Re: Execute Rexx from Cobol
Hah! We had a similar problem a few months ago at my current client; after upgrading to z/OS 2.2, a REXX/ISPF app started bombing. Many moons before I'd written an external exec and called it LOG; its only purpose is to send to the guy responsible for supporting that app (me, I mean) messages under certain circumstances so I could be apprised of problems. Turns out that a new library in 2.2 has a load module named LOG, which was intercepting the old invocation. Easy fix: I just renamed the REXX module and updated the code to use the new name. But it gave me a turn for a few days. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* Jonny snorted. "You mean out among the decadence of the big worlds? Come on, Jame, you don't really believe that sophistication implies depravity, do you?" / "Of course not. But someone's bound to try and convince you that depravity implies sophistication." From _Cobra_ by Timothy Zahn */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Lars Höglund Sent: Tuesday, May 7, 2024 14:27 We had a program called JOBINFO (in allocated STEPLIB) Didn't realize that jobinfo = jobinfo() in a Rexx will trying to start, and maybe executing the cobolmodule We also have a Rexx called jobinfo, and that the one I want to execute. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Mainframe performance tool replacement
I think I'm about to reveal my obsolescence: Where my clients didn't use SAS, they mostly used DYL-280II or QuikJob. Or REXX, of course. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* Jonny snorted. "You mean out among the decadence of the big worlds? Come on, Jame, you don't really believe that sophistication implies depravity, do you?" / "Of course not. But someone's bound to try and convince you that depravity implies sophistication." From _Cobra_ by Timothy Zahn */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of raji ece Sent: Tuesday, May 7, 2024 8:20 AM We have been running with SAS and MICS software to analysis system performance and to produce reports on daily basis. There is a situation to come out of using SAS due to many reasons. We would like to know the alternate product for this SAS and MICS. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Netview
"Also Known As...". --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* I believe what really happens in history is this: The old man is always wrong, and the young people are always wrong about what is wrong with him. The practical form it takes is this: that, while the old man may stand by some stupid custom, the young man always attacks it with some theory that turns out to be equally stupid. -G K Chesterton */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Radoslaw Skorupka Sent: Saturday, April 27, 2024 18:08 "vel" is not Polish. We don't have letter "v". It is latin, so I supposed it is wide known. And yes, it is "aka". BTW: WTF is aka??? :-) Last, but not least: thank you for kind words about my English (I still polish my English :-) ) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
ooRexx forum?
References-in-passing to ooRexx are fine here, I suppose, but if I want to get into details, where should I go to ask questions? The ooRexx documentation mentions www.rexxla.org/forum.html, but that nets me a 404 error. And I looked at comp.lang.rexx (also recommended by the documentation), but it didn't seem to me any of the recent posts there were about REXX, much less ooRexx specifically. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* If you are not being criticized, you may not be doing much. -Donald Rumsfeld */ -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: REXX vs other languages -- EXECIO intuitiveness
Oh, Unix. Sorry, you did say "OMVS", I just didn't pay attention. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* The sad thing for us rationalists is that the vast majority of the human race would rather be told that "two and two is five and make no mistake about it" than "I think it is possible that two and two may be four. -from The Stars in Their Courses by Isaac Asimov */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Paul Gilmartin Sent: Sunday, April 21, 2024 15:02 Not exactly: <https://www.ibm.com/docs/en/zos/3.1.0?topic=functions-rexx-io> --- On Sun, 21 Apr 2024 14:54:33 -0400, Bob Bridges wrote: >Wait, what? Are you saying TSO-REXX has LINEIN, CHAROUT and so on? -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: REXX vs other languages -- EXECIO intuitiveness
Wait, what? Are you saying TSO-REXX has LINEIN, CHAROUT and so on? ...Although I do think EXECIO is nicely flexible. Still, I find myself looking up the syntax occasionally when doing something unusual. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* [Hitler] has grasped the falsity of the hedonistic attitude to life. Nearly all western thought since the last war, certainly all ‘progressive’ thought, has assumed tacitly that human beings desire nothing beyond ease, security and avoidance of pain. In such a view of life there is no room, for instance, for patriotism and the military virtuesHitler, because in his own joyless mind he feels it with exceptional strength, knows that human beings ~don’t~ want only comfort, safety, short working-hours, hygiene, birth-control and, in general, common sense; they also, at least intermittently, want struggle and self-sacrifice, not to mention drums, flags and loyalty-parades. However they may be as economic theories, Fascism and Nazism are psychologically far sounder than any hedonistic conception of life. -George Orwell, reviewing _Mein Kampf_ in 1940. */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Seymour J Metz Sent: Sunday, April 21, 2024 10:40 Given that REXX in an OMVS environment supports ANSI stream I/O, why use EXECIO? --- On Sat, 20 Apr 2024 23:58:18 -0400, Steve Thompson wrote: >I concur about REXX EXECIO I/O is not exactly intuitive. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: REXX vs other languages -- EXECIO intuitiveness
Long before I started using ooRexx, before I even knew it existed in fact, I talked my boss at one company into letting me install a copy of Regina on my company workstation in order to save him some work. It turned out to be an interesting project. Apparently until then someone would occasionally grab a random meg or two of firewall logs and read them into Excel. Then someone else would spend time sorting lines, deleting most of them but keeping all the ones that reported a rejected attempt at sending a packet. The thing is, if a workstation sends ten thousand packets to a single IP address, or to several, it's probably legitimate work. If many workstations send packets to one IP address, likewise work. But if one IP address sends one packet to each of thousands of other addresses, it's very likely a virus looking for other machines to infect. So someone would take all those firewall records, try to parse dates and IP addresses, and come up with suspicious behavior. I heard my boss talking on the phone about this process - I think he said it normally took someone a couple hours - and after he hung up I approached him about a better way. So I took a day or two writing a Regina program which could parse out all those records and produce a CSV of the suspicious actors in a few seconds. After that I was the company virus hunter. I maintained a database, which wasn't too bad, but I also had to run around to various locations to eliminate the problem malware, which was an unwelcome chore. Still, I enjoyed the hunt. And Rexx is really, really good at that sort of text interpretation. (Programming is so cool!) --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* Law #36 of combat operations: Radar tends to fail at night and in bad weather, and especially during both. */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Paul Gilmartin Sent: Sunday, April 21, 2024 01:11 Which Rexx do you use on desktop systems? BTW, is the Regina mailing list active? -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: REXX vs other languages WAS: Rexx numeric digits and scientific notation question
Well, they may not be reserved, if you say so. But I think I'd be a fool to try using "is", "if" or "in" as a loop counter, certainly for the sake of the programmer who inherits my work but I'm sure it would confuse me too. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* When a man is getting better he understands more and more clearly the evil that is still left in him. When a man is getting worse, he understands his own badness less and less. A moderately bad man knows he is not very good; a thoroughly bad man thinks he is all right. This is common sense, really. You understand sleep when you are awake, not while you are sleeping. You can see mistakes in arithmetic when your mind is working properly; while you are making them you cannot see them. You can understand the nature of drunkenness when you are sober, not when you are drunk. Good people know about both good and evil; bad people do not know about either. -C S Lewis, _Christian Behavior_ */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Rony G. Flatscher Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2024 13:51 There are *no* reserved words in Rexx like in many other languages. (This alleviates one to have to learn them by heart. But more importantly, should the language get additional keywords over time they would not break existing Rexx programs that happen to use them already, unlike other programming languages.) > --- On Sat, 20 Apr 2024 11:08:03 -0400, Bob Bridges wrote: >> It was while I was coding in REXX that I tried abutting a variable >> named 'x' with another string, and couldn't figure out why the >> program behaved as it did. Eventually figured out I had >> inadvertently created a hex constant. Maybe as an overreaction, I >> have never since used one-character variable names, always two or >> more. (What do I use for loop counters?, you ask. I use 'j' plus >> another letter; 'jr' for records, for example, 'jd' for days >> whatever. More obvious would have been 'i', but there are too many >> two-letter reserved words even in REXX that start with 'i'.) > I like to use longer names with mnemonic value as control variables > and, if the body of the loop is more than a couple lines, cite the > control variable at the END so the interpreter verifies nesting. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: REXX vs other languages WAS: Rexx numeric digits and scientific notation question
I've inherited a REXX app from a departed coworker who uses (for example)
'complete?' as a Boolean variable name, where in REXX I would use 'fcomplete'
for the same purpose ('f' for "flag"). I see the sense of the question mark,
but I've been coding too many decades; I can't FEEL it. I probably won't adopt
it.
---
Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313
/* Crossbows don't kill people; quarrels do. -from a conversation at a
Patrick-O'Brian listserv */
-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of
Robert Prins
Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2024 16:18
Try the two characters that are pretty much unique to REXX, "!" and "?"
especially for small local loops.
--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: REXX vs other languages WAS: Rexx numeric digits and scientific notation question
Ooh, I'm sure I've read that I can do that but I forgot. I like that - think I'll start doing it myself. Normally I'm rabid about indentation, but occasionally in a longer program I lose track of something and have to spend a of time searching for where I left out an End. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* Do you know what constitutes a "hate crime"? Put your thinking caps on. What tools do we need to determine whether a crime was motivated by hate or prejudice? Answer: We need thought police. -from "See, I Told You So" by Rush Limbaugh */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Paul Gilmartin Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2024 11:41 > I like to use longer names with mnemonic value as control variables and, if the body of the loop is more than a couple lines, cite the control variable at the END so the interpreter verifies nesting. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: REXX vs other languages WAS: Rexx numeric digits and scientific notation question
It was while I was coding in REXX that I tried abutting a variable named 'x' with another string, and couldn't figure out why the program behaved as it did. Eventually figured out I had inadvertently created a hex constant. Maybe as an overreaction, I have never since used one-character variable names, always two or more. (What do I use for loop counters?, you ask. I use 'j' plus another letter; 'jr' for records, for example, 'jd' for days whatever. More obvious would have been 'i', but there are too many two-letter reserved words even in REXX that start with 'i'.) --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* When I was ten, I read fairy tales in secret and would have been ashamed if I had been found doing so. Now that I am fifty I read them openly. When I became a man I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up. -C.S. Lewis */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Andrew Rowley Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 22:41 It doesn't cause a problem except when it does. One danger is a typo in a variable name. When I wrote some complex Rexx I did use SIGNAL ON NOVALUE, but I wasn't totally appeased! --- On 20/04/2024 12:41 am, Rony G. Flatscher wrote: > Rexx defines the value of variables that have no explicit value > assigned to them to be the name of the variable in uppercase, so it > does not cause a problem. (It does cause problems for programmers who > got trained to always make sure that a value is assigned to variables. > This is the reason why ooRexx has an option to activate checking for > the use of uninitialized variables in Rexx programs to appease those > who are not accustomed to it or feel that it should not be allowed. ;) ) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: REXX vs other languages WAS: Rexx numeric digits and scientific notation question
Oh, I dunno. Generalizations aren't invalid as long as you don't mistake them
for blanket stereotypes, and generalizations are the only possible way to
describe general groups. I see no cause for offense here.
---
Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313
/* Be kind whenever possible. It is always possible. -Dalai Lama */
(I swear this was just the next tagline in the queue; I didn't pick it out for
this occasion. Really, I promise.)
-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of
Seymour J Metz
Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 12:54
Why don't you speak for yourself instead of inventing urban legends?
Both old timers and youngsters are individuals, with vast panoplies of
different attitudes and opinions. It is presumptuous and rude to make such
arrogant blanket characterizations.
There are plenty of old timers who like the bleeding edge, and plenty of
youngsters("young fogies") who are resistant to change.
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List on behalf of
David Crayford <0595a051454b-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu>
Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 11:25 AM
I’m not sure I would use Java as a REXX alternative now we have Python. REXX is
very much legacy now. The old timers love it because it’s all they know but
push come to shove Python is much easier to learn then Java with all the OO
cruft.
--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: REXX vs other languages WAS: Rexx numeric digits and scientific notation question
I don't often admit it, because I expect to get flamed for it, but in fact when I write in VBA almost all my variables are type VAR - that is, I hardly ever use the Dim statement to assign a type. To introduce an array, sure, or to maintain correct spelling in the longer var names. But it's rare indeed that I feel the need to specify that a variable is going to be BYTE, STRING or whatever. So obviously, coding in typeless REXX doesn't bother me . --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* This universe is full of magical things patiently waiting for our wits to grow sharper. */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Rony G. Flatscher Sent: Thursday, April 18, 2024 06:30 The mileage of people here vary including the Java people themselves who have started to reduce the need of explicit declarations like the new "var" (imitating JavaScript) instead of strict types or foregoing the static main method such that one can at least code the main method without the explicit declarations. The motivation about these changes is to make Java easier, reduce typing needs and the like. --- On 18.04.2024 02:22, Andrew Rowley wrote: > I find Rexx difficult because explicit declarations and static typing (as > well as tightly controlled scopes) actually make programming easier, in > general. They show up bugs in the code and make it easier to write correct > programs. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: REXX vs other languages WAS: Rexx numeric digits and scientific notation question
This whole post was fascinating me, partly because I'm still a novice at
ooRexx, still wrapping my head around certain concepts (messaging being one
example). I may as well say, though, that when I finally broke down and got
myself a copy, I then took not one hour but two or three days off to read the
documentation before I started writing the program I had in mind. There was so
much more to it than I expected, having believed that it would be simply
TSO-REXX with object support.
Messaging...As I said, I'm still wrapping my head around that. I'm used to
creating classes and then invoking their methods; to use the term "message" in
this connection causes my brain to pause temporarily. So far the only thing
I've worked out is that messaging ~is~ invoking a class' method, that is, it's
just another way of saying the same thing. But the way you describe it, I
suspect I'm missing something.
---
Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313
/* Taxation ~with~ representation isn't all that great, either. */
-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of
Rony G. Flatscher
Sent: Wednesday, April 17, 2024 14:24
ooRexx adds the message expression to Rexx to simplify interactions with any
kind of values. E.g.
instead of coding
say reverse("abc") /* yields a string "cba" */
you can optionally code:
say "abc"~reverse /* yields a string "cba" */
The message expression consists of a receiver value (synonyms: object,
instance) on the left-hand side of the tilde (~), which is the message
operator, followed by the name of a message on the right hand side. If the
message has arguments you would supply them in parentheses.
The receiver is then responsible to search for a method (function) by the name
of the received message, invokes it and returns the result, if any.
This is a quite simple concept.
You may want to take a look at the article
<https://research.wu.ac.at/files/41301564/ISECON23_Flatscher_Proposing_ooRexx_article.pdf>
which introduces Rexx and ooRexx to engineering educators. Reading that
article, any interested REXX programmer from this mailing list should be able
to learn ooRexx in about half an hour!
--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Program to split a jobs output
Triangle? Aren't they the ones who published IOF back around Y2K? Sounds awfully familiar. But that was a long time ago; maybe I'm thinking of a different product. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* Government exists to protect us from each other. Where government has gone beyond its limits is in deciding to protect us from ourselves. -Ronald Reagan */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of David Spiegel Sent: Tuesday, April 9, 2024 20:59 They were going to let it go, but, apparently Triangle Systems bought it in November '23. Sorry for any increase in blood pressure. --- On 2024-04-09 20:28, Bob Bridges wrote: > Ack! When? Why?? IOF was always my favorite, though I haven't seen it in a > decade or two. > > -Original Message- > From: David Spiegel > Sent: Tuesday, April 9, 2024 08:28 > > IOF - But it's going away > > --- On 2024-04-09 08:15, Allan Staller wrote: >> Several commercial products do this . CA-DELIVER, INFOPAC (probably a couple >> of more I am not familiar with. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Program to split a jobs output
Ack! When? Why?? IOF was always my favorite, though I haven't seen it in a decade or two. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* It would be nice to spend billions on schools and roads, but right now that money is desperately needed for political ads. -Andy Borowitz */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of David Spiegel Sent: Tuesday, April 9, 2024 08:28 IOF - But it's going away --- On 2024-04-09 08:15, Allan Staller wrote: > Several commercial products do this . CA-DELIVER, INFOPAC (probably a couple > of more I am not familiar with. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Rexx numeric digits and scientific notation question
Perl...what environment(s) is it available in? My usual coding platforms are z/OS (specifically TSO) and Windows, mostly MS Office. I don't actually know PowerShell; I've been exposed to it, see that it's very powerful for some purposes, and have modified PS scripts in minor ways. In other words my facility with PS is very much like younger mainframers' with JCL. But since I'm supposed to be a security jock, and sometimes have reason to extract data from AD to compare with RACF/TSS/ACF2, I see that really learning PS would be a good thing. As I've probably said here before, I lusted after ooRexx from the first day I heard about it, but at first couldn't see where I'd actually use it; I can't hand ooRexx code to clients, unless they already use it (and no one does). I finally broke down and got myself a copy for a small plain-text-to-formatted-PDF conversion I did for an error manual; I tried converting the plain text to formatted RTF using VBA, but gave it up as a bad job and did it in ooRexx, after taking a few days off to learn what I don't know. (There's a lot more to it than I expected.) Now I use it for automation on my own machine, but that’s all. Ruby -- no, never have. Again, what environment(s) is it available on? --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* When I have a little money, I buy books; and if I have any left, I buy food and clothes. -Erasmus */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Seymour J Metz Sent: Sunday, March 17, 2024 15:14 CLIST will never go away, but I avoid it as much as possible. There is a very limited set of use cases for it, IMHO, and REXX has been my goto scripting language for decades, with a grudging nod to Perl when CPAN can make my life easier. PowerShell suggests that you're not limited to Z, inwhich case it's worth looking at ooRexx. Have you looked at Ruby? From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List on behalf of Bob Bridges <0587168ababf-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> Sent: Friday, March 15, 2024 7:58 PM I can tell you how it happened to me, at any rate. I was a long-time CLISTer, and then one day, back in the mid '80s it might have been, I ran across a warning from IBM that someday soon CLIST might go away and REXX would be the only supported language for system automation (or something like that). I took them seriously - I didn't know at the time that they used to issue that warning periodically - and sat down with a manual to start learning REXX. I quickly realized that it's ~much~ superior to CLIST, and have been an enthusiast ever since. But that needn't stop me from tacking on other languages; I'm not tired of that yet, and I still have ambitions of adding more. Python is better, you say? But can I use it in the TSO environment? If it's only for Unix, I may pass for now. I still work for multiple clients and it seems to me I could usefully focus on languages that the clients are likely to use themselves. That means TSO REXX, VBA and VBS, SQL, assembler, probably PowerShell, maybe PL/1... What else? Seriously I'm open to the next one I should tackle. I keep hearing about Python, Lua, Ruby, C++ and others, but in what environment(s) would I use them? -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Learning one's tools
Boy, ain't THAT the truth!, he says sadly, thinking of an app he didn't write and is now responsible for maintaining. This thing passes multiple values between programs using (if I understand it correctly) a single character string consisting of many assignment statements, which are then parsed and evaluated upon returning to the calling program. Me, I probably would've used ISPF pool variables, but I'm not sure that would be easier to follow. So far I don't mess with it much; it works. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* Every year, on April 15, all members of Congress would be placed in individual prison cells with the necessary tax forms and a copy of the Tax Code. They would remain locked in the cells, without food or water, until they had completed their tax returns and successfully undergone a full IRS audit. Of course this system would probably result in a severe shortage of congresspersons. But there might also be some drawbacks. -Dave Barry's plan to simplify the tax code, 2000-04-09 */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Seymour J Metz Sent: Sunday, March 17, 2024 18:46 Expect the code to be modified by someone with significantly less knowledge of the problem domain, even if they are an expert in the language. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Learning one's tools
I really gotta get back into PL/1. It was my first language, and I still like it. Just haven't used it in a few decades. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* The more sophisticated the technology, the more vulnerable it is to primitive attack. People often overlook the obvious. -Dr Who, 1978 */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Robert Prins Sent: Sunday, March 17, 2024 10:44 I've updated PL/I code myself reducing ***CPU*** time from well over three hours to just 20 minutes, by just changing two declarations, and while working at a Dutch airline company, I reduced CPU usage of two PL/I programs calculating CRCs by more than 99.5%, removing calls to the PL/I library. Hell, if you look at the current Enterprise PL/I Programming Guide, GI13-5620-00, on PDF page 372 (book page 316) in the "Avoiding calls to library routines" paragraph, the text that reads When your code refers to a member of a BASED structure with REFER, the compiler often has to generate one or more calls to a library routine to map the structure at run time. These calls can be expensive, and so when the compiler makes these calls, it will issue a message so that you can locate these potential hot-spots in your code. If you do have code that uses BASED structures with REFER, which the compiler flags with this message, you might get better performance by passing the structure to a subroutine that declares a corresponding structure with * extents. This will cause the structure to be mapped once at the CALL statement, but there will no further remappings when it is accessed in the called subroutine. is almost a literal copy of text in an email I sent to IBM's Peter Elderon close to 30 years ago, and if you use PL/I to build linked lists, and/or trees using BASED storage, I'd suggest you think about the second (area-reference) parameter of the ALLOC builtin function, and the NEXTALLOC builtin, both are the result of my RFEs, and combining them with the EMPTY builtin, well think about it. ;) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Learning one's tools
I suppose code reviews are like post-battle debriefs, in which every choice of the commander is questioned, and when challenged with a better option he can only say "I didn't think of that at the time". It must be extremely painful for the guy in the glare of the spotlight, but if it's done right -- too late to blame anyone now, we're just trying to make sure everyone has a chance to learn how to do it better next time -- it's also extremely valuable. I truly hated having the code reviewers poke at my baby, and at the start of this thread I pointed out ways in which they didn't do it right. But I agree with Shmuel, when done right you might even say they're necessary. (And post-surgical reviews, too. The patient lived, or the patient died, fine, but now we want to know what to do differently next time.) --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* The kingdom of Heaven is not for the well-meaning; it is for the desperate. -James Denney (1856-1917) */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Seymour J Metz Sent: Sunday, March 17, 2024 00:41 However, disagree vehemently about "Code reviews are dumb and not needed by good programmers." The first two things that a good programmer learns are that nobody has a monopoly on good ideas and that "Even Jove nods". Code reviews are like auditors and tech writers: when they are good they are very very good, and when they are bad they are horrid. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Algol
I wonder whether Alan Kay is the author of an article I read during the late '70s in PC Computing; the name sounds familiar. I made copies and kept them for a while, but I've lost track of them now. In that article the writer spoke of teaching students who came not knowing much about computer programming but being strong and certain on one point, that computer people were rigorously logical. Then he had to disillusion them. He mentioned their dismay at learning of the existence of TWO schemes, ASCII and EBCDIC, with different sort results. Another of his points that sticks in my memory is a description of a chip that used 5 bits for instructions and had 32 different instructions. "Maybe it isn't immediately obvious, but that's an error in design. It means that every possible bit combination is a valid instruction, so when your program has an error, the probability of it ending anywhere near the error point is nil." I've often bewailed the loss of that article; many of its observations are still relevant today. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* I know everyone thinks Republicans aren't funny. But if you get a bunch of us together, we can be a real riot. -Nancy Mace at Washington Press Club */ From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List on behalf of Rupert Reynolds Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2024 2:39 PM Alan Kay described computing as a 'pop culture' and I see his point--we don't often learn from history and we often re-invent things and 'solve' problems that have already been solved before :-) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Learning one's tools
No place is all bad. The same company started me, upon hiring, on several days of Deltak courses, one on JCL and one on COBOL. It is to them that I owe a lifelong familiarity with JCL. I wonder sometimes how mainframers get on without it. (Well, "lifelong": It was 1980, so I was probably 26.) --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* A strong conviction that something must be done is the parent of many bad measures. -Daniel Webster */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Seymour J Metz Sent: Friday, March 15, 2024 15:38 That sounds like a hostile working environment. The people doing a code review should know the language and the local standards; nit sounds like they knew neither. From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List on behalf of Bob Bridges <0587168ababf-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> Sent: Friday, March 15, 2024 12:37 PM I once worked at a company that instituted code reviews; a new program would be gone over by a half-dozen coworkers to be sure it adhered to local standards. This sort of thing is always painful to the coder, and nevertheless (I admit reluctantly) can have considerable value if done right. One problem I had with it, though, is that the standards we created for ourselves admitted that there are times when exceptions should be made for special cases, and yet when those cases arose no exceptions were ever allowed; the team invariably flinched, leaned back in their seats and said "no, that's not according to our standards". One particular example always rankled: Whenever someone felt the need to use a STRING or UNSTRING command (I should have said we were COBOL developers), the team always struck it down on the grounds that STRING and UNSTRING are unusual commands and some COBOL coders would be unfamiliar with it. My contention here is that that's absolutely true, and it's the job of the COBOL coder to ~learn~ the STRING and UNSTRING statements, as tools of his profession. I never persuaded anyone to that view, though. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Algol
I did a lot of coding in Algol during my time at a local University in the late '70s. My impression at the time was that it had a serious paucity of built-in functions, but that it enabled me to write my own and make them easily available to my programs. So I stuffed a library full of I/O and string-handling functions and got along just fine, it seemed to me. Haven't encountered it since; I don’t know what advances may have been made in that arena. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* That sort of wit which employs itself insolently in criticizing and censuring the words and sentiments of others in conversation is absolute folly; for it answers none of the ends of conversation. He who uses it neither improves others, is improved himself, nor pleases anyone. -Poor Richard’s Almanack, 1756 */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Rupert Reynolds Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2024 09:07 developing a language which is effectively the best bits (IMHO) of Rexx, C and even older languages such as Algol 68 (much underrated in my book) and hints of PL/1 -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Hmm, 3 ... (Re: Rexx numeric digits and scientific notation question
Surely that's moon-pie and dreamscapes? There's no serious suggestion that that will ever happen, is there? I'm all for it, but don't expect it ever. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* Sometimes you feel like a nut. After a day of working on a walnut farm, you don't. -Mike Rowe of the TV show "Dirty Jobs" */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Rony G. Flatscher Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2024 06:03 A massive improvement for the mainframes were to make ooRexx available on them. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Rexx numeric digits and scientific notation question
And there, I guess, is the answer to my question; no, I can safely stick with REXX for now, and leave Python alone, since Python is limited to OMVS. Maybe someday if I become a serious Unix jock. (The assertion that TSO isn't "modern" doesn't concern me.) I still meant what I said about being interested in tacking on a next language. I hear a lot about Lua these days.... --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* Thousands of years ago, Egyptians worshiped cats. Cats have never forgotten this. */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of David Crayford Sent: Friday, March 15, 2024 20:17 Like what, TSO? I don’t find I need to do that any more as I work in a UNIX shell. Let me flip that around. Can I use REXX to implement the kind of scripting that I do in Python? For example, process a YAML configuration file. We need to do that stuff on z/OS now. CICS resource definitions can be defined as YAML documents, configuration as code and all that stuff. DevOps, Git repos. REXX is a pretty poor language for anything modern. > --- On 16 Mar 2024, at 7:45 am, Jay Maynard > <05997213d6c2-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote: > Can you use, say, Python to implement all the scripting kinds of things you > can use REXX for? -Original Message- From: robhbrid...@gmail.com Sent: Friday, March 15, 2024 19:58 Python is better, you say? But can I use it in the TSO environment? If it's only for Unix, I may pass for now. I still work for multiple clients and it seems to me I could usefully focus on languages that the clients are likely to use themselves. That means TSO REXX, VBA and VBS, SQL, assembler, probably PowerShell, maybe PL/1... What else? Seriously I'm open to the next one I should tackle. I keep hearing about Python, Lua, Ruby, C++ and others, but in what environment(s) would I use them? -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Rexx numeric digits and scientific notation question
I can tell you how it happened to me, at any rate. I was a long-time CLISTer, and then one day, back in the mid '80s it might have been, I ran across a warning from IBM that someday soon CLIST might go away and REXX would be the only supported language for system automation (or something like that). I took them seriously - I didn't know at the time that they used to issue that warning periodically - and sat down with a manual to start learning REXX. I quickly realized that it's ~much~ superior to CLIST, and have been an enthusiast ever since. But that needn't stop me from tacking on other languages; I'm not tired of that yet, and I still have ambitions of adding more. Python is better, you say? But can I use it in the TSO environment? If it's only for Unix, I may pass for now. I still work for multiple clients and it seems to me I could usefully focus on languages that the clients are likely to use themselves. That means TSO REXX, VBA and VBS, SQL, assembler, probably PowerShell, maybe PL/1... What else? Seriously I'm open to the next one I should tackle. I keep hearing about Python, Lua, Ruby, C++ and others, but in what environment(s) would I use them? --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* Sometimes you feel like a nut. After a day of working on a walnut farm, you don't. -Mike Rowe of the TV show "Dirty Jobs" */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of David Crayford Sent: Friday, March 15, 2024 18:41 REXX can indeed be quite tricky to navigate. I recently conducted a session titled "Python for REXX programmers" at work, and during the preparation, I was surprised (although not entirely) by the numerous traps and pitfalls inherent in REXX. When you add to this its absence of basic functionalities like sorting lists, it begs the question: Why opt for REXX when we have a plethora of alternatives available today? The obvious answer may be familiarity, but in our industry, this argument seems rather weak unless you're confined to a limited environment. After all, I wouldn't want to revert to using a 1990s-era flip-top phone, let alone a rotary dial from the 1970s. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: 0C4 error upon calling an external REXX module!
LOL. As my college Greek teacher told me, when I complained about an illogicality - well, he waxed eloquent on a number of points on that subject, but he finished with "...you'll find it a lot easier to learn it than to change it". --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* Sometimes you feel like a nut. After a day of working on a walnut farm, you don't. -Mike Rowe of the TV show "Dirty Jobs" */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Charles Mills Sent: Friday, March 15, 2024 19:31 You're right, but that is the standard Rexx message for any situation where the called module does not return a zero return code (return code as opposed to return string value). "You must have called the routine incorrectly, because it said it was not happy with the call." I agree with you, but Rexx does not, and Rexx counts more than I do. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Learning one's tools
Heh - I just used this tagline in an email to someone else, and it seems appropriate here. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* I find that when someone's taking time to do something right in the present, he's a perfectionist with no ability to prioritize, whereas when someone took time to do something right in the past, he's a master artisan of great foresight. -xkcd */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Seymour J Metz Sent: Friday, March 15, 2024 15:38 That sounds like a hostile working environment. The people doing a code review should know the language and the local standards; nit sounds like they knew neither. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Learning one's tools
My boss at a later job heartily agreed with you, Shmuel. Not coïncidentally, I liked him a lot :). --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* You must ask for God's help. Even when you have done so, it may seem to you for a long time that no help, or less help than you need, is being given. Never mind. After each failure, ask forgiveness, pick yourself up, and try again. Very often what God first helps us toward is not the virtue itself but just this power of always trying again. -C S Lewis, _Christian Behavior_ */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Seymour J Metz Sent: Friday, March 15, 2024 15:38 That sounds like a hostile working environment. The people doing a code review should know the language and the local standards; nit sounds like they knew neither. From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List on behalf of Bob Bridges <0587168ababf-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> Sent: Friday, March 15, 2024 12:37 PM To rant on a related subject, I once worked at a company that instituted code reviews; a new program would be gone over by a half-dozen coworkers to be sure it adhered to local standards. This sort of thing is always painful to the coder, and nevertheless (I admit reluctantly) can have considerable value if done right. One problem I had with it, though, is that the standards we created for ourselves admitted that there are times when exceptions should be made for special cases, and yet when those cases arose no exceptions were ever allowed; the team invariably flinched, leaned back in their seats and said "no, that's not according to our standards". One particular example always rankled: Whenever someone felt the need to use a STRING or UNSTRING command (I should have said we were COBOL developers), the team always struck it down on the grounds that STRING and UNSTRING are unusual commands and some COBOL coders would be unfamiliar with it. My contention here is that that's absolutely true, and it's the job of the COBOL coder to ~learn~ the STRING and UNSTRING statements, as tools of his profession. I never persuaded anyone to that view, though. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
0C4 error upon calling an external REXX module!
We just got done resolving a very odd error, and I spent a lot of time constructing an email in order to ask for help here. We now have spotted the cause, but I hate to waste the work, and the puzzle in case anyone likes puzzles. We just finished upgrading from z/OS 1.14 to 2.2. (I know, the rest comes in phase 3.) A REXX/ISPF app started abending at each call to the external subroutine named LOG. The call looks like this: call log What LOG should do, and used to do, is manipulate the string and send me a TSO message; what actually happened each time looks like this: System abend code 0C4, reason code 0004. Abend in external subroutine LOG. 28 +++ call log self 'Entering' Error running SCR0100, line 28: Incorrect call to routine I added statements here and there trying to get it to give up its secrets but made little progress. The clues I settled on were: 1) 0C4? That's a really weird code to get from a REXX call, isn't it? 2) It says "incorrect call to routine", but the call is ~not~ incorrect; there's only one argument and it's any string value. 3) Since LOG's purpose is to send a TSO SEND message, attention focused for a while on the fact that SYS1.BRODCAST had filled up. But a sysprog determined it had been full for ages, and it had been sending me messages just fine for months, until the upgrade. 4) The TSO SEND command continues to work fine, when I call it from the ISPF command line. 5) The LOG subroutine, too, works fine, when I invoke it from the ISPF command line using the TSO EX command, like this: ==> tso ex 'hlq.library.name(log)','string' 6) I added SAY statements inside the LOG module, hoping to find out exactly where it was bogging down, but none of them were executed. I concluded that it isn't any code inside LOG that's failing, but the call itself; the REXX interpreter's never getting as far as the LOG exec. 7) I wondered whether a new member named LOG had crept into the SYSPROC or SYSEXEC concatenation and was supplanting this one, but no. I commented out all the calls to LOG and everything worked fine. In the end a sysprog checked the linklist and determined that #7 was on the right track; there's a new Broadcom module named LOG. So all I gotta do is rename my LOG module and reïnstate the calls using the new name. But it sure kept me awake a few nights first. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* It is well to remember that the entire universe, with one trifling exception, is composed of others. -John Andrew Holmes */ -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Learning one's tools
To rant on a related subject, I once worked at a company that instituted code reviews; a new program would be gone over by a half-dozen coworkers to be sure it adhered to local standards. This sort of thing is always painful to the coder, and nevertheless (I admit reluctantly) can have considerable value if done right. One problem I had with it, though, is that the standards we created for ourselves admitted that there are times when exceptions should be made for special cases, and yet when those cases arose no exceptions were ever allowed; the team invariably flinched, leaned back in their seats and said "no, that's not according to our standards". One particular example always rankled: Whenever someone felt the need to use a STRING or UNSTRING command (I should have said we were COBOL developers), the team always struck it down on the grounds that STRING and UNSTRING are unusual commands and some COBOL coders would be unfamiliar with it. My contention here is that that's absolutely true, and it's the job of the COBOL coder to ~learn~ the STRING and UNSTRING statements, as tools of his profession. I never persuaded anyone to that view, though. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* Democracy is where you can say what you think even if you don't think. */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Rupert Reynolds Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2024 22:22 There's nothing wrong with 'signal', of course, except that a lot of people reading the code won't be expecting it :-) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Rexx numeric digits and scientific notation question
My problem is that I think of SIGNAL as a sort of careless GOTO. No doubt it's often used that way (and really I have nothing against GOTO, when used in moderation), but since I know it isn't ~exactly~ a GOTO, in practice I don't use it at all because I don't feel I understand exactly what it does. I don't trust it, and I haven't yet bothered to learn to be comfortable with it. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* As a father, I have a vested interest in seeing my children do well in school. If they don't, they won't graduate, and will probably wind up living in my house until they are thirty years old. This will interfere with my plan to reach retirement age without killing another human being. -W Bruce Cameron, _Study Habits_ (2001) */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Rupert Reynolds Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2024 22:22 As a style thing, I'd be quite happy to initialise everything inline once, but if I need to re-initialise then I'd want to be sure everything is the same second time around, so I'd probably use 'procedure expose' to initialise (and 'signal on novalue' as well, to avoid being caught out by different behaviour on the second time around). There's nothing wrong with 'signal', of course, except that a lot of people reading the code won't be expecting it :-) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: bpxwunix
I've a REXX subroutine that uses DFSORT (or is it SYNCSORT?) to sort the stack, but this is easier. But it's gonna work only if I have at least a UID and GID, right? --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* It is always the right time to do the right thing. -Martin Luther King, Jr. */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Steve Beaver Sent: Thursday, March 7, 2024 13:36 /* REXX */ stdin.0=5 stdin.1="KIJJ" stdin.2="KQWR" stdin.3="ADGF" stdin.4="OEPE" stdin.5="VNVV" cmd="sort" call bpxwunix cmd,stdin.,stdout.,stderr. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: 35th International Rexx Symposium in Birsbane (Australia) about to start
Well, let me focus on that one thing. If I can define a class as a cluster of data values and/or subroutines, and instantiate objects in that class, then isn't that "object-oriented" even if it doesn't have any features to define inheritance from other classes? You may think it's a pretty feature-poor example of it, but what else would you call it if not "object-oriented"? --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* In order to write for "The A-Team", you'd have to be a much better writer than most of those who write the evening news at networks and local stations — forget about shows like "Hill Street Blues" or "The Muppet Show", where writing REALLY counts. -Linda Ellerbee in _And So It Goes_ */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Seymour J Metz Sent: Monday, March 4, 2024 15:19 I'ld say that to be OO it must at least have inheritance. ____ From: Bob Bridges Sent: Monday, March 4, 2024 2:30 PM Well, yeah. But a) I'm not far enough into that debate to understand all the issues and distinctions, and b) at any rate "object-oriented" means SOMETHING. As I said, when he wrote "dynamic" I was sure he didn't mean just "lively" or "ever-changing". Heck, I'm satisfied if "object-oriented" means merely that I can define objects and create instances of them. All the other stuff about inheritance and other even more arcane features, they're great, but I wouldn't say a language cannot be object-oriented without them. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Seymour J Metz Sent: Sunday, March 3, 2024 00:33 Actually, there's been a decades long language war over what object-oriented means. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Changes to user's TSO PROFILE
(Although come to think of it I guess PREFIX/NOPREFIX isn't one of the fields recorded in TSS. I don't remember about ACF2 or RACF.) --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* If you have a problem with me, text me. And if you don’t have my number, you don’t know me well enough to have a problem with me. -Christian Bale */ -Original Message- From: robhbrid...@gmail.com Sent: Monday, March 4, 2024 14:34 Protect, no, but since many of the fields in the TSO profile are recorded in the security ID, mightn't they at least track the changes when they occur? -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Lennie Bradshaw Sent: Monday, March 4, 2024 10:22 The TSO prefix is stored in an unprotected control block (the ECT I think). As such, almost any program running in the TSO session can change it. I don't think that any of RACF, ACF2 or TSS can protect you against that. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Changes to user's TSO PROFILE
Protect, no, but since many of the fields in the TSO profile are recorded in the security ID, mightn't they at least track the changes when they occur? --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* Politicians used to understand, without being told, that they didn't necessarily have whatever it takes to fill our lives with meaning. Their job was to fill potholes. -Joseph Sobran */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Lennie Bradshaw Sent: Monday, March 4, 2024 10:22 The TSO prefix is stored in an unprotected control block (the ECT I think). As such, almost any program running in the TSO session can change it. I don't think that any of RACF, ACF2 or TSS can protect you against that. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Steve Beaver Sent: 04 March 2024 15:09 RACF, ACF2, TSS --- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List on behalf of rpinion865 <042a019916dd-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> Date: Monday, March 4, 2024 at 9:40 AM Is there anything that tracks changes to a TSO user's PREFIX? I have a user who says her PREFIX keeps getting changed to NOPREFIX. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: 35th International Rexx Symposium in Birsbane (Australia) about to start
Well, yeah. But a) I'm not far enough into that debate to understand all the issues and distinctions, and b) at any rate "object-oriented" means SOMETHING. As I said, when he wrote "dynamic" I was sure he didn't mean just "lively" or "ever-changing". Heck, I'm satisfied if "object-oriented" means merely that I can define objects and create instances of them. All the other stuff about inheritance and other even more arcane features, they're great, but I wouldn't say a language cannot be object-oriented without them. (Let the flames begin.) --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* The Constitution is supposed to define the powers of the federal government -- authorizing some powers, which are enumerated, while reserving all other powers to the states and the people. This means that the first question we should ask when a new law is proposed is: "Does the Constitution allow the federal government to do this?" -Joseph Sobran, 2001-01-06 */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Seymour J Metz Sent: Sunday, March 3, 2024 00:33 Actually, there's been a decades long language war over what object-oriented means. ________ From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List on behalf of Bob Bridges <0587168ababf-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> Sent: Saturday, March 2, 2024 8:43 AM I'm curious what "dynamic" means in this context. All I can think of so far is "frequently changing", but that doesn't seem to fit; it sounds like you mean something much more specific, rather as "object-oriented" means a very particular thing in coding. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of ronyF Sent: Friday, March 1, 2024 17:45 The 35th International Rexx Symposium in Brisbane, Australia, is about to start with tutorials this Sunday (tomorrow), March 3rd Working with the easy to learn, to read, to use and to maintain dynamic programming language family of Rexx has always been fun and a real benefit and critical success factor. A professional programmer not having a dynamic language in his workbench portfolio can simply not solve certain problems with the ease and speed of a dynamic language. So all static programming language fans, this is an opportunity to get a glimpse of how easy and how powerful a dynamic language, especially from the Rexx family of programming languages, can be! -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: 35th International Rexx Symposium in Birsbane (Australia) about to start
Sounds like more than just an interpreted language, then. But I'm a little confused why (for instance) they include VBScript in that list. What functions does it have that make it dynamic? Not, since you're busy, that I care VERY much. Just mildly curious. Explain if you want, but otherwise, thanks for the information. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* The Constitution is supposed to define the powers of the federal government -- authorizing some powers, which are enumerated, while reserving all other powers to the states and the people. This means that the first question we should ask when a new law is proposed is: "Does the Constitution allow the federal government to do this?" -Joseph Sobran, 2001-01-06 */ -Original Message- From: ronyF Sent: Saturday, March 2, 2024 21:10 being a little bit under time pressure (setting up the tutorials) just a hint: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dynamic_programming_language>. (Note it is missing Rexx or ooRexx in the list of dynamic languages, probably because the authors have never heard of it. Also some of the listed languages are statically typed, Rexx/ooRexx are dynamically typed.) --- On 2024-03-02 23:43, Bob Bridges wrote: > I'm curious what "dynamic" means in this context. All I can think of > so far is "frequently changing", but that doesn't seem to fit; it sounds > like you mean something much more specific, rather as "object-oriented" > means a very particular thing in coding. > > -Original Message- > From: ronyF > Sent: Friday, March 1, 2024 17:45 > > The 35th International Rexx Symposium in Brisbane, Australia, is about > to start with tutorials this Sunday (tomorrow), March 3rd > > Working with the easy to learn, to read, to use and to maintain dynamic > programming language family of Rexx has always been fun and a real > benefit and critical success factor. > > A professional programmer not having a dynamic language in his workbench > portfolio can simply not solve certain problems with the ease and speed > of a dynamic language. So all static programming language fans, this is > an opportunity to get a glimpse of how easy and how powerful a dynamic > language, especially from the Rexx family of programming languages, can > be! -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: 35th International Rexx Symposium in Birsbane (Australia) about to start
I'm curious what "dynamic" means in this context. All I can think of so far is "frequently changing", but that doesn't seem to fit; it sounds like you mean something much more specific, rather as "object-oriented" means a very particular thing in coding. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* I'm not naive about my country. My country is definitely not always right; my country has at times been terribly wrong. But I know this about Americans: We don't set out to kill innocent people. We don't cheer when innocent people die. -Dave Barry, 2001-09-14 */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of ronyF Sent: Friday, March 1, 2024 17:45 The 35th International Rexx Symposium in Brisbane, Australia, is about to start with tutorials this Sunday (tomorrow), March 3rd Working with the easy to learn, to read, to use and to maintain dynamic programming language family of Rexx has always been fun and a real benefit and critical success factor. A professional programmer not having a dynamic language in his workbench portfolio can simply not solve certain problems with the ease and speed of a dynamic language. So all static programming language fans, this is an opportunity to get a glimpse of how easy and how powerful a dynamic language, especially from the Rexx family of programming languages, can be! -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: [Very much off-topic] Re: AI is the real deal.
Speaking of old predictions: /* By 2005 or so, it will be clear that the Internet's impact on the economy has been no greater than the fax machine's. -Paul Krugman, Nobel-prize-winning economist in 1998 */ --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Lennie Dymoke-Bradshaw Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2024 16:58 Sorry, the date has been truncated on the left. That should be 11994. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Allan Staller Sent: 22 February 2024 19:42 The last mainframe will be turned off in 1994 - Gartner Group -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Seymour J Metz Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2024 11:11 AM A 5-year prediction is generally safe, because in 5 years people will have forgotten the predictions. Who remembers the failed 5-year predictions for, e.g., controlled fusion, human level machine translation? I expect it to eventually happen, but as for when, Hypotheses non fingo <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypotheses_non_fingo>. On the flip side, hand optimization for pipelined machines is labor intensive and fragile; a compiler with an ARCHLVL parameter is better suited for the job. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Something keeps releasing space on a large (annual) DS
Ooh, now that's interesting! The content of this file would lend itself
well to compression - all alphanumeric with a few parens, colons and the
like. But what happens when someone needs to view it? Does it compress
automatically or is another step required?
It's not something I can bring up now, because everyone's busy with a z/OS
upgrade. But next month...
---
Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313
/* For Sale: Parachute. Only used once, never opened, small stain. */
-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of
Michael Oujesky
Sent: Wednesday, February 21, 2024 13:49
You might consider SMS compression to reduce the physical size of the file.
If you do, change the BLKSIZE to 32760 as SMS compression writes full tracks
and the BLKSIZE becomes logical (the size of the buffer used in passing date
to/from the application).
--- At 11:44 AM 2/21/2024, Bob Bridges wrote:
>I'm not a sysprog (just a security geek), but I can at least allocate
>datasets, and at the start of this year it fell to me to allocate a new
>dataset in which are logged all changes made in the security system.
>Past year's log are in the 12000-track range, so I started with a
>smaller allocation while I took the time to talk to our sysprog about
>space requirements. It's populated from a daily production job, by the
>way.
>
>When I re-allocated it, on his advice I tried a multi-volume and
>extended allocation (PS-E). Almost immediately the job started
>bombing, claiming that the first four volumes it tried didn't have the
>necessary space to add an extension. The sysprog is puzzled - says it
>should have looked in volumes that DO have the space, not the ones that
>don't.
>
>Second attempt (I don't count the temporary smaller allocation) I kept
>PS-E but dropped the multi-volume requirement. I've never done one of
>those anyway, and don't trust 'em. The system promptly dropped the
>extra tracks I allocated, and a day or two later the job started
>bombing with a B37-04.
>
>Third attempt: Forget PS-E (I'm unfamiliar with that too) and just used
>SPACE=(TRK,(9000,1000)). That seemed to work for a whole week, but I
>just noticed that something, somewhere, has released extra space AGAIN;
>3.4 tells me it's now 1960 tracks and 83%. The job isn't bombing yet;
>some time later in the year I'm guessing it's going to.
>
>Pardon my frustration: WHAT THE HECK IS GOING ON? Why does it keep
>releasing space although I never specified RLSE? The sysprog doesn't
>know either - but he's an external contractor who just took over the
>system a few months ago and if it's something simple he may not be
>aware yet of ... I dunno, something in SMS maybe?
>
>Some wrinkles that may or may not be relevant:
>
>1) The dataset is written using a REXX exec that calculates the DSN by
>reference to the current year. This relieves folks from having to
>update the JCL every year, but maybe something about the way the exec
>does the allocate is causing the problem? I'm guessing not, because as
>far as I now this job has run correctly for years. But just in case:
>
> "ALLOC DDN(CHG$$OT) DSN('') MOD CATALOG REUSE",
> "SPACE(300,30) CYLINDERS RECFM(V,B) LRECL(304) BLKSIZE(27998)"
>
>2) I don't know anything about SMS, but could something there be
>releasing space?
>
>3) What IS extended PS, anyway? I'm told it allows more than 16
>extents, but a) how many more? And b) how else is it different?
>
>4) I allocated the dataset each time using not batch JCL but 3.2 ...
>expecting there's no difference.
--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Something keeps releasing space on a large (annual) DS
I'm not a sysprog (just a security geek), but I can at least allocate datasets,
and at the start of this year it fell to me to allocate a new dataset in which
are logged all changes made in the security system. Past year's log are in the
12000-track range, so I started with a smaller allocation while I took the time
to talk to our sysprog about space requirements. It's populated from a daily
production job, by the way.
When I re-allocated it, on his advice I tried a multi-volume and extended
allocation (PS-E). Almost immediately the job started bombing, claiming that
the first four volumes it tried didn't have the necessary space to add an
extension. The sysprog is puzzled - says it should have looked in volumes that
DO have the space, not the ones that don't.
Second attempt (I don't count the temporary smaller allocation) I kept PS-E but
dropped the multi-volume requirement. I've never done one of those anyway, and
don't trust 'em. The system promptly dropped the extra tracks I allocated, and
a day or two later the job started bombing with a B37-04.
Third attempt: Forget PS-E (I'm unfamiliar with that too) and just used
SPACE=(TRK,(9000,1000)). That seemed to work for a whole week, but I just
noticed that something, somewhere, has released extra space AGAIN; 3.4 tells me
it's now 1960 tracks and 83%. The job isn’t bombing yet; some time later in
the year I'm guessing it's going to.
Pardon my frustration: WHAT THE HECK IS GOING ON? Why does it keep releasing
space although I never specified RLSE? The sysprog doesn't know either - but
he's an external contractor who just took over the system a few months ago and
if it's something simple he may not be aware yet of ... I dunno, something in
SMS maybe?
Some wrinkles that may or may not be relevant:
1) The dataset is written using a REXX exec that calculates the DSN by
reference to the current year. This relieves folks from having to update the
JCL every year, but maybe something about the way the exec does the allocate is
causing the problem? I'm guessing not, because as far as I now this job has
run correctly for years. But just in case:
"ALLOC DDN(CHG$$OT) DSN('') MOD CATALOG REUSE",
"SPACE(300,30) CYLINDERS RECFM(V,B) LRECL(304) BLKSIZE(27998)"
2) I don't know anything about SMS, but could something there be releasing
space?
3) What IS extended PS, anyway? I'm told it allows more than 16 extents, but
a) how many more? And b) how else is it different?
4) I allocated the dataset each time using not batch JCL but 3.2 ... expecting
there's no difference.
---
Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313
/* Law #6 of combat operations: If it's stupid but it works, it isn't stupid.
*/
--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Banks migrate from mainframes to AI-driven cloud tech
"...where mainframes’ resilience meets the agility of cloud computing." What is the "agility" of the cloud, exactly? --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* Always look a gift horse in the mouth. It may have hoof-and-mouth disease. -Bob Bridges, 1977 */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Mark Regan Sent: Friday, February 9, 2024 06:35 https://www.finextra.com/newsarticle/43673/banks-migrate-from-mainframes-to-ai-driven-cloud-tech -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Reading a scratch tape
Been a while since I had to do this, but can't you just BLP? --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* The road to the promised land runs past Sinai. The moral law may exist to be transcended; but there is no transcending it for those who have not first admitted its claim upon them, and then tried with all their strength to meet that claim, and fairly and squarely faced the fact of their failure. -C S Lewis, _The Problem of Pain_ */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Brian Fraser Sent: Wednesday, February 7, 2024 07:34 TS7700 wont read a tape in scratch category, I don't know about Control-M, but in CA1 there is a utility called CTSSYNC to "protect" a scratch tape by altering the cat code back to non-scratch. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Connect:Direct question
Decades ago when I had first discovered the exciting geekery of computer programming, I remarked in a passing group of fellow enthusiasts that this was the most fun I'd ever had in my life. One of them said "Yeah? Would you be interested in a job this fall?" So the Academic Computer Center hired me (just a student job) to a) run a HASP station and b) help other students debug their programs. The latter would come to the desk, all confused: "I ran this program last semester and it worked, but now it's failing and [all chorus it together with me] I DIDN'T CHANGE A THING!". The response is always simple: Well, let's look at the compile errors. And it was almost always right there. This was a PL/C compiler with lots of willingness to guess, so it might say "Stm 53: Missing right parenthesis in column 14". And the student then says "Oh, well, I did change that ONE statement..." The point of this rambling digression is this: If you want someone to help you diagnose your program at a distance, and you say "I keep getting errors", mightn't it be helpful to say WHAT errors? This is kind of basic. Quote them exactly, please. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* To be humble to superiors is duty, to equals courtesy, to inferiors nobleness. -Poor Richard */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Gadi Ben-Avi Sent: Wednesday, January 31, 2024 08:51 I am trying to transfer a file using Connect:Direct from one z/OS system to another. I need to specify both STORCLAS and DATACLAS. This is what I am writing: CPYSEQ PROCESS- SNODE=RTST COPY1 COPY- FROM (DSN=G120NTN.KVTNKSP.UNLOAD- DISP=SHR - PNODE - ) - TO (DSN=G120NTN.KVTNKSP.UNLOAD- DISP=(NEW,CATLG) - SPACE=(CYL,(999,),RLSE) - SYSOPTS="STORCLAS=RKF1 DATACLAS=EXT" - SNODE - ) And I keep getting errors. How to I specify more than one parameter in SYSOPTS. I've tried writing a comma between the parameters with the same results. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: RACF Automation (Cross Posted)
ACF2 has since added full support for RACF-style groups, and some ACF2 shops have made the change to using those instead of UID strings. This was before that, though, and I'm pretty sure they handled it by storing, for each role, groups of UID strings. I don't remember the details of how that worked, but I was their ETL guy and I remember creating lots of mass-import data for pouring into SAM-Jupiter. The problem it is was more than twenty years ago, so it's all pretty fuzzy... --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* It's extremely difficult to distinguish a Canadian from an American. In fact the most reliable way of doing so is to make that observation in the presence of a Canadian. -attributed at the Gunroom to a "British man of letters" */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Jon Perryman Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2024 18:53 It appears that Beta Systems acquired the product and call it Beta-Access. https://www.betasystems.com/en/products/beta-access/ It also appears they removed everything except for RACF support. RACF had groups which made implementing role-based administration easier. ACF2 and Top-Secret have a different architecture which some customer implementations were burdensome to implement within SAM. It also had performance implications. However, it had the benefit for customers acquiring other companies where they could use the same SAF logic regardless of the SAF products being used. It also allowed conversion between SAF products. --- On Thu, 25 Jan 2024 17:51:46 -0500, Bob Bridges wrote: >Back when my client in Ohio installed it, we called it "Sam-Jupiter". > The client seemed content with their choice, although it was really > designed to work with RACF and this is an ACF2 client. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Custom ISPF command
Good point. I do the same kind of thing already with dataset names; I keep a table at each client for my own libraries, and no matter where I go my general REXX library is XG, my JCL library is JG, a scratch data library is DG and so on. There are other abbreviations; XT is the "team" exec library where I put routines that should be available to everyone on my team. No need to think about what I had to name it here; the RENDSN function looks up the alias and returns the correct DSN. Of course I also put shortcuts in there for long-winded names of production libraries that I have to refer to frequently enough. Anyway, yeah, makes sense to do that for command names too. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* No one would talk much in society if he knew how often he misunderstands others. -Goethe */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Mark Zelden Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2024 14:50 2) A common / easy name to quickly invoke a product or some other menu option. For example, I have "shortcuts" like HCD, IPCS, SMPE, ISMF, WLM, ISHell, CA1, CA7, SDsd, TMS (which I could point to CA1 or some other tape management product), IPL (my IPLINFO exec) as some examples. So for #2, I could have many different clients / shops I am working at and no matter which one I always type "WLM" to get to WLM -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: RACF Automation (Cross Posted)
Back when my client in Ohio installed it, we called it "Sam-Jupiter". I don't know what the extra name implies. The client seemed content with their choice, although it was really designed to work with RACF and this is an ACF2 client. Also Sailpoint, but I think you mentioned that possibility already. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* Getting an inch of snow is like winning 10 cents in the lottery. -from _Calvin & Hobbes_ */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Jon Perryman Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2024 14:08 See if SAM (Security Administration Manager) still exists (possibly rebranded). The company no longer exists but I found https://dl.acm.org/doi/pdf/10.1145/266741.266758 which described the product. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Custom ISPF command
I used to add my own commands to the ISPF command table. But somehow I got out of the habit; I went to a new site, didn't get around to it, got used to just putting "TSO" in front of commands, then forgot where to go to do it the other way. Now I can find the command table again, but why? I'm used to the "TSO" prefix, I do it without thinking about it. This, be it known, is an invitation to tell me "oh, but there are other advantages to the commands table...", which I either never knew or have forgotten. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* In order to write for "The A-Team", you'd have to be a much better writer than most of those who write the evening news at networks and local stations — forget about shows like "Hill Street Blues" or "The Muppet Show", where writing REALLY counts. -Linda Ellerbee, _And So It Goes_ */ -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Another Getting away from the mainframe tale
Getting off-topic, here, but I've never felt the lure of the 365 subscription. Maybe it's just because I'm an old fart, but I dislike the idea of using software that they can change when THEY want to. MS Office is the one app I shell out real money for whenever I buy a new PC; the rest of the time I'm happy using shareware, open software and the like. But I want the software in my own hot little hands, not theirs. For the same reason I'd still be using POP3 instead of IMAP, if I could. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* The harder I practice, the luckier I get. -Gary Player */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Steve Thompson Sent: Monday, January 22, 2024 08:55 Along those lines, if you get an office 365 subscription, bundled into this is one-drive. So unless you specifically save documents to a file server or on/in your computer (you do not use a one-drive path) you are using M/$ cloud. And what I have found is, if you turn off one-drive, Word, XL, and others have problems with saving, restoring data. But not if you have them using a file server. ?!? And this means as soon as you create a new spreadsheet/document/powerpoint/etc. you have to do a "save as" to the file server. Now, enterprise users of windows & Office, whole nuther thing. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Another Getting away from the mainframe tale
Yes, Tim, perennially entertaining. A client I did some work for a couple years ago has been working on a two-year project to dump their mainframe for the past six years; they're still plugging away at it. A year ago they got new a new mainframe box which of course involved upgrading z/OS and a bunch of attendant apps. But it turned out that an old app X wouldn't play nice with the new Omegamon, so they had to put the new mainframe hardware on the shelf for a while. I hear they just finished replacing app X, and are now (re)embarked on the project to upgrade z/OS and all the other stuff and take their shiny new mainframe off the shelf. I haven't yet asked my contacts there how this works with their goal of getting rid of the mainframe. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* The worst thing about new books is that they keep us from reading the old ones. -Joseph Joubert (1754-1824) */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Tim Ribble Sent: Friday, January 19, 2024 13:42 Haven't posted here in quite some time but I thought it'd be fun to post another "getting off the mainframe" story. Been working for the City of San Antonio for 25 years now. I started as part of the mainframe staff and that was my primary function until 2009 when it was decided to move away from the mainframe. In the intervening years, my primary function moved to storage/backup systems which made sense for me since I dealt heavily with storage/backup operations on the mainframe and HDS storage. We were supposed to be off the mainframe by 30 Sep 2012 but here we are in 2024 and it's still running production applications. It's just a handful but they're critical. So here I am maintaining both a z/890 & HDS USP-V with no IBM or Hitachi support (just hardware support contracts from third party vendors). I'm now hearing we'll be off of it by Nov of this year. You think I'm going to hold my breath? I may actually retire before it's gone. Anyway, I just thought this audience may be amused by this. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: I hate to be a pain (Cross-Posted)
I gotta plead guilty to this. I know the basickest of basics about Unix security, mostly from reading "The Cuckoo's Egg" multiple times; I've also hit the manuals occasionally, but I'm woefully ignorant and I know it. I guess it helps that I know it, but it'll be better still to learn more. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* I still believe that standing up for the truth of God is the greatest thing in the world. This is the end (purpose) of life. The end of life is not to be happy. The end of life is not to achieve pleasure and avoid pain. The end of life is to do the will of God, come what may. -Martin Luther King, Jr. */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Rick Troth Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2024 11:14 What Itschak said about USS/Unix being unfamiliar to mainframe security teams is reality. Unix and USS matter when you're in a multi-platform environment (where I live). -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of ITschak Mugzach Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2024 08:59 unix file system is less understood and maintained by the mainframe security teams, so the risk is built in uss security (if you do not use external security for this). -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Opinion
Tell me why. I'm trying to visualize, and can't see why curved would make a big difference. I'm interested in being persuaded, though. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 I still believe that standing up for the truth of God is the greatest thing in the world. This is the end (purpose) of life. The end of life is not to be happy. The end of life is not to achieve pleasure and avoid pain. The end of life is to do the will of God, come what may. -Martin Luther King, Jr. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Bill Hitefield Sent: Monday, January 15, 2024 12:38 I have not used that specific monitor, but I do use a curved monitor. Love it! For me, much better than a flat monitor. I was hooked after I tried the first one (a Samsung). > -Original Message- > From: Steve Beaver > Sent: Monday, January 15, 2024 12:33 PM > > Does anyone have an opinion on LG - 49" IPS LED Curved UltraWide Dual QHD 144Hz FreeSync > and G-SYNC Compatible Monitor with HDR (HDMI, DisplayPort, USB) - Black -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Stupid JCL question
Just to be pedantic, aren't ~all~ characters hex characters? That is, they can
be expressed in hex. I suppose (but I'm not sure) that "non-hex character" is
intended to mean a character that can be expressed directly, eg a space can be
expressed as '40'x or as ' '. Whereas a tab character in EBCDIC needs to show
up as '05'x; there's no way to insert it into my data with the character.
('05'x? Yeah, I think that’s right.)
---
Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313
/* ...the director and the writers keep changing the script. The actors will
do a scene, and the director will say, "OK, that was perfect, but this time,
Bob, instead of saying 'What's for dinner?' you say, 'Wait a minute! Benzene
is actually a hydrocarbon!' And say it with a Norwegian accent. Also, we
think maybe your character should have no arms." -Dave Barry, describing his
acting debut in "Dave's World" */
-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of
Paul Gilmartin
Sent: Friday, December 22, 2023 15:48
A likely offender is instream NETDATA, which could have any character, even
non-hex in any position. Most characters are non-hex.
--- On Fri, 22 Dec 2023 15:30:03 -0500, Steve Thompson wrote:
>Oh has that come back to byte people!! (data stream(s) having any hex
>character in any position).
--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Stupid JCL question
Oh, simply because the whole job is 160-something lines. One inserted '//' is a lot less risky than editing that many records, that's all. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* My own idea, for what it is worth, is that all sadness which is not now either arising from the repentance of a concrete sin and hastening towards concrete amendment or restitution, or else arising from pity and hastening towards active assistance, is simply bad. -CS Lewis (1898-1963) */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Jousma, David Sent: Friday, December 22, 2023 12:49 Ok, so how about the obvious response…… Since you are going to edit the JCL to add // or something, why not just comment out or delete the remaining JCL? -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Sri h Kolusu Sent: Friday, December 22, 2023 12:30 Your option works, however, there is another option to make jcl skip steps with enclosing the steps as data. For example, if you had 10 steps and you want only first 6 steps to run then simply add //SAVEDD DATA,DLM=## after step 5 and everything else below it will be ignored . It also will give the flexibility of skipping some steps in between and run later steps too. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Stupid JCL question
Ooh, not bad! At least, it looks not-bad at first blush, though before I implement it I guess I'll wait to see what other comments surface here. Thanks, Sri. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* Freedom of the press is limited to those who own one. -Abbott Joseph Liebling */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Sri h Kolusu Sent: Friday, December 22, 2023 12:30 Your option works, however, there is another option to make jcl skip steps with enclosing the steps as data. For example, if you had 10 steps and you want only first 6 steps to run then simply add //SAVEDD DATA,DLM=## after step 5 and everything else below it will be ignored . It also will give the flexibility of skipping some steps in between and run later steps too. //STEP0100 EXEC PGM=PGM0 //STEP0500 EXEC PGM=PGM4 //STEP0600 EXEC PGM=PGM5 //STEP0700 EXEC PGM=PGM6 //STEP0800 EXEC PGM=PGM7 //STEP0900 EXEC PGM=PGM8 So, from the above example. You code it as follows. //STEP0100 EXEC PGM=PGM0 //STEP0500 EXEC PGM=PGM4 //SAVEDD DATA,DLM=## //STEP0600 EXEC PGM=PGM5 //STEP0700 EXEC PGM=PGM6 //STEP0800 EXEC PGM=PGM7 //STEP0900 EXEC PGM=PGM8 For example, if you want to run steps 1 thru 5 and 8 thru 10 you code something like this //STEP0100 EXEC PGM=PGM0 //STEP0500 EXEC PGM=PGM4 //SAVEDD DATA,DLM=## //STEP0600 EXEC PGM=PGM5 //STEP0700 EXEC PGM=PGM6 ## //STEP0800 EXEC PGM=PGM7 //STEP0900 EXEC PGM=PGM8 -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Stupid JCL question
That's actually how I experimented: Created a couple of IEFBR14 statements. '//' between them caused the second to be discarded; when I added a JOB card after the '//', it executed both of them. I was reluctant to experiment with the real job; it plays with production DSs and takes a while to run. Then "oh, duh!", I thought, and... --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* By 2005 or so, it will be clear that the Internet's impact on the economy has been no greater than the fax machine's. -Paul Krugman, Nobel-prize-winning economist in 1998 */ -Original Message- From: robhbrid...@gmail.com Sent: Friday, December 22, 2023 11:20 Never mind - figured it out by experimentation. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of D alta Sent: Friday, December 22, 2023 11:08 Yes - that will work. You can also test it using a few IEFBR14 steps. Insert // after the first one and you will see that the subsequent steps will not execute. --- On Friday, December 22, 2023 at 11:04:26 AM EST, Bob Bridges wrote: I should know this - I've been using JCL for decades - but I find I'm uncertain about something I haven't done in a while. I have a production job here that will eventually be rewritten, but for now I'm just going to tell it to execute only the first couple steps. I had in mind inserting "//" before the part of the JCL that I want to skip. Very simple. But wait - does the JCL interpreter discard the rest of the job when it sees that empty '//', or does it interpret the rest as the start of a new job? (Since there's no subsequent JOB statement I'm not terribly worried about it, but it's sloppy; maybe I should just use a COND parm on the JOB card.) This info is probably in the JCL ref, but I don't immediately see it. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Stupid JCL question
Never mind - figured it out by experimentation. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* Misers are hard to live with, but they make great ancestors. -from "Money Talk", Jan 2009 */ -Original Message- From: robhbrid...@gmail.com Sent: Friday, December 22, 2023 11:04 I should know this - I've been using JCL for decades - but I find I'm uncertain about something I haven't done in a while. I have a production job here that will eventually be rewritten, but for now I'm just going to tell it to execute only the first couple steps. I had in mind inserting "//" before the part of the JCL that I want to skip. Very simple. But wait - does the JCL interpreter discard the rest of the job when it sees that empty '//', or does it interpret the rest as the start of a new job? (Since there's no subsequent JOB statement I'm not terribly worried about it, but it's sloppy; maybe I should just use a COND parm on the JOB card.) This info is probably in the JCL ref, but I don't immediately see it. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Stupid JCL question
I should know this - I've been using JCL for decades - but I find I'm uncertain about something I haven't done in a while. I have a production job here that will eventually be rewritten, but for now I'm just going to tell it to execute only the first couple steps. I had in mind inserting "//" before the part of the JCL that I want to skip. Very simple. But wait - does the JCL interpreter discard the rest of the job when it sees that empty '//', or does it interpret the rest as the start of a new job? (Since there's no subsequent JOB statement I'm not terribly worried about it, but it's sloppy; maybe I should just use a COND parm on the JOB card.) This info is probably in the JCL ref, but I don't immediately see it. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* "Poor Diogenes; if you knew how to get on with people you wouldn't have to live like that." / "Poor Aristippos; if you knew how to live like this you wouldn't have to get on with people." -a condensation of their respective schools of thought a few centuries BC */ -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Assembler programmer wanted
Sorry, didn't mean to be unclear. I did indeed say "while I am employed by a California company I am a company resource", but I meant it strictly hypothetically; I could equally well have said "if I am employed" etc. Before remote work became more usual I contracted in a lot of states, but never California. Five or so years before COVID I switched over to all remote; I work from home in NC. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* Cheap, fast, good: Pick two. */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Dean Kent Sent: Tuesday, December 19, 2023 11:51 My response was directed at Bob Bridges, who indicated he is in California. In California the 'contract' I was asked to sign is not enforceable, which is why the back page said 'Not applicable to California and Minnesota employees'. Yes, some states have stronger labor laws than others. So, no, in California a company cannot require what it wants - only what the law allows. --- On 12/19/2023 6:27 AM, Seymour J Metz wrote: > In the US it varies by state, but in general the company can require what it > wants. If you refuse to sign, they may negotiate or may refuse to hire you. > Certain contract terms, e.g., yellow dog (non-compete) are illegal in some > states. > > Software is subject to multiple forms of IP protection, e.g., copyright, > patent, trademark, and some open source licenses depend on copyright law. > > --- On 12/4/2023 7:53 AM, Bob Bridges wrote: >> Ok, now you've got me curious. While I'm employed by a California software >> company, I ~am~ a company resource, am I not? How is the law worded to >> bypass that (so to speak)? >> >> -Original Message- >> From: Dean Kent >> Sent: Monday, December 4, 2023 09:48 >> >> California law, to the best of my knowledge, does give the employer >> ownership of an invention/product if it was developed using company >> resources, and/or... -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: SMP/E question of the day
Oops. I have a REXX exec that creates a TSO alias on command, just because I don't do it often enough to remember the syntax at the time. I named it TALIAS. Maybe I'd better find another name...at least I should if I put it in a team library. If it's my own SYSPROC or SYSEXEC PDS I don't guess it matters. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* Most people thought [in 2000] that Web content should somehow be “free,” a hopelessly naïve ideology known today as “dot-communism.”...Dot-communism has been discarded along with its political counterpart, as users find that the adjective “free” means, as it always does, “paid for by someone else,” who insists on getting it back one way or another. -David S Platt, "Introducing Microsoft .NET, Third Edition", 2003 */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Seymour J Metz Sent: Monday, December 18, 2023 13:21 TALIAS gives a name for both target and distribution libraries; DALIAS gives a name for only distribution. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
What is the PDS command?
Long ago I wrote - I'm pretty sure I wrote - a REXX exec that would do a 3.14 search through multiple libraries for a character string. I'm looking for it now, and I find one in my archives that uses the PDS command to do the search. But what's the PDS command? I've a strong suspicion that I wrote this at a client that had a popular CBTTAPE utility, and if so it's not appropriate for my current location. Can someone confirm? If you care, what I really want to do is search through a list of JCL libraries for certain DSN fragments. There's a job we're probably going to shut down, and I want to be sure the datasets it produces are not used anywhere else in production. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* "Bother", said the Borg, "we've assimilated a Pooh". */ -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Assembler programmer wanted (but off-topic)
I'm reminded of a bit from "The Sting", a movie about a big con. A supplier is providing the uniforms and other props for the con, and during discussion the head of the con says "Ok, how do you want to be paid? You want a cut, or flat rate?" Supplier: Who's the mark? Head: Doyle Lonnegan. Supplier (with a disgusted look): Flat rate! --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* Getting an inch of snow is like winning 10 cents in the lottery. -from _Calvin & Hobbes_ */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Radoslaw Skorupka Sent: Wednesday, December 6, 2023 16:07 3. I'm aware of application programmers paid in similar way. However it is exception, not the rule. And usually they are paid "in futures", because the startup cannot afford regular salary. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: CBS's "60 Minutes": Quantum Computing
Ok, I watched it. I learned some things, but I still don't get it: 1) Scott Pelley describes the possible states of a bit (0 or 1), and then says "Quantum encodes information on electrons ... [which] behave in a way so that they are heads AND tails and everything in between. You've gone from handling one bit of information to exponentially more data". Omitting the unfortunate misuse of "exponentially", if an electron can be in all states at once, how can a programmer, or the program, determine what data is recorded on it? I don't see how that can be true; they must be using impressive language to gloss over the details. 2) Michi Okaku likens the difference to calculating a path through a maze. A "classical" computer (his word) must check all possible turnings one at a time. But a quantum computer (he claims) "scans all possible routes simultaneously". I can't picture that, and therefore I'm doubtful; again, I suspect him of blathering about something that he really does understand but cannot describe accurately for a 60-Minutes audience. 3) We're shown a diagram of five Q-bits, and the voiceover says "Unlike transistors, each additional Q-bit doubles the computer's power". That is ~not~ "unlike transistors"; it's exactly what traditional bits do. "It's exponential", continues the voiceover, which, again, is exactly what classical bits are. "So, while 20 transistors are 20 times more powerful than one, twenty Q-bits are a ~million~ times more powerful...". Somebody should have vetted this sequence. 4) Karina Chou (sp?) of Google says their quantum computer is making an error about every 100 steps; they're aiming for one every million or so. Even at that target rate they surely need a lot of self-checking and self-correcting, no? 5) Dario Gill, when the interviewer asked whether programmers have to learn a new way of programming, responds "I think that's what's really nice, that you actually just use a regular laptop, and you write a program - very much like you would write a traditional program - but when you click on 'Go', it just happens to run on a very different kind of computer". I cannot reconcile this with the above nor with other statements being made about quantum computing. It's occurred to me that the whole quantum-computing mania might be no more than a huge hoax. I don't believe it, no. But so far I'm utterly clueless how to understand the claims about it. Regardless, thanks, Mr Sipples. Very interesting. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* Silence promotes the presence of God, prevents many harsh and proud words, and suppresses many dangers in the way of ridiculing or harshly judging our neighborsIf you are faithful in keeping silence when it is not necessary to speak, God will preserve you from evil when it is right for you to talk. -Francois Fenelon (1651-1715) */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Timothy Sipples Sent: Monday, December 4, 2023 23:22 If you'd like to understand why IBM is so bullish on quantum computing - and so focused on quantum-safe cryptography - this "60 Minutes" story is well worth watching: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K4ssT6Dzmnw -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Assembler programmer wanted
Ok, now you've got me curious. While I'm employed by a California software company, I ~am~ a company resource, am I not? How is the law worded to bypass that (so to speak)? --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* A tart temper never mellows with age, and a sharp tongue is the only edged tool that grows keener with constant use. -from "Rip van Vinkle" by Washington Irving */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Dean Kent Sent: Monday, December 4, 2023 09:48 As part of the employment agreement for this acquiring company we had to sign a contract that stated anything we thought, said, did, wrote, or otherwise created - whether at work or at home - while employed was owned by the company[But] State laws prevented them from snatching ownership for most of what they were claiming. California law, to the best of my knowledge, does give the employer ownership of an invention/product if it was developed using company resources, and/or -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Assembler programmer wanted
I think you're both dreaming. If you wrote that program on your own time and then sold it to the customer, you could sell it on whatever terms you and they could agree on, including residuals if that's what you (and they) want. If they paid you to write it, then it's theirs, that's all. ...Unless, as has been pointed out, you manage to make residuals a condition of your employment. If you think you can get your employer to agree to pay you for your time and then pay you again when the program runs, well, feel free to demand that. I'll watch. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* Even Popeye didn't eat his spinach until he absolutely had to. -from Important Stuff My Kids Have Taught Me */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Wayne Bickerdike Sent: Sunday, December 3, 2023 15:08 When a bank runs an EFTPOS transaction, a fee is charged, all thanks to some code. When they run a mortgage amortization program, a debit occurs on a periodic basis. The whole system of direct debits generates a transfer of funds from a customer to the code executor... -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Dave Beagle Sent: Sunday, December 3, 2023 15:07 Incorrect. Every time a program of mine ran, the company saved money and the executives got paid bonuses or salaries (often both) for my work. --- On Sunday, December 3, 2023, 3:01 PM, Bob Bridges wrote: Interesting analogy. But surely there's one obvious difference: When an entertainment program runs, someone gets paid, and residuals mean whoever gets paid (by subscribers, say) has to share the receipts with the writers. But when a company runs a program they own, they don't receive any money for it; it's just work getting done. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Dave Beagle Sent: Sunday, December 3, 2023 14:17 I always thought this was something a union for IT workers would ask for in a contract. Why should actors get residuals every time a show runs and not the programmers every time their program runs? Written programs are every bit intellectual property as a TV program. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Assembler programmer wanted
LOL, the Indians and I would have more work offered to us :). --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* I like what the Roman fellow said: “I think nothing human alien to me.” When I read of a Mao or a Susan Smith, I try to imagine their temptations, not to exculpate them, but to implicate myself. Part of the greatness of Macbeth lies in the way it shows terrible crimes from the inside, without in the least excusing them. -Joe Sobran, Dec 1994 */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Doug Fuerst Sent: Saturday, December 2, 2023 15:37 Maybe we should ask for residuals for our creative property like actors. We give it all away too easily. What would happen if we all went on strike? -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Assembler programmer wanted
Interesting analogy. But surely there's one obvious difference: When an entertainment program runs, someone gets paid, and residuals mean whoever gets paid (by subscribers, say) has to share the receipts with the writers. But when a company runs a program they own, they don't receive any money for it; it's just work getting done. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* Our cause is never more in danger than when a human, no longer desiring, but still intending, to do our Enemy's will, looks round upon a universe from which every trace of Him seems to have vanished, and asks why he has been abandoned, and still obeys. -advice to a tempter, from The Screwtape Letters by C S Lewis */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Dave Beagle Sent: Sunday, December 3, 2023 14:17 I always thought this was something a union for IT workers would ask for in a contract. Why should actors get residuals every time a show runs and not the programmers every time their program runs? Written programs are every bit intellectual property as a TV program. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Assembler programmer wanted
Hey, I didn't say we don't ~want~ better rates. I didn't even say we don't
deserve them (though I might if pressed. I don't use the word "deserve"
casually). I said only that we don't need them - and added that I was speaking
strictly for myself :).
When I was an employee I'd been at the same company for 14 years. Inevitably I
was underpaid, and I say that not as an indictment of my employer, it's just
what happens when you stay at the same place that long. I've been contracting
since then and the money is much better out here. Like a convenience store,
the buyers have to pay more for convenience - in the case of computer
contracting, that would be the ability to send me home for any reason or no
reason ("we decided not to do that project after all"). But they have to pay
extra cash for it. Even after paying my own travel expenses, and even counting
the often-long periods between gigs, I was still better off financially when I
started contracting.
$45/hr? If you're talking about COBOL developers, hasn't the price risen on
them in the last ten years, due to increasing scarcity and no decrease in the
need? I'm not in that market any longer (I do RACF/ACF2/TSS), but it seems to
me I've been seeing $50/hr and up for them.
---
Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313
/* I have a page bookmarked somewhere — but I can't find it just at the moment
— in which a guy fills the screen with details about his [World of Warcraft]
characters, what level they are, what they're doing, where they're doing it,
what they plan to do next, and ending "And now you know how I feel when you
talk about sports." -Dorothy J. Heydt */
-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of
Doug Fuerst
Sent: Saturday, December 2, 2023 18:36
Let me get this right: Companies will pay their lawyers $750 an hour and up,
but the people that write the code to keep their businesses running, that do
the support work to keep those businesses running, us they want to pay $45 an
hour for, and give us a list of skills they want a mile long.
I said this facetiously originally, but what I just said is unfortunately the
truth. You all took it seriously, so there it is. Seriously.
Lately, the numbers are back to pre-Covid. Thankfully, I don't have much time
left in this business. By that time, ChatGPT will be fixing it all. I'll be on
the golf course. So far, ChatGPT can't swing a golf club.
-- Original Message --
>From "Bob Bridges"
Date 12/2/2023 16:51:46
>Again, I'm speaking only for myself, but I definitely think we DON'T "need"
>better terms. I have a great job that pays me more money than I spend for
>doing what I wanted to do anyway.
>
>(Not that I'd insist on giving back some of it if folks insist on
>offering more. But I don't want to ride the edge of client resentment.
>If they're gritting their teeth and thinking "Boy, he'd better be worth
>it!" the day I come aboard, I'm already behind. Better they should
>feel superior at having gotten me for less than they were willing to
>pay.)
>
>-Original Message-
>From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On
>Behalf Of Doug Fuerst
>Sent: Saturday, December 2, 2023 16:37
>
>We need a better union. Maybe Fran Drescher is available. Actors have better
>terms. Former Nanny's apparently can get them.
>
>We need better terms.
--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Assembler programmer wanted
Again, I'm speaking only for myself, but I definitely think we DON'T "need" better terms. I have a great job that pays me more money than I spend for doing what I wanted to do anyway. (Not that I'd insist on giving back some of it if folks insist on offering more. But I don't want to ride the edge of client resentment. If they're gritting their teeth and thinking "Boy, he'd better be worth it!" the day I come aboard, I'm already behind. Better they should feel superior at having gotten me for less than they were willing to pay.) --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* As a general rule, people marry most happily with their own kind. The trouble lies in the fact that people usually marry at an age where they do not really know what their own kind is. -Robertson Davies */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Doug Fuerst Sent: Saturday, December 2, 2023 16:37 We need a better union. Maybe Fran Drescher is available. Actors have better terms. Former Nanny's apparently can get them. We need better terms. -- Original Message -- >From "Mike Schwab" Date 12/2/2023 16:11:33 PM >If you wrote it while employed or under hourly contract its a work for >hire and company owns. If paid for a finish product or during off duty >time you have the copyright and resellable, but strongly suggested to >incle the copyright assignment in the sales contract. > >--- On Sat, Dec 2, 2023 at 2:37 PM Doug Fuerst wrote: >> Maybe we should ask for residuals for our creative property like actors. >> We give it all away too easily. >> >> What would happen if we all went on strike? >> >> Interesting thought -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Assembler programmer wanted
Can't speak for anyone else, but I usually just take (or turn down) the first offer, mostly I think out of poor self-image. Not sure why, because I don't mind dickering over a car. The only exception I can remember off-hand is when a consulting company that employed me was looking to cut costs, and asked that I go independent and start invoicing them rather than being a W-2. They offered me the same rate I'd been making as an employee, which wasn't going to work for me if they stopped paying me for bench time. But mostly I say "$65/hr? Yeah, I can do that". Shameful, I know. This, by the way, is one of those differences I had in mind when I said Yankee and Indian recruiters approach the negotiation differently. American companies have a definite range in mind and aren't usually shy about stating it in the opening email. (Although I wouldn't be surprised if they give the lower part of the range, knowing they can raise it if they run across a really attractive candidate.) Indian companies don’t usually state the range up front; instead I see "please send us your resume and your lowest rate...". Different assumptions about the way the process should work, I suppose. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* The cure for boredom is curiosity. There is no cure for curiosity. -Dorothy Parker */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Seymour J Metz Sent: Saturday, December 2, 2023 13:05 How many programmers negotiate when a recruiter contacts them with a lowball offer, and how many just move it to the circular file? When I'm looking for people, I don't want to scare away good candidates with an offer that might offend them; I ask "What are you looking for?". From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List on behalf of Bob Bridges Sent: Saturday, December 2, 2023 12:01 AM On the other hand maybe it's just a negotiating tactic. There are several differences in the way Indian and Yankee recruiters approach me (and I assume everyone else too); maybe lowballing is just one of the ways they're used to doing business, with the assumption that they'll have to go higher to actually close the deal. ...$125/hr, really? I should maybe pay more attention to the advice a fellow contractor gave me a couple decades ago. I was working for ... well, apparently you would regard it as peanuts although it's always been adequate for me. But Joe said I should demand $250/hr. I'd work only about a third of the time, but since that's about three times what I typically was getting, it would come out even - and in the slack periods I could work on some saleable project. I understood what he was saying; I just couldn't find a way to say "$250/hr" with a straight face. Maybe that's a common foible. My ex made really high-end decorated cakes, the sort that we saw going for $150 and up at state fairs; but she couldn't bring herself to ask more for her work than the cost of materials. She just couldn't believe her work was worth it. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Tony Harminc Sent: Friday, December 1, 2023 17:37 I interpreted Bob's comment "...I think the rate is unusual; I'm guessing they don't think they can get one of their regulars to do it." as meaning he thought it (60-65 $/hr) was high. But I agree that finding someone with serious assembler chops for that price isn't going to be easy. $65/hour sounds much more like an all-in employee-with-benefits kind of rate back-calculated from a salary. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Farley, Peter Sent: Friday, December 1, 2023 16:31 Agreed, very low. I asked for and received $125/hr back in 1999 for a complex assembler consulting job (BTAM / BDAM / multitasking / etc). With inflation and time passing the starting rate for that kind of work has to go over $200/hr at the very least to attract anyone with the talent and experience. If it is a truly junior position though, say maintaining and perhaps documenting old single-function utility ASM subroutines, that might not be a terrible starting point to negotiate upwards. Anything more complicated than that, start the negotiation higher, or much higher depending on the actual work to be done. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Mike Shaw Sent: Friday, December 1, 2023 16:15 Gotta be low... -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Gord Tomlin Sent: Friday, December 1, 2023 15:24 --- On 2023-12-01 14:14 PM, Bob Bridges wrote: Pure curiosity: unusually low or unusually high? -Original Message- From: robhbrid...@gmail.com Sent: Friday, December 1, 2023 14:14 I have a req here from Enterprise solutions for an assembler programmer, paying "60-
Re: Assembler programmer wanted
What I actually meant is "high for this recruiter". Enterprise Solutions has mostly Indians working their phones, and I expect they hire mostly Indian contractors for low rates. I've never worked for them so I may be doing them an injustice. But the few times I've talked to one of theirs on the phone, I heard plenty of other voices on other phones in the background, so I picture a large collection of desks in an open room with no cubicle walls. And usually they're talking lower rates, although it's mostly for COBOL developers. On the other hand maybe it's just a negotiating tactic. There are several differences in the way Indian and Yankee recruiters approach me (and I assume everyone else too); maybe lowballing is just one of the ways they're used to doing business, with the assumption that they'll have to go higher to actually close the deal. ...$125/hr, really? I should maybe pay more attention to the advice a fellow contractor gave me a couple decades ago. I was working for ... well, apparently you would regard it as peanuts although it's always been adequate for me. But Joe said I should demand $250/hr. I'd work only about a third of the time, but since that's about three times what I typically was getting, it would come out even - and in the slack periods I could work on some saleable project. I understood what he was saying; I just couldn't find a way to say "$250/hr" with a straight face. Maybe that's a common foible. My ex made really high-end decorated cakes, the sort that we saw going for $150 and up at state fairs; but she couldn't bring herself to ask more for her work than the cost of materials. She just couldn't believe her work was worth it. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* Important safety note: If you are explosively decompressed to vacuum, open your mouth and exhale immediately. (Fortunately, screaming in terror has just this effect.) -Geoffrey Landis and S J Van Sickle on sci.space.tech */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Tony Harminc Sent: Friday, December 1, 2023 17:37 I interpreted Bob's comment "...I think the rate is unusual; I'm guessing they don't think they can get one of their regulars to do it." as meaning he thought it (60-65 $/hr) was high. But I agree that finding someone with serious assembler chops for that price isn't going to be easy. $65/hour sounds much more like an all-in employee-with-benefits kind of rate back-calculated from a salary. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Farley, Peter Sent: Friday, December 1, 2023 16:31 Agreed, very low. I asked for and received $125/hr back in 1999 for a complex assembler consulting job (BTAM / BDAM / multitasking / etc). With inflation and time passing the starting rate for that kind of work has to go over $200/hr at the very least to attract anyone with the talent and experience. If it is a truly junior position though, say maintaining and perhaps documenting old single-function utility ASM subroutines, that might not be a terrible starting point to negotiate upwards. Anything more complicated than that, start the negotiation higher, or much higher depending on the actual work to be done. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Mike Shaw Sent: Friday, December 1, 2023 16:15 Gotta be low... -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Gord Tomlin Sent: Friday, December 1, 2023 15:24 --- On 2023-12-01 14:14 PM, Bob Bridges wrote: Pure curiosity: unusually low or unusually high? -Original Message- From: robhbrid...@gmail.com Sent: Friday, December 1, 2023 14:14 I have a req here from Enterprise solutions for an assembler programmer, paying "60-65 $/hr" on corp-to-corp. Anyone wanted a copy, let me know and I'll pass it on. I've never done business with this recruiter but I think the rate is unusual; I'm guessing they don't think they can get one of their regulars to do it. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Assembler programmer wanted
I have a req here from Enterprise solutions for an assembler programmer, paying "60-65 $/hr" on corp-to-corp. Anyone wanted a copy, let me know and I'll pass it on. I've never done business with this recruiter but I think the rate is unusual; I'm guessing they don't think they can get one of their regulars to do it. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* anti-evolutionists [in 1925 Tennessee] were fearful that a scientific idea would undermine religious belief. Today, pro-evolutionists are fearful that a religious idea will undermine scientific belief. The former had insufficient confidence in religion; the latter insufficient confidence in scienceEach tells us something important about where we stand in the universe, and it is foolish to insist that they must despise each other. -Neil Postman, "The End of Education" */ -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: SSL Error
I am neither an IBM enthusiast nor an IBM basher, but I quickly admit, when it comes up, that they write the best documentation in the world and give lousy customer service. CA is the opposite; their documentation needs a LOT of work, but they're amazingly responsive when I need a behavior explained. (I say "CA" but it should be Broadcom now. Hard to predict how the purchase will affect their documentation and/or customer service.) --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* No one would talk much in society if he knew how often he misunderstands others. -Goethe */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Roberto Halais Sent: Thursday, November 30, 2023 08:15 Error found. The certificate had to have the DEFAULT( YES) parameter specified in our CA TOP SECRET environment. Man, are those messages misleading. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: PC Interference from shredder Was: Kinda fun
This is why I have some sympathy for the military guys who have to decide what knowledge to classify. We're told all the horror stories about stupidly-held secrets that don't need to be secrets, and it isn’t that I don't believe them. And the boundaries of one military airfield may not be that big a deal. But sometimes really important secrets can be noodled out from seemingly innocent data, and knowing that one can't foresee all the problems must keep those guys up at night. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* Space isn't remote at all. It's only an hour's drive away, if your car could go straight upward. -Sir Fred Hoyle */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Paul Gilmartin Sent: Sunday, November 12, 2023 08:56 A co-worker had worked for the FAA at a commercial airport near a military airfield. Military controlled its airspace; airport controlled its. He made a scatter plot of where planes vanished from civilian control, thinking it might be useful..He showed it to a military colleague who was aghast that the boundary of military control, classified, was publicly available. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Kinda fun
Hah! A few years ago I had my hardware-geek son build my latest tower PC. It's pretty good - not water-cooled like the one he made for himself, but a nice big monitor and I finally gave him permission to load me up on RAM. But ... Do normal commercial PCs have Faraday cage around them, or something? I can't use my old paper shredder any more, because when it fires up within the same room, the PC suddenly dies and has to be rebooted. A minor EMP, I take it. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* The will to win is not nearly as important as the will to prepare to win. -R.M. Knight */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Leonard D Woren Sent: Saturday, November 11, 2023 02:12 Long ago I was told why my shop didn't carpet the tape storage area. Apparently some shop that did had a problem with unreadable tapes. Eventually they figured out that all the unreadable tapes were on the bottom row of the tape storage. And the outside cleaning people used a vacuum cleaner... --- Bob Bridges wrote on 11/8/2023 6:56 AM: > /* The more sophisticated the technology, the more vulnerable it is to > primitive attack. People often overlook the obvious. -Dr Who, 1978 */ -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Subject: Re: Kinda fun
Diagonal line, I never thought of that! But I only just now realized why a dropped deck was never much of an issue for me. (I'm slow.) I was, as I said, a $HASP operator - but a) the social-scientist geeks who brought in large boxes of cards didn't care about the order, and anyway I never happened to drop a box. And b) whatever I wrote myself was as a student, and student assignments just don't get that long - 50 cards at most, unlike the stuff I write professionally. I'm just not old enough to have used cards on the post-college jobs. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* Wear your learning, like your watch, in a private pocket, and do not pull it out and strike it merely to show you have one. If you are asked what o'clock it is, tell it, but do not proclaim it hourly and unasked, like the watchman. -Lord Chesterfield */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of billogden Sent: Friday, November 10, 2023 16:51 I used 026, 029, and 129 machines. (And the 010 machines; remember those!) Never bothered me, but I agree with the comment that their use (and punched cards in general) encouraged me to be much more careful with my "on paper" programming before starting to punch cards. Dunno how to translate this "feeling" into the modern world where we start typing (on a graphics screen) before we have finished deciding how the program "should" work. Times certainly change. Also as mentioned, I quickly found it was better to do my own keypunching! I had lots of "hands on" on 1620s, 1401s, 1410s, and 7040s. (I used 7090s and 7094s, but not "hands on"!) Being ancient and over the hill, I cannot remember how I worked with our 1130s and 1800s (and 1500s, if you remember those). I remember paper tape on one of the 1620s and I hated it! Trying to make modern sense of this discussion (if possible) I can see where starting to type before most of the thinking process is complete can lead to a "liking" for interpreted languages --- where at least some of the error messages occur at the typing stage --- instead of much later times that occur long after the keypunching stage! In a sense, it often seems that some of our "modern" techniques have eliminated inspecting compiler listings. ... Why sequence numbers? Like many of us, I used a carefully drawn diagonal line (with a "magic marker") across the top of the card deck as a useful restoration tool when I dropped the deck! -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Kinda fun
That beats me; the best I can do is some time in the late '80s. I read about an extension to an app we used, and sent off for it. It came in the form of a card deck, and I had to ask around to find any old card reading we might still have. There was one in one of our factories in VA, so I sent it off there in the inter-office mail and they read it in for me. Then had to link-edit it, of course. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* ...the value we have given to [the word "Puritanism"] is one of the really solid triumphs of the last hundred years. By it we rescue annually thousands of humans from temperance, chastity and sobriety of life. -advice to a tempter, from The Screwtape Letters by C S Lewis */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of David L. Craig Sent: Friday, November 10, 2023 04:07 In the 21st Century, I encountered an IOCP deck for a 3081 at a shop that shall remain nameless. I'll guess it was prepared ~1985. --- On 23Nov08:1703+, Schmitt, Michael wrote: > What's the latest that people still used punched cards and/or paper tape? -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Kinda fun
I'm trying to remember, 'cause I was a $HASP operator, briefly, back in college. Let's see, that was a drum printer (not a chain). But why would the hood be pushed up when it ran out of paper? I can't picture what would be going on there. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* If you think health care is expensive now, wait until you see what it costs when it is free! -P J O'Rourke */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Cameron Conacher Sent: Wednesday, November 8, 2023 10:38 Anyone else recall…. Have the HASP operator read your JOB Deck, Walking over to the printer to collect your output Waiting for the output, and setting your card deck on the printer The printer running out of paper and the hood rises up Your card deck is spilled all over the floor -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Kinda fun
Let's see, how many nanoseconds is that again? (Sorry, I'll go sit in a corner now.) --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* Men know what they want. If they're in a bicycle store, they ask the question, "which one is the best?" And that's the one they want. If they are in the chainsaw store, they want the best chainsaw. You never see a man holding a chainsaw and frowning, saying, "I can't decide. Maybe what I want instead is a guppy." -from _Why Men Don't Shop_ by W Bruce Cameron */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Allan Staller Sent: Wednesday, November 8, 2023 09:31 A similar story at Hughes Aircraft up until the mid 90's. One (1) user insisted on use of punched cards. This is in pre-ficon days. Unfortunately, the data center did not have the cojones to charge the user. The day he retired, the project was initiated to remove the keypunches and disconnect the 2503(?) card/reader punch. In those days, the limit on bus/tag cables was 200 ft (cumulative). IIRC, that particular block multiplexer was running about 190 ft. De-installing the 2503 saved about 125 ft. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Kinda fun
Reminds me of an old tagline: /* The more sophisticated the technology, the more vulnerable it is to primitive attack. People often overlook the obvious. -Dr Who, 1978 */ And also, come to think of it: /* It is important to realize that any lock can be picked with a big enough hammer. -Sun System & Network Admin manual */ --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Rick Troth Sent: Wednesday, November 8, 2023 09:50 One great thing about punched cards (and printed paper, and even such things as paper tape) is that they don't suffer degaussing or other such high-tech ailments. (They have their own /different/ problems.) Cards and printed paper are even human readable. Wow. Let's hear it for low tech and old tech! -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: SORT Help with JFY and SQZ
Since listserv emails are always plain-text (well, at least in my experience), there's no way for you to control the font used at the other end. All you can send are the text characters; the recipient controls what font is used for plain-text emails. For just the reasons you're thinking of I tell my client to display plain-text emails in a fixed-spacing font*, so I looked at the below and thought "what formatting issues? Looks fine to me". I don't understand why everyone doesn't do that. * It's Consolas, because it's the only one I see that slashes zeroes. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* Science is a way of trying not to fool yourself. -Richard Feynman */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Don Johnson Sent: Wednesday, November 8, 2023 09:04 Good morning! I am trying to do what I thought was a simple SORT Copy function to create some commands from an input file, but I am being thwarted by embedded blanks in my line. Here is the input (Sorry for the formatting issues, I am not sure how to post fixed-space text): +1+2+3+4+5+6+7+8+9+- > 400 B400-DATABASE 1001 BRN B400-BRANCH-BLDG >(1001) T > 400 B400-DATABASE3 HST B400-TRANHIST >(0003) H > 400 B400-DATABASE4 HST B400-TRANHIST >(0004) H > 400 B400-DATABASE5 HST B400-TRANHIST >(0005) H -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Kinda fun
Yes!, that's it. Thanks. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* Every now and then go away, have a little relaxation, for when you come back to your work your judgment will be surer. Go some distance away because then the work appears smaller and more of it can be taken in at a glance and a lack of harmony and proportion is more readily seen. -Leonardo Da Vinci */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Phil Smith III Sent: Wednesday, November 8, 2023 09:11 Bob, your musing about communications parameters sounds like full/half duplex. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Kinda fun
Ok, Shmuel, I'm curious. Dropped decks are the only reason I ever heard, back when I was a $HASP operator. What's the more important reason? (Mostly when customers brought huge decks of cards, two or three or four boxes sometimes, each card was a single row of a database, so the order didn't necessarily matter. But with program code, sure.) --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* You know you've had too much coffee when Juan Valdez names his donkey after you. You've worn out the handle on your favorite coffee mug. Your eyes stay open when you sneeze. */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Seymour J Metz Sent: Wednesday, November 8, 2023 07:26 People were using sequence numbers for editing before SPF. Dropped decks is but one of several reasons, and, IMHO, not the most important. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Kinda fun
Sure. And as my dad used to tell me, "Sure, you can do it; but if you make a mistake I'll get mad at you, but if I do it myself and make a mistake, I'll only be mad at myself". So I like coding my own statements, even aside from it being quicker. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* It is not fatigue simply as such that produces anger, but unexpected demands on a man already tired. Whatever men expect, they soon come to think they have a right to; the sense of disappointment can, with very little skill on our part, be turned into a sense of injury. -advice to a tempter, from The Screwtape Letters by C S Lewis */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Seymour J Metz Sent: Wednesday, November 8, 2023 07:07 I found that it took less time to punch my own programs than to have the keypunch operators do it; as you noted, errors. The same applies to typing once I had access to FORMAT and, later, SCRIPT. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Kinda fun
My old boss sent me a pack of 50 blank punch cards for Christmas a few years ago, just as a sort of gag gift. He says he uses them for shopping lists and such. I'd probably be more inclined to keep them as bookmarks, except I already use old business cards for that. But I thought it was an interesting idea and went to eBay to see what I could get them for. My buss must have a source of his own, because the last I looked people are trying to sell old punch cards for $100 for a pack of 50, or even $10 for just one. They're antiques, now! Yeah, here we go: $11 Canadian for one. US$19.45 for 15. $26.69 for 40. Like that. Here's a test question for youngsters: Why do they "boot" a computer? Where does that term come from? I'm guessing most of them will assume it's a sort of joke, that you have to kick a computer to get the ol' clunker going, like "percussive maintenance" on a TV. Oops, an old-style CRT TV, I mean, of course, which I suppose is another thing that doesn't exist any more. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* An education isn't how much you have committed to memory, or even how much you know. It's being able to differentiate between what you know and what you don't. -Anatole France */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Schmitt, Michael Sent: Tuesday, November 7, 2023 16:57 The card punch machines I used would punch each character as you typed it, rather than buffer and punch card at the end of the line. So, you had to type *perfectly*. A single mistake meant throw out the card. Or save it for bookmarks and grocery lists. I like to ask the new people I work with "Why does ISPF maintain sequence numbers in source?" (or JCL, sysin members, etc.). Not one answers "so you can put your punched card deck back in order when you drop it". (They also don't know why old programs, and JCL, is all upper case.) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Kinda fun
That WAS fun! I preceded that author by, I think, barely a year; I waffled around, changed majors twice (Religion, then Music, then Accounting), and reluctantly took one computer-programming class (PL/C) in the summer of 75. It was NOT boring, it was incredibly cool and I was instantly hooked. Punch cards didn't seem onerous to me because I hadn't yet imagined anything better. I learned the technical tricks of the 029 (I don't know, there must have been some, no?), then learned how much better the 129 was and thought it was 'way cooler. When not doing homework I sat at a teletype, taught myself Basic and FORTRAN, and saved my work on paper tape. My fiancée resented the inordinate amount of time I spent amusing myself writing useless games and utilities just because I could. I finished my degree in Accounting but went straight into programming jobs after graduation. It was a long time before I stopped using my flowcharting template, and years more before I stopped feeling guilty about coding on the fly without flowcharting first. So, yeah, I'm happy not to use punch cards now, but I didn't think to dislike them then. I'm even happier not to have to plug a phone handset into a modem - but at the time, typing up my long, long letters electronically and sending them over a modem to my best friend at the other end of the country was an enormous improvement over sitting at my desk and writing them out with a fountain pen. And while we're on the subject, anyone else remember having to establish communication parms over a modem? You had to agree with the other end about parity bits, and about some kind of echo that I'm pretty sure we called "single" or "double" something. Single was when my own terminal displayed the key I typed immediately; "dual" or "double" was when it waited until it was echoed back from the other end. The lag was the downside of double; the advantage was that I could see what character actually made the trip across the chancy phone lines, and could correct errors more reliably. What was that called? I forget. Oh, and the modem protocols: XMODEM, YMODEM, Kermit and the like. I remember when I first got a 2400-baud modem; it transferred text so blindingly fast that I almost couldnt read the text as it scrolled on my screen! For the first time it might be practical to send a 100K file, if you could spare an hour or two! --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* It's extremely difficult to distinguish a Canadian from an American. In fact the most reliable way of doing so is to make that observation in the presence of a Canadian. -attributed at the Gunroom to a "British man of letters" */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Phil Smith III Sent: Tuesday, November 7, 2023 16:18 https://blog.computationalcomplexity.org/2023/11/in-bad-old-days-we-had-punc hcards-how.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Does IBM file manager let you access panvalet
Yep, my very first gig when I went into contracting: The client (an insurance company in Baltimore, now defunct I've heard) got mad at CA's predatory pricing and decided to dump ~all~ their products in favor of various competitors: tape management, scheduling, report archiving et al. My part was to crack the manuals on all the new products and figure out what rules (in ACF2, this was) would be required to make the new products act approximately like the old. I heard later that six months after I finished, they kissed and made up. Sounds like a lot of wasted money to me. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* When you want to test a stream's depth, don't use both feet. -Chinese proverb */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Allan Staller Sent: Tuesday, October 24, 2023 08:09 That is not an option I would undertake. Last I heard both Panvalet and Endeavour are both CA (Compuware) which is what prompted the bill, And the question in this thread. My opinion is that BMC is behaving like the CA of the late 80's, early 90's. How many installations decided to dump CA at that time? My USD $0.02 worth. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Attila Fogarasi Sent: Tuesday, October 24, 2023 4:07 AM Your other option is to convert Panvalet to Endevor (easy to do as Endevor supports the 10 character names that Panvalet has). Either way it wll be much cheaper than BMC. --- On Tue, Oct 24, 2023 at 2:15 PM Brian Westerman < brian_wester...@syzygyinc.com> wrote: > Does IBM file Manager let you access (i.e. browse) Panvalet datasets > like the old Compuware File-aid product? One of our clients is > getting a huge bill from BMC (they bought Compuware), and they are > thinking about replacing File-Aid with IBM File Manager. One of the > things they use File-Aid for is to read Panvalet (they don't have the > panvalet ISPF panel option). I jsut want to make sure that File > Manager has no issues with reading the panvalet datasets similar to how > file-aid does it. > > I have File-Manager here, but I don't have Panvalet so I can't tell if > they are compatible. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Israel
"Politics"? Off-topic, yes (mostly, not entirely). Haven't heard a word of politics yet. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* The road to the promised land runs past Sinai. The moral law may exist to be transcended; but there is no transcending it for those who have not first admitted its claim upon them, and then tried with all their strength to meet that claim, and fairly and squarely faced the fact of their failure. -C S Lewis, _The Problem of Pain_ */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of esmie moo Sent: Monday, October 9, 2023 16:55 Enough please about politics. This is a technical information board. Daren please pull the plug on this thread. --- On Sunday, October 8, 2023 at 12:46:05 p.m. EDT, Steve Beaver <050e0c375a14-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote: Has anyone heard from Benyamin in Israel since the shit storm has started? -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: PL/X Open Source and PL/I (off topic)
I would say "No, no exceptions". I don't mean that all companies are monsters, only that moral behavior is a feature of individual humans. If a company behaves well it's because one or more individuals within the company are making moral decisions on its behalf. This isn't a condemnation of companies. I'm just saying it's the only way it CAN be. A group is not a person and cannot have moral judgement, though its individual members may. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* ...it is not humanity in the abstract that is to be saved, but you -- you, the individual reader, John Stubbs or Janet Smith. Blessed and fortunate creature, your eyes shall behold Him and not another'sYour place in heaven will seem to be made for you and you alone, because you were made for it -- made for it stitch by stitch as a glove is made for a hand. -from "The Problem of Pain" by CS Lewis. */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Robert Prins Sent: Monday, October 2, 2023 12:40 Big companies do not have morals, with maybe some, I don't know which ones, exceptions. --- On 2023-10-02 13:03, Clem Clarke wrote: > And it morally should. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: z/OS 3.1 documentation
CA has taken to combining all their various TSS manuals into one gigantic PDF; no more individual manuals for installation, the admins, the CFILE, reporting and trouble-shooting, messages and so on, they're all just chapters in one PDF. I dislike it, but I don't see that I have any option but to get used to it. So when you said you can't select individual manuals, I thought maybe IBM had taken up the practice too. But no, you said "set of PDF files", so I guess you found them all in a single downloaded ZIP and cannot select individual PDFs to be downloaded without everything else? --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* "All's fair in love and war" -- what a contemptible lie! -Lazarus Long */ --- On Fri, 29 Sep 2023 16:27:51 +0100, Lennie Dymoke-Bradshaw wrote: >Having seen the announcement of z/OS 3.1 today I have tried to obtain >the usual PDF collection of documentation. > >I found it can be downloaded in zip form here, by selecting "IBM z/OS >Indexed PDF/PDX Collection". This has given me the set of pdf files. > >https://www.ibm.com/docs/en/zos/3.1.0 > >However, there seems to be no way of selecting individual manuals by >title, as there was at previous z/OS levels. > >Have I downloaded the wrong package? Or is this no longer to be available? -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: [EXTERNAL] Any recommendations for a 3270 emulator for Android
A few years ago I worked for a mainframe-security consulting company. Your comment reminds me of a client: They wanted to create a PC-based security app that would interact with TSS. They didn't know about mainframes, which is why they wanted to hire us. They knew telnet and I think they figured that was all they needed for communication; they were dismayed when I exposed them to EBCDIC, and that was before they even got to true terminal emulation. Prospective client, I should have said. That project never got started. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* I sometimes use big words so I'll sound photosynthesis. -heard from my son-in-law */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Pew, Curtis G Sent: Wednesday, September 27, 2023 14:44 I understand the reasons we went with Virtel were: 1. I think the license was a bit less than licensing ZOC for all our users. 2. (The biggy) It was a lot easier to add MFA to a web app than figure out how to do it with native 3270. (I have to go through a VPN, which requires MFA, to use ZOC.) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Any recommendations for a 3270 emulator for Android
"Outdated" terminal emulators? They wish. Not that I have anything against new and especially better ideas. But I think Attachmate, Rocket, QWS3270 and others work just fine. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* There are few things more discouraging to the mind that likes to believe it is master in its own house, than the unquestionable effect of a full belly. -from The Mauritius Command by Patrick O'Brian */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Bob T Roller Sent: Sunday, September 24, 2023 19:35 I recently received an email advertisement for a product called “Virtel Web Access,the browser-based 3270 emulation technology to replace outdated TN3270 terminal emulators(like PCOMM, Attachmate, Rocket/BlueZone and more), also can replace expensive VTAM session managers(like TPX, CL/SuperSession, Tubes, and more).” I don’t have any experience with it. --- On Sun, Sep 24, 2023 at 7:26 PM, Charles Mills [charl...@mcn.org] wrote: > Anyone have personal recommendations for a 3270 emulator for Android phones > and/or tablets? > > Android, NOT Windows -- you would have to pry Vista out of my cold, dead > fingers. > > I certainly don't intend to do heads-down coding on my phone. This is just so > I could respond to a client emergency without having to lug my laptop around. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: I have an Idea for ISPF...
Huh. I remember the default limit of eight, but don't think about it much; I think my usual max is four or five. At three or four I start using SCRNAME and closing down unused screens. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* How much better for us if all humans died in costly nursing homes amid doctors who lie, nurses who lie, friends who lie, as we have trained them, promising life to the dying, encouraging the belief that sickness excuses every indulgence, and even, if our workers know their job, withholding all suggestion of a priest lest it should betray to the sick man his true condition! -musings of a tempter, from The Screwtape Letters by C S Lewis */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Tom Marchant Sent: Monday, September 18, 2023 16:23 I have been unable to convince my site to increase the maximum number of split screens, so I created my own ISPCFIGU that allows 32 and placed it in ISPLLIB. I've shown a few other people how to do it. I often use more than 8, and sometimes more than 16. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Bill Johnson
Oh, that's easy. Just compile a list of Bill Johnson's last 20 posts, and get members' attestation that they're typical of what he's posted for the past ten years. (Or less than ten years, if you're afeared of getting the admin in trouble for waiting so long.) Bill does contribute one or two on-topic, knowledgeable and non-abusing posts in every twenty or twenty-five, but the ratio should be convincing. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* If you want a kitten, start out by asking for a horse. -from "Great Truths Kids Have Learned" */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Charles Mills Sent: Monday, September 18, 2023 16:11 OMG Darren! What can we do to support you (and the list)? --- On Mon, 18 Sep 2023 19:24:23 +, Darren Evans-Young wrote: >I have removed Bill Johnson from the IBM-MAIN list and you all know why. > >He has now officially lodged a complaint against me accusing me of >discrimination and violating his 1st Amendment rights. This complaint >was sent to the President and the Chief Administrative Officer at The >University of Alabama. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Error messages (a rant and an idea)
Sorry, I can't agree. Manuals are the lifeblood of any competent z/OS worker, no? And since they're available on-line, all I have to do is get a decent collection of them. Message manuals are among my first choice, always. Seems like I'm going against the current, here, but if they tried to add all the text of every message manual to every app ... nah, I can't see it. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* They do not preach that their God will rouse them a little before the nuts work loose. They do not teach that His pity allows them to leave their job when they damn-well choose. -from "The Sons of Martha" by Rudyard Kipling */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Lionel B. Dyck Sent: Monday, September 18, 2023 08:07 I submitted this IBM Idea and would appreciate your support if you're able to vote: https://ibm-z-hardware-and-operating-systems.ideas.ibm.com/ideas/ZOS-I-3827 Title: All error messages for shell tools should be complete and NOT require referencing a Messages and Codes manual Text: Receiving a message like this (example from DSFS dsadm command): IDFS00329E Could not set creation parameters, return code 126 reason code ED07621A. Is confusing and meaningless to the average OMVS shell user. They are not used to finding a messages and codes manual (which is so last millennium) and using Google/Bing/... is useless in finding this, and similar, messages. All shell commands that run under OMVS should provide clear, and complete, messages without requiring the user to find a messages and codes manual. The days of the 1960's and 1970's to -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Assembler, was: AI expert hot new position
Predictions are risky, but I'm going to expose myself just for fun: My bet is that these salaries represent a bubble that won't last long. AI is the latest cool thing, right? These are correspondingly cool numbers, but I'm thinking the bubble will burst. Soon? I dunno. What's "soon"? More than a year, probably. Maybe four or five years? But predictions, especially my predictions, are worth exactly what you're paying for them. See the collection of taglines: --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* By 2005 or so, it will be clear that the Internet's impact on the economy has been no greater than the fax machine's. -Paul Krugman, Nobel-prize-winning economist in 1998 */ /* Computers in the future may weigh no more than 1.5 tons. -Popular Mechanics, forecasting in 1949 the relentless march of science */ /* The most important fundamental laws and facts of physical science have all been discovered, and these are now so firmly established that the possibility of their ever being supplemented in consequence of new discoveries is exceedingly remote. -Abraham Albert Michelson in 1903 */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Bill Johnson Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2023 17:07 AI Specialist Salary Last Updated on: August 14, 2023 The average AI specialist salary in the United States is $165,980 per year, or $79.80 per hour. Their monthly salary starts at $6,907 and goes up to $20,494 per month, or about $245,931 per year. The top-paying states for artificial intelligence specialists are California at $246,143 per year, Oregon at $201,305, and Washington at $193,768. The lowest-paying area is Georgia, with an average salary of $90,068 a year. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Assembler, was: AI expert hot new position
Bill, it sounds to me like you're conflating two things, ie how many assembler programmers are needed with how much such a programmer can make. You've been saying the market for assembler programmers is doomed to decline (and I have no opinion to offer on that), and you conclude that therefore a specialist will make more money only until the skillset involved begins to decline. Dean, on the other hand, is saying that the few specialists who keep providing a service that's falling into disuse are going to go on working and making ~more~ money, and I think he's right. So does the DICE article you quoted. The reason is that when no one wants that skill any more, the fact is that a few people still want it and have a hard time finding it. I'm thinking not only of my own experiences but also, here, an article I read recently about the last company in the world that deals with 3½" diskettes. It's a dead market, right? But only almost - and the one company that sells them, and provides other services, is up to the eyeballs in urgent requests for help from people who really need it and can't find it anywhere else. So being skilled in providing a service that is getting harder and harder to find (and it's getting harder to find precisely ~because~ fewer employers want it) is a pretty enviable position to be in. This accords with the advice offered by Richard Bolles, the writer of the annual publication "What Color is Your Parachute?", which many of us remember with reverence. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* Following the path of least resistance is what makes rivers and men crooked. */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Bill Johnson Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2023 16:47 A generalist will rarely be unemployed. A specialist will usually make more money but only until the skillset involved begins to decline or is phased out. Assembler programming has been in decline for decades. -- From Dice.com September 2022. There’s a pervasive myth that being able to program in assembly language makes you a master programmer with deity-level skills. Yet novice programmers can also pick up the nuances of assembly language—provided they invest the time and effort. Today, assembly language finds its greatest use in compiler development and low-level engineering, with some finance applications. Some companies definitely need the talent. According to Lightcast (formerly Emsi Burning Glass), which collects and analyses millions of job postings from across the country, there were 5,088 open job postings over the past 12 months that mentioned assembly language; however, the platform estimates job growth for the language at -10.8 percent over the next two years. That’s a steep decline. Those skilled in assembly language can expect relatively high salaries, at least: Lightcast pegs the median salary for jobs requiring assembly language at $93,022, which can drift higher with the right mix of skills and experience. Jobs requesting assembly language knowledge include software developer/engineer, training and development specialist, embedded software engineer, and firmware engineer. --- On Wednesday, September 13, 2023, 4:27 PM, Dean Kent wrote: My own belief (whether founded or not) is that if you follow your passion and become good at it, someone will recognize that and feel it is valuable enough to pay for it. I also believe that specialists tend to demand a higher rate than generalists. Assembler is a specialty, and while there may not be a lot of demand, the ones who do require it will pay. I compare it to, for example, I have some classic vehicles with carburetors. Not too many mechanics work on carburetors any more - but those who do have a lot of work. Fine craftsmen may not be in huge demand due to the 'production line' manufacturing of most furniture - but those who do it make good money and have plenty of work.People who specialize in repairing antique clocks, pottery, rugs, etc. may not be able to get a job anywhere - but if they are good at it, they have plenty of business. As long as the mainframe runs legacy code, there will be a need for assembler programmers. That's my opinion, at least. --- On 9/13/2023 8:52 AM, Bob Bridges wrote: > I've long observed that no matter what your employer hired you for, what you > turn out to be good at is what they use you for. At one location I was the > only one who bothered to figure out what was wrong with the big greenbar > printer when it went haywire; before I left, therefore, I was the one folks > came to when it misbehaved, and I was the one ordering supplies for it. At > another place my boss remarked, during an annual review, that "we gotta get > you on some of these team projects; we keep using you as the lone > fire-fighter for odd problems, but team projects
Re: Assembler, was: AI expert hot new position
I've long observed that no matter what your employer hired you for, what you turn out to be good at is what they use you for. At one location I was the only one who bothered to figure out what was wrong with the big greenbar printer when it went haywire; before I left, therefore, I was the one folks came to when it misbehaved, and I was the one ordering supplies for it. At another place my boss remarked, during an annual review, that "we gotta get you on some of these team projects; we keep using you as the lone fire-fighter for odd problems, but team projects will look good an your resume". I nodded enthusiastically and agreed aloud, but the fact is I ~liked~ being the guy in the corner who did the odd jobs, figuring out the software that no one else had time for. I always recommend to young folks that they keep on doing what they're interested in doing. Obviously this doesn't mean neglecting assigned tasks that sound boring; if I don't do what my boss wants me to do then I'm useless to him. But eventually he'll discover that he wants me to do some of the things I'm especially good at too. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* The only way of discovering the limits of the possible is to venture a little way past them into the impossible. -[Arthur C] Clarke's 2nd law. */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Arthur Fichtl Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2023 04:18 As a now retired freelance z/OS guy based in Munich/Germany I had to find a market niche at my employer. Therefore I specialized on debugging, analysis of dumps and the like. For those tasks HLASM was inevitable. My colleagues preferred more comfortable tasks and languages and therefore I for myself had a quite secure job. And I liked it. My 1st language was the Siemens 4004 Assembler with punch cards as the user interface. Quite funny. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: AI expert hot new position.
I routinely discard the last part of a URL if it looks like that, not because I'm mean and suspicious but just for brevity. For example, some interesting articles I read and pass on have links that end it "...?utm_source=pocket-newtab-en-us"; the link works just fine without it. But I've never this type, and I'm glad to know what it does. Thanks, Paul. --- Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313 /* Now there sits a man with an open mind. You can feel the draft from here. -Groucho Marx */ -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Paul Gilmartin Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2023 15:58 That URL looked funny to me, so I asked on an Apple-centric forum and got: > The rest of the URL is critical. It means your copy/paste buffer is being > sent over the internet. It could be benign, like a text to voice app, a > grammar checker, a scanner program. Or, it could be what the last security > update was all about. > > You need to find out if the network location can be trusted, so look at the > first part of the URL. --- On Sun, 10 Sep 2023 17:23:10 +, Bob T Roller wrote: >AI will pay handsomely. > >AI expert is a hot new position in the freelance jobs market >https://www.cnbc.com/2023/09/10/ai-expert-is-a-hot-new-position-in-the- >freelance-jobs-market.html?__source=iosappshare%7Ccom.apple.UIKit.activ >ity.CopyToPasteboard -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
