Re: FCC question RF exposure question
Anders, that refers to the RF exposure to human beings. Mobile means that the antenna needs to be or will be more that 20 cm away from humans. Portable means that the antenna will be within 20 cm of the body. Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 = Anders Svensson B anders.b.svensso To n...@ericsson.com emc-p...@ieee.org Sent by: emc-p...@ieee.org emc-p...@ieee.org cc Subject 12/16/2008 02:02 FCC question RF exposure question AM Hi group, What means with the expression in a FCC grant: mobile-only exposure conditions? Regards Anders - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc Graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. can be posted to that URL. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald dhe...@gmail.com - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc Graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. can be posted to that URL. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald: dhe...@gmail.com
Re: Wimax
There are none specifically for Wimax (to my knowledge) but there are for the frequencies that it uses. Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 = Steve O'Steen Steve.OSteen@acs testlab.com To Sent by: emc-p...@ieee.org emc-p...@ieee.org cc sost...@acstestlab.com Subject 12/11/2008 02:56 Wimax PM Are there any applicable compliance standards for Wimax, specifically focused on Electromagnetic Compatibility for the EMC and RTTE Directives? I don’t recall seeing anything that was harmonized but, are there publications from work groups or technical groups that would be available? Steve O'Steen Advanced Compliance Solutions, Inc. sost...@acstestlab.com 770-831-8048 ext. 210 www.acstestlab.com CONFIDENTIAL This e-mail and any attachments may contain information which is confidential, proprietary, privileged or otherwise protected by law. The information is solely intended for the named addressee (or a person responsible for delivering it to the addressee). If you are not the intended recipient of this message, you are not authorized to read, print, retain, copy or disseminate this message or any part of it. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail and delete it from your computer. - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc Graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. can be posted to that URL. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald dhe...@gmail.com - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc Graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. can be posted to that URL. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald: dhe...@gmail.com
RE: DIY Equipment and Calibration
I believe that you will also need your calibrating equipment traceable to a National Standards group such as NIST in the US. Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 == Spencer, David H David.Spencer@xe To rox.com cmander...@micron.com Sent by: emc-p...@ieee.org emc-p...@ieee.org cc Subject 12/11/2008 08:04 RE: DIY Equipment and Calibration AM Chris, I've built several CDN's. Repaired both CDN's and LISN's. Never messed with building an EM clamp. Too much hassle IMO. As far as calibration, I try to calibrate as much as is practical in house.All the LISN's, ISN's, CDN's, cable loss, amplifier performance, etc etc . But in reality those calibrations are just verifications. To perform those verifications most people are lacking a network impedance analyzer. The test jigs or setups are easy to build or cheap to purchase. Regarding an accrediting organization accepting the results, you'll need a process. You can't go wrong by referencing CISPR 16 et. al. in that respect. You'll need the verification data. AND, you'll need the measurement uncertainty. The last item, you can gather from your impedance analyzer accuracy specifications (and calibration report) and the test jig VSWR losses. As for where you can send you in-house built test items, most any ISO17025 test lab which calibrates EMC or similar devices can perform the calibration. Regards David Spencer EMC Engineer Xerox Corp. From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org] On Behalf Of cmander...@micron.com Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2008 5:00 PM To: emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: DIY Equipment and Calibration I'm aware of some people making their own CDN's and LISN's among other things and I have few questions about that. 1) Has anyone tried to build their own EM Injection clamp? If so, were you able to find a ferrite supplier that sold half-ring cores? 2) Is it acceptable to calibrate your own equipment? If so, how do accrediting bodies view this, and what documentation will they want to see? If not, does anyone have suggestions about where in the US I can send such homemade equipment for calibration (preferably Western US to save on shipping)? Thanks, Chris - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc Graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. can be posted to that URL. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald dhe...@gmail.com - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc Graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. can be posted to that URL. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions,
Re: EMI Receiver
My management calls it that expensive do-hickey. Bob Heller St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 Price, Andrew (SELEX GALILEO, UK) To Andrew.P.Price@s emc-p...@ieee.org elexgalileo.com cc Sent by: emc-p...@ieee.org Subject EMI Receiver 12/01/2008 09:00 AM Hi All What was wrong with the old Stoddart/Ailtech Identity? EMI/Field Intensity Meter Regards Andy Andrew P. Price Principle Hardware Engineer, EMC Specialist SELEX GALILEO, Sensors Airborne Systems Christopher Martin Road Basildon Essex SS14 3EL Mail Ref : K160 ( Tel Direct : +44 (0)1268 887271 ( Tel EMC LAB : +44 (0)1268 883308 )Mobile: +44 (0)7507 854888 P Please consider the environment before printing this email. SELEX Sensors and Airborne Systems Limited Registered Office: Sigma House, Christopher Martin Road, Basildon, Essex SS14 3EL A company registered in England Wales. Company no. 02426132 This email and any attachments are confidential to the intended recipient and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended recipient please delete it from your system and notify the sender. You should not copy it or use it for any purpose nor disclose or distribute its contents to any other person. - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc Graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. can be posted to that URL. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald dhe...@gmail.com - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc Graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. can be posted to that URL. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald: dhe...@gmail.com
Re: FW: Deviation of Performance Criteria
John, one of the problems with defining criteria is that you cannot define criteria that will encompass all of the past, present, and future equipment in the world. Only the manufacturer (keeping in mind his customers and competitors) can definitively define what is or is not acceptable. Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 John Harrington jharrington@keit hley.com To Sent by: emc-p...@ieee.org emc-p...@ieee.org cc Subject 11/07/2008 07:21 FW: Deviation of Performance AMCriteria Hi Group While we all have our copies of EN 61326 close at hand I’d like to see what your consensus of opinion is on the meaning of paragraph 6.2.102 of EN61326-2-1. ‘ 6.2.102 Tests with continuously present electromagnetic phenomenon No visual degradation of parameters of the EUT is allowed during application of the test, except as specified by the manufacturer.†The standard calls it an “addition†to the requirements of EN 61326-1 section 6.2 but does not indicate whether it replaces the tables there or modifies the Criterion A requirements. What do you think? Thanks John Harrington From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org] On Behalf Of Kunde, Brian Sent: Thursday, November 06, 2008 8:12 AM To: EMC-PSTC@listserv.ieee.org Subject: RE: Deviation of Performance Criteria Thanks to all. Your comments were greatly appreciated and helpful. The Other Brian From: Martin, Charles R (GE EntSol, SensInsp) [mailto:charles.mar...@ge.com] Sent: Wednesday, November 05, 2008 6:25 PM To: Kunde, Brian; EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG Subject: RE: Deviation of Performance Criteria Hi Brian, I agree with you, I don't see any other statements. Table 2 evaluation of immunity test results notes possible combinations of device function, phenomenon and performance criteria. This has been removed in EN 61326-1:2006 and the performance criteria has been added to the immunity test requirements tables for each port and phenomenon. Thanks, Charlie Martin From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org] On Behalf Of Kunde, Brian Sent: Wednesday, November 05, 2008 2:24 PM To: Ted Eckert; EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG Subject: RE: Deviation of Performance Criteria As Doug mentioned in his email, the allowance of deviations appear to have been removed in the 2006 version of the EN 61326-1 standard which I believe becomes mandatory in February 2009. Can anyone else confirm this or is there some other statement in the 2006 version that I’m not seeing that allows the deviation? Thanks, The Other Brian From: Ted Eckert [mailto:ted.eck...@microsoft.com] Sent: Wednesday, November 05, 2008 1:53 PM To: Kunde, Brian; EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG Subject: RE: Deviation of Performance Criteria As I read EN 61326, it allows the manufacturer to specify the performance criteria for each test. The standard only requires that equipment shall not become dangerous or unsafe as a result of the application of the tests. Table 2 is only an example of evaluation of immunity test results. The note states “…performance criteria B and/or C may be accepted provided that both the specification and the test report highlight such deviation(s) for the relevant combination(s) of function and test.†The standard does require that the deviations be listed in the specifications in addition to the test report. If the published specifications do not describe the deviations, the manufacturer may be considered in noncompliance with the standard. If they have declared compliance via the standard, this could be an issue. If the manufacturer has chosen not to use the standards route but claims compliance with the essential requirements of the directive, you may have an argument if the peripheral is not suitable for its intended use because of the deviation. I agree with David Spencer; you
13.56 MHz RFID for India
I am aware that 865-867 MHz RFID is allowed in India and it does not require a license. Does anyone know if 13.56 MHz is an allowable RFID frequency for India? Thank you, Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list.Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald: dhe...@gmail.com All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: Radiated Emission Measurements above 1GHz
So if I understand this, there is no testing required for Europe above a gigahertz for EN 55022 at this time? Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 = Pettit, Ghery ghery.pettit@int el.comTo rehel...@mmm.com 10/30/2008 04:47 rehel...@mmm.com PM cc emc-p...@ieee.org emc-p...@ieee.org Subject RE: Radiated Emission Measurements above 1GHz That is correct. It was quickly withdrawn and reissued without the limits above 1 GHz. I'm still waiting for my updated copy from Global, too. :-) From: rehel...@mmm.com [mailto:rehel...@mmm.com] Sent: Thursday, October 30, 2008 1:54 AM To: Pettit, Ghery Cc: emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: RE: Radiated Emission Measurements above 1GHz Ghery, are you saying that the BS version has the error and was withdrawn? If so we were not notified of this action by British Standards. We get their standards through their subscription service. Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 === Robert E. Heller/US-Corpora te/3M/US To Pettit, Ghery 10/30/2008 03:45 ghery.pet...@intel.com AM cc emc-p...@ieee.org emc-p...@ieee.org Subject RE: Radiated Emission Measurements above 1GHz(Document link: Robert E. Heller) So what is the bottom line? Are there or are there not limits for Europe (EN 55022) above a gig? I have copies of both BS EN 55022:2006 and BS EN 55022:2006 +A1:2007 Incorporating corrigendum no. 1. Both standards have a section 6.2 and both standards have limits from 1 to 6 GHz. BS EN 55022:2006 is listed in the OJ so I assume that it is valid. Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 Pettit, Ghery ghery.pettit@int el.comTo Sent by: Jim Hulbert jim.hulb...@pb.com emc-p...@ieee.org Flavin, John john.fla...@teradata.com emc-p...@ieee.org 10/29/2008 08:45 emc-p...@ieee.org PM cc Subject RE: Radiated Emission Measurements above 1GHz You must have an early copy put out by BSI. They made a mistake and included Amendment 1 to CISPR 22, Edition 5.0 and withdrew it promptly when I pointed out their error. Limits above 1 GHz should not be included in EN 55022:2006. Ghery S. Pettit, NCE Convener, CISPR SC I WG3 From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org] On Behalf Of Jim Hulbert Sent: Wednesday, October 29, 2008 10:09 AM To: Flavin, John; emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: RE: Radiated Emission Measurements above 1GHz EN 55022:2006 does indeed include the limits for radiated emissions in the range 1 GHz to 6 GHz. Look at section 6.2. This standard is published in the OJ and becomes compulsory under the EMC Directive as of 1 Oct 2009. Jim Hulbert, Group Leader TSO
RE: Touch test
Pete (or anyone on the list), do you know of a human body circuit model that is above 1 MHz? The circuits that are talked about below only go to a megahertz. Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 === Pete Perkins peperkinspe@cs.c omTo Sent by: 'Mike Hurley' emc-p...@ieee.org mikehur...@meadtest.com emc-p...@ieee.org cc 10/16/2008 11:25 AMSubject RE: Touch test Mike, The Touch Current test circuits are taken directly from IEC 60990 (Measurement of Touch Current and Protective Conductor Current). A collection of Touch Current measurements measured with the circuit that includes the frequency compensation network shown in these standards (called the Perception-Reaction network) can be found at www.safetylink.com by searching on perkins. :) br, Pete Peter E Perkins, PE Principal Product Safety Engineer PO Box 23427 Tigard, ORe 97281-3427 503/452-1201 fone/fax p.perk...@ieee.org -Original Message- From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org] On Behalf Of Mike Hurley Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2008 7:35 AM To: emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: Touch test Can anyone tell me if the touch test circuits of 60950 and 60065 are the same? Mike Hurley Director Mead testing ltd mikehur...@meadtest.com www.meadtest.com phone 44 (0) 1279 635865 fax 44 (0) 1279 635874 Mead Testing Limited is a company registered in England with company number 4572600 whose registered office is: Unit 25 Mead Park, River Way, Harlow, CM20 2SE. VAT number: 802 3904 59 - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald: dhe...@gmail.com All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald: dhe...@gmail.com All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list.Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald: dhe...@gmail.com All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: Radiated Emission Measurements above 1GHz
So what is the bottom line? Are there or are there not limits for Europe (EN 55022) above a gig? I have copies of both BS EN 55022:2006 and BS EN 55022:2006 +A1:2007 Incorporating corrigendum no. 1. Both standards have a section 6.2 and both standards have limits from 1 to 6 GHz. BS EN 55022:2006 is listed in the OJ so I assume that it is valid. Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 Pettit, Ghery ghery.pettit@int el.comTo Sent by: Jim Hulbert jim.hulb...@pb.com emc-p...@ieee.org Flavin, John john.fla...@teradata.com emc-p...@ieee.org 10/29/2008 08:45 emc-p...@ieee.org PM cc Subject RE: Radiated Emission Measurements above 1GHz You must have an early copy put out by BSI. They made a mistake and included Amendment 1 to CISPR 22, Edition 5.0 and withdrew it promptly when I pointed out their error. Limits above 1 GHz should not be included in EN 55022:2006. Ghery S. Pettit, NCE Convener, CISPR SC I WG3 From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org] On Behalf Of Jim Hulbert Sent: Wednesday, October 29, 2008 10:09 AM To: Flavin, John; emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: RE: Radiated Emission Measurements above 1GHz EN 55022:2006 does indeed include the limits for radiated emissions in the range 1 GHz to 6 GHz. Look at section 6.2. This standard is published in the OJ and becomes compulsory under the EMC Directive as of 1 Oct 2009. Jim Hulbert, Group Leader TSO Competitive Compliance Engineering Pitney Bowes, 35 Waterview Drive, Shelton, CT 06484 Tel: 203-924-3621 (Internal 442-3621) Fax: 203-924-3352 (Internal 442-3352) From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org] On Behalf Of Flavin, John Sent: Tuesday, October 28, 2008 5:20 PM To: emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: Radiated Emission Measurements above 1GHz We have copies of AS/NZS CISPR 22:2006 and CNS 13438:2006, both of which show radiated emission limits in the range 1-6GHz. Both reference CISPR 16-1-4 for the description of the test site. (Our copy of EN55022:2006 does not show any such limits.) A few questions: Has the CISPR test site for 1GHz been decided? Has the validation method for the site been decided? If the test site or site validation method is still not settled, how does one test to the limits shown in these two standards? John D. Flavin Teradata TCP Engineering 17095 Via del Campo San Diego, CA 92127 john.fla...@teradata.com V: (858) 485-3874 F: (213) 337-5432 - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald: dhe...@gmail.com All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald: dhe...@gmail.com All emc-pstc postings are
RE: Radiated Emission Measurements above 1GHz
Ghery, are you saying that the BS version has the error and was withdrawn? If so we were not notified of this action by British Standards. We get their standards through their subscription service. Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 === Robert E. Heller/US-Corpora te/3M/US To Pettit, Ghery 10/30/2008 03:45 ghery.pet...@intel.com AM cc emc-p...@ieee.org emc-p...@ieee.org Subject RE: Radiated Emission Measurements above 1GHz(Document link: Robert E. Heller) So what is the bottom line? Are there or are there not limits for Europe (EN 55022) above a gig? I have copies of both BS EN 55022:2006 and BS EN 55022:2006 +A1:2007 Incorporating corrigendum no. 1. Both standards have a section 6.2 and both standards have limits from 1 to 6 GHz. BS EN 55022:2006 is listed in the OJ so I assume that it is valid. Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 Pettit, Ghery ghery.pettit@int el.comTo Sent by: Jim Hulbert jim.hulb...@pb.com emc-p...@ieee.org Flavin, John john.fla...@teradata.com emc-p...@ieee.org 10/29/2008 08:45 emc-p...@ieee.org PM cc Subject RE: Radiated Emission Measurements above 1GHz You must have an early copy put out by BSI. They made a mistake and included Amendment 1 to CISPR 22, Edition 5.0 and withdrew it promptly when I pointed out their error. Limits above 1 GHz should not be included in EN 55022:2006. Ghery S. Pettit, NCE Convener, CISPR SC I WG3 From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org] On Behalf Of Jim Hulbert Sent: Wednesday, October 29, 2008 10:09 AM To: Flavin, John; emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: RE: Radiated Emission Measurements above 1GHz EN 55022:2006 does indeed include the limits for radiated emissions in the range 1 GHz to 6 GHz. Look at section 6.2. This standard is published in the OJ and becomes compulsory under the EMC Directive as of 1 Oct 2009. Jim Hulbert, Group Leader TSO Competitive Compliance Engineering Pitney Bowes, 35 Waterview Drive, Shelton, CT 06484 Tel: 203-924-3621 (Internal 442-3621) Fax: 203-924-3352 (Internal 442-3352) From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org] On Behalf Of Flavin, John Sent: Tuesday, October 28, 2008 5:20 PM To: emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: Radiated Emission Measurements above 1GHz We have copies of AS/NZS CISPR 22:2006 and CNS 13438:2006,
Fw: rod antenna measurement not allowed below 30 MHz for FCC
Mario, if you want the FCC reference for non-use of rods: Part 15.31(a)(3) calls out ANSI C63.4-2003 as a test method and C63.4 allows rod antenna measurements under 30 MHz. But 15.31(a)(3) also excludes paragraph 4.1.5.2 of C63.4 from being used which specifies the electric field measurements under 30 MHz with monopole (rod) antennas. Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 = The list of standards used by the FCC for measurements may be found at http://www.fcc.gov/oet/ea/eameasurements.html They are not consistent in using a loop antenna. For Access Broadband (in Part 15) the Commission uses loop antennas below 30 MHz (see http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/FCC-04-245A1.pdf . For Part 18 equipment, MP-5 specifies loops below 18 MHz and either loops or half-wave dipoles (never rod antenas) from 18-30 MHz. See http://www.fcc.gov/Bureaus/Engineering_Technology/Documents/measurement/mp5/ mp5-1986.pdf . There's possibly some room for other methods under Part 15. 15.31 says in part: Section 15.31 Measurement standards [SNIPPED] (b) All parties making compliance measurements on equipment subject to the requirements of this part are urged to use these measurement procedures. Any party using other procedures should ensure that such other procedures can be relied on to produce measurement results compatible with the FCC measurement procedures. The description of the measurement procedure used in testing the equipment for compliance and a list of the test equipment actually employed shall be made part of an application for certification or included with the data required to be retained by the party responsible for devices authorized pursuant to a Declaration of Conformity or devices subject to verification. Cortland KA5S === From: To: emc-p...@ieee.org Cc: Grace Lin Sent: 10/21/2008 8:15:00 AM Subject: rod antenna measurement not allowed below 30 MHz for FCC Dear Members, I´ve heard that FCC will not accept rod antenna measurements below 30 MHz. This was´nt published anywhere in the rules. May I ask you to help finding a source on the FCC web site to get such important information in the future? Kind regards Mario Lehmann Geschäftsbereich European Compliance Laboratory (ECL) __ HERBERG. Service Plus GmbH Tel: +49 911 59835-923 Nordostpark 51 Fax: +49 911 59835-90 90411 Nürnberg mailto: mlehm...@herberg-sp.de http://www.herberg-sp.de Amtsgericht Nürnberg Geschäftsführer HRB 19587 Peter Birkmann http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list.Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald: dhe...@gmail.com All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
315 MHz
Is 315 MHz a useable frequency for a short range device for Europe? I can't find it in 70-03. It is a key fob frequency for unlocking car doors. Does Europe use 433 MHz for this? Thanks, Bob Heller 3M Company, St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list.Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald:emc-p...@daveheald.com All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
300 328
Does ETSI EN 300 328 cover voice transmission? Thanks, Bob Heller St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list.Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald:emc-p...@daveheald.com All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
Re: Copies of CNS standards
Thank you Grace. You may want to impress upon the BSMI official the need that we have to purchase the BSMI standards in English. While we can have them translated, it is an expense delay in using the standards and we cannot be absolutely certain that the standard has been translated correctly. A translation by BSMI would be convenient and comforting. Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 Grace Lin gracelinnj@gmail .com To Sent by: emc-p...@ieee.org emc-p...@ieee.org cc Subject 08/13/2008 06:49 Re: Copies of CNS standards AM As Ted Mentioned, GB standards are for mainland China. They may be viewed through www.sac.gov.cn (the rectangular icon on the bottom left side). For CNS standards, I tried cnsonline.com. I stopped when I was asked for an account. Several members did go through it and purchased CNS standards. I will forward the difficulty of purchasing CNS standards to BSMI. In the meantime, if you urgently need any CNS standard(s), please let me know by Thursday, August 14, 2008. A top rank of BSMI official is coming to Detroit for the 2008 IEEE EMC Symposium next week. He is more than happy to assist you. Best regards, Grace On 8/12/08, Brian O'Connell oconne...@tamuracorp.com wrote: For the ANSI webstore, did you look under Chinese GB ? About 15 months ago I bought a Chinese std from ANSI - so do not know what changed. I just visited the cnsonline and bsmi.gov.tw sites and got a multitude of 404 errors, and a 301 (moved). Also, perhaps Grace Lin could advise, as she once wrote an article on comparing this std to CISPR. -Original Message- From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org]On Behalf Of Knighten, Jim L Sent: Tuesday, August 12, 2008 1:20 PM To: emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: RE: Copies of CNS standards Charles, I found acquisition of CNS 13438 to be difficult. Couldn't find it on the ANSI site. To purchase from cnsonline, you must purchase a HiTech prepaid card and that was the difficult part for us. The web site was difficult. We finally got our in-country rep. to get it for us. They said the website was too difficult and they went down to the BSMI office, purchased a paper copy, scanned it and sent it by e-mail. Good luck. Jim James L. Knighten, Ph.D. EMC Engineer Teradata Corporation 17095 Via Del Campo San Diego, CA 92127 858-485-2537 - phone 213-337-5432 - fax -Original Message- From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org] On Behalf Of Brian O'Connell Sent: Tuesday, August 12, 2008 10:47 AM To: emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: RE: Copies of CNS standards may not be safe for some browsers - www.cnsonline.com.tw/en/ also, ANSI has CNS - http://webstore.ansi.org -Original Message- From: emc-p...@ieee.org [mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org]On Behalf Of Grasso, Charles Sent: Tuesday, August 12, 2008 10:25 AM To: emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: Copies of CNS standards Hello list members, Where can I buy copies of the CNS standards? Best Regards Charles Grasso - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list.Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald:emc-p...@daveheald.com All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at:
300 440
Does ETSI EN 300 440 cover FHSS transmitters in the 2.4 GHz range? I have a wireless mouse in this range that has a test report done to 300 440 and I am wondering if this device should have been done to 300 328 or is 300 440 good enough? Thanks, Bob Heller St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list.Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald:emc-p...@daveheald.com All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
Ancillary Equipment
Can someone please define ancillary equipment for me as used in conjunction with European RF standards (for example, ETSI EN 301 489-1). The definition contained in that document leaves me somewhat confused. Also what if the equipment contains other functions not related to the transmitter? For example, a passport reader that reads an RFID tag but also has a mode that read UV inks. What is ancillary and what is not? Thanks, Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 = - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list.Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald:emc-p...@daveheald.com All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
Re: Low Loss Coax Cable
By flexible do people mean bendable or do they mean twistable. It has been my experience that when flipping an antenna between vertical and horizontal the brunt of the force is on the connector and not the cable (or perhaps this is so because the cable does not twist well). Bob Heller 3M Company - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list.Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald:emc-p...@daveheald.com All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
Re: Query on dealing with BSMI for EMC
Jim, Go to: ts.nist.gov/standards/conformity/mra/mra.cfm Select: APEC Tel MRA Select: How to apply for CAB designation under the APEC Tel MRA Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 == Knighten, Jim L Jim.Knighten@Ter adata.com To Sent by: emc-p...@ieee.org emc-p...@ieee.org cc Subject 07/07/2008 04:28 Query on dealing with BSMI for EMC PM Esteemed experienced colleagues, My company has a NVLAP-accredited EMC test laboratory in California. My product is ITE equipment (high value, low volume) and does not include telecom. My method of certification is usually the Declaration of Conformity. I understand that I can request my scope of accreditation be increased by NVLAP to include Taiwan’s CNS 13438. I am struggling to understand the process to follow in dealing with Taiwan. Do I need to become a BSMI (Taiwan) recognized laboratory and get a lab number? If so, how do I proceed? I appreciate any enlightenment. Jim James L. Knighten, Ph.D. - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list.Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald:emc-p...@daveheald.com All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
Russia + EMC
Can someone provide a thumbnail sketch on the process of importing a wireless communication headset (such as those used at McDonald's et al)? Are EMC/radio test reports from accredited test houses outside of Russia accepted? Are markings required? Thank you, Bob Heller, 3M Company St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list.Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald:emc-p...@daveheald.com All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
Re: Antwort: Re: FCC requirements for Card Readers
The requirements would be CFR 47, Part 15, Subpart B, Class A: 15.19 Labeling 15.105 Info to User 15.107 Conducted Emissions 15.109 Radiated Emissions The procedure would be ANSI C63.4 You can find the requirements at: www.gpoaccess.gov/cfr/retrieve.html Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 mlehmann@herberg- sp.de To 06/10/2008 06:41 rehel...@mmm.com AM cc Subject Antwort: Re: FCC requirements for Card Readers Bob, yes, I do. Regards Mario Lehmann Geschäftsbereich European Compliance Laboratory (ECL) __ HERBERG. Service Plus GmbH Tel: +49 911 59835-923 Nordostpark 51 Fax: +49 911 59835-90 90411 Nürnberg mailto: mlehm...@herberg-sp.de http://www.herberg-sp.de Amtsgericht Nürnberg Geschäftsführer HRB 19587 Peter Birkmann
Fw: Antwort: Re: FCC requirements for Card Readers
As an additional note, if the card reader contained RFID then it would fall under Subpart C. Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 === - Forwarded by Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US on 06/10/2008 07:39 AM - Robert E. Heller/US-Corpora te/3M/US To emc-p...@ieee.org 06/10/2008 07:36 cc AMmlehm...@herberg-sp.de Subject Re: Antwort: Re: FCC requirements for Card Readers(Document link: Robert E. Heller) The requirements would be CFR 47, Part 15, Subpart B, Class A: 15.19 Labeling 15.105 Info to User 15.107 Conducted Emissions 15.109 Radiated Emissions The procedure would be ANSI C63.4 You can find the requirements at: www.gpoaccess.gov/cfr/retrieve.html Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 mlehmann@herberg- sp.de To 06/10/2008 06:41 rehel...@mmm.com AM cc Subject Antwort: Re: FCC requirements for Card Readers Bob, yes, I do. Regards Mario Lehmann Geschäftsbereich European Compliance Laboratory (ECL) __ HERBERG. Service Plus GmbH Tel: +49 911 59835-923 Nordostpark 51 Fax: +49 911 59835-90
Re: ICES -003 approval for FCC DoC product
No you don't. The latest version is ICES-003 2004 Issue 4. Actually the FCC will accept test data done to CISPR 22 (see CFR 47, Part 15.109 (g)). If the ITE device is an intentional radiator, then the testing site will have to be listed by the FCC and IC. Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 === Kbalasubramanian@ scmmicro.co.in Sent by: To emc-p...@ieee.org emc-p...@ieee.org cc 06/09/2008 05:33 Subject AMICES -003 approval for FCC DoC product Dear Experts, We have tested our ITE device for FCC Part15 Class B compliance in an NVLAP accredited lab. In the same lab for the same device we conducted testing for CISPR22 Class B compliance also. Based on these 2 reports we have issued DoC for placing the device in US EU market. Now the same device we plan to sell in Canada. Do we need another testing or can we issue a DoC based on the FCC CISPR reports. Sincerely                                                          SCM Microsystems (India) Pvt. Ltd. K. Balasubramanian                                         Modules 0506, 0507 0508, D – Block, Manager – Hardware                                        South Wing, TIDEL Park, Tel : +91 44 22540020  Ext : 305                       #4, Rajiv Gandhi Road,(formerly Canal Bank Road) Fax :+91 44 22540029                                       Taramani, Chennai – 600113. India E-mail:kbalasubraman...@scmmicro.co.in         Web : http://scmmicro.com ‘This email and any attachment may contain confidential information and are intended solely for the use of the named recipient(s). If you have received this information in error, you are prohibited from reading, copying, distributing and using the information. If you are not a named addressee or otherwise an intended recipient you are requested to immediately notify the sender and to delete this email and all attachments from your system.’ - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list.Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald:emc-p...@daveheald.com All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list.Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald:emc-p...@daveheald.com All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
Re: ICES -003 approval for FCC DoC product
It is not automatic however (and I'm not implying that you implied that). Among other items you will have to provide your NSA data. Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 == Scott Drysdale sd...@canada.com To rehel...@mmm.com 06/09/2008 09:50 kbalasubraman...@scmmicro.co.in AM cc Subject Re: ICES -003 approval for FCC DoC product Good Afternoon, To further Bobs comments, labs registered with the FCC may already be registered with Industry Canada. The requirements are virtually identical, and I don't remember a filing fee for registration. You can check here: http://strategis.ic.gc.ca/app/sitt/testFacilities/launchIndex.do?TF_ACTION=TF_INDEXtemplateKey=SITT_TESTFACILITIESTF_TYPE=1TF_LANG=eng Best Regards, Scott Drysdale OOO - Own Opinions Only --- Original Message Follows --- From: rehel...@mmm.com To: kbalasubraman...@scmmicro.co.in Cc: Subject: Re: ICES -003 approval for FCC DoC product Date: Mon, 9 Jun 2008 07:22:04 -0500 No you don't. The latest version is ICES-003 2004 Issue 4. Actually the FCC will accept test data done to CISPR 22 (see CFR 47, Part 15.109 (g)). If the ITE device is an intentional radiator, then the testing site will have to be listed by the FCC and IC. Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 === Kbalasubramanian@ scmmicro.co.in Sent by: To emc-p...@ieee.org emc-p...@ieee.org cc 06/09/2008 05:33 Subject AMICES -003 approval for FCC DoC product Dear Experts, We have tested our ITE device for FCC Part15 Class B compliance in an NVLAP accredited lab. In the same lab for the same device we conducted testing for CISPR22 Class B compliance also. Based on these 2 reports we have issued DoC for placing the device in US EU market. Now the same device we plan to sell in Canada. Do we need another testing or can we issue a DoC based on the FCC CISPR reports. Sincerely SCM Microsystems (India) Pvt. Ltd. K. Balasubramanian Modules 0506, 0507 0508, D – Block, Manager – Hardware South Wing, TIDEL Park, Tel : +91 44 22540020 Ext : 305 #4, Rajiv Gandhi Road,(formerly Canal Bank Road) Fax :+91 44 22540029Taramani, Chennai – 600113. India E-mail:kbalasubraman...@scmmicro.co.in Web : http://scmmicro.com ‘This email and any attachment may contain confidential information and are intended solely for the use of the named recipient(s). If you have received this information in error, you are prohibited from reading, copying, distributing and using the information. If you are not a named addressee or otherwise an intended recipient you are requested to immediately notify the sender and to delete this email and all attachments from your system.’ - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list.Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators:
Accessory
For Europe, can you test an accessory by itself (such as a printer in self-print mode with the proper cabling hanging off it) or do you have to test it in a typical user system configuration (hanging off a computer)? Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 = - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list.Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald:emc-p...@daveheald.com All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
Probes and Antennas
What European standard are probes tested under? If I am selling a broadband probe from 1 MHz to 3 GHZ and a preamp for the probe, what standard do I test to? What standards do antenna manufacturers test to? Are there immunity exclusion bands for these devices? Thanks, Bob Heller 3M Company St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list.Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald:emc-p...@daveheald.com All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
mw/mhz
I am reading a Japanese standard for 2.4 GHz and it gives an antenna power limit of 3mW/MHz (no antenna distance). Can someone help as to how this is measured. I guess I don't understand the parameter being measured. Thanks Bob Heller 3M Company St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list.Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald:emc-p...@daveheald.com All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
Re: Fw: resend environmental quotation.
While interesting, do we really need the philosophical/political emails on this site? Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list.Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to emc-p...@ieee.org Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas emcp...@ptcnh.net Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org David Heald:emc-p...@daveheald.com All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
Fort Lauderdale
Are there any test houses in the Fort Lauderdale, Florida area with ten-meter turntables (anechoic or OATS)? Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 === --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list
Re: Painting the ferrite tiles on a Semi-anechoic chamber
We placed a lighter colored wall covering on ours. We went to the tile manufacturer and asked them for their approved materials, process, etc. and then the company that built our chamber applied it. Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 === --- Original Message - From: Fallah, Ahmad afal...@ciena.com To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Sent: Tuesday, December 03, 2002 7:36 PM Subject: Painting the ferrite tiles on a Semi-anechoic chamber Group, Has anyone attempted to paint the inside of an anechoic chamber (i.e., paint the ferrite tiles)? Some chambers have partial or no coverage of the ferrite tiles by the absorber cones, which result in darkening the chamber's inside. The idea is to paint the ferrite tiles in a light color to brighten up the inside. Thanks, Ahmad Fallah --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list
Re: groundplane of alternative test sites
However in C63.4 : 2000, Section 5.4.6.5 (NSA for alternative test sites) a groundplane is called out. Section 5.4.6.5 is referenced from Section 5.4.2. The very last sentence of Section 5.4.6.5 states, The alternative test site is considered suitable for performing radiated emissions testing if all NSA measurements prescribed above meet the requirements of 5.4.6.1 and the reference groundplane requirements of 5.4.3 Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 === KC CHAN [PDD] kcc...@hkpc.orgTo: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Sent by: cc: owner-emc-pstc@majordo Subject: groundplane of alternative test sites mo.ieee.org 12/02/2002 08:09 PM Please respond to KC CHAN [PDD] Just want to share with you all what I found. For alternative test sites of radiated emission testing, C63.4 : 2001 In Section 5.4.2, it only requires volumetric NSA requirements, no requirement for ground plane. C63.4 : 1992 In section 5.4.2, it requires volumetric NSA requirements(5.4.6) and ground plane requirements( 5.4.3) CISPR 16-1 : 1998 In section 16.7.3, it requires both volumetric NSA and ground plane requirements. Any charge of the latest CISPR 16-1: 1999 ? --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list
RE: Ferrite clamps
What is S11? Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 === Ghery, You are right. The parameters for S11 and ferrite are widely varying and probably that is why no specifications were made up. However, most ferrites do behave in the area around 75-300 ohms so a 100 % tolerance (SWR 1:2) may be achieved. This needs investigations of course. I think that using current transformer techniques in the early stage of the clamp and suitable load resistors the S11 may be controlled, however. Regards, Gert Gremmen ce-test, qualified testing Rotterdam, The Netherlands --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list
Re: DC Input Power Conducted Emissions
Does this require a different LISN other than the standard LISN? Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 === Ron Pickard RPickard@hypercom To: rehel...@mmm.com .comcc: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: Re: DC Input Power Conducted Emissions 11/25/2002 02:50 PM Bob, Also to what Leslie has stated, if your equipment is considered to be Telecommunications Network Equipment, then ETSI's EN300386 would apply, which requires a conducted emissions test, according to EN55022, of the DC input power port (see clause 6.2) if the input wiring is greater than 3m. Best regards, Ron Pickard rpick...@hypercom.com owner-emc-pstc@majordo mo.ieee.org To: rehel...@mmm.com, emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org cc: 11/25/02 01:07 PM Subject: Re: DC Input Power Conducted Emissions Please respond to leslie_bai Bob, EN55022 is applicable to ITE equipment, there is no conducted emissions on DC port. However, EN55022 excludes any equipment (or part of the ITE equipment) which has a primary function of radio transmission and/or reception according to the ITU Radio Regulations (excerpt from EN55022:1998, Clause 3.1). For excluded equipement, Conducted emission testing on DC port may be required. Here is an example. For Short Range Device (SRD), EN 301 489-3 both DC and AC ports are required Conducted Emissions testing, refer to Clause 7.1 (Emissions) at Page 14 of EN 301 489-3 (2000-08). If your PC is just another personal computer mainly for data processing rather than data transmission, Conducted emission testing on the DC port is not applicable. Hope this helps. Leslie rehel...@mmm.com wrote: Is it a requirement to measure conducted emissions on a DC input power port under CISPR 22 or EN55022? The equipment is a PC that runs off a DC power bus? Thanks, Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-ps! tc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list
DC Input Power Conducted Emissions
Is it a requirement to measure conducted emissions on a DC input power port under CISPR 22 or EN55022? The equipment is a PC that runs off a DC power bus? Thanks, Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list
RE: ReIssue: When CE doesn't pass
You would certainly violate any warranties such as service and manufacturing. Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 = lisa_cef...@mksinst.co mTo: Chris K. Poore chr...@percept.com Sent by: cc: EMC-PSTC emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org owner-emc-pstc@majordo owner-emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org mo.ieee.org Subject: RE: ReIssue: When CE doesn't pass 11/25/2002 07:06 AM Please respond to Lisa_Cefalo I would be a bit concerned with altering another's product. Two things could happen, you could violate some other aspect of CE, so you would need to re-test everything, or, you could violate something in the design itself, and how would you explain a field problem? The liability would rest on you either way. Passing CE is such a relative term, as we all know, and depends on many things including standards tested to, and pass/fail criteria. What to do? A nasty dilemma. My suggestion would be, if you want to make the investment, would be to find out the source of the problem and perhaps approach the OEM with a proposal for your purchasing a special unit that has hardened RF immunity (or emissions, whichever is the problem) That way, your not accusing them of lying, just stating that your requirements in the environment used are a bit more stringent. Worth a try. Good luck Lisa Lisa A. Cefalo, CRE Manager, Reliability and Design Services MKS Instruments 6 Shattuck Road Andover, MA 01810 (978)-975-2350 X 5669 lisa_cef...@mksinst.com --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list
Revised EMCD
Can someone give me a brief status on the revised EMC Directive? Is it still alive? Will it require testing and marking of completed cable assemblies? If so, does anyone know what test setup is being proposed? Thanks, Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list
Re: Question on Receiver EMI testing..
The real world lives in the near field. Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 = Hans Mellberg emcconsultant@yahoo.c To: Cortland Richmond 72146@compuserve.com omGrasso, Charles charles.gra...@echostar.com Sent by: ieee pstc list emc-p...@ieee.org owner-emc-pstc@majordo cc: mo.ieee.org Subject: Re: Question on Receiver EMI testing.. 10/30/2002 10:53 AM Please respond to Hans Mellberg That reminds me of a set-top b-b receiver I was testing long ago. While it met all the class B specs both rad and susc., when placed on top of a TV there were interference issues because of the close proximity! (both from the TV and from the set-top!) Depending on your application, you may often have to test beyond the limits if your clientel is to remain satisfied! = Best Regards Hans Mellberg Regulatory Compliance EMC Design Services Consultant By the Pacific Coast next to Silicon Valley, Santa Cruz, CA, USA office:831-454-9450, cell:408-507-9694, fax:831-454-0755 __ Do you Yahoo!? HotJobs - Search new jobs daily now http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/ --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list
60601-1-2
Has the version EN 60601-1-2 : 2002 been published in the OJ yet? Or is the 1993 version still the latest? Can someone point me to the web for the latest harmonized standards list to the Medical Device Directive? Thanks, Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list
RE: Mobile Power Cart
If the cart can be used with the battery charger in place, I would also do it to EN55014 (since, I assume, that it is basically a motor driven device). Then harmonics and flicker would apply as well. Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 Joshua Wiseman jwiseman@printronix.c To: Emc-Pstc (E-mail) emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org om cc: Sent by: Subject: RE: Mobile Power Cart owner-emc-pstc@majordo mo.ieee.org 10/17/2002 10:15 AM Please respond to Joshua Wiseman I am getting a lot of response about Safety, but I forget to say that I need to know about EMC as well. At this time my plan is to test the unit as an option with my printer in place. I plan to test to EN 55022 and EN 55024 including 61000 series, but would Harmonics and Flicker testing be of concerns as well. Again thanks for the help, Josh -Original Message- From: Joshua Wiseman [mailto:jwise...@printronix.com] Sent: Wednesday, October 16, 2002 3:39 PM To: Emc-Pstc (E-mail) Subject: Mobile Power Cart Hi all, My marketing department has decided it would be a good idea to put a printer on a battery cart. My question is what standards will I need to test to for this. The power cart will be supplied with a battery charger, 12V lead-acid battery, and a 12Vdc to 120Vac or 12Vdc to 230Vac inverter. Thanks in advance for your help, Josh --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list
Electric + Water
How about a very efficient electric-chair : -) Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list
EN 61000-3-2:2000
Clause 6.2.3.1 (page 13) of the above standard talks about repeatability. Does this mean that the harmonic tests must be repeated a certain numbers of times or is repeatability used to determine or shorten the test observation period? Also in Table Z1 (clause 6.2.4, page 14), what is the type of equipment behavior called out as quasi-stationary? Thanks, Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list
RE: FCC and Professional Scanner : Verification or certification
Not necessarily, you may want to cost reduce the product in the future and may need the 'A' to 'B' overhead. Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 = John Shinn john.shinn@sanmin To: 'Gary McInturff' gary.mcintu...@worldwidepackets.com a-sci.com john.sh...@sanmina-sci.com 'Pierre SELVA' e.l...@wanadoo.fr 07/29/2002 09:22 'Forum Safety-emc' emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org AM cc: (bcc: Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US) Please respond toSubject: RE: FCC and Professional Scanner : Verification or certification John Shinn Obviously there is considerable disagreement between myself and what appears to be the rest of the group. The positions regarding the consideration of the scanner as a Class A device were well thought out. I will bow to the consenses of the group However, even if the scanner were intended only for an Industrial / commercial market, and it could meet the Class B limits, wouldn't it be better to issue a DoC in order to open up more markets for the device? John --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list
Pacemakers
Is anyone aware of any radiated immunity standards or test limits for pacemakers (national, international, or industry)? Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list
Re: NSA measurement and its uncertainty
Look at CISPR 16-1, Annex M for insight. This provides the basis for the +/- 4 dB. 3 of the 4 dB is already measurement uncertainty with the remaining 1 dB as site imperfections. However this MU does not include the signal source or the repeatibility of the test procedure. Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 = KC CHAN [PDD] kcc...@hkpc.orgTo: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org cc: (bcc: Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US) 07/17/2002 02:53 Subject: NSA measurement and its uncertainty AM Please respond to KC CHAN [PDD] Hi all I just got a tough question from our auditor about NSA and uncertainty. He asked if we will include the uncertainty into our Normalized Site Attenuation measurement or not. If we include the uncertainty of NSA measurement, it is impossible for us to ensure it is within the +/- 4dB with 95% CL. I would like to seek comment form the expertise if it is necessary to include the uncertainty when we do the NSA measurement. Thank you KC Chan --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list
C-Tick Artwork
Does anyone know if Australian C-Tick electronic artwork is publically available for downloading from the Web? I did not find anything on the ACA website. Thank you, Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list
EN 12895
Can anyone tell me which Directive the following standard falls under (is harmonized to): EN 12895 Industrial Trucks - Electromagnetic Compatibility Thanks, Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list
RE: Accreditation - testing ourselves and a new question.
In my experience and opinion, they are wasting your time and money. Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 = Gary McInturff Gary.McInturff@worldwidep To: am...@westin-emission.no ackets.com\EMC-PSTC (E-mail)\ cc: (bcc: Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US) 05/23/2002 11:08 AM Subject: RE: Accreditation - testing ourselves and a new question. Please respond to Gary McInturff Amund I'm not quite sure I understand this. Are you saying that for pre-qualification only, that you want to run the gear? If that's the case I don't believe that their accreditation speaks to that in any fashion, but their business insurance etc might have something to say about it. If my main income was coming from the continued operation and calibration of some very expensive equipment, it would have to be a very special case before I let others operate it and potentially put it at risk. In fact the test lab I use has a branch near me. The measuring equipment, ground plane and structures were all purchased by me for a third company some years ago when I ran the EMI lab and I physically operated it for many years. Obviously, I am intimately familiar with it, but I keep my hands off of it, unless they ask me to make a quick check or something. If it is for accreditation then I think the hang-up is going to be in the quality manuals and documents that are part of the lab's accreditation. There is a section on the test personnel and their past and future training etc. You are not an employee of the lab so wouldn't fall under their quality guidelines, or necessarily adhere to their processes. To insure that they would have to sit there and oversee you, even if they were to allow. So they are going to charge you for the lab personnel anyway. As long as we are talking about procedural changes I would like to ask how test labs are treating the various input voltages available in most equipment. This would be for radiated emissions not conducted. Conducted emissions tests at different voltages are pretty clear in my mind, but not radiated emissions. Until just recently all of the labs I am aware of, and I used three or four, all used the same process for radiated emissions. Under the assumption that the logic operated at the same 5, 3.3 or 2.2 volts not matter what the input power range was. The radiated emissions was performed at generally 120 Vac, in the US. One lab always ran it at 230, as CISPR 22 made reference to the input voltage, while the US largely left it unaddressed other than noting that they accept the CISPR 22 limits and procedures as long as they are used both in amplitude and frequency range. I once saw a reference, may be Taiwan, that specified testing at multiple voltages, but even then only for Class B equipment. My primary lab has started, a prescan at each voltage under consideration, 120 and 230, and then selected a test voltage. It has now advanced to doing a much more intense scan at 100, 120 , 230 volts and then selecting a voltage (variances are often more equipment temperature related than voltage related, in my opinion and are in the noise floor - less than 1 dB). Only then does the test begin. The last time I was there the pre-scan took three hours. Then we could look for a full range of suspects, and finals. What used to be about a 4 hour process has become an 8 hour process, doubling my test expenses. Other than their desire for accuracy, which is a bit difficult to argue against, I can't find justification in the standards that demand it and it is eroding my budget. So basically I need to have a sanity check and either quit complaining at the test house or force the issue. In all
RE: Accreditation - testing ourselves
It is not true of 17025 nor is it the way auditors interpret it. An accredited lab is an accredited lab. Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 Michael.Sundstrom@ nokia.comTo: dave.clem...@motorola.com am...@westin-emission.no 05/23/2002 10:59 emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org AM cc: (bcc: Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US) Please respond toSubject: RE: Accreditation - testing ourselves Michael.Sundstrom Don't forget the aspect of self testing. Doesn't 17025 have special provisions / requirements about self testing your own item? I hear third party testing is always given precedence over self testing data. Is this true and written in 17025 or just the way the auditors interpret it? Michael Sundstrom NOKIA TCC Dallas / EMC ofc: (972) 374-1462 cell: (817) 917-5021 amateur call: KB5UKT -Original Message- From: ext Clement Dave-LDC009 [mailto:dave.clem...@motorola.com] Sent: Thursday, May 23, 2002 9:14 AM To: 'am...@westin-emission.no'; 'emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org' Subject: RE: Accreditation - testing ourselves From: am...@westin-emission.no [mailto:am...@westin-emission.no] Sent: Thursday, May 23, 2002 8:25 AM An EMC test lab is accredited according to ISO/IEC 17025. They are also accredited for many tests as the IEC61000-4-series, EN55022 and many other. We have previously done some EMC pre-testing in this lab and we have operated the test equipment ourselves. Now, they won't let us do that with reference to their accreditation status. The test lab personnel have to operate the test equipment. Does it make sense, is there any restriction in the accreditation ? There is nothing in ISO 17025 that would prevent a lab from allowing someone from coming in and using the equipment. However, if they had not made provisions in their QA manual for use by non lab personnel they would be in violation of there own procedures and subject to audit findings by the lab accrediting body. Specifically they would need to address; how they were going to ensure that testing done by non lab personnel would not be represented as lab performed testing and that test equipment was still in calibration after use by non lab personnel. They may be hiding behind the accreditation as a graceful way of stopping a practice they no longer want to be involved in. Dave Clement Motorola Inc. Global Homologation Engineering 20 Cabot Blvd. Mansfield, MA 02048 P:508-851-8259 F:508-851-8512 C:508-725-9689 mailto:dave.clem...@motorola.com --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to:
Re: Accreditation - testing ourselves
As long as the data you gather is not used in a test report to show compliance, it is between you and the lab (and their lawyers) as to what you can and cannot do. It has nothing to do with accreditation. Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 = amund@westin-emiss ion.no To: \EMC-PSTC \(E-mail\)\ cc: (bcc: Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US) 05/23/2002 07:25 Subject: Accreditation - testing ourselves AM Please respond to amund Hi all, An EMC test lab is accredited according to ISO/IEC 17025. They are also accredited for many tests as the IEC61000-4-series, EN55022 and many other. We have previously done some EMC pre-testing in this lab and we have operated the test equipment ourselves. Now, they won't let us do that with reference to their accreditation status. The test lab personnel have to operate the test equipment. Does it make sense, is there any restriction in the accreditation ? We have always made a clear cut between pre-testing and accredited testing. Best regards Amund Westin --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list
Re: CE MARKING A SYSTEM
Contrary to popular opinion, the TCF route is not designed to get around standards. Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 === John Woodgate jmw@jmwa.demon To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org .co.uk cc: (bcc: Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US) Subject: Re: CE MARKING A SYSTEM 04/30/2002 08:55 AM Please respond to John Woodgate I read in !emc-pstc that Gordon,Ian ian.gor...@edwards.boc.com wrote (in E1BA0362B28ED211A1E80008C71EA30601818F4F@EXC_EAS01) about 'CE MARKING A SYSTEM', on Tue, 30 Apr 2002: Can anyone advise the course of action in applying a CE mark as regards EMC to a system some of whose component parts are not built by us and whose D of C's claim light industrial immunity. However, the system has been running in very harsh environments e.g. plasma etch applications at customer sites and we wish to claim industrial level immunity for the system. The system is obviously fit for purpose in the intended environment. We have performed radiated testing to this level on the whole system. Unfortunately if we surge test these light industrial components which form part of the system we are certain they will fail at the appropriate levels. One component is an industrial PC. Does anybody have any suggestions as to what action to take to allow us to apply the CE mark and claim industrial immunity? If you are sure it won't pass the normal industrial immunity tests, but is fit for purpose and thus you don't want to have to make it conform, you have to use the Technical File route. -- Regards, John Woodgate, OOO - Own Opinions Only. http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk Interested in professional sound reinforcement and distribution? Then go to http://www.isce.org.uk PLEASE do NOT copy news posts to me by E-MAIL! --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list
FCC Contact
Can anyone provide me with phone and/or name contacts for FCC rules interpretation (Parts 15, 18, and 68)? Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list
CNS Standards
Can anyone provide a source to purchase Taiwan EMC standards (CNS) in English? Thank you, Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list
Measurement Uncertainty Software
Does anyone know of any measurement uncertainty software that may be on the market to help in the determination of measurement uncertainty for the various EMC test methods? Thanks, Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list
RE: FCC part 15 section 109
Ghery, you are correct. Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 == Pettit, Ghery ghery.pettit@i To: Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US@3M-Corporate ntel.com Pettit, Ghery ghery.pet...@intel.com cc: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org 03/26/2002 'kristiaan.carpent...@alcatel.be' kristiaan.carpent...@mmm.com 10:06 AM Subject: RE: FCC part 15 section 109 The 108 MHz breakpoint applies to unintentional radiators, as well. From 15.33(b)(1) - Highest Used FrequencyUpper Test Frequency Limit 108 MHz 1 GHz 108 MHz to 500 MHz 2 GHz 500 MHz to 1 GHz 5 GHz 1 GHz5th harmonic or 40 GHz, whichever is lower Ghery S. Pettit Intel -Original Message- From: rehel...@mmm.com [mailto:rehel...@mmm.com] Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2002 4:08 AM To: Pettit, Ghery Cc: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org; 'kristiaan.carpent...@alcatel.be' Subject: RE: FCC part 15 section 109 The 108 MHz is for equipment that are intentional radiators (10th harmonic, see 15.33 (a)(1) and 15.208 (f). For unintentional radiators it is the 5th harmonic (see 15.33 (b)(1)). Be sure and read 15.35 (b) on the use of the proper detectors above 1000 MHz (uses 'average' and 'peak' detectors (not a 'quasi-peak' detector). Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 = Pettit, Ghery ghery.pettit@i To: 'kristiaan.carpent...@alcatel.be' ntel.com kristiaan.carpent...@alcatel.be emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org 03/25/2002 cc: (bcc: Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US) 11:50 AM Subject: RE: FCC part 15 section 109 Please respond to Pettit, Ghery Kristiaan, The test procedures of ANSI C63.4-2000 must be used, even when testing to the limits in CISPR 22. The 10 meter test distance is fine, but to the extent that the test methods differ, ANSI C63.4 must be followed. Don't forget that if the product has a clock higher than 108 MHz, testing above 1 GHz will be required to the FCC limits. The upper frequency will depend upon the actual maximum clock speed in the product. Ghery Pettit Intel -Original Message- From: kristiaan.carpent...@alcatel.be [mailto:kristiaan.carpent...@alcatel.be] Sent: Monday, March 25, 2002 8:41 AM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: FCC part 15 section 109 Hello group, Part 15, section 109, states that as an alternative to the radiated emission limits shown in paragraphs (a) and (b) of this section, digital devices may be shown to comply with CISPR22 3rd ed. Further-on is stated that the testmethods of part 15 (referring to ANSI C63.4) apply. Question: If a lab performs Part 15 measurements for Class B devices below 1000MHz according to CISPR22:1997 with - the limits of CISPR22 - the procedures of CISPR22 - at a 10 meter distance as per CISPR22, Are these measurements performed in an correct way? Regards, Kris Carpentier File att1.htm not included with reply --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list
RE: FCC part 15 section 109
The 108 MHz is for equipment that are intentional radiators (10th harmonic, see 15.33 (a)(1) and 15.208 (f). For unintentional radiators it is the 5th harmonic (see 15.33 (b)(1)). Be sure and read 15.35 (b) on the use of the proper detectors above 1000 MHz (uses 'average' and 'peak' detectors (not a 'quasi-peak' detector). Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 = Pettit, Ghery ghery.pettit@i To: 'kristiaan.carpent...@alcatel.be' ntel.com kristiaan.carpent...@alcatel.be emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org 03/25/2002 cc: (bcc: Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US) 11:50 AM Subject: RE: FCC part 15 section 109 Please respond to Pettit, Ghery Kristiaan, The test procedures of ANSI C63.4-2000 must be used, even when testing to the limits in CISPR 22. The 10 meter test distance is fine, but to the extent that the test methods differ, ANSI C63.4 must be followed. Don't forget that if the product has a clock higher than 108 MHz, testing above 1 GHz will be required to the FCC limits. The upper frequency will depend upon the actual maximum clock speed in the product. Ghery Pettit Intel -Original Message- From: kristiaan.carpent...@alcatel.be [mailto:kristiaan.carpent...@alcatel.be] Sent: Monday, March 25, 2002 8:41 AM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: FCC part 15 section 109 Hello group, Part 15, section 109, states that as an alternative to the radiated emission limits shown in paragraphs (a) and (b) of this section, digital devices may be shown to comply with CISPR22 3rd ed. Further-on is stated that the testmethods of part 15 (referring to ANSI C63.4) apply. Question: If a lab performs Part 15 measurements for Class B devices below 1000MHz according to CISPR22:1997 with - the limits of CISPR22 - the procedures of CISPR22 - at a 10 meter distance as per CISPR22, Are these measurements performed in an correct way? Regards, Kris Carpentier File att1.htm not included with reply --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list
RE: FCC part 15 section 109
The 108 MHz is for equipment that are intentional radiators (10th harmonic, see 15.33 (a)(1) and 15.208 (f). For unintentional radiators it is the 5th harmonic (see 15.33 (b)(1)). Be sure and read 15.35 (b) on the use of the proper detectors above 1000 MHz (uses 'average' and 'peak' detectors (not a 'quasi-peak' detector). Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 = Pettit, Ghery ghery.pettit@i To: 'kristiaan.carpent...@alcatel.be' ntel.com kristiaan.carpent...@alcatel.be emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org 03/25/2002 cc: (bcc: Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US) 11:50 AM Subject: RE: FCC part 15 section 109 Please respond to Pettit, Ghery Kristiaan, The test procedures of ANSI C63.4-2000 must be used, even when testing to the limits in CISPR 22. The 10 meter test distance is fine, but to the extent that the test methods differ, ANSI C63.4 must be followed. Don't forget that if the product has a clock higher than 108 MHz, testing above 1 GHz will be required to the FCC limits. The upper frequency will depend upon the actual maximum clock speed in the product. Ghery Pettit Intel -Original Message- From: kristiaan.carpent...@alcatel.be [mailto:kristiaan.carpent...@alcatel.be] Sent: Monday, March 25, 2002 8:41 AM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: FCC part 15 section 109 Hello group, Part 15, section 109, states that as an alternative to the radiated emission limits shown in paragraphs (a) and (b) of this section, digital devices may be shown to comply with CISPR22 3rd ed. Further-on is stated that the testmethods of part 15 (referring to ANSI C63.4) apply. Question: If a lab performs Part 15 measurements for Class B devices below 1000MHz according to CISPR22:1997 with - the limits of CISPR22 - the procedures of CISPR22 - at a 10 meter distance as per CISPR22, Are these measurements performed in an correct way? Regards, Kris Carpentier File att1.htm not included with reply --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list
Test Equipment for NEMA TS 2
Can anyone direct me to a seller or renter of test equipment for the testing to NEMA TS 2? Thank you, Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list
RE: Earthing of conductive floor tiles
Funny you should mention that. We had the same problem only it turned out to be an access plate in our turntable. Even though the plate is screwed into the turntable, over time the screws loosen enough through vibrations and the plate starts arcing. Like all great inventions, we accidentally found this out during our troubleshooting by making a scan with the access plate removed. The plate is now a permanent part of our turntable preventive maintenance schedule. Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 = - Forwarded by Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US on 03/20/2002 12:14 PM - Hans Mellberg emcconsultant@ To: David Spencer dspen...@oresis.com yahoo.com 'Arno van Kesteren ' avkes...@eso.org 'emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org ' emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org 03/20/2002 cc: (bcc: Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US) 10:31 AM Subject: RE: Earthing of conductive floor tiles Please respond to Hans Mellberg Several years ago I was called in to debug a chamber that had spurious emissions whilst turning the table. Naturally, everyone accused the tt manufacturer but after several hours of frustrating dead ends, it turned out that the small amount of vibration caused by the tt was causing the floor tiles to move and shift ever so slightly. This was enough for small amounts of static charge to develop and discharge causing the emissions in the chamber. Once this was ascertained, grounding the floor tiles eliminated the problem. We used copper tape under every tile folded over till the tile manufacturer came in with a permanent solution which included spring fingers. These metal lined tiles were for a false raised floor for cabling and a/c and not the ferrite types. --- David Spencer dspen...@oresis.com wrote: Hi Arno, John gave you the short answer...the MFG should have installation instructions. In all of the installation I have been party, there is a grid of copper tape laid down in the conductive adhesive. This keeps the adhesive from getting excessively resistive over large areas. Surface resistance tests run anywhere from 100k-400k ohms when it's all done. Note that if you are installing relay racks or metal benches that you can run into ground loops. Have a Great Day, Dave Spencer Oresis Communications -Original Message- From: Arno van Kesteren To: Arno van Kesteren; emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Sent: 3/18/02 1:48 PM Subject: Earthing of conductive floor tiles Dear Group, Do conductive tiles in floors for ESD prevention have to be connected together (e.g. through a low impedance earth bond) ? Arno van Kesteren ESO Munich, Germany e-mail: avkes...@eso.org --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard:
EU Harmonized Frequencies
Are there any harmonized frequencies under the RTTE Directive? Is there a website for viewing the harmonized frequencies? Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list
RFID Device
Can anyone help me get information on what Brazilian standards might apply the following product? * RFID product (radio frequency identification device) * 900 MHz * 700 milliwatts * Used to check inventory and product locations in a warehouse by radio frequency. I have checked the www.anatel.gov.br website and I have obtained some information but not enough to feel confident about what might apply. Thanks in advance. Best regards, Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list
RE: ESD Generator confidence test (humor)
My first memorable experience with ESD was at the age of 10. I would build quite a charge on my body when playing basketball in the gym. And I would always get a hugh zap when I pushed on the metal handle of the water fountain. I knew just enough physics to know that a rubber basketball was an insulator so the next time I went to get a drink I used the basketball to push on the handle and then bent over to get a drink.well you know the rest. I still carry a tiny scar on my lower lip to this day. Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 == Gary McInturff Gary.McInturff@worldwidepa To: Chris Maxwell chris.maxw...@nettest.com ckets.com Chris Chileshe chris.chile...@ultronics.co.uk emc-pstc emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org 02/28/2002 11:31 AM cc: brian_ku...@leco.com Please respond to Gary(bcc: Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US) McInturff Subject: RE: ESD Generator confidence test (humor) One other life lesson one I learned about ESD test areas. One should always check that the drain wire is actually in place before on stands on the ground plane and zaps the heck out of some equipment at 20 K or so. I was trying to leave burn marks in the plastic housing to show me where the arcs were actually penetrating the device. After a few smacks with the gun. The whole ground plane was now elevated and when I leaned forward the table height coincided with a very important, (at least to me) and well known anatomical point so I got to be the ground path. I used much different words, and volume levels that those of your technician and I don't recommend the sensation to anyone. Gary -Original Message- From: Chris Maxwell [mailto:chris.maxw...@nettest.com] Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2002 7:05 AM To: Chris Chileshe; emc-pstc Cc: brian_ku...@leco.com Subject: RE: ESD Generator confidence test (humor) This brings up a good real life story. I used to work with a technician (John) who helped with our in-house compliance testing. One day, we were discussing the Horizontal Coupling Plane (HCP) which has a 1MegaOhm drain wire to the Ground Reference Plane (GRP). His theory was that he could stand on the GRP and touch the HCP during a discharge; and he wouldn't feel anything because of the drain wire. I argued that the 1MegaOhm resistance was much higher than his body resistance to ground; so he would get a very noticable zap. Our theoretical arguments went nowhere. We decided to experiment. I have alot of respect for John; because he beleived strongly enough that he volunteered to be the guinea pig. I set the ESD gun for 4KV and hit the HCP. John's hands jumped from the HCP and he said something like oooh or ouch (I can't remember exactly). So, let that be a lesson to you guys out there. John already suffered so that others may learn :-) Chris Maxwell | Design Engineer - Optical Division email chris.maxw...@nettest.com | dir +1 315 266 5128 | fax +1 315 797 8024 NetTest | 6 Rhoads Drive, Utica, NY 13502 | USA web www.nettest.com | tel +1 315 797 4449 | -Original Message- From: Chris Chileshe [SMTP:chris.chile...@ultronics.co.uk] Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2002 7:41 AM To: 'emc-pstc' Cc: 'brian_ku...@leco.com' Subject: RE: ESD Generator confidence test (humor) Brian proposes a confidence test on ESD guns using colleagues.. If the ESD gun is working properly, they will fall to the floor quivering slightly. Then they will wet their pants and forget who they are for about 25 to 30 minutes. A number of questions arise Brian.. Is the order of events an essential part of the confidence test i.e. if they wet their pants *before* they fall to the floor, will the gun be deemed to have failed the test? Is there any useful information to be gained from the slight quiver, i.e. frequency, amplitude etc which might help with calibration of the discharge tip? Should
Re: radiated emission from 15 inch TFT-LCD
It has been my experience that LCDs do not emit much energy in themselves but their driving electronics might. I just tested a thin film transistor liquid crystal display on Tuesday. Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 = Wani, Vijay (V) To: 'emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org' emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org vw...@dow.com cc: (bcc: Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US) Subject: radiated emission from 15 inch TFT-LCD 02/06/2002 09:01 PM Please respond to Wani, Vijay (V) hello Group: My question is kind of general but i would appreciate any input / experience. typical, TFT-LCD is enclosed in a metal enclosure and there is a shielded window to prevent any emi from front. Is LCD (video signal) big source of emi? if LCD unit not properly isolated (shielded) within a system, does it immune to emi (intra-system interference)? thank you in advance. vijay --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on browse and then emc-pstc mailing list
Re: EN 61000-3-2 applicability and let-outs
I realise that none of the above give much comfort to manufacturers of domestic or consumer products, but maybe a computer manufacturer could offer a version without PFC only for use in installations that have a dedicated LV supply. No, the big problem is for manufacturers who make commercial and light industrial equipment that are under 16A and are connected to the public power mains. This is the majority of commercial equipment. As was mentioned previously, the harmonic and flicker standards are considered by many to be skewed standards because they were heavily influenced by the power industry virtually to the exclusion of all other data and input. The issue is not whether harmonics and line votage variations are a problem. The issue is to what extent they are a problem. And until these standards become unskewed and all data is weighed, these two tainted standards will not be believeable. Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 CherryClough@ao l.comTo: j...@jmwa.demon.co.uk cc: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org 01/24/2002 (bcc: Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US) 11:58 AM Subject: EN 61000-3-2 applicability and let-outs Please respond to CherryClough Dear John I understand the following statements to be true. Please make corrections / comments where necessary. 1) EN 61000-3-2 only applies to equipment consuming up to 16A/phase, and there are no mandatory harmonic limits in the EU (yet) for higher-powered equipment, other than what the power supplier might impose. So EN 61000-3-2 is optional for equipment consuming 16A/phase. 2) EN 61000-3-2 currently has a let-out for professional equipment that consumes more than 1kW, so its application is optional for that category of equipment too. This could exclude many of the larger products sold solely for commercial and/or industrial use from EN 61000-3-2. (Maybe the combined air-conditioner / personal computer may not be such a bad idea if it gets consumption up above 1kW!). 3) The 'public low voltage supply' is a 4156/230V supply with more than one consumer connected. Large plants or office building often take their power at MV (11kV or more) and transform their own LV supply with their own distribution transformer - creating a 'private' low voltage supply dedicated for their own use. EN 61000-3-2 is optional for any equipment sold solely for use on such dedicated low voltage supplies. Privately-generated LV supplies ditto. 4) My copy of EN 61000-3-2 has a paragraph at the end of its Scope section that says: Special equipment, which is not widely used and is designed in such a way that it is unable to comply with the requirements (limits), may be subject to installation restrictions. The supply authorities shall be notified as authorization may be required before connection. So custom-made or low-volume manufactured equipment (even if under 16A/phase) does not have to comply with EN 61000-3-2, as long as their users check with their power suppliers that they are OK to be connected. Maybe they could agree to deal with any harmonic issues at site-level, by installing an active harmonic cancellation unit. Regards, Keith Armstrong --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old
SAR Test Facility
Can someone point me to a SAR test facility in the U.S.? Thanks, Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server.
SAR Test Equipment
We are looking into SAR testing. Anyone know of manufacturers of SAR test equipment? Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server.
High Frequency Pre-amp
This question may have recently posted but I'm not able to search the archives so I'll ask again. We have an immediate need for a pre-amp above 1000 MHz. Would you be so kind as to let me know what brands/models and frequency range you are using. Any pro/con insights would be welcome as well. Please contact me on or off-line. Thanks, Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server.
RE: EMI guard bands
After listening to this thread, it brings up a question that I have had over the years regarding limit lines and passing margins. Are there EMI guard bands already built into the limit lines? I find it very difficult to believe that a group of reasonable people developing a limit line would have determined that they had thought of every possible EMI interference issue and would not have built a safety margin into that limit. Does anyone have any historical development data or insights into the creation of limits? Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server.
Re: RTTE Directive
Richard, * If the test methods you are using are harmonized to the RTTE Directive then you do not need a Notified Body. * If the frequency you are using is harmonized by all EU countries then you do not need the Alert symbol (exclamation point in a circle). 1. Harmonized test methods and frequency = CE marking 2. Harmonized test methods and non-harmonized frequency = CE marking and Alert symbol 3. Non-harmonized test methods and non-harmonized frequency = CE marking and Notified Body number and Alert symbol 4. Use of TCF (same as 3.) At this point in time, most of the test methods you will use are harmonized to the RTTE Directive so you do not have to use a Notified Body to verify your test methods. However, there are virtually no harmonized frequencies so you will have to notify all of the Telecommunication Authorities of the frequency that you intend to use so that they can make a judgement as to its authorization and restriction within its country. Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 richwoods@tycoi nt.com To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org cc: (bcc: Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US) 12/13/2001 Subject: RTTE Directive 11:00 AM Please respond to richwoods I previously used a Notified Body in the conformity process to the RTTE Directive since only a draft radio standard existed at the time. However, a harmonized standard now exists. I understand that I have two choices: 1) Continue to use the existing Declaration of Conformity to the essential requirements of the RTTE, or 2) Issue a new Declaration in which we declare compliance with the harmonized radio standard and make no mention of the participation of the Notified Body. Is my understanting correct? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server. --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server.
Re: Stepping receiver, step sizes.
The FCC uses a bandwidth of 1.0 MHz for frequencies above 1.0 GHz, see Part 15, 15.35(b). I do not believe that there is a stated CISPR bandwidth above a gig. Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 === Scott.Mee@jci.c om To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org cc: (bcc: Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US) 12/06/2001 Subject: Stepping receiver, step sizes. 07:17 AM Please respond to Scott.Mee Hello Group! I would like to ask a question regarding EMI Receiver step sizes in the higher frequency range. We are performing radiated emissions testing in a semi-anechoic chamber using an EMI receiver. We plan to cover a high frequency range between 1 and 5 GHz (a large spanse to cover!). I would like to know what practical step size (ie. 8kHz or 20kHz or 80kHz) I could choose for such a wide range and keep: 1. The data accurate, meaning that I wouldn't be missing or stepping around energy by taking to large of a step. 2. Keep the amount of data I'm collecting to a reasonable amount so that I may process it (apply correction factors for antenna, cable loss, pre-amplifier). My question comes up primarily because I haven't found any specifications that require things like minimum scan time, maximum step size, or the like. Is anyone aware of a specification out there that covers this, or have any information/personal experience that could help me make a determination? Thanks for any help in advance! Regards, Scott Mee EMC Engineer Johnson Controls Inc. PH: 616.394.2565 EMAIL: scott@jci.com --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server. --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server.
ITE for industrial locations
Test it for the environment(s) it will be used in. Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 === - Forwarded by Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US on 12/04/2001 11:32 AM - Bailey, Jeff jbailey@mysst. To: '\EMC-Group\' emc-p...@ieee.org com cc: (bcc: Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US) Subject: ITE for industrial locations 12/04/2001 09:38 AM Please respond to Bailey, Jeff Hello group, I am in the process of defining a test plan for a product that fits nicely into the definition of ITE as stated in 3.1 of EN55022:1998 and therefore into EN55024:1998 as well. My issue is that although it is obviously ITE (Industrial network communication hardware) it is also designed for use in industrial environments not residential. As hard as I try to justify designing the test plan around EN61000-6-2 or even EN61326 I still keep getting pulled back to the definition of ITE and therefore feel that legally I must test to EN55022 and EN55024. I am seeing this as somewhat of a flaw in the system as I feel my product should be evaluated to an Industrial set of immunity tests. Does anyone have any pointers on how I can test the product within the word of the law while still being able to sleep at night? Must I try to squeeze more out of the budget in order to test to the legally required standards and then test again to the ones that make sense? I seem to remember a recent thread on this but of course I did not archive it... Seeking words of enlightenment and thanking in advance. Jeff Bailey Compliance Engineering SST - A Division of Woodhead Canada Phone: (519) 725 5136 ext. 363 Fax: (519) 725 1515 email: jbai...@mysst.com mailto:jbai...@mysst.com Web: www.mysst.com http://www.mysst.com All comments contained in the message are my own and do not necessarily express the views of SST/Woodhead Canada Limited. --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server. --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server.
[Fwd: Student Design Contest from IEEE EMC Education Committee]
I'd like to pass this on to the group. Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 - Forwarded by Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US on 11/20/2001 05:46 AM - Greetings, Original Message Subject: Student Design Contest from IEEE EMC Education Committee List-Post: emc-pstc@listserv.ieee.org Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2001 14:44:26 -0600 From: Robert Nelson robert.m.nel...@ndsu.nodak.edu Dear IEEE EMC Education Committee members (and interested folks), The Education Committee of the IEEE EMC (Electromagnetic Compatibility) Society is sponsoring the third annual EMC Student Design Competition, and would like to invite students you know to enter. In a nutshell the contest involves registering to receive a noisy circuit (electrically noisy, that is), and designing appropriate fixes to make the circuit quieter. Your students might win $900 plus a trip to the 2002 International IEEE EMC Symposium to be held in Minneapolis, MN in August 2002! Additional information about the contest is available either from the home page for the IEEE EMC Society ( http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/ ), (noting that there are two links dealing with the contest) or from the home page for the Education Committee ( http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/edu/index.html ). Please go to the link discussing the Contest. You might also want to peruse an article written about the 2001 contest. This is available via the link on the page http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/edu/edurpts.htm If you have any questions, please contact Ahmad Fallah ( ahmadfal...@ieee.org ). Thanks for passing this on! Sincerely, Dr. Bob Nelson Secretary, IEEE EMC Education Committee North Dakota State University Dept. of Electrical and Computer Eng. Fargo, ND 58105 V: (701)-231-7619 F: (701)-231-8677 E-mail: r.m.nel...@ieee.org --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server.
Re: My departure
John, you must do what you must do but I for one will be sorry to see you leave. Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 === John Woodgate jmw@jmwa.demon To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org .co.uk cc: (bcc: Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US) Subject: My departure 11/15/2001 03:06 PM Please respond to John Woodgate As a result of representations from one of the administrators, which I consider totally unjustified, I am leaving the group. I regret having to break contact with those that responded favourably to my input. You are free to e-mail me if you wish. -- Regards, John Woodgate, OOO - Own Opinions Only. http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk Eat mink and be dreary! --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server. --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server.
60601-1-2
I heard that the IEC has issued the new 60601-1-2 EMC standard for medical equipment on the 30th of September. Does anyone know when the EN will follow and when its DOW will be? Thanks, Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server.
Industrial ITE
If you have ITE equipment that is going into an industrial environment, what standards apply? In particular what generic or family immunity standards apply (I'm not concerned with basic standards)? EN55024 seems to be written for the residential environment (for example, 3V/m is called out). The generic industrial standard indicates that you use EN55011 for emissions instead EN55022. Is there a catch-22 here (no pun intended)? Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server.
Marine Equipment
It is my understanding that marine equipment is exempt from the EMC Directive and from FCC regulations. Can anyone tell me what standards would cover a battery operated lighting system running at 100 VAC, 1500 Hz for both Europe and the U.S.? Thanks, Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server.
Re: 134kHz transmitter in the U.K.
Bob, the following apply under the RTTE: ETSI EN 300 330-2 For the transmitter portion ETSI EN 300 330-1 For the transmitter portion ETSI EN 301 489-3 For EMC ETSI EN 301 489-1 For EMC Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 = Sykes, Bob bob.sykes@marc To: 'emc-p...@ieee.org' emc-p...@ieee.org oni.com cc: (bcc: Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US) Subject: 134kHz transmitter in the U.K. 09/19/2001 09:49 AM Please respond to Sykes, Bob Greetings, We are looking at providing a short range RFID system to the U.K., and I am tasked with determining the regulatory requirements for this system. It incorporates a low power transmitter/receiver operating at 134kHz. I am familiar with the LVD and EMCD requirements, but unable to determine RTTE applicability, or whether U.K. National regulations apply. Any help would be most appreciated. adTHANKSvance, -Bob Sykes Marconi Commerce Systems --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server. --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server.
ETSI EN 300 330-X
ETSI EN 300 330-2, Electromagnetic compatibility and Radio spectrum Matters (ERM); Short Range Devices (SRD); Radio equipment in the frequency 9 kHz to 25 MHz and inductive loop systems in the frequency range 9 kHz to 30 MHz; Part 2: Harmonized EN under article 3.2 of the RTTE Directive is now a harmonized standard under the RTTE Directive as it implies. ETSI EN 300 330-2 calls out ETSI EN 300 330-1 as the standard to use for test limits, test procedures, etc. However, ETSI EN 300 330-1 is not harmonized to the RTTE Directive. The question is this: if we use ETSI EN 300 330-2 is show compliance to the RTTE Directive, can we use ETSI EN 300 330-1 without having to submit through a Notified Body? It is my understanding that the use of any standard that is not harmonized to the RTTE Directive requires intervention by a Notified Body to ensure the proper test suite usage. Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server.
Re: ENV 50121-5
John, I totally agree with Chris and you. In addition to the scope, I would like to add that a brief description of an amendment to a standard should be made available. I will not be at the IEC meeting but if there is a manner in which you think that I can provide support, don't hesitate to ask. Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 === John Woodgate jmw@jmwa.demon To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org .co.uk cc: (bcc: Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US) Subject: Re: ENV 50121-5 09/06/2001 04:36 PM Please respond to John Woodgate I read in !emc-pstc that Chris Maxwell chris.maxw...@nettest.com wrote (in 83d652574e7af740873674f9fc12dbaa675...@utexh1w2.gnnettest.com) about 'ENV 50121-5', on Thu, 6 Sep 2001: The thorn is... I believe that the at least the scope statement of any standard should be public information that can be accessed as part of the regulatory body websites (whether it's CENELEC, ACA whoever). There should also be no fear of people being whacked for copywrite violations because they share the scope statement from a standard. Sometimes, the title just isn't descriptive enough. I agree. The IEC web site does have a lot of information in the public area, but not the actual Scope clauses. If an opportunity arises at the IEC General Meeting in Firenze in October, I will raise the matter. I call on anyone else who will be there to consider supporting the proposal that the Scope clauses should be publicly available. We do purchase standards that we know will apply to our products. However; I have been burned by buying standards that sounded like they would apply; but really don't. Indeed; this creates unnecessary and destructive aversion. I assume that a few others have had similar experiences; and that's why we see so many questions in the EMC-PSTC regarding standards applicability. Some companies do care about the cost of that $75 standard. I tend to compare the cost of the standard with the cost of the POS material that is binned! -- Regards, John Woodgate, OOO - Own Opinions Only. http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk Eat mink and be dreary! --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server. --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old
RE: Noise from flourescent light ballasts?
Timothy...very germane, very instructional. Thanks, Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 == Christman, Timothy (STP) To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Timothy.Christman@gu cc: (bcc: Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US) idant.com Subject: RE: Noise from flourescent light ballasts? 09/06/2001 03:22 PM Please respond to Christman, Timothy (STP) Not sure if this is germane to the list, but... Many newer fluorescent fixtures use an electronic ballast -- they use a switching converter or flyback to develop the high voltage required for the bulbs (laptop backlight elements work the same way). Apparently this reduces the amount of iron required for the ballast transformer (and $$$'s?), but has the unfortunate side-effect of creating a massive array of unwanted noise sources. Usually the switching frequency is designed to be just beyond the audible range, which is consistent w/ your description. As Richard noted, any switching / chopper circuit could be the culprit. The lights tend to pose problems for measurement/instrumentation circuits w/ high source and high receiver impedance (where capacitive coupling dominates) -- pretty intuitive when you consider that the bulb in the fixture has a large surface area at high potential, switching at KHz. frequencies. Timothy J. Christman Test Engineer Guidant Corporation 4100 Hamline Ave. N. St. Paul, MN 55112 USA www.guidant.com Opinions are mine, not those of my employer. My employer is evidently smarter. --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server.
Re: Power Amplifier for 2 GHz Immunity
We have recently purchased an Amplifier Research Model 25SIG4A and we use an AR FP2080 probe. We have two antennas for that range, a Schaffner bilog and an A. H. Systems horn. Other than the upcoming 60601-1-2 for medical equipment, are there any other upcoming standards that call out immunity testing over a gig? To my knowledge no present standard does. Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 == UMBDENSTOCK@Senso rmatic.com To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org cc: (bcc: Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US) 09/05/2001 10:19 Subject: Power Amplifier for 2 GHz Immunity AM Please respond to UMBDENSTOCK Hello Forum, I was wondering what amplifier you are using for the 2 GHz testing requirement of EN61000-4-3? Any comments regarding if I had to do it over again, I would have . . . relative to your 2 GHz setup? Best regards, Don Umbdenstock Sensormatic --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server. --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server.
Laser Pointers
What EMC/emission standards for the US and Europe do laser pointers fall under? Thanks, Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.rcic.com/ click on Virtual Conference Hall,
Re: Examples of EMC problems in the real world
Ralph, what is a toroidal cord? Is it a power cord with toroids? Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.rcic.com/ click on Virtual Conference Hall,
Ready Made Connecting Devices
What are the chances of ready made connecting devices remaining in the EMCD 2000 as defined (i.e., cables et al)? If testing (CE marking) is required, are there existing standards/test methods that will cover these devices? Or will the TCF route be required? Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.rcic.com/ click on Virtual Conference Hall,
Re: CE Marking
Good question. Does the shipping packaging/crating even have to have CE marking or is it only the equipment, sales packaging, and accompanying documentation? Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 === Mavis, Robert RMavis@pelco.c To: emc-p...@ieee.org om cc: (bcc: Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US) Subject: 06/20/2001 09:31 AM Please respond to Mavis, Robert Hello Group, This question is in regards to a CE Marked assembly. The Completed end unit is CE Compliant and Marked. The end unit is disassembled and shipped in 2 shipping containers into the EU. What are the CE Marking requirements for the two shipping containers? Do we place a CE mark on both? We have only tested the unit as a whole and testing the parts separately is not typical installation or use. Robert L. Mavis Compliance Engineering Specialist Engineering Department, Compliance Engineering Group Pelco 3500 Pelco Way Clovis, CA 93612-5699 Phone: (559) 292-1981 x2309 Toll Free: (800) 292-1981 x2309 Fax: (559) 291-3775 email: rma...@pelco.com URL: http://www.pelco.com - File att1.htm not included with reply --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.rcic.com/ click on Virtual Conference Hall,
Typing Shortcuts
Over time I have come across many typing shortcuts using the English language, such as: OTOH - on the other hand WRT - with regard to BTW - (I am still trying to figure out this one) Can someone please list the more common ones? I sometimes strain my brain trying to figure them out and they are in my own language. It must be terribly confusing to most of our world-wide colleagues. Thanks, Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.rcic.com/ click on Virtual Conference Hall,
Re: EN55022 Radiated Test Set up
The distance is measured to the closest point (rotated) of the EUT periphery (including cables) and the mid-point of the antenna. References: * CISPR 16-2, clause 2.6.2.3 * FCC 47 CFR, Part 15, clause 15.31(f) Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 === Alex McNeil alex.mcneil@ingenicofort To: 'emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org' emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org ronic.com cc: (bcc: Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US) Subject: EN55022 Radiated Test Set up 06/13/2001 03:27 AM Please respond to Alex McNeil Hi Guys, I have a query regarding how the 3M or 10M emissions set up should be measured. EMC Test Houses seem to appply the measurement of the 3M/10M differently e.g. measurement can be to the front (or rear) edge of the EUT, peripherals and cables setup with Turntable at 0 degrees. This means that at some point during Turntable revolutions the EUT will violate the 3M or 10M rule i.e. the EUT with peripherals and cables will be less than the initial measured distance during turntable movement. Should the 3M/10M be measured to the periphery of the EUT after monitoring the turntable revolution? This would mean that during Turntable movement the 3M or 10M is not violated with peripherals or cables, but also that the centre of the setup is always more than 3M/10M. Any Ideas or better still any simply explained documents (for all EMC test procedures) that spells this out very precisely. Best Regards Alex McNeil --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.rcic.com/ click on Virtual Conference Hall, --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.rcic.com/ click on Virtual Conference Hall,
Re: Antenna Calibration
At least once a year. This is mandated by our accreditation (NVLAP). We also have to use a nationally accreditated calibration lab (we use Liberty Labs). Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 MartinJP@appliedbios ystems.comTo: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org cc: (bcc: Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US) 05/22/2001 07:39 PM Subject: Antenna Calibration Please respond to MartinJP How often do you calibrate your biconical and log periodic antennas? Why did you choose that interval? Thanks Joe Martin EMC/Product Safety Engineer Applied Biosystems --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.rcic.com/ click on Virtual Conference Hall,
RE: Cooking induction apparatus and FCC
Part 18 still uses MP-5 but it is not mandatory. In cases of dispute, MP-5 will be used by the FCC. You can't go wrong, however, using ANSI C63.4 as the test set-up. Or you can use the CISPR limits as Gary described. I do not know what C64.5 is. You do not have to submit your test results through a TCB. Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 Gary McInturff Gary.McInturff@worldwidepa To: 'Pierre SELVA' pierre.se...@worldonline.fr ckets.com Forum Safety-emc emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org cc: (bcc: Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US) 05/21/2001 10:59 AM Subject: RE: Cooking induction apparatus and FCC Please respond to Gary McInturff Bon Jour (That's about it for my French) Pierre, MP-5 isn't relevant any more. I believe you want ANSI C64.5. and I think you'll find mostly similarities. I can't think of any dissimilarities of the top of my head, Even FCC part 15 allows use of the CISPR limits for radiated and conducted emissions. The only caveat (ah, more French!) is that if you accept the radiated limits during test you also have to accept the conducted limits. Some folks trip up on that one. It means that the conducted limits are really 150Khz even at US line voltage, not the normal FCC start of 450 Khz. Gary -Original -Original Message- From: Pierre SELVA [mailto:pierre.se...@worldonline.fr] Sent: Monday, May 21, 2001 6:09 AM To: Forum Safety-emc Cc: Pierre SELVA Subject: Cooking induction apparatus and FCC Dear colleagues, I need to know your opinion on the following : I have to perform EMC testing on an induction cooking table and I would like to obtain the FCC certification. In Europe, this kind of apparatus is subjected to the EN55011 (CISPR11) and the test conditions are clearly stated, mainly for the EUT configuration. I understand for the USA, the product has to be tested according to Part 18 requirements. This part explains that the technical requirements for the measurement are described in the MP-5 document. As this one is a little bit old (1986), do you believe I can use the CISPR11 to demonstrate compliance, or should I use the MP5 ? If I have to use the MP-5, do you know if somewhere the EUT configuration is described, or is the worst case at the manufacturer discretion ? And, at last, do you know if I have to submit my test results and EUT description to FCC directly (electronic submittal), or should I have to go to a TCB ? In advance, I thank you a lot for your answers, Best regards from France Pierre SELVA 2 route de la Grobelle 73000 JACOB BELLECOMBETTE - France Tel : 33 (0)6 60 52 04 96 Fax : 33 (0)6 61 37 87 48 e-mail : mailto:pierre.se...@worldonline.fr pierre.se...@worldonline.fr mailto:pierrese...@onetelnet.fr pierrese...@onetelnet.fr File att1.htm not included with reply --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.rcic.com/ click on Virtual Conference Hall,
Resubmittals under the RTTE Directive
Under what conditions/design changes does an intentional radiator need to be resubmitted under the RTTE Directive? In the U.S., resubmission is required for Class 2 changes (essentially anything that changes the output such as changes in power, antenna, frequency, modulation, etc.). Is there a reference document/data that applies to the RTTE Directive in this area? Bob Heller 3M Product Safety, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.rcic.com/ click on Virtual Conference Hall,
Test Set Up for Shielding Effectiveness
Does anyone know of a company that sells test set-ups/jigs for the measurement of shielding effectiveness of planar materials or CRT screen filters? Thanks, Bob Heller 3M Company --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.rcic.com/ click on Virtual Conference Hall,
RTTE Packaging
I saw some postings recently to the following question but I was not able to browse the recent archives so I will ask the question again. Under the RTTE Directive is there any labeling requirements for the product packaging or shipping packaging? If so, what is required? Thanks, Bob --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.rcic.com/ click on Virtual Conference Hall,
Re: Flicker problem
So the real problem lies with the power companies for the power outage in the first place...(just joking). = John Woodgate j...@jmwa.demon.co.uk on 03/14/2001 12:03:56 PM Please respond to John Woodgate j...@jmwa.demon.co.uk To: Wagner, John P (John) johnwag...@avaya.com cc: EMC-PSTC emc-p...@ieee.org Colgan, Chris chris.col...@tagmclarenaudio.com (bcc: Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US) Subject: Re: Flicker problem 4203d61676d0ae468aa5cea90a891c13235...@cof110avexu4.global.avaya.com, Wagner, John P (John) johnwag...@avaya.com wrote: I think this refers to Amendment 1of IEC 61000-3-3 published January 2001. Apparently it has not yet been transposed into an EN. It was dual-voted, so it will be. ? The amendment (at least as it effects me) deals primarily with requirements and limits for inrush current. Well, inrush current is dealt with in the unamended standard, but neither that or the amendment deal with it directly. Limits are expressed as 'dmax', the maximum relative voltage change, measured as an r.m.s. value over the worst half-cycle, starting from the zero-crossing. The amendment goes into much more detail about this, and gives relaxed limits for some types of equipment. The main problem with inrush current is where there is a lot of equipment in one location, and there is a power outage. When the power comes back on, cumulative inrush current may reach many tens of times normal load current, causing protective devices to operate and restore the 'outage'! In some cases, protective equipment has been damaged. -- Regards, John Woodgate, OOO - Own Opinions Only. Phone +44 (0)1268 747839 Fax +44 (0)1268 777124. http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk Foxhunters suffer from tallyhosis. PLEASE do not mail copies of newsgroup posts to me. --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.rcic.com/ click on Virtual Conference Hall, --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.rcic.com/ click on Virtual Conference Hall,
NEMA Test House
Is there a test house in the Spokane, WA area (USA) that can do NEMA TS 1 and TS 2 testing? Thanks, Bob Heller 3M Company --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Jim Bacher: jim_bac...@mail.monarch.com Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org
TTE and TNE Revisited
I thank all who answered my question. I now know some details about the equipment I was asking about. Where does the following equipment fall in the European Directives and standards scheme? It is a loop back device used by telephone company repair people. It allows ringing out telephone wire pairs from a remote distance. A typical use would be to alligator clip this device at local switching hub (building, neighborhood, etc.) and then to remotely determine which pairs are which. It has the ability to take commands by touch-tone tones to inject tones onto the lines (below 3 kHz) and to switch pairs. It runs on a 9 volt battery and is not intended to be used on a telephone line that is in use. Thanks again, Bob Heller 3M Company --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Jim Bacher: jim_bac...@mail.monarch.com Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org
TTE and TNE
Does Telephone Terminal Equipment and Telephone Network Equipment fall under the RTTE Directive? If not, what Directive do they belong to? EMC? Low Voltage? What set of standards apply (or is this question too vague)? Thanks, Bob Heller 3M Company --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Jim Bacher: jim_bac...@mail.monarch.com Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org
Re: IEC and EN 61000-6-2
-- Forwarded by Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US on 02/12/2001 05:37 AM --- Robert E. Heller 02/12/2001 05:27 AM 3M Product Safety, St. Paul, MN 55107 76-1-01 EMC Laboratory Fax: 651-778-6252 To: Benoit Nadeau bnad...@matrox.com cc: Subject: Re: IEC and EN 61000-6-2 (Document link: Robert E. Heller) I have a copy of BS EN 61000-6-2:1999. It does not reference ENV 50204 nor does it reference any digital radio telephone frequencies for testing. The normative reference is EN 61000-4-3:1996 (see Annex ZA). The test specifications indicate: * 80 to 1000 MHz * 10 volts per meter * 80% AM modulation at 1kHz * Performance criteria A One note applies to Europe: Note 3 - Except for ITU broadcast frequency bands 87 MHz to 108 MHz, 174 MHz to 230 MHz, and 470 MHz to 790 MHz, where the level shall be 3 V/m. The DOW is 1.4.2002 Benoit Nadeau bnad...@matrox.com on 02/09/2001 09:36:47 AM Please respond to Benoit Nadeau bnad...@matrox.com To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org cc:(bcc: Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US) Subject: IEC and EN 61000-6-2 Bonjour de Montréal, I just bought the new generic Immunity Standard for industrial environment but, unfortunately, I ordered the IEC version of it, not the EN version. Obviously, an IEC standard would not reference an ENV standard and I know that EN500082-2 referenced ENV50204. Is it still the case for EN61000-6-2 ? Did they change the level? Your help will be appreciated, Regards, -- Benoît Nadeau, ing. M.ing (P.eng., M.eng.) Conformity Group Manager Matrox 1055, boul. St-Regis Dorval (Québec) Canada H9P 2T4 Tel: (514) 822-6000 (x2475) Fax: (514) 822-6275 http://www.matrox.com Chairman 2001 IEEE EMC International Symposium on Electromagnetic Compatibility Montreal August 13 to 17, 2001 http://www.2001emcmtl.org -- --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Jim Bacher: jim_bac...@mail.monarch.com Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Jim Bacher: jim_bac...@mail.monarch.com Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org
Re: Cost of EMC Testing
You forgot Power Frequency Magnetic Fields (on the computer monitor), 61000-4-8. brian_kunde brian_ku...@leco.com on 01/25/2001 12:00:20 PM Please respond to brian_kunde brian_ku...@leco.com To: emc-pstc emc-p...@ieee.org cc:(bcc: Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US) Subject: Cost of EMC Testing All this talk about Test Labs has got me thinking about the cost for EMC Testing for CE marking. I know test labs have become more competitive over the last few years but am I paying too much? I know that the cost depends on many factors such as the size of the EUT and how many configurations, but for the sake of comparison how much should someone expect to pay for CE testing EMC ONLY for a computer (IT Equipment) in only one configuration? That would be one test of the following: Radiated and Line Conducted emissions, Harmonics, Flicker, Radiated Immunity, Conducted Immunity, Surge, Burst, Dips, ESD (did I forget anything?). For you test labs out there please respond directly to me or in a way that would not be viewed as advertising. I don't want to get anyone in trouble. I'm in the United States if that matters. I know that products are shipped all over for testing so lab location probably doesn't factor in all that much. Thanks, Brian --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Jim Bacher: jim_bac...@mail.monarch.com Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Jim Bacher: jim_bac...@mail.monarch.com Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org
Copper Thieving
Please excuse my lack of knowledge..what is copper thieving? --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Jim Bacher: jim_bac...@mail.monarch.com Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org
RE: EN61000-3-2 Amendments.
-- Forwarded by Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US on 01/18/2001 08:07 AM --- Robert E. Heller 01/18/2001 08:08 AM 3M Product Safety, St. Paul, MN 55107 76-1-01 EMC Laboratory Fax: 651-778-6252 To: Doug Best doug.b...@ifrsys.com cc: Subject: RE: EN61000-3-2 Amendments. (Document link: Robert E. Heller) My read on this is if the equipment can be operated (in real life) with the battery charger attached then it must be tested with the battery charger in place (this would be worst case configuration). If it cannot be operated then test the battery charger with the unit not operating (charge mode only). I do not believe that you can declare non-compliance. For others readingwould it be O.K. to declare in the operator's manual that the unit must not be operated while charging? = Doug Best doug.b...@ifrsys.com on 01/16/2001 04:17:32 PM Please respond to Doug Best doug.b...@ifrsys.com To: Jim Eichner jim.eich...@xantrex.com cc: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org (bcc: Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US) Subject: RE: EN61000-3-2 Amendments. Agreed Jim, I just got done testing a portable piece of test equipment that has a AC power draw of 110W nominally, this equipment has a lead acid battery that provides battery operation, when the battery is fully charged the equipment passes class A marginally (10% under the limit worst case), but when the battery charger is running the AC power draw increases 20 Watts and the 13th harmonic goes out of spec (8-10% above limit). My question is, can we specify compliance to the specification when the battery is suitably charged, and note non-compliance if the first condition is not meant? -Doug Best Compliance Technician IFR Americas Inc. Design Engineering doug.b...@ifrsys.com -Original Message- From: Jim Eichner [mailto:jim.eich...@xantrex.com] Sent: Monday, January 15, 2001 13:44 To: 'EMC-PSTC - forum' Subject: RE: EN61000-3-2 Amendments. Jim: You wrote essentially anything will pass now. Oh how I wish that were true! The absolute requirements do make it easier for low power equipment to pass, but for anything above several hundred watts all bets are off and running the test can lead to ugly surprises. For example, I recently tested 2 battery chargers to A14: one with approx. 400W draw and the other approx. 800W. The 400W one just barely passes and the 800W one fails miserably. Smaller bulk filter caps would help, but there's that pesky functionality thing! Regards, Jim Eichner Sr. Regulatory Compliance Engineer Mobile Markets Xantrex Technology Inc. Email: jim.eich...@xantrex.com Website: www.xantrex.com Any opinions expressed are those of my invisible friend, who really exists. Honest. -Original Message- From: Jim Conrad [mailto:jc...@shore.net] Sent: Friday, January 12, 2001 12:10 PM To: 'Allan, James'; brett_sand...@snellwilcox.com; 'emc-pstc (E-mail)' Subject: RE: EN61000-3-2 Amendments. Al, It relaxed the limits for almost all products except ITE, TV's, etc. I do not remember all the details since I have not had to apply it yet. Essentially the harmonic current limits are no longer relative based on the power consumption of the device but based are on absolute values as if the product was drawing 15A(not sure of this exact #). But essentially anything will pass now. You can purchase A14 on the IEC web site at www.iec.chThere is also a 75 watt exemption. Products less that 75 watts automatically comply. Best regards, Jim' Jim Conrad P.O. Box 25 Hamilton, MA 01936-0025 USA jc...@shore.net Phone #: 978-468-3909 FAX #: 978-468-3909 -Original Message- From:Allan, James [mailto:james_al...@milgo.com] Sent:Friday, January 12, 2001 2:53 PM To:brett_sand...@snellwilcox.com; 'emc-pstc (E-mail)'; 'jc...@shore.net' Subject:RE: EN61000-3-2 Amendments. In a nutshell how did A14 change 61000-3-2. I don't have a copy of A14 yet. Jim Allan Manager, Engineering Services Milgo Solutions LLC 1619 N Harrison Parkway Sunrise, FL, 33323 E-mail james_al...@milgo.com Phone (954) 846-3720 Fax (954) 846-5693 -Original Message- From:Jim Conrad [SMTP:jc...@shore.net] Sent:Friday, January 12, 2001 10:09 AM To:brett_sand...@snellwilcox.com; 'emc-pstc (E-mail)' Subject:RE: EN61000-3-2 Amendments. Yes, you can use the A14 for the January 1, 2001 compliance. Just be sure to add 61000-3-2 A14 to your DOC. Best regards, Jim Jim Conrad P.O. Box 25 Hamilton, MA 01936-0025 USA jc...@shore.net Phone #: 978-468-3909 FAX #: 978-468-3909
Re: NSA above 1 GHz
Mike, in C63.4, the project number is 1-13.2. The contact is Michael Windler. michael.j.wind...@us.ul.com From the latest C63 Newsletter: The key issues being addressed in this project include ground plane influences, site reflections and practical frequency limits to the traditional method for normalized site attenuation (NSA) under 1000 MHz. There are five labs making various reflective ambient measurements (including placing absorber material on the ground plane between the transmitter and receive antennas). Mike Cantwell michael.cantw...@flextronics.com on 01/03/2001 02:06:20 PM Please respond to Mike Cantwell michael.cantw...@flextronics.com To: 'emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org' emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org cc:(bcc: Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US) Subject: NSA above 1 GHz Does anyone know of any Normalized Site Attenuation measurements above 1 GHz? I'm specifically interested in whether or not ANSI C63.4 or CISPR-22 is planning this, and if so, is there any preliminary info? Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks, Mike Cantwell --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Jim Bacher: jim_bac...@mail.monarch.com Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Jim Bacher: jim_bac...@mail.monarch.com Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org
Re: Surge (immunity) requirement for equipment in telecommunication c enters
If the cables are longer than 10 meters, there is a good chance that they may run in cable troughs along side of cables that may come in from the out of doors. == Zohar Zosmanovich zohar_zosmanov...@radwin.com on 12/20/2000 05:47:20 AM Please respond to Zohar Zosmanovich zohar_zosmanov...@radwin.com To: 'emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org' emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org cc:(bcc: Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US) Subject: Surge (immunity) requirement for equipment in telecommunication c enters Hi, The EN 300 386 (EMC requirements for telecommunication network equipment) require to perform a surge of 1.2/50 Tr/Th us, 0,5 kV to ports for indoor signal lines (in telecommunication centers), when cables longer than 10 m are connected ! Can some one explain my the rational of divided up to 10 m and more than 10 m, anyway all cable is in the building (indoors) ? Zohar (Jana) Zosmanovich Compliance Engineer, RADWIN ltd. 34 Habarzel St., Tel Aviv 69710, Israel Tel.: 972-3-7666735 ; Fax: 972-3-7657535 Email: mailto:zohar_zosmanov...@radwin.com --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Jim Bacher: jim_bac...@mail.monarch.com Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Jim Bacher: jim_bac...@mail.monarch.com Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org
