Re: [Zope] Re: newbie -- creating a Product
Max M wrote:"Btw. I don't see any reason to use words like 'drivel' and 'bullshit'."It is rude and counterproductive. And I don't recall that I have beenrude on this list in general or to you specifically." Of course it is rude and counterproductive. It seems to be a feature on this list being rude and immature. Not from everyone of course, just from the minority. If certain 'personality types' get irritated when reading and replying to a community support list, they shouldn't be here. You've just got to ignore it and put it down to a 'lack of class' as another list member put it. On 11/7/06, Jonathan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: - Original Message -From: "Tres Seaver" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>To: <zope@zope.org>Sent: Monday, November 06, 2006 7:00 PM Subject: [Zope] Re: newbie -- creating a Product> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-> Hash: SHA1>> Max M wrote:>> Jonathan skrev:>>>>>> Well the problem is that Zope 2 was never easy for beginners either. >>>> And by now it is starting to get phased out for Zope 3.>>>>>> This is the first I have heard about Zope 2 being phased out...>>>> Well .. get used to it then ;-) >>>> Z2 will keep on being maintained until it is replaced by Z3. The goal of>> the zope developers is not about keeping Z2 and Z3 running for as long>> as possible. Only for as long as necessary. >>>> Z2 is still being maintained, and will be for a long time. But the>> development is all moving in the direction of Z3.>>>> Read the changelog of the latest Z2 releases. They are practially only >> about bugfixes and Z3 integration. Core Zope 2 development has>> practically grinded to a halt. New developments are taking place in Zope>> 3.>>>>>> How is that not an outphasing? >> I would actually bet on Jim's "door #3" (Zope2 reabsorbing Zope3) as a> more likely outcome. Five years later, the number of production> installations of Zope3 compared to Zope2 is statistically insignificant; > the use of Zope3 technology within Zope2, however, is growing by leaps> and bounds.+1 I think this is a very realistic/feasible option. The installed base ofZope 2 applications is too large for Zope 2 to disappear, and porting Zope 2 applications to Zope 3 is not practical. I am hoping that "Door #3" is thewinning door!___Zope maillist - Zope@zope.orghttp://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope** No cross posts or HTML encoding! **(Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )-- michael ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Re: [Zope] Re: newbie -- creating a Product
- Original Message - From: "Tres Seaver" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Sent: Monday, November 06, 2006 7:00 PM Subject: [Zope] Re: newbie -- creating a Product -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Max M wrote: Jonathan skrev: Well the problem is that Zope 2 was never easy for beginners either. And by now it is starting to get phased out for Zope 3. This is the first I have heard about Zope 2 being phased out... Well .. get used to it then ;-) Z2 will keep on being maintained until it is replaced by Z3. The goal of the zope developers is not about keeping Z2 and Z3 running for as long as possible. Only for as long as necessary. Z2 is still being maintained, and will be for a long time. But the development is all moving in the direction of Z3. Read the changelog of the latest Z2 releases. They are practially only about bugfixes and Z3 integration. Core Zope 2 development has practically grinded to a halt. New developments are taking place in Zope 3. How is that not an outphasing? I would actually bet on Jim's "door #3" (Zope2 reabsorbing Zope3) as a more likely outcome. Five years later, the number of production installations of Zope3 compared to Zope2 is statistically insignificant; the use of Zope3 technology within Zope2, however, is growing by leaps and bounds. +1 I think this is a very realistic/feasible option. The installed base of Zope 2 applications is too large for Zope 2 to disappear, and porting Zope 2 applications to Zope 3 is not practical. I am hoping that "Door #3" is the winning door! ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
[Zope] Re: newbie -- creating a Product
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Max M wrote: > Jonathan skrev: > >>> Well the problem is that Zope 2 was never easy for beginners either. >>> And by now it is starting to get phased out for Zope 3. >> >> This is the first I have heard about Zope 2 being phased out... > > Well .. get used to it then ;-) > > Z2 will keep on being maintained until it is replaced by Z3. The goal of > the zope developers is not about keeping Z2 and Z3 running for as long > as possible. Only for as long as necessary. > > Z2 is still being maintained, and will be for a long time. But the > development is all moving in the direction of Z3. > > Read the changelog of the latest Z2 releases. They are practially only > about bugfixes and Z3 integration. Core Zope 2 development has > practically grinded to a halt. New developments are taking place in Zope 3. > > > How is that not an outphasing? I would actually bet on Jim's "door #3" (Zope2 reabsorbing Zope3) as a more likely outcome. Five years later, the number of production installations of Zope3 compared to Zope2 is statistically insignificant; the use of Zope3 technology within Zope2, however, is growing by leaps and bounds. Tres. - -- === Tres Seaver +1 202-558-7113 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Palladion Software "Excellence by Design"http://palladion.com -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.2.2 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFFT8yf+gerLs4ltQ4RAvS4AKC2bYw7gCDO4Uwqs8ZV/2T5fhT+KACdHS+h Cmrr+OBh0g1rWK5BM6f1St0= =rGTb -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Re: [Zope] Re: newbie -- creating a Product
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 6 Nov 2006, at 20:01, Max M wrote: Well the problem is that Zope 2 was never easy for beginners either. And by now it is starting to get phased out for Zope 3. Nothing is phased out for Zope 3. That is incorrect, and that's what causes FUD. jens -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (Darwin) iD8DBQFFT6crRAx5nvEhZLIRAn54AJ0XVMS2y7akRg17LHEsaPpmxBnbcACgg3jq EoFwS2Lmp+k7itgNitzZKXU= =d8dE -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
[Zope] Re: newbie -- creating a Product
Andreas Jung skrev: The future of Zope 2 and Zope 3 are open - Yes so please stop arguing as if we are arguing anything but opinions. read the corresponding posting on Zope 2+3 by Jim Fulton published after the last PyCon. There is no word of phasing out Zope 2. I believe it will happen a lot faster than you think. New versions of Plone will use it exensively, so there will be a lot of new developers from that comunity. Which is pretty big. That will drive the shift forward. I know plenty of Plone developers, and I don't recall that any of them yearn to stay in Z2 after having tried Z3. Quite the opposite. Btw. I don't see any reason to use words like 'drivel' and 'bullshit'. It is rude and counterproductive. And I don't recall that I have been rude on this list in general or to you specifically. I am not trolling I just gave a new developer what I believe is good advice. -- hilsen/regards Max M, Denmark http://www.mxm.dk/ IT's Mad Science ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Re: [Zope] Re: newbie -- creating a Product
--On 6. November 2006 21:06:31 +0100 Max M <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Andreas Jung skrev: --On 6. November 2006 20:01:55 +0100 Max M <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Well the problem is that Zope 2 was never easy for beginners either. And by now it is starting to get phased out for Zope 3. BS A case of bear says that in the next two years (1. Jan. 2008) the vast majority of Zope development will take place in Z3 technologies. Zope 3 is a big spare-part and component factory and it is easy to integrate stuff into Zope 2. That is currently happening. But *stop* your drivel about Zope being phased out. Zope might fade away at some time in the far future because there is something better but there is *no active* phasing-out by the community. The future of Zope 2 and Zope 3 are open - read the corresponding posting on Zope 2+3 by Jim Fulton published after the last PyCon. There is no word of phasing out Zope 2. -aj pgpaDGsdzk9IA.pgp Description: PGP signature ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
[Zope] Re: newbie -- creating a Product
Max M skrev: Andreas Jung skrev: --On 6. November 2006 20:01:55 +0100 Max M <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Well the problem is that Zope 2 was never easy for beginners either. And by now it is starting to get phased out for Zope 3. BS A case of bear says that in the next two years (1. Jan. 2008) the vast majority of Zope development will take place in Z3 technologies. A case of beer will do in lack of bears. -- hilsen/regards Max M, Denmark http://www.mxm.dk/ IT's Mad Science ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
[Zope] Re: newbie -- creating a Product
Andreas Jung skrev: --On 6. November 2006 20:01:55 +0100 Max M <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Well the problem is that Zope 2 was never easy for beginners either. And by now it is starting to get phased out for Zope 3. BS A case of bear says that in the next two years (1. Jan. 2008) the vast majority of Zope development will take place in Z3 technologies. -- hilsen/regards Max M, Denmark http://www.mxm.dk/ IT's Mad Science ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
[Zope] Re: newbie -- creating a Product
Jonathan skrev: Well the problem is that Zope 2 was never easy for beginners either. And by now it is starting to get phased out for Zope 3. This is the first I have heard about Zope 2 being phased out... Well .. get used to it then ;-) Z2 will keep on being maintained until it is replaced by Z3. The goal of the zope developers is not about keeping Z2 and Z3 running for as long as possible. Only for as long as necessary. Z2 is still being maintained, and will be for a long time. But the development is all moving in the direction of Z3. Read the changelog of the latest Z2 releases. They are practially only about bugfixes and Z3 integration. Core Zope 2 development has practically grinded to a halt. New developments are taking place in Zope 3. How is that not an outphasing? -- hilsen/regards Max M, Denmark http://www.mxm.dk/ IT's Mad Science ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
[Zope] Re: newbie -- creating a Product
Jonathan skrev: P.S. if you want a complete newbie NOT to use zope, throw them into the deep end with Zope 3 (compared to Zope 2 there is not a lot of documentation, examples, and expertise available to help newbies; not to mention the fact that Zope 3 is still rapidly evolving). There is a *lot* more documentation of Z3 than there was of Z2 when I was a newbie in that... -- hilsen/regards Max M, Denmark http://www.mxm.dk/ IT's Mad Science ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Re: [Zope] Re: newbie -- creating a Product
--On 6. November 2006 20:01:55 +0100 Max M <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Well the problem is that Zope 2 was never easy for beginners either. And by now it is starting to get phased out for Zope 3. BS -aj -- ZOPYX Ltd. & Co. KG - Charlottenstr. 37/1 - 72070 Tübingen - Germany Web: www.zopyx.com - Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Phone +49 - 7071 - 793376 E-Publishing, Python, Zope & Plone development, Consulting pgpv7s5A88eIl.pgp Description: PGP signature ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Re: [Zope] Re: newbie -- creating a Product
- Original Message - From: "Max M" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Sent: Monday, November 06, 2006 2:01 PM Subject: [Zope] Re: newbie -- creating a Product Jens Vagelpohl skrev: Mind what I said (or tried to say). If you are a *new developer*, with a *new project*, you are far better of starting with Zope 3 than with Zope 2. That's questionable. Answers like this only add to a certain FUD factor out there about Zope2 being thrown out shortly. You don't have to throw out Zope 2 to start using Zope 3. Just ignore Zope 2 and get on with it. If you need features that are in Zope 2 but not in Zope 3, you are better of using a framework like Plone. Hell no. Trying to throw a complete newbie not just into developing with Zope, but developing with Plone on top of Zope is, IMHO, insane. Not only do you need to learn Zope, you also need to learn the various Plone programming paradigms. That is why I recommended Zope 3 as the first choice. Zope 3 is clearly ready for production. In many areas it is allready far better than Zope 2. I don't understand why it is better for a newbie to learn Zope 2 than Zope 3? Zope 2 has so many warts, and is a dead end. That's just bad advice, unless someone truly wants those portal-like functionalities in Plone. And if they don't, they should use Zope 3. I did not say that Zope 2 was useless. I still spend most of my time working on Plone based projects. This is a case of professional "blinders". You've been working with a specific combination for years so these things come easy to you. The problem is you don't seem to see that there is healthy life outside of Plone. Or outside of Zope 3, for that matter. Well the problem is that Zope 2 was never easy for beginners either. And by now it is starting to get phased out for Zope 3. This is the first I have heard about Zope 2 being phased out... Jonathan ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
[Zope] Re: newbie -- creating a Product
Jens Vagelpohl skrev: Mind what I said (or tried to say). If you are a *new developer*, with a *new project*, you are far better of starting with Zope 3 than with Zope 2. That's questionable. Answers like this only add to a certain FUD factor out there about Zope2 being thrown out shortly. You don't have to throw out Zope 2 to start using Zope 3. Just ignore Zope 2 and get on with it. If you need features that are in Zope 2 but not in Zope 3, you are better of using a framework like Plone. Hell no. Trying to throw a complete newbie not just into developing with Zope, but developing with Plone on top of Zope is, IMHO, insane. Not only do you need to learn Zope, you also need to learn the various Plone programming paradigms. That is why I recommended Zope 3 as the first choice. Zope 3 is clearly ready for production. In many areas it is allready far better than Zope 2. I don't understand why it is better for a newbie to learn Zope 2 than Zope 3? Zope 2 has so many warts, and is a dead end. That's just bad advice, unless someone truly wants those portal-like functionalities in Plone. And if they don't, they should use Zope 3. I did not say that Zope 2 was useless. I still spend most of my time working on Plone based projects. This is a case of professional "blinders". You've been working with a specific combination for years so these things come easy to you. The problem is you don't seem to see that there is healthy life outside of Plone. Or outside of Zope 3, for that matter. Well the problem is that Zope 2 was never easy for beginners either. And by now it is starting to get phased out for Zope 3. This is not something I make up. It is the stated goal for all the Zope 2 based projects I have heard about. They call it slowly migrating to Zope 3, but it really is the same goal! This will take years. But it is happening. Eg. any new development in Plone will be in Zope 3. At least afaik. -- hilsen/regards Max M, Denmark http://www.mxm.dk/ IT's Mad Science ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Re: [Zope] Re: newbie -- creating a Product
--On 6. November 2006 13:37:52 -0500 Jonathan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: P.S. if you want a complete newbie NOT to use zope A complete newbie is a person that will ask you how to use a spoon for eating its soup. None of the frameworks is suitable for a complete newbie. A complete newbie needs to learn the basics of programming (html, python scripting) first first before touching any framework. Let's better discuss persons with some programming skills :-) -aj -- ZOPYX Ltd. & Co. KG - Charlottenstr. 37/1 - 72070 Tübingen - Germany Web: www.zopyx.com - Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Phone +49 - 7071 - 793376 E-Publishing, Python, Zope & Plone development, Consulting pgpg7mdsvscUz.pgp Description: PGP signature ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Re: [Zope] Re: newbie -- creating a Product
- Original Message - From: "Jens Vagelpohl" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "zope user list" Sent: Monday, November 06, 2006 1:18 PM Subject: Re: [Zope] Re: newbie -- creating a Product -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 6 Nov 2006, at 17:59, Max M wrote: Jens Vagelpohl skrev: If your are using Zope 2 and is a newbie, do yourself the favour of starting with Zope 3. If you want to work in zope 2 you should use Plone as a base, and create products with Archgen XML (AGX) There are no advantages in using plain Zope 2 anymore. I'm sorry, that's just complete BS. No it isn't! Mind what I said (or tried to say). If you are a *new developer*, with a *new project*, you are far better of starting with Zope 3 than with Zope 2. That's questionable. Answers like this only add to a certain FUD factor out there about Zope2 being thrown out shortly. If you need features that are in Zope 2 but not in Zope 3, you are better of using a framework like Plone. Hell no. Trying to throw a complete newbie not just into developing with Zope, but developing with Plone on top of Zope is, IMHO, insane. Not only do you need to learn Zope, you also need to learn the various Plone programming paradigms. That's just bad advice, unless someone truly wants those portal-like functionalities in Plone. Plone is a screwdriver, and you're advising people to pound a nail into the wall with a screwdriver. I have done Zope for +6 years, and I would not dream of starting up a project from scratch in Zope 2 anymore. I did not say that Zope 2 was useless. I still spend most of my time working on Plone based projects. This is a case of professional "blinders". You've been working with a specific combination for years so these things come easy to you. The problem is you don't seem to see that there is healthy life outside of Plone. Or outside of Zope 3, for that matter. +1+1+1+1... :-) P.S. if you want a complete newbie NOT to use zope, throw them into the deep end with Zope 3 (compared to Zope 2 there is not a lot of documentation, examples, and expertise available to help newbies; not to mention the fact that Zope 3 is still rapidly evolving). Jonathan ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Re: [Zope] Re: newbie -- creating a Product
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 6 Nov 2006, at 17:59, Max M wrote: Jens Vagelpohl skrev: If your are using Zope 2 and is a newbie, do yourself the favour of starting with Zope 3. If you want to work in zope 2 you should use Plone as a base, and create products with Archgen XML (AGX) There are no advantages in using plain Zope 2 anymore. I'm sorry, that's just complete BS. No it isn't! Mind what I said (or tried to say). If you are a *new developer*, with a *new project*, you are far better of starting with Zope 3 than with Zope 2. That's questionable. Answers like this only add to a certain FUD factor out there about Zope2 being thrown out shortly. If you need features that are in Zope 2 but not in Zope 3, you are better of using a framework like Plone. Hell no. Trying to throw a complete newbie not just into developing with Zope, but developing with Plone on top of Zope is, IMHO, insane. Not only do you need to learn Zope, you also need to learn the various Plone programming paradigms. That's just bad advice, unless someone truly wants those portal-like functionalities in Plone. Plone is a screwdriver, and you're advising people to pound a nail into the wall with a screwdriver. I have done Zope for +6 years, and I would not dream of starting up a project from scratch in Zope 2 anymore. I did not say that Zope 2 was useless. I still spend most of my time working on Plone based projects. This is a case of professional "blinders". You've been working with a specific combination for years so these things come easy to you. The problem is you don't seem to see that there is healthy life outside of Plone. Or outside of Zope 3, for that matter. jens -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (Darwin) iD8DBQFFT3xdRAx5nvEhZLIRAjC+AJ9LB97a9L9Cd7KdFPO930r61UVRUACfc4w8 ung9EM2iVqmfZEj+zjznLR8= =i6xK -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
[Zope] Re: newbie -- creating a Product
Jens Vagelpohl skrev: If your are using Zope 2 and is a newbie, do yourself the favour of starting with Zope 3. If you want to work in zope 2 you should use Plone as a base, and create products with Archgen XML (AGX) There are no advantages in using plain Zope 2 anymore. I'm sorry, that's just complete BS. No it isn't! Mind what I said (or tried to say). If you are a *new developer*, with a *new project*, you are far better of starting with Zope 3 than with Zope 2. If you need features that are in Zope 2 but not in Zope 3, you are better of using a framework like Plone. I have done Zope for +6 years, and I would not dream of starting up a project from scratch in Zope 2 anymore. I did not say that Zope 2 was useless. I still spend most of my time working on Plone based projects. -- hilsen/regards Max M, Denmark http://www.mxm.dk/ IT's Mad Science ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Re: [Zope] Re: newbie -- creating a Product
--On 6. November 2006 11:42:02 -0500 Jonathan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: If your are using Zope 2 and is a newbie, do yourself the favour of starting with Zope 3. If you want to work in zope 2 you should use Plone as a base, and create products with Archgen XML (AGX) There are no advantages in using plain Zope 2 anymore. I'm sorry, that's just complete BS. jens + 1 Also +1 on the BS. Plone is a solution for lots of use-cases but it is not a solution for all-and-everything. Keep in mind that Plone is (easily spoken) a skin with with some business logic at implements CMS functionality on top of a huge pile of frameworks. Compare it to an iceberg (one seventh of the iceberg you'll see over the waterline is Plone and the rest are frameworks under the hood). Complex application scenarios often don't match with the Plone use-cases. Therefore it is better to build in such cases your own application on top of CMF instead Plone. And once again: don't sell Plone as all-in-one device to every customer - that's unprofessional. A good consultant/developers knows when to use Plone and when not to use Plone. -aj pgpRjS1U1COPb.pgp Description: PGP signature ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Re: [Zope] Re: newbie -- creating a Product
- Original Message - From: "Jens Vagelpohl" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "zope list user" Sent: Monday, November 06, 2006 11:20 AM Subject: Re: [Zope] Re: newbie -- creating a Product -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 6 Nov 2006, at 15:51, Max M wrote: Aidan skrev: I'm a complete Zope novice. Forgive me if my question is inane. I need to be able to send an e-mail (following a form submit) with an attachment (and I prefer not to use DTML). I can send e-mails withOUT attachments, but according to this: http://mail.zope.org/pipermail/zope/2005-May/ 159291.html If your are using Zope 2 and is a newbie, do yourself the favour of starting with Zope 3. If you want to work in zope 2 you should use Plone as a base, and create products with Archgen XML (AGX) There are no advantages in using plain Zope 2 anymore. I'm sorry, that's just complete BS. jens + 1 Jonathan ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Re: [Zope] Re: newbie -- creating a Product
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 6 Nov 2006, at 15:51, Max M wrote: Aidan skrev: I'm a complete Zope novice. Forgive me if my question is inane. I need to be able to send an e-mail (following a form submit) with an attachment (and I prefer not to use DTML). I can send e-mails withOUT attachments, but according to this: http://mail.zope.org/pipermail/zope/2005-May/ 159291.html If your are using Zope 2 and is a newbie, do yourself the favour of starting with Zope 3. If you want to work in zope 2 you should use Plone as a base, and create products with Archgen XML (AGX) There are no advantages in using plain Zope 2 anymore. I'm sorry, that's just complete BS. jens -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (Darwin) iD8DBQFFT2C9RAx5nvEhZLIRAoZVAKCSz5LFjYjkw5RwnWqD6mgUS+uidACgtea3 29NejysD8vmOcCBf4/RlP8Q= =+uW7 -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Re: [Zope] Re: newbie -- creating a Product
+---[ Max M ]-- | | There are no advantages in using plain Zope 2 anymore. What a crock. -- Andrew Milton [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
[Zope] Re: newbie -- creating a Product
Aidan skrev: I'm a complete Zope novice. Forgive me if my question is inane. I need to be able to send an e-mail (following a form submit) with an attachment (and I prefer not to use DTML). I can send e-mails withOUT attachments, but according to this: http://mail.zope.org/pipermail/zope/2005-May/159291.html If your are using Zope 2 and is a newbie, do yourself the favour of starting with Zope 3. If you want to work in zope 2 you should use Plone as a base, and create products with Archgen XML (AGX) There are no advantages in using plain Zope 2 anymore. -- hilsen/regards Max M, Denmark http://www.mxm.dk/ IT's Mad Science ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
