Re: Adding another heading to the TOC

[Karen Mardahl]

Problem solved thanks to Karen Z., Linda G., Fred R., Lin S., and Shelley S.!

I had overlooked the right-click on the TOC.
I thought the Format  Document  PDF Setup  Bookmarks tab was
supposed to do the trick. Now I will remember:

1. Open .book and mark TOC as selected.
2. Right-click and select Set Up Table of Contents or Edit  Set Up
Table of Contents
3. Move desired format to the Include Paragraphs Tagged box.

Thanks everyone.

regards, Karen Mardahl


-Original Message-
Frame 7.1p116, WinXP
I have a TOC with only 3 headings.
I added a Heading 4 to the other files in the .book. Now I need that to show
up in the TOC.

What I have done:
* Added a Heading 4TOC (to match the other 3 levels) in the Paragraph
designer for the TOC.
* Added the layout info to the Reference page.
* Updated the PDF info for the document to say take 4 headings.

snip
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Color problem

[Patricia Carmel]

Hello All,

I imported the formats from a stable template with several additional
color definitions to another file. None of the color definitions appear
in the second file and instead, there are a series of RGB + numbers
definitions, all black, which refuse to budge when I try to delete them
(using the Color Definitions dialog box).  What should I do to get rid
of these unwanted color definitions and why aren't the imported colors
being accepted into the new file?

TIA

Regards,

Patricia



Patricia Carmel | Technical Communications Manager | Unipier Ltd |
Mobile: +972-54-492-2958 | Ext: +972-9-892-0808

Always be wary of any helpful item that weighs less than its operating
manual.Terry Pratchett



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Identifying the type of imported by copy files

[Steve Rickaby]

Hi Framers

A friend has a FrameMaker file prepared on PC with figures imported by copy 
that show up as gray boxes when viewed on Mac - so no surprises there. 
Examination of the MIF shows that they are bitmaps. Is there any way to 
identify the embedded image types from the MIF?

The bitmaps in the MIF are all prefixed by: 

=OLE2
%v
[bitmap data]

...if that's any clue. My reading of the MIF on-line guide suggests that the 
'=OLE2' is FrameMaker's facet definition, but what does this actually mean in 
terms of graphic format? Surely 'OLE' is a technology, not a graphics format? 
It's not listed in any copy of the MIF on-line guide (6, 7.0) that I have. 
Maybe it's in the 7.2 version?
-- 
Steve
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RE: Color problem

[Niels Fanøe]

Perhaps a PNG graphic slipped into the doc? Save as MIF and open it again - see 
if it took care of the unwanted color definitions. 

If this took care of your problem, search for PNG in the Framers archive for 
an explanation - should be quite a few hits. If not, I've no clue.

-Niels

- -Original Message-
- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
- [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
-  On Behalf Of Patricia Carmel
- Sent: 6. juni 2006 12:21
- To: framers@lists.frameusers.com
- Subject: Color problem
- 
- Hello All,
- 
- I imported the formats from a stable template with several 
- additional color definitions to another file. None of the 
- color definitions appear in the second file and instead, 
- there are a series of RGB + numbers definitions, all black, 
- which refuse to budge when I try to delete them (using the 
- Color Definitions dialog box).  What should I do to get rid 
- of these unwanted color definitions and why aren't the 
- imported colors being accepted into the new file?
- 
- TIA
- 
- Regards,
- 
- Patricia
- 
- 
- 
- Patricia Carmel | Technical Communications Manager | Unipier Ltd |
- Mobile: +972-54-492-2958 | Ext: +972-9-892-0808
- 
- Always be wary of any helpful item that weighs less than 
- its operating
- manual.Terry Pratchett
- 
- 
- 
- ___
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- 
- Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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- [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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- http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/nfa%40maconomy.dk
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- Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit 
- http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
- 
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RE: Color problem

[Patricia Carmel]

Hi Niels,

Totally solved the problem. I don't know what the connection with a png graphic 
is, but simply saving the file as .mif then saving the mif file as fm removed 
all the black definitions and restored the cusomized colors I'd created in the 
original file.

Many thanks.

Patricia

-Original Message-
From: Niels Fanøe [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Tuesday, June 06, 2006 12:50 PM
To: Patricia Carmel; framers@lists.frameusers.com
Subject: RE: Color problem

Perhaps a PNG graphic slipped into the doc? Save as MIF and open it again - see 
if it took care of the unwanted color definitions. 

If this took care of your problem, search for PNG in the Framers archive for 
an explanation - should be quite a few hits. If not, I've no clue.

-Niels

- -Original Message-
- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
- [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
-  On Behalf Of Patricia Carmel
- Sent: 6. juni 2006 12:21
- To: framers@lists.frameusers.com
- Subject: Color problem
- 
- Hello All,
- 
- I imported the formats from a stable template with several additional 
- color definitions to another file. None of the color definitions 
- appear in the second file and instead, there are a series of RGB + 
- numbers definitions, all black, which refuse to budge when I try to 
- delete them (using the Color Definitions dialog box).  What should I 
- do to get rid of these unwanted color definitions and why aren't the 
- imported colors being accepted into the new file?
- 
- TIA
- 
- Regards,
- 
- Patricia
- 
- 
- 
- Patricia Carmel | Technical Communications Manager | Unipier Ltd |
- Mobile: +972-54-492-2958 | Ext: +972-9-892-0808
- 
- Always be wary of any helpful item that weighs less than its 
- operating
- manual.Terry Pratchett
- 
- 
- 
- ___
- 
- 
- You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED]
- 
- Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
- 
- To unsubscribe send a blank email to
- [EMAIL PROTECTED]
- or visit
- http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/nfa%40maconomy.dk
- 
- Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit 
- http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
- 


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Re: Framemaker and Translation

[John Posada]

 We are beginning to have to get our manuals and documentation
 translated.  What's the best way to set up this workflow.

As your translation company for their advice...they have some
experience in this process.

John Posada
Senior Technical Writer

So long and thanks for all the fish.
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RE: Framemaker and Translation

[Stephen O'Brien]

Hi Steve,

I've been reading this thread with interest as our documentation (FM) 
is going to be translated into German and Japonese starting in 
January 2007. The people at the other end are distributors who are 
going to have to put together an efficient workflow. You mention in 
your comment being able to provide details...I am very interested...


Thanks.

At 10:45 AM 6/6/2006, Steve Wiseman wrote:

We use translators that can take the FM files and return them as FM files
including any marker and conditional text in the document. If you want
details, please let me know. We have been happy with the results. I
recommend them as they use translators in the destination country rather
than locals from here.

For your information, they use an application called Trados that imports MIF
files.

Best regards,
Steve


Steve Wiseman

CEO, Context Documentation and Interactive Services

Official MIF2GO Resellers and Trainers

www.context.co.il

Tel (Isr): +972-2-999-7816

 (UK): +44-845-244-7802

  Mob: +972-522-341-957

Skype: zusman


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of
Loren R. Elks
Sent: 06 June 2006 15:02
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: Framers List
Subject: Framemaker and Translation

We are beginning to have to get our manuals and documentation translated.
What's the best way to set up this workflow.

For example, do we develop in FM, then output to another format (say
RTF,etc), the translators use this format, we get it back, then convert back
with FM?


Sincerely,
Loren




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Stephen O'Brien
Documentation/Technical Writer
InnovMetric Logiciels (Software) Inc.
1-418-688-2061


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RE: Framemaker and Translation

[Diane Gaskill]

Loren, all

There is a book called Localization and Framemaker that explains the basics
of localization, tells you how to find, screen, and hire the RIGHT vendor
for the work you are doing, what you need to provide to the vendor to get a
good estimate for your job, how to work with the vendor, and explains what
the vendor can actually do for you.  It explains the localization process
(what the vendor does with your files) and  contains a table of prices that
you can use to get a fairly good idea of how much you can expect to pay for
their services.  The book is a 24-page pdf file that you can download free
from
http://www.bapmf.net/resources/2000_localization_FM/locindex.html

Note that ALL localization vendors can take a set of FM files and give you
the same set of FM files back, translated into as many target languages as
you desire.

Incidentally, Trados is a company based here in the Silicon Valley, not an
application.  Trados makes a set of software tools, including the S-tagger
and the Translators Workbench, that is the industry standard toolset today.
But it is not the only set of tools on the market and some vendors use other
tools instead, including home-grown ones.  Some of these tools are
compatible with each other and some are not.  When you talk to the vindor,
find out which toolset they use and ask about compatibility with the Trados
toolset, and particularly about the TM.  TM = translation memory - a
database that stores translated words, phrases, and paragraphs.  Using the
TM is optional, and little more expensive if they use it to start with, but
can save you a lot of $ when upgrading your docs, online help, software,
etc.  They just pull the already translated text out of the TM and add the
changes.  BTW, the data in the TM is something that you own, not the vendor,
and they should give it to you when the job is finished.  That way, if you
change vendors, you can continue from where you left off and not pay to have
the whole doc translated again.

Hope this helps.

Diane
=

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Stephen O'Brien
Sent: Tuesday, June 06, 2006 7:44 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 'Loren R. Elks'; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: 'Framers List'
Subject: RE: Framemaker and Translation


Hi Steve,

I've been reading this thread with interest as our documentation (FM)
is going to be translated into German and Japonese starting in
January 2007. The people at the other end are distributors who are
going to have to put together an efficient workflow. You mention in
your comment being able to provide details...I am very interested...

Thanks.

At 10:45 AM 6/6/2006, Steve Wiseman wrote:
We use translators that can take the FM files and return them as FM files
including any marker and conditional text in the document. If you want
details, please let me know. We have been happy with the results. I
recommend them as they use translators in the destination country rather
than locals from here.

For your information, they use an application called Trados that imports
MIF
files.

Best regards,
Steve


Steve Wiseman

CEO, Context Documentation and Interactive Services

Official MIF2GO Resellers and Trainers

www.context.co.il

Tel (Isr): +972-2-999-7816

  (UK): +44-845-244-7802

   Mob: +972-522-341-957

Skype: zusman


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of
Loren R. Elks
Sent: 06 June 2006 15:02
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: Framers List
Subject: Framemaker and Translation

We are beginning to have to get our manuals and documentation translated.
What's the best way to set up this workflow.

For example, do we develop in FM, then output to another format (say
RTF,etc), the translators use this format, we get it back, then convert
back
with FM?


Sincerely,
Loren




** To unsubscribe, send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] **
** with unsubscribe framers (no quotes) in the body.   **

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Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.8.2/356 - Release Date: 05/06/2006


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Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.8.2/356 - Release Date: 05/06/2006



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Stephen O'Brien
Documentation/Technical Writer
InnovMetric Logiciels (Software) Inc.
1-418-688-2061


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RE: Framemaker and Translation

[Ann Zdunczyk]

Loren,

I agree with everything that has been said so far. Definitely check with
your vendor to make sure that they handle the technology that you are
writing about. Some translation houses specialize in different technologies
(Medical, Telecom, Legal, etc.)

Trados by the way was based in Ireland and German if I remember correctly.
It has now been purchased by SDL. 

If you have any other questions let me know.

Z 


**
Ann Zdunczyk
President
a2z Publishing, Inc.
Phone: (336)922-1271
Fax:   (336) 922-4980
Cell:  (336)456-4493
http://www.a2z-pub.com
**

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Diane Gaskill
Sent: Tuesday, June 06, 2006 12:47 PM
To: 'Loren R. Elks'
Cc: 'Framers List'; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: Framemaker and Translation

Loren, all

There is a book called Localization and Framemaker that explains the basics
of localization, tells you how to find, screen, and hire the RIGHT vendor
for the work you are doing, what you need to provide to the vendor to get a
good estimate for your job, how to work with the vendor, and explains what
the vendor can actually do for you.  It explains the localization process
(what the vendor does with your files) and  contains a table of prices that
you can use to get a fairly good idea of how much you can expect to pay for
their services.  The book is a 24-page pdf file that you can download free
from http://www.bapmf.net/resources/2000_localization_FM/locindex.html

Note that ALL localization vendors can take a set of FM files and give you
the same set of FM files back, translated into as many target languages as
you desire.

Incidentally, Trados is a company based here in the Silicon Valley, not an
application.  Trados makes a set of software tools, including the S-tagger
and the Translators Workbench, that is the industry standard toolset today.
But it is not the only set of tools on the market and some vendors use other
tools instead, including home-grown ones.  Some of these tools are
compatible with each other and some are not.  When you talk to the vindor,
find out which toolset they use and ask about compatibility with the Trados
toolset, and particularly about the TM.  TM = translation memory - a
database that stores translated words, phrases, and paragraphs.  Using the
TM is optional, and little more expensive if they use it to start with, but
can save you a lot of $ when upgrading your docs, online help, software,
etc.  They just pull the already translated text out of the TM and add the
changes.  BTW, the data in the TM is something that you own, not the vendor,
and they should give it to you when the job is finished.  That way, if you
change vendors, you can continue from where you left off and not pay to have
the whole doc translated again.

Hope this helps.

Diane
=

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Stephen O'Brien
Sent: Tuesday, June 06, 2006 7:44 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 'Loren R. Elks'; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: 'Framers List'
Subject: RE: Framemaker and Translation


Hi Steve,

I've been reading this thread with interest as our documentation (FM) is
going to be translated into German and Japonese starting in January 2007.
The people at the other end are distributors who are going to have to put
together an efficient workflow. You mention in your comment being able to
provide details...I am very interested...

Thanks.

At 10:45 AM 6/6/2006, Steve Wiseman wrote:
We use translators that can take the FM files and return them as FM 
files including any marker and conditional text in the document. If you 
want details, please let me know. We have been happy with the results. 
I recommend them as they use translators in the destination country 
rather than locals from here.

For your information, they use an application called Trados that 
imports
MIF
files.

Best regards,
Steve


Steve Wiseman

CEO, Context Documentation and Interactive Services

Official MIF2GO Resellers and Trainers

www.context.co.il

Tel (Isr): +972-2-999-7816

  (UK): +44-845-244-7802

   Mob: +972-522-341-957

Skype: zusman


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On 
Behalf Of Loren R. Elks
Sent: 06 June 2006 15:02
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: Framers List
Subject: Framemaker and Translation

We are beginning to have to get our manuals and documentation translated.
What's the best way to set up this workflow.

For example, do we develop in FM, then output to another format (say 
RTF,etc), the translators use this format, we get it back, then convert
back
with FM?


Sincerely,
Loren




** To unsubscribe, send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] **
** with unsubscribe framers (no quotes) in the body.   **

--
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Checked by AVG Free Edition.

Re: Identifying the type of imported by copy files

[Jeremy H. Griffith]

On Tue, 6 Jun 2006 10:44:23 +0100, Steve Rickaby 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

A friend has a FrameMaker file prepared on PC with figures 
imported by copy that show up as gray boxes when viewed on 
Mac - so no surprises there. Examination of the MIF shows 
that they are bitmaps. Is there any way to identify the 
embedded image types from the MIF?

The bitmaps in the MIF are all prefixed by: 

=OLE2

You're hosed.  OLE is a Windows-only technology.  Basically,
what is stored is not a bitmap, but a binary mini-filesystem
in Microsoft's proprietary (and undocumented) Structured
Storage format.  The files in there contain the info that
the original application that created the graphic needs to
edit it, so in that sense the data is self-contained.  For
editing you need the application, but for view and print
you do not, because one of the files is a WMF (metafile)
that can be used for display... in Windows only.  ;-)

When we ran into this in Mif2Go, we reverse-engineered the
MS format, and found a way to dig out that WMF.  However,
there is often more than one WMF, and identifying the right
one to uses as the display image is tricky... and not always
possible.  So Mif2Go has an option that puts out *all* the
WMFs in an OLE object as individual files, allowing you to
choose the right one, if its best guess wasn't it.

So you could use Mif2Go, on Windows, to extract the WMFs
for your graphics... but WMFs are not viewable on the Mac.
The next best choice would be to have Mif2Go use Frame's
graphics export filters, in Windows, to produce bitmaps
that *are* usable on Mac, like JPEGs.  That would not
require that you have the original application that was
used to create the graphics; Frame and Mif2Go are enough.

HTH!

-- Jeremy H. Griffith, at Omni Systems Inc.
  [EMAIL PROTECTED]  http://www.omsys.com/
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re: Caption Links in PDF Solved

[Shlomo Perets]

Don Spencer wrote:

   Once all the tags over the illustrations match the tags beneath the
 pictures, format the tag's font to 2 pts and make its color white.  ...

 The only downside I've discovered is, if one is in Reader and searching the
 word that matches the caption, Figure for example, the cursor will land
 atop each illustration, finding the invisible word.  Odd maybe, but unlikely
 to be a problem.

The vast majority of users will probably not notice anything suspicious... 
but white text -- in addition to being searchable -- can be copied/pasted, 
spoken, greeked, displayed (or even printed with some older printer 
drivers/imagesetters). See http://www.microtype.com/Hmmms.html#0412 for 
examples + additional discussion.



Shlomo Perets

MicroType, http://www.microtype.com
Training, consulting  add-ons: FrameMaker, Structured FM and Acrobat


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RE: Framemaker and Translation

[karyn hunt]

Another place to bone up quickly: There's a company called Enlaso that does 
translations. They recently did a Webcast called Translation 101 in which 
they went over all the basics. I think they have that Webcast stored on 
their website. I found it tremendously helpful just in getting a broad 
overview of things to think about, what to look out for, what's involved, 
etc etc etc.


Karyn



From: Ann Zdunczyk [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: 'Diane Gaskill' [EMAIL PROTECTED],'Loren R. Elks' 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
CC: 'Framers List' framers@frameusers.com, 
[EMAIL PROTECTED],[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Subject: RE: Framemaker and Translation
Date: Tue, 6 Jun 2006 12:58:59 -0400

Loren,

I agree with everything that has been said so far. Definitely check with
your vendor to make sure that they handle the technology that you are
writing about. Some translation houses specialize in different technologies
(Medical, Telecom, Legal, etc.)

Trados by the way was based in Ireland and German if I remember correctly.
It has now been purchased by SDL.

If you have any other questions let me know.

Z


**
Ann Zdunczyk
President
a2z Publishing, Inc.
Phone: (336)922-1271
Fax: (336) 922-4980
Cell: (336)456-4493
http://www.a2z-pub.com
**

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Diane Gaskill
Sent: Tuesday, June 06, 2006 12:47 PM
To: 'Loren R. Elks'
Cc: 'Framers List'; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: Framemaker and Translation

Loren, all

There is a book called Localization and Framemaker that explains the basics
of localization, tells you how to find, screen, and hire the RIGHT vendor
for the work you are doing, what you need to provide to the vendor to get a
good estimate for your job, how to work with the vendor, and explains what
the vendor can actually do for you. It explains the localization process
(what the vendor does with your files) and contains a table of prices that
you can use to get a fairly good idea of how much you can expect to pay for
their services. The book is a 24-page pdf file that you can download free
from http://www.bapmf.net/resources/2000_localization_FM/locindex.html

Note that ALL localization vendors can take a set of FM files and give you
the same set of FM files back, translated into as many target languages as
you desire.

Incidentally, Trados is a company based here in the Silicon Valley, not an
application. Trados makes a set of software tools, including the S-tagger
and the Translators Workbench, that is the industry standard toolset today.
But it is not the only set of tools on the market and some vendors use 
other

tools instead, including home-grown ones. Some of these tools are
compatible with each other and some are not. When you talk to the vindor,
find out which toolset they use and ask about compatibility with the Trados
toolset, and particularly about the TM. TM = translation memory - a
database that stores translated words, phrases, and paragraphs. Using the
TM is optional, and little more expensive if they use it to start with, but
can save you a lot of $ when upgrading your docs, online help, software,
etc. They just pull the already translated text out of the TM and add the
changes. BTW, the data in the TM is something that you own, not the vendor,
and they should give it to you when the job is finished. That way, if you
change vendors, you can continue from where you left off and not pay to 
have

the whole doc translated again.

Hope this helps.

Diane
=

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Stephen O'Brien
Sent: Tuesday, June 06, 2006 7:44 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 'Loren R. Elks'; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: 'Framers List'
Subject: RE: Framemaker and Translation


Hi Steve,

I've been reading this thread with interest as our documentation (FM) is
going to be translated into German and Japonese starting in January 2007.
The people at the other end are distributors who are going to have to put
together an efficient workflow. You mention in your comment being able to
provide details...I am very interested...

Thanks.

At 10:45 AM 6/6/2006, Steve Wiseman wrote:
We use translators that can take the FM files and return them as FM
files including any marker and conditional text in the document. If you
want details, please let me know. We have been happy with the results.
I recommend them as they use translators in the destination country
rather than locals from here.

For your information, they use an application called Trados that
imports
MIF
files.

Best regards,
Steve


Steve Wiseman

CEO, Context Documentation and Interactive Services

Official MIF2GO Resellers and Trainers

www.context.co.il

Tel (Isr): +972-2-999-7816

 (UK): +44-845-244-7802

 Mob: +972-522-341-957

Skype: zusman


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL 

RE: Framemaker and Translation

[Diane Gaskill]

Hi Ann,

You are right, SDL did purchase Trados.  According to the SDL website, they
have two offices in Ireland,  including a technology center.  However, I was
told by the TRADOS tech pubs manager, whom I met at a BAPMF meeting a couple
of months ago, that they have relocated their headquarters to the USA.  As I
recall, she said it was here, but I cannot confirm this by the SDL website,
because SDL does not show specific offices labeled Trados.  Everything says
SDL.  SDL lists their USA headquarters in Plano Texas, and there is a page
on the SDL website that explains the acquisition.

One additional note to what Ann said.  In addition to specializing in a
particular technology, some L10N vendors also specialize in specific
languages (Asian or European, for example).  Be sure to ask about that when
you talk to a vendor you are considering.

Diane



-Original Message-
From: Ann Zdunczyk [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, June 06, 2006 9:59 AM
To: 'Diane Gaskill'; 'Loren R. Elks'
Cc: 'Framers List'; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: Framemaker and Translation


Loren,

I agree with everything that has been said so far. Definitely check with
your vendor to make sure that they handle the technology that you are
writing about. Some translation houses specialize in different technologies
(Medical, Telecom, Legal, etc.)

Trados by the way was based in Ireland and German if I remember correctly.
It has now been purchased by SDL.

If you have any other questions let me know.

Z


**
Ann Zdunczyk
President
a2z Publishing, Inc.
Phone: (336)922-1271
Fax:   (336) 922-4980
Cell:  (336)456-4493
http://www.a2z-pub.com
**

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Diane Gaskill
Sent: Tuesday, June 06, 2006 12:47 PM
To: 'Loren R. Elks'
Cc: 'Framers List'; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: Framemaker and Translation

Loren, all

There is a book called Localization and Framemaker that explains the basics
of localization, tells you how to find, screen, and hire the RIGHT vendor
for the work you are doing, what you need to provide to the vendor to get a
good estimate for your job, how to work with the vendor, and explains what
the vendor can actually do for you.  It explains the localization process
(what the vendor does with your files) and  contains a table of prices that
you can use to get a fairly good idea of how much you can expect to pay for
their services.  The book is a 24-page pdf file that you can download free
from http://www.bapmf.net/resources/2000_localization_FM/locindex.html

Note that ALL localization vendors can take a set of FM files and give you
the same set of FM files back, translated into as many target languages as
you desire.

Incidentally, Trados is a company based here in the Silicon Valley, not an
application.  Trados makes a set of software tools, including the S-tagger
and the Translators Workbench, that is the industry standard toolset today.
But it is not the only set of tools on the market and some vendors use other
tools instead, including home-grown ones.  Some of these tools are
compatible with each other and some are not.  When you talk to the vindor,
find out which toolset they use and ask about compatibility with the Trados
toolset, and particularly about the TM.  TM = translation memory - a
database that stores translated words, phrases, and paragraphs.  Using the
TM is optional, and little more expensive if they use it to start with, but
can save you a lot of $ when upgrading your docs, online help, software,
etc.  They just pull the already translated text out of the TM and add the
changes.  BTW, the data in the TM is something that you own, not the vendor,
and they should give it to you when the job is finished.  That way, if you
change vendors, you can continue from where you left off and not pay to have
the whole doc translated again.

Hope this helps.

Diane
=

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Stephen O'Brien
Sent: Tuesday, June 06, 2006 7:44 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 'Loren R. Elks'; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: 'Framers List'
Subject: RE: Framemaker and Translation


Hi Steve,

I've been reading this thread with interest as our documentation (FM) is
going to be translated into German and Japonese starting in January 2007.
The people at the other end are distributors who are going to have to put
together an efficient workflow. You mention in your comment being able to
provide details...I am very interested...

Thanks.

At 10:45 AM 6/6/2006, Steve Wiseman wrote:
We use translators that can take the FM files and return them as FM
files including any marker and conditional text in the document. If you
want details, please let me know. We have been happy with the results.
I 

RE: Framemaker and Translation

[mathieu jacquet]

Loren,

I happen to work as a project manager as well as a translator (English to 
French ; Trados, Translation manager, Deja Vu, Fast Help Translation 
Assistant and so on...) and technical writer (English and French ; mostly FM 
and Word) in a multilingual documentation services company (translation, 
technical writing, multimedia communication, etc.) based in Toulouse, 
France.


Ideally, what you just have to do is develop your documentation, using 
either Word or FM or whatever tool meets the needs of your documentation 
team, and then send your files, whatever the format (html, mif, xml, doc, 
rtf, idd...) , to the vendor.


The vendor is supposed to take in charge the whole process of translation, 
from format conversions, creation and setting of the Translation Memory 
depending on your needs (if you don not have one already), alignment of 
existing multilingual documents (aligning a text means taking two similar 
texts, one in English and one in French and make their segments - i.e. 
sentences - correspond in order to feed a TM). If you send an HTML Web site 
page, then you'll receive an HTML Web site translated page ; send a pdf and 
you'll have the same pdf translated ; same thing for FM, Word documents, 
etc.


You can also send a .doc and ask for a .pdf, and inversely. Possibilities 
are multiple.


The biggest part your team will have to do is to prepare INSTRUCTIONS as 
regards : layout, products, software (are they translated or not ?), 
copyright, part numbers and revisions (references, same in English and in 
other languages..?), abbreviations (are they translated ..?), etc. The more 
precise the instructions, the faster and the more accurate the translation. 
Be sure to have available internal proofreaders at hand too...


Hope this will help, do not hesitate to contact me for more information.

Cheers,

Mathieu.

Mathieu Jacquet
Raptrad-imagine (www.raptrad-imagine.com)
Toulouse, France



From: karyn hunt [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: framers@frameusers.com
Subject: RE: Framemaker and Translation
Date: Tue, 06 Jun 2006 19:38:05 +

Another place to bone up quickly: There's a company called Enlaso that does 
translations. They recently did a Webcast called Translation 101 in which 
they went over all the basics. I think they have that Webcast stored on 
their website. I found it tremendously helpful just in getting a broad 
overview of things to think about, what to look out for, what's involved, 
etc etc etc.


Karyn



From: Ann Zdunczyk [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: 'Diane Gaskill' [EMAIL PROTECTED],'Loren R. Elks' 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
CC: 'Framers List' framers@frameusers.com, 
[EMAIL PROTECTED],[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Subject: RE: Framemaker and Translation
Date: Tue, 6 Jun 2006 12:58:59 -0400

Loren,

I agree with everything that has been said so far. Definitely check with
your vendor to make sure that they handle the technology that you are
writing about. Some translation houses specialize in different 
technologies

(Medical, Telecom, Legal, etc.)

Trados by the way was based in Ireland and German if I remember correctly.
It has now been purchased by SDL.

If you have any other questions let me know.

Z


**
Ann Zdunczyk
President
a2z Publishing, Inc.
Phone: (336)922-1271
Fax: (336) 922-4980
Cell: (336)456-4493
http://www.a2z-pub.com
**

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Diane Gaskill
Sent: Tuesday, June 06, 2006 12:47 PM
To: 'Loren R. Elks'
Cc: 'Framers List'; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: Framemaker and Translation

Loren, all

There is a book called Localization and Framemaker that explains the 
basics

of localization, tells you how to find, screen, and hire the RIGHT vendor
for the work you are doing, what you need to provide to the vendor to get 
a

good estimate for your job, how to work with the vendor, and explains what
the vendor can actually do for you. It explains the localization process
(what the vendor does with your files) and contains a table of prices that
you can use to get a fairly good idea of how much you can expect to pay 
for

their services. The book is a 24-page pdf file that you can download free
from http://www.bapmf.net/resources/2000_localization_FM/locindex.html

Note that ALL localization vendors can take a set of FM files and give you
the same set of FM files back, translated into as many target languages as
you desire.

Incidentally, Trados is a company based here in the Silicon Valley, not an
application. Trados makes a set of software tools, including the S-tagger
and the Translators Workbench, that is the industry standard toolset 
today.
But it is not the only set of tools on the market and some vendors use 
other

tools instead, including home-grown ones. Some of these tools are
compatible with each other and some are not. When you talk to the vindor,
find 

importing Framemaker files into InDesign CS

[Tumpa Banerjee]

Hello,
   
  I am trying to import some FM files into InDesign CS. I converted the FM 
files to RTF and then did File  Place and placed the content. The problem is 
that the graphics did not import properly (they are chopped and also overlap 
the text in places). Could someone plaes tell me what is a better way to do 
this?
   
  best regards,
  Ananya

 __
Do You Yahoo!?
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http://mail.yahoo.com 
___


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Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.

Adding another heading to the TOC

[Karen Mardahl]

Hi

Frame 7.1p116, WinXP

I've gotten myself confused, so I need some help.

I have a TOC with only 3 headings.

I added a Heading 4 to the other files in the .book. Now I need that
to show up in the TOC.

What I have done:
* Added a "Heading 4TOC" (to match the other 3 levels) in the
Paragraph designer for the TOC.
* Added the layout info to the Reference page.
* Updated the PDF info for the document to say take 4 headings.

I have only done this once before, and that was to a legacy doc with
all sorts of garbage floating about. My memory fails me. This is a
clean template and I don't want to mess things up. I did not create
the TOC layout.

Thanks in advance.

regards, Karen Mardahl

Adding another heading to the TOC

[Karen Mardahl]

Problem solved thanks to Karen Z., Linda G., Fred R., Lin S., and Shelley S.!

I had overlooked the right-click on the TOC.
I thought the Format > Document > PDF Setup > Bookmarks tab was
supposed to do the trick. Now I will remember:

1. Open .book and mark TOC as selected.
2. Right-click and select Set Up Table of Contents or Edit > Set Up
Table of Contents
3. Move desired format to the Include Paragraphs Tagged box.

Thanks everyone.

regards, Karen Mardahl

> -Original Message-
> Frame 7.1p116, WinXP
> I have a TOC with only 3 headings.
> I added a Heading 4 to the other files in the .book. Now I need that to show
> up in the TOC.
>
> What I have done:
> * Added a "Heading 4TOC" (to match the other 3 levels) in the Paragraph
> designer for the TOC.
> * Added the layout info to the Reference page.
> * Updated the PDF info for the document to say take 4 headings.

Color problem

[Patricia Carmel]

Hello All,

I imported the formats from a stable template with several additional
color definitions to another file. None of the color definitions appear
in the second file and instead, there are a series of RGB + numbers
definitions, all black, which refuse to budge when I try to delete them
(using the Color Definitions dialog box).  What should I do to get rid
of these unwanted color definitions and why aren't the imported colors
being accepted into the new file?

TIA

Regards,

Patricia



Patricia Carmel | Technical Communications Manager | Unipier Ltd |
Mobile: +972-54-492-2958 | Ext: +972-9-892-0808

"Always be wary of any helpful item that weighs less than its operating
manual."Terry Pratchett

Identifying the type of imported by copy files

[Steve Rickaby]

Hi Framers

A friend has a FrameMaker file prepared on PC with figures imported by copy 
that show up as gray boxes when viewed on Mac - so no surprises there. 
Examination of the MIF shows that they are bitmaps. Is there any way to 
identify the embedded image types from the MIF?

The bitmaps in the MIF are all prefixed by: 

=OLE2
&%v
[bitmap data]

...if that's any clue. My reading of the MIF on-line guide suggests that the 
'=OLE2' is FrameMaker's facet definition, but what does this actually mean in 
terms of graphic format? Surely 'OLE' is a technology, not a graphics format? 
It's not listed in any copy of the MIF on-line guide (6, 7.0) that I have. 
Maybe it's in the 7.2 version?
-- 
Steve

Color problem

[Harro de Jong]

Patricia Carmel wrote:

> I imported the formats from a stable template with several additional
> color definitions to another file. None of the color
> definitions appear
> in the second file and instead, there are a series of RGB + numbers
> definitions, all black, which refuse to budge when I try to
> delete them
> (using the Color Definitions dialog box).  What should I do to get rid
> of these unwanted color definitions and why aren't the imported colors
> being accepted into the new file?

The unwanted definitions are probably there because they're used in
graphics included in the file. 

Harro de Jong

Color problem

[Niels Fanøe]

Perhaps a PNG graphic slipped into the doc? Save as MIF and open it again - see 
if it took care of the unwanted color definitions. 

If this took care of your problem, search for "PNG" in the Framers archive for 
an explanation - should be quite a few hits. If not, I've no clue.

-Niels

-> -Original Message-
-> From: framers-bounces+nfa=maconomy.dk at lists.frameusers.com 
-> [mailto:framers-bounces+nfa=maconomy.dk at lists.frameusers.com]
->  On Behalf Of Patricia Carmel
-> Sent: 6. juni 2006 12:21
-> To: framers at lists.frameusers.com
-> Subject: Color problem
-> 
-> Hello All,
-> 
-> I imported the formats from a stable template with several 
-> additional color definitions to another file. None of the 
-> color definitions appear in the second file and instead, 
-> there are a series of RGB + numbers definitions, all black, 
-> which refuse to budge when I try to delete them (using the 
-> Color Definitions dialog box).  What should I do to get rid 
-> of these unwanted color definitions and why aren't the 
-> imported colors being accepted into the new file?
-> 
-> TIA
-> 
-> Regards,
-> 
-> Patricia
-> 
-> 
-> 
-> Patricia Carmel | Technical Communications Manager | Unipier Ltd |
-> Mobile: +972-54-492-2958 | Ext: +972-9-892-0808
-> 
-> "Always be wary of any helpful item that weighs less than 
-> its operating
-> manual."Terry Pratchett
-> 
-> 
-> 
-> ___
-> 
-> 
-> You are currently subscribed to Framers as NFA at maconomy.dk.
-> 
-> Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com.
-> 
-> To unsubscribe send a blank email to
-> framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com
-> or visit 
-> http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/nfa%40maconomy.dk
-> 
-> Send administrative questions to lisa at frameusers.com. Visit 
-> http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
-> 

Identifying the type of imported by copy files

[Dov Isaacs]

Unfortunately, apparently the figures weren't put into the 
FrameMaker document via simple copy/paste (bad idea anyway),
but via OLE, "Object Linking and Embedding," which effectively
requires that the FrameMaker document be edited on a system
of the same platform with the application and the application's
file/data available from which the data was copied.

- Dov


> -Original Message-
> From: framers-bounces+isaacs=adobe.com at lists.frameusers.com 
> [mailto:framers-bounces+isaacs=adobe.com at lists.frameusers.com]
>  On Behalf Of Steve Rickaby
> Sent: Tuesday, June 06, 2006 2:44 AM
> To: framers at FrameUsers.com
> Subject: Identifying the type of imported by copy files
> 
> Hi Framers
> 
> A friend has a FrameMaker file prepared on PC with figures 
> imported by copy that show up as gray boxes when viewed on 
> Mac - so no surprises there. Examination of the MIF shows 
> that they are bitmaps. Is there any way to identify the 
> embedded image types from the MIF?
> 
> The bitmaps in the MIF are all prefixed by: 
> 
> =OLE2
> &%v
> [bitmap data]
> 
> ...if that's any clue. My reading of the MIF on-line guide 
> suggests that the '=OLE2' is FrameMaker's facet definition, 
> but what does this actually mean in terms of graphic format? 
> Surely 'OLE' is a technology, not a graphics format? It's not 
> listed in any copy of the MIF on-line guide (6, 7.0) that I 
> have. Maybe it's in the 7.2 version?
> -- 
> Steve
> ___

Color problem

[Patricia Carmel]

Hi Niels,

Totally solved the problem. I don't know what the connection with a png graphic 
is, but simply saving the file as .mif then saving the mif file as fm removed 
all the black definitions and restored the cusomized colors I'd created in the 
original file.

Many thanks.

Patricia

-Original Message-
From: Niels Fan?e [mailto:n...@maconomy.dk] 
Sent: Tuesday, June 06, 2006 12:50 PM
To: Patricia Carmel; framers at lists.frameusers.com
Subject: RE: Color problem

Perhaps a PNG graphic slipped into the doc? Save as MIF and open it again - see 
if it took care of the unwanted color definitions. 

If this took care of your problem, search for "PNG" in the Framers archive for 
an explanation - should be quite a few hits. If not, I've no clue.

-Niels

-> -Original Message-
-> From: framers-bounces+nfa=maconomy.dk at lists.frameusers.com
-> [mailto:framers-bounces+nfa=maconomy.dk at lists.frameusers.com]
->  On Behalf Of Patricia Carmel
-> Sent: 6. juni 2006 12:21
-> To: framers at lists.frameusers.com
-> Subject: Color problem
-> 
-> Hello All,
-> 
-> I imported the formats from a stable template with several additional 
-> color definitions to another file. None of the color definitions 
-> appear in the second file and instead, there are a series of RGB + 
-> numbers definitions, all black, which refuse to budge when I try to 
-> delete them (using the Color Definitions dialog box).  What should I 
-> do to get rid of these unwanted color definitions and why aren't the 
-> imported colors being accepted into the new file?
-> 
-> TIA
-> 
-> Regards,
-> 
-> Patricia
-> 
-> 
-> 
-> Patricia Carmel | Technical Communications Manager | Unipier Ltd |
-> Mobile: +972-54-492-2958 | Ext: +972-9-892-0808
-> 
-> "Always be wary of any helpful item that weighs less than its 
-> operating
-> manual."Terry Pratchett
-> 
-> 
-> 
-> ___
-> 
-> 
-> You are currently subscribed to Framers as NFA at maconomy.dk.
-> 
-> Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com.
-> 
-> To unsubscribe send a blank email to
-> framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com
-> or visit
-> http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/nfa%40maconomy.dk
-> 
-> Send administrative questions to lisa at frameusers.com. Visit 
-> http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
-> 

Framemaker and Translation

[John Posada]

> We are beginning to have to get our manuals and documentation
> translated.  What's the best way to set up this workflow.

As your translation company for their advice...they have some
experience in this process.

John Posada
Senior Technical Writer

"So long and thanks for all the fish."

Color problem

[Doug]

If you have FrameScript, the ReplaceColors script will also let you
delete all unused colors, including those stubborn colors that can't
otherwise be deleted (w'out saving as MIF).

Also, if you use PNG graphics, make sure they use a 24 bit color depth
before you import them.

--Doug

Framemaker and Translation

[Stephen O'Brien]

Hi Steve,

I've been reading this thread with interest as our documentation (FM) 
is going to be translated into German and Japonese starting in 
January 2007. The people at the other end are distributors who are 
going to have to put together an efficient workflow. You mention in 
your comment being able to provide details...I am very interested...

Thanks.

At 10:45 AM 6/6/2006, Steve Wiseman wrote:
>We use translators that can take the FM files and return them as FM files
>including any marker and conditional text in the document. If you want
>details, please let me know. We have been happy with the results. I
>recommend them as they use translators in the destination country rather
>than locals from here.
>
>For your information, they use an application called Trados that imports MIF
>files.
>
>Best regards,
>Steve
>
>
>Steve Wiseman
>
>CEO, Context Documentation and Interactive Services
>
>Official MIF2GO Resellers and Trainers
>
>www.context.co.il
>
>Tel (Isr): +972-2-999-7816
>
>  (UK): +44-845-244-7802
>
>   Mob: +972-522-341-957
>
>Skype: zusman
>
>
>-Original Message-
>From: owner-framers at omsys.com [mailto:owner-framers at omsys.com] On Behalf 
>Of
>Loren R. Elks
>Sent: 06 June 2006 15:02
>To: framers at omsys.com
>Cc: Framers List
>Subject: Framemaker and Translation
>
>We are beginning to have to get our manuals and documentation translated.
>What's the best way to set up this workflow.
>
>For example, do we develop in FM, then output to another format (say
>RTF,etc), the translators use this format, we get it back, then convert back
>with FM?
>
>
>Sincerely,
>Loren
>
>
>
>
>** To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo at omsys.com **
>** with "unsubscribe framers" (no quotes) in the body.   **
>
>--
>No virus found in this incoming message.
>Checked by AVG Free Edition.
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>
>
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>
>
>** To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo at omsys.com **
>** with "unsubscribe framers" (no quotes) in the body.   **

Stephen O'Brien
Documentation/Technical Writer
InnovMetric Logiciels (Software) Inc.
1-418-688-2061

Framemaker and Translation

[Diane Gaskill]

Loren, all

There is a book called Localization and Framemaker that explains the basics
of localization, tells you how to find, screen, and hire the RIGHT vendor
for the work you are doing, what you need to provide to the vendor to get a
good estimate for your job, how to work with the vendor, and explains what
the vendor can actually do for you.  It explains the localization process
(what the vendor does with your files) and  contains a table of prices that
you can use to get a fairly good idea of how much you can expect to pay for
their services.  The book is a 24-page pdf file that you can download free
from
http://www.bapmf.net/resources/2000_localization_FM/locindex.html

Note that ALL localization vendors can take a set of FM files and give you
the same set of FM files back, translated into as many target languages as
you desire.

Incidentally, Trados is a company based here in the Silicon Valley, not an
application.  Trados makes a set of software tools, including the S-tagger
and the Translators Workbench, that is the industry standard toolset today.
But it is not the only set of tools on the market and some vendors use other
tools instead, including home-grown ones.  Some of these tools are
compatible with each other and some are not.  When you talk to the vindor,
find out which toolset they use and ask about compatibility with the Trados
toolset, and particularly about the TM.  TM = translation memory - a
database that stores translated words, phrases, and paragraphs.  Using the
TM is optional, and little more expensive if they use it to start with, but
can save you a lot of $ when upgrading your docs, online help, software,
etc.  They just pull the already translated text out of the TM and add the
changes.  BTW, the data in the TM is something that you own, not the vendor,
and they should give it to you when the job is finished.  That way, if you
change vendors, you can continue from where you left off and not pay to have
the whole doc translated again.

Hope this helps.

Diane
=

-Original Message-
From: framers-bounces+dgcaller=earthlink@lists.frameusers.com
[mailto:framers-bounces+dgcaller=earthlink.net at lists.frameusers.com]On
Behalf Of Stephen O'Brien
Sent: Tuesday, June 06, 2006 7:44 AM
To: swiseman at context.co.il; 'Loren R. Elks'; framers at omsys.com
Cc: 'Framers List'
Subject: RE: Framemaker and Translation


Hi Steve,

I've been reading this thread with interest as our documentation (FM)
is going to be translated into German and Japonese starting in
January 2007. The people at the other end are distributors who are
going to have to put together an efficient workflow. You mention in
your comment being able to provide details...I am very interested...

Thanks.

At 10:45 AM 6/6/2006, Steve Wiseman wrote:
>We use translators that can take the FM files and return them as FM files
>including any marker and conditional text in the document. If you want
>details, please let me know. We have been happy with the results. I
>recommend them as they use translators in the destination country rather
>than locals from here.
>
>For your information, they use an application called Trados that imports
MIF
>files.
>
>Best regards,
>Steve
>
>
>Steve Wiseman
>
>CEO, Context Documentation and Interactive Services
>
>Official MIF2GO Resellers and Trainers
>
>www.context.co.il
>
>Tel (Isr): +972-2-999-7816
>
>  (UK): +44-845-244-7802
>
>   Mob: +972-522-341-957
>
>Skype: zusman
>
>
>-Original Message-
>From: owner-framers at omsys.com [mailto:owner-framers at omsys.com] On Behalf 
>Of
>Loren R. Elks
>Sent: 06 June 2006 15:02
>To: framers at omsys.com
>Cc: Framers List
>Subject: Framemaker and Translation
>
>We are beginning to have to get our manuals and documentation translated.
>What's the best way to set up this workflow.
>
>For example, do we develop in FM, then output to another format (say
>RTF,etc), the translators use this format, we get it back, then convert
back
>with FM?
>
>
>Sincerely,
>Loren
>
>
>
>
>** To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo at omsys.com **
>** with "unsubscribe framers" (no quotes) in the body.   **
>
>--
>No virus found in this incoming message.
>Checked by AVG Free Edition.
>Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.8.2/356 - Release Date: 05/06/2006
>
>
>--
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>Checked by AVG Free Edition.
>Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.8.2/356 - Release Date: 05/06/2006
>
>
>
>** To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo at omsys.com **
>** with "unsubscribe framers" (no quotes) in the body.   **

Stephen O'Brien
Documentation/Technical Writer
InnovMetric Logiciels (Software) Inc.
1-418-688-2061


___


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Framemaker and Translation

[Ann Zdunczyk]

Loren,

I agree with everything that has been said so far. Definitely check with
your vendor to make sure that they handle the technology that you are
writing about. Some translation houses specialize in different technologies
(Medical, Telecom, Legal, etc.)

Trados by the way was based in Ireland and German if I remember correctly.
It has now been purchased by SDL. 

If you have any other questions let me know.

Z 


**
Ann Zdunczyk
President
a2z Publishing, Inc.
Phone: (336)922-1271
Fax:   (336) 922-4980
Cell:  (336)456-4493
http://www.a2z-pub.com
**

-Original Message-
From: framers-bounces+azdunczyk=triad.rr@lists.frameusers.com
[mailto:framers-bounces+azdunczyk=triad.rr.com at lists.frameusers.com] On
Behalf Of Diane Gaskill
Sent: Tuesday, June 06, 2006 12:47 PM
To: 'Loren R. Elks'
Cc: 'Framers List'; framers at omsys.com; swiseman at context.co.il
Subject: RE: Framemaker and Translation

Loren, all

There is a book called Localization and Framemaker that explains the basics
of localization, tells you how to find, screen, and hire the RIGHT vendor
for the work you are doing, what you need to provide to the vendor to get a
good estimate for your job, how to work with the vendor, and explains what
the vendor can actually do for you.  It explains the localization process
(what the vendor does with your files) and  contains a table of prices that
you can use to get a fairly good idea of how much you can expect to pay for
their services.  The book is a 24-page pdf file that you can download free
from http://www.bapmf.net/resources/2000_localization_FM/locindex.html

Note that ALL localization vendors can take a set of FM files and give you
the same set of FM files back, translated into as many target languages as
you desire.

Incidentally, Trados is a company based here in the Silicon Valley, not an
application.  Trados makes a set of software tools, including the S-tagger
and the Translators Workbench, that is the industry standard toolset today.
But it is not the only set of tools on the market and some vendors use other
tools instead, including home-grown ones.  Some of these tools are
compatible with each other and some are not.  When you talk to the vindor,
find out which toolset they use and ask about compatibility with the Trados
toolset, and particularly about the TM.  TM = translation memory - a
database that stores translated words, phrases, and paragraphs.  Using the
TM is optional, and little more expensive if they use it to start with, but
can save you a lot of $ when upgrading your docs, online help, software,
etc.  They just pull the already translated text out of the TM and add the
changes.  BTW, the data in the TM is something that you own, not the vendor,
and they should give it to you when the job is finished.  That way, if you
change vendors, you can continue from where you left off and not pay to have
the whole doc translated again.

Hope this helps.

Diane
=

-Original Message-
From: framers-bounces+dgcaller=earthlink@lists.frameusers.com
[mailto:framers-bounces+dgcaller=earthlink.net at lists.frameusers.com]On
Behalf Of Stephen O'Brien
Sent: Tuesday, June 06, 2006 7:44 AM
To: swiseman at context.co.il; 'Loren R. Elks'; framers at omsys.com
Cc: 'Framers List'
Subject: RE: Framemaker and Translation


Hi Steve,

I've been reading this thread with interest as our documentation (FM) is
going to be translated into German and Japonese starting in January 2007.
The people at the other end are distributors who are going to have to put
together an efficient workflow. You mention in your comment being able to
provide details...I am very interested...

Thanks.

At 10:45 AM 6/6/2006, Steve Wiseman wrote:
>We use translators that can take the FM files and return them as FM 
>files including any marker and conditional text in the document. If you 
>want details, please let me know. We have been happy with the results. 
>I recommend them as they use translators in the destination country 
>rather than locals from here.
>
>For your information, they use an application called Trados that 
>imports
MIF
>files.
>
>Best regards,
>Steve
>
>
>Steve Wiseman
>
>CEO, Context Documentation and Interactive Services
>
>Official MIF2GO Resellers and Trainers
>
>www.context.co.il
>
>Tel (Isr): +972-2-999-7816
>
>  (UK): +44-845-244-7802
>
>   Mob: +972-522-341-957
>
>Skype: zusman
>
>
>-Original Message-
>From: owner-framers at omsys.com [mailto:owner-framers at omsys.com] On 
>Behalf Of Loren R. Elks
>Sent: 06 June 2006 15:02
>To: framers at omsys.com
>Cc: Framers List
>Subject: Framemaker and Translation
>
>We are beginning to have to get our manuals and documentation translated.
>What's the best way to set up this workflow.
>
>For example, do we develop in FM, then output to another format (say 
>RTF,etc), the translators use this 

Identifying the type of imported by copy files

[Jeremy H. Griffith]

On Tue, 6 Jun 2006 10:44:23 +0100, Steve Rickaby 
 wrote:

>A friend has a FrameMaker file prepared on PC with figures 
>imported by copy that show up as gray boxes when viewed on 
>Mac - so no surprises there. Examination of the MIF shows 
>that they are bitmaps. Is there any way to identify the 
>embedded image types from the MIF?
>
>The bitmaps in the MIF are all prefixed by: 
>
>=OLE2

You're hosed.  OLE is a Windows-only technology.  Basically,
what is stored is not a bitmap, but a binary mini-filesystem
in Microsoft's proprietary (and undocumented) Structured
Storage format.  The "files" in there contain the info that
the original application that created the graphic needs to
edit it, so in that sense the data is self-contained.  For
editing you need the application, but for view and print
you do not, because one of the "files" is a WMF (metafile)
that can be used for display... in Windows only.  ;-)

When we ran into this in Mif2Go, we reverse-engineered the
MS format, and found a way to dig out that WMF.  However,
there is often more than one WMF, and identifying the right
one to uses as the display image is tricky... and not always
possible.  So Mif2Go has an option that puts out *all* the
WMFs in an OLE object as individual files, allowing you to
choose the right one, if its "best guess" wasn't it.

So you could use Mif2Go, on Windows, to extract the WMFs
for your graphics... but WMFs are not viewable on the Mac.
The next best choice would be to have Mif2Go use Frame's
graphics export filters, in Windows, to produce bitmaps
that *are* usable on Mac, like JPEGs.  That would not
require that you have the original application that was
used to create the graphics; Frame and Mif2Go are enough.

HTH!

-- Jeremy H. Griffith, at Omni Systems Inc.
http://www.omsys.com/

Caption Links in PDF Solved

[Shlomo Perets]

Don Spencer wrote:

 >   Once all the tags over the illustrations match the tags beneath the
 > pictures, format the tag's font to 2 pts and make its color white.  ...

 > The only downside I've discovered is, if one is in Reader and searching the
 > word that matches the caption, "Figure" for example, the cursor will land
 > atop each illustration, finding the invisible word.  Odd maybe, but unlikely
 > to be a problem.

The vast majority of users will probably not notice anything suspicious... 
but white text -- in addition to being searchable -- can be copied/pasted, 
spoken, greeked, displayed (or even printed with some older printer 
drivers/imagesetters). See http://www.microtype.com/Hmmms.html#0412 for 
examples + additional discussion.


Shlomo Perets

MicroType, http://www.microtype.com
Training, consulting & add-ons: FrameMaker, Structured FM and Acrobat

Framemaker and Translation

[karyn hunt]

Another place to bone up quickly: There's a company called Enlaso that does 
translations. They recently did a Webcast called Translation 101 in which 
they went over all the basics. I think they have that Webcast stored on 
their website. I found it tremendously helpful just in getting a broad 
overview of things to think about, what to look out for, what's involved, 
etc etc etc.

Karyn



From: "Ann Zdunczyk" 
To: "'Diane Gaskill'" ,"'Loren R. Elks'" 

CC: 'Framers List' , 
framers at omsys.com,swiseman at context.co.il
Subject: RE: Framemaker and Translation
Date: Tue, 6 Jun 2006 12:58:59 -0400
>Loren,
>
>I agree with everything that has been said so far. Definitely check with
>your vendor to make sure that they handle the technology that you are
>writing about. Some translation houses specialize in different technologies
>(Medical, Telecom, Legal, etc.)
>
>Trados by the way was based in Ireland and German if I remember correctly.
>It has now been purchased by SDL.
>
>If you have any other questions let me know.
>
>Z
>
>
>**
>Ann Zdunczyk
>President
>a2z Publishing, Inc.
>Phone: (336)922-1271
>Fax: (336) 922-4980
>Cell: (336)456-4493
>http://www.a2z-pub.com
>**
>
>-Original Message-
>From: framers-bounces+azdunczyk=triad.rr.com at lists.frameusers.com
>[mailto:framers-bounces+azdunczyk=triad.rr.com at lists.frameusers.com] On
>Behalf Of Diane Gaskill
>Sent: Tuesday, June 06, 2006 12:47 PM
>To: 'Loren R. Elks'
>Cc: 'Framers List'; framers at omsys.com; swiseman at context.co.il
>Subject: RE: Framemaker and Translation
>
>Loren, all
>
>There is a book called Localization and Framemaker that explains the basics
>of localization, tells you how to find, screen, and hire the RIGHT vendor
>for the work you are doing, what you need to provide to the vendor to get a
>good estimate for your job, how to work with the vendor, and explains what
>the vendor can actually do for you. It explains the localization process
>(what the vendor does with your files) and contains a table of prices that
>you can use to get a fairly good idea of how much you can expect to pay for
>their services. The book is a 24-page pdf file that you can download free
>from http://www.bapmf.net/resources/2000_localization_FM/locindex.html
>
>Note that ALL localization vendors can take a set of FM files and give you
>the same set of FM files back, translated into as many target languages as
>you desire.
>
>Incidentally, Trados is a company based here in the Silicon Valley, not an
>application. Trados makes a set of software tools, including the S-tagger
>and the Translators Workbench, that is the industry standard toolset today.
>But it is not the only set of tools on the market and some vendors use 
>other
>tools instead, including home-grown ones. Some of these tools are
>compatible with each other and some are not. When you talk to the vindor,
>find out which toolset they use and ask about compatibility with the Trados
>toolset, and particularly about the TM. TM = translation memory - a
>database that stores translated words, phrases, and paragraphs. Using the
>TM is optional, and little more expensive if they use it to start with, but
>can save you a lot of $ when upgrading your docs, online help, software,
>etc. They just pull the already translated text out of the TM and add the
>changes. BTW, the data in the TM is something that you own, not the vendor,
>and they should give it to you when the job is finished. That way, if you
>change vendors, you can continue from where you left off and not pay to 
>have
>the whole doc translated again.
>
>Hope this helps.
>
>Diane
>=
>
>-Original Message-
>From: framers-bounces+dgcaller=earthlink.net at lists.frameusers.com
>[mailto:framers-bounces+dgcaller=earthlink.net at lists.frameusers.com]On
>Behalf Of Stephen O'Brien
>Sent: Tuesday, June 06, 2006 7:44 AM
>To: swiseman at context.co.il; 'Loren R. Elks'; framers at omsys.com
>Cc: 'Framers List'
>Subject: RE: Framemaker and Translation
>
>
>Hi Steve,
>
>I've been reading this thread with interest as our documentation (FM) is
>going to be translated into German and Japonese starting in January 2007.
>The people at the other end are distributors who are going to have to put
>together an efficient workflow. You mention in your comment being able to
>provide details...I am very interested...
>
>Thanks.
>
>At 10:45 AM 6/6/2006, Steve Wiseman wrote:
> >We use translators that can take the FM files and return them as FM
> >files including any marker and conditional text in the document. If you
> >want details, please let me know. We have been happy with the results.
> >I recommend them as they use translators in the destination country
> >rather than locals from here.
> >
> >For your information, they use an application called Trados that
> >imports
>MIF
> >files.
> >
> >Best 

Framemaker and Translation

[Diane Gaskill]

Hi Ann,

You are right, SDL did purchase Trados.  According to the SDL website, they
have two offices in Ireland,  including a technology center.  However, I was
told by the TRADOS tech pubs manager, whom I met at a BAPMF meeting a couple
of months ago, that they have relocated their headquarters to the USA.  As I
recall, she said it was here, but I cannot confirm this by the SDL website,
because SDL does not show specific offices labeled Trados.  Everything says
SDL.  SDL lists their USA headquarters in Plano Texas, and there is a page
on the SDL website that explains the acquisition.

One additional note to what Ann said.  In addition to specializing in a
particular technology, some L10N vendors also specialize in specific
languages (Asian or European, for example).  Be sure to ask about that when
you talk to a vendor you are considering.

Diane



-Original Message-
From: Ann Zdunczyk [mailto:azdunc...@triad.rr.com]
Sent: Tuesday, June 06, 2006 9:59 AM
To: 'Diane Gaskill'; 'Loren R. Elks'
Cc: 'Framers List'; framers at omsys.com; swiseman at context.co.il
Subject: RE: Framemaker and Translation


Loren,

I agree with everything that has been said so far. Definitely check with
your vendor to make sure that they handle the technology that you are
writing about. Some translation houses specialize in different technologies
(Medical, Telecom, Legal, etc.)

Trados by the way was based in Ireland and German if I remember correctly.
It has now been purchased by SDL.

If you have any other questions let me know.

Z


**
Ann Zdunczyk
President
a2z Publishing, Inc.
Phone: (336)922-1271
Fax:   (336) 922-4980
Cell:  (336)456-4493
http://www.a2z-pub.com
**

-Original Message-
From: framers-bounces+azdunczyk=triad.rr@lists.frameusers.com
[mailto:framers-bounces+azdunczyk=triad.rr.com at lists.frameusers.com] On
Behalf Of Diane Gaskill
Sent: Tuesday, June 06, 2006 12:47 PM
To: 'Loren R. Elks'
Cc: 'Framers List'; framers at omsys.com; swiseman at context.co.il
Subject: RE: Framemaker and Translation

Loren, all

There is a book called Localization and Framemaker that explains the basics
of localization, tells you how to find, screen, and hire the RIGHT vendor
for the work you are doing, what you need to provide to the vendor to get a
good estimate for your job, how to work with the vendor, and explains what
the vendor can actually do for you.  It explains the localization process
(what the vendor does with your files) and  contains a table of prices that
you can use to get a fairly good idea of how much you can expect to pay for
their services.  The book is a 24-page pdf file that you can download free
from http://www.bapmf.net/resources/2000_localization_FM/locindex.html

Note that ALL localization vendors can take a set of FM files and give you
the same set of FM files back, translated into as many target languages as
you desire.

Incidentally, Trados is a company based here in the Silicon Valley, not an
application.  Trados makes a set of software tools, including the S-tagger
and the Translators Workbench, that is the industry standard toolset today.
But it is not the only set of tools on the market and some vendors use other
tools instead, including home-grown ones.  Some of these tools are
compatible with each other and some are not.  When you talk to the vindor,
find out which toolset they use and ask about compatibility with the Trados
toolset, and particularly about the TM.  TM = translation memory - a
database that stores translated words, phrases, and paragraphs.  Using the
TM is optional, and little more expensive if they use it to start with, but
can save you a lot of $ when upgrading your docs, online help, software,
etc.  They just pull the already translated text out of the TM and add the
changes.  BTW, the data in the TM is something that you own, not the vendor,
and they should give it to you when the job is finished.  That way, if you
change vendors, you can continue from where you left off and not pay to have
the whole doc translated again.

Hope this helps.

Diane
=

-Original Message-
From: framers-bounces+dgcaller=earthlink@lists.frameusers.com
[mailto:framers-bounces+dgcaller=earthlink.net at lists.frameusers.com]On
Behalf Of Stephen O'Brien
Sent: Tuesday, June 06, 2006 7:44 AM
To: swiseman at context.co.il; 'Loren R. Elks'; framers at omsys.com
Cc: 'Framers List'
Subject: RE: Framemaker and Translation


Hi Steve,

I've been reading this thread with interest as our documentation (FM) is
going to be translated into German and Japonese starting in January 2007.
The people at the other end are distributors who are going to have to put
together an efficient workflow. You mention in your comment being able to
provide details...I am very interested...

Thanks.

At 10:45 AM 6/6/2006, Steve Wiseman wrote:
>We 

Framemaker and Translation

[mathieu jacquet]

Loren,

I happen to work as a project manager as well as a translator (English to 
French ; Trados, Translation manager, Deja Vu, Fast Help Translation 
Assistant and so on...) and technical writer (English and French ; mostly FM 
and Word) in a multilingual documentation services company (translation, 
technical writing, multimedia communication, etc.) based in Toulouse, 
France.

Ideally, what you just have to do is develop your documentation, using 
either Word or FM or whatever tool meets the needs of your documentation 
team, and then send your files, whatever the format (html, mif, xml, doc, 
rtf, idd...) , to the vendor.

The vendor is supposed to take in charge the whole process of translation, 
from format conversions, creation and setting of the Translation Memory 
depending on your needs (if you don not have one already), alignment of 
existing multilingual documents (aligning a text means taking two similar 
texts, one in English and one in French and make their segments - i.e. 
sentences - correspond in order to feed a TM). If you send an HTML Web site 
page, then you'll receive an HTML Web site translated page ; send a pdf and 
you'll have the same pdf translated ; same thing for FM, Word documents, 
etc.

You can also send a .doc and ask for a .pdf, and inversely. Possibilities 
are multiple.

The biggest part your team will have to do is to prepare INSTRUCTIONS as 
regards : layout, products, software (are they translated or not ?), 
copyright, part numbers and revisions (references, same in English and in 
other languages..?), abbreviations (are they translated ..?), etc. The more 
precise the instructions, the faster and the more accurate the translation. 
Be sure to have available internal proofreaders at hand too...

Hope this will help, do not hesitate to contact me for more information.

Cheers,

Mathieu.

Mathieu Jacquet
Raptrad-imagine (www.raptrad-imagine.com)
Toulouse, France


>From: "karyn hunt" 
>To: framers at frameusers.com
>Subject: RE: Framemaker and Translation
>Date: Tue, 06 Jun 2006 19:38:05 +
>
>Another place to bone up quickly: There's a company called Enlaso that does 
>translations. They recently did a Webcast called Translation 101 in which 
>they went over all the basics. I think they have that Webcast stored on 
>their website. I found it tremendously helpful just in getting a broad 
>overview of things to think about, what to look out for, what's involved, 
>etc etc etc.
>
>Karyn
>
>
>
>From: "Ann Zdunczyk" 
>To: "'Diane Gaskill'" ,"'Loren R. Elks'" 
>
>CC: 'Framers List' , 
>framers at omsys.com,swiseman at context.co.il
>Subject: RE: Framemaker and Translation
>Date: Tue, 6 Jun 2006 12:58:59 -0400
>>Loren,
>>
>>I agree with everything that has been said so far. Definitely check with
>>your vendor to make sure that they handle the technology that you are
>>writing about. Some translation houses specialize in different 
>>technologies
>>(Medical, Telecom, Legal, etc.)
>>
>>Trados by the way was based in Ireland and German if I remember correctly.
>>It has now been purchased by SDL.
>>
>>If you have any other questions let me know.
>>
>>Z
>>
>>
>>**
>>Ann Zdunczyk
>>President
>>a2z Publishing, Inc.
>>Phone: (336)922-1271
>>Fax: (336) 922-4980
>>Cell: (336)456-4493
>>http://www.a2z-pub.com
>>**
>>
>>-Original Message-
>>From: framers-bounces+azdunczyk=triad.rr.com at lists.frameusers.com
>>[mailto:framers-bounces+azdunczyk=triad.rr.com at lists.frameusers.com] On
>>Behalf Of Diane Gaskill
>>Sent: Tuesday, June 06, 2006 12:47 PM
>>To: 'Loren R. Elks'
>>Cc: 'Framers List'; framers at omsys.com; swiseman at context.co.il
>>Subject: RE: Framemaker and Translation
>>
>>Loren, all
>>
>>There is a book called Localization and Framemaker that explains the 
>>basics
>>of localization, tells you how to find, screen, and hire the RIGHT vendor
>>for the work you are doing, what you need to provide to the vendor to get 
>>a
>>good estimate for your job, how to work with the vendor, and explains what
>>the vendor can actually do for you. It explains the localization process
>>(what the vendor does with your files) and contains a table of prices that
>>you can use to get a fairly good idea of how much you can expect to pay 
>>for
>>their services. The book is a 24-page pdf file that you can download free
>>from http://www.bapmf.net/resources/2000_localization_FM/locindex.html
>>
>>Note that ALL localization vendors can take a set of FM files and give you
>>the same set of FM files back, translated into as many target languages as
>>you desire.
>>
>>Incidentally, Trados is a company based here in the Silicon Valley, not an
>>application. Trados makes a set of software tools, including the S-tagger
>>and the Translators Workbench, that is the industry standard toolset 
>>today.
>>But it is not the only set of tools on the market and some 

importing Framemaker files into InDesign CS

[Tumpa Banerjee]

Hello,

  I am trying to import some FM files into InDesign CS. I converted the FM 
files to RTF and then did File > Place and placed the content. The problem is 
that the graphics did not import properly (they are chopped and also overlap 
the text in places). Could someone plaes tell me what is a better way to do 
this?

  best regards,
  Ananya

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