditions of auctions make sense?
(5a) If not, how else can we make them more obvious?

(6) Should there be a time limit for the termination message?
(6a) If so, should it be a few days?
(6b) A few weeks?
(6c) A month?
(6d) Something else?

(7) Any other comments?

--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

Re: DIS: [Proto] Archimedes' Principle

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

On 4/3/21 10:20 PM, Aris Merchant via agora-discussion wrote:

Title: Archimedes' Principle
Adoption index: 2.0
Author: Aris
Co-author(s): Trigon, nix


Speaking officially as Treasuror, I would like to point out that this is 
remarkably similar to a proposal I myself drafted a while ago except 
that it's more focused on this specific change.


I truly do believe that a system like the one described in this proposal 
is better than what we have now. Charities will actually be funded the 
right amount each month, and the entire system just becomes more 
predictable in general. Additionally, despite the fact that the monthly 
message will ideally be automated and sent as soon as possible after the 
beginning of the month, the correct value will even be available beforehand.


TL;DR: This proposal gets Treasuror endorsement.

--
Trigon

 ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST

I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
I LOVE SPAGHETTI
transfer Jason one coin
nch was here
I hereby
don't... trust... the dragon...
don't... trust... the dragon...
Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this

DIS: (no subject)

[Trigon via agora-discussion]

this is a test message, please ignore.

Re: BUS: Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Secretary] Weekly Report

[Trigon]

I'd love to contribute to the economic stabilization; however, being a 
shiniless scrub, I cannot. I extend thanks to everyone who is involved 
in this effort.


On 9/25/2017 10:41 PM, Aris Merchant wrote:

On Mon, Sep 25, 2017 at 8:50 PM, Kerim Aydin  wrote:



On Mon, 25 Sep 2017, Owen Jacobson wrote:

* The reward for authoring or pending a successful proposal pended with shinies 
is 1 sh.


Ok, so as much as I understand the assessor's lateness, I suspect it cost me
personally a fair purse of shinies.  I'm at the point where I'm ready to call 
the
entire wildly-adjusting and oscillating"system" frustrating guesswork and
gambling to tune out of it entirely, voting to just keep AP and be happy with
a couple actions a week.


Economic reform goals:

1. Keep everything stable. I'd say we also need to keep things
interesting, but frankly everyone could use a bit of boringness right
now. This is impacting the workloads of several officers (meaning we
have to do our work in bursts) and is ruining stability and financial
planing. IMHO, this is is also the biggest flaw in at least two
proposals, Shiny Weather and Hot Potato, which would both actually
reduce stability in the markets.

2. Keep Agora solvent. Another major flaw in most financial proposals.
At least half of any wealth from taxes should go to Agora. Yes, that's
right, half. I know this is going to be unpopular, but wealth
redistribution will not actually create a good financial system unless
rule based rewards work. This is the upside of "print money" style
proposals, which people vote against primarily because they're
applying too much real world economics (not that people need to vote
for them, see the next sentence, but I think they vote against for the
wrong reasons). The disadvantage of that kind of proposal is that
they're short term fixes that don't solve the underlying problem. I'm
starting to think that a two tier tax might be best. A wealth
redistribution tax would be placed on the rich, while a public tax
would be levied on all but the poor.

3. Redistribute wealth. Yeah, this is third. No, that isn't a mistake.
Every self-respecting economic reform proposal does this, but it's
actually rather pointless without the other two. Until those happen,
shines aren't a stable form of value.

Temporary fix (mandatory charity): I have 48 shinies. I pay Agora 16
shines. All players, but especially o and P.S.S SHOULD give Agora 1/3
of their shinies, receiving nothing in exchange. I pledge to publish a
list of who has and has not done so. I also pledge that if I judge the
response of the community to be insufficient, I will submit and pend a
proposal levying a tax upon all players.

-Aris

DIS: Re: BUS: [Proposal] Slower Promotion

[Trigon]

Do four people or the ADoP want to support me so that an Assessor 
election can be started?


On 9/26/2017 3:13 PM, Nic Evans wrote:



On 09/26/17 16:02, Kerim Aydin wrote:



On Tue, 26 Sep 2017, Nic Evans wrote:

I personally find it frustrating that we vote on things before the last
setis resolved. This should be a relatively safe way to slow down, if we
want to.

Really, it overlapped wholly because you were late on Assessment, and your
response is to give the Promotor another task and slow the whole game down?

This is absurd.  Was going to let it pass, but I point the Finger at Nichdel
for late Assessment of Decision to Adopt proposal 7876.

I note, for the purposes of determining carding, that this lateness had a
direct and material impact on my own earnings as well as others.

I note to the Referee, so e can feel informed and NOT believe that there are
no rules violations this week, that Nichdel was similarly late on proposals
7877-7898.

Sorry - lateness happens, most is not a big deal, but this is a really poor
response to be frustrated at the voting system as a result.


Even if I'm not late this can and does still happen. Assessment is 7-14
days after promotion, and promotion is weekly. I'm not trying to punish
anyone else, I'm trying to make my own failure less catastrophic for
gamestate.

I resign from Assessor.



-G.

DIS: Rules confuse me.

[Trigon]

At the time that I'm writing this, the Full Logical Ruleset [1] claims 
that the most recent change to the ruleset is the adoption of Proposal 
7875, "Better Accounting" [2]. This should have modified rules 2496 and 
2497, but the text that was proposed to be appended cannot be found. 
Additionally, Proposal 7873 has not been added anywhere yet, despite the 
resolution post [2] stating that it has passed.


Additionally, Proposals 7875-7898 [3] were distributed 10 Sept 2017, and 
the length of the voting period is 7 days, meaning that there should 
have been a resolution post some time the next week, but there hasn't 
been one. In fact, the last Assessor post was on the 7th.


So, if someone could explain if I'm wrong, I'd appreciate that.

[1] https://agoranomic.org/ruleset/flr.txt
[2] https://www.mail-archive.com/agora-official@agoranomic.org/msg08264.html
[3] https://www.mail-archive.com/agora-official@agoranomic.org/msg08268.html

-- Trigon

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: I'm joining!

[Trigon]

Noted. I thought that by not formatting anything in the email, it would 
just not format anything. Clearly I was wrong. I downloaded Thunderbird 
and set it to not use formatting, so this should work. Tell me if it 
doesn't.


On 9/24/2017 5:30 PM, Aris Merchant wrote:

Welcome to Agora, Trigon! Quick etiquette thing: we generally prefer
plain text email. Your email software probably has a setting for it
somewhere.

-Aris

On Sun, Sep 24, 2017 at 10:51 AM, Reuben Staley <thnold...@yahoo.com> wrote:

Hey nerds! After reading through the public archives for a little over a
week to decide whether or not I should join, I decided that I should.

-- Reuben Staley


---
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
http://www.avg.com



-- Trigon

.