Re: Stus-List question LF38 steering

[john sandford via CnC-List]

Hi

I’m late posting on this one.

LF38 rudder stock Grease fitting is very tricky to get access to unless you are 
very skinny, flexible and have long arms and eyes on stalks.

I removed the grease fitting and replaced it with a high pressure hose with a 
grease nipple on the end. Found the hose at Crappytire, in the grease gun 
section. NPT male one end and female on the other.

Now I can apply grease using a grease gun in the Stbd Lazarete, alongside the 
fuel tank, without needing the above mentioned genetics.

And yes, what a HUGE difference a bit/lot of grease makes.

 

 

 

From: Camille Cloutier [mailto:camillepo...@gmail.com] 
Sent: April-26-19 10:15 AM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Subject: Re: Stus-List question LF38 steering

 

Hi!!

 

Thank you for the quick and precise answer! It is very appreciated! 

 

Last question: what king of grease do you us in the grease cup? White grease?

 

Have a good day! 

 

Camille

 

 

 

Le mer. 24 avr. 2019 à 15:36, Dreuge via CnC-List  a 
écrit :

Camille,

 

I originally had steering which was stiff and somewhat resistant  to turning.  
My problem turned out to be old dry crusted grease in the rudder tube.  After 
dropping the rudder, cleaning out the old, and replacing the rudder lubed with 
SuperLube, resulted in nice smooth steering.  I grease it via a cup about once 
a year.  All remains nice and well.

 

It sounds easy, but it was a challenge to remove the radial. The bolts holding 
the radial together in my case were galled/corroded in place.  

 

Take a look at by blog post:  
http://svjohannarose.blogspot.com/2014/12/rudder-and-steering.html

 

 

As for a grease cup, you likely do have one (or had one).  it should be on the 
aft starboard side of the rudder rube.   It is easy to access with the steering 
radial removed.  Regular access requires an arm contortion trick: open the deck 
access plate just aft of the rudder post, stick you arm down and twist it under 
the radial drive disk, then reach towards the rudder post.   It should be there.

 

 

 

-
Paul E.

1981 C&C Landfall 38 
S/V Johanna Rose
Fort Walton Beach, FL

 

http://svjohannarose.blogspot.com/

 

 

On Apr 24, 2019, at 11:10 AM, Camille Cloutier via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

Hi,

We just signed in the CnC-List mailing list and we would have a question
concerning our C&C boat Landfall 38. We live in Qu?bec and we are french
speaking so I'll try to express myself as good as I can :)

We find that the streering wheel is harder to turn then other C&C we have
tried. We have replace all the wires so we are sure that the problem
doesn't come from the pedestal. In the instruction manual, they talk about a
grease cup which we don't have. We don't have teflon washer around the
rudder shaft in the water either.

Does anyone have informations about how the whole rudder system is put
together so we can recondition it to have a smooth and easy steering wheel
?

Thank you very much

Camille

 

___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List question LF38 steering

[dwight veinot via CnC-List]

Blue grease marine

On Fri, Apr 26, 2019 at 10:16 AM Camille Cloutier via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Hi!!
>
> Thank you for the quick and precise answer! It is very appreciated!
>
> Last question: what king of grease do you us in the grease cup? White
> grease?
>
> Have a good day!
>
> Camille
>
>
>
> Le mer. 24 avr. 2019 à 15:36, Dreuge via CnC-List 
> a écrit :
>
>> Camille,
>>
>> I originally had steering which was stiff and somewhat resistant  to
>> turning.  My problem turned out to be old dry crusted grease in the rudder
>> tube.  After dropping the rudder, cleaning out the old, and replacing the
>> rudder lubed with SuperLube, resulted in nice smooth steering.  I grease it
>> via a cup about once a year.  All remains nice and well.
>>
>> It sounds easy, but it was a challenge to remove the radial. The bolts
>> holding the radial together in my case were galled/corroded in place.
>>
>> Take a look at by blog post:
>> http://svjohannarose.blogspot.com/2014/12/rudder-and-steering.html
>>
>>
>> As for a grease cup, you likely do have one (or had one).  it should be
>> on the aft starboard side of the rudder rube.   It is easy to access with
>> the steering radial removed.  Regular access requires an arm contortion
>> trick: open the deck access plate just aft of the rudder post, stick you
>> arm down and twist it under the radial drive disk, then reach towards the
>> rudder post.   It should be there.
>>
>>
>>
>> -
>> Paul E.
>> 1981 C&C Landfall 38
>> S/V Johanna Rose
>> Fort Walton Beach, FL
>>
>> http://svjohannarose.blogspot.com/
>>
>>
>> On Apr 24, 2019, at 11:10 AM, Camille Cloutier via CnC-List <
>> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> We just signed in the CnC-List mailing list and we would have a question
>> concerning our C&C boat Landfall 38. We live in Qu?bec and we are french
>> speaking so I'll try to express myself as good as I can :)
>>
>> We find that the streering wheel is harder to turn then other C&C we have
>> tried. We have replace all the wires so we are sure that the problem
>> doesn't come from the pedestal. In the instruction manual, they talk
>> about a
>> grease cup which we don't have. We don't have teflon washer around the
>> rudder shaft in the water either.
>>
>> Does anyone have informations about how the whole rudder system is put
>> together so we can recondition it to have a smooth and easy steering wheel
>> ?
>>
>> Thank you very much
>>
>> Camille
>>
>>
>> ___
>>
>> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
>> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
>> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>>
>> ___
>
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> --
Sent from Gmail Mobile
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List question LF38 steering

[Dreuge via CnC-List]

I have been happy with SuperLube Synthetic grease.  Below is a quick link I 
found on Amazon.

I use Super Lube for many tasks.  In addition to lubricating the rudder, I use 
on winches (except the pawls), on O-rings, …, and some electrical terminals as 
it’s also a good dielectric grease.   

I even know of a guy who uses it for chapped lips (and swears by it).  While it 
is listed as a food grade lubricate, I have not gone that far yet!


https://www.amazon.com/Super-Lube-41160-Synthetic-Translucent/dp/B0083R1FME/ref=sr_1_2?keywords=Super+Lube&qid=1556301173&s=gateway&sr=8-2
 
<https://www.amazon.com/Super-Lube-41160-Synthetic-Translucent/dp/B0083R1FME/ref=sr_1_2?keywords=Super+Lube&qid=1556301173&s=gateway&sr=8-2>




-
Paul E.
1981 C&C Landfall 38 
S/V Johanna Rose
Fort Walton Beach, FL

http://svjohannarose.blogspot.com/

> On Apr 26, 2019, at 11:18 AM, cnc-list-requ...@cnc-list.com wrote:
> 
> Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2019 09:15:09 -0400
> From: Camille Cloutier  <mailto:camillepo...@gmail.com>>
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>
> Subject: Re: Stus-List question LF38 steering
> Message-ID:
><mailto:cak1b36wikgzkjeruhga3v6wkhytzpeph7brzfm7n-uatb6h...@mail.gmail.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> 
> Hi!!
> 
> Thank you for the quick and precise answer! It is very appreciated!
> 
> Last question: what king of grease do you us in the grease cup? White
> grease?
> 
> Have a good day!
> 
> Camille
> 

___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List question

[CHARLES SCHEAFFER via CnC-List]

When I pulled my rudder to inspect the bearings I drilled the fiberglass tube 
that holds the delrin bearings and added SS zerc fittings to allow me to grease 
the assembly. I don't want a petroleum product to leach into the water and need 
the grease to work in cold temperatures so I ordered a food grade synthetic 
from McMasterCarr and I believe Super Lube from Ace Hardware also meets that 
criteria.

Chuck, Resolute, 1990 C&C 34/36R


> On April 26, 2019 at 9:15 AM Camille Cloutier via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi!!
> 
> Thank you all for the quick and precise answers! It is very appreciated! 
> 
> Last question: what king of grease do you us in the grease cup? White 
> grease?
> 
> Have a good day! 
> 
> Camille
> 
> Le mer. 24 avr. 2019 à 16:44, ssjohnson via CnC-List < 
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com > a écrit :
> 
> > > Greetings Camille and welcome to the list!  My LF38 has 
> not had your issue. But. When I upgraded the steering pedestal we found that 
> the cockpit sole had completely desalinated, so, we had about a 2'x3' piece 
> of marine plywood vacuum sealed with fiberglass resin and new holes drilled, 
> with edges sealed,  for the pedestal and rudder post.  In retrospect I had 
> noticed a puddle of rainwater accumulating around the rudder post.  It was 
> about a $3,500 repair but needed to be done.
> > The grease cap is on the aft side of the lower rudder.  I replaced 
> > it with a grease fitting on a 5' hose leading to a bracket under the strbd 
> > laserette.  I add a squeeze once a year.  BTW, I've removed and replaced 
> > the rudder about 6 times.  I finally had it rebuilt by competition 
> > composites in Ottawa.  Now it is only 150lbs instead of 300 :-o
> > Good luck, Camille!
> > Spencer Johnson 
> > 84 LF 38 "Alegria " #165
> > Racine, WI
> > ___
> > 
> > Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  
> > Each and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list 
> > - use PayPal to send contribution --https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> > 
> > 
> > > ___
> 
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each 
> and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use 
> PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> 
> 
 
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List question

[Camille Cloutier via CnC-List]

Hi!!

Thank you all for the quick and precise answers! It is very appreciated!

Last question: what king of grease do you us in the grease cup? White
grease?

Have a good day!

Camille

Le mer. 24 avr. 2019 à 16:44, ssjohnson via CnC-List 
a écrit :

> Greetings Camille and welcome to the list!  My LF38 has not had your
> issue. But. When I upgraded the steering pedestal we found that the cockpit
> sole had completely desalinated, so, we had about a 2'x3' piece of marine
> plywood vacuum sealed with fiberglass resin and new holes drilled, with
> edges sealed,  for the pedestal and rudder post.  In retrospect I had
> noticed a puddle of rainwater accumulating around the rudder post.  It was
> about a $3,500 repair but needed to be done.
> The grease cap is on the aft side of the lower rudder.  I replaced it with
> a grease fitting on a 5' hose leading to a bracket under the strbd
> laserette.  I add a squeeze once a year.  BTW, I've removed and replaced
> the rudder about 6 times.  I finally had it rebuilt by competition
> composites in Ottawa.  Now it is only 150lbs instead of 300 :-o
> Good luck, Camille!
> Spencer Johnson
> 84 LF 38 "Alegria " #165
> Racine, WI
> ___
>
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
>
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List question LF38 steering

[Camille Cloutier via CnC-List]

Hi!!

Thank you for the quick and precise answer! It is very appreciated!

Last question: what king of grease do you us in the grease cup? White
grease?

Have a good day!

Camille



Le mer. 24 avr. 2019 à 15:36, Dreuge via CnC-List  a
écrit :

> Camille,
>
> I originally had steering which was stiff and somewhat resistant  to
> turning.  My problem turned out to be old dry crusted grease in the rudder
> tube.  After dropping the rudder, cleaning out the old, and replacing the
> rudder lubed with SuperLube, resulted in nice smooth steering.  I grease it
> via a cup about once a year.  All remains nice and well.
>
> It sounds easy, but it was a challenge to remove the radial. The bolts
> holding the radial together in my case were galled/corroded in place.
>
> Take a look at by blog post:
> http://svjohannarose.blogspot.com/2014/12/rudder-and-steering.html
>
>
> As for a grease cup, you likely do have one (or had one).  it should be on
> the aft starboard side of the rudder rube.   It is easy to access with the
> steering radial removed.  Regular access requires an arm contortion trick:
> open the deck access plate just aft of the rudder post, stick you arm down
> and twist it under the radial drive disk, then reach towards the rudder
> post.   It should be there.
>
>
>
> -
> Paul E.
> 1981 C&C Landfall 38
> S/V Johanna Rose
> Fort Walton Beach, FL
>
> http://svjohannarose.blogspot.com/
>
>
> On Apr 24, 2019, at 11:10 AM, Camille Cloutier via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> We just signed in the CnC-List mailing list and we would have a question
> concerning our C&C boat Landfall 38. We live in Qu?bec and we are french
> speaking so I'll try to express myself as good as I can :)
>
> We find that the streering wheel is harder to turn then other C&C we have
> tried. We have replace all the wires so we are sure that the problem
> doesn't come from the pedestal. In the instruction manual, they talk about
> a
> grease cup which we don't have. We don't have teflon washer around the
> rudder shaft in the water either.
>
> Does anyone have informations about how the whole rudder system is put
> together so we can recondition it to have a smooth and easy steering wheel
> ?
>
> Thank you very much
>
> Camille
>
>
> ___
>
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
>
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List question

[ssjohnson via CnC-List]

Greetings Camille and welcome to the list!  My LF38 has not had your issue. 
But. When I upgraded the steering pedestal we found that the cockpit sole had 
completely desalinated, so, we had about a 2'x3' piece of marine plywood vacuum 
sealed with fiberglass resin and new holes drilled, with edges sealed,  for the 
pedestal and rudder post.  In retrospect I had noticed a puddle of rainwater 
accumulating around the rudder post.  It was about a $3,500 repair but needed 
to be done.The grease cap is on the aft side of the lower rudder.  I replaced 
it with a grease fitting on a 5' hose leading to a bracket under the strbd 
laserette.  I add a squeeze once a year.  BTW, I've removed and replaced the 
rudder about 6 times.  I finally had it rebuilt by competition composites in 
Ottawa.  Now it is only 150lbs instead of 300 :-oGood luck, Camille!Spencer 
Johnson 84 LF 38 "Alegria " #165Racine, WI___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List question LF38 steering

[Dreuge via CnC-List]

Camille,

I originally had steering which was stiff and somewhat resistant  to turning.  
My problem turned out to be old dry crusted grease in the rudder tube.  After 
dropping the rudder, cleaning out the old, and replacing the rudder lubed with 
SuperLube, resulted in nice smooth steering.  I grease it via a cup about once 
a year.  All remains nice and well.

It sounds easy, but it was a challenge to remove the radial. The bolts holding 
the radial together in my case were galled/corroded in place.  

Take a look at by blog post:  
http://svjohannarose.blogspot.com/2014/12/rudder-and-steering.html 



As for a grease cup, you likely do have one (or had one).  it should be on the 
aft starboard side of the rudder rube.   It is easy to access with the steering 
radial removed.  Regular access requires an arm contortion trick: open the deck 
access plate just aft of the rudder post, stick you arm down and twist it under 
the radial drive disk, then reach towards the rudder post.   It should be there.



-
Paul E.
1981 C&C Landfall 38 
S/V Johanna Rose
Fort Walton Beach, FL

http://svjohannarose.blogspot.com/ 
> 
>> On Apr 24, 2019, at 11:10 AM, Camille Cloutier via CnC-List <
>> cnc-list@cnc-list.com > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> We just signed in the CnC-List mailing list and we would have a question
>> concerning our C&C boat Landfall 38. We live in Qu?bec and we are french
>> speaking so I'll try to express myself as good as I can :)
>> 
>> We find that the streering wheel is harder to turn then other C&C we have
>> tried. We have replace all the wires so we are sure that the problem
>> doesn't come from the pedestal. In the instruction manual, they talk about a
>> grease cup which we don't have. We don't have teflon washer around the
>> rudder shaft in the water either.
>> 
>> Does anyone have informations about how the whole rudder system is put
>> together so we can recondition it to have a smooth and easy steering wheel
>> ?
>> 
>> Thank you very much
>> 
>> Camille

___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List question

[ALAN BERGEN via CnC-List]

Make sure the cables are aligned so that they aren't rubbing on the
quadrant. Then lube the cable, chain and turning blocks with motor oil.
There should also be a delrin washer around the rudder post, under the
collar that keeps the rudder from falling down. You said you don't have a
grease cup, but try looking again. It looks like a small tuna fish can,
mounted on the forward side of the fiberglass surrounding the rudder post.
It should be filled with grease, and when you turn the cap, it forces the
grease around the rudder post.

Alan Bergen
35 Mk III Thirsty
Rose City YC
Portland, OR

On Wed, Apr 24, 2019 at 8:49 AM Robert Boyer via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> I can speak from experience on my LF38.  Your problem is most likely a
> misalignment in the upper rudder bearing--the one mounted right below the
> helm mounted with 4 bolts.  The correction is probably best performed out
> of the water.  Simply loosen the four bolts & move the bearing until the
> steering frees up then tighten the mounting bolts.
>
> If this is not the problem I would add grease to the grease cup on the
> rudder shaft.
>
> Bob
>
> Bob Boyer
> S/V Rainy Days (1983 C&C Landfall 38 - Hull #230)
> Blog: dainyrays.blogspot.com
> 
> Email: dainyr...@icloud.com
> Annapolis, MD
> (Presently in Charleston SC for the winter)
>
> On Apr 24, 2019, at 11:10 AM, Camille Cloutier via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> We just signed in the CnC-List mailing list and we would have a question
> concerning our C&C boat Landfall 38. We live in Québec and we are french
> speaking so I'll try to express myself as good as I can :)
>
> We find that the streering wheel is harder to turn then other C&C we have
> tried. We have replace all the wires so we are sure that the problem
> doesn't come from the pedestal. In the instruction manual, they talk about a
> grease cup which we don't have. We don't have teflon washer around the
> rudder shaft in the water either.
>
> Does anyone have informations about how the whole rudder system is put
> together so we can recondition it to have a smooth and easy steering wheel
> ?
>
> Thank you very much
>
> Camille
>
>
> ___
>
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> 
>
> ___
>
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
> use PayPal to send contribution --
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.paypal.me_stumurray&d=DwICAg&c=clK7kQUTWtAVEOVIgvi0NU5BOUHhpN0H8p7CSfnc_gI&r=9w3G7Cf8YfQnrjmtuNxwDJYr3JMv9f1pAfgAJ9xXYQQ&m=OmDPyR4_3qxJQxfvu8bmm-tOhR2Tm9UsYszPTmt4RF0&s=WEPy5-wMM62cX70Yq93z2KrQ72ELuofpYGXvSMgsDgQ&e=
>
>
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List question

[Robert Boyer via CnC-List]

I can speak from experience on my LF38.  Your problem is most likely a 
misalignment in the upper rudder bearing--the one mounted right below the helm 
mounted with 4 bolts.  The correction is probably best performed out of the 
water.  Simply loosen the four bolts & move the bearing until the steering 
frees up then tighten the mounting bolts.

If this is not the problem I would add grease to the grease cup on the rudder 
shaft.

Bob

Bob Boyer
S/V Rainy Days (1983 C&C Landfall 38 - Hull #230)
Blog: dainyrays.blogspot.com
Email: dainyr...@icloud.com
Annapolis, MD 
(Presently in Charleston SC for the winter)

> On Apr 24, 2019, at 11:10 AM, Camille Cloutier via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi, 
> 
> We just signed in the CnC-List mailing list and we would have a question 
> concerning our C&C boat Landfall 38. We live in Québec and we are french 
> speaking so I'll try to express myself as good as I can :)
> 
> We find that the streering wheel is harder to turn then other C&C we have 
> tried. We have replace all the wires so we are sure that the problem doesn't 
> come from the pedestal. In the instruction manual, they talk about a grease 
> cup which we don't have. We don't have teflon washer around the rudder shaft 
> in the water either.
> 
> Does anyone have informations about how the whole rudder system is put 
> together so we can recondition it to have a smooth and easy steering wheel? 
> 
> Thank you very much
> 
> Camille
> 
> 
> ___
> 
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
> every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use 
> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> 
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question about Maintaining DataMarine Knot meter's sending unit

[Josh Muckley via CnC-List]

You're going to need a tool like a dental pick.  I use my pocket knife.  I
can't imagine any significant damage to the body of the unit and damage to
the o-ring is irrelevant.  There are plastic pry tools available for
delicate tasks but in a pinch you might have luck with the corner of a
credit card.

Josh Muckley
S/V Sea Hawk
1989 C&C 37+
Solomons, MD




On Wed, Mar 27, 2019, 12:10 PM kelly petew via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Hey Listers,
>
> I have an old datamarine knot meter.
>
> For 15 seasons, I have applied a heavy grease to the sending unit
> annually.  That’s it.
>
> Never had a problem until last season when it briefly leaked just after
> launch.  Before I could take any action, the leak stopped.
>
> But remembering this, this season, I decided to replace the two [2] “O”
> rings on the body of the sending unit.
>
> But, being careful not to damage the sending unit, I have been unable to
> remove the old rings by hand.
>
> Can everyone suggest a tool or technique for the removal of the O rings
> without risking damage?
>
>
>
> Thanks!
>
>
>
> Fair Winds,
>
> Pete W.
>
> Siren Song
>
> C&C30MKII
>
> Deltaville, Va.
> ___
>
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
>
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question for Fred and others - Smart Watch apps & connectivity

[Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List]

I had noticed that the sailing software for Smartwatches seems to be paired 
with watches provided by the same vendor.  I did find an app called Ocean 
Sailor but it doesn’t seem to be that useful.  It is more like google maps.

I think I will uninstall Ocean Sailor and try some of the other GPS apps in the 
Samsung Store.  None of them really seem to be that great

Mike
Persistence
Halifax, NS

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Pete 
Shelquist via CnC-List
Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2018 1:46 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Pete Shelquist
Subject: Re: Stus-List Question for Fred and others - Smart Watch apps & 
connectivity

RaceQs runs on the Garmin Vivoactive, but it appears they are moving over to 
Apple Watch

Or you can go with something preloaded from garmin.  At first blush is appears 
the sailing apps are similar, but Quatix definitely has more and it’s currently 
on sale :
https://buy.garmin.com/en-US/US/p/580642





From: CnC-List  On Behalf Of Dennis C. via 
CnC-List
Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2018 11:20 AM
To: CnClist 
Cc: Dennis C. 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Question for Fred and others - Smart Watch apps & 
connectivity

http://raceqs.com/smart-watch/

Dennis C.

On Thu, Dec 27, 2018 at 7:55 AM Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
Hi All

Smart watches have become increasingly popular and tend to slave themselves to 
a smart phone and also have wifi.  I have always thought that it would be nice 
to have a great sailing app running on a smart phone stashed below with the 
watch as a repeater.  Large digits showing GPS speed, Heading Bearing, distance 
to waypoint, etc…  Also be nice to have a nice GPS app when hiking in the 
woods, etc .. that acts like a marine GPS or chartplotter showing tracks, 
distance travelled and the like.  What I have been able to find so far is 
trying to be more like Google Maps or a car style GPS than like either of 
these.  A final very nice option would be the ability to use the wifi 
capability of the boat’s instruments to set up the watch as a repeater for 
speed over water, wind speed, direction, depth etc ….

Persistence has Raymarine i50/60 SDW instruments as well as a Raymarine A65 
chartplotter all networked together.  Watch is Samsung Galaxy watch (42mm), 
phone is Samsung S7 (Android).  Also interested in Apple watch apps since there 
are likely more of them

Thanks and looking forward to an interesting discussion

Mike
Persistence
Halifax, NS
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question for Fred and others - Smart Watch apps & connectivity

[Pete Shelquist via CnC-List]

RaceQs runs on the Garmin Vivoactive, but it appears they are moving over to 
Apple Watch

 

Or you can go with something preloaded from garmin.  At first blush is appears 
the sailing apps are similar, but Quatix definitely has more and it’s currently 
on sale : 

https://buy.garmin.com/en-US/US/p/580642 

 

 

 

 

 

From: CnC-List  On Behalf Of Dennis C. via 
CnC-List
Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2018 11:20 AM
To: CnClist 
Cc: Dennis C. 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Question for Fred and others - Smart Watch apps & 
connectivity

 

http://raceqs.com/smart-watch/

 

Dennis C.

 

On Thu, Dec 27, 2018 at 7:55 AM Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> > wrote:

Hi All

 

Smart watches have become increasingly popular and tend to slave themselves to 
a smart phone and also have wifi.  I have always thought that it would be nice 
to have a great sailing app running on a smart phone stashed below with the 
watch as a repeater.  Large digits showing GPS speed, Heading Bearing, distance 
to waypoint, etc…  Also be nice to have a nice GPS app when hiking in the 
woods, etc .. that acts like a marine GPS or chartplotter showing tracks, 
distance travelled and the like.  What I have been able to find so far is 
trying to be more like Google Maps or a car style GPS than like either of 
these.  A final very nice option would be the ability to use the wifi 
capability of the boat’s instruments to set up the watch as a repeater for 
speed over water, wind speed, direction, depth etc ….  

 

Persistence has Raymarine i50/60 SDW instruments as well as a Raymarine A65 
chartplotter all networked together.  Watch is Samsung Galaxy watch (42mm), 
phone is Samsung S7 (Android).  Also interested in Apple watch apps since there 
are likely more of them

 

Thanks and looking forward to an interesting discussion

 

Mike

Persistence

Halifax, NS

___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question for Fred and others - Smart Watch apps & connectivity

[Dennis C. via CnC-List]

http://raceqs.com/smart-watch/

Dennis C.

On Thu, Dec 27, 2018 at 7:55 AM Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Hi All
>
>
>
> Smart watches have become increasingly popular and tend to slave
> themselves to a smart phone and also have wifi.  I have always thought that
> it would be nice to have a great sailing app running on a smart phone
> stashed below with the watch as a repeater.  Large digits showing GPS
> speed, Heading Bearing, distance to waypoint, etc…  Also be nice to have a
> nice GPS app when hiking in the woods, etc .. that acts like a marine GPS
> or chartplotter showing tracks, distance travelled and the like.  What I
> have been able to find so far is trying to be more like Google Maps or a
> car style GPS than like either of these.  A final very nice option would be
> the ability to use the wifi capability of the boat’s instruments to set up
> the watch as a repeater for speed over water, wind speed, direction, depth
> etc ….
>
>
>
> Persistence has Raymarine i50/60 SDW instruments as well as a Raymarine
> A65 chartplotter all networked together.  Watch is Samsung Galaxy watch
> (42mm), phone is Samsung S7 (Android).  Also interested in Apple watch apps
> since there are likely more of them
>
>
>
> Thanks and looking forward to an interesting discussion
>
>
>
> Mike
>
> Persistence
>
> Halifax, NS
>
> ___
>
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
>
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question for Fred and others - Smart Watch apps & connectivity

[Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List]

Mike,

a bit different tack...

I use a Suunto Ambit 2.0 watch that has a number of features you talk about. It 
has programmable display, where you can set up a number of parameters (GPS 
speed in kt., course, heading, distance travelled, waypoints, track (no map), 
ETA at the next waypoint etc.). I never tried to program it for sailing (other 
than having the SoG, timer and distance to waypoint displayed), but it can be 
done (and I bet that there are already numerous free apps available at the 
Suunto’s Movecount site). The most sophisticated application that I have on the 
phone is my skiing app, which shows the total vertical descent for the day, 
number of runs, last run max speed, last run vertical and last run time. The 
watch records your track (if you want to) and a number of parameters (speed, 
altitude etc. – all stuff that a GPS can collect). The current version is 3.0 
(changed from Ant+ to Bluetooth for connecting to accessories); this does not 
mean much other than you can connect to an Apple phone wirelessly (over BT).

I am not sure if this helps...

Marek
Ottawa, ON

From: Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List
Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2018 08:55
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Hoyt, Mike
Subject: Stus-List Question for Fred and others - Smart Watch apps & 
connectivity

Hi All

Smart watches have become increasingly popular and tend to slave themselves to 
a smart phone and also have wifi.  I have always thought that it would be nice 
to have a great sailing app running on a smart phone stashed below with the 
watch as a repeater.  Large digits showing GPS speed, Heading Bearing, distance 
to waypoint, etc…  Also be nice to have a nice GPS app when hiking in the 
woods, etc .. that acts like a marine GPS or chartplotter showing tracks, 
distance travelled and the like.  What I have been able to find so far is 
trying to be more like Google Maps or a car style GPS than like either of 
these.  A final very nice option would be the ability to use the wifi 
capability of the boat’s instruments to set up the watch as a repeater for 
speed over water, wind speed, direction, depth etc ….

Persistence has Raymarine i50/60 SDW instruments as well as a Raymarine A65 
chartplotter all networked together.  Watch is Samsung Galaxy watch (42mm), 
phone is Samsung S7 (Android).  Also interested in Apple watch apps since there 
are likely more of them

Thanks and looking forward to an interesting discussion

Mike
Persistence
Halifax, NS
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question about anchor light

[Matthew Schlanger via CnC-List]

Thanks for all the comments. I ended up getting it apart and just changing out 
the bulb for an LED.

Good to know about the new alternatives. I did seal it up with some silicon 
putting it back together.

Thanks

Matt

> On May 7, 2018, at 1:28 PM, Francois Rivard  
> wrote:
> 
> Hi Matt, 
> 
> When I took my mast down I took a good look at the brittle dried-up housing, 
> crazed plastic lens, and iffy led conversion on the existing unit and threw 
> it in the trash.  I replaced it with the SignalMate tricolor 
> (https://signalmate.com/navigation-light-models/combination-tri-color-with-anchor-2-wire/
>  
> )
> 
> They claim it's made to mil specs... I believe it.  It's completely sealed, 
> the machining and anodizing on the housing is beautiful, and the lens is nice 
> and thick.  
> 
> It's pricey but to me, worth every penny as it is completely "install it and 
> forget it".  Living in Georgia my mast does not come down very often so no 
> maintenance is a big plus. As a bonus it's by far the brightest mast light on 
> the lake, I consider it cheap insurance against drunken pontoon pilots.  
> 
> Good luck with the project. 
> 
> Best Regards, 
> 
> -Francois Rivard
> 1990 34+ "Take Five"
> Lake Lanier, GA
> 
> 

___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question about anchor light

[Dennis C. via CnC-List]

The list might find this informative:

https://www.dco.uscg.mil/Portals/9/DCO%20Documents/5p/CG-5PC/INV/Alerts/1015.pdf

Dennis C.

On Tue, May 8, 2018 at 5:32 PM, Rick Brass via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Regarding “certified” lights:
>
>
>
> We’ve had this discussion several times on the list.
>
>
>
> If you are a manufacturer and building a boat for sale in the US, you must
> use lights that have been tested and certified to meet the specifications
> set by the USCG. That requirement is included in the CFRs (Consolidated
> Federal Regulations), I think in part 46 but I’m not certain and don’t have
> the time to look it up at the moment.
>
>
>
> If you are a boat owner, you are required by the COLREGS to use lights
> that meet or exceed the visibility standards of the COLREGS, which are
> basically color, angle of view, and distance at which they can be seen
> based on the size and operation of the boat.
>
>
>
> Nowhere in US law is there a requirement that you purchase “certified”
> lights, or lights from the original source used by the OEM.
>
>
>
> Rick Brass
>
> Washington, NC
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] *On Behalf Of 
> *Francois
> Rivard via CnC-List
> *Sent:* Tuesday, May 8, 2018 11:33 AM
> *To:* Chuck S 
> *Cc:* Francois Rivard ;
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> *Subject:* Re: Stus-List Question about anchor light
>
>
>
> Hi Chuck,
>
>
>
> The MarineBeam and most of the units in that price range "meet or exceed"
> the certification guidelines but are not actually certified.  As I
> understood it the certification process was expensive and they pass the
> cost to you.
>
>
>
> Some folks said online that if your masthead unit is not certified you may
> run into insurance issues if you ever made a claim.  I'm not sure if that's
> actually substantiated.
>
>
>
> -Francois
>
> 1990 34+ "Take Five"
>
> Lake Lanier, GA
>
>
>
>
>
> ___
>
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
>
>
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question about anchor light

[Rick Brass via CnC-List]

Regarding “certified” lights:

 

We’ve had this discussion several times on the list. 

 

If you are a manufacturer and building a boat for sale in the US, you must use 
lights that have been tested and certified to meet the specifications set by 
the USCG. That requirement is included in the CFRs (Consolidated Federal 
Regulations), I think in part 46 but I’m not certain and don’t have the time to 
look it up at the moment.

 

If you are a boat owner, you are required by the COLREGS to use lights that 
meet or exceed the visibility standards of the COLREGS, which are basically 
color, angle of view, and distance at which they can be seen based on the size 
and operation of the boat.

 

Nowhere in US law is there a requirement that you purchase “certified” lights, 
or lights from the original source used by the OEM.

 

Rick Brass

Washington, NC

 

 

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Francois 
Rivard via CnC-List
Sent: Tuesday, May 8, 2018 11:33 AM
To: Chuck S 
Cc: Francois Rivard ; cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Subject: Re: Stus-List Question about anchor light

 

Hi Chuck, 

 

The MarineBeam and most of the units in that price range "meet or exceed" the 
certification guidelines but are not actually certified.  As I understood it 
the certification process was expensive and they pass the cost to you.  

 

Some folks said online that if your masthead unit is not certified you may run 
into insurance issues if you ever made a claim.  I'm not sure if that's 
actually substantiated. 

 

-Francois

1990 34+ "Take Five"

Lake Lanier, GA

 

 

___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question about anchor light

[Francois Rivard via CnC-List]

Hi Chuck,

I looked at those as well.  They did not have the Strobe at the time, to
get the strobe you had to go DIY.  It has nice features.  The main
difference in price is the certification and the machined aluminum case.
The MarineBeam and most of the units in that price range "meet or exceed"
the certification guidelines but are not actually certified.  As I
understood it the certification process was expensive and they pass the
cost to you.

Some folks said online that if your masthead unit is not certified you may
run into insurance issues if you ever made a claim.  I'm not sure if that's
actually substantiated. The machined aluminum case will definitely be more
impervious to the elements.  Since my mast stay up for extended periods I
figured that in the big scheme of things it's worth the extra 200 bucks.

One could make the argument that the plastic units cost 1/3 therefore they
only have to last 1/3 long to break even and you keep your money all
along.  That's a fair argument.  I went for the "less likely to have to
climb the mast" side of things.  I don't have the mast climbing equipment
and paying a guy to do it for me is about 80-100 bucks round trip as I
found out last year.

Tomatoes / Tomahtoes   :-)


-Francois
1990 34+ "Take Five"
Lake Lanier, GA

On Mon, May 7, 2018 at 7:36 PM, Chuck S  wrote:

> Responding late to the discussion. My mast is out so I am replacing all
> the light fixtures and wiring and selected MarineBeam's Anchor
> Light/tri-color/Strobe Combo that works with two wires.
> https://store.marinebeam.com/smart-led-tri-color-anchor-
> light-and-strobe-n3-tri-cmb/
> I tested the light and it is very very bright and works just like they
> claim and the strobe flashes S-O-S. Lots of features for $109 and it seems
> very well made. We'll see how it holds up.
>
> Replaced the VHF antenna wire too.
>
> On May 7, 2018 at 1:34 PM Matthew Schlanger via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
> Thanks.
> Still thinking a white anchor light, but you reflect my experience, at the
> last minute I started thinking just change it out.
>
> Matt
>
> On May 7, 2018, at 1:28 PM, Francois Rivard 
> wrote:
>
> Hi Matt,
>
> When I took my mast down I took a good look at the brittle dried-up
> housing, crazed plastic lens, and iffy led conversion on the existing unit
> and threw it in the trash.  I replaced it with the SignalMate tricolor (
> https://signalmate.com/navigation-light-models/combination-tri-color-with-
> anchor-2-wire/)
>
> They claim it's made to mil specs... I believe it.  It's completely
> sealed, the machining and anodizing on the housing is beautiful, and the
> lens is nice and thick.
>
> It's pricey but to me, worth every penny as it is completely "install it
> and forget it".  Living in Georgia my mast does not come down very often so
> no maintenance is a big plus. As a bonus it's by far the brightest mast
> light on the lake, I consider it cheap insurance against drunken pontoon
> pilots.
>
> Good luck with the project.
>
> Best Regards,
>
> -Francois Rivard
> 1990 34+ "Take Five"
> Lake Lanier, GA
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ___
>
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and
> every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use
> PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
>
>
>
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question about anchor light

[Matthew Schlanger via CnC-List]

Bill,

How did you get the unit apart? I took off the plate on top with the two screws.
Didn’t do much.
I tried unscrewing it but reached a point where I didn’t want to break it.
What’s the secret?

Tomorrow I was going to either manhandle it until it breaks or unscrews, then 
replace with whatever they have locally or just change the bulb for an LED.
 
And I am confused now, isn’t an anchor light just white. 360 degrees. What’s 
with the tricolor variety?

I left my Davis on and someone stomped it so I upgraded the LED when I got the 
new Davis from Defender. The old one had the lens separated from the base, I 
don’t know if it was from impact or just age.

Thanks Matt

> On May 7, 2018, at 2:44 PM, Bill Coleman via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> I wish this had all happened several hours ago, Just this morning I ordered 
> all the stuff I had on my screen from Defender, including a replacement 
> Series 40 stack AquaSignal Lens, because the old one was so crazed.
> Then I ordered the tri light from marinebeam, and the anchor light, the link 
> to that is
>  
> https://store.marinebeam.com/bay15d-replacement-led-bulb-for-aqua-signal-series-40-50-55/
>  
> <https://store.marinebeam.com/bay15d-replacement-led-bulb-for-aqua-signal-series-40-50-55/>
>  
> Matt, if you just replace the anchor light, this is probably the one.
> But, Now I am thinking of this SignalMate of Francois, it looks really nice. 
> Would also eliminate the Davis Windex light I just ordered.
> But, I see it is still polycarbonate, so I am guessing it will craze as well. 
>  But I will probably be dead by then, so I guess it doesn’t matter. . . 
>  
> Bill Coleman
> C&C 39 Erie, PA
>  
> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Matthew 
> Schlanger via CnC-List
> Sent: Monday, May 07, 2018 1:35 PM
> To: Francois Rivard
> Cc: Matthew Schlanger; cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Question about anchor light
>  
> Thanks.
> Still thinking a white anchor light, but you reflect my experience, at the 
> last minute I started thinking just change it out.
>  
> Matt
>  
>> On May 7, 2018, at 1:28 PM, Francois Rivard > <mailto:jeanfrancoisriv...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>>  
>> Hi Matt, 
>>  
>> When I took my mast down I took a good look at the brittle dried-up housing, 
>> crazed plastic lens, and iffy led conversion on the existing unit and threw 
>> it in the trash.  I replaced it with the SignalMate tricolor 
>> (https://signalmate.com/navigation-light-models/combination-tri-color-with-anchor-2-wire/
>>  
>> <https://signalmate.com/navigation-light-models/combination-tri-color-with-anchor-2-wire/>)
>>  
>> They claim it's made to mil specs... I believe it.  It's completely sealed, 
>> the machining and anodizing on the housing is beautiful, and the lens is 
>> nice and thick.  
>>  
>> It's pricey but to me, worth every penny as it is completely "install it and 
>> forget it".  Living in Georgia my mast does not come down very often so no 
>> maintenance is a big plus. As a bonus it's by far the brightest mast light 
>> on the lake, I consider it cheap insurance against drunken pontoon pilots.  
>>  
>> Good luck with the project. 
>>  
>> Best Regards, 
>>  
>> -Francois Rivard
>> 1990 34+ "Take Five"
>> Lake Lanier, GA
>>  
>>  
> 
>  
> ___
> 
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
> every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use 
> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray 
> <https://www.paypal.me/stumurray>
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question about anchor light

[Chuck S via CnC-List]

Responding late to the discussion. My mast is out so I am replacing all the 
light fixtures and wiring and selected MarineBeam's Anchor 
Light/tri-color/Strobe Combo that works with two wires. 
https://store.marinebeam.com/smart-led-tri-color-anchor-light-and-strobe-n3-tri-cmb/
I tested the light and it is very very bright and works just like they claim 
and the strobe flashes S-O-S. Lots of features for $109 and it seems very well 
made. We'll see how it holds up.

Replaced the VHF antenna wire too.


> On May 7, 2018 at 1:34 PM Matthew Schlanger via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Thanks.
> Still thinking a white anchor light, but you reflect my experience, at 
> the last minute I started thinking just change it out.
> 
> Matt
> 
> 
> > > On May 7, 2018, at 1:28 PM, Francois Rivard 
> mailto:jeanfrancoisriv...@gmail.com > wrote:
> > 
> > Hi Matt, 
> > 
> > When I took my mast down I took a good look at the brittle dried-up 
> > housing, crazed plastic lens, and iffy led conversion on the existing unit 
> > and threw it in the trash.  I replaced it with the SignalMate tricolor 
> > (https://signalmate.com/navigation-light-models/combination-tri-color-with-anchor-2-wire/)
> > 
> > They claim it's made to mil specs... I believe it.  It's completely 
> > sealed, the machining and anodizing on the housing is beautiful, and the 
> > lens is nice and thick.  
> > 
> > It's pricey but to me, worth every penny as it is completely 
> > "install it and forget it".  Living in Georgia my mast does not come down 
> > very often so no maintenance is a big plus. As a bonus it's by far the 
> > brightest mast light on the lake, I consider it cheap insurance against 
> > drunken pontoon pilots.  
> > 
> > Good luck with the project. 
> > 
> > Best Regards, 
> > 
> > -Francois Rivard
> > 1990 34+ "Take Five"
> > Lake Lanier, GA
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > > 
> 
 

> ___
> 
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each 
> and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use 
> PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> 
> 
 
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question about anchor light

[Matthew Schlanger via CnC-List]

Yes I put a new one on that was LED. I agree.

Thanks

> On May 7, 2018, at 1:53 PM, Francois Rivard  
> wrote:
> 
> I understand.  
> 
> Another thing I forgot to mention is the built-in Windex light.  If you sail 
> at night it's really nice to have.  
> 
> Decisions, Decisions... 
> 
> I hope it works out to your liking!
> 
>> -Francois Rivard
>> 1990 34+ "Take Five"
>> Lake Lanier, GA
> 
> 
> On Mon, May 7, 2018 at 1:34 PM, Matthew Schlanger  > wrote:
> Thanks.
> Still thinking a white anchor light, but you reflect my experience, at the 
> last minute I started thinking just change it out.
> 
> Matt
> 
>> On May 7, 2018, at 1:28 PM, Francois Rivard > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Matt, 
>> 
>> When I took my mast down I took a good look at the brittle dried-up housing, 
>> crazed plastic lens, and iffy led conversion on the existing unit and threw 
>> it in the trash.  I replaced it with the SignalMate tricolor 
>> (https://signalmate.com/navigation-light-models/combination-tri-color-with-anchor-2-wire/
>>  
>> )
>> 
>> They claim it's made to mil specs... I believe it.  It's completely sealed, 
>> the machining and anodizing on the housing is beautiful, and the lens is 
>> nice and thick.  
>> 
>> It's pricey but to me, worth every penny as it is completely "install it and 
>> forget it".  Living in Georgia my mast does not come down very often so no 
>> maintenance is a big plus. As a bonus it's by far the brightest mast light 
>> on the lake, I consider it cheap insurance against drunken pontoon pilots.  
>> 
>> Good luck with the project. 
>> 
>> Best Regards, 
>> 
>> -Francois Rivard
>> 1990 34+ "Take Five"
>> Lake Lanier, GA
>> 
>> 
> 
> 

___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question about anchor light

[Bill Coleman via CnC-List]

I wish this had all happened several hours ago, Just this morning I ordered
all the stuff I had on my screen from Defender, including a replacement
Series 40 stack AquaSignal Lens, because the old one was so crazed.

Then I ordered the tri light from marinebeam, and the anchor light, the link
to that is

 

https://store.marinebeam.com/bay15d-replacement-led-bulb-for-aqua-signal-ser
ies-40-50-55/

 

Matt, if you just replace the anchor light, this is probably the one.

But, Now I am thinking of this SignalMate of Francois, it looks really nice.
Would also eliminate the Davis Windex light I just ordered.

But, I see it is still polycarbonate, so I am guessing it will craze as
well.  But I will probably be dead by then, so I guess it doesn't matter. .
. 

 

Bill Coleman

C&C 39 Erie, PAanimated_favicon1

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Matthew
Schlanger via CnC-List
Sent: Monday, May 07, 2018 1:35 PM
To: Francois Rivard
Cc: Matthew Schlanger; cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Subject: Re: Stus-List Question about anchor light

 

Thanks.

Still thinking a white anchor light, but you reflect my experience, at the
last minute I started thinking just change it out.

 

Matt

 

On May 7, 2018, at 1:28 PM, Francois Rivard 
wrote:

 

Hi Matt, 

 

When I took my mast down I took a good look at the brittle dried-up housing,
crazed plastic lens, and iffy led conversion on the existing unit and threw
it in the trash.  I replaced it with the SignalMate tricolor
(https://signalmate.com/navigation-light-models/combination-tri-color-with-a
nchor-2-wire/)

 

They claim it's made to mil specs... I believe it.  It's completely sealed,
the machining and anodizing on the housing is beautiful, and the lens is
nice and thick.  

 

It's pricey but to me, worth every penny as it is completely "install it and
forget it".  Living in Georgia my mast does not come down very often so no
maintenance is a big plus. As a bonus it's by far the brightest mast light
on the lake, I consider it cheap insurance against drunken pontoon pilots.  

 

Good luck with the project. 

 

Best Regards, 

 

-Francois Rivard

1990 34+ "Take Five"

Lake Lanier, GA

 

 

 

___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question about anchor light

[Francois Rivard via CnC-List]

I understand.

Another thing I forgot to mention is the built-in Windex light.  If you
sail at night it's really nice to have.

Decisions, Decisions...

I hope it works out to your liking!

-Francois Rivard
1990 34+ "Take Five"
Lake Lanier, GA


On Mon, May 7, 2018 at 1:34 PM, Matthew Schlanger 
wrote:

> Thanks.
> Still thinking a white anchor light, but you reflect my experience, at the
> last minute I started thinking just change it out.
>
> Matt
>
> On May 7, 2018, at 1:28 PM, Francois Rivard 
> wrote:
>
> Hi Matt,
>
> When I took my mast down I took a good look at the brittle dried-up
> housing, crazed plastic lens, and iffy led conversion on the existing unit
> and threw it in the trash.  I replaced it with the SignalMate tricolor (
> https://signalmate.com/navigation-light-models/combination-tri-color-with-
> anchor-2-wire/)
>
> They claim it's made to mil specs... I believe it.  It's completely
> sealed, the machining and anodizing on the housing is beautiful, and the
> lens is nice and thick.
>
> It's pricey but to me, worth every penny as it is completely "install it
> and forget it".  Living in Georgia my mast does not come down very often so
> no maintenance is a big plus. As a bonus it's by far the brightest mast
> light on the lake, I consider it cheap insurance against drunken pontoon
> pilots.
>
> Good luck with the project.
>
> Best Regards,
>
> -Francois Rivard
> 1990 34+ "Take Five"
> Lake Lanier, GA
>
>
>
>
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question about anchor light

[Jim Reinardy via CnC-List]

Matt,
 
I would 2nd the recommendation on Marinebeam.  They will have both the LED 
replacement bulb you would need or a new fixture.  My fixture was in pretty 
good shape so I bought the bulb last year.  I don't generally spend much time 
at anchor so I can't say it got a workout, but it always tests fine.
 
Jim Reinardy
C&C 30-2 "Firewater"
Milwaukee, WI
 
- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Stus-List Question about 
anchor light
From: "Matthew Schlanger via CnC-List" 
Date: 5/7/18 10:34 am
To: "Francois Rivard" 
Cc: "Matthew Schlanger" , cnc-list@cnc-list.com

Thanks. Still thinking a white anchor light, but you reflect my experience, at 
the last minute I started thinking just change it out.
 
Matt

On May 7, 2018, at 1:28 PM, Francois Rivard  
wrote:

  Hi Matt,   
When I took my mast down I took a good look at the brittle dried-up housing, 
crazed plastic lens, and iffy led conversion on the existing unit and threw it 
in the trash.  I replaced it with the SignalMate tricolor 
(https://signalmate.com/navigation-light-models/combination-tri-color-with-anchor-2-wire/)
 
They claim it's made to mil specs... I believe it.  It's completely sealed, the 
machining and anodizing on the housing is beautiful, and the lens is nice and 
thick.  
 
It's pricey but to me, worth every penny as it is completely "install it and 
forget it".  Living in Georgia my mast does not come down very often so no 
maintenance is a big plus. As a bonus it's by far the brightest mast light on 
the lake, I consider it cheap insurance against drunken pontoon pilots.  
 
Good luck with the project. 
 
Best Regards, 
 
-Francois Rivard
1990 34+ "Take Five"
Lake Lanier, GA
 
 


 


___ Thanks everyone for supporting 
this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. 
If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- 
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question about anchor light

[Matthew Schlanger via CnC-List]

Thanks.
Still thinking a white anchor light, but you reflect my experience, at the last 
minute I started thinking just change it out.

Matt

> On May 7, 2018, at 1:28 PM, Francois Rivard  
> wrote:
> 
> Hi Matt, 
> 
> When I took my mast down I took a good look at the brittle dried-up housing, 
> crazed plastic lens, and iffy led conversion on the existing unit and threw 
> it in the trash.  I replaced it with the SignalMate tricolor 
> (https://signalmate.com/navigation-light-models/combination-tri-color-with-anchor-2-wire/
>  
> )
> 
> They claim it's made to mil specs... I believe it.  It's completely sealed, 
> the machining and anodizing on the housing is beautiful, and the lens is nice 
> and thick.  
> 
> It's pricey but to me, worth every penny as it is completely "install it and 
> forget it".  Living in Georgia my mast does not come down very often so no 
> maintenance is a big plus. As a bonus it's by far the brightest mast light on 
> the lake, I consider it cheap insurance against drunken pontoon pilots.  
> 
> Good luck with the project. 
> 
> Best Regards, 
> 
> -Francois Rivard
> 1990 34+ "Take Five"
> Lake Lanier, GA
> 
> 

___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question about anchor light

[Frederick G Street via CnC-List]

Matthew — I replaced my ancient (and ineffective) anchor light and separate 
tricolor last year with one of these:

https://store.marinebeam.com/led-tri-color-and-all-around-anchor-navigation-stack-light-n4-tri-124/
 


The MarineBeam gear is well-built, and performs very well, generally exceeding 
USCG requirements for visibility and color.  Given the propensity of 
festoon-type lamps to be a bit loose, I’d say replace the whole darn thing and 
be done with it.  You should be able to reuse the existing wiring, unless it’s 
badly corroded; on our older boats, C&C did NOT use tinned wire, and much of 
the old lamp-cord wiring in our old masts was not good to begin with, and has 
definitely not aged well…

— Fred

Fred Street -- Minneapolis
S/V Oceanis (1979 C&C Landfall 38) -- on the hard in Bayfield, WI   :^(

> On May 7, 2018, at 10:38 AM, Matthew Schlanger via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> My mast is down and I was thinking of changing out the bulb on my anchor 
> light to an LED.
> On my C&C 35 Mk3 I have a Aqua Signal Series 40 All-Round Navigation Light.
> First, for the life of me I can’t unscrew it, I don’t want to break the thing.
> Then if someone reveals the secret to getting it apart, any info on what LED 
> units to use?
> The aqua site is opaque and yet warns against after market LEDs, and I want 
> to go in the water this weekend if possible so can’t wait for a long shipment.
> 
> Then thinking maybe I just upgrade to a new unit, fresh and sealed, does 
> anyone have a good recommendation? Or suggestions on what to avoid?
> 
> The easy thing is to leave it alone, yet I think I would sleep better on the 
> hook with an LED.
> 
> Thanks in advance.
> 
> Matthew Schlanger
> The Office
> C&C 35 Mk3
> South Nyack, NY
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question about anchor light

[Matthew Wolford via CnC-List]

I like my Hella.

Sent from my iPhone

> On May 7, 2018, at 11:38 AM, Matthew Schlanger via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> My mast is down and I was thinking of changing out the bulb on my anchor 
> light to an LED.
> On my C&C 35 Mk3 I have a Aqua Signal Series 40 All-Round Navigation Light.
> First, for the life of me I can’t unscrew it, I don’t want to break the thing.
> Then if someone reveals the secret to getting it apart, any info on what LED 
> units to use?
> The aqua site is opaque and yet warns against after market LEDs, and I want 
> to go in the water this weekend if possible so can’t wait for a long shipment.
> 
> Then thinking maybe I just upgrade to a new unit, fresh and sealed, does 
> anyone have a good recommendation? Or suggestions on what to avoid?
> 
> The easy thing is to leave it alone, yet I think I would sleep better on the 
> hook with an LED.
> 
> Thanks in advance.
> 
> Matthew Schlanger
> The Office
> C&C 35 Mk3
> South Nyack, NY
> 
> 
> ___
> 
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
> every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use 
> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> 


___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question about anchor light

[Dennis C. via CnC-List]

Marinebeam.com

Dennis C. 

Sent from my iPhone

> On May 7, 2018, at 10:38 AM, Matthew Schlanger via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> My mast is down and I was thinking of changing out the bulb on my anchor 
> light to an LED.
> On my C&C 35 Mk3 I have a Aqua Signal Series 40 All-Round Navigation Light.
> First, for the life of me I can’t unscrew it, I don’t want to break the thing.
> Then if someone reveals the secret to getting it apart, any info on what LED 
> units to use?
> The aqua site is opaque and yet warns against after market LEDs, and I want 
> to go in the water this weekend if possible so can’t wait for a long shipment.
> 
> Then thinking maybe I just upgrade to a new unit, fresh and sealed, does 
> anyone have a good recommendation? Or suggestions on what to avoid?
> 
> The easy thing is to leave it alone, yet I think I would sleep better on the 
> hook with an LED.
> 
> Thanks in advance.
> 
> Matthew Schlanger
> The Office
> C&C 35 Mk3
> South Nyack, NY
> 
> 
> ___
> 
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
> every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use 
> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> 

___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question about anchor light

[Joel Aronson via CnC-List]

Matt,

Are there 2 screws in the top?

Look at this option:

https://www.defender.com/product3.jsp?name=dr.-led-white-polar-star-40-navigation-led-replacement-bulb&path=-1|65136|2312550|2312566|2312568&id=1200640

Joel

On Mon, May 7, 2018 at 11:38 AM, Matthew Schlanger via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> My mast is down and I was thinking of changing out the bulb on my anchor
> light to an LED.
> On my C&C 35 Mk3 I have a Aqua Signal Series 40 All-Round Navigation Light.
> First, for the life of me I can’t unscrew it, I don’t want to break the
> thing.
> Then if someone reveals the secret to getting it apart, any info on what
> LED units to use?
> The aqua site is opaque and yet warns against after market LEDs, and I
> want to go in the water this weekend if possible so can’t wait for a long
> shipment.
>
> Then thinking maybe I just upgrade to a new unit, fresh and sealed, does
> anyone have a good recommendation? Or suggestions on what to avoid?
>
> The easy thing is to leave it alone, yet I think I would sleep better on
> the hook with an LED.
>
> Thanks in advance.
>
> Matthew Schlanger
> The Office
> C&C 35 Mk3
> South Nyack, NY
>
>
> ___
>
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
>


-- 
Joel
301 541 8551
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question about bleeding a Yanmar 3GM30F

[Nauset Beach via CnC-List]

Hi Russ, 

 

There is an unknown number of inches of air now “trapped” in the system but 
would estimate at least 12” if not more based on the height of the fuel level 
in the tank [and therefore within the pickup tube] plus the fitting on top of 
the tank and whatever length of hose fuel dribbled out of when I disconnected 
the hose from the pickup fitting.  Then there is 9-10 feet of fuel in the hose 
to reach the fuel pump on the engine.  

 

To my knowledge, the engine is not self bleeding.  If it were then just running 
the engine should solve the issue.  Can anyone confirm if that would work? I 
could try to start the engine and let it run on that 9-10’ of fuel but assumed 
once that air bubble reached the engine it would stall out.  Am on land so 
cannot run the engine with a load.  

 

In previous years I have bled the system at the secondary filter and the HP 
pump using the finger lever on the fuel pump, but never needed to bleed the 
injectors.  Reading online seems to indicate that is a 2 person job with one 
pressing the starter button to turn over the engine while the other monitors 
each injector and closes the bleed screw when solid fuel comes out.  Am working 
solo on this and am not sure I could turn the crankshaft by hand with the 
compression valves open, if that would work.  

 

Using the manual pump and cracking open the bleed screw on the secondary fuel 
filter should work, it just will take a while and push that 9-10’ of fuel in 
the hose out onto oil absorb pads and of course all over the side of the 
engine.  Was hoping there was a better [cleaner and faster] way.  

 

Have read about annealing the copper washers [probably on this list years ago] 
but figured Mr Murphy would stop by with his impeccable timing if I tried to do 
that…

 

Thanks,

Brian

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Russ & 
Melody via CnC-List
Sent: Sunday, May 06, 2018 11:48 AM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Russ & Melody 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Question about bleeding a Yanmar 3GM30F

 


Hi Brian,

>From your description posted a while ago, you do not have a system full of 
>air. Nor do you have a filter full of air. You have at most a few inches of 
>air in the tank pick-up & hose rune. Is this still the case?

Isn't this Yanmar a self-bleeding version once it's running?

BTW, copper washers as easily annealed using a propane torch. Google for the 
method. Then they are reusable.

Cheers, Russ
Sweet 35 mk-1

At 08:22 AM 5/6/2018, you wrote:



Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
 boundary="=_NextPart_000_0003_01D3E52C.7D8F9580"
Content-Language: en-us

Josh, nice videos.  The priming bulb would be great to have to facilitate this 
process.  May install one next time I change the fuel filters and am not under 
time pressure to get the boat launched…Â  Â Am still on the hard over an 
hour’s drive away with an early Thursday AM launch time.  
 
Can the seal washers from McMaster be tightened multiple times?  Unlike the 
Yanmar copper washers…Â Â  Do you have specific seal washers at McMaster that 
work in the Yanmar fuel system?  Have replaced the 8 and 12 mm Yanmar washers 
when replacing the fuel filter housing.  A “professional” mechanic had 
over tightened the supply banjo bolt stripping the threads.  
 
Found this suggestion on line and not sure if it makes sense; not sure if this 
would force the air past / through the injectors leave the system fully primed. 
 Do not want to cause more problems:  
 
“If your fuel system is now filled with air, I would try the following. 
Engage the decompression levers, close the cooling water thru hull, pull the 
engine stop, and then spin the engine using the starter. Hopefully that will 
pull fuel through the system and return any air back to the tank. If you just 
try to start the engine and air is the system, you will get air into the high 
pressure injector lines and starting will be a problem.”  
 
May just go the route Edd suggested and do it manually…Â  
 
Any other suggestions? 
 
Thanks,
Brian
 

 


 
<http://www.avg.com/email-signature?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient>
 

Virus-free.  
<http://www.avg.com/email-signature?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient>
 www.avg.com 

 

___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question about bleeding a Yanmar 3GM30F

[Russ & Melody via CnC-List]

Hi Brian,

From your description posted a while ago, you do
not have a system full of air. Nor do you have a
filter full of air. You have at most a few inches
of air in the tank pick-up & hose rune. Is this still the case?

Isn't this Yanmar a self-bleeding version once it's running?

BTW, copper washers as easily annealed using a
propane torch. Google for the method. Then they are reusable.

Cheers, Russ
Sweet 35 mk-1

At 08:22 AM 5/6/2018, you wrote:

Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
boundary="=_NextPart_000_0003_01D3E52C.7D8F9580"
Content-Language: en-us

Josh, nice videos.  The priming bulb would be
great to have to facilitate this process.  May
install one next time I change the fuel filters
and am not under time pressure to get the boat
launched…Â   Am still on the hard over an
hour’s drive away with an early Thursday AM launch time.Â

Can the seal washers from McMaster be tightened
multiple times?  Unlike the Yanmar copper
washers…Â   Do you have specific seal washers
at McMaster that work in the Yanmar fuel
system?  Have replaced the 8 and 12 mm Yanmar
washers when replacing the fuel filter
housing.  A “professional” mechanic had
over tightened the supply banjo bolt stripping the threads.Â

Found this suggestion on line and not sure if it
makes sense; not sure if this would force the
air past / through the injectors leave the
system fully primed. Â Do not want to cause more problems:Â

“If your fuel system is now filled with air, I
would try the following. Engage the
decompression levers, close the cooling water
thru hull, pull the engine stop, and then spin
the engine using the starter. Hopefully that
will pull fuel through the system and return any
air back to the tank. If you just try to start
the engine and air is the system, you will get
air into the high pressure injector lines and starting will be a problem.”Â

May just go the route Edd suggested and do it manually…Â

Any other suggestions?

Thanks,
Brian




---
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
http://www.avg.com
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question about bleeding a Yanmar 3GM30F

[Nauset Beach via CnC-List]

Josh, nice videos.  The priming bulb would be great to have to facilitate this 
process.  May install one next time I change the fuel filters and am not under 
time pressure to get the boat launched…   Am still on the hard over an hour’s 
drive away with an early Thursday AM launch time.  

 

Can the seal washers from McMaster be tightened multiple times?  Unlike the 
Yanmar copper washers…   Do you have specific seal washers at McMaster that 
work in the Yanmar fuel system?  Have replaced the 8 and 12 mm Yanmar washers 
when replacing the fuel filter housing.  A “professional” mechanic had over 
tightened the supply banjo bolt stripping the threads.  

 

Found this suggestion on line and not sure if it makes sense; not sure if this 
would force the air past / through the injectors leave the system fully primed. 
 Do not want to cause more problems:  

 

“If your fuel system is now filled with air, I would try the following. Engage 
the decompression levers, close the cooling water thru hull, pull the engine 
stop, and then spin the engine using the starter. Hopefully that will pull fuel 
through the system and return any air back to the tank. If you just try to 
start the engine and air is the system, you will get air into the high pressure 
injector lines and starting will be a problem.”  

 

May just go the route Edd suggested and do it manually…  

 

Any other suggestions? 

 

Thanks,

Brian

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Josh Muckley 
via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, May 04, 2018 8:26 PM
To: C&C List 
Cc: Josh Muckley 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Question about bleeding a Yanmar 3GM30F

 

I have found that the 3HM35F (almost the same engine) primes very easily.  I 
make more than problems by opening the official bleed screws.  They will 
perpetually leak.  In fact, I JB welded the screw on the engine filter and the 
HP pump in place.  I have replaced the associated banjo fitting copper washers 
with seal washers.  Yanmar makes some which I can provide the part numbers for 
or you can use seal washers from McMaster-Carr.  This was a huge upgrade that 
completely eliminated fuel and air leaks.

 

I have also installed a priming bulb in the fuel supply line which helps prime 
the entire system including the racor.  When I prime the system I prime the 
racor and then I only loosen the fuel banjo fitting into the engine filter.  
Once it is clear I loosen the banjo at the HP pump.  2 points and that's it.  
With copper washers you need to replace them but with seal washers they are 
reusable.

 

https://youtu.be/mdHIt14l0R8

 

https://youtu.be/H-GI38vE4hQ

 

Josh Muckley

S/V Sea Hawk 

1989 C&C 37+

Solomons, MD 

 

On Fri, May 4, 2018, 6:06 PM Nauset Beach via CnC-List mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> > wrote:

I pulled the fuel hose off the tank pickup nipple as part of cleaning the tank 
– though did not really need to do so.  Now presumably there is some air in the 
fuel hose.  

 

Do I have to bleed that air using the tiny manual fuel pump on the side of the 
engine?  Or can I try to start the engine [it has been winterized for 6 months] 
and hopefully pull the air “bubble” to the fuel filter / engine?  There is ~ 6’ 
of fuel hose from the tank to a Racor, then another 4’ of fuel hose to reach 
the fuel pump, so it would take a long time and be quite a bit of fuel that is 
pumped out of the small Yanmar fuel filter bleed screw.  Hoping to minimize the 
time and inevitable diesel dribbles on the side of the engine.  

 

Thanks,

Brian

___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question about bleeding a Yanmar 3GM30F

[Josh Muckley via CnC-List]

I have found that the 3HM35F (almost the same engine) primes very easily.
I make more than problems by opening the official bleed screws.  They will
perpetually leak.  In fact, I JB welded the screw on the engine filter and
the HP pump in place.  I have replaced the associated banjo fitting copper
washers with seal washers.  Yanmar makes some which I can provide the part
numbers for or you can use seal washers from McMaster-Carr.  This was a
huge upgrade that completely eliminated fuel and air leaks.

I have also installed a priming bulb in the fuel supply line which helps
prime the entire system including the racor.  When I prime the system I
prime the racor and then I only loosen the fuel banjo fitting into the
engine filter.  Once it is clear I loosen the banjo at the HP pump.  2
points and that's it.  With copper washers you need to replace them but
with seal washers they are reusable.

https://youtu.be/mdHIt14l0R8

https://youtu.be/H-GI38vE4hQ

Josh Muckley
S/V Sea Hawk
1989 C&C 37+
Solomons, MD

On Fri, May 4, 2018, 6:06 PM Nauset Beach via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> I pulled the fuel hose off the tank pickup nipple as part of cleaning the
> tank – though did not really need to do so.  Now presumably there is some
> air in the fuel hose.
>
>
>
> Do I have to bleed that air using the tiny manual fuel pump on the side of
> the engine?  Or can I try to start the engine [it has been winterized for 6
> months] and hopefully pull the air “bubble” to the fuel filter / engine?
> There is ~ 6’ of fuel hose from the tank to a Racor, then another 4’ of
> fuel hose to reach the fuel pump, so it would take a long time and be quite
> a bit of fuel that is pumped out of the small Yanmar fuel filter bleed
> screw.  Hoping to minimize the time and inevitable diesel dribbles on the
> side of the engine.
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Brian
> ___
>
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
>
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question about bleeding a Yanmar 3GM30F

[Russ & Melody via CnC-List]

Hi Brian,

It is best to run the engine, with a bit o' load if you can.

If it stops due to air then bleeding at the
injectors is pretty easy but you might get lucky
and it will just hiccup but keep running.

Cheers, Russ
Sweet 35 mk-1

At 03:05 PM 5/4/2018, you wrote:

Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
boundary="=_NextPart_000_0056_01D3E3D2.86506790"
Content-language: en-us

I pulled the fuel hose off the tank pickup
nipple as part of cleaning the tank – though did
not really need to do so.  Now presumably there is some air in the fuel hose.

Do I have to bleed that air using the tiny
manual fuel pump on the side of the engine?  Or
can I try to start the engine [it has been
winterized for 6 months] and hopefully pull the
air “bubble” to the fuel filter / engine?  There
is ~ 6’ of fuel hose from the tank to a Racor,
then another 4’ of fuel hose to reach the fuel
pump, so it would take a long time and be quite
a bit of fuel that is pumped out of the small
Yanmar fuel filter bleed screw.  Hoping to
minimize the time and inevitable diesel dribbles on the side of the engine.

Thanks,
Brian
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with
your contributions.  Each and every one is
greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the
list - use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray



---
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
http://www.avg.com
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question about bleeding a Yanmar 3GM30F

[Edd Schillay via CnC-List]

Brian,

I think you’re going to need to get the air out of the system by using the 
manual pump and the bleed screws along the way. 

All the best, 

Edd

---
Edd M. Schillay
Captain of the Starship Enterprise 
C&C 37+ | Sail No: NCC-1701-B
City Island, New York
www.StarshipSailing.com
---
914.774.9767   | Mobile
---
Sent via iPhone X
iPhone. iTypos. iApologize


On May 4, 2018, at 6:05 PM, Nauset Beach via CnC-List  
wrote:

I pulled the fuel hose off the tank pickup nipple as part of cleaning the tank 
– though did not really need to do so.  Now presumably there is some air in the 
fuel hose. 
 
Do I have to bleed that air using the tiny manual fuel pump on the side of the 
engine?  Or can I try to start the engine [it has been winterized for 6 months] 
and hopefully pull the air “bubble” to the fuel filter / engine?  There is ~ 6’ 
of fuel hose from the tank to a Racor, then another 4’ of fuel hose to reach 
the fuel pump, so it would take a long time and be quite a bit of fuel that is 
pumped out of the small Yanmar fuel filter bleed screw.  Hoping to minimize the 
time and inevitable diesel dribbles on the side of the engine. 
 
Thanks,
Brian
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question for 29mk ii owners

[bushmark4--- via CnC-List]

James, I read your post with interest...I used to drool over those photos of 
White Magic in the brochures; that's what sold me on the C&Cs...still hooked 
too!

 

 


Richard
s/v Bushmark4; 1985 C&C 37 CB; 
Richard N. Bush
2950 Breckenridge Lane, Suite Nine
Louisville, Kentucky 40220-1462 
502-584-7255

 

 

-Original Message-
From: Jim via CnC-List 
To: cnc-list 
Cc: jcn ; Lisle Kingery, PhD 
Sent: Wed, Feb 28, 2018 9:00 pm
Subject: Re: Stus-List Question for 29mk ii owners



Lisle
I co-own C&C 29 Mk II, s/n 001, White Magic.  See the following link for more 
29 MkII info (if you look close the brochure pictures are of White Magic!) 
http://www.frontiernet.net/~markvii/index.htm

Sail her in fresh water on Lake Winnipeg (6th largest lake in North America) in 
Manitoba, Canada and the boat has been to one end of the lake to the other (258 
miles long; and between 20 to 60 miles wide).

Handles very well. Good cruiser for two; great club racer as won many Wednesday 
evening races.  Set up for single handing, with all lines lead aft and lazy 
jacks for main, autopilot, etc so very easy to sail single.

My son (age 22) and daughter (age 18) both like sailing her and are comfortable 
taking her in and out of harbour on their own, the inboard Yanmar is easy to 
use and totally reliable, etc. so overall a very good boat.



As point of reference, I also own (don't ask why...) a '71 C&C 35 MK 1 that I 
sail on Lake of the Woods, in Ontario Canada.

It does not have the bells and whistles of the 29, but for handling and pure 
sailing pleasure and speed the 35 is hard to beat.  It has considerably more 
room (although not fancy) which is nice for longer cruising.

Picked her up from the original owner who purchased her new in 1971 from the 
Toronto boat show.  I'm now lovingly restoring and updating (but not too much).



C&C's are great boats and I like both the 29 and 35 for different reasons.  
Which one is right for you will depend on how you plan to use it.   I'll send 
you my cell number to your email if you want to chat.



Cheers,

James Neirinck









___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question for 29mk ii owners

[Jim via CnC-List]

Lisle 
I co-own C&C 29 Mk II, s/n 001, White Magic. See the following link for more 29 
MkII info (if you look close the brochure pictures are of White Magic!) 
http://www.frontiernet.net/~markvii/index.htm 
Sail her in fresh water on Lake Winnipeg (6th largest lake in North America) in 
Manitoba, Canada and the boat has been to one end of the lake to the other (258 
miles long; and between 20 to 60 miles wide). 
Handles very well. Good cruiser for two; great club racer as won many Wednesday 
evening races. Set up for single handing, with all lines lead aft and lazy 
jacks for main, autopilot, etc so very easy to sail single. 
My son (age 22) and daughter (age 18) both like sailing her and are comfortable 
taking her in and out of harbour on their own, the inboard Yanmar is easy to 
use and totally reliable, etc. so overall a very good boat. 

As point of reference, I also own (don't ask why...) a '71 C&C 35 MK 1 that I 
sail on Lake of the Woods, in Ontario Canada. 
It does not have the bells and whistles of the 29, but for handling and pure 
sailing pleasure and speed the 35 is hard to beat. It has considerably more 
room (although not fancy) which is nice for longer cruising. 
Picked her up from the original owner who purchased her new in 1971 from the 
Toronto boat show. I'm now lovingly restoring and updating (but not too much). 

C&C's are great boats and I like both the 29 and 35 for different reasons. 
Which one is right for you will depend on how you plan to use it. I'll send you 
my cell number to your email if you want to chat. 

Cheers, 
James Neirinck 


- Original Message -

From: "Lisle Kingery, PhD via CnC-List"  
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
Cc: "Lisle Kingery, PhD"  
Sent: Wednesday, February 28, 2018 9:56:07 AM 
Subject: Stus-List Question for 29mk ii owners 

Hello all, last summer I was looking seriously at a 30mk ii but it didn’t work 
out and I benefitted enormously with talking to a few owners on the list. 

I’m now looking at a 29 mk ii and was wondering if anyone who has experience 
with this model would have a few minutes to chat by phone about their 
experience with the boat? If so let me know back channel at 
lisle.king...@gmail.com 

Thanks, 

Lisle 



___ 

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray 


___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question for 29mk ii owners

[Shane Vanstrom via CnC-List]

Check out the Lake Ontario C&C 29 
Association 
page on Facebook. Tons of knowledgeable 29 folks on there.

Shane Vanstrom
Executive Vice President
Licensed Real Estate Salesperson
Eastern Hospitality Advisors
An EHA of Buffalo Company
482 Delaware Avenue
Buffalo, NY 14202
Office: (716) 362-1220
Fax: (716) 362-1270
Mobile: (716) 913-4901
svanst...@eha.us.com


Eastern Hospitality Advisors is a construction management company that 
specializes in hospitality construction and renovation. Our Build at Cost model 
is a proven method designed to create exceptional savings for our clients. 
Since we focus strictly on hotels, we bring a level of expertise and experience 
rarely seen in the hospitality construction industry. We have a strong track 
record for completing projects on or ahead of schedule and within or under 
budget. Please visit our website to learn more about our company and services: 
www.eha.us.com

CONFIDENTIALITY: This e-mail message and any attachments are confidential and 
may be privileged.
From: CnC-List  on behalf of "Lisle Kingery, PhD 
via CnC-List" 
Reply-To: "cnc-list@cnc-list.com" 
Date: Wednesday, February 28, 2018 at 10:57 AM
To: "cnc-list@cnc-list.com" 
Cc: "Lisle Kingery, PhD" 
Subject: Stus-List Question for 29mk ii owners

Hello all, last summer I was looking seriously at a 30mk ii but it didn’t work 
out and I benefitted enormously with talking to a few owners on the list.

I’m now looking at a 29 mk ii and was wondering if anyone who has experience 
with this model would have a few minutes to chat by phone about their 
experience with the boat? If so let me know back channel at 
lisle.king...@gmail.com

Thanks,

Lisle


___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question for 29mk ii owners

[bushmark4--- via CnC-List]

Lisle, I previously owned a 29-2; it is a great sailing boat; it is a bit 
tender; probably a lot more tender than the 30; it will not be as roomy as the 
30, but that will be a matter of preference for you to decide; I had mine for 
about 5-6 years and loved it, but eventually decided to look for a bit more 
room , so I went to a 33-2 and now have a 37;
either way, they are great boats...you can't go wrong design wise..but do have 
the boat thoroughly checked out (surveyed); sometimes there are maintenance or 
other issues which are not readily discernible;

Keep us advised of your progress and your eventual decision,

 

 


Richard
s/v Bushmark4; 1985 C&C 37 CB; Ohio River; (still flooding)


Richard N. Bush 
2950 Breckenridge Lane, Suite Nine
Louisville, Kentucky 40220-1462 
502-584-7255

 

 

-Original Message-
From: Lisle Kingery, PhD via CnC-List 
To: cnc-list 
Cc: Lisle Kingery, PhD 
Sent: Wed, Feb 28, 2018 10:57 am
Subject: Stus-List Question for 29mk ii owners



Hello all, last summer I was looking seriously at a 30mk ii but it didn’t work 
out and I benefitted enormously with talking to a few owners on the list. 


I’m now looking at a 29 mk ii and was wondering if anyone who has experience 
with this model would have a few minutes to chat by phone about their 
experience with the boat? If so let me know back channel at 
lisle.king...@gmail.com


Thanks,


Lisle





___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray


___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question: Radar reflector vs. active radar

[David Castor via CnC-List]

Check the Practical Sailor archives.  They tested radar reflectors and
found none of them were really very effective, IIRC.  But better than
nothing.  Also, even if your active radar did help make you more visible,
you'd have to have it on.

On Sat, Feb 3, 2018 at 1:29 AM, Damian Greene via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> One of the fellow members of our UK yacht club (Reading Offshore Sailing
> Club) has a funny story about entering Le Havre in fog with their active
> radar reflector. Based on the size of their echo, the other traffic was
> expecting a much bigger ship entering the channel, and had cleared out of
> the way.
>
> On Friday, February 2, 2018, 6:23:21 PM GMT, Frederick G Street via
> CnC-List  wrote:
>
>
> That’s one of the more weird things I’ve heard… radars are specifically
> designed to try to filter out any signals not their own.
>
> Other boats might have something like the CARD system aboard to pick up
> other vessels’ radar:
>
> http://nordkyndesign.com/collision-avoidance-at-sea-ais-alarm-project/
>
> But those systems haven’t been available new for a decade.  The other type
> of device that you could have on your vessel to help other radar-equipped
> vessels see you better would be an active radar target augmentation system
> like the Echo-Max:
>
> https://www.echomax.co.uk/radar-target-enhancers-x-band-dual-band.html
>
> Or a Search and Rescue Transponder (SART):
>
> http://www.offshoreblue.com/safety/sart.php
>
>
> — Fred
>
> Fred Street -- Minneapolis
> S/V Oceanis (1979 C&C Landfall 38) -- on the hard in Bayfield, WI   :^(
>
> On Feb 2, 2018, at 11:42 AM, Damian Greene via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
> Here's a question for your collective wisdom:
>
> We regularly have fog here in Maine, and my normal practice is to hoist a
> Davis emergency radar reflector in the shrouds (so I hopefully will not get
> run over by a lobster boat). So this year I decided to get the yard to
> mount an EchoMax reflector on the mast, and be better prepared.
>
> However, reviewing my work-list with the yard maintenance manager
> yesterday, he asked why I was doing this, as I have radar, and the signal
> from my radome would light up on other boats' radar better than a reflector.
>
> That's something I've never heard before, so I told him I would
> investigate and get back on that. Frankly, this does not make a lot of
> sense - why would people bother with radar reflectors - but he has more
> than 20 years' experience with Hinckley and others.
>
> I'd like a definitive answer (Fred?) to resolve this.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Damian Greene
>
> ex C&C 34 Ghost
> now Sabre 38 Freefall
> Bass Harbor, Maine
>
>
> ___
>
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
> use PayPal to send contribution --  https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
>
> ___
>
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
>
>
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question: Radar reflector vs. active radar

[Damian Greene via CnC-List]

 One of the fellow members of our UK yacht club (Reading Offshore Sailing Club) 
has a funny story about entering Le Havre in fog with their active radar 
reflector. Based on the size of their echo, the other traffic was expecting a 
much bigger ship entering the channel, and had cleared out of the way.
On Friday, February 2, 2018, 6:23:21 PM GMT, Frederick G Street via 
CnC-List  wrote:  
 
 That’s one of the more weird things I’ve heard… radars are specifically 
designed to try to filter out any signals not their own.
Other boats might have something like the CARD system aboard to pick up other 
vessels’ radar:
http://nordkyndesign.com/collision-avoidance-at-sea-ais-alarm-project/
But those systems haven’t been available new for a decade.  The other type of 
device that you could have on your vessel to help other radar-equipped vessels 
see you better would be an active radar target augmentation system like the 
Echo-Max:
https://www.echomax.co.uk/radar-target-enhancers-x-band-dual-band.html
Or a Search and Rescue Transponder (SART):
http://www.offshoreblue.com/safety/sart.php

— Fred

Fred Street -- Minneapolis
S/V Oceanis (1979 C&C Landfall 38) -- on the hard in Bayfield, WI   :^(

On Feb 2, 2018, at 11:42 AM, Damian Greene via CnC-List  
wrote:
Here's a question for your collective wisdom: 
We regularly have fog here in Maine, and my normal practice is to hoist a Davis 
emergency radar reflector in the shrouds (so I hopefully will not get run over 
by a lobster boat). So this year I decided to get the yard to mount an EchoMax 
reflector on the mast, and be better prepared.
However, reviewing my work-list with the yard maintenance manager yesterday, he 
asked why I was doing this, as I have radar, and the signal from my radome 
would light up on other boats' radar better than a reflector.
That's something I've never heard before, so I told him I would investigate and 
get back on that. Frankly, this does not make a lot of sense - why would people 
bother with radar reflectors - but he has more than 20 years' experience with 
Hinckley and others.
I'd like a definitive answer (Fred?) to resolve this.

Thanks,
Damian Greene
ex C&C 34 Ghostnow Sabre 38 FreefallBass Harbor, Maine

___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --  https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

  ___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question: Radar reflector vs. active radar

[Damian Greene via CnC-List]

 Thanks all for these helpful responses, and Fred in particular. 
Damian
=
On Friday, February 2, 2018, 6:29:25 PM GMT, Joel Aronson via CnC-List 
 wrote:  
 
 FWIW, ISAF requires radar reflectors regardless whether the boat has radar.  
Even on a steel hull.
Joel
On Fri, Feb 2, 2018 at 1:22 PM, Frederick G Street via CnC-List 
 wrote:

That’s one of the more weird things I’ve heard… radars are specifically 
designed to try to filter out any signals not their own.
Other boats might have something like the CARD system aboard to pick up other 
vessels’ radar:
http://nordkyndesign.com/ collision-avoidance-at-sea- ais-alarm-project/
But those systems haven’t been available new for a decade.  The other type of 
device that you could have on your vessel to help other radar-equipped vessels 
see you better would be an active radar target augmentation system like the 
Echo-Max:
https://www.echomax.co.uk/ radar-target-enhancers-x-band- dual-band.html
Or a Search and Rescue Transponder (SART):
http://www.offshoreblue.com/ safety/sart.php

— Fred

Fred Street -- Minneapolis
S/V Oceanis (1979 C&C Landfall 38) -- on the hard in Bayfield, WI   :^(

On Feb 2, 2018, at 11:42 AM, Damian Greene via CnC-List  
wrote:
Here's a question for your collective wisdom: 
We regularly have fog here in Maine, and my normal practice is to hoist a Davis 
emergency radar reflector in the shrouds (so I hopefully will not get run over 
by a lobster boat). So this year I decided to get the yard to mount an EchoMax 
reflector on the mast, and be better prepared.
However, reviewing my work-list with the yard maintenance manager yesterday, he 
asked why I was doing this, as I have radar, and the signal from my radome 
would light up on other boats' radar better than a reflector.
That's something I've never heard before, so I told him I would investigate and 
get back on that. Frankly, this does not make a lot of sense - why would people 
bother with radar reflectors - but he has more than 20 years' experience with 
Hinckley and others.
I'd like a definitive answer (Fred?) to resolve this.

Thanks,
Damian Greene
ex C&C 34 Ghostnow Sabre 38 FreefallBass Harbor, Maine


__ _

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/ stumurray






-- 
Joel 
301 541 8551___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --  https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

  ___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question: Radar reflector vs. active radar

[Gary Russell via CnC-List]

Reflection is only effective if it reflects back to the radar transmitter.
Curved surfaces don't work very well and a flat surface will only work if
it is perpendicular to the incoming signal.  That's why most radar
reflectors are 3 flat surfaces at right angles to each other.  They are
often called corner cubes or retro-reflectors and are designed to reflect
the incoming signal back to the source.  That's why stealth aircraft and
ships have no right angles.

Gary
S/V Kaylarah
'90 C&C 37+
East Greenwich, RI, USA

~~~_/)~~


On Fri, Feb 2, 2018 at 2:47 PM, Leslie Paal via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> the radar antenna is a good sized metal construction.  It will reflect.
> Also, since it is tuned to the same (about) frequencies, it can passively
> re-radiate some of the signal.
>
> Leslie.
>
> 
> On Fri, 2/2/18, Frederick G Street via CnC-List 
> wrote:
>
>  Subject: Re: Stus-List Question: Radar reflector vs. active radar
>  To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
>  Cc: "Frederick G Street" 
>  Date: Friday, February 2, 2018, 10:22 AM
>
>  That’s one
>  of the more weird things I’ve heard… radars are
>  specifically designed to try to filter out any signals not
>  their own.
>  Other
>  boats might have something like the CARD system aboard to
>  pick up other vessels’ radar:
>  http://nordkyndesign.com/collision-avoidance-at-sea-ais-alarm-project/
>  But
>  those systems haven’t been available new for a decade.
>   The other type of device that you could have on your
>  vessel to help other radar-equipped vessels see you better
>  would be an active radar target augmentation system like the
>  Echo-Max:
>  https://www.echomax.co.uk/radar-target-enhancers-x-band-dual-band.html
>  Or a
>  Search and Rescue Transponder (SART):
>  http://www.offshoreblue.com/safety/sart.php
>
>  — Fred
>
>
>  Fred Street
>  -- Minneapolis
>  S/V Oceanis (1979 C&C
>  Landfall 38) -- on the hard in Bayfield,
>  WI   :^(
>
>
>  On Feb 2, 2018, at
>  11:42 AM, Damian Greene via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
>  Here's a question for your collective
>  wisdom:
>  We regularly have fog here in
>  Maine, and my normal practice is to hoist a Davis emergency
>  radar reflector in the shrouds (so I hopefully will not get
>  run over by a lobster boat). So this year I decided to get
>  the yard to mount an EchoMax reflector on the mast, and be
>  better prepared.
>  However, reviewing my
>  work-list with the yard maintenance manager yesterday, he
>  asked why I was doing this, as I have radar, and the signal
>  from my radome would light up on other boats' radar
>  better than a reflector.
>  That's something I've
>  never heard before, so I told him I would investigate and
>  get back on that. Frankly, this does not make a lot of sense
>  - why would people bother with radar reflectors - but he has
>  more than 20 years' experience with Hinckley and
>  others.
>  I'd like a definitive answer (Fred?) to resolve
>  this.
>
>  Thanks,
>  Damian Greene
>  ex C&C 34 Ghostnow Sabre 38 FreefallBass Harbor,
>  Maine
>  ___
>
>  Thanks everyone for supporting
>  this list with your contributions.  Each and every one is
>  greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use
>  PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
>
>  -Inline Attachment Follows-
>
>
>
> ___
>
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
>
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question: Radar reflector vs. active radar

[Leslie Paal via CnC-List]

the radar antenna is a good sized metal construction.  It will reflect.  Also, 
since it is tuned to the same (about) frequencies, it can passively re-radiate 
some of the signal.

Leslie.


On Fri, 2/2/18, Frederick G Street via CnC-List  wrote:

 Subject: Re: Stus-List Question: Radar reflector vs. active radar
 To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
 Cc: "Frederick G Street" 
 Date: Friday, February 2, 2018, 10:22 AM
 
 That’s one
 of the more weird things I’ve heard… radars are
 specifically designed to try to filter out any signals not
 their own.
 Other
 boats might have something like the CARD system aboard to
 pick up other vessels’ radar:
 http://nordkyndesign.com/collision-avoidance-at-sea-ais-alarm-project/
 But
 those systems haven’t been available new for a decade.
  The other type of device that you could have on your
 vessel to help other radar-equipped vessels see you better
 would be an active radar target augmentation system like the
 Echo-Max:
 https://www.echomax.co.uk/radar-target-enhancers-x-band-dual-band.html
 Or a
 Search and Rescue Transponder (SART):
 http://www.offshoreblue.com/safety/sart.php
 
 — Fred
 
 
 Fred Street
 -- Minneapolis
 S/V Oceanis (1979 C&C
 Landfall 38) -- on the hard in Bayfield,
 WI   :^(
 
 
 On Feb 2, 2018, at
 11:42 AM, Damian Greene via CnC-List 
 wrote:
 Here's a question for your collective
 wisdom: 
 We regularly have fog here in
 Maine, and my normal practice is to hoist a Davis emergency
 radar reflector in the shrouds (so I hopefully will not get
 run over by a lobster boat). So this year I decided to get
 the yard to mount an EchoMax reflector on the mast, and be
 better prepared.
 However, reviewing my
 work-list with the yard maintenance manager yesterday, he
 asked why I was doing this, as I have radar, and the signal
 from my radome would light up on other boats' radar
 better than a reflector.
 That's something I've
 never heard before, so I told him I would investigate and
 get back on that. Frankly, this does not make a lot of sense
 - why would people bother with radar reflectors - but he has
 more than 20 years' experience with Hinckley and
 others.
 I'd like a definitive answer (Fred?) to resolve
 this.
 
 Thanks,
 Damian Greene
 ex C&C 34 Ghostnow Sabre 38 FreefallBass Harbor,
 Maine
 ___
 
 Thanks everyone for supporting
 this list with your contributions.  Each and every one is
 greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use
 PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
 
 
 -Inline Attachment Follows-
 
 

___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question: Radar reflector vs. active radar

[Joel Aronson via CnC-List]

FWIW, ISAF requires radar reflectors regardless whether the boat has
radar.  Even on a steel hull.

Joel

On Fri, Feb 2, 2018 at 1:22 PM, Frederick G Street via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> That’s one of the more weird things I’ve heard… radars are specifically
> designed to try to filter out any signals not their own.
>
> Other boats might have something like the CARD system aboard to pick up
> other vessels’ radar:
>
> http://nordkyndesign.com/collision-avoidance-at-sea-ais-alarm-project/
>
> But those systems haven’t been available new for a decade.  The other type
> of device that you could have on your vessel to help other radar-equipped
> vessels see you better would be an active radar target augmentation system
> like the Echo-Max:
>
> https://www.echomax.co.uk/radar-target-enhancers-x-band-dual-band.html
>
> Or a Search and Rescue Transponder (SART):
>
> http://www.offshoreblue.com/safety/sart.php
>
>
> — Fred
>
> Fred Street -- Minneapolis
> S/V Oceanis (1979 C&C Landfall 38) -- on the hard in Bayfield, WI   :^(
>
> On Feb 2, 2018, at 11:42 AM, Damian Greene via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
> Here's a question for your collective wisdom:
>
> We regularly have fog here in Maine, and my normal practice is to hoist a
> Davis emergency radar reflector in the shrouds (so I hopefully will not get
> run over by a lobster boat). So this year I decided to get the yard to
> mount an EchoMax reflector on the mast, and be better prepared.
>
> However, reviewing my work-list with the yard maintenance manager
> yesterday, he asked why I was doing this, as I have radar, and the signal
> from my radome would light up on other boats' radar better than a reflector.
>
> That's something I've never heard before, so I told him I would
> investigate and get back on that. Frankly, this does not make a lot of
> sense - why would people bother with radar reflectors - but he has more
> than 20 years' experience with Hinckley and others.
>
> I'd like a definitive answer (Fred?) to resolve this.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Damian Greene
>
> ex C&C 34 Ghost
> now Sabre 38 Freefall
> Bass Harbor, Maine
>
>
>
> ___
>
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
>
>


-- 
Joel
301 541 8551
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question: Radar reflector vs. active radar

[Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List]

Some radar will interfere with some other radar sometimes. The weird lines you 
see do not show where the boat is. I have never seen this sailing, but I have 
flying. It was a series of curved dashed lines across the screen.
AIS will be 10,000x better than any kind of radar reflector to get you seen by 
other boats, but the radar reflector can’t hurt.

Joe Della Barba
Coquina
C&C 35 MK I


From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Damian 
Greene via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, February 02, 2018 12:42 PM
To: C&C List
Cc: Damian Greene
Subject: Stus-List Question: Radar reflector vs. active radar

Here's a question for your collective wisdom:

We regularly have fog here in Maine, and my normal practice is to hoist a Davis 
emergency radar reflector in the shrouds (so I hopefully will not get run over 
by a lobster boat). So this year I decided to get the yard to mount an EchoMax 
reflector on the mast, and be better prepared.

However, reviewing my work-list with the yard maintenance manager yesterday, he 
asked why I was doing this, as I have radar, and the signal from my radome 
would light up on other boats' radar better than a reflector.

That's something I've never heard before, so I told him I would investigate and 
get back on that. Frankly, this does not make a lot of sense - why would people 
bother with radar reflectors - but he has more than 20 years' experience with 
Hinckley and others.

I'd like a definitive answer (Fred?) to resolve this.

Thanks,

Damian Greene

ex C&C 34 Ghost
now Sabre 38 Freefall
Bass Harbor, Maine
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Question: Radar reflector vs. active radar

[Frederick G Street via CnC-List]

That’s one of the more weird things I’ve heard… radars are specifically 
designed to try to filter out any signals not their own.

Other boats might have something like the CARD system aboard to pick up other 
vessels’ radar:

http://nordkyndesign.com/collision-avoidance-at-sea-ais-alarm-project/ 


But those systems haven’t been available new for a decade.  The other type of 
device that you could have on your vessel to help other radar-equipped vessels 
see you better would be an active radar target augmentation system like the 
Echo-Max:

https://www.echomax.co.uk/radar-target-enhancers-x-band-dual-band.html 


Or a Search and Rescue Transponder (SART):

http://www.offshoreblue.com/safety/sart.php 



— Fred

Fred Street -- Minneapolis
S/V Oceanis (1979 C&C Landfall 38) -- on the hard in Bayfield, WI   :^(

> On Feb 2, 2018, at 11:42 AM, Damian Greene via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Here's a question for your collective wisdom: 
> 
> We regularly have fog here in Maine, and my normal practice is to hoist a 
> Davis emergency radar reflector in the shrouds (so I hopefully will not get 
> run over by a lobster boat). So this year I decided to get the yard to mount 
> an EchoMax reflector on the mast, and be better prepared.
> 
> However, reviewing my work-list with the yard maintenance manager yesterday, 
> he asked why I was doing this, as I have radar, and the signal from my radome 
> would light up on other boats' radar better than a reflector.
> 
> That's something I've never heard before, so I told him I would investigate 
> and get back on that. Frankly, this does not make a lot of sense - why would 
> people bother with radar reflectors - but he has more than 20 years' 
> experience with Hinckley and others.
> 
> I'd like a definitive answer (Fred?) to resolve this.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Damian Greene
> 
> ex C&C 34 Ghost
> now Sabre 38 Freefall
> Bass Harbor, Maine

___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List question about a C&C 30 mkii keel

[Rick Brass via CnC-List]

The “smile” isn’t that uncommon, nor is it exclusive to C&C boats. I’ve seen it 
on a Ranger 26, a couple of Newports, and older Beneteau…

 

The problem is not the “job” mating the keel to the stub. The problem is that 
the joint flexes as the boat heels (the thin layer of sealant between the 
surfaces lets a little flex happen), and over time the torque will ease off and 
allow the cracks in the fairing compound or paint at the edges of the joint.  
If you retorque the nuts every 4 or 5 years, the cosmetic impacts seem to go 
away – or at least be quite minimal.

 

The Ranger 26, BTW, was bought by the son of a friend. When we went to do the 
bottom, we discovered the crack… and then found out that the keel was actually 
held in place by capscrews screwed into the top of the keel from inside the 
boat. Which really looked to me to be a good way to lose the keel if you didn’t 
tighten the bolts regularly.

 

Rick Brass

Washington, NC

 

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Matthew L. 
Wolford via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, September 22, 2017 8:40 AM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Matthew L. Wolford 
Subject: Re: Stus-List question about a C&C 30 mkii keel

 

I don’t know the model, but the “C&C smile” is commonplace.  They did not do a 
great job mating the keel and fiberglass at the joint.

 

Anyone know this particular model? 

 

 

___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List question about a C&C 30 mkii keel

[Jim Reinardy via CnC-List]

When I owned a Catalina 27, the email list for that boat talked 
a lot about the “Catalina smile”.  It’s not unique to C&C.
Jim ReinardyC&C 30-2 “Firewater”Milwaukee




Get Outlook for iOS





On Sat, Sep 23, 2017 at 7:08 AM -0500, "Matthew L. Wolford via CnC-List" 
 wrote:














I don’t know the model, but the “C&C smile” is commonplace.  They 
did not do a great job mating the keel and fiberglass at the joint.
 
Anyone know this particular model? 


 

From: Lisle Kingery, PhD via CnC-List 
Sent: Thursday, September 21, 2017 7:37 PM
To: CnC-List@cnc-list.com 
Cc: Lisle Kingery, PhD 
Subject: Stus-List question about a C&C 30 mkii 
keel
 

Hi all, 
 
More questions from an aspiring C&C owner. :)
 
I'm considering this 1987 C&C 30mkii and overall it looks interesting. 

 
http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1987/C%26C-30-3079275/Rochester/NY/United-States#.WcRLTWiPJPY

 
I'm stuck with a draft of 5 or under where I'll be keeping the eventual 
sailboat I get and this is the only wing keel version I see available at least 
reasonably nearby. 
 
I have a question about what appears to be at least a surface crack along 
the middle of the keel that goes pretty much the entire length of the keel. 

 
I've pasted the picture into the email below but not sure if that is going 
to show up on the listserv. 
 
If not, if anyone familiar with this model in particular could let me know 
if you could take a quick look at the picture and provide an opinion on normal 
vs. abnormal I could email pics. Thanks for your consideration.
 
Lisle
 






___

This list is supported by 
the generous donations of our members. If you wish to make a contribution to 
offset our costs, please go to:  https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All 
Contributions are greatly appreciated!






___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List question about a C&C 30 mkii keel

[Randy Stafford via CnC-List]

the inevitable loosening of the bolts 
>> as the keel moves around while sailing – and thus require less frequent 
>> torqueing or reduce the development of the next smile.
>>  
>> Rick Brass
>> Washington, NC
>>  
>>  
>>  
>> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com 
>> <mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com>] On Behalf Of Bruce Whitmore via 
>> CnC-List
>> Sent: Friday, September 22, 2017 11:54 AM
>> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>
>> Cc: Bruce Whitmore mailto:bwhitm...@sbcglobal.net>>
>> Subject: Re: Stus-List question about a C&C 30 mkii keel
>>  
>> Hi Josh,
>>  
>> Quick question which I've wrestled with in my mind - Why torque the keel 
>> bolts on the hard?  Since the keel will spend most of its time hanging from 
>> the bottom of the boat in the water, isn't it better to torque the bolts in 
>> the specific situation where the stresses will be applied?
>>  
>> Thanks for the insights,
>>  
>> Bruce Whitmore
>> 
>> (847) 404-5092 (mobile)
>> bwhitm...@sbcglobal.net <mailto:bwhitm...@sbcglobal.net>
>>  
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> ___
>> 
>> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
>> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to: 
>> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray <https://www.paypal.me/stumurray>
>> 
>> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray <https://www.paypal.me/stumurray>
> 
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List question about a C&C 30 mkii keel

[Dennis C. via CnC-List]

Torque specs are found here:

 http://www.cncphotoalbum.com/doityourself/torquebolts/torquebolts.htm

Dennis C.
Touche' 35-1 #83
Mandeville, LA

On Sep 22, 2017 2:38 PM, "David Miles via CnC-List" 
wrote:

> Great explanation.
> What is the correct torque to apply?
> Thx.
> David
> C&C30MK2 Impulse
>
> On September 22, 2017 11:23:45 AM Rick Brass via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
>> Lisle;
>>
>>
>>
>> As others have said, you appear to be looking at the C&C Smile. That is a
>> crack in the bottom paint or fairing compound covering the joint where the
>> top of the lead keel meets the bottom of the fiberglass keel stub. As these
>> things go, yours appears to be pretty minor. On older boats with a swept
>> back keel, I’ve seen gaps at the leading edge of the joint of a quarter
>> inch or so.
>>
>>
>>
>> The probable cause is that the tension on the keel bolts is too low. When
>> the boat was built, a sealing compound was put between the top of the keel
>> and the bottom of the hull, and the bolts were torqued tight. As the boat
>> heels when sailing, the keel flexes slightly to the side, and the bolts
>> tend to lose torque over time. That leads to the crack – the C&C Smile – in
>> the hard paint or fairing compound covering the joint. On older boats with
>> the swept back keel, the crack can be accentuated if the boat is blocked at
>> the back of the keel, or with too much of the boat’s weight supported to
>> far back. Some of the listers have indicated damage to the keel stub from
>> hard groundings, but I don’t see any real evidence of that in your photos.
>>
>>
>>
>> The condition can be cosmetic, or a real problem. Probably cosmetic in
>> well over 90% of the time. You can tell if it is a real problem if you put
>> the boat in the water and water leaks into the bilge from the joint.
>>
>>
>>
>> The solution is to torque the bolts properly, and retorque them
>> periodically. My 38 had a fairly large smile when I bought her in 2003. The
>> bolts got retorqued when I had some keel work done in 2004. Again in about
>> 2009, when we also opened up a small groove along the smile, put 5200
>> sealer in the groove, faired the joint, and applied a layer of glass cloth
>> from the leading edge of the joint to about 2 feet back  to address the
>> cosmetic issues. No smile when the bottom was painted in 2013. A slight
>> crack was evident last winter when I painted the bottom, and a little water
>> seeped out of the 5200 sealer – so I retorqued the bolts again (it had been
>> 8 years after all) and applied another layer of glass before the bottom
>> paint.
>>
>>
>>
>> If you find you have a water leak – which I suspect is not likely given
>> the appearance of the smile, the fix is to drop the keel, apply 5200 as a
>> new layer of sealer, and torque the bolts properly. That stops the leak,
>> but won’t stop the smile (5200, after all, is flexible and that is what
>> causes the smile). Fairing and a fiberglass band over the joint will
>> eliminate the cosmetic issues so long as you retorque the bolts every few
>> years into the future.
>>
>>
>>
>> As others have said, get a good survey. You are already paying a
>> relatively high price for  late 80s boat, and I really doubt that putting
>> another $5000 or more into rebidding the keel would be a desirable activity.
>>
>>
>>
>> Bruce;
>>
>>
>>
>> The reason that torqueing the bolts while on the hard is preferable to
>> doing it in the water might be that, when in the water, a goodly portion of
>> the effort is directed at supporting the weight of the keel instead of
>> applying force to the seal. On the hard, with the weight of the boat
>> holding the keel tightly to the stub, you would tend to get a tighter seal
>> and more tension on the bolts, which should slow down the inevitable
>> loosening of the bolts as the keel moves around while sailing – and thus
>> require less frequent torqueing or reduce the development of the next smile.
>>
>>
>>
>> Rick Brass
>>
>> Washington, NC
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] *On Behalf Of *Bruce
>> Whitmore via CnC-List
>> *Sent:* Friday, September 22, 2017 11:54 AM
>> *To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com
>> *Cc:* Bruce Whitmore 
>> *Subject:* Re: Stus-List question about a C&C 30 mkii keel
>>
>>
>>
>> Hi Josh,
>>
>>
>>
>

Re: Stus-List question about a C&C 30 mkii keel

[David Miles via CnC-List]

Great explanation.
What is the correct torque to apply?
Thx.
David
C&C30MK2 Impulse


On September 22, 2017 11:23:45 AM Rick Brass via CnC-List 
 wrote:



Lisle;



As others have said, you appear to be looking at the C&C Smile. That is a 
crack in the bottom paint or fairing compound covering the joint where the 
top of the lead keel meets the bottom of the fiberglass keel stub. As these 
things go, yours appears to be pretty minor. On older boats with a swept 
back keel, I’ve seen gaps at the leading edge of the joint of a quarter 
inch or so.




The probable cause is that the tension on the keel bolts is too low. When 
the boat was built, a sealing compound was put between the top of the keel 
and the bottom of the hull, and the bolts were torqued tight. As the boat 
heels when sailing, the keel flexes slightly to the side, and the bolts 
tend to lose torque over time. That leads to the crack – the C&C Smile – in 
the hard paint or fairing compound covering the joint. On older boats with 
the swept back keel, the crack can be accentuated if the boat is blocked at 
the back of the keel, or with too much of the boat’s weight supported to 
far back. Some of the listers have indicated damage to the keel stub from 
hard groundings, but I don’t see any real evidence of that in your photos.




The condition can be cosmetic, or a real problem. Probably cosmetic in well 
over 90% of the time. You can tell if it is a real problem if you put the 
boat in the water and water leaks into the bilge from the joint.




The solution is to torque the bolts properly, and retorque them 
periodically. My 38 had a fairly large smile when I bought her in 2003. The 
bolts got retorqued when I had some keel work done in 2004. Again in about 
2009, when we also opened up a small groove along the smile, put 5200 
sealer in the groove, faired the joint, and applied a layer of glass cloth 
from the leading edge of the joint to about 2 feet back  to address the 
cosmetic issues. No smile when the bottom was painted in 2013. A slight 
crack was evident last winter when I painted the bottom, and a little water 
seeped out of the 5200 sealer – so I retorqued the bolts again (it had been 
8 years after all) and applied another layer of glass before the bottom paint.




If you find you have a water leak – which I suspect is not likely given the 
appearance of the smile, the fix is to drop the keel, apply 5200 as a new 
layer of sealer, and torque the bolts properly. That stops the leak, but 
won’t stop the smile (5200, after all, is flexible and that is what causes 
the smile). Fairing and a fiberglass band over the joint will eliminate the 
cosmetic issues so long as you retorque the bolts every few years into the 
future.




As others have said, get a good survey. You are already paying a relatively 
high price for  late 80s boat, and I really doubt that putting another 
$5000 or more into rebidding the keel would be a desirable activity.




Bruce;



The reason that torqueing the bolts while on the hard is preferable to 
doing it in the water might be that, when in the water, a goodly portion of 
the effort is directed at supporting the weight of the keel instead of 
applying force to the seal. On the hard, with the weight of the boat 
holding the keel tightly to the stub, you would tend to get a tighter seal 
and more tension on the bolts, which should slow down the inevitable 
loosening of the bolts as the keel moves around while sailing – and thus 
require less frequent torqueing or reduce the development of the next smile.




Rick Brass

Washington, NC







From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Bruce 
Whitmore via CnC-List

Sent: Friday, September 22, 2017 11:54 AM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Bruce Whitmore 
Subject: Re: Stus-List question about a C&C 30 mkii keel



Hi Josh,



Quick question which I've wrestled with in my mind - Why torque the keel 
bolts on the hard?  Since the keel will spend most of its time hanging from 
the bottom of the boat in the water, isn't it better to torque the bolts in 
the specific situation where the stresses will be applied?




Thanks for the insights,



Bruce Whitmore

(847) 404-5092 (mobile)
bwhitm...@sbcglobal.net <mailto:bwhitm...@sbcglobal.net>








--
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you 
wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray


All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List question about a C&C 30 mkii keel

[Neil Gallagher via CnC-List]

Keel bolts should be torqued with the boat on the hard.  It's like any 
other bolted connection, you want to tighten it before you put the load 
on the connection so that you pretension the bolts and compress the 
joint.  For a boat, that's before the weight of the keel is hanging on 
the bolts.


Neil Gallagher
Weatherly 35-1
Glen Cove, NY

On 9/22/2017 11:53 AM, Bruce Whitmore via CnC-List wrote:

Hi Josh,

Quick question which I've wrestled with in my mind - Why torque the 
keel bolts on the hard?  Since the keel will spend most of its time 
hanging from the bottom of the boat in the water, isn't it better to 
torque the bolts in the specific situation where the stresses will be 
applied?


Thanks for the insights,
Bruce Whitmore

(847) 404-5092 (mobile)
bwhitm...@sbcglobal.net



*From:* Josh Muckley via CnC-List 
*To:* C&C List 
*Cc:* Josh Muckley 
*Sent:* Friday, September 22, 2017 10:15 AM
*Subject:* Re: Stus-List question about a C&C 30 mkii keel

C&C smile.  This is common where the lead keel meets the fiberglass 
keel stub.  First order of business is to torque/check of the keel 
bolts.  This is done on the hard.  Then check for water ingress in the 
water.  From the pictures it looks like someone else already did some 
fill work.


Worst case scenario you'll have to drop the keel and re-bed.

Second to worst case is that you'll use some type of epoxy and filler 
and fiberglass to patch a bandaid around the crack.


Josh Muckley
S/V Sea Hawk
1989 C&C 37+
Solomons, MD
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If 
you wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to: 
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray


All Contributions are greatly appreciated!




___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!


___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List question about a C&C 30 mkii keel

[Rick Brass via CnC-List]

Lisle;

 

As others have said, you appear to be looking at the C&C Smile. That is a crack 
in the bottom paint or fairing compound covering the joint where the top of the 
lead keel meets the bottom of the fiberglass keel stub. As these things go, 
yours appears to be pretty minor. On older boats with a swept back keel, I’ve 
seen gaps at the leading edge of the joint of a quarter inch or so.

 

The probable cause is that the tension on the keel bolts is too low. When the 
boat was built, a sealing compound was put between the top of the keel and the 
bottom of the hull, and the bolts were torqued tight. As the boat heels when 
sailing, the keel flexes slightly to the side, and the bolts tend to lose 
torque over time. That leads to the crack – the C&C Smile – in the hard paint 
or fairing compound covering the joint. On older boats with the swept back 
keel, the crack can be accentuated if the boat is blocked at the back of the 
keel, or with too much of the boat’s weight supported to far back. Some of the 
listers have indicated damage to the keel stub from hard groundings, but I 
don’t see any real evidence of that in your photos.

 

The condition can be cosmetic, or a real problem. Probably cosmetic in well 
over 90% of the time. You can tell if it is a real problem if you put the boat 
in the water and water leaks into the bilge from the joint.

 

The solution is to torque the bolts properly, and retorque them periodically. 
My 38 had a fairly large smile when I bought her in 2003. The bolts got 
retorqued when I had some keel work done in 2004. Again in about 2009, when we 
also opened up a small groove along the smile, put 5200 sealer in the groove, 
faired the joint, and applied a layer of glass cloth from the leading edge of 
the joint to about 2 feet back  to address the cosmetic issues. No smile when 
the bottom was painted in 2013. A slight crack was evident last winter when I 
painted the bottom, and a little water seeped out of the 5200 sealer – so I 
retorqued the bolts again (it had been 8 years after all) and applied another 
layer of glass before the bottom paint. 

 

If you find you have a water leak – which I suspect is not likely given the 
appearance of the smile, the fix is to drop the keel, apply 5200 as a new layer 
of sealer, and torque the bolts properly. That stops the leak, but won’t stop 
the smile (5200, after all, is flexible and that is what causes the smile). 
Fairing and a fiberglass band over the joint will eliminate the cosmetic issues 
so long as you retorque the bolts every few years into the future.

 

As others have said, get a good survey. You are already paying a relatively 
high price for  late 80s boat, and I really doubt that putting another $5000 or 
more into rebidding the keel would be a desirable activity.

 

Bruce;

 

The reason that torqueing the bolts while on the hard is preferable to doing it 
in the water might be that, when in the water, a goodly portion of the effort 
is directed at supporting the weight of the keel instead of applying force to 
the seal. On the hard, with the weight of the boat holding the keel tightly to 
the stub, you would tend to get a tighter seal and more tension on the bolts, 
which should slow down the inevitable loosening of the bolts as the keel moves 
around while sailing – and thus require less frequent torqueing or reduce the 
development of the next smile.

 

Rick Brass

Washington, NC

 

 

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Bruce 
Whitmore via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, September 22, 2017 11:54 AM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Bruce Whitmore 
Subject: Re: Stus-List question about a C&C 30 mkii keel

 

Hi Josh,

 

Quick question which I've wrestled with in my mind - Why torque the keel bolts 
on the hard?  Since the keel will spend most of its time hanging from the 
bottom of the boat in the water, isn't it better to torque the bolts in the 
specific situation where the stresses will be applied?

 

Thanks for the insights,

 

Bruce Whitmore

(847) 404-5092 (mobile)
bwhitm...@sbcglobal.net <mailto:bwhitm...@sbcglobal.net> 

 

 

___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List question about a C&C 30 mkii keel

[bushmark4--- via CnC-List]

 Lisle, you better buy that boat quickly, it won't be on the market long.

 


Richard
s/v Bushmark4; 1085 C&C 37 CB; Ohio River, Mile 584.4


Richard N. Bush 
2950 Breckenridge Lane, Suite Nine
Louisville, Kentucky 40220-1462 
502-584-7255

 

 

-Original Message-
From: Ronald B. Frerker via CnC-List 
To: cnc-list 
Cc: Ronald B. Frerker 
Sent: Fri, Sep 22, 2017 12:04 pm
Subject: Re: Stus-List question about a C&C 30 mkii keel



Randy, compared to that, our Mk 1s ARE spartan.
But I still love it!
Ron
Wild Cheri
C&C 30-1
STL





  
 
 
  
 From: Randy Stafford via CnC-List 
 To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
Cc: Randy Stafford ; "Lisle Kingery, PhD" 

 Sent: Friday, September 22, 2017 9:22 AM
 Subject: Re: Stus-List question about a C&C 30 mkii keel
  
 


Hi Lisle,


I couldn’t confirm by looking at the third picture (of the keel) in the 
YachtWorld listing, but I suspect that is the seam between the actual lead keel 
and the fiberglass keel stub that is part of the hull.  The keel bolts to the 
hull at that keel stub.  That seam looks pretty darn good to me.  Google “C&C 
smile” and you’ll see worse seams, for example here’s a DIY article on fixing 
one: http://cncphotoalbum.com/doityourself/smile/index.htm.


If you’re not already considering this, I might recommend you hire a reputable 
professional marine surveyor to survey the boat.  It might cost you $1000, but 
that will buy you peace of mind.  The survey would hopefully identify any 
deal-breaking issues with the boat, or else give you reassurance that you’re 
buying a sound boat.  If you buy the boat, the survey might give you an initial 
list of things that need attention, and a good survey report is generally 
valuable to have if you ever go to sell the boat.  In fact you should ask the 
seller to see any previous survey reports.


That is a good-looking boat.  I love the interior - it makes my 1972 C&C 30 MK 
I look quite spartan in comparison.


Cheers,
Randy Stafford
S/V Grenadine
C&C 30-1 #7
Ken Caryl, CO



On Sep 21, 2017, at 5:37 PM, Lisle Kingery, PhD via CnC-List 
 wrote:


Hi all,


More questions from an aspiring C&C owner. :)


I'm considering this 1987 C&C 30mkii and overall it looks interesting. 


http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1987/C%26C-30-3079275/Rochester/NY/United-States#.WcRLTWiPJPY



I'm stuck with a draft of 5 or under where I'll be keeping the eventual 
sailboat I get and this is the only wing keel version I see available at least 
reasonably nearby. 


I have a question about what appears to be at least a surface crack along the 
middle of the keel that goes pretty much the entire length of the keel. 


I've pasted the picture into the email below but not sure if that is going to 
show up on the listserv. 


If not, if anyone familiar with this model in particular could let me know if 
you could take a quick look at the picture and provide an opinion on normal vs. 
abnormal I could email pics. Thanks for your consideration.


Lisle











___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List question about a C&C 30 mkii keel

[Ronald B. Frerker via CnC-List]

Randy, compared to that, our Mk 1s ARE spartan.But I still love it!RonWild 
CheriC&C 30-1STL


  From: Randy Stafford via CnC-List 
 To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
Cc: Randy Stafford ; "Lisle Kingery, PhD" 

 Sent: Friday, September 22, 2017 9:22 AM
 Subject: Re: Stus-List question about a C&C 30 mkii keel
   
Hi Lisle,
I couldn’t confirm by looking at the third picture (of the keel) in the 
YachtWorld listing, but I suspect that is the seam between the actual lead keel 
and the fiberglass keel stub that is part of the hull.  The keel bolts to the 
hull at that keel stub.  That seam looks pretty darn good to me.  Google “C&C 
smile” and you’ll see worse seams, for example here’s a DIY article on fixing 
one: http://cncphotoalbum.com/doityourself/smile/index.htm.
If you’re not already considering this, I might recommend you hire a reputable 
professional marine surveyor to survey the boat.  It might cost you $1000, but 
that will buy you peace of mind.  The survey would hopefully identify any 
deal-breaking issues with the boat, or else give you reassurance that you’re 
buying a sound boat.  If you buy the boat, the survey might give you an initial 
list of things that need attention, and a good survey report is generally 
valuable to have if you ever go to sell the boat.  In fact you should ask the 
seller to see any previous survey reports.
That is a good-looking boat.  I love the interior - it makes my 1972 C&C 30 MK 
I look quite spartan in comparison.
Cheers,Randy StaffordS/V GrenadineC&C 30-1 #7Ken Caryl, CO

On Sep 21, 2017, at 5:37 PM, Lisle Kingery, PhD via CnC-List 
 wrote:
Hi all,
More questions from an aspiring C&C owner. :)
I'm considering this 1987 C&C 30mkii and overall it looks interesting. 
http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1987/C%26C-30-3079275/Rochester/NY/United-States#.WcRLTWiPJPY

I'm stuck with a draft of 5 or under where I'll be keeping the eventual 
sailboat I get and this is the only wing keel version I see available at least 
reasonably nearby. 
I have a question about what appears to be at least a surface crack along the 
middle of the keel that goes pretty much the entire length of the keel. 
I've pasted the picture into the email below but not sure if that is going to 
show up on the listserv. 
If not, if anyone familiar with this model in particular could let me know if 
you could take a quick look at the picture and provide an opinion on normal vs. 
abnormal I could email pics. Thanks for your consideration.
Lisle

___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!


___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!


   ___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List question about a C&C 30 mkii keel

[Bruce Whitmore via CnC-List]

Hi Josh,
Quick question which I've wrestled with in my mind - Why torque the keel bolts 
on the hard?  Since the keel will spend most of its time hanging from the 
bottom of the boat in the water, isn't it better to torque the bolts in the 
specific situation where the stresses will be applied?
Thanks for the insights, Bruce Whitmore

(847) 404-5092 (mobile)
bwhitm...@sbcglobal.net


  From: Josh Muckley via CnC-List 
 To: C&C List  
Cc: Josh Muckley 
 Sent: Friday, September 22, 2017 10:15 AM
 Subject: Re: Stus-List question about a C&C 30 mkii keel
   
C&C smile.  This is common where the lead keel meets the fiberglass keel stub.  
First order of business is to torque/check of the keel bolts.  This is done on 
the hard.  Then check for water ingress in the water.  From the pictures it 
looks like someone else already did some fill work.
Worst case scenario you'll have to drop the keel and re-bed.
Second to worst case is that you'll use some type of epoxy and filler and 
fiberglass to patch a bandaid around the crack.
Josh MuckleyS/V Sea Hawk1989 C&C 37+Solomons, 
MD___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!


   ___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List question about a C&C 30 mkii keel

[John Irvin via CnC-List]

I believe that the secret to a successful smile repair is to use a filling 
compound which flexes. The keel flexes under sail and hard fillers eventually 
crack, have to be routed out. Firefly (27-111) uses marine goop successfully in 
fresh water.
Good luck!

Sent from Mail<https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for Windows 10

From: Josh Muckley via CnC-List<mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>
Sent: September 22, 2017 10:15 AM
To: C&C List<mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>
Cc: Josh Muckley<mailto:muckl...@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Stus-List question about a C&C 30 mkii keel

C&C smile.  This is common where the lead keel meets the fiberglass keel stub.  
First order of business is to torque/check of the keel bolts.  This is done on 
the hard.  Then check for water ingress in the water.  From the pictures it 
looks like someone else already did some fill work.

Worst case scenario you'll have to drop the keel and re-bed.

Second to worst case is that you'll use some type of epoxy and filler and 
fiberglass to patch a bandaid around the crack.

Josh Muckley
S/V Sea Hawk
1989 C&C 37+
Solomons, MD

___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List question about a C&C 30 mkii keel

[Randy Stafford via CnC-List]

Hi Lisle,

I couldn’t confirm by looking at the third picture (of the keel) in the 
YachtWorld listing, but I suspect that is the seam between the actual lead keel 
and the fiberglass keel stub that is part of the hull.  The keel bolts to the 
hull at that keel stub.  That seam looks pretty darn good to me.  Google “C&C 
smile” and you’ll see worse seams, for example here’s a DIY article on fixing 
one: http://cncphotoalbum.com/doityourself/smile/index.htm 
.

If you’re not already considering this, I might recommend you hire a reputable 
professional marine surveyor to survey the boat.  It might cost you $1000, but 
that will buy you peace of mind.  The survey would hopefully identify any 
deal-breaking issues with the boat, or else give you reassurance that you’re 
buying a sound boat.  If you buy the boat, the survey might give you an initial 
list of things that need attention, and a good survey report is generally 
valuable to have if you ever go to sell the boat.  In fact you should ask the 
seller to see any previous survey reports.

That is a good-looking boat.  I love the interior - it makes my 1972 C&C 30 MK 
I look quite spartan in comparison.

Cheers,
Randy Stafford
S/V Grenadine
C&C 30-1 #7
Ken Caryl, CO

> On Sep 21, 2017, at 5:37 PM, Lisle Kingery, PhD via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> More questions from an aspiring C&C owner. :)
> 
> I'm considering this 1987 C&C 30mkii and overall it looks interesting. 
> 
> http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1987/C%26C-30-3079275/Rochester/NY/United-States#.WcRLTWiPJPY
>  
> 
> 
> I'm stuck with a draft of 5 or under where I'll be keeping the eventual 
> sailboat I get and this is the only wing keel version I see available at 
> least reasonably nearby. 
> 
> I have a question about what appears to be at least a surface crack along the 
> middle of the keel that goes pretty much the entire length of the keel. 
> 
> I've pasted the picture into the email below but not sure if that is going to 
> show up on the listserv. 
> 
> If not, if anyone familiar with this model in particular could let me know if 
> you could take a quick look at the picture and provide an opinion on normal 
> vs. abnormal I could email pics. Thanks for your consideration.
> 
> Lisle
> 
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> 
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List question about a C&C 30 mkii keel

[Josh Muckley via CnC-List]

C&C smile.  This is common where the lead keel meets the fiberglass keel
stub.  First order of business is to torque/check of the keel bolts.  This
is done on the hard.  Then check for water ingress in the water.  From the
pictures it looks like someone else already did some fill work.

Worst case scenario you'll have to drop the keel and re-bed.

Second to worst case is that you'll use some type of epoxy and filler and
fiberglass to patch a bandaid around the crack.

Josh Muckley
S/V Sea Hawk
1989 C&C 37+
Solomons, MD
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Question about awlgrip hull pain

[Allen Miles via CnC-List]

Septum is 30-2 #167. She has a Universal 20 up diesel


On Sep 10, 2017 11:18 AM, "Chad Osmond via CnC-List" 
wrote:

> > Apparently the broker thinks this is one of the last 30 mark iis of
> it's era made and it has a universal diesel.
>
> Check the hull number, it will be on the transom, and in the aft cabin
> beside the stove.
> The last few digits show the hull number, it'll be between 140?-175.
>
> On Fri, Sep 8, 2017 at 6:42 PM, Lisle Kingery, PhD via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> I've come across this interesting 1990 c&c 30 mark ii but the hull has
>> been painted with awlgrip.
>>
>> http://www.boats.com/sailing-boats/1990-c-c-fiberglass-30-62
>> 59222/#.WbMazdEpCfA
>>
>> From what I'm reading about thisnpaint looks good for a couple years but
>> then can be a real PITA and expensive long term. I searched the forum for
>> related posts but didn't find much. Thoughts on whether folks think it's a
>> really bad idea to have this paint on the hull?
>>
>> Apparently the broker thinks this is one of the last 30 mark iis of it's
>> era made and it has a universal diesel.
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Lisle
>>
>> ___
>>
>> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
>> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
>> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>>
>> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>>
>>
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Question about awlgrip hull pain

[Chad Osmond via CnC-List]

> Apparently the broker thinks this is one of the last 30 mark iis of it's
era made and it has a universal diesel.

Check the hull number, it will be on the transom, and in the aft cabin
beside the stove.
The last few digits show the hull number, it'll be between 140?-175.

On Fri, Sep 8, 2017 at 6:42 PM, Lisle Kingery, PhD via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> I've come across this interesting 1990 c&c 30 mark ii but the hull has
> been painted with awlgrip.
>
> http://www.boats.com/sailing-boats/1990-c-c-fiberglass-30-
> 6259222/#.WbMazdEpCfA
>
> From what I'm reading about thisnpaint looks good for a couple years but
> then can be a real PITA and expensive long term. I searched the forum for
> related posts but didn't find much. Thoughts on whether folks think it's a
> really bad idea to have this paint on the hull?
>
> Apparently the broker thinks this is one of the last 30 mark iis of it's
> era made and it has a universal diesel.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Lisle
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Question about awlgrip hull pain

[Josh Muckley via CnC-List]

Yep, sorry guys, I stand corrected.  It was Awlcraft 2000 to which I meant
to refer.  Awlgrip 2000 doesn't exist.

Josh



On Sun, Sep 10, 2017, 8:54 AM Dennis C. via CnC-List 
wrote:

> There is also Awlcraft 2000 which is a "softer", more easily repaired
> version of Awlgrip.  I had Touche' painted with Awlcraft in 2011.  Still
> looks great.  Still getting compliments.
>
> Dennis C.
> Touche' 35-1 #83
> Mandeville, LA
>
>
> On Sun, Sep 10, 2017 at 7:40 AM, Josh Muckley via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
>> Awlgrip is the original paint which is beautiful because it has a color
>> and clear coat in the same application.  The color settles and the clear
>> comes to the surface.  This makes for the brilliant, long lasting shine.
>> The problem comes when repairs are required.  In order to repair a damaged
>> area the border between old and nem needs to be feathered in.  This creates
>> a halo around the damaged area and is caused by the separate layers of
>> clear and color.  The company insists that only their soap is formulated to
>> prevent damaging the finish.  They also insist that any amount of
>> polishing/buffing/sanding/or waxing will cause damage to the paint,
>> subsequently hold dirt and look dull.
>>
>> Awlgrip has come out with a newer product called Awlgrip 2000 and it
>> doesn't have the separate clear and color parts.  It isn't quite as
>> beautiful when new but it is easier to repair.  I'm not sure about
>> polishing.
>>
>> There is a second company which was recommended to me by a boat yard
>> called Alex Seal.  They said that it looks and works almost exactly like
>> Awlgrip 2000 but is cheaper.  They pointed to what looked like a new travel
>> lift and said they had rebuilt it 5 years ago and that it was a 20 year old
>> lift.
>>
>> Josh Muckley
>> S/V Sea Hawk
>> 1989 C&C 37+
>> Solomons, MD
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Question about awlgrip hull pain

[Dave Godwin via CnC-List]

I used Awlcraft 2000 for the hull and the decks. I had already decided to use 
it after talking to the Alexseal rep (good stuff, same as Awlcraft 2000) and 
when conferring with my painter he said that that was they only shot Awlcraft 
on new builds and repairs. Another former professional painter from Zimmerman 
Marine preferred it.

I’ve been able do some buffing of areas with a bit of orange peel. 
Repairability was tops on my list both because I was going to be doing the 
painting and because I run into things. Often...

As far as it not being as “beautiful” as Awlgrip, well, I’m fairly certain that 
no-one can tell the difference between well-done Awlcraft and Awlgrip. Maybe a 
professional.

Best,
Dave Godwin
1982 C&C 37 - Ronin
Reedville - Chesapeake Bay
Ronin’s Overdue Refit 
> On Sep 10, 2017, at 8:53 AM, Dennis C. via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> There is also Awlcraft 2000 which is a "softer", more easily repaired version 
> of Awlgrip.  I had Touche' painted with Awlcraft in 2011.  Still looks great. 
>  Still getting compliments.
> 
> Dennis C.
> Touche' 35-1 #83
> Mandeville, LA
> 
> On Sun, Sep 10, 2017 at 7:40 AM, Josh Muckley via CnC-List 
> mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
> Awlgrip is the original paint which is beautiful because it has a color and 
> clear coat in the same application.  The color settles and the clear comes to 
> the surface.  This makes for the brilliant, long lasting shine.  The problem 
> comes when repairs are required.  In order to repair a damaged area the 
> border between old and nem needs to be feathered in.  This creates a halo 
> around the damaged area and is caused by the separate layers of clear and 
> color.  The company insists that only their soap is formulated to prevent 
> damaging the finish.  They also insist that any amount of 
> polishing/buffing/sanding/or waxing will cause damage to the paint, 
> subsequently hold dirt and look dull.
> 
> Awlgrip has come out with a newer product called Awlgrip 2000 and it doesn't 
> have the separate clear and color parts.  It isn't quite as beautiful when 
> new but it is easier to repair.  I'm not sure about polishing.
> 
> There is a second company which was recommended to me by a boat yard called 
> Alex Seal.  They said that it looks and works almost exactly like Awlgrip 
> 2000 but is cheaper.  They pointed to what looked like a new travel lift and 
> said they had rebuilt it 5 years ago and that it was a 20 year old lift.
> 
> Josh Muckley
> S/V Sea Hawk
> 1989 C&C 37+
> Solomons, MD
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> 
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Question about awlgrip hull pain

[Dennis C. via CnC-List]

There is also Awlcraft 2000 which is a "softer", more easily repaired
version of Awlgrip.  I had Touche' painted with Awlcraft in 2011.  Still
looks great.  Still getting compliments.

Dennis C.
Touche' 35-1 #83
Mandeville, LA

On Sun, Sep 10, 2017 at 7:40 AM, Josh Muckley via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Awlgrip is the original paint which is beautiful because it has a color
> and clear coat in the same application.  The color settles and the clear
> comes to the surface.  This makes for the brilliant, long lasting shine.
> The problem comes when repairs are required.  In order to repair a damaged
> area the border between old and nem needs to be feathered in.  This creates
> a halo around the damaged area and is caused by the separate layers of
> clear and color.  The company insists that only their soap is formulated to
> prevent damaging the finish.  They also insist that any amount of
> polishing/buffing/sanding/or waxing will cause damage to the paint,
> subsequently hold dirt and look dull.
>
> Awlgrip has come out with a newer product called Awlgrip 2000 and it
> doesn't have the separate clear and color parts.  It isn't quite as
> beautiful when new but it is easier to repair.  I'm not sure about
> polishing.
>
> There is a second company which was recommended to me by a boat yard
> called Alex Seal.  They said that it looks and works almost exactly like
> Awlgrip 2000 but is cheaper.  They pointed to what looked like a new travel
> lift and said they had rebuilt it 5 years ago and that it was a 20 year old
> lift.
>
> Josh Muckley
> S/V Sea Hawk
> 1989 C&C 37+
> Solomons, MD
>
>
>
>
>
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Question about awlgrip hull pain

[Josh Muckley via CnC-List]

Awlgrip is the original paint which is beautiful because it has a color and
clear coat in the same application.  The color settles and the clear comes
to the surface.  This makes for the brilliant, long lasting shine.  The
problem comes when repairs are required.  In order to repair a damaged area
the border between old and nem needs to be feathered in.  This creates a
halo around the damaged area and is caused by the separate layers of clear
and color.  The company insists that only their soap is formulated to
prevent damaging the finish.  They also insist that any amount of
polishing/buffing/sanding/or waxing will cause damage to the paint,
subsequently hold dirt and look dull.

Awlgrip has come out with a newer product called Awlgrip 2000 and it
doesn't have the separate clear and color parts.  It isn't quite as
beautiful when new but it is easier to repair.  I'm not sure about
polishing.

There is a second company which was recommended to me by a boat yard called
Alex Seal.  They said that it looks and works almost exactly like Awlgrip
2000 but is cheaper.  They pointed to what looked like a new travel lift
and said they had rebuilt it 5 years ago and that it was a 20 year old lift.

Josh Muckley
S/V Sea Hawk
1989 C&C 37+
Solomons, MD



On Sep 8, 2017 6:43 PM, "Lisle Kingery, PhD via CnC-List" <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> I've come across this interesting 1990 c&c 30 mark ii but the hull has
> been painted with awlgrip.
>
> http://www.boats.com/sailing-boats/1990-c-c-fiberglass-30-
> 6259222/#.WbMazdEpCfA
>
> From what I'm reading about thisnpaint looks good for a couple years but
> then can be a real PITA and expensive long term. I searched the forum for
> related posts but didn't find much. Thoughts on whether folks think it's a
> really bad idea to have this paint on the hull?
>
> Apparently the broker thinks this is one of the last 30 mark iis of it's
> era made and it has a universal diesel.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Lisle
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Question about awlgrip hull paint

[Fred Hazzard via CnC-List]

My Awlgrip 14 yrs old and looks good except for some light dock rash.  I'd
like to polish out these surface blemishes. What should I do or not do?

Fred Hazzard
S/V Fury
C&C 44
Portland,Or

On Sep 9, 2017 9:21 AM, "Dennis C. via CnC-List" 
wrote:

> AwlCare is good stuff.  I use it on Touche's 4 year old Awlcraft 2000
> paint about every 6 months.  It's very easy to apply and polish.  Can do
> entire boat in about 2-3 hours.  Nice shine when done.  Recommended.
>
> Dennis C.
> Touche' 35-1 #83
> Mandeville, LA
>
> On Sat, Sep 9, 2017 at 11:06 AM, Rick Brass via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> The instructions for maintaining the new paint job are to wash regularly
>> with fresh water, and annually with a product sold by the paint company.
>> (Awlcare?). The guy who did my paint job says the special stuff really
>> isn’t necessary, though it might be a good idea after the paint job is a
>> few years old.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Question about awlgrip hull pain

[coltrek via CnC-List]

Rejex is the only polish I have seen that will get you through a canal or any 
brackish water without getting a mustache. It is nothing short of amazing.
http://www.rejex.com/rejex.html


Regards,
Bill Coleman  C&C 39

 Original message 
From: "Dennis C. via CnC-List"  
Date: 9/9/17  12:20  (GMT-05:00) 
To: CnClist  
Cc: "Dennis C."  
Subject: Re: Stus-List Question about awlgrip hull pain 

AwlCare is good stuff.  I use it on Touche's 4 year old Awlcraft 2000 paint 
about every 6 months.  It's very easy to apply and polish.  Can do entire boat 
in about 2-3 hours.  Nice shine when done.  Recommended.
Dennis C.Touche' 35-1 #83Mandeville, LA

On Sat, Sep 9, 2017 at 11:06 AM, Rick Brass via CnC-List 
 wrote: The instructions for maintaining the new paint 
job are to wash regularly with fresh water, and annually with a product sold by 
the paint company. (Awlcare?). The guy who did my paint job says the special 
stuff really isn’t necessary, though it might be a good idea after the paint 
job is a few years old.  

___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Question about awlgrip hull pain

[Ronald B. Frerker via CnC-List]

Had mine painted red in the mid-eighties and was great looking for twenty or 
more years.  Last couple of years it's been looking kinda dull.  Time to 
repaint after thirty plus years.RonWild CheriC&C 30-1STL


  From: "Lisle Kingery, PhD via CnC-List" 
 To: CnC-List@cnc-list.com 
Cc: "Lisle Kingery, PhD" 
 Sent: Friday, September 8, 2017 5:43 PM
 Subject: Stus-List Question about awlgrip hull pain
   
Hi all, 

I've come across this interesting 1990 c&c 30 mark ii but the hull has been 
painted with awlgrip. 
http://www.boats.com/sailing-boats/1990-c-c-fiberglass-30-6259222/#.WbMazdEpCfA

>From what I'm reading about thisnpaint looks good for a couple years but then 
>can be a real PITA and expensive long term. I searched the forum for related 
>posts but didn't find much. Thoughts on whether folks think it's a really bad 
>idea to have this paint on the hull? 
Apparently the broker thinks this is one of the last 30 mark iis of it's era 
made and it has a universal diesel.
Thanks,
Lisle___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!


   ___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Question about awlgrip hull pain

[Dennis C. via CnC-List]

AwlCare is good stuff.  I use it on Touche's 4 year old Awlcraft 2000 paint
about every 6 months.  It's very easy to apply and polish.  Can do entire
boat in about 2-3 hours.  Nice shine when done.  Recommended.

Dennis C.
Touche' 35-1 #83
Mandeville, LA

On Sat, Sep 9, 2017 at 11:06 AM, Rick Brass via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> The instructions for maintaining the new paint job are to wash regularly
> with fresh water, and annually with a product sold by the paint company.
> (Awlcare?). The guy who did my paint job says the special stuff really
> isn’t necessary, though it might be a good idea after the paint job is a
> few years old.
>
>
>
>
>
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Question about awlgrip hull pain

[Rick Brass via CnC-List]

Lisle;

 

My 41 year old 38 just had her second paint job last fall. The previous one
was over 20 years old, and looking a bit worse for wear - but had gotten
very little maintenance in the 14 years since I bought her.

 

The instructions for maintaining the new paint job are to wash regularly
with fresh water, and annually with a product sold by the paint company.
(Awlcare?). The guy who did my paint job says the special stuff really isn't
necessary, though it might be a good idea after the paint job is a few years
old. 

 

I have to say, that's a lot less maintenance than a wax job on gelcoat every
3 to 6 months.. Or even the annual New Glass refresh I do on my 25.

 

And, unless the photos of the 30 that you posted are quite old, it appears
the boat is VERY shiny and the paint job should last a long time.

 

Rick Brass

Imzadi  C&C 38 mk2 #47

la Belle Aurore  C&C 25 mk1 #225

Washington, NC

 

 

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Marek
Dziedzic via CnC-List
Sent: Saturday, September 9, 2017 7:29 AM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Marek Dziedzic 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Question about awlgrip hull pain

 

I agree with Bruce. My ex C&C 24 had the hull awlgripped before I bought it.
I had it for 8 years and had no problems. No waxing needed. Just wash every
spring. And looks great. Not to mention that it seals the hull better than
gelcoat. 

 

Marek 

1994 c270 Legato

Ottawa, Ontario 

 

 

 Original message 

From: bwhitmore via CnC-List mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> > 

Date: 9/8/17 19:57 (GMT-04:00) 

To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>  

Cc: bwhitmore mailto:bwhitm...@sbcglobal.net> > 

Subject: Re: Stus-List Question about awlgrip hull pain 

 

I had a 1977 27 for 16 years that was awgripped before I bought her in 2000.
Looked great, tough as all get out and got compliments right up until the
day I sold her.  Clean it up well and apply Poliglow.  Better than Gelcoat
IMHO.  

 

Bruce Whitmore 

1994 C&C 37/40+

 

 

___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Question about awlgrip hull pain

[Ken Heaton via CnC-List]

Our hull is Awlgripped, probably 10 or more years ago. When we washed it
this spring I was asked by several people if we had just had the boat
painted, it still looks that good.

Awlgrip lasts a very long time.

Don't wax it and do not put Poly Glow on it, just clean it now and then.

Ken H.

On Saturday, 9 September 2017, Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
> I agree with Bruce. My ex C&C 24 had the hull awlgripped before I bought
it.  I had it for 8 years and had no problems. No waxing needed. Just wash
every spring. And looks great. Not to mention that it seals the hull better
than gelcoat.
> Marek
> 1994 c270 Legato
> Ottawa, Ontario
>
>  Original message 
> From: bwhitmore via CnC-List 
> Date: 9/8/17 19:57 (GMT-04:00)
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc: bwhitmore 
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Question about awlgrip hull pain
> I had a 1977 27 for 16 years that was awgripped before I bought her in
2000.  Looked great, tough as all get out and got compliments right up
until the day I sold her.  Clean it up well and apply Poliglow.  Better
than Gelcoat IMHO.
> Bruce Whitmore
> 1994 C&C 37/40+
> Dodging Irma...
>
>
> Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
>  Original message 
> From: "Lisle Kingery, PhD via CnC-List" 
> Date: 9/8/17 6:42 PM (GMT-05:00)
> To: CnC-List@cnc-list.com
> Cc: "Lisle Kingery, PhD" 
> Subject: Stus-List Question about awlgrip hull pain
> Hi all,
>
> I've come across this interesting 1990 c&c 30 mark ii but the hull has
been painted with awlgrip.
>
http://www.boats.com/sailing-boats/1990-c-c-fiberglass-30-6259222/#.WbMazdEpCfA
>
> From what I'm reading about thisnpaint looks good for a couple years but
then can be a real PITA and expensive long term. I searched the forum for
related posts but didn't find much. Thoughts on whether folks think it's a
really bad idea to have this paint on the hull?
> Apparently the broker thinks this is one of the last 30 mark iis of it's
era made and it has a universal diesel.
> Thanks,
> Lisle
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Question about awlgrip hull pain

[Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List]

I agree with Bruce. My ex C&C 24 had the hull awlgripped before I bought it.  I 
had it for 8 years and had no problems. No waxing needed. Just wash every 
spring. And looks great. Not to mention that it seals the hull better than 
gelcoat.

Marek
1994 c270 Legato
Ottawa, Ontario


 Original message 
From: bwhitmore via CnC-List 
Date: 9/8/17 19:57 (GMT-04:00)
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: bwhitmore 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Question about awlgrip hull pain

I had a 1977 27 for 16 years that was awgripped before I bought her in 2000.  
Looked great, tough as all get out and got compliments right up until the day I 
sold her.  Clean it up well and apply Poliglow.  Better than Gelcoat IMHO.

Bruce Whitmore
1994 C&C 37/40+

Dodging Irma...



Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone

 Original message 
From: "Lisle Kingery, PhD via CnC-List" 
Date: 9/8/17 6:42 PM (GMT-05:00)
To: CnC-List@cnc-list.com
Cc: "Lisle Kingery, PhD" 
Subject: Stus-List Question about awlgrip hull pain

Hi all,

I've come across this interesting 1990 c&c 30 mark ii but the hull has been 
painted with awlgrip.

http://www.boats.com/sailing-boats/1990-c-c-fiberglass-30-6259222/#.WbMazdEpCfA

>From what I'm reading about thisnpaint looks good for a couple years but then 
>can be a real PITA and expensive long term. I searched the forum for related 
>posts but didn't find much. Thoughts on whether folks think it's a really bad 
>idea to have this paint on the hull?

Apparently the broker thinks this is one of the last 30 mark iis of it's era 
made and it has a universal diesel.

Thanks,

Lisle
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Question about awlgrip hull pain

[bwhitmore via CnC-List]

I had a 1977 27 for 16 years that was awgripped before I bought her in 2000.  
Looked great, tough as all get out and got compliments right up until the day I 
sold her.  Clean it up well and apply Poliglow.  Better than Gelcoat IMHO.  
Bruce Whitmore 1994 C&C 37/40+
Dodging Irma...


Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
 Original message From: "Lisle Kingery, PhD via CnC-List" 
 Date: 9/8/17  6:42 PM  (GMT-05:00) To: 
CnC-List@cnc-list.com Cc: "Lisle Kingery, PhD"  
Subject: Stus-List Question about awlgrip hull pain 
Hi all, 

I've come across this interesting 1990 c&c 30 mark ii but the hull has been 
painted with awlgrip. 
http://www.boats.com/sailing-boats/1990-c-c-fiberglass-30-6259222/#.WbMazdEpCfA

From what I'm reading about thisnpaint looks good for a couple years but then 
can be a real PITA and expensive long term. I searched the forum for related 
posts but didn't find much. Thoughts on whether folks think it's a really bad 
idea to have this paint on the hull? 
Apparently the broker thinks this is one of the last 30 mark iis of it's era 
made and it has a universal diesel.
Thanks,
Lisle
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Question on best fuel filter setup

[PETER OCAMPO via CnC-List]

Hi Damian

I have the w33 and this just happens to me on a sail to jewel island after 
delivery of 35 hours no issues. But let my fuel drop to 1/3 and it clogged 
with. A 2 micron. 

I just filled the racor w fuel and it self primed no issues getting back to 
mooring but I am pulling he tank and cleaning it  saw sludge in bottom of tank 
when I pulled the sending unit   

Peter

Goonie island  C&c 40 1983 aft 


Sent from my iPhone

> On Jun 30, 2017, at 11:03 AM, Josh Muckley via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> I haven't actually re-checked my engine manual but IIRC the stock engine 
> filter (primary? ) for a Yanmar 3HM35F is 2 micron.  The boat came with a 
> Racor 200FG installed between the tank and the engine which I believe makes 
> this the (secondary?).  Recent discussions on this list have led me to 
> reconsider running a 2 micron in the Racor but aside from needing to 
> occasionally vent air from the Racor I have had no other adverse effects and 
> haven't changed either of the filters in about 4 years.
> 
> After closing on the boat I chased what I thought was an air leak in the fuel 
> system for months.  I got pretty good at venting the system and learned what 
> worked and what didn't.  What was needed and what wasn't.  The mechanic 
> advised me to avoid operating the vent screw on the filter housing since he 
> had seen his share of stripped vent screws.  Heeding his advice, I resorted 
> to primarily venting from the vent port on the outlet of the Racor and the 
> vent screw built into the banjo fitting on the high pressure fuel pump.  I 
> soon learned that the vent screw on the HP pump was prone to stripping too!  
> Ugh!  In my time of need I simply JB Welded the screw in place.  Now I was 
> forced to vent from nothing but the outlet of the racor.  I noticed quite 
> quickly that the vent port was poorly located and provided ineffective 
> removal of the air since it wasn't close enough to the high point.  The only 
> other places to vent wer actually loosening banjo fittings along the fuel 
> circuit but unfortunately they use copper gaskets which are really designed 
> to be a one time use item otherwise they leak.  Another problem that I 
> encountered was that bleeding the engine required a considerable amount of 
> fuel - upwards of a gallon to flush out all the air.  None of the bleed 
> screws or banjo fittings were designed to catch the spilt fuel.  Finally I 
> installed a bleed system which you can see in my video.  Maybe I'm just lucky 
> but since having installed this system I have had the engine shut down due to 
> air but have NEVER had to vent from anywhere except through this system.  
> If/when I change the engine filter I will simply keep the bowl slightly loose 
> and then prime until fuel leaks out of the threads.
> 
> https://youtu.be/H-GI38vE4hQ?t=2m13s
> 
> Now to answer your questions:
> 1) What micron rating filter?
>   - I'd refer you to the owners manual.  The majority of bearing were comes 
> from particals smaller than 5 microns and those parts don't have exacting 
> tolerances like the HP pump and Injectors.  As stated above, IIRC the yanmar 
> primary filter part is 2 micron.
>  
> 2) Are there better new designs? I see Racor have spin-off models. Are these 
> easier to change and bleed on the fly?
>   - I don't know any of the marketing reasons but I like the Racor 200 or 500 
> series that have a clear bowl.  This allows tou to see if air/water/dirt is 
> accumulating.
> 
> 3) Should I have primary and secondary filters?
>   - IMO yes.  If you have room you can go one step further and have a standby 
> filter in parallel.  If it looks like a clogged filter is the problem for 
> your shutdown then you simply shift filters.  You can change the dirty one 
> later, at the dock, in calw seas.
> 
> 4) How best to bleed the air?
>   - Do what you can to fill the filter media and bowl most of the way even if 
> that is just simply pouring fuel in the bowl and then attaching the bowl. 
> 
> 5) The Westerbeke W33 manual says it's self bleeding and essentially not to 
> mess with the pump. What do you know of this?
>   - It would seem that while I have manufacturers recommended vent points, 
> they are not needed.  In my case, more vents and better venting just means 
> less cranking.  To that end, if you simply placed a dry filter in the housing 
> and hoped that the engine would self vent you'd probably find yourself 
> cranking for a considerable amount of time.  Besides just because the engine 
> is self venting doesn't mean that the filter is.
> 
> Josh Muckley
> S/V Sea Hawk
> 1989 C&C 37+
> Solomons, MD
> 
> 
> On Jun 30, 2017 7:54 AM, "Damian Greene via CnC-List"  
> wrote:
> I have some questions for your collective wisdom: what is the best fuel 
> filter setup?
> 
> First of all, I have to admit I just bought a Sabre 38 (1986). We are en 
> route home from Essex CT to Bass Harbor ME. We were going through fairly 
> rough seas yesterday entering Buzzards Bay

Re: Stus-List Question on best fuel filter setup

[Josh Muckley via CnC-List]

I haven't actually re-checked my engine manual but IIRC the stock engine
filter (primary? ) for a Yanmar 3HM35F is 2 micron.  The boat came with a
Racor 200FG installed between the tank and the engine which I believe makes
this the (secondary?).  Recent discussions on this list have led me to
reconsider running a 2 micron in the Racor but aside from needing to
occasionally vent air from the Racor I have had no other adverse effects
and haven't changed either of the filters in about 4 years.

After closing on the boat I chased what I thought was an air leak in the
fuel system for months.  I got pretty good at venting the system and
learned what worked and what didn't.  What was needed and what wasn't.  The
mechanic advised me to avoid operating the vent screw on the filter housing
since he had seen his share of stripped vent screws.  Heeding his advice, I
resorted to primarily venting from the vent port on the outlet of the Racor
and the vent screw built into the banjo fitting on the high pressure fuel
pump.  I soon learned that the vent screw on the HP pump was prone to
stripping too!  Ugh!  In my time of need I simply JB Welded the screw in
place.  Now I was forced to vent from nothing but the outlet of the racor.
I noticed quite quickly that the vent port was poorly located and provided
ineffective removal of the air since it wasn't close enough to the high
point.  The only other places to vent wer actually loosening banjo fittings
along the fuel circuit but unfortunately they use copper gaskets which are
really designed to be a one time use item otherwise they leak.  Another
problem that I encountered was that bleeding the engine required a
considerable amount of fuel - upwards of a gallon to flush out all the
air.  None of the bleed screws or banjo fittings were designed to catch the
spilt fuel.  Finally I installed a bleed system which you can see in my
video.  Maybe I'm just lucky but since having installed this system I have
had the engine shut down due to air but have NEVER had to vent from
anywhere except through this system.  If/when I change the engine filter I
will simply keep the bowl slightly loose and then prime until fuel leaks
out of the threads.

https://youtu.be/H-GI38vE4hQ?t=2m13s

Now to answer your questions:
1) What micron rating filter?
  - I'd refer you to the owners manual.  The majority of bearing were comes
from particals smaller than 5 microns and those parts don't have exacting
tolerances like the HP pump and Injectors.  As stated above, IIRC the
yanmar primary filter part is 2 micron.

2) Are there better new designs? I see Racor have spin-off models. Are
these easier to change and bleed on the fly?
  - I don't know any of the marketing reasons but I like the Racor 200 or
500 series that have a clear bowl.  This allows tou to see if
air/water/dirt is accumulating.

3) Should I have primary and secondary filters?
  - IMO yes.  If you have room you can go one step further and have a
standby filter in parallel.  If it looks like a clogged filter is the
problem for your shutdown then you simply shift filters.  You can change
the dirty one later, at the dock, in calw seas.

4) How best to bleed the air?
  - Do what you can to fill the filter media and bowl most of the way even
if that is just simply pouring fuel in the bowl and then attaching the
bowl.

5) The Westerbeke W33 manual says it's self bleeding and essentially not to
mess with the pump. What do you know of this?
  - It would seem that while I have manufacturers recommended vent points,
they are not needed.  In my case, more vents and better venting just means
less cranking.  To that end, if you simply placed a dry filter in the
housing and hoped that the engine would self vent you'd probably find
yourself cranking for a considerable amount of time.  Besides just because
the engine is self venting doesn't mean that the filter is.

Josh Muckley
S/V Sea Hawk
1989 C&C 37+
Solomons, MD


On Jun 30, 2017 7:54 AM, "Damian Greene via CnC-List" 
wrote:

I have some questions for your collective wisdom: what is the best fuel
filter setup?

First of all, I have to admit I just bought a Sabre 38 (1986). We are en
route home from Essex CT to Bass Harbor ME. We were going through fairly
rough seas yesterday entering Buzzards Bay and the engine died - backed off
on revs over a minute or so, then stopped. Restart would not go to high
revs,  and died. I figured it was the fuel filter, but we took a TowBoat US
tow into New Bedford rather than mess around. I changed the filter and all
seems fine.

The filter is a Racor 2010. Engine is a Westerbeke 33. Diesel tank was half
full.

It turns out the PO had installed a 2 micron primary (there is no
secondary). It looked fine - so no major crud. I have a 10 micron installed
now, as I had a couple of these as spares. The local yard recommend 30
 micron.

I could not figure out how to bleed the air, so I filled the housing to the
top with diesel, and poured more in the top before inserting and ti

Re: Stus-List Question on best fuel filter setup

[Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List]

Andy,

If you calculate how much water can condense in the fuel tank you would find 
that the amount is miniscule. The main source of water in the fuel tank is the 
crumbled O ring at the fuel cap.

If you keep a full tank on a hot day, the fuel may expand and leak through the 
vent. Many marinas forbid filling up tanks to the top, especially before the 
winter storage (and this is when most people think that having a full tank is 
beneficial).

Marek
1994 C270 “Legato”
Ottawa, ON

From: Andrew Burton via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, June 30, 2017 10:04
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Andrew Burton
Subject: Re: Stus-List Question on best fuel filter setup

Per instruction from the best diesel mechanics I know, I run a 30 micron filter 
in my Racor and a 5 or 10 in my engine filter. I don't wonder that your 2 
micron filter clogged as soon as your roiled the fuel in your tank. I'm 
surprised it took that long to stop the engine.
A useful addition to ease changing filters is a small electric fuel pump 
between the tank and the Racor, but I keep a quart or two of diesel in a bottle 
and top up the filter exactly as you did. Now that I've cleaned my tank, I only 
change filters once a season so it's hard to justify installing the pump.
I do make sure to keep my tank full as much as possible to avoid condensation 
forming inside it.

Andy
C&C 40
Peregrine

___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Question on best fuel filter setup

[Andrew Burton via CnC-List]

Per instruction from the best diesel mechanics I know, I run a 30 micron
filter in my Racor and a 5 or 10 in my engine filter. I don't wonder that
your 2 micron filter clogged as soon as your roiled the fuel in your tank.
I'm surprised it took that long to stop the engine.
A useful addition to ease changing filters is a small electric fuel pump
between the tank and the Racor, but I keep a quart or two of diesel in a
bottle and top up the filter exactly as you did. Now that I've cleaned my
tank, I only change filters once a season so it's hard to justify
installing the pump.
I do make sure to keep my tank full as much as possible to avoid
condensation forming inside it.

Andy
C&C 40
Peregrine

On Fri, Jun 30, 2017 at 8:48 AM, Danny Haughey via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Hi Damian!
>
> Congrats on the new boat!!   I don't have an answer for you but very
> interested in the conversation!!
>
> You should think about joining the Sabre list serve too.  Its pretty
> active.  Not as much as this but, still active.  I joined them during my
> boat shopping because The Sabre 38MKII was on my short list.  I just stayed
> on because there is some great info and conversations over there!  they're
> on a yahoo group
>
> Danny
>
>
>
> On 6/30/2017 7:53 AM, Damian Greene via CnC-List wrote:
>
> I have some questions for your collective wisdom: what is the best fuel
> filter setup?
>
> First of all, I have to admit I just bought a Sabre 38 (1986). We are en
> route home from Essex CT to Bass Harbor ME. We were going through fairly
> rough seas yesterday entering Buzzards Bay and the engine died - backed off
> on revs over a minute or so, then stopped. Restart would not go to high
> revs,  and died. I figured it was the fuel filter, but we took a TowBoat US
> tow into New Bedford rather than mess around. I changed the filter and all
> seems fine.
>
> The filter is a Racor 2010. Engine is a Westerbeke 33. Diesel tank was
> half full.
>
> It turns out the PO had installed a 2 micron primary (there is no
> secondary). It looked fine - so no major crud. I have a 10 micron installed
> now, as I had a couple of these as spares. The local yard recommend 30
>  micron.
>
> I could not figure out how to bleed the air, so I filled the housing to
> the top with diesel, and poured more in the top before inserting and
> tightening the top screw. I would not fancy doing that in rough seas.
>
> So questions:
>
> 1) What micron rating filter?
>
> 2) Are there better new designs? I see Racor have spin-off models. Are
> these easier to change and bleed on the fly?
>
> 3) Should I have primary and secondary filters?
>
> 4) How best to bleed the air?
>
> 5) The Westerbeke W33 manual says it's self bleeding and essentially not
> to mess with the pump. What do you know of this?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Damian
>
> Damian Greene
> 1982 C&C 34 Ghost (for sale)
> 1986 Sabre 38 Serenity (new name TBD)
> Bass Harbor ME
>
>
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>


-- 
Andrew Burton
61 W Narragansett Ave
Newport, RI
USA 02840
http://sites.google.com/site/andrewburtonyachtservices/
phone  +401 965 5260
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Question on best fuel filter setup

[Danny Haughey via CnC-List]

Hi Damian!

Congrats on the new boat!!   I don't have an answer for you but very 
interested in the conversation!!


You should think about joining the Sabre list serve too.  Its pretty 
active.  Not as much as this but, still active.  I joined them during my 
boat shopping because The Sabre 38MKII was on my short list.  I just 
stayed on because there is some great info and conversations over 
there!  they're on a yahoo group


Danny



On 6/30/2017 7:53 AM, Damian Greene via CnC-List wrote:
I have some questions for your collective wisdom: what is the best 
fuel filter setup?


First of all, I have to admit I just bought a Sabre 38 (1986). We are 
en route home from Essex CT to Bass Harbor ME. We were going through 
fairly rough seas yesterday entering Buzzards Bay and the engine died 
- backed off on revs over a minute or so, then stopped. Restart would 
not go to high revs,  and died. I figured it was the fuel filter, but 
we took a TowBoat US tow into New Bedford rather than mess around. I 
changed the filter and all seems fine.


The filter is a Racor 2010. Engine is a Westerbeke 33. Diesel tank was 
half full.


It turns out the PO had installed a 2 micron primary (there is no 
secondary). It looked fine - so no major crud. I have a 10 micron 
installed now, as I had a couple of these as spares. The local yard 
recommend 30  micron.


I could not figure out how to bleed the air, so I filled the housing 
to the top with diesel, and poured more in the top before inserting 
and tightening the top screw. I would not fancy doing that in rough seas.


So questions:

1) What micron rating filter?

2) Are there better new designs? I see Racor have spin-off models. Are 
these easier to change and bleed on the fly?


3) Should I have primary and secondary filters?

4) How best to bleed the air?

5) The Westerbeke W33 manual says it's self bleeding and essentially 
not to mess with the pump. What do you know of this?


Thanks,

Damian

Damian Greene
1982 C&C 34 Ghost (for sale)
1986 Sabre 38 Serenity (new name TBD)
Bass Harbor ME



___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!


___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Question about steering cables

[Richard N. Bush via CnC-List]

 Rick, thanks, I do not have any "slack" wires, but I can deflect/pull them 
about 1/2 to 3/4 of an inch; some one had suggested I look at the Edson Utube 
video, which I did; they say the 1/2 to 3/4 in. is about right; leaving little 
or no play in the wheel.  I think I'm good on this one , only 1,001 more things 
to do!

 


Richard
1095 C&C 37 CB Ohio River; Mi 596;


Richard N. Bush  
2950 Breckenridge Lane, Suite Nine
Louisville, Kentucky 40220-1462 
502-584-7255

 

 

-Original Message-
From: Rick Rohwer via CnC-List 
To: cnc-list 
Cc: Rick Rohwer 
Sent: Wed, May 6, 2015 12:58 pm
Subject: Re: Stus-List Question about steering cables


Richard,  
Someone else may chime in with better info, but my question is what you 
consider “play”.  Does that mean that you can deflect the cable by .5-.75”? or 
that the cable hangs that much with no pressure?  I would think the second 
scenario would not be acceptable.  I would also think that you would feel that 
in the steering or will at some point.  I have adjusted mine to “snug” but mine 
is readily available!  Thanks for reminding me though as I need to check mine 
as well.  
 
Cheers 
 
  
 
 
Rick 
 
C&C 37+ “Paikea” 
 
Poulsbo, WA  
  
   

On May 5, 2015, at 8:58 AM, Richard N. Bush via CnC-List < 
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:



Hi all, in getting ready for spring I noticed some slack in my steering 
cables in the area between the quadrant and the sheaves which turn the cable up 
into the helm; the play is about 1/2 to 3/4 inch; is there a norm or a standard 
rule of thumb for how much, if any flex, or looseness is considered standard, 
similar to the tension of an engine belt, (I'm thinking of the 1/2 inch flex 
for the alternator belt, etc)?   I did tighten up the cable terminal on the 
quadrant and that seemed to tighten the cable a bit, but I can only reach on of 
the terminals, not both of them...: also, we got in our first sail of the 
season last Sunday and there was no noticeable play or slack in the steering 
wheel.   many thanks to the group for your collective wisdom!   
   
   

   
   

Richard 
 1985 C&C 37 CB; Ohio River Mile 596; 
 
 
 
 Richard N. Bush  
 2950 Breckenridge Lane, Suite Nine 
 Louisville, Kentucky 40220-1462  
 502-584-7255
   
   

 
  
   
 
   
  
 


 ___ Email address: 
CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing 
-- go to the bottom of page at: 
http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
 ___ 
 
Email address: 
 CnC-List@cnc-list.com 
To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of 
page at: 
http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com 
 

   
  
  
 


___

Email
address:
CnC-List@cnc-list.com
To change your list preferences, including
unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page
at:
http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com


 
___

Email address:
CnC-List@cnc-list.com
To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of 
page at:
http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com

Re: Stus-List Question about steering cables

[Rick Rohwer via CnC-List]

Richard, 
Someone else may chime in with better info, but my question is what you 
consider “play”.  Does that mean that you can deflect the cable by .5-.75”? or 
that the cable hangs that much with no pressure?  I would think the second 
scenario would not be acceptable.  I would also think that you would feel that 
in the steering or will at some point.  I have adjusted mine to “snug” but mine 
is readily available!  Thanks for reminding me though as I need to check mine 
as well. 
Cheers

Rick
C&C 37+ “Paikea”
Poulsbo, WA
> On May 5, 2015, at 8:58 AM, Richard N. Bush via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi all, in getting ready for spring I noticed some slack in my steering 
> cables in the area between the quadrant and the sheaves which turn the cable 
> up into the helm; the play is about 1/2 to 3/4 inch; is there a norm or a 
> standard rule of thumb for how much, if any flex, or looseness is considered 
> standard, similar to the tension of an engine belt, (I'm thinking of the 1/2 
> inch flex for the alternator belt, etc)?   I did tighten up the cable 
> terminal on the quadrant and that seemed to tighten the cable a bit, but I 
> can only reach on of the terminals, not both of them...: also, we got in our 
> first sail of the season last Sunday and there was no noticeable play or 
> slack in the steering wheel.   many thanks to the group for your collective 
> wisdom!
> 
> Richard
> 1985 C&C 37 CB; Ohio River Mile 596;
> 
> Richard N. Bush 
> 2950 Breckenridge Lane, Suite Nine
> Louisville, Kentucky 40220-1462 
> 502-584-7255
> 
> 
> ___ Email address: 
> CnC-List@cnc-list.com  To change your list 
> preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: 
> http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com 
> ___
> 
> Email address:
> CnC-List@cnc-list.com
> To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom 
> of page at:
> http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
> 

___

Email address:
CnC-List@cnc-list.com
To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of 
page at:
http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com

Re: Stus-List Question about steering cables

[Chuck S via CnC-List]

Hi Richard, 
I just replaced my idler plate and chain and cables. The tension is not to be 
banjo string tight, but only tight enough that the rudder turns immediately 
when you turn the wheel, also no noticeable slack in the lazy cable. Here's a 
youtube video from Edson Marine. The tension is explained at 7:30 minutes into 
the video. 



Chuck 
Resolute 
1990 C&C 34R 
Broad Creek, Magothy River, Md 

- Original Message -

From: "Martin DeYoung via CnC-List"  
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
Cc: "Martin DeYoung"  
Sent: Tuesday, May 5, 2015 1:52:36 PM 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Question about steering cables 



Richard, 



The Edison web site may have cable tension information that would work as a 
guideline. 



A few months back a cnc-lister mentioned finding significant corrosion damage 
to the aluminum backing plates at the point the cable turning blocks were 
attached. If you notice the cables loosing tension over a short time that would 
be a good place to check. 



On Calypso I set the steering cable tension to have +-1/2” deflection at the 
middle of the longest run. I perform the first tensioning, rotated the 
wheel/rudder for a few minutes then re-check in case the cable needed to seat a 
bit more. 



Martin DeYoung 

Calypso 

1971 C&C 43 

Seattle 






From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Richard N. 
Bush via CnC-List 
Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2015 8:58 AM 
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
Cc: Richard N. Bush 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Question about steering cables 




Hi all, in getting ready for spring I noticed some slack in my steering cables 
in the area between the quadrant and the sheaves which turn the cable up into 
the helm; the play is about 1/2 to 3/4 inch; is there a norm or a standard rule 
of thumb for how much, if any flex, or looseness is considered standard, 
similar to the tension of an engine belt, (I'm thinking of the 1/2 inch flex 
for the alternator belt, etc)? I did tighten up the cable terminal on the 
quadrant and that seemed to tighten the cable a bit, but I can only reach on of 
the terminals, not both of them...: also, we got in our first sail of the 
season last Sunday and there was no noticeable play or slack in the steering 
wheel. many thanks to the group for your collective wisdom! 





Richard 
1985 C&C 37 CB; Ohio River Mile 596; 



Richard N. Bush 
2950 Breckenridge Lane, Suite Nine 
Louisville, Kentucky 40220-1462 
502-584-7255 






___ Email address: 
CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing 
-- go to the bottom of page at: 
http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com 

___ 

Email address: 
CnC-List@cnc-list.com 
To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of 
page at: 
http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com 


___

Email address:
CnC-List@cnc-list.com
To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of 
page at:
http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com

Re: Stus-List Question about steering cables

[Martin DeYoung via CnC-List]

Richard,

The Edison web site may have cable tension information that would work as a 
guideline.

A few months back a cnc-lister mentioned finding significant corrosion damage 
to the aluminum backing plates at the point the cable turning blocks were 
attached.  If you notice the cables loosing tension over a short time that 
would be a good place to check.

On Calypso I set the steering cable tension to have +-1/2” deflection at the 
middle of the longest run.  I perform the first tensioning, rotated the 
wheel/rudder for a few minutes then re-check in case the cable needed to seat a 
bit more.

Martin DeYoung
Calypso
1971 C&C 43
Seattle

[Description: Description: cid:D1BF9853-22F7-47FB-86F2-4115CE0BAF2F]

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Richard N. 
Bush via CnC-List
Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2015 8:58 AM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Richard N. Bush
Subject: Re: Stus-List Question about steering cables

Hi all, in getting ready for spring I noticed some slack in my steering cables 
in the area between the quadrant and the sheaves which turn the cable up into 
the helm; the play is about 1/2 to 3/4 inch; is there a norm or a standard rule 
of thumb for how much, if any flex, or looseness is considered standard, 
similar to the tension of an engine belt, (I'm thinking of the 1/2 inch flex 
for the alternator belt, etc)?   I did tighten up the cable terminal on the 
quadrant and that seemed to tighten the cable a bit, but I can only reach on of 
the terminals, not both of them...: also, we got in our first sail of the 
season last Sunday and there was no noticeable play or slack in the steering 
wheel.   many thanks to the group for your collective wisdom!

Richard
1985 C&C 37 CB; Ohio River Mile 596;

Richard N. Bush
2950 Breckenridge Lane, Suite Nine
Louisville, Kentucky 40220-1462
502-584-7255


___ Email address: 
CnC-List@cnc-list.com<mailto:CnC-List@cnc-list.com> To change your list 
preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: 
http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
___

Email address:
CnC-List@cnc-list.com
To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of 
page at:
http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com

Re: Stus-List Question about steering cables

[Richard N. Bush via CnC-List]

 Doug, thanks, so I guess I'm in the acceptable "range"? 

 


Richard
1985 C&C 37 CB; Ohio River, Mile 596;


Richard N. Bush 
2950 Breckenridge Lane, Suite Nine
Louisville, Kentucky 40220-1462 
502-584-7255

 

 

-Original Message-
From: Douglas Mountjoy via CnC-List 
To: cnc-list 
Cc: Douglas Mountjoy 
Sent: Tue, May 5, 2015 1:35 pm
Subject: Re: Stus-List Question about steering cables


 
  
   

 
  
Richard,   
  
When I tightened my steering cables, I tightened them to almost remove all slop 
in the wheel. but not so tight to put a strain on anything. I now have about 
1/2 to 3/4 inch play in the wheel.  
  
 
Doug Mountjoy 

sv Pegasus
   
LF38 #4   
  
just west of Ballard, WA  
 
 
  
  
On Tue, May 5, 2015 at 8:58 AM, Richard N. Bush via CnC-List
 wrote:   
   
  
   Hi all, in getting ready for spring I noticed some slack in my steering 
cables in the area between the quadrant and the sheaves which turn the cable up 
into the helm; the play is about 1/2 to 3/4 inch; is there a norm or a standard 
rule of thumb for how much, if any flex, or looseness is considered standard, 
similar to the tension of an engine belt, (I'm thinking of the 1/2 inch flex 
for the alternator belt, etc)?   I did tighten up the cable terminal on the 
quadrant and that seemed to tighten the cable a bit, but I can only reach on of 
the terminals, not both of them...: also, we got in our first sail of the 
season last Sunday and there was no noticeable play or slack in the steering 
wheel.   many thanks to the group for your collective wisdom!  
  
  
   
  
  
  
Richard
 1985 C&C 37 CB; Ohio River Mile 596;



 Richard N. Bush 
 2950 Breckenridge Lane, Suite Nine
 Louisville, Kentucky 40220-1462 
 502-584-7255   
  
  
   

 
  
   
 
 

   
   
 ___ Email address: 
CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing 
-- go to the bottom of page at: 
http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com   
 
___
 
 Email address:
 CnC-List@cnc-list.com
 To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom 
of page at:
 http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
 
 
   
  
  
 
 

___

Email
address:
CnC-List@cnc-list.com
To change your list preferences, including
unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page
at:
http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com


 
___

Email address:
CnC-List@cnc-list.com
To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of 
page at:
http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com

Re: Stus-List Question about steering cables

[Douglas Mountjoy via CnC-List]

Richard,
When I tightened my steering cables, I tightened them to almost remove all
slop in the wheel. but not so tight to put a strain on anything. I now have
about 1/2 to 3/4 inch play in the wheel.

Doug Mountjoy
sv Pegasus
LF38 #4
just west of Ballard, WA

On Tue, May 5, 2015 at 8:58 AM, Richard N. Bush via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

>  Hi all, in getting ready for spring I noticed some slack in my steering
> cables in the area between the quadrant and the sheaves which turn the
> cable up into the helm; the play is about 1/2 to 3/4 inch; is there a norm
> or a standard rule of thumb for how much, if any flex, or looseness is
> considered standard, similar to the tension of an engine belt, (I'm
> thinking of the 1/2 inch flex for the alternator belt, etc)?   I did
> tighten up the cable terminal on the quadrant and that seemed to tighten
> the cable a bit, but I can only reach on of the terminals, not both of
> them...: also, we got in our first sail of the season last Sunday and there
> was no noticeable play or slack in the steering wheel.   many thanks to the
> group for your collective wisdom!
>
>  Richard
> 1985 C&C 37 CB; Ohio River Mile 596;
>
> Richard N. Bush
> 2950 Breckenridge Lane, Suite Nine
> Louisville, Kentucky 40220-1462
> 502-584-7255
>
>
> ___ Email address:
> CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including
> unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at:
> http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
>
> ___
>
> Email address:
> CnC-List@cnc-list.com
> To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the
> bottom of page at:
> http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
>
>
>
___

Email address:
CnC-List@cnc-list.com
To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of 
page at:
http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com

Re: Stus-List Question about steering cables

[Richard N. Bush via CnC-List]

 Hi all, in getting ready for spring I noticed some slack in my steering cables 
in the area between the quadrant and the sheaves which turn the cable up into 
the helm; the play is about 1/2 to 3/4 inch; is there a norm or a standard rule 
of thumb for how much, if any flex, or looseness is considered standard, 
similar to the tension of an engine belt, (I'm thinking of the 1/2 inch flex 
for the alternator belt, etc)?   I did tighten up the cable terminal on the 
quadrant and that seemed to tighten the cable a bit, but I can only reach on of 
the terminals, not both of them...: also, we got in our first sail of the 
season last Sunday and there was no noticeable play or slack in the steering 
wheel.   many thanks to the group for your collective wisdom!

 


Richard
1985 C&C 37 CB; Ohio River Mile 596;


Richard N. Bush 
2950 Breckenridge Lane, Suite Nine
Louisville, Kentucky 40220-1462 
502-584-7255
 



 
 
 

___Emailaddress:CnC-List@cnc-list.comTo
 change your list preferences, includingunsubscribing -- go to the bottom of 
pageat:http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com 
___

Email address:
CnC-List@cnc-list.com
To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of 
page at:
http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com

Re: Stus-List Question on C&C 35 MKIII

[David Jacobs]

Eric,

 

I have the same boat and the hull is cored below the waterline.

 

Dave

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Erik
Hillenmeyer
Sent: Tuesday, December 03, 2013 4:05 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Subject: Re: Stus-List Question on C&C 35 MKIII

 

1984 C&C 35 MKIII - Is this boat solid or cored below the waterline?

 

Erik

 

From: "cnc-list-requ...@cnc-list.com" 
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
Sent: Tuesday, December 3, 2013 11:00 AM
Subject: CnC-List Digest, Vol 95, Issue 13


Send CnC-List mailing list submissions to
cnc-list@cnc-list.com

To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
cnc-list-requ...@cnc-list.com

You can reach the person managing the list at
cnc-list-ow...@cnc-list.com

When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of CnC-List digest..."


Today's Topics:

  1. Re:  halyards again( 10 aloft = 1 on the rail ) (Dr. Mark Bodnar)
  2. Re:  Stiff throttle - now control handles (Dennis C.)
  3. Re:  Halyard Tension (Ronald B. Frerker)
  4. Re:  Stiff throttle and belt recommendations for Yamar 2GM20
  on cnc 30 mkII (Richard N. Bush)


--

Message: 1
Date: Tue, 03 Dec 2013 11:44:58 -0400
From: "Dr. Mark Bodnar" 
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Subject: Re: Stus-List halyards again( 10 aloft = 1 on the rail )
Message-ID: <529dfc7a.1000...@accesswave.ca>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL:
<http://cnc-list.com/pipermail/cnc-list_cnc-list.com/attachments/20131203/f8
f04503/attachment-0001.html>

--

Message: 2
Date: Tue, 3 Dec 2013 07:45:51 -0800 (PST)
From: "Dennis C." 
To: "cnc-list@cnc-list.com" 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Stiff throttle - now control handles
Message-ID:
<1386085551.45940.yahoomail...@web121906.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

For anyone who might need them, I have a pair of new Edson pedestal mount
engine control handles.? Just the handles, not the assembly.? 

Contact me off list if interested.

Dennis C.
Touche' 35-1 #83
Mandeville, LA




>
> From: "dre...@gmail.com" 
>To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
>Sent: Tuesday, December 3, 2013 9:18 AM
>Subject: Re: Stus-List Stiff throttle
> 
>
>
>Hi,
>
>
>I had a cable once that was also painfully stiff to a point that I broke
the handle trying to move it. ? It turned out that cable housing was split
at a point near the middle of the cable which allowed the inner cable to
corrode at that location. ? A new cable and self-manufactured handle fixed
it. ? ? ?You may want to check along the cable bends for split cable
housings and replace. ? ?
>
>
>On another boat, I once saw a stiff cable caused by an over tight clamp
near the injector. ?It was fixed just by loosening the clamp a bit.?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>-
>Paul E.
>1979 C&C 29 Mk1
>S/V Johanna Rose
>Carrabelle, FL 
>
>On Dec 3, 2013, at 9:07 AM, cnc-list-requ...@cnc-list.com wrote:
>
>Date: Mon, 2 Dec 2013 22:03:28 -0800
>>From:?kevindrisc...@gmail.com
>>To:?cnc-list@cnc-list.com
>>Subject: Stus-List Stiff throttle and belt recommendations for Yamar
2GM20on cnc 30 mkII
>>
>>
>>(4) - The throttle is painfully stiff to the point I almost need two hands
to move it. Is there an easy ?lubrication point to get it moving again till
I can replace the cable?
>>Thanks everybody.?
>>Kevin
>>
>>s/v Osprey?
>>
>>C&C 30 mkII
>>Pic from
Thanksgiving:?https://docs.google.com/file/d/0BwhcX19YaPJ8QWtlbGE2NzhYRzQ/ed
it?usp=docslist_api
>>Sent from my Tablet
>>
>
>___
>This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album
>http://www.cncphotoalbum.com/
>CnC-List@cnc-list.com
>
>
>
-- next part --
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL:
<http://cnc-list.com/pipermail/cnc-list_cnc-list.com/attachments/20131203/36
2681c9/attachment-0001.html>

--

Message: 3
Date: Tue, 3 Dec 2013 08:37:02 -0800 (PST)
From: "Ronald B. Frerker" 
To: "cnc-list@cnc-list.com" 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Halyard Tension
Message-ID:
<1386088622.52181.yahoomail...@web122901.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

While halyard tension doesn't affect draft as much on the sail as on a
dacron sail, the tension does change the angle of attach of the jib entry.
?It will open and close with tension.
Ron
Wild Cheri




On Tu

Re: Stus-List Question on C&C 35 MKIII

[Erik Hillenmeyer]

1984 C&C 35 MKIII - Is this boat solid or cored below the waterline?
 
Erik
 


 From: "cnc-list-requ...@cnc-list.com" 
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
Sent: Tuesday, December 3, 2013 11:00 AM
Subject: CnC-List Digest, Vol 95, Issue 13
  

Send CnC-List mailing list submissions to
    cnc-list@cnc-list.com

To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
    http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
    cnc-list-requ...@cnc-list.com

You can reach the person managing the list at
    cnc-list-ow...@cnc-list.com

When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of CnC-List digest..."


Today's Topics:

   1. Re:  halyards again( 10 aloft = 1 on the rail ) (Dr. Mark Bodnar)
   2. Re:  Stiff throttle - now control handles (Dennis C.)
   3. Re:  Halyard Tension (Ronald B. Frerker)
   4. Re:  Stiff throttle and belt recommendations for Yamar 2GM20
      on cnc 30 mkII (Richard N. Bush)


--

Message: 1
Date: Tue, 03 Dec 2013 11:44:58 -0400
From: "Dr. Mark Bodnar" 
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Subject: Re: Stus-List halyards again( 10 aloft = 1 on the rail )
Message-ID: <529dfc7a.1000...@accesswave.ca>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: 


--

Message: 2
Date: Tue, 3 Dec 2013 07:45:51 -0800 (PST)
From: "Dennis C." 
To: "cnc-list@cnc-list.com" 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Stiff throttle - now control handles
Message-ID:
    <1386085551.45940.yahoomail...@web121906.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

For anyone who might need them, I have a pair of new Edson pedestal mount 
engine control handles.? Just the handles, not the assembly.? 

Contact me off list if interested.

Dennis C.
Touche' 35-1 #83
Mandeville, LA




>
> From: "dre...@gmail.com" 
>To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
>Sent: Tuesday, December 3, 2013 9:18 AM
>Subject: Re: Stus-List Stiff throttle
> 
>
>
>Hi,
>
>
>I had a cable once that was also painfully stiff to a point that I broke the 
>handle trying to move it. ? It turned out that cable housing was split at a 
>point near the middle of the cable which allowed the inner cable to corrode at 
>that location. ? A new cable and self-manufactured handle fixed it. ? ? ?You 
>may want to check along the cable bends for split cable housings and replace. 
>? ?
>
>
>On another boat, I once saw a stiff cable caused by an over tight clamp near 
>the injector. ?It was fixed just by loosening the clamp a bit.?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>-
>Paul E.
>1979 C&C 29 Mk1
>S/V Johanna Rose
>Carrabelle, FL 
>
>On Dec 3, 2013, at 9:07 AM, cnc-list-requ...@cnc-list.com wrote:
>
>Date: Mon, 2 Dec 2013 22:03:28 -0800
>>From:?kevindrisc...@gmail.com
>>To:?cnc-list@cnc-list.com
>>Subject: Stus-List Stiff throttle and belt recommendations for Yamar 2GM20on 
>>cnc 30 mkII
>>
>>
>>(4) - The throttle is painfully stiff to the point I almost need two hands to 
>>move it. Is there an easy ?lubrication point to get it moving again till I 
>>can replace the cable?
>>Thanks everybody.?
>>Kevin
>>
>>s/v Osprey?
>>
>>C&C 30 mkII
>>Pic from 
>>Thanksgiving:?https://docs.google.com/file/d/0BwhcX19YaPJ8QWtlbGE2NzhYRzQ/edit?usp=docslist_api
>>Sent from my Tablet
>>
>
>___
>This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album
>http://www.cncphotoalbum.com/
>CnC-List@cnc-list.com
>
>
>
-- next part --
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: 


--

Message: 3
Date: Tue, 3 Dec 2013 08:37:02 -0800 (PST)
From: "Ronald B. Frerker" 
To: "cnc-list@cnc-list.com" 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Halyard Tension
Message-ID:
    <1386088622.52181.yahoomail...@web122901.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

While halyard tension doesn't affect draft as much on the sail as on a dacron 
sail, the tension does change the angle of attach of the jib entry. ?It will 
open and close with tension.
Ron
Wild Cheri




On Tuesday, December 3, 2013 7:27 AM, "Hoyt, Mike"  
wrote:

Sam
?
Draft still moves.? Also some of us like to ease main 
halyard tension downwind and tighten upwind.? On the C&C115 with North 
3DL we have always used halyard, cunningham, outhaul to adjust sail shape along 
with other controls as well.? With the replacement of main and #1 with new 
3DL this year we still continue to use these.? On the #1 we do not adjust 
the tension as much as we used to with the old one.? With teh main we do 
adjust as much as with the old one.
?
?
Mike



From: CnC-List 
[mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cn

Re: Stus-List Question for Listers in the North East USA - Point Judith - Advice needed!

[Bill Bina]

I have stopped in Pt Judith many times. I have weathered nights in 35-40 
knot winds in the harbor of refuge. My anchor rode was taut as a bow 
string, but I've never had holding issues there. It can be a pretty wild 
night if the wind is up, but at least the waves are mitigated pretty 
well. I usually go up and circle around around Gardner Island, which is 
past Plato, and then head south down between Gardiner and Beach Island 
into the beautiful and very protected anchorage. Be aware that in the 
south end of the anchorage there may be marked shellfish beds. The owner 
will be out to see you if you don't stay clear. That's okay, as there is 
plenty of room for you. The water around Plato Island is not deep enough 
for you to navigate, unless you remove your keel first. :-)


Bill Bina



On 7/16/2013 2:12 PM, Indigo wrote:


I am planning to stop in Pt Judith on my way from Stonington to 
Cuttyhunk and planning to anchor. I have heard that holding in Pt 
Judith is not great. Could any listers with recent experience of Pt 
Judith offer me any practical advice?  Is it worth going up the 
channel to the anchorage north of Plato Island?  I am not looking for 
any services etc, just a safe place to stop overnight?


Jonathan

Indigo C&C35MlIII #39



___
This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album
http://www.cncphotoalbum.com
CnC-List@cnc-list.com


___
This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album
http://www.cncphotoalbum.com
CnC-List@cnc-list.com

Re: Stus-List Question for Raymarine techs.

[Frederick G Street]

Hi, Colin -- the resistance tests others have mentioned can be run on the raw 
transducer itself, if you can identify the proper pins in the connector.  I 
would guess that the connector at the masthead is probably corroded beyond 
repair, and you should consider replacing the whole cable/masthead connector 
assembly (Raymarine part #A28163) rather than try to troubleshoot a bad cable.  
BEFORE you run that up the mast, connect the old transducer to it and connect 
to the wind instrument, and see if the old transducer still works; or just run 
the resistance tests through the cable and see what happens.  This will tell 
you if you need a new masthead transducer, as well (Raymarine part #R28170).

The transducers are definitely NOT attached permanently to the cable; and no, 
Seatalk cable won't work -- as mentioned before, it's four-conductor stranded 
with shield, where Seatalk is two heavier conductors with shield.


Fred Street -- Minneapolis
S/V Oceanis (1979 C&C Landfall 38) -- on the hard in Bayfield, WI   :^(

On Apr 14, 2013, at 4:20 PM, Colin Kilgour  wrote:

> Fred, Rich and anyone else who has got their Raymarine ticket...
> 
> My Raymarine (ST60) wind transducer began dying a slow death after a 
> particularly breezy and rainy passage in the fall of 2011.  By the fall of 
> 2012, it was pretty much dead and while there was power at the display, there 
> was no data coming from the masthead.  
> 
> When a crewman who loves to go aloft finally got up to the masthead a few 
> weeks ago, the transducer was loose and darn near fell into his hand.  He 
> cleaned up all the contacts and re-attached the transducer, but no joy was to 
> be had.  (Occassionally, the wind speed would read "0.0" instead of "-.-" but 
> that's it.
> 
> My hypothesis is that the transducer worked itself loose in the storm and a 
> mix of salty and fresh water has been pouring into the cable ever since and 
> it has now failed.  (And yes, I've checked all the connections from the base 
> of the mast back to the helm).
> 
> Now, to replace the cable, do I need a Seatalk cable? or can I use something 
> more standard?  Also, do I have to replace the transducer?  Raymarine ships 
> the transducers with cable attached, so I'm wondering if there's some magic 
> to that.
___
This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album
http://www.cncphotoalbum.com
CnC-List@cnc-list.com

Re: Stus-List Question for Raymarine techs.

[Ken Heaton]

The following is from a thread on the Raymarine Technical Forum here:
http://raymarine.ning.com/forum/topics/third-times-a-charm

You will need to determine where the issue lies either with the masthead or
the display.  You will be able to test the masthead with the below test to
confirm it is working properly and if it tests "good", then next I would
perform a factory reset immediately followed by the calibration process
outlined in chapter four of the owners handbook. If the problem still
persists, I would have to recommend that the display be sent to the below
address to be evaluated by a service technician for repair.

Masthead Test:

Using a digital volt meter you should see the following readings:

Red to Screen: 8V

Blue to Screen: Variable 2 to 6V

Green to Screen: Variable 2 to 6V

Yellow to Screen: Variable 0 to 5V

If any one of the readings are out of spec. then the masthead is at fault.


This pin out for the transducer block at the masthead may come in handy too:

http://api.ning.com/files/cZ-SnQ88P2q*OHxq2UoEzqnwmchSwKOEk9WcMbpEY1*TgYeLp0WUVDKaUxEUUpwN8CaH0298HXRo8YadeliOCCoQoyBDvaWe/mastheadblocktransducerconnections.pdf


Ken H.

C&C 37 XL Salazar

Cape Breton Island


On 14 April 2013 19:18, Rick Taillieu  wrote:

> Colin,
>
> ** **
>
> Check your Gmail account.
>
> ** **
>
> Cheers
>
> ** **
>
> ** **
>
> Rick Taillieu
>
> Nemesis
>
> '75 C&C 25  #371
>
> Shearwater Yacht Club
>
> Halifax, NS.
>
> ** **
>
> ** **
>
> ** **
>
> *From:* CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] *On Behalf Of *Colin
> Kilgour
> *Sent:* April-14-13 6:21 PM
> *To:* C&C List
> *Subject:* Stus-List Question for Raymarine techs.
>
> ** **
>
> Fred, Rich and anyone else who has got their Raymarine ticket...
>
> My Raymarine (ST60) wind transducer began dying a slow death after a
> particularly breezy and rainy passage in the fall of 2011.  By the fall of
> 2012, it was pretty much dead and while there was power at the display,
> there was no data coming from the masthead.  
>
> When a crewman who loves to go aloft finally got up to the masthead a few
> weeks ago, the transducer was loose and darn near fell into his hand.  He
> cleaned up all the contacts and re-attached the transducer, but no joy was
> to be had.  (Occassionally, the wind speed would read "0.0" instead of
> "-.-" but that's it.
>
> My hypothesis is that the transducer worked itself loose in the storm and
> a mix of salty and fresh water has been pouring into the cable ever since
> and it has now failed.  (And yes, I've checked all the connections from the
> base of the mast back to the helm).
>
> Now, to replace the cable, do I need a Seatalk cable? or can I use
> something more standard?  Also, do I have to replace the transducer?
> Raymarine ships the transducers with cable attached, so I'm wondering if
> there's some magic to that.
>
> Thoughts welcome... 
>
> ** **
>
> Cheers,
> Colin
> --
>
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version: 2013.0.3272 / Virus Database: 3162/6244 - Release Date: 04/14/13*
> ***
>
> ___
> This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album
> http://www.cncphotoalbum.com
> CnC-List@cnc-list.com
>
>
___
This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album
http://www.cncphotoalbum.com
CnC-List@cnc-list.com

Re: Stus-List Question for Raymarine techs.

[Rick Taillieu]

Colin,

 

Check your Gmail account.

 

Cheers

 

 

Rick Taillieu

Nemesis

'75 C&C 25  #371

Shearwater Yacht Club

Halifax, NS.

 

 

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Colin
Kilgour
Sent: April-14-13 6:21 PM
To: C&C List
Subject: Stus-List Question for Raymarine techs.

 

Fred, Rich and anyone else who has got their Raymarine ticket...

My Raymarine (ST60) wind transducer began dying a slow death after a
particularly breezy and rainy passage in the fall of 2011.  By the fall of
2012, it was pretty much dead and while there was power at the display,
there was no data coming from the masthead.  

When a crewman who loves to go aloft finally got up to the masthead a few
weeks ago, the transducer was loose and darn near fell into his hand.  He
cleaned up all the contacts and re-attached the transducer, but no joy was
to be had.  (Occassionally, the wind speed would read "0.0" instead of "-.-"
but that's it.

My hypothesis is that the transducer worked itself loose in the storm and a
mix of salty and fresh water has been pouring into the cable ever since and
it has now failed.  (And yes, I've checked all the connections from the base
of the mast back to the helm).

Now, to replace the cable, do I need a Seatalk cable? or can I use something
more standard?  Also, do I have to replace the transducer?  Raymarine ships
the transducers with cable attached, so I'm wondering if there's some magic
to that.

Thoughts welcome... 

 

Cheers,
Colin

  _  

No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2013.0.3272 / Virus Database: 3162/6244 - Release Date: 04/14/13

___
This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album
http://www.cncphotoalbum.com
CnC-List@cnc-list.com

Re: Stus-List Question for Raymarine techs.

[Knowles Rich]

The ST60 masthead xducer and cable can be bought separately. There are also 
measurements that can beamed from the display end of the cable which will give 
you some idea of what's going on. I'm at the yacht club having dinner and will 
look them out later for you. 

Rich Knowles
Indigo. LF38
Halifax

On 2013-04-14, at 18:20, Colin Kilgour  wrote:

Fred, Rich and anyone else who has got their Raymarine ticket...

My Raymarine (ST60) wind transducer began dying a slow death after a 
particularly breezy and rainy passage in the fall of 2011.  By the fall of 
2012, it was pretty much dead and while there was power at the display, there 
was no data coming from the masthead.  

When a crewman who loves to go aloft finally got up to the masthead a few weeks 
ago, the transducer was loose and darn near fell into his hand.  He cleaned up 
all the contacts and re-attached the transducer, but no joy was to be had.  
(Occassionally, the wind speed would read "0.0" instead of "-.-" but that's it.

My hypothesis is that the transducer worked itself loose in the storm and a mix 
of salty and fresh water has been pouring into the cable ever since and it has 
now failed.  (And yes, I've checked all the connections from the base of the 
mast back to the helm).

Now, to replace the cable, do I need a Seatalk cable? or can I use something 
more standard?  Also, do I have to replace the transducer?  Raymarine ships the 
transducers with cable attached, so I'm wondering if there's some magic to that.

Thoughts welcome... 

Cheers,
Colin
___
This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album
http://www.cncphotoalbum.com
CnC-List@cnc-list.com

___
This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album
http://www.cncphotoalbum.com
CnC-List@cnc-list.com

Re: Stus-List Question for Raymarine techs.

[Paul Fountain]

Colin,

 

When debugging a a ray wind instrument issue a couple of years ago I talked
to Terry at CMC (yeah I know not always the most helpful folks - but I've
had good success with them) He gave me a number of pin resistance  readings
to test the transducer - may show if it's the transducer or cable.
Especially good if you have the transducer down ... We ended up putting a
known good transducer from another boat up - and proved it was a wiring
issue - so checked the wires to find the bad connection at the mast base.

 

The cable is a 4 wire plus shield and bare shield ground wire - not sure of
the capacitance of it - the connector on mine is molded on to the cable so
tough to replace the cable and not the connector - and if memory serves me
ti is part of the mount too but I'll confirm that Monday or Tuesday when I
prep the mast ... yes despite the weather we do plan to launch this week!

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Colin
Kilgour
Sent: April-14-13 5:21 PM
To: C&C List
Subject: Stus-List Question for Raymarine techs.

 

Fred, Rich and anyone else who has got their Raymarine ticket...

My Raymarine (ST60) wind transducer began dying a slow death after a
particularly breezy and rainy passage in the fall of 2011.  By the fall of
2012, it was pretty much dead and while there was power at the display,
there was no data coming from the masthead.  

When a crewman who loves to go aloft finally got up to the masthead a few
weeks ago, the transducer was loose and darn near fell into his hand.  He
cleaned up all the contacts and re-attached the transducer, but no joy was
to be had.  (Occassionally, the wind speed would read "0.0" instead of "-.-"
but that's it.

My hypothesis is that the transducer worked itself loose in the storm and a
mix of salty and fresh water has been pouring into the cable ever since and
it has now failed.  (And yes, I've checked all the connections from the base
of the mast back to the helm).

Now, to replace the cable, do I need a Seatalk cable? or can I use something
more standard?  Also, do I have to replace the transducer?  Raymarine ships
the transducers with cable attached, so I'm wondering if there's some magic
to that.

Thoughts welcome... 

 

Cheers,
Colin

___
This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album
http://www.cncphotoalbum.com
CnC-List@cnc-list.com

Re: Stus-List Question

[Stevan Plavsa]

Kind of sounds like the battle I'm losing with a new bearing on my car, the
damn race just won't go in I finally took a caliper and measured the
old vs new, 1mm difference. Jeez, on an automotive bearing that's a lot!
That reminds me, I have to contact the parts vendor and try and get a
replacement.

Something about hoses, there are no regulated size guidelines. There is no
standard and they measure them differently, or so says Nigel Calder. You
may try purchasing a tiny section of another brand of hose in that size to
see if it fits better. On a reinforced hose like that I bet 1mm or 2mm
would make a big difference.

Steve
C&C 32
Toronto



On Thu, Apr 11, 2013 at 8:05 PM, Robert Abbott wrote:

>  Chuck:
>
> Yesterday, I did not have my 'heat gun'dumb had a ceramic heater,
> tap hot water, dish detergent, cut the inside edge of the hose with a box
> cutter to make an accepting angle of attachment.the problem is lack of
> leverage to push the hose over the not necessary 'lip' the manufacturer put
> on the mixing elbow.my next attempt on this job will include a 'heat
> gun'.If I have to I will melt the GD hose on the mixing elbow but one
> way or the other, it is going on.
>
> The hard part of this job was removing and reattaching the 'exhaust
> flange' from the 'exhaust manifold'.it's the incredibly difficult and
> limited space you have to work in.and my situation is further
> challenged by having a hot water tank in the locker I am trying to work
> from.  Anchoring the new muffler wasn't exactly a relaxing moment but not
> as difficult as the mixing elbow.
>
> You gotta enjoy this sadistic pleasure or why would we own these wonderful
> boats?
>
>
> Bob Abbott
> AZURA
> C&C 32 - 84
> Halifax, N.S.
>
>
>
>
> On 2013/04/11 7:28 PM, Chuck S wrote:
>
> Have you tired warming the hose?
> Wear gloves, heat up a tea kettle of water, soap up the mixing elbow with
> Joy dish detergent.  Pour hot water on and into the hose end.  Try not to
> get any in the mixing elbow.
>
> Be persisistent, be *Resolute*.  Or offer to buy a yard guy a 30 pack of
> beer to show you?  He'll probably do it on his break for you.
>
> Chuck
> Resolute
> 1990 C&C 34R
> Atlantic City, NJ
>  --
> *From: *"Robert Abbott" 
> *To: *cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> *Sent: *Thursday, April 11, 2013 8:27:48 AM
> *Subject: *Stus-List Question
>
> Rich:
>
> I did that also, beveled the inside of the hose with a box cutter.   The
> hose is a hard-walled, marine exhaust hose with a wire
> lining.extremely stiff.  The lip on the mixing elbow is the
> challengebecause of where it is with me lying on my left side inside
> the engine compartment, I don't have enough leverage to push the hose
> over the lip.   The other end slides on the new muffler with little effort.
>
> There's no way I could use an angle grinder down there to take the 'lip'
> off.I need the use of two hands to use the grinder
> properly/safely.I can't position myself with the room, or lack
> thereof, to do that.  I have a hot water tank in the port lazarette that
> further restricts the access to the engine compartment.
>
> The idea of a 'tail pipe expander' might be the solutionit's only
> $20after what I went through yesterday and the way parts of my body
> feel today, I would gladly pay another $20 to bring this boat project to
> a conclusion.
>
> Bob Abbott
> AZURA
> C&C 32 - 84
> Halifax, N.S.
>
>
>
> ___
> This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album
> http://www.cncphotoalbum.com
> CnC-List@cnc-list.com
>
>
___
This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album
http://www.cncphotoalbum.com
CnC-List@cnc-list.com

Re: Stus-List Question: 37+ Recessed cabin plate

[DAVID R MOCNY]

Ed,

Wow! I appreciate everyone's quick response and your solution as well. We'll 
have to sit back and consider this new information tomorrow on Obsession to see 
what direction we want to take, I am sure it will involve a bit of Mount Gay... 
 Will let you know where we end up. At some point the skipper will give the 
"make it so" command so I need to be ready. 

I am fortunate to have a full service machine shop at our facility so if there 
is a will, there is a way (they helped us with our Force 10 lower pan). In any 
case, I will keep the group posted.

Ed, Stus-List participants, thank you ever so much!

Signing out...

Joanne
Obsession
C&C 37/40+

From: Edd Schillay ; 
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com ; 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Question: 37+ Recessed cabin plate 
Sent: Fri, Apr 12, 2013 1:41:36 AM 

Joanne,

We did something different with ours with parts of the C&C "spear" off as well 
as parts of the "37 +". 

We knocked the remaining pieces off and used some molding putty to fix some of 
the edges that cracked off.

We then painted the entire thing in a flat black. 

Lastly, I went online to a custom vinyl lettering site and had the boat name 
made up in white lettering with a reflective outline so that it would fit 
inside. 

Rob Ball saw the finished product last September in Mystic and mentioned how 
much he liked the idea and the new look. 

You can see it if you zoom in on this picture:

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-_pUcUZefrfY/UG2byO27YdI/Blk/VKt3WcYZ9Mw/s1600/Day1Sailing.jpg


All the best,

Edd

---
Edd M. Schillay
Starship Enterprise
NCC-1701-B
C&C 37+ | City Island, NY
---
914.332.4400  | Office
914.332.1671  | Fax
914.774.9767  | Mobile
---
Sent via iPhone 5

On Apr 11, 2013, at 9:24 PM, Us  wrote:

Ok all, I have a question that has been driving me crazy... Does anyone have a 
resource for the recessed plate on the port and starboard cabin that has the 
C&C star logo with the 37+??? Ours is an obvious replacement as it is made of 
smoke plexiglass with the emblems just glued on. I know this can't be original 
and I want to replace it with something that Represents the quality of the 
boat. I've spoken to some woodworkers and machinists and a one piece plate will 
not be easy (reverse template needed). Any advice or resources would be GREATLY 
appreciated!

Joanne
Obsession
C&C 37/40+


___
This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album
http://www.cncphotoalbum.com
CnC-List@cnc-list.com
___
This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album
http://www.cncphotoalbum.com
CnC-List@cnc-list.com

Re: Stus-List Question: 37+ Recessed cabin plate

[Chuck S]

Joanne, 
The letters I found that I will try ( other projects scream for attention ) 
came from a vanity license plate set from Walmart, made so you can make your 
own statement. It has the right sized letters and numbers so I can put C&C 34R 
on each side. I tossed the packaging and can't find a name on it. Should be 
available from Pep Boys or Auto Zone or internet? 


Chuck 
Resolute 
1990 C&C 34R 
Atlantic City, NJ 
- Original Message -
From: "DAVID R MOCNY"  
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com, cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
Sent: Thursday, April 11, 2013 10:24:23 PM 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Question: 37+ Recessed cabin plate 


Chuck, 

That is exactly the signage I am referring to, I seriously thought it was the 
previous owners doing as a local 34+ had different signage - hard to know what 
was original. Still like the raised letters, will have to continue to look 
around for a source. Btw, thank you for your quick response, ya'll are awesome! 

Joanne 
Obsession 
37/40+ 





From: Chuck S ; 
To: ; 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Question: 37+ Recessed cabin plate 
Sent: Fri, Apr 12, 2013 1:37:34 AM 



Do you mean the 3" x 15" plastic plaque that has the model name on it like "C&C 
37 +"? 

All of the lettering fell off of our C&C 34R plaque. The plaques themselves are 
very strongly adhered to the cabin sides. I intend to glue new plastic letters 
using Goop or other waterproof glue. 



Chuck 
Resolute 
1990 C&C 34R 
Atlantic City, NJ 
- Original Message -
From: "Us"  
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
Cc: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
Sent: Thursday, April 11, 2013 9:24:51 PM 
Subject: Stus-List Question: 37+ Recessed cabin plate 

Ok all, I have a question that has been driving me crazy... Does anyone have a 
resource for the recessed plate on the port and starboard cabin that has the 
C&C star logo with the 37+??? Ours is an obvious replacement as it is made of 
smoke plexiglass with the emblems just glued on. I know this can't be original 
and I want to replace it with something that Represents the quality of the 
boat. I've spoken to some woodworkers and machinists and a one piece plate will 
not be easy (reverse template needed). Any advice or resources would be GREATLY 
appreciated! 

Joanne 
Obsession 
C&C 37/40+ 


___ 
This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album 
http://www.cncphotoalbum.com 
CnC-List@cnc-list.com 

___ 
This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album 
http://www.cncphotoalbum.com 
CnC-List@cnc-list.com 
___
This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album
http://www.cncphotoalbum.com
CnC-List@cnc-list.com

Re: Stus-List Question: 37+ Recessed cabin plate

[DAVID R MOCNY]

Chuck, 

That is exactly the signage I am referring to, I seriously thought it was the 
previous owners doing as a local 34+ had different signage - hard to know what 
was original. Still like the raised letters, will have to continue to look 
around for a source. Btw, thank you for your quick response, ya'll are 
awesome!

Joanne
Obsession
37/40+___
This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album
http://www.cncphotoalbum.com
CnC-List@cnc-list.com

Re: Stus-List Question: 37+ Recessed cabin plate

[Edd Schillay]

Joanne,

We did something different with ours with parts of the C&C "spear" off as well 
as parts of the "37 +". 

We knocked the remaining pieces off and used some molding putty to fix some of 
the edges that cracked off.

We then painted the entire thing in a flat black. 

Lastly, I went online to a custom vinyl lettering site and had the boat name 
made up in white lettering with a reflective outline so that it would fit 
inside. 

Rob Ball saw the finished product last September in Mystic and mentioned how 
much he liked the idea and the new look. 

You can see it if you zoom in on this picture:

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-_pUcUZefrfY/UG2byO27YdI/Blk/VKt3WcYZ9Mw/s1600/Day1Sailing.jpg


All the best,

Edd

---
Edd M. Schillay
Starship Enterprise
NCC-1701-B
C&C 37+ | City Island, NY
---
914.332.4400  | Office
914.332.1671  | Fax
914.774.9767  | Mobile
---
Sent via iPhone 5

On Apr 11, 2013, at 9:24 PM, Us  wrote:

Ok all, I have a question that has been driving me crazy... Does anyone have a 
resource for the recessed plate on the port and starboard cabin that has the 
C&C star logo with the 37+??? Ours is an obvious replacement as it is made of 
smoke plexiglass with the emblems just glued on. I know this can't be original 
and I want to replace it with something that Represents the quality of the 
boat. I've spoken to some woodworkers and machinists and a one piece plate will 
not be easy (reverse template needed). Any advice or resources would be GREATLY 
appreciated!

Joanne
Obsession
C&C 37/40+


___
This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album
http://www.cncphotoalbum.com
CnC-List@cnc-list.com
___
This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album
http://www.cncphotoalbum.com
CnC-List@cnc-list.com