Re: Fwd: Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Pam DeTray wrote: Did you buy the potentizer to make your own reagents? Thanks. Pam DeTray What is this potentiser. Is it a two well radionics box or similiar??? Is it portable. I imagine this might solve my problems of manifesting essences while travelling and the need for a lab. Glen A -Original Message- From: D S Chamberlain [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Fri, 1 Mar 2002 10:38:06 +1100 Hi James: I'll try to keep it short. I started using the FB in May 2000, at first I had no idea how to use it, beyond how I used the cosmic pipe it replaced. So I just dowsed once a month and added or removed the reagents supplied by Hugh. Nothing much happened initially as we at that stage were going into our usual dry winter. Come Spring though WOW! snip I don't know whether it was the reagents or my intentions but things started to go bad fairly quickly. The citrus seemed to get every bug known to man, together with the veggies which were a disaster, some trees not all just dropped their fruit, all this despite it being a good summer weather wise. About January February 2001 Hugh came up with a new combination of reagents which made sense to me so I bought a potentiser and started dowsing weekly to check the potencies. Since then things have been great except for the weather. -- ___ Sign-up for your own FREE Personalized E-mail at Email.com http://www.email.com/?sr=signup -- Garuda Biodynamics - for BD Preps, Consultations, Books Diagrams See our web site @ http://get.to/garuda
Re: Fwd: Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Sounds great Lloyd, do you have an address for purchase? I am liking the imaginations of its potential and I look forward to experimenting with one Thanks Glen Lloyd Charles wrote: - Original Message - From: Glen Atkinson What is this potentiser Is it a two well radionics box or similiar??? Is it portable I imagine this might solve my problems of manifesting essences while travelling and the need for a lab Glen A Hi Glen Mine is a Prue instruments M4 - has a silver source plate, recipient well, 2 card slots (takes the Malcolm Rae cards), an extender lead so you can do bottles or a large tank, fits easily in a kids shoe box, cost a bit over $A500, dial settings go all the way from 1X to 10MM An experienced homeopath and dowser told me you have bought the rolls royce of potentisers In your line of work I think you would very quickly pay for one of these Lloyd Charles -- Garuda Biodynamics - for BD Preps, Consultations, Books Diagrams See our web site http://getto/garuda
Re: Fwd: Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Thanks for this David D S Chamberlain wrote: The potentiser is a Prue Instruments Multipotentcy Simulator Master Module M4. It can use two card sources or a plate source, it can be extended. Prue Instruments 8 Lucinda Ave Springwood NSW 2777 Australia Telephone from outside Aust 612 4751 2904 Fax 612 4751 2903 Cost Au$525 Very portable measures about 8 x 5 x 2 !/2 high. You will need your own cards as these are not supplied. Hope this helps David C - Original Message - From: Glen Atkinson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, 5 March 2002 6:57 AM Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: Radionics (Drought update) Pam DeTray wrote: Did you buy the potentizer to make your own reagents? Thanks. Pam DeTray What is this potentiser. Is it a two well radionics box or similiar??? Is it portable. I imagine this might solve my problems of manifesting essences while travelling and the need for a lab. Glen A -Original Message- From: D S Chamberlain [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Fri, 1 Mar 2002 10:38:06 +1100 Hi James: I'll try to keep it short. I started using the FB in May 2000, at first I had no idea how to use it, beyond how I used the cosmic pipe it replaced. So I just dowsed once a month and added or removed the reagents supplied by Hugh. Nothing much happened initially as we at that stage were going into our usual dry winter. Come Spring though WOW! snip I don't know whether it was the reagents or my intentions but things started to go bad fairly quickly. The citrus seemed to get every bug known to man, together with the veggies which were a disaster, some trees not all just dropped their fruit, all this despite it being a good summer weather wise. About January February 2001 Hugh came up with a new combination of reagents which made sense to me so I bought a potentiser and started dowsing weekly to check the potencies. Since then things have been great except for the weather. -- ___ Sign-up for your own FREE Personalized E-mail at Email.com http://www.email.com/?sr=signup -- Garuda Biodynamics - for BD Preps, Consultations, Books Diagrams See our web site @ http://get.to/garuda -- Garuda Biodynamics - for BD Preps, Consultations, Books Diagrams See our web site @ http://get.to/garuda
Re: Fwd: Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Hi David, I guess in my haste around the radionics material, I must have missed the difference btwn. the FB and the cosmic pipe which I thought was an FB. Can you briefly explain the difference? thanks, Jane - Original Message - From: D S Chamberlain [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2002 6:38 PM Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: Radionics (Drought update) Hi James: I'll try to keep it short. I started using the FB in May 2000, at first I had no idea how to use it, beyond how I used the cosmic pipe it replaced.
Re: Fwd: Re: Radionics (Drought update)
G'day Jane What I call a field Broadcaster (FB) is the design of Hugh Lovel. The cosmic pipe was a design supposedly by Galen H (can't spell it) that I got from a radionics newsletter. I built and installed the cosmic pipe about 1994. Sorry for the confusion. David C - Original Message - From: jsherry [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, 1 March 2002 11:59 PM Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: Radionics (Drought update) Hi David, I guess in my haste around the radionics material, I must have missed the difference btwn. the FB and the cosmic pipe which I thought was an FB. Can you briefly explain the difference? thanks, Jane - Original Message - From: D S Chamberlain [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2002 6:38 PM Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: Radionics (Drought update) Hi James: I'll try to keep it short. I started using the FB in May 2000, at first I had no idea how to use it, beyond how I used the cosmic pipe it replaced.
Re: Fwd: Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Greetings from the land of the wizards of OZ to Gil, Hugh Alan and fellow list members, I have been sitting back enjoying the cut and thrust of this discusion of radionics. Alan mentions his and Peter Tomkins concerns of what would happen if radionics was used to suppress life rather than to enhance it. This concern could be expanded to any form of human endeavour, there is always a what if factor. Isee the management of the what if factor as being part of human development and evolution. It is not conducive to human development to succumb to fears of what if, but it is conducive to this development to listen to the concerns of other people, consider them and then make a decision based on the best information available at the time. The more information and research that you have on any subject the more chance that you have to make a correct decision.Seventy five percent will get you a distinction at most universities, if you were right in 75 percent of the decisions that you make you are a genius, and would wind up being amongst the very wealthy of this world. Peter Tomkins concerns of the use of eloptic energy may very well be right on the mark, however it is only by use, constant monitoring and recording of results, then transfer of information that we can make decisions based on fact, not personal prejudices. For example I have just finished reading a 1995 report on field broadcasters from the Borderland science people in California that suggests that there is a problem with the interaction between copper coils, non-symmetrical crystals and PVC pipe. When I have assimilated this information I will share it with list members for what I am sure will be great discussion on the use of radionics. By the way Allan what do you mean by potentised substances are self policing? Until next time, Sincere regards James Hedley To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, February 19, 2002 1:04 PM Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: Radionics (Drought update) Glen - You present concerns that Peter Tompkins expressed to me a couple of years back. Peter is so concerned about the misuse of eloptic energy that he will neither towers of power nor cosmic pipes on his property. He also expressed concern for what would become of mankind if radionics was used by those who want to supress Life rather than expand it. Broadcasting, from whatever device, is a horrendous responsibility. I feel that potentized substances themselves are somewhat self-policing, however. -Allan
Re: Fwd: Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Dear David, Nice to hear from you again. Could you please share with the list what your experiences were with the field broadcasters as it will help to hear from people such as Lloyd and you in Australia who have used their field broadcasters for a while. Sincere regards James - Original Message - From: D S Chamberlain [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, February 19, 2002 5:26 PM Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: Radionics (Drought update) I agree with all that has been said about the dangers, BUT if we untrained suckers don't do it who will? Do we all sit back and await the guru's arrival? There appears to be the perception that you can just bung in a pipe and get rid of all your weeds and other problems, a silver bullet approach. This has not been my experience. Dr. Elaine Ingham will be in Aust and NZ in March, those who would like to attend her seminars should go to her WebPages. David C - Original Message - From: Lloyd Charles [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, 19 February 2002 1:52 PM Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: Radionics (Drought update) - Original Message - From: Gil Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, February 19, 2002 9:36 AM Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: Radionics Accreditation Dear Gil and list -- My remarks here are to be taken as only applying to experimental use of radionics in agriculture Gil wrote Hi! Jane, Hugh and the List. I agree with your concerns about some one driving a Cosmic Pipe or other Radionic Device and putting out energy other than that which is desired. Me too. but I have a serious problem in that I am one of the un-trained un-accredited people who has come to this with only my integrity and good intent (And common sense) We also need to look at what is the alternative - In my case (I can already hear the gasps of horror ) the alternative would have been a continuation of chemical farming in some form, but the use of potentised remedies in field broadcasters or instruments of similar ilk will be the most valuable tool (of many) that we use to get us out of it. And I'm sorry folks but I refuse to hand my farm over to the banks and chemical companies because of some idealistic system that would not deliver a satisfactory result in my situation. Gil again This is an area in which I differ from Hugh. I do not think that devices like his Field Broadcaster should be in the public domain. I think it requires specialist knowledge along with a high degree of responsibility for the resulting broadcast. My background says that I should argue with Gil but I find it very difficult to disagree. A wise fellow once told me to remember that the potential to do good (with any instrument or machine) will always be about equal to the potential to do damage - thus it requires a higher level of intellect and ability to operate a bulldozer than a shovel. If we see Gil's emphasis on training as an opportunity for those already practicing radionics to quietly exclude unsuitable people before they advance far enough to do real harm then I agree. However I feel that this process is already in place - I got good guidance, and a well timed dose of cautionary advice from Hugh Lovel when I started with the field broadcaster. And have had similar help and guidance from others - including a couple of magic days at James and Barbara Hedley's place recently. As far as the weekend specials go (there is another one on in South Australia soon I hear) they are a training excercise for the organisers but the attrition rate is extraordinarily high - there are 2 dial analysers sitting in the bottom of wardrobes all over the place - if these guys can afford to waste $3000 to $7000 in such a manner then so be it - The problem that I have with radionics is the product sellers. This is a serious and very dangerous situation - how on earth can an operator (regardless of his inherent honesty) get a proper and beneficial analysis result when the whole purpose and INTENT of sitting down at the instrument was to increase his sales of brand X supersoup or whatever - after all there's a payment due on the new mercedes 4 wheel drive next week and the bank needs a bit of a top up. How do you stop this with regulation or accreditation?? I would like to hear more from other list members on this as I can see the sense in both Gil's and Hugh's argument but sittin' on the fence is a dangerous policy long term. Cheers all Lloyd Charlers
Re: Fwd: Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Thanks Lloyd, That makes much more sense. I have a lot of problems with a Laboratory attached to Sales Organisation and I would also have a lot of difficulty with the use of Radionics in this area. When I am doing soil reclamation work, that requires a Lab Test, I use one of two Labs, then pay a consultant I greatly respect, to interpret it and make recommendations. I have the client pay both directly. When it comes to doing the actual work resulting from it, I will supervise the client's employees or contractors, for a fee, but that is my limit of involvement. At the risk of sounding puritanical (And I have been intentionally pushing a few comfort zones on this list), Radiesthesia/ Radionics is only reliable when done with complete detachment. I do not see how Radionics can be reliably used, if there is a potential for personal gain or loss involved. Others have talked of working from a position of Love. That is one way of stating it. For Radionics/ Radiesthesia to be of value, it must include utter independence of the practitioner. Personally I think in terms of having no ownership in the out come. I strive to put my self in a space, what ever the out come, it is of no concern to me. I do not mean that this is a position of not caring, but that I recognise that every situation in which a person finds them selves, they have made some contributing action to that situation. I have client files on my desk with people wanting Golden Bullets for situations they have created, ranging from a the physical, to relationship issues. While I will do what I can and work with empathy, I will avoid emotional involvement. Gil Lloyd Charles wrote: Hi Gil --- Yeah I did it again eh -- garbled my message! I was referring to the use of radionic analysis to build physical fertiliser programs which is a bit outside of BD but common practice in eco farming circles. When we couple this with the situation of commission sales or permanent employment (the product seller)representing a particular product (supersoup brand x or whatever) then there is a real problem. This is already happening and is getting radionics a bad name. Some of these guys will be at that weekend special I referred to. This is the sort of thing you are trying to stop and a major reason that I agree with you even tho I have no proper training!! Cheers Lloyd Charles Gil wrote I am a little puzzled by how on earth can an operator (regardless of his inherent honesty) get a proper and beneficial analysis result when the whole purpose and INTENT of sitting down at the instrument was to increase his sales of brand X supersoup or whatever .
Re: Radionics (Drought update)
I wish you'd comment on this info a bit more. What intentional particles? And intention--who's and how to counteract this? Hi All - I would first observe that, from the point of view of Western Tropical astrology, both Uranus (Cosmic Shakti) and Neptune (Cosmic Waters) are in the dry, yang air sign of Aquarius. That to me seems to be a major Sky Sign of all this. Uranus in particular will exactly conjunct the USA Moon (27 Aquarius in the July 4, 1776 horoscope - Sibley version) three big times this year. The Moon is a major player in our nation chart, for we are founded under the sign of Cancer, ruled by the Moon. The three exact conjunctions are : March 29-31, 2002 Aug. 10-12, 2002 (but in truth Uranus goes slowly over the Moon all summer in close orb) Jan 19-21, 2003. Since the Moon is the primary ruler of the physical waters, it would seem the year-long conjunction of the drying, shocking Uranian impulse will continue to hit us in the belly and breast (Moon), the heart (Sun in the Moon's sign of Cancer), and the ankles (Aquarius). What does that mean in terms of a nation's physical being? Your speculation is as good as mine. We seem collectively unable to handle the Shakti shocks, which are altogether drying in addition to everything else, and the waters - in all respects physical, emotional and etheric - are toxic. All this seems entirely likely to be intensified in the months ahead. I could go on at length about the Big Planetary Sky Sign of the year (Saturn in Gemini opposite Pluto in Sagittarius), but I will suffice to say that this influence - which has been dominant since 2001, is waxing toward fulfillment in late May, 2002. Without trying to be glib, I feel the best any individual can do is to follow our visions with integrity, and hoe carefully our own little acres. Larger forces are at work. Yet our responsibilities to hold the vision and work toward their realization continue. But I am getting preachy, so I will close this section with a short expression of hope. I feel we (all of us) are going to come through all of this - ultimately - much more wide awake spiritually, and much more ready to build a culture that is honoring of all the beings who are part of the Sacred Hoop of life on Earth. That is good. Also, Steven, you're a Reiki master, are you not? I was hoping you too could share a couple of stories about vibrational healing with us if you don't mind... I have been a Reiki practitioner since 1977, and a Master since 1990. I studied with John Harvey Gray, 89, the longest-practicing Master in the West. He's great. I've had dozens and dozens of wonderful experience giving Reiki over the years, for it is in truth an effective aid. I served as a firefighter for years in my small town, and often was able to effectively comfort and support people in extreme trauma at accidents and fires. Most recently I arrived to visit at the home of my old friend Sherry Jennings in Wilton, NH (she has taught the K class at Pine Hill Waldorf School since forever). Sherry had just fallen and twisted her ankle wickedly. She was in excruciating pain. The Reiki (and a Medicine Song) helped enormously. She was able to sleep comfortably all night, and, thankfully, next day the X-rays showed no damage. After the treatment she never felt any pain, nor was she at all hobbled in her walking. Sherry was amazed. (And truth to tell, so was I - I always am amazed, over and over, for I'm a skeptical kind of guy. But there, once again, was fresh evidence staring me in the face). Yay Reiki ! It's good stuff. Not the answer to all health issues, but a definite aid. Should be a part of everyone's Medicine Bag. Watch who you approach as a teacher, though. Lots of people have gotten Wildly Creative with Reiki in recent years. Some of the innovations are no doubt worthwhile, but some are dangerous. Best, I feel, to start with just the simple basic energies teachings and then work with them for several years before getting too experimental. It's good to cultivate humility in this miraculous realm, and know how little you (and often others) know. Best, Steven Steven McFadden, Director Chiron Communications 7 Avenida Vista Grande #195 Santa Fe, NM 87508 USA http://www.chiron-communications.com
Re: Fwd: Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Glen Atkinson finished off with So folks this is a self regulating society. Do 'we' have the morality to actually learn consciously what we are doing and exercise some level of caution and restraint on its development and distribution or is it every being for themselves regardless of outcome? Our societies seem to have both kinds of folks eh? Seems to me we DO have the morality to learn consciously and exercise wisdom for the greater good. Let's work on those that have the greater good in their hearts becoming the dominant force on the planet. To further Barbara's question about weather patterns, do you use your all in one homeopathic prep remedies for rain with sequential sprays? Have you worked on weather patterning with your preps you make, Glen? Blessings, Jane - Original Message - From: Glen Atkinson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, February 18, 2002 8:39 PM Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: Radionics (Drought update) Gil I support your concerns here. The little amount of playing around with my pipe tells me it is a very powerful instrument that can very easily be abused, consciously or unconsciously. And my experiements with the BD preps show me they are also very powerful and can create chaos if used inappropriately. Given that very few people on the planet actually understand the spiritual activity of each of the preps and what they do at various potencies, I am a tad afraid of what this sudden burst of broadcasting of them will ultimately be doing to themselves and every living being in their environment. Given the relatively little ability folk have for viewing life Biodynamically - seeing what the preps do to plants and animals - then they will probably allow any inbalance to perpetuate for much longer than is healthy and so on. So yes highly skilled practitioners are needed for these devices. For many years I was not inclined to spread potentised prep knowledge to BDers as they do not have or seem interested in gaining the skills to use them. The 'cat is out of the bag' though now, so it is better people have access to how to understand them, if they wish, than not. WHich is why I am prepared to travel about the planet showing my basic understanding and making my books and diagrams available for free on the web in the vain hope that they will be read, understood and applied in a manner that can make for conscious preparation usage. Dowsing I am concerned though does not take steps toward conscious understanding, it sets folk free with an inexact technique for diagnosis to apply powerful substances thru a powerful instrument to a wide area of land. Scarey Interestingly there is little chance any form of 'legislation' of this practise will arise soon as this will neccessitate scientific acknowledgment that a highly dilute water sample contained in a closed bottle can influence a simple copper circuit powered by the earth. Yeah right. So folks this is a self regulating society. Do 'we' have the morality to actually learn consciously what we are doing and exercise some level of caution and restraint on its development and distribution or is it every being for themselves regardless of outcome? Glen A Gil Robertson wrote: Hi! Jane, Hugh and the List. I agree with your concerns about some one driving a Cosmic Pipe or other Radionic Device and putting out energy other than that which is desired. I could make your skin crawl with stories about inappropriate use and miss use of these devices. That is one of the reasons that there is specialised knowledge that is not in the public domain. While one can open up a Radionic Instrument or Device and copy it, there are some things that are not apparent, that are unlikely to be observed and the resulting instrument will not be as powerful as is possible. This is an area in which I differ from Hugh. I do not think that devices like his Field Broadcaster should be in the public domain. I think it requires specialist knowledge along with a high degree of responsibility for the resulting broadcast. I note that I do not know of anyone who has actually followed his design to the last turn on a coil. It seems to be human nature to improve things. Every deviation from hugh's design, be it the number of turns, the diameter of a coil or the wire gauge, changes the function of the device. If you have ever built an old style radio, you will know how important this is. When one gets to making Preps and setting the boundary of the broadcast, is where knowledge and taking responsibility really become important. You may be growing a vegetable crop, such as grass to be grazed, and want to pile on nitrogen, but the next farm may be into a fruit crop, if your broadcast trespasses, you could wipe out his income!!! I really think these things should be operated by trained, accredited folk, possibly supplying the service in some form of profit sharing, based on the crop produced above average. Do
Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Our winter in NH has been quite dry. Unusually dry. Much too dry. Essie At 07:44 AM 2/20/02 -0700, you wrote: Dear List: Our experience at Aurora Farm for the past two years or so has been one where we have to work much harder at the sequential sprays in order to bring that Blessed Moisture. And we would have to very much agree with Peter Thompkins take on having devices(eloptic) any where in one's vicinity. Too much atmospheric interference for nature to find a balance. How has everyone's winter been? Dry? Blessings, Barbara Aurora Farm is the only unsubsidized, family-run seed farm in North America offering garden seeds grown using Rudolf Steiner's methods of spiritual agriculture. http://www.kootenay.com/~aurora -Original Message- From: Steven McFadden [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Monday, February 18, 2002 3:01 PM Subject: Re: Radionics (Drought update) how does this new information jive with the growing belief among growers that tiny manmade airborne particles are being intentionally released in the atmosphere? Most uncomfortably, I should say. - S Steven McFadden Chiron Communications 7 Avenida Vista Grande #195 Santa Fe, NM 87508 USA http://www.chiron-communications.com
Re: Radionics (Drought update)
I wish you'd comment on this info a bit more. What intentional particles? And intention--who's and how to counteract this? Jane - I talk to farmer regularly - particularly farmers in California's Central Valley - who believe that the u.s. airforce is depositing small particles of aluminum in the atmosphere. They are doing this with alarming regularity and the effects of these drops can often be seen, they tell me, by long lasting 'vapor trails.' I'm told that at times the sky over the valley becomes a checkerboard, with enough lines to make over a hundred squares in the sky. Of course, there is even less rainfall in the area than usual. What's up and why? Who knows? Plausible explanations: the military working with the forces of globalization to make certain that all U.S. commercial agriculture will occur in other countries? The airforce working for the insurance companies to put an end to strong tropical storms reaching the U.S. mainland? The airforce working overtime to insure record snows in Utah for the Olympics? Who knows... But, it's stuff like this that's making cloudbusting - - with it's ability to suck clouds of anti-life forces out of the sky - - a growing operation on savvy biological farms. Here's a question for you: why is the government so concerned that I wear my seatbelt that they hold more roadblocks for checking seatbelts than they ever do for checking exhaust systems for leaks, or breaks, or wipers, or, it seems to me, sobriety. -Allan
Re: Radionics (Drought update)
At 09:52 PM 2/14/02 +1100, James and Barbara wrote: This proposition is backed up by the use of Sai Baba's Sanjeevini healing cards that can be downloaded from his web page. Would you please send me the web address - I can't seem to locate the cards. Thanks, Essie Hull
Re: Fwd: Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Hi Gil --- Yeah I did it again eh -- garbled my message! I was referring to the use of radionic analysis to build physical fertiliser programs which is a bit outside of BD but common practice in eco farming circles. When we couple this with the situation of commission sales or permanent employment (the product seller)representing a particular product (supersoup brand x or whatever) then there is a real problem. This is already happening and is getting radionics a bad name. Some of these guys will be at that weekend special I referred to. This is the sort of thing you are trying to stop and a major reason that I agree with you even tho I have no proper training!! Cheers Lloyd Charles Gil wrote I am a little puzzled by how on earth can an operator (regardless of his inherent honesty) get a proper and beneficial analysis result when the whole purpose and INTENT of sitting down at the instrument was to increase his sales of brand X supersoup or whatever .
Re: Radionics (Drought update)
This just in - research on disturbed rain patterns worldwide. Sigh, Steven New satellite data shows tiny airborne particles are changing rainfall patterns around the world, researchers said Sunday. The man-made particles, mostly from burning fossil fuels, make it more difficult for clouds to form and less likely to rain if they do form, researchers said at the annual meeting of the American Association for the Advancement of Science. Because they block sunlight, these tiny particles slow down evaporation from lakes and oceans, said conference participant Daniel Rosenfeld of the Hebrew University of Jerusalem. So they suppress clouds in the first place, he said. What's more, he said, the particles are too small to form the seeds of raindrops, so the clouds that do form ... have a hard time to rain. The analysis, he said, is based on new data from a joint American-Japanese satellite that uses radar to examine particles in both shallow clouds, near the Earth's surface, and the large, high clouds that contribute most of the rainfall. http://www.upi.com/view.cfm?StoryID=17022002-040642-4951r Steven McFadden, Director Chiron Communications 7 Avenida Vista Grande #195 Santa Fe, NM 87508 USA http://www.chiron-communications.com
Re: Radionics (Drought update)
So, Steve, et al, how does this new information jive with the growing belief among growers that tiny manmade airborne particles are being intentionally released in the atmosphere? -Allan This just in - research on disturbed rain patterns worldwide. Sigh, Steven New satellite data shows tiny airborne particles are changing rainfall patterns around the world, researchers said Sunday. The man-made particles, mostly from burning fossil fuels, make it more difficult for clouds to form and less likely to rain if they do form, researchers said at the annual meeting of the American Association for the Advancement of Science.
Re: Fwd: Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Hi! Jane, Hugh and the List. I agree with your concerns about some one driving a Cosmic Pipe or other Radionic Device and putting out energy other than that which is desired. I could make your skin crawl with stories about inappropriate use and miss use of these devices. That is one of the reasons that there is specialised knowledge that is not in the public domain. While one can open up a Radionic Instrument or Device and copy it, there are some things that are not apparent, that are unlikely to be observed and the resulting instrument will not be as powerful as is possible. This is an area in which I differ from Hugh. I do not think that devices like his Field Broadcaster should be in the public domain. I think it requires specialist knowledge along with a high degree of responsibility for the resulting broadcast. I note that I do not know of anyone who has actually followed his design to the last turn on a coil. It seems to be human nature to improve things. Every deviation from hugh's design, be it the number of turns, the diameter of a coil or the wire gauge, changes the function of the device. If you have ever built an old style radio, you will know how important this is. When one gets to making Preps and setting the boundary of the broadcast, is where knowledge and taking responsibility really become important. You may be growing a vegetable crop, such as grass to be grazed, and want to pile on nitrogen, but the next farm may be into a fruit crop, if your broadcast trespasses, you could wipe out his income!!! I really think these things should be operated by trained, accredited folk, possibly supplying the service in some form of profit sharing, based on the crop produced above average. Do you demand the right to have access to an operating theatre and doing your own surgery? When you fly between countries, do you insist on sitting up front and driving, while taking an active part in weather prediction and air craft movement control, or do you accept that there are some specialist jobs, better let to others? I am suspicious of radionics or any other medical procedure performed without Love. I assure you that a properly trained Radionic Practitioner works within love. Gil
Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Thanks Allan, Points taken. As I said, I do not understand how there can be a basis in Law, by which one can do that. The term was in general use in many countries long before the trademark was issued, thus in any Law System based on either Common Law or Statue Law, could not Trademark it. Example: Goodyear has a Trademark on the word in that particular font, any one can have a goodyear, as long as it is not in those particular letters. A simple challenge would have the matter set aside, but it is easier to bitch about a Them than doing something about. Why not just go ahead and use Biodynamic, BD etc and let Them spend their money in the Courts to try and establish their right to the lie. I very much doubt if proper legal advice would encourage them to do this and thus risk having the Court strip them of their claim and show them to be the egotistical fools them seem to be. Like wise the U.S. Patent on indigenous seeds not worth the paper it is written, if tested, as U.S. Patent Office can only grant tittle to original intellectual property that has not passed into the public domain. Generations of use, void any tittle that the U.S. Patent office or anyone else offers. I very much doubt the Multinationals would risk allowing a Court action go to determination over this as they would undoubtedly loose. They would try to out spend any challenger, then settle out of Court at the last possible moment, avoiding a determination at all cost. I have no qualms about germinating any seed that I choose, believing that the forces that made the seed a reality, are other than human. Get real and do not believe all that you are told. Many actually believe that George Washington's Dad's apple tree was a cherry tree. Gil
Re: Fwd: Re: Radionics (Drought update)
- Original Message - From: Gil Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, February 19, 2002 9:36 AM Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: Radionics Accreditation Dear Gil and list -- My remarks here are to be taken as only applying to experimental use of radionics in agriculture Gil wrote Hi! Jane, Hugh and the List. I agree with your concerns about some one driving a Cosmic Pipe or other Radionic Device and putting out energy other than that which is desired. Me too. but I have a serious problem in that I am one of the un-trained un-accredited people who has come to this with only my integrity and good intent (And common sense) We also need to look at what is the alternative - In my case (I can already hear the gasps of horror ) the alternative would have been a continuation of chemical farming in some form, but the use of potentised remedies in field broadcasters or instruments of similar ilk will be the most valuable tool (of many) that we use to get us out of it. And I'm sorry folks but I refuse to hand my farm over to the banks and chemical companies because of some idealistic system that would not deliver a satisfactory result in my situation. Gil again This is an area in which I differ from Hugh. I do not think that devices like his Field Broadcaster should be in the public domain. I think it requires specialist knowledge along with a high degree of responsibility for the resulting broadcast. My background says that I should argue with Gil but I find it very difficult to disagree. A wise fellow once told me to remember that the potential to do good (with any instrument or machine) will always be about equal to the potential to do damage - thus it requires a higher level of intellect and ability to operate a bulldozer than a shovel. If we see Gil's emphasis on training as an opportunity for those already practicing radionics to quietly exclude unsuitable people before they advance far enough to do real harm then I agree. However I feel that this process is already in place - I got good guidance, and a well timed dose of cautionary advice from Hugh Lovel when I started with the field broadcaster. And have had similar help and guidance from others - including a couple of magic days at James and Barbara Hedley's place recently. As far as the weekend specials go (there is another one on in South Australia soon I hear) they are a training excercise for the organisers but the attrition rate is extraordinarily high - there are 2 dial analysers sitting in the bottom of wardrobes all over the place - if these guys can afford to waste $3000 to $7000 in such a manner then so be it - The problem that I have with radionics is the product sellers. This is a serious and very dangerous situation - how on earth can an operator (regardless of his inherent honesty) get a proper and beneficial analysis result when the whole purpose and INTENT of sitting down at the instrument was to increase his sales of brand X supersoup or whatever - after all there's a payment due on the new mercedes 4 wheel drive next week and the bank needs a bit of a top up. How do you stop this with regulation or accreditation?? I would like to hear more from other list members on this as I can see the sense in both Gil's and Hugh's argument but sittin' on the fence is a dangerous policy long term. Cheers all Lloyd Charlers
Re: Fwd: Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Gil I support your concerns here. The little amount of playing around with my pipe tells me it is a very powerful instrument that can very easily be abused, consciously or unconsciously. And my experiements with the BD preps show me they are also very powerful and can create chaos if used inappropriately. Given that very few people on the planet actually understand the spiritual activity of each of the preps and what they do at various potencies, I am a tad afraid of what this sudden burst of broadcasting of them will ultimately be doing to themselves and every living being in their environment. Given the relatively little ability folk have for viewing life Biodynamically - seeing what the preps do to plants and animals - then they will probably allow any inbalance to perpetuate for much longer than is healthy and so on. So yes highly skilled practitioners are needed for these devices. For many years I was not inclined to spread potentised prep knowledge to BDers as they do not have or seem interested in gaining the skills to use them. The 'cat is out of the bag' though now, so it is better people have access to how to understand them, if they wish, than not. WHich is why I am prepared to travel about the planet showing my basic understanding and making my books and diagrams available for free on the web in the vain hope that they will be read, understood and applied in a manner that can make for conscious preparation usage. Dowsing I am concerned though does not take steps toward conscious understanding, it sets folk free with an inexact technique for diagnosis to apply powerful substances thru a powerful instrument to a wide area of land. Scarey Interestingly there is little chance any form of 'legislation' of this practise will arise soon as this will neccessitate scientific acknowledgment that a highly dilute water sample contained in a closed bottle can influence a simple copper circuit powered by the earth. Yeah right. So folks this is a self regulating society. Do 'we' have the morality to actually learn consciously what we are doing and exercise some level of caution and restraint on its development and distribution or is it every being for themselves regardless of outcome? Glen A Gil Robertson wrote: Hi! Jane, Hugh and the List. I agree with your concerns about some one driving a Cosmic Pipe or other Radionic Device and putting out energy other than that which is desired. I could make your skin crawl with stories about inappropriate use and miss use of these devices. That is one of the reasons that there is specialised knowledge that is not in the public domain. While one can open up a Radionic Instrument or Device and copy it, there are some things that are not apparent, that are unlikely to be observed and the resulting instrument will not be as powerful as is possible. This is an area in which I differ from Hugh. I do not think that devices like his Field Broadcaster should be in the public domain. I think it requires specialist knowledge along with a high degree of responsibility for the resulting broadcast. I note that I do not know of anyone who has actually followed his design to the last turn on a coil. It seems to be human nature to improve things. Every deviation from hugh's design, be it the number of turns, the diameter of a coil or the wire gauge, changes the function of the device. If you have ever built an old style radio, you will know how important this is. When one gets to making Preps and setting the boundary of the broadcast, is where knowledge and taking responsibility really become important. You may be growing a vegetable crop, such as grass to be grazed, and want to pile on nitrogen, but the next farm may be into a fruit crop, if your broadcast trespasses, you could wipe out his income!!! I really think these things should be operated by trained, accredited folk, possibly supplying the service in some form of profit sharing, based on the crop produced above average. Do you demand the right to have access to an operating theatre and doing your own surgery? When you fly between countries, do you insist on sitting up front and driving, while taking an active part in weather prediction and air craft movement control, or do you accept that there are some specialist jobs, better let to others? I am suspicious of radionics or any other medical procedure performed without Love. I assure you that a properly trained Radionic Practitioner works within love. Gil -- Garuda Biodynamics - for BD Preps, Consultations, Books Diagrams See our web site @ http://get.to/garuda
Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Gil, The Sanjeevini cards are awesome. Thank you to you and James and Barbara Hadley for bringing them to my (and other list members') attention. There is nothing that would indicate to me that these prayers are anything but pure. And yet I have the hardest time reconciling these with the rumblings that surfaced in Nexus a couple of years ago. Before that I held Sai Baba in the highest regard. What is one like me to do? Virginia
Re: Fwd: Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Glen - You present concerns that Peter Tompkins expressed to me a couple of years back. Peter is so concerned about the misuse of eloptic energy that he will neither towers of power nor cosmic pipes on his property. He also expressed concern for what would become of mankind if radionics was used by those who want to supress Life rather than expand it. Broadcasting, from whatever device, is a horrendous responsibility. I feel that potentized substances themselves are somewhat self-policing, however. -Allan
Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Hi! Virginia, The Sanjeevini cards are awesome. I recognise your concern about things that have been reported about Sai Baba. I to do not know what to make of it. I have read the material in Nexus and in several Web Sites. I know a number of people who have been drawn to him and made the big journey etc and they mostly seem to have got something from it. Personally I have not been drawn to him and not much concerned much about him one way or another. If you read carefully the history of how the cards came into being, it was through a lady who happened to be in contact with him and she had him endorse them, but he was not involved in them coming into the physical. As I recall, the Lady's name was Mrs Poornima Nagpal. She was trained in Malcolm Rae Card type Radionic Instruments and wanted a system that was affordable for people in India. Even the locally produced instruments, are close to the prices in the UK, US and Oz. I think instrument price is related to the very small numbers in use. I am currently trying to find a way of producing quality instruments at a better price, but no easy with the very small numbers required. She prayed and was offered the SSS system and channel it over a periods of weeks or months. You will note the use of fragrances. I understand that they represent the energy pattern of traditional treatments. There are a couple of important points. Instead of instruments costing hundreds or thousands, it uses a fist full of cards and a couple of paper instruments. As the system is offered as a free download, one can obtain it for the cost of downloading and printing. Another is the time involved in each treatment, which is the shortest I know of. It is particularly suited to self treatment and looking after one's own house hold. But it is also used by full time practitioners. Gil Virginia Salares wrote: Gil, The Sanjeevini cards are awesome. Thank you to you and James and Barbara Hadley for bringing them to my (and other list members') attention. There is nothing that would indicate to me that these prayers are anything but pure. And yet I have the hardest time reconciling these with the rumblings that surfaced in Nexus a couple of years ago. Before that I held Sai Baba in the highest regard. What is one like me to do? Virginia
Re: Fwd: Re: Radionics (Drought update)
I agree with all that has been said about the dangers, BUT if we untrained suckers don't do it who will? Do we all sit back and await the guru's arrival? There appears to be the perception that you can just bung in a pipe and get rid of all your weeds and other problems, a silver bullet approach. This has not been my experience. Dr. Elaine Ingham will be in Aust and NZ in March, those who would like to attend her seminars should go to her WebPages. David C - Original Message - From: Lloyd Charles [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, 19 February 2002 1:52 PM Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: Radionics (Drought update) - Original Message - From: Gil Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, February 19, 2002 9:36 AM Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: Radionics Accreditation Dear Gil and list -- My remarks here are to be taken as only applying to experimental use of radionics in agriculture Gil wrote Hi! Jane, Hugh and the List. I agree with your concerns about some one driving a Cosmic Pipe or other Radionic Device and putting out energy other than that which is desired. Me too. but I have a serious problem in that I am one of the un-trained un-accredited people who has come to this with only my integrity and good intent (And common sense) We also need to look at what is the alternative - In my case (I can already hear the gasps of horror ) the alternative would have been a continuation of chemical farming in some form, but the use of potentised remedies in field broadcasters or instruments of similar ilk will be the most valuable tool (of many) that we use to get us out of it. And I'm sorry folks but I refuse to hand my farm over to the banks and chemical companies because of some idealistic system that would not deliver a satisfactory result in my situation. Gil again This is an area in which I differ from Hugh. I do not think that devices like his Field Broadcaster should be in the public domain. I think it requires specialist knowledge along with a high degree of responsibility for the resulting broadcast. My background says that I should argue with Gil but I find it very difficult to disagree. A wise fellow once told me to remember that the potential to do good (with any instrument or machine) will always be about equal to the potential to do damage - thus it requires a higher level of intellect and ability to operate a bulldozer than a shovel. If we see Gil's emphasis on training as an opportunity for those already practicing radionics to quietly exclude unsuitable people before they advance far enough to do real harm then I agree. However I feel that this process is already in place - I got good guidance, and a well timed dose of cautionary advice from Hugh Lovel when I started with the field broadcaster. And have had similar help and guidance from others - including a couple of magic days at James and Barbara Hedley's place recently. As far as the weekend specials go (there is another one on in South Australia soon I hear) they are a training excercise for the organisers but the attrition rate is extraordinarily high - there are 2 dial analysers sitting in the bottom of wardrobes all over the place - if these guys can afford to waste $3000 to $7000 in such a manner then so be it - The problem that I have with radionics is the product sellers. This is a serious and very dangerous situation - how on earth can an operator (regardless of his inherent honesty) get a proper and beneficial analysis result when the whole purpose and INTENT of sitting down at the instrument was to increase his sales of brand X supersoup or whatever - after all there's a payment due on the new mercedes 4 wheel drive next week and the bank needs a bit of a top up. How do you stop this with regulation or accreditation?? I would like to hear more from other list members on this as I can see the sense in both Gil's and Hugh's argument but sittin' on the fence is a dangerous policy long term. Cheers all Lloyd Charlers
Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Hugh Lovel wrote: Snip:- I'm not comfortable with calling myself biodynamic if it means I become associated with the kind of behavior Demeter has shown. I don't want to be branded with the nomenclature of a stuck-up insular cult. I am with you. Gil
Re: Radionics (Drought update)
No, but all this shows is that BD organisations are out of touch with the true wholism of Biodynamics. And so be it. This is a point often made on this list. Glen Gil Robertson wrote: Glen Atkinson wrote: I d like to suggest BD is a complete system and the above are just part of it. You are welcome to do so, but can you show me a BD registering organisation that includes them in their requirements? Gil -- Garuda Biodynamics - for BD Preps, Consultations, Books Diagrams See our web site @ http://get.to/garuda Glen, Gil, Greg, et. al., I like Greg's presentation that the heart of BD is the remedies, and you ain't BD unless you work with the remedies (and do this well). But we know the Demeter Association has a trademark on the term biodynamic and often does NOT work well with the remedies. We also know that Steiner was about as wholistic (holistic) as it gets, and that if we associate anything with biodynamics it is Steiner. Steiner meant to see agriculture be all-embracive and work from what he called the the wider spheres. So whenever I think of biodynamics I think of including everything--bar nothing. However, this is not the perspective of the neophyte who knows nothing of Steiner and can't possibly guess that biodynamic agriculture is so different from all the other reductionist stuff, Allan Savory's Holistic Resource Management excluded. (I gather that Savory would incorporate use of the Steiner Remedies into his resource management if it were clear to him how these worked.) Having said that I guess I can say I agree with Glen that, at least to me, biodynamics is good ol' wholistic agriculture and embraces everything--would embrace chemicals if only these contributed to the overall purity and vitality of what we grow. But words are meant to communicate. It doesn't matter what I mean by a word. What counts is what others think I mean. The word biodynamic or the term BD were trouble enough to communicate with back when Demeter didn't own them. Now, as far as I can see they are hopelessly tainted. So, though we may have a good idea of who and what we are, how to communicate this? I give up on using BD as a term. I see much more prospect in talking about the Steiner Remedies. If folks respond to Steiner Remedies I can explain further and introduce more about wholistic thinking. See where I'm coming from? We get into these discussions and it is like lawyers spliting hairs. But we must get clear on terms. On the other hand, when we can't we are free to use any terms or no terms at all. Good ol' Babylon. Kind of a lawyer's dream. To me the best thing that has happened to Steiner's work is that Demeter (Anne Mendenhall) has said We own the term biodynamic and we control its use. Now if you want to really use Steiner's ideas in freedom you have to go beyond the term biodynamic. Now it is free. By raising the issue and trying to clamp a lid on things Demeter has done us all a favor. Now the box is open and the blessings have infiltrated the wider spheres. Reverse Pandora. Best, Hugh P.S. Can someone please post this on SANET? I'm off that list for now. --HL
Re: Fwd: Re: Radionics (Drought update)
It was written, So why not use Radionic Devices and do it from the comfort of the office? This is what worries (for lack of a better way of putting it) the more archaic folk. Why not put your love for your kids in a radionic device and do so from the comfort of the office? It seems to me that the major difference between BD and other Ag is conscious spirituality. Let's stop bashing the traditionalists for how ignorant they/I am (though I don't consider myself either) and understand that this whole form of ag is like a living prayer. The only problem that I see arising from this whole debate is the bickering amongst brothers and sisters and the possibility to cookie cutter Biodynamics with the type of attitude depicted above. I truly do not mean to bash anyone. It is just a shame to see such a wonderful concept turn into such bickering, anger and the need to prove or put down. Just think on this for a moment. As we have simplified or production, what has happened. First we have not created more time for ourselves as was the intent but less. We have solved a handful of problems to create a mountain more. And the quality of stuff now is crap. When embarking on a new technology I believe that we have to understand that this is the trend of humanity. Keeping this these concepts in mind in our creative endeavors can only help the outcome. In Love and Light, Chris
Re: Fwd: Re: Radionics (Drought update)
I truly do not mean to bash anyone. It is just a shame to see such a wonderful concept turn into such bickering, anger and the need to prove or put down. Just for the record, Chris, I missed the anger and bickering that seems to have disturbed you. I've just seen Gil, Glen, Hugh, Jane, et al trying to get a better grasp of each others understanding of what biodynamics is. (Among other things.) Gotta break some eggs to make omlets. Gotta smash some rocks together to make sparks. A lot of good ideas come through when folks like these start butting heads. Aside from this, how would this really work any other way, other than for the whole group to sit still and assume that one or two people really knew what biodynamics is/was/shall be and then plan to just listen to them? And then we can all done a pious mode, knowing that we know someone who knows? Well, that's not the way we do it here on Biodynamics Now! Aside from all of that, I think we've all come a long way in extending a modicum of civility as we share our insights and feelings. Folks, be polite by all means, and, yes, inhabit a living a prayer, but please don't allow yourself to be ashamed to share a divergent opinion, or a heartfelt question. -Allan Balliett moderator, BD Now!
Re: Radionics (Drought update) FOR BDNOW
Please Forward. Thanks. I truly do not mean to bash anyone. It is just a shame to see such a wonderful concept turn into such bickering, anger and the need to prove or put down. Dear Chris, Allan, Hugh, Glen, et al, Well, that's one opinion. Everyone has one. We all tend to see things through our own experiences and prejudices and I think that this is a particularly prejudiced view. As I see it, there are two opposing forces at work in Steiner Agriculture going on in the U.S. at this moment. I base this on many facts, not the least of which is the absconding of term biodynamic by Demeter Co. But hey, let's not, for the moment, focus on all the incredibly stupid and self-serving things that Demeter, BDA and JPI have done in the past 20 years, let's focus on what's really going on. The two opposing forces are represented on the one hand, by those, generally, in/on BDNOW who want to explore, expand, modify, improve, innovate and apply hard science as well as, shall we say, 'not so hard' or intuitive, metaphysical science to the notions and suggestions that Steiner brought to the world in his lectures and through other means. In other words, work to make it grow and become more effective and acceptable. We're the group struggling to find a simple word to define what we do and what Steiner did that's not biodynamic. On the other hand, or side, is the group of people who believe in and support the BDA, Demeter and JPI. These people represent the ones who want total control (re: trademark) over all that is biodynamic in the U.S. and beyond. I say beyond since the rulers at Dornach have approved and financed the vapid, unethical treachery carried out by BDA/DAI/JPI. (I digress.) Generally, this group can be characterized by a LACK of desire to explore, expand, modify, improve, innovate, apply hard science and develop 'not so hard' science or intuitive insights to what Steiner offered. They are more interested in promoting and preserving a religion than in helping others and by virtue of their exclusive knowledge (as Lorand once told me only for the BD priesthood) and control of biodynamics in such a way that money flows to their organizations and officially sponsored consultants, they perpetuate their organizations rather than develop, legitimize, expand and bring Steiner Agriculture to the greater world, as RS wanted. You may disagree with these characterizations. That's OK. This is how I see it, however. There is a general dialog on BDNOW, which, on occasion, includes bickering, anger, the need to prove and put down, as within any family, but more often than not includes a lot of information about Steiner and related practices that would never see the light of day in the BDA journal, on the Demeter website/newsletter or in JPI publications. They simply don't have the far ranging, wild-ass point of view of Steiner that others do. (In looking for legitimacy, i.e. control, they have lost their credibility.) They have limited imaginations and a limited understanding of the Universal Laws and Principles underpinning Steiner's work. Frankly, I don't think they even understand Steiner. If they did, they'd be way ahead of us with new products and innovations.) Forgive them. They don't understand BDNOW, one of the most used listserve sites on the internet, and it's potential for spreading THEIR point of view. Now I ask you the most important question in this missive. Have you ever seen any attempt at dialog by the self-appointed leaders of the official biodynamic associations - BDA, DAI or JPI - on BDNOW? Maybe once or twice in the past. I'm talking now. Here's where the gauntlet is thrown down. IF THEY REALLY BELIEVED WHAT THEY SAY AND PROMOTE, THEY'D ENGAGE IN THE DIALOG ON BDNOW and would defend what they do and say vigorously. They don't. And it's easy to figure out why. When was the last time you read an email from Anne Mendenhall (Secretary of BDA and Director - Demeter), Chuck Beedy (Executive Director - BDA), Andrew Lorand and Alan York (BDA approved BD consultants), Lincoln Geiger (Board Member - Demeter and BDA), Heinz Grotzke (Associate Editor Biodynamics), Jean Yeager (VP - BDA and Anthroposophy Association Bigwig), Hugh Courtney (Director JPI and BDA), Ernie Harvey (Prez. BDA), Christoph Altemueller (BDA Board) or Harold Hoven (Director - BDA and gardener/teacher at the Rudolf Steiner College in Sacramento)? You don't and you won't. None of them has the courage of their convictions to debate in public on BDNOW. They prefer the dark corners of agriculture over which they think they have influence. That's why they stole the trademark. They're not interested in any change or excoriation that could erode their influence or hurt their pocketbooks. Control is what they sell. Not enlightenment. If they really believed in what they were doing and believed in Steiner's desire to carry his work around the world, they'd be on the list. Pure and simple. (By the way, please
Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Hugh Lovel wrote: Snip - To me the best thing that has happened to Steiner's work is that Demeter (Anne Mendenhall) has said We own the term biodynamic and we control its use. Now if you want to really use Steiner's ideas in freedom you have to go beyond the term biodynamic. I do not understand under which Legal System, Demeter or anyone else can claim ownership of either the name or the concept. Once something has been put in the public domain (published) it is not able to be Patented. Even if something is Patented, an individual can make one for one's own use, but not to sell the actual item, but I believe one can use one's own replica to make something else and sell that. Example: you access the Patent of a device to cut holes in reinforced concrete and make your copy of the device, you can use that s part of your business, but not sell the actual device. I do not believe Demeter can claim any contribution to the intellectual property. I do not think that RS claimed that anything he offered was uniquely his original work. I understand that in the Agricultural Lectures, he was reintroducing old customs, that had been lost through changing practises and offering some explanation as to how they may function, as he encouraged us to innovate. Gil
Re: Fwd: Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Allan Balliett wrote: Snip - Folks, be polite by all means, and, yes, inhabit a living a prayer, but please don't allow yourself to be ashamed to share a divergent opinion, or a heartfelt question. Here here, Gil
Re: Radionics (Drought update)
HUGH wrote.. Yes point taken. In the US the term Biodynamics is owned by an organisation and thus they can define it. Here in NZ it is a generic word and one of its meaning is 'a agricultural system based on the indications of RS'. Which according to my reading allows for all things mentioned. If we - elsewhere in the world- allow it to be defined by the organisiations then thats all it will be, however RS work is so completely wholistic it deserves more than to be left to 'them'. So yes in the US its a dead word and Gils comment stands, elswhere it is what we the practioners make it and the Associations are just monuments to certain individuals egos and near on irrelevant except to a fanatical few. Im for holding the vision of BD as wholistic and continuing on. When in the US I guess I will have to use Quantum Ag or some such term. hum bummer. Glen Hugh Lovel wrote: Gil Robertson wrote: While BD is the best Ag System we have to date. It is at this time, not a complete system. We also have to consider Paramagnetics, water restructuring, mineral balance, clay spreading, gypsum spreading, ameliorating salinity etc. I d like to suggest BD is a complete system and the above are just part of it. Glen Dear Glen, et. al., I might amend that suggestion. If we stick with the nomenclature of BD or biodynamic we have to deal with a long entrenched cult mentality that is close-minded to certain innovations. Despite the work of Lily Kolisko the BD mentality has largely stuck with and insisted upon an antiquated system of stirring and spraying that the vast majority of farmers simply are unable to accomplish. I believe that's the position of the Demeter organizations worldwide. To be certified BD you have to stir each remedy separately for an hour and then spray. You don't do this. Greg doesn't do this. I don't do this. Each in our own ways we use homeopathic potencies and at the very least we combine remedies and eliminate the lengthy stirring process. I'm told here in the states that isn't acceptable for BD certification. And you've seen how the horn manure remedy has been overused, liming has been discouraged, etc. by BD pedagogues. Horn clay is not accepted in orthodox circles here in the states. Radionics is not accepted. Dowsing is given the hex sign by many in the old guard. Somehow rotational grazing and compost tea has slipped past all the censors I'm aware of but I'm not so sure about paramagnetics, water restructuring, cloudbusting, weather patterning, etc. What I'm saying is we can't use the term BD or biodynamic to indicate a complete system way of thinking because the owners of these terms aren't all-embracing enough to let such a thing happen. We may use these terms as all-embracing on our own behalf, but somewhere along the line we will run into flak for it. This gives an appearance to outsiders that, yes, BD is a somewhat narrow cult, and how many are willing to submit to passing the litmus tests for BD certification when these tests are to say the very least arcane? Do you pass the tests in NZ? I don't pass the tests here in the states, I assure you. Shucks. BD has ended up with some all-embracing folks involved in it, I think because one has to be pretty all-embracing to get to BD. But as it stands I think the die-hard BD organizations will never be all-embracing. Best wishes, Hugh -- Garuda Biodynamics - for BD Preps, Consultations, Books Diagrams See our web site @ http://get.to/garuda
Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Hi! Virginia, Thank you for sharing your experiences. There are so many stories of people taking responsibility for there patch without chemicals and I am very interested in the concept of being able to control precipitation and evaporation. I flew over many deserts on my way to England and found the contrast with the lush condition there against my own area. When I asked the local rainfall, I found it was about the same as we get, they have very little evaporation, where as we have six feet or more. I want to work on reducing evaporation in desert regions. As for which instrument to start learning on. I am afraid I would suggest you do a formal course with some one like Lutie Larson. I would expect that she would teach you at least four instruments as that is really the minimum, in time you will most likely learn even more. The instruments are quite an investment as is training and has to take place over a longish period.. There is far to much to learn in a few days of instant coffee courses and one needs to do case studies to learn. If you noticed a post by James Hedley, he mentions the Sai Sanjeevini System. This is a paper based Radionic System that can be down loaded free from the internet along with extensive instructions. In my case, I printed the cards and covered them on both sides with clear contact. There are two paper instruments included. The function is modelled very much on the Malcolm Rae Card instruments, but with great simplification. WIth SSS, there are about 265 cards, while there are many thousands for the Rae system. They are a good starting point and are used by many of us as well as more complex systems. If I am working with some one wanting to give up smoking, I will often give them the SSS Card, so they can do there own bit as well. I am yet to find a distant learning course in Radionics that is comprehensive. If anyone has one, feel free to send a copy for me to have a look at. So my suggestion would be to get in contact with the Larsons and find out what they offer and down load the SSS. Gil Virginia Salares wrote: Gil, Thank you for sharing your knowledge of radionics.
Re: Radionics (Drought update)
I guess I didn't understand what this meant until this post for which I thank you all. Having been an artist in my previous incarnation in this life, paper is something I could get excited about. Now blessed water by paper...wow! I'm ready! I always suspected there must be some really good purpose for art. But this is not the same as using a radionic device, machine or instrument is it? Dear Jane, My Webster's isn't much help in defining what a radionic instrument is. Neither is it any help with Astral, Etheric, and some other such words that are frequently used on this list. Someday I must write the publishers. Definitions of words are hardly cut and dried, as Steiner so sptly chose to emphasize. It is common to have four or five definitions of any given word. My Webster's has 17 definitions of the word of. That's a pretty common word and the trend is to have fewer definitions on the less commonly used words. As we use words their definitions rightly should grow. We might define a radionic instrument variously. Heironymus engaged in a long correspondence back in the fifties with John W. Campbell, Editor of Astounding Science Fiction, aka ANALOG. It comprises nearly 80 pages in Hieronymus's autobiography, THE STORY OF ELOPTIC ENERGY. Campbell made an india ink drawing of the parts of Hieronymus's eloptic analyser on poster board, assembled them and demonstrated the drawings worked just as well as the hardware model. This seemed to put radionics in the realm of magic and mystery. But as we know magic is naught but science that is unexplained. William A. Tiller's book SCIENCE AND HUMAN TRANSFORMATION (which I'm slowly plowing through) seems to go a long way towards opening up the physics of why a paper model can be just as effective as hardware. Still I believe Hieronymus and Campbell would have agreed both the hardware Hieronymus Analyser and the posterboard india ink model were bona fide radionic instruments. So where do you draw the line? Both instruments are vias for human intention. Both are mechanical tools, of if you will, machines. As such the Sanathana Sai Sanjeevini cards qualify as radionic instruments seems to me. But if I was writing dictionaries such an application of the term would require an additional definition to accomodate those who disagree. Nonetheless I would go along with James Hedley's classification of the cards as a paper based radionic system. That's as good a description of them as I know of. Best, Hugh
Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Gil Robertson wrote While BD is the best Ag System we have to date. It is at this time, not a complete system. We also have to consider Paramagnetics, water restructuring, mineral balance, clay spreading, gypsum spreading, ameliorating salinity etc. The delivering of BD to large acreage's is a major logistic challenge. Sorry purists, but I see Radionics as the only way to deliver. I have read RS several times and each time very carefully. I note that He was about energy as his explanation of many things. I believe he would take Radionics on board with both hands. He emphatically encouraged us to take his work further and suggested what he offered was but a beginning. Unfortunately, there are some who try to regard his agriculture talks as if it was a religious text and frozen in time. That was not his intention and he even intended to deliver at least other series of talks, but passed on before that came to be. I challenge all to speculate on what would have been included in those and try and pencil it in and try it. Gil Brilliant Thank you Gil Lloyd Charles
Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Thanks for your explanation Markess. I was unfamiliar with the term conings as you had assumed. As for radionics, I am a bit surprised that you (of course I don't know you so I'm not sure why I am surprised...) use a radionic device. I am NOT a bd purist, or purist of any kind. However, my intuition or gut instinct of depending on such a device is that it is a form of giving away one's power. I think it useful to use tools to train ourselves to be the instrument, making the tool ultimately redundant. So if these gauge's, pipes, machines help you eventually learn to do all of these things by hand as you say, then more power to you! (forgive the pun). I am sure to hear cries of treason on this list as we know many who swear by these devices, which I know have been around a while. Perhaps it's a form of laziness to allow/expect devices to take up such patrols for you? I mean no disrespect from this--we all have time constraints and make choices as to what acts to perform ourselves and which to have others or other things do for us. Dear Jane, Giving away one's power? Basically a radionic instrument is a vehicle for intent. Prayer is efficacious, but as a vehicle all we have is a brief focus of our thought, and often our intent is very, very general. With radionic instruments we can ask questions as well as set up treatments that are extremely specific. And then we use the instrument as a way of focusing and stabilizing our intent for specific periods of time. Thus with radionic instruments we EXTEND our power, which is a far cry from giving it away. Best, Hugh Lovel
Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Gil Robertson wrote: While BD is the best Ag System we have to date. It is at this time, not a complete system. We also have to consider Paramagnetics, water restructuring, mineral balance, clay spreading, gypsum spreading, ameliorating salinity etc. I d like to suggest BD is a complete system and the above are just part of it. Glen
Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Markess wrote: So do you sense this in your gut as an emotion or in your heart mind as a feeling? Dear Markess, Hugh Gil et al, I should be more specific with my words. I do not have 'thoughts' about this, but more a knowing. We are vibratory creatures. We have the ability to form, focus and hold intent and project that holographically. We can be working with trees, in partnership with nature, further deepening the vibratory rate of our intent...Or we can be clear channels as in Reiki as you say. Really I think we could do whatever we want, in whatever form of energy signature in the way of accessing, holding, sending, being 'energy' with nothing more than our own bodies. Hugh, if you say people cannot hold focus or stabilize detailed intent, but that you can tell a machine to do this for you, don't you FIRST have to give the machine those detailed instructions? What, you can't work in the realm of the invisible and have such conditions on your request, visualization, manifestation whatever? One can't include in one's intent a time and space element? Why not? Why does a machine do this better than I can? The deeper I connect with my vibratory self, the more I see is possible to see in the invisible realms. The more I work in partnership with my higher self and my guides, the more there is to hear there. It's like any other practice. Having said that I also would say that I have not used a radionic device that I am aware of. The part of me that I call my intuition, which is something I have worked on with for many decades, the part that gives me unfailingly good advice (well, except for the time I blurted out that the human body is the perfect radionic instrument)--is real clear about radionic devices. For me, it is a clear NO. Why? I feel/know that if for some reason my intent is not for the greater good, that Nature, in her infinite wisdom can act in a self-regulating manner that is for the greater good. I do not feel a machine has such abilities. Why not use a tree for broadcasting out to large areas? Why not use a circle of trees circumscribing the areas to be covered in preps? Why not work in nature? Why can't you set intent in great detail, lovingly co-created with nature? I know you can. Forget belief here. It is a clear knowing. Sorry, have no scientific evidence to back it up. I think it would be great if someone would have a conversation with Steiner about these things! You know, direct perception. Have a talk with Herr Steiner about radionics. Go Gil! Report back to us what he has to say. Blessings, Jane - Original Message - From: Moen Creek [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2002 9:27 PM Subject: Re: Radionics (Drought update) From: jsherry [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Wed, 13 Feb 2002 15:37:05 -0500 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: Radionics (Drought update) But I do believe the human body is the perfect radionic instrument. Blessings, Jane Quoting John Trudell the other day on our local LS Radio WORT We need to believe less think more. Jane what are your thoughts that lead you to this belief. What are your experiences you base them on. John also stated Feelings are how the 'Being' speaks, emotions are all civilization leave us with. So do you sense this in your gut as an emotion or in your heart mind as a feeling? In Love Light Markess PS http://www.johntrudell.com/ has his new CD bone days
Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Glen Atkinson wrote: I d like to suggest BD is a complete system and the above are just part of it. You are welcome to do so, but can you show me a BD registering organisation that includes them in their requirements? Gil
Re: Radionics (Drought update)
instructions? What, you can't work in the realm of the invisible and have such conditions on your request, visualization, manifestation whatever? One can't include in one's intent a time and space element? Why not? Why does a machine do this better than I can? The deeper I connect with my vibratory self, the more I see is possible to see in the invisible realms. The more I work in partnership with my higher self and my guides, the more there is to hear there. It's like any other practice. Having said that I also would say that I have not used a radionic device that I am aware of. The part of me that I call my intuition, which is something I have worked on with for many decades, the part that gives me unfailingly good advice (well, except for the time I blurted out that the human body is the perfect radionic instrument)--is real clear about radionic devices. For me, it is a clear NO. Why? I feel/know that if for some reason my intent is not for the greater good, that Nature, in her infinite wisdom can act in a self-regulating manner that is for the greater good. I do not feel a machine has such abilities. Why not use a tree for broadcasting out to large areas? Why not use a circle of trees circumscribing the areas to be covered in preps? Why not work in nature? Why can't you set intent in great detail, lovingly co-created with nature? I know you can. Forget belief here. It is a clear knowing. Sorry, have no scientific evidence to back it up. I think it would be great if someone would have a conversation with Steiner about these things! You know, direct perception. Have a talk with Herr Steiner about radionics. Go Gil! Report back to us what he has to say. Blessings, Jane - Original Message - From: Moen Creek [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2002 9:27 PM Subject: Re: Radionics (Drought update) From: jsherry [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Wed, 13 Feb 2002 15:37:05 -0500 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: Radionics (Drought update) But I do believe the human body is the perfect radionic instrument. Blessings, Jane Quoting John Trudell the other day on our local LS Radio WORT We need to believe less think more. Jane what are your thoughts that lead you to this belief. What are your experiences you base them on. John also stated Feelings are how the 'Being' speaks, emotions are all civilization leave us with. So do you sense this in your gut as an emotion or in your heart mind as a feeling? In Love Light Markess PS http://www.johntrudell.com/ has his new CD bone days
Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Help! Guys, I know enough from being on this list about what is radionics and where to get info. I wanted to know WHY Markess used a radionic device, not what it is...sorry for the confusion. Thanks for your answer. By giving away one's power, I am not talking about one's personal power, but of being a clear channel. A clear channel dependent on an instrument is not a clear channel. However, I could see where radionics may have a place in diagnostics in my life, perhaps, big maybe. But for practice or healing, if I had a healer who I wanted work from and their concentration was so easily led astray by an attractive person on the street, I would certainly find someone else to work with who had greater powers of concentration and focus. Gotta go, but I want to point out how often on the internet I see people writing lose as loose and loose as lose. When I figure out the significance, I'll let ya know. Blessings on good work, with or without radionic devices. Jane - Original Message - From: Gil Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2002 12:05 AM Subject: Re: Radionics (Drought update) Hi! Jane, Radionics is a formalization of a number of closely related energetic
Re: Radionics (Drought update)
What you say is true of, I believe, any device used to transfer the subtle energies...pendulum, whatever. The instrument is needed for focus, and, after a while, beings will attend to aid the work. Do you know of anyone carrying Drown's work forward? Also, have you ever heard of Oscar Brunler? Sarah Cherry Gil Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi! Jane,Radionics is a formalization of a number of closely related energeticmethodologies. Radionics traces it's history over a similar period as BD. Thereare a number of schools of thought in Radionics and some do not speak to others.Radionics ranges from the very complex to the very simple and across the rangesome thing work much better than others. Some methods require broadcast overlong period, or repeated broadcasts, some are one shot hits, great differences.Some Radionics Practitioners formally trained and others are not even in contactwith another like minded soul. With early work by Abrams, considerabledevelopment was continued by Drown. Most Radionics, as we know it, is post Drownand built on her work and on that of those who came after her. February 2003marks sixty years of Radionics in the UK where most of the major developments! have taken place and much of the research leading to us having some idea of whatactually happens, has taken place. There will be a major conference to mark thedate.Radionics has taken many paths and many dead ends. It seems to me that a highpercentage of those who do the hard miles and actually study it to depth, alsomake some contribution to overview, with new instruments or betterunderstanding. Every now and a again some one will come up with a system thatmakes things over complicated and cumbersome. These divergence's are usuallyshort lived. The really powerful systems in use currently are paper based. Herein Oz, Frank Moody found that the circuit of an instrument, would work as wellas the physical instrument, in the hands of a trained practitioner. He laterdeveloped this further and we can increase our arson of instruments at thephotocopier any time we need more. In India, Western type instruments, even whenmade loc! ally were too dear for the local needs and they came up with the ystem, which will treat a large range of the sort things most people will comeacross. I have previously posted on the joint UK - US development of theMeridian Card System, the fastest working system I know about.With all these systems, it is still necessary to have a good understanding ofwhat you are trying to do. If working on people or animals, you must have theappropriate anatomy and physiology and an understanding of disease and how allthe systems work. In venturing into agriculture or the environment, one shouldhave the required knowledge appropriate to the area of interest.On top of all this, to be a creditable practitioner, one needs to have ones lifein order, as most of what Radionics is about is done by the mind of thepractitioner, thus if one has distractions, lack of concentration or effected bysubstances, your work will reflect that situati! on.Then there is the core knowledge of Radionics. This is to do with anunderstanding of the energies involved, the subtle anatomy and other matterswhich have a meaning in Radionics, which at times is quite different from otherdisciplines. This is only taught person to person and not available in publishedform. It is this that divides the formally trained from those who are not. Thevetting of students before and during training is rigorous and unforgiving.Around the place are many people making instruments without the core knowledge,and while they may work to some extent, they are not a patch on those properlydesigned and constructed.Having studied the core knowledge, the practitioner is free to go on andinnovate and develop Radionics further. The recent major innovation has been theMeridian System. I am currently doing some promising work in the Agriculture/Environmental area.Over time, Radionics has tak! en on board many other vibrational methodologies -Homeopathy, Flower Essences, Gem Essences, several Colour methods etc etc. Thesecan be made up as a pill or liquid, or broadcast direct to the client. To useeach of these, the practitioner must of course also study the field they aregoing to venture into. Thus most of us are continually studying and teaching oneanother. While the basic training is three and a half years, learning is forever.Having rambled at length above, I can now get to the core point of your post.Yes, we can work without instruments, but at the risk of loosing focus. Theinstruments, rates, cards etc are nothing more than a focus for thepractitioner's mind. There are all sort of hazards in non instrument Radionics.Say you are working on a client (Most Radionics is remote - we rarely meet ourclients) and an attractive person walks down the street and catches yourattention, the treatment can be redir! ected to that person and away from theclient. It may not desirable for
Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Hi, Jane, For me, some give a name and some don't. Drown was an early radionics practitioner who developed a marvelous techique for diagnosing the human body. She was so successful she drew fire from the FDA to the extent evidence was actually fabricated for her trial. Trevor Constable wrote of her work and actually studied with her. I'd love to know if any of her devices are still in existance. I'd think there'd be a lot to learn. Brunler was also a radionics practitioner who studied the subtle energy from the crown chakra and felt it correlated with the age of the soul. namaste, Sarah jsherry [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dear Wayne Sarah et al,So you're kind of speaking directly then with your higher selves and thedeva? Do they give you their names?Do you also use the MAP system?And Sarah I am not familiar with Drown nor Brunler. But I do believe thehuman body is the perfect radionic instrument.Blessings,Jane- Original Message -From: "Wayne and Sharon McEachern" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2002 7:49 AMSubject: Re: Radionics (Drought update)Jane -- please read on.Moen Creek wrote:Deva of Light Expression Farm.If we are asking questions about the veggie garden here at the Farm, wewould add the Overlighting Deva of the LE veggie garden.If we are doing a soil balancing in the veggie garden, we would add theOL D! eva of Soil to the Coning.And so forthBest...Wayne*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*Sharon and Wayne McEachernhttp://www.LightExpression.com[EMAIL PROTECTED]"A Divine Program for Healing and Transformation"andExpressing the Light"A Ministry Dedicated to the Divine Process"*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*Do You Yahoo!? Send FREE Valentine eCards with Yahoo! Greetings!
Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Title: Re: Radionics (Drought update) Good old web sez, http://www.chirobase.org/12Hx/drown.html This article originally appeared in the April 1968 issue of Today's Health, a magazine published by the American Medical Association. During the 1960s and 1970s, the author investigated and wrote about many quackery-related topics. After that, he taught communications at Howard University and developed a writing and editing service, which he still operates today. The date of the crime was May 23, 1963. more at http://www.syntac.net/hoax/drown.php including lots of insults slander, photos to! In the well LL Markess From: jsherry [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Wed, 13 Feb 2002 17:29:14 -0500 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: Radionics (Drought update) Drown
Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Dear Jane, please read on. jsherry wrote: Dear Wayne Sarah et al, So you're kind of speaking directly then with your higher selves and the deva? That would be fair to say. We use dowsing and / kinesiology to communicate with the coning. And, as you can see from the original post, there may be many different members of the Devic community participating in the coning depending on the specific information which you are seeking. Do they give you their names? We have never asked. I should say that I should say that I have never asked. I don't believe that Sharon has -- or else she would have mentioned it to me. The love and appreciation is always felt and the Devic community at large is there on every property waiting for the owners to consciously communicate and participate in a co-creative process. Do you also use the MAP system? We have used the MAP system. Currently, we are working with a new protocol which was made available to us about a year ago. It is pretty special and wondrous healing events are being accomplished through that work. More on that in the near future. In light, Wayne And Sarah I am not familiar with Drown nor Brunler. But I do believe the human body is the perfect radionic instrument. Blessings, Jane - Original Message - From: Wayne and Sharon McEachern [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2002 7:49 AM Subject: Re: Radionics (Drought update) Jane -- please read on. Moen Creek wrote: Deva of Light Expression Farm. If we are asking questions about the veggie garden here at the Farm, we would add the Overlighting Deva of the LE veggie garden. If we are doing a soil balancing in the veggie garden, we would add the OL Deva of Soil to the Coning. And so forth Best... Wayne *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* Sharon and Wayne McEachern http://www.LightExpression.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] A Divine Program for Healing and Transformation and Expressing the Light A Ministry Dedicated to the Divine Process *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* -- *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* Sharon and Wayne McEachern http://www.LightExpression.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] A Divine Program for Healing and Transformation and Expressing the Light A Ministry Dedicated to the Divine Process *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*
Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Title: Re: Radionics (Drought update) Gil, please expound further on The really powerful systems in use currently are paper based. Here in Oz, Frank Moody found that the circuit of an instrument, would work as well as the physical instrument, in the hands of a trained practitioner. He later developed this further and we can increase our arson of instruments at the photocopier any time we need more. I use SE .05 paper instrument as an adjuvant in some deeper work mainly miasm clearing. Though working on interactions of dis-ease in several Subtle Bodies all at once has been an nagging thought in the back of my mind. Would Frank be amenable to posting an attachment - through Allan of this instrument or where I may send for a master. Quanta quest etc. Also when you posted on the joint UK - US development of the Meridian Card System you did not give us a clear visual description of their 3D aspects, materials etc. In Love Light Markess
Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Re: Drown. The line of Radionic training that I had and will teach is directly down line from Ruth Drown. She did major development work, taking the Abrams concepts and making major simplifications to the instruments. From something that took at least two strong men to carry, she came up with some thing with an infinitely greater capacity and about the size of a portable type writer. She greatly expanded the knowledge of "Rates" and developed a sequential, logical form of analysis (scanning for the "two knobers"). Most serious Radionics follows some form of this. She had a large number of sheets of rates, starting with one that determined which systems needed checking, thus if there is no problem, one does not check it. The instrument opened flat, with the lid to the left (or right for left handed people), the sheets are in the lid and a sliding pointer used to indicate the item being checked, while the rate is "put up" on the graduated knobs. The instrument used the well known "stick pad". The vary early Delawarr instruments (in the UK) were actually copies, as the FDA had stopped production of instruments in the US. George and those working with him soon made significant modifications and shortly abandoned the stick pad for the pendulum, which is vastly faster. I know little about the history of the "two knob" school of Radionics, although I have read a couple of lots of course notes. I would invite some one working in that area to post on it. George Delawarr and that group made huge advances. I believe the only member of the original Delawarr group still around is the wonderful Lavender Dower, known to a number of people on the list and whom I had the privilege to visit twice last year. Lavender still takes an avid interest in the still developing field of Radionics, encouraging us and is a fitting matriarch. Enid Eden, who would be about twenty years younger, and the Principal of Keys College of Radionics and Clare Longhorn, here in Oz are among the next lot, who were the young people on the edge of those pioneers. Enid was one of the team who did much of the development work on formalising our understanding of Agricultural Radionics. Lavender was the leading light in working on animals, particularly horses and farm animals. Malcolm Rae made big jumps in instrument design. His is widely known for his MGA Card based instruments, we use his "Base 44" for analysis and a large amount of treatments. The Base 44 is so quick compared with instruments like the "Base 10" and other Drown like instruments. Even the Peggetty and many of the paper based instruments are descended from the concepts of Drown, as they are based on her developments in analysis. I think the major changes from Drown to now are that her analysis sheet was huge, bigger than A3 and double sided, while ours is on one side of an A4 with the treatments on the other. Tansley's work on the subtle anatomy greatly helped reduce the work on the physical, as if we with deal with issues on the subtle, we get to it before it manifests in the physical. It still takes six or more hours to do a full detailed analysis. One could go on to mention many more, but the post os too long now. Regards Gil Sarah Cherry wrote: What you say is true of, I believe, any device used to transfer the subtle energies...pendulum, whatever. The instrument is needed for focus, and, after a while, beings will attend to aid the work. Do you know of anyone carrying Drown's work forward? Also, have you ever heard of Oscar Brunler? Sarah Cherry Gil Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Hi! Jane, Radionics is a formalization of a number of closely related energetic methodologies.
Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Moen Creek wrote: Gil, Please expound further on The really powerful systems in use currently are paper based. Here in Oz, Frank Moody found that the circuit of an instrument, would work as well as the physical instrument, in the hands of a trained practitioner. He later developed this further and we can increase our arson of instruments at the photocopier any time we need more. Frank is now about 97 or so and lives a mobile live, travelling between contacts and staying from days to months at an address, these days within Oz and NZ. He has lots of people trying to pump him for information. He does not want to continue with this, as it cuts into his healing time, which he regards as more important than talking to each new generation of people who find him. I live in a relatively remote part of Oz and a couple of days travel from one end of his normal range. A contact who is a trained writer and who has written extensively on closely related subjects. They are I understanding interviewing him, with a view to eventual publication. I may be involved in preparing it for publication if it comes to be. He has given the Radionic Centre of Australia the right to collect and publish all his earlier work. His paper based instruments were not put in the public domain, only in in house newsletters of societies etc or as personal gifts. As with any Radionic Instrument, one still needs the knowledge to do an analysis and what ever specialist knowledge is required, such as if one is broadcasting Bach Flower Essences, one needs to be familiar with those teachings to check your dowsing. I will not be posting Frank's Instruments on the 'net. Frank is not on the internet, does not have his own phone and asks to not have his where abouts made public as he wants to just spend his old age doing healings on those who cross his path. I am not familiar with the SE.05. My experience with miasms and the subtle anatomy is limited to Base 44 and MGA. I have other instruments that can be used, but I have not done so. Copen had a system of treating seven levels of subtle body, using several Base 10 instruments. I have Mark 2 with impressive addition knobs and switches, but never used that aspect of it. Keys College and The Radionic Association (both UK, as was Copen) only treat the Physical, Astral, Etheric and Mental bodies. With the Meridian Card System, the only public document I know of is the section in Radionic Therapy from one Millennium to the Next by Lavender Dower and Jayne Southern. Published and available from Keys College of Radionics, P.O Box 194, London SE16 1QZ. I do not know what the intention is on availability of the system. I will email them and find out. As far as I know, the only public showing of the system was at a Radionic Forum in Bristol UK, a year or so ago. Gil
Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Hi! Jane, You may have missed a point. A clear channel dependent on an instrument. Radionics is not like say Reiki, where the channel is acting as a duct for an energy greater than one's self. In Radionics, the analysis is a form of communication and the treatment uses an energy, that at this point is not fully understood. We can only talk about what it is not, as there are not yet the language or the full understanding. It is not electrical, optical, magnetic or electro-magnetic. It is another energy which travels much faster. It is very difficult to find ways of describing it. Before you question my wordsmithing, consider the problem of describing an native that has never been off a desert island, what it is like to stand in total darkness in a rail tunnel and have the Flying Scotchman pass through at full tilt. There is much about Radionics that is hard to describe. While BD is the best Ag System we have to date. It is at this time, not a complete system. We also have to consider Paramagnetics, water restructuring, mineral balance, clay spreading, gypsum spreading, ameliorating salinity etc. The delivering of BD to large acreage's is a major logistic challenge. Sorry purists, but I see Radionics as the only way to deliver. I have read RS several times and each time very carefully. I note that He was about energy as his explanation of many things. I believe he would take Radionics on board with both hands. He emphatically encouraged us to take his work further and suggested what he offered was but a beginning. Unfortunately, there are some who try to regard his agriculture talks as if it was a religious text and frozen in time. That was not his intention and he even intended to deliver at least other series of talks, but passed on before that came to be. I challenge all to speculate on what would have been included in those and try and pencil it in and try it. Gil jsherry wrote: Help! Guys, I know enough from being on this list about what is radionics and where to get info. I wanted to know WHY Markess used a radionic device, not what it is...sorry for the confusion. Thanks for your answer. By giving away one's power, I am not talking about one's personal power, but of being a clear channel. A clear channel dependent on an instrument is not a clear channel. However, I could see where radionics may have a place in diagnostics in my life, perhaps, big maybe. But for practice or healing, if I had a healer who I wanted work from and their concentration was so easily led astray by an attractive person on the street, I would certainly find someone else to work with who had greater powers of concentration and focus. Gotta go, but I want to point out how often on the internet I see people writing lose as loose and loose as lose. When I figure out the significance, I'll let ya know. Blessings on good work, with or without radionic devices. Jane - Original Message - From: Gil Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2002 12:05 AM Subject: Re: Radionics (Drought update) Hi! Jane, Radionics is a formalization of a number of closely related energetic
Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Jane -- please read on. Moen Creek wrote: Jane, I'll take the moderately simple Q first. what do you mean by "conings"? Fran's training come through the Perelandra work. She calls in higher selves, spirit guides, the White Brotherhood, leaves room for participants to ask in their personals while we hold hands around the table. Plainly, I think that Markess is saying that a Coning is a conscious calling or gathering of various consciousness(es) for a particular purpose. A deliberate meeting. We will have different Conings established for various purposes here at the Farm. As you get into your desired work for the moment, you might call in the various entities which are affected or affecting the information which you are seeking. For instance, if we are in need of information on the Farm in general, we call in my higher self, Sharon's higher self, and the Overlighting Deva of Light Expression Farm. If we are asking questions about the veggie garden here at the Farm, we would add the Overlighting Deva of the LE veggie garden. If we are doing a soil balancing in the veggie garden, we would add the OL Deva of Soil to the Coning. And so forth Best... Wayne *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* Sharon and Wayne McEachern http://www.LightExpression.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] "A Divine Program for Healing and Transformation" and Expressing the Light "A Ministry Dedicated to the Divine Process" *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*
Re: Radionics (Drought update)
Hi! Jane, Radionics is a formalization of a number of closely related energetic methodologies. Radionics traces it's history over a similar period as BD. There are a number of schools of thought in Radionics and some do not speak to others. Radionics ranges from the very complex to the very simple and across the range some thing work much better than others. Some methods require broadcast over long period, or repeated broadcasts, some are one shot hits, great differences. Some Radionics Practitioners formally trained and others are not even in contact with another like minded soul. With early work by Abrams, considerable development was continued by Drown. Most Radionics, as we know it, is post Drown and built on her work and on that of those who came after her. February 2003 marks sixty years of Radionics in the UK where most of the major developments have taken place and much of the research leading to us having some idea of what actually happens, has taken place. There will be a major conference to mark the date. Radionics has taken many paths and many dead ends. It seems to me that a high percentage of those who do the hard miles and actually study it to depth, also make some contribution to overview, with new instruments or better understanding. Every now and a again some one will come up with a system that makes things over complicated and cumbersome. These divergence's are usually short lived. The really powerful systems in use currently are paper based. Here in Oz, Frank Moody found that the circuit of an instrument, would work as well as the physical instrument, in the hands of a trained practitioner. He later developed this further and we can increase our arson of instruments at the photocopier any time we need more. In India, Western type instruments, even when made locally were too dear for the local needs and they came up with the SSS System, which will treat a large range of the sort things most people will come across. I have previously posted on the joint UK - US development of the Meridian Card System, the fastest working system I know about. With all these systems, it is still necessary to have a good understanding of what you are trying to do. If working on people or animals, you must have the appropriate anatomy and physiology and an understanding of disease and how all the systems work. In venturing into agriculture or the environment, one should have the required knowledge appropriate to the area of interest. On top of all this, to be a creditable practitioner, one needs to have ones life in order, as most of what Radionics is about is done by the mind of the practitioner, thus if one has distractions, lack of concentration or effected by substances, your work will reflect that situation. Then there is the core knowledge of Radionics. This is to do with an understanding of the energies involved, the subtle anatomy and other matters which have a meaning in Radionics, which at times is quite different from other disciplines. This is only taught person to person and not available in published form. It is this that divides the formally trained from those who are not. The vetting of students before and during training is rigorous and unforgiving. Around the place are many people making instruments without the core knowledge, and while they may work to some extent, they are not a patch on those properly designed and constructed. Having studied the core knowledge, the practitioner is free to go on and innovate and develop Radionics further. The recent major innovation has been the Meridian System. I am currently doing some promising work in the Agriculture/ Environmental area. Over time, Radionics has taken on board many other vibrational methodologies - Homeopathy, Flower Essences, Gem Essences, several Colour methods etc etc. These can be made up as a pill or liquid, or broadcast direct to the client. To use each of these, the practitioner must of course also study the field they are going to venture into. Thus most of us are continually studying and teaching one another. While the basic training is three and a half years, learning is for ever. Having rambled at length above, I can now get to the core point of your post. Yes, we can work without instruments, but at the risk of loosing focus. The instruments, rates, cards etc are nothing more than a focus for the practitioner's mind. There are all sort of hazards in non instrument Radionics. Say you are working on a client (Most Radionics is remote - we rarely meet our clients) and an attractive person walks down the street and catches your attention, the treatment can be redirected to that person and away from the client. It may not desirable for either. The Instruments, Charts, Rate Books, Cards and most important, the Witness are required for focus and for safety. I will give an example. I have developed some weather modifying methodologies. I had some successes using my instruments, and decided to see if I could do it by
