date:20161013


the perennial '937' problem

just installed 6085 XDE 5.0 from floppies but there is no option in the
installer to load and setup to boot settimedove.boot from the copilot volume

someone must have figured this out

on the other hand, since none of the compilers or actual useful stuff is 
installed,
since you're SUPPOSED to fetch this off the XNS network, maybe not.

I should post this on comp.sys.xerox :-)

Re: Any Kryoflux, Discferret, Catweasel, or other floppy flux images wanted

2016-10-13 Thread Santo Nucifora

HI Phil,

Sorry, I guess "dead" was a little harsh.  Sorry for that.  I'm glad to
know that it's still alive.  I appreciate your reply and I'd love to have a
DiscFerret board (actually, if I could request two, that would be great in
case I mess one up).  I do have a hot air solder station and have done
surface mount before so that shouldn't be a problem.  I'd be happy to
report back as well.

I will email you off-list.
Santo



On Thu, Oct 13, 2016 at 8:45 AM, Philip Pemberton 
wrote:

> On 13/10/16 11:39, Santo Nucifora wrote:
> > Hi Eric,
> >
> > First off, thanks for attempting this.  I spent last night trying to
> > recreate a disk using the CP/M-86 streams I had posted with the Kryoflux
> > and failed.  I'm going to play with it a little until I can get a working
> > reproduction so I would not rely on those Kryoflux streams just yet.  I
> am
> > guessing the only way I can reproduce a disk is through the Kryoflux
> > streams written back to a disk but I can't seem to do that.
> >
> > I noticed that Discferret had a wiki page on the Victor 9000 format.  It
> > looks like it handled the format but it looks like it is a dead project
> and
> > I'm guessing you can't get Discferret boards anymore.
>
> I have about a dozen bare DiscFerret boards in my cupboard if anyone
> wants one.
> The board house ran them as hot-air levelled instead of silver-plated,
> so they need the SMD pads for the RAM and FPGA (and ideally the PIC too)
> cleaning with desolder wick before having those parts installed.
> Electrically they're fine.
>
> If you'd prefer to run your own boards (maybe you really like the gold
> on purple that OSH Park do?), I have no problem with someone downloading
> Eagle, running CAM and uploading the resulting Gerber files to a board
> house. Student Me would have appreciated it if you'd have kicked him a
> few quid for doing that, but these days... screw it, go have fun. It's
> GPLv2 / open hardware. If we ever meet in person, say thank-you. That'll
> do. :)
>
> Heck, go make a box full of DiscFerrets for you and your friends. I'd
> actually like to see people getting something out of it more than I'd
> like to see money from it :)
>
> There's even an ATE program (FerretTest) which can give you a rough idea
> where to look for bad solder joints and things. Lots of things to help
> you DIY boards (though I actually wrote it because I had a run of boards
> with solder bridges on the RAM and FPGA which were causing read/write
> issues).
>
>
> As far as "dead project" goes, it's only dead in the sense that I have
> no inclination to buy parts and assemble boards again. Anyone who's been
> following DiscFerret for long enough knows the tale. The record's been
> stuck so long it's worn through, so I won't repeat it :P
>
>
> Regarding the API and microcode, they're not "dead", they're "stable"! I
> can't think of anything else to add. What more does it need than read
> and write? Tell me!
>
>
> TL/DR: it was a university final year project that kinda escaped the
> lab. I'm glad you all still like it and talk about it. I never saw that
> coming.
>
>
> Cheers,
> --
> Phil.
> classic...@philpem.me.uk
> http://www.philpem.me.uk/
>

Re: Getting out of the hobby

2016-10-13 Thread Julian Wolfe

Funny, there's this 11/23+ (BA11-S style) I bought from Pavl Zachary many years 
ago, it's been a near-constant companion through all of my moves and most of 
the VCF Midwests.  Despite the bouncing, banging, and shuffling, it's always 
worked.  It ran 24/7 at my home for much of its life, without so much as a 
hiccup.



We found a brand new 11/23+ a few weeks ago that promptly smoked its power 
supply on power-on.


I have a second unit that I keep for spares, but the power supply gets flicked 
on regularly whenever I can remember to do so, just to keep the caps from 
drying up.  I've never needed any of its parts.



My experience is that classic computers are like anything else that isn't 
exercised regularly - it isn't just sufficient to repair them and take them out 
every few years for use.  They need love.



If it were me in your place, I'd pare down what you have and just use your 
favorites on a regular basis for minimum grief.




 On Tue, 11 Oct 2016 13:07:29 -0700Seth Morabito li...@loomcom.com 
wrote 




Hey folks, 

 

Recent activity on the list, especially the "Ka... ching!" thread, has 

had me reevaluating a lot of what I get out of this hobby. I think there 

are two things going on that make it less fun for me now: The money, 

and the age of the stuff. I'll try to explain. 

 

I've never been a real "collector", I suppose. I don't feel a burning 

need to fill every hole in a product line, or to put things on display. 

I've also never been in this for the money, far from it. No, the only 

reason I've ever collected classic computers is because I've loved 

playing with them. That's really all there is to it. I enjoy the sights, 

sounds, and smells of firing up vintage computers and seeing them work. 

 

On the money front, as I said I've never been in this for the money. 

There was a time when most of this stuff could just be had for free, and 

that was fun! Going on rescue trips was a blast. I'll never regret 

driving down to LA from the Bay Area to rescue a PDP-11/34, or the time 

that a bunch of us got togethr and picked up an 11/45 and an Imlac PDS-1 

from Bill Gosper's house. What a time that was -- I didn't even keep any 

of it, I was just there for the rescue and the camaraderie. 

 

But nowadays, there's so much less of that. 99% of what trades hands 

seems to go back and forth on eBay for real big bucks. And that's 

probably just the sign of a maturing hobby, but it's not really what I 

enjoy. 

 

And secondly, lately there's been a lot less of "firing up vintage 

computers and seeing them work", and a whole lot more "carefully 

replacing capacitors and praying that the vintage computer will still 

fire up". We've reached the point where the hardware I love is dying. 

It's been dying for years, I suppose, but now it's in hospice care. And, 

frankly, that part of it is so much less fun for me than actually using 

the systems. Am I just lazy? Maybe. And don't get me wrong, I've learned 

SO MUCH about electronics from taking care of these systems, so I don't 

consider it a loss at all. It's just not what I want to spend my time 

on. 

 

I've been ruminating on all of this pretty hard for the last couple of 

months, and I've concluded that my enjoyment just isn't there any more. 

Now that I'm surrounded by a bunch of stuff that I'm not getting 

much out of, I feel like I'm being weighed down by the hobby. I think 

it's time for me to move on and concentrate on other things. 

 

I'm not sure yet what that means for my current collection. It's already 

much smaller than it once was, as I've found homes for a lot of things 

over the years. I've moved a lot, and every time I've moved I've found 

homes for things I didn't want to take with me. It's probably time to do 

that again, only without the moving part. 

 

I think probably I'll have one last big "sale" of stuff, which I'll post 

about here. At this point most of what I have is vintage home computers, 

terminals, and QBUS PDP-11 stuff, so not everyone will be interested in 

it -- but maybe some people will. 

 

-Seth 

-- 

Seth Morabito 

w...@loomcom.com

Sage II

2016-10-13 Thread emanuel stiebler


Hi all,
finally found myself a SAGE II.
(no software)

Anybody could help me out with the floppies for it?

Was there a kermit version for it?

Cheers & thanks

RE: Getting out of the hobby


> Recent activity on the list, especially the "Ka... ching!" thread, has
> had me reevaluating a lot of what I get out of this hobby. I think there
> are two things going on that make it less fun for me now: The money,
> and the age of the stuff. I'll try to explain.

Perhaps I am one of the lucky ones (for once). I started being interested
in classic computers long before most people, Back when I could find
interesting machines that I could afford. And I have kept them. For all
people told me to 'downsize the collection' when I was moving house,
I moved the lot. 

So while I am saddened by the price rises, it doesn;t affect me too much.
I have enough projects to keep me going for the rest of my life and then
some :-) (And before somebody asks, yes I have made a will). The problem
for me (being selfish) about high prices is that if I am missing some option
that I want/need, I am probably not going to be able to afford it. 

It does sadden me, though, that many enthusiasts are not going to be 
able to get interesting machines to play with and learn from. I am very
much in favour of running these old machines, the sort of collector who
buys them as an investment and never turns them on has nothing in 
common with me. And I do not accept that people who have paid a lot
for a machine will look after it better than those who (a few years 
earlier) got it for peanuts.

The nostalgia aspect doesn't really interest me. I do not want the home
computers that friends had, I do not want to play the games I didn't
play years ago. I want interesting pieces of electronics that I probably
hadn't heard of when they were current. 

The age of the hardware doesn't bother me. Sure I have to replace 
antisocial mains filter capacitors, replace failed ICs, etc. But I was doing
that 20 years ago. So that doesn't seem to be a recent problem.

I do feel the hobby has changed. I haven't, which is why I don't post
much here any more. When I started it was all people trying to restore
and run the genuine old hardware. Now it seems there are a lot of 
emulators running on hardware I don't understand. And add-ons to
perfectly understandable and hackable machines using microcontrollers
and FPGAs that you can't probe with a logic analyser. That sort of thing
is what I got into classic computing to avoid, so I am not going to 
put such devices into my PDPs, etc. 

-tony

Re: Gould 32/77 (was: NWA auctions)



On 10/13/16 9:01 AM, Rick Bensene wrote:

> These are neat machines, and I hope that they end up in the hands of
> someone that can care for them rather than ending up scrap.
> 

hope ht was one of us :-)

RE: Gould 32/77 (was: NWA auctions)

$4500!  Is it likely a collector or someone that would be using these things 
somewhere?

I don't know my PDP stuff well.. the 11/45 is from around the early 70s right?

-Original Message-
From: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Kyle Owen
Sent: Thursday, October 13, 2016 9:40 AM
To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts 
Subject: Re: Gould 32/77 (was: NWA auctions)

Looks like one person got both the 11/45s for $4500 total. Too much for me, but 
that didn't seem like a bad deal.

Kyle

RE: CBM edge connectors pitch?


> I thought the question about the prevalence of .156" connectors in early
> systems was interesting and I assume someone here has the detail on the
> rationale.

I have wondered if it's an approximation to 0.15625" -- 5/32" pitch.

-tony

Re: Sage II

2016-10-13 Thread william degnan

On Thu, Oct 13, 2016 at 11:56 AM, emanuel stiebler  wrote:

> On 2016-10-13 17:16, william degnan wrote:
>
> Did you get this from Ebay?
>>
>
> Nope, just waited few years until it popped up ;-)
>
> http://www.thebattles.net/sage/
>>
>
> Yes, I know that one. I also got some documentation with it,
> checked already if it is all on the web and it is.
>
> Weirdly, some documents have a different first page, but the rest is the
> same ...
>
>
I may have some software that is missing from that site, if so I will image
and upload  will let you know
bill

Re: Gould 32/77 (was: NWA auctions)


On 10/13/16 9:14 AM, Al Kossow wrote:



On 10/13/16 9:01 AM, Rick Bensene wrote:


These are neat machines, and I hope that they end up in the hands of
someone that can care for them rather than ending up scrap.


hope ht was one of us :-)






I ended up with the TI-980.  The 11/45's got out of range for me...

9 minutes left on the other Gould 32/77; hope someone here ends up with 
it...


- Josh

Re: NWA auctions

2016-10-13 Thread Brent Hilpert

On 2016-Oct-13, at 12:35 AM, jim stephens wrote:
> On 10/12/2016 11:04 PM, Josh Dersch wrote:
>> Any idea what this might be?  Looks interesting, but not a lot of 
>> information to go by apart from the "Display Systems Incorporated" badges...
>> 
>> https://grafeauction.proxibid.com/aspr/Portable-simulator-display-screens/32464587/LotDetail.asp?lid=32464587
>>  
>> 
>> - Josh 
> 
> There is a horribly stylized some set of letters in front of the Display 
> Systems Incorporated.  I don't know if I could figure it out even if the 
> photo was close up and focused.  I hate designers. Typical crap they pull, 
> make logos with letter you can't figure out if you tried.
> 
> The blurry blob to the left the tie first "D" is some set of letters or a 
> word, can't tell.


The blurry blob logo is the letters "dsi" in lowercase, done in a kind of 
stencil font or font with a widely varying line width.

RE: Gould 32/77 (was: NWA auctions)



> I don't know my PDP stuff well.. the 11/45 is from around the early 70s right?

1972 I think. It's a very nice machine, all TTL (over 1000 ICs in CPU, MMU
and floating point processor). I suppose the 11/70 is even more fun 
(with 22 bit addressing, etc) but the 11/45 is one of my all-time favourites.

-tony

RE: Gould 32/77 (was: NWA auctions)

2016-10-13 Thread Paul Birkel

But then add the "Internet Fee" and Sales Tax (read the Terms and Conditions) 
for a ~26% mark-up from the closing price.  So ~$5670.

-Original Message-
From: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Brad H
Sent: Thursday, October 13, 2016 1:07 PM
To: 'General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts'
Subject: RE: Gould 32/77 (was: NWA auctions)

$4500!  Is it likely a collector or someone that would be using these things 
somewhere?

I don't know my PDP stuff well.. the 11/45 is from around the early 70s right?

-Original Message-
From: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Kyle Owen
Sent: Thursday, October 13, 2016 9:40 AM
To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts 
Subject: Re: Gould 32/77 (was: NWA auctions)

Looks like one person got both the 11/45s for $4500 total. Too much for me, but 
that didn't seem like a bad deal.

Kyle

Re: Gould 32/77 (was: NWA auctions)

2016-10-13 Thread Kyle Owen

Looks like one person got both the 11/45s for $4500 total. Too much for me,
but that didn't seem like a bad deal.

Kyle

Re: Gould 32/77 (was: NWA auctions)

2016-10-13 Thread JP Hindin




On Thu, 13 Oct 2016, Al Kossow wrote:

On 10/13/16 9:01 AM, Rick Bensene wrote:


These are neat machines, and I hope that they end up in the hands of
someone that can care for them rather than ending up scrap.



hope ht was one of us :-)


That's what I said when I quit bidding at $180.

I had one of those moments where I went "You know, I'd like to spend more, 
but I have a building full of computers, I can't really fit any more, and 
at $200+ it starts getting harder to justify it to the wife."


Which is usually a sign it's getting harder to justify to myself and my 
conscience is telling me it's time to fold.


But I sure hope it went to a collector.

(It's not often I find computer stuff within 2.5 hours of my home, too.)

 - JP

Re: CBM edge connectors pitch?

2016-10-13 Thread Brent Hilpert

On 2016-Oct-13, at 10:39 AM, Jim Brain wrote:
> I thought the question about the prevalence of .156" connectors in early 
> systems was interesting and I assume someone here has the detail on the 
> rationale.
> 
> Jim
> 
>  Forwarded Message 
> Subject:  CBM edge connectors pitch?
> Date: Thu, 13 Oct 2016 19:31:47 +0200
> From: silve...@wfmh.org.pl
> Reply-To: cbm-hack...@musoftware.de
> To:   cbm-hack...@musoftware.de
> 
> Do we know what is the norm used in the CBM edge connectors? Like the IEEE, 
> USER PORT or CASSETTE?
> 
> I found out mentions that it uses a 0.156" pitch. Where the heck does that 
> come from? Nothing "round" in either metric or imperial..
> -- 
> SD!
>   Message was sent through the cbm-hackers mailing list

The 0.156" is presumably the oldest PCB edge connector, I have an example in 
tube equipment going back to 1959.
Very common in all sorts of equipment through the 60s and 70s.

As Tony suggests, it matches up with 5/32" spacing, just as 0.125 is 1/8".
Where the rounding of the 1/4 thou (0.00025) took place - in the name or the 
implementation - I'm not sure.

Re: NWA auctions

On 10/13/2016 10:20 AM, Brent Hilpert wrote:

On 2016-Oct-13, at 12:35 AM, jim stephens wrote:

On 10/12/2016 11:04 PM, Josh Dersch wrote:

Any idea what this might be? Looks interesting, but not a lot of information to go by
apart from the "Display Systems Incorporated" badges...

https://grafeauction.proxibid.com/aspr/Portable-simulator-display-screens/32464587/LotDetail.asp?lid=32464587

- Josh

There is a horribly stylized some set of letters in front of the Display
Systems Incorporated. I don't know if I could figure it out even if the photo
was close up and focused. I hate designers. Typical crap they pull, make logos
with letter you can't figure out if you tried.

The blurry blob to the left the tie first "D" is some set of letters or a word,
can't tell.

The blurry blob logo is the letters "dsi" in lowercase, done in a kind of
stencil font or font with a widely varying line width.

Went for a quarter.

I looked at the photography of the interior of several of the 747
simulator heads, and there appear to be some with bare CRTs mounted on
edge like the ones on this unit. There are a couple of other "portable
screens" as well. I suspect when they were working on the simulations
in the machine room they used these as temporary hookups to see what was
appearing in the cockpits by hooking them up to the actual machines.

Also, I found another complete Evans and Sutherland machine here. Mr
H*t got it as well, rather cheap. I hope as others have said this
is not a scrapper, since a large price was paid for the 11/45 that buyer
seems to have purchased.

The two bay 11/45 went for twice the bid, since it was listed as 2 pcs @
1500 each == $3000 total.

https://grafeauction.proxibid.com/aspr/Assorted-avionics-cabinets-and-computer-equipment/32464904/LotDetail.asp?lid=32464904

thanks
Jim

Re: NWA auctions

2016-10-13 Thread Dennis Boone

 > No, it doesn't make an incredible amount of sense for some of this...

Considering how many cabinets full of computer equipment were labelled
"avionics rack", it's clear the auctioneers had no clue what most of
this stuff was.

De

Re: CBM edge connectors pitch?




On 10/13/2016 3:07 PM, Eric Smith wrote:

It doesn't make much difference in practice.  The highest pin-count
.156" connector I've ever dealt with was 86 pin (43x2), and the
difference in the nominal first-to-last position is only 10.5 mils,
which is on the order of the non-cumulative position tolerance.
If these are the connectors that can have keys inserted between every 
connector, the small difference would be significant as those would not 
align between a metric connector and an English (inch) board.  The 
electrical connections would line up w/o any keying as you say.

Re: booting 6085 XDE 5.0 settime.boot

On 10/13/16 3:17 PM, Mike Ross wrote:

> Assuming you've installed this to an emulated disk... if you can chuck
> the disk image over to me there's a few things I could try... I have a
> 6085 running VP & Lisp images from Dave's MFM emulator.
> 

I only have one emulator right now, and I've been busy dumping MFM
disks.

I did take a snapshot of XDE 5.0 though. I'll put that up on 
bitsavers/bits/Xerox/6085

Today's project is trying to get Smalltalk installed. Minor detour getting a 
HxC floppy
emulator working correctly. It turns out OSX disk utility doesn't make a FAT32 
fs the HxC
understands, so I had to use Rufus on WinXP.

Also, if anyone needs it, I made a high resolution scan of the Xerox optical 
mousepad
which is up under pdf/xerox/mouse

Re: booting 6085 XDE 5.0 settime.boot

Oh, and a HUGE thank you to Dave for getting 6085 sector extraction working
this past week!

On 10/13/16 3:38 PM, Al Kossow wrote:
> 
> 
> On 10/13/16 3:17 PM, Mike Ross wrote:
> 
>> Assuming you've installed this to an emulated disk... if you can chuck
>> the disk image over to me there's a few things I could try... I have a
>> 6085 running VP & Lisp images from Dave's MFM emulator.
>>
> 
> I only have one emulator right now, and I've been busy dumping MFM
> disks.
> 
> I did take a snapshot of XDE 5.0 though. I'll put that up on 
> bitsavers/bits/Xerox/6085
> 
> Today's project is trying to get Smalltalk installed. Minor detour getting a 
> HxC floppy
> emulator working correctly. It turns out OSX disk utility doesn't make a 
> FAT32 fs the HxC
> understands, so I had to use Rufus on WinXP.
> 
> Also, if anyone needs it, I made a high resolution scan of the Xerox optical 
> mousepad
> which is up under pdf/xerox/mouse
> 
> 
>

Re: NWA auctions

On 10/13/16 1:37 PM, Noel Chiappa wrote:

 > From: Jim Stephens

 > The two bay 11/45 went for twice the bid, since it was listed as 2 pcs
 > @ 1500 each

Yeah, I couldn't quite work that out - did it mean there were two mostly
identical ones, and they only had pictures of one, or did it mean 'two racks'?

Noel

It means (as far as I can tell) "two items" where the items in this case 
are the two racks.  You're buying the lot, but bidding on the cost of a 
single item. The TI 980B I got 
(https://grafeauction.proxibid.com/asp/LotDetail.asp?lid=32464722) was 
sold as three items (the rack, the printer on the small rack, and some 
weird readout on a rolling pedstal).  No, it doesn't make an incredible 
amount of sense for some of this...

- Josh

Re: booting 6085 XDE 5.0 settime.boot

2016-10-13 Thread Mike Ross

On Fri, Oct 14, 2016 at 4:51 AM, Al Kossow  wrote:
>
> the perennial '937' problem
>
> just installed 6085 XDE 5.0 from floppies but there is no option in the
> installer to load and setup to boot settimedove.boot from the copilot volume
>
> someone must have figured this out
>
> on the other hand, since none of the compilers or actual useful stuff is 
> installed,
> since you're SUPPOSED to fetch this off the XNS network, maybe not.
>
> I should post this on comp.sys.xerox :-)

Assuming you've installed this to an emulated disk... if you can chuck
the disk image over to me there's a few things I could try... I have a
6085 running VP & Lisp images from Dave's MFM emulator.

Mike

http://www.corestore.org
'No greater love hath a man than he lay down his life for his brother.
Not for millions, not for glory, not for fame.
For one person, in the dark, where no one will ever know or see.'

Re: booting 6085 XDE 5.0 settime.boot



On 10/13/16 3:38 PM, Al Kossow wrote:

> Today's project is trying to get Smalltalk installed.


requirements 8k control store, 3.7mb memory and it turns out
you can't have anything higher than a rev C IOP board, I assume
it doesn't know how to deal with the changes made for the bigger
disks

Re: Getting out of the hobby

2016-10-13 Thread j...@cimmeri.com




On 10/13/2016 12:46 PM, tony duell wrote:

Perhaps I am one of the lucky ones (for once). I started being interested
in classic computers long before most people...

...

I do feel the hobby has changed. I haven't, which is why I don't post
much here any more. When I started it was all people trying to restore
and run the genuine old hardware. Now it seems there are a lot of
emulators running on hardware I don't understand. And add-ons to
perfectly understandable and hackable machines using microcontrollers
and FPGAs that you can't probe with a logic analyser. That sort of thing
is what I got into classic computing to avoid, so I am not going to
put such devices into my PDPs, etc.

-tony


Hear, hear!

- J.

ASR 33 buzzing

Posting around hoping somebody might be able to point me in the right
direction.  I tried greenkeys but no response.

 

I have an ASR 33 I got.  When I plug it in on Line mode there is a clicking
in the power supply area and nothing else.  If I put it to Off or Local,
there is a loud buzzing sound and eventually a 2A fuse on the back left side
of the machine blows.  It's like something's stuck but the noise is kind of
hard to pin down.  Wondering if there's any Model 33 experienced guys out
there. :)

Re: ASR 33 buzzing

2016-10-13 Thread Paul Koning


> On Oct 13, 2016, at 7:14 PM, Brad H  
> wrote:
> 
> Posting around hoping somebody might be able to point me in the right
> direction.  I tried greenkeys but no response.
> 
> 
> 
> I have an ASR 33 I got.  When I plug it in on Line mode there is a clicking
> in the power supply area and nothing else.  If I put it to Off or Local,
> there is a loud buzzing sound and eventually a 2A fuse on the back left side
> of the machine blows.  It's like something's stuck but the noise is kind of
> hard to pin down.  Wondering if there's any Model 33 experienced guys out
> there. :)
> 

Given the blown fuse I'd suspect a stuck mechanism, so the motor is stalled and 
you're getting overcurrent.  Try turning the motor by hand to confirm.

paul

Re: ADM 3A in Sunnyvale, CA

On 10/11/16 10:14 AM, Al Kossow wrote:

> Depending on the length of the HV lead, you may need side or
> bottom anode button. VT100 is bottom, newer terminals tend to
> have it on the side.
> 

Took a look this morning and the anode is on the top, but swapping tubes
will be a bit of a hassle because the mounting is pop riveted to a frame
in four places. The frame bolts onto the expansion foam top cover of the
terminal.

RE: ASR 33 buzzing

The buzzing definitely seems to be coming from the motor.  I put a plastic
tool to the casing and could feel it vibrating. However, I can turn it by
hand (clockwise) and see all the gears and striker mechanisms working.

It did manage to work briefly yesterday.. it did kind of a 'reset'.  But
yeah.. not today.

-Original Message-
From: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Paul Koning
Sent: Thursday, October 13, 2016 4:28 PM
To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts 
Subject: Re: ASR 33 buzzing

> On Oct 13, 2016, at 7:14 PM, Brad H 
wrote:
> 
> Posting around hoping somebody might be able to point me in the right 
> direction.  I tried greenkeys but no response.
> 
> 
> 
> I have an ASR 33 I got.  When I plug it in on Line mode there is a 
> clicking in the power supply area and nothing else.  If I put it to 
> Off or Local, there is a loud buzzing sound and eventually a 2A fuse 
> on the back left side of the machine blows.  It's like something's 
> stuck but the noise is kind of hard to pin down.  Wondering if there's 
> any Model 33 experienced guys out there. :)
> 

Given the blown fuse I'd suspect a stuck mechanism, so the motor is stalled
and you're getting overcurrent.  Try turning the motor by hand to confirm.

paul

RE: Getting out of the hobby


> There are still plenty of enthusiastic, younger folks who are most
> definitely into running the "genuine old hardware" - it's just that this
> list hasn't traditionally offered much of a draw for these users. As noted,
> the list was formed by and for users of the classic-era 'big iron' gear,
> many of whom have simply succumbed to attrition in one form or another.

Actually, it wasn't. I have been a member almost from day 1, and my first
question to the list founder (I think it was Selam) was 'Are minicomputers
welcome on the list, or is it micros only?'

> To summarize, the future of a list like this is in the 8-bit (even 16-bit)
> "home computer" kids.. like myself. They are fond of CBM, Atari, Apple,
> BBC, TI, Timex-Sinclair, Osborne, Kaypro, Wang and so on. If the hobby is
> to remain alive, these folks need to be welcomed in..

There are plenty of people who play the 8-bit home micro games they
grew up playing, but many of them (at least the ones I know of) run them
on a PC-based emulator not the real hardware. 

There are exceptions of course.

-tony

Re: Gould 32/77 (was: NWA auctions)


On 10/13/16 8:34 PM, Bob Rosenbloom wrote:


On 10/13/2016 9:01 AM, Rick Bensene wrote:

I'm curious what the Systems 32/77 is..
Wasn't Gould SEL?  maybe an SEL system?


The 32/77-series was a 32-bit machine implemented in ECL, based on
earlier SEL designs, but is definitely Gould in design/manufacture.

Some of the machines in the series had a very powerful (for the time)
floating point unit (known as the IPU) that operated in tandem with the
main CPU that vastly increased the number-crunching power available

The machines were mainly intended for real-time control applications (as
used in the flight sim applications in the auction)

The machine ran a real-time executive called MPX-32.

More information: http://www.encore-support.com/htmls/32_77.htm

Years ago, I had some experience with these machines.  They were quite
powerful for their time, and were also workhorses that just ran and ran.
Very robust design.

These are neat machines, and I hope that they end up in the hands of
someone that can care for them rather than ending up scrap.

--
Rick Bensene
The Old Calculator Museum
http://oldcalculatormuseum.com




Well... with a momentary lapse of reason, I bought the Gould / SEL 
system. It won't go to scrap.
No idea how I'm going to get it, and what I'm going to do with it, but 
after reading about it last night,

I thought it might be fun to play with. We'll see...


Very nice!  Glad it's not going to scrappers, I was seriously debating 
bidding on one of the two systems but I just don't have the room.  I'd 
love to see pictures of this thing once you manage to get it back to 
your place.


- Josh




Bob

Re: Getting out of the hobby

2016-10-13 Thread drlegendre .

"There are plenty of people who play the 8-bit home micro games they
grew up playing, but many of them (at least the ones I know of) run them
on a PC-based emulator not the real hardware."

You don't really think that retro video gaming is the singular, or even the
primary focus of 8-bit micro nostalgia, do you? That seems like a bit of a
shallow view, at least from my perspective.

"There are exceptions of course."

I'd offer that the membership - current and future - is largely composed of
'exceptions', and always will be. Simple truth is that +most+ folks simply
don't give a gnat's arse about any of this stupid old crap
that we've cultivated such an interest in, and built a culture around it.

On Thu, Oct 13, 2016 at 11:39 PM, tony duell 
wrote:

>
> > There are still plenty of enthusiastic, younger folks who are most
> > definitely into running the "genuine old hardware" - it's just that this
> > list hasn't traditionally offered much of a draw for these users. As
> noted,
> > the list was formed by and for users of the classic-era 'big iron' gear,
> > many of whom have simply succumbed to attrition in one form or another.
>
> Actually, it wasn't. I have been a member almost from day 1, and my first
> question to the list founder (I think it was Selam) was 'Are minicomputers
> welcome on the list, or is it micros only?'
>
> > To summarize, the future of a list like this is in the 8-bit (even
> 16-bit)
> > "home computer" kids.. like myself. They are fond of CBM, Atari, Apple,
> > BBC, TI, Timex-Sinclair, Osborne, Kaypro, Wang and so on. If the hobby is
> > to remain alive, these folks need to be welcomed in..
>
> There are plenty of people who play the 8-bit home micro games they
> grew up playing, but many of them (at least the ones I know of) run them
> on a PC-based emulator not the real hardware.
>
> There are exceptions of course.
>
> -tony
>

Re: ASR 33 buzzing

2016-10-13 Thread drlegendre .

Tony's suggestion is the best at this point - look for issues with the
motor start and/or run caps. A shorted (or open..) cap can certainly cause
this issue. Shorted and it draws excess current in the cap, open and it may
prevent motor starting / running which likewise draws excess (stall)
current, but in the motor windings.

Also, it shouldn't be too hard to isolate the motor assy. itself from the
rest of the circuit - lift the correct lead(s) from the AC power
distribution system. It may be much easier if you can deal with the motor /
cap assy. as a single entity, rather than within the rest of the complexity.

This is just generic advice from a guy who's never fixed a 33. But assuming
yours has the standard AC synchronous motor, it should all apply. Motors
only draw excess current for a very few reasons - overload / stall, shorted
windings, bad start / run caps and possibly associated start / run relays.

On Thu, Oct 13, 2016 at 11:34 PM, tony duell 
wrote:

>
> > The buzzing definitely seems to be coming from the motor.  I put a
> plastic
> > tool to the casing and could feel it vibrating. However, I can turn it by
> > hand (clockwise) and see all the gears and striker mechanisms working.
>
> Should the motor be running in the 'Off' positon of the switch, though?
>
> If the motor is buzzing and taking a high current (which blows the fuse),
> what about the motor run capacitor (the one on the mechanism chassis
> itself, wired to the motor)? Maybe it has failed.
>
> -tony
>

Re: ASR 33 buzzing

did  you  get the  links  we  sent you  over  on the greenkeys  list  for  
sources on 33 manuals and paperwork  we  sent you?  We did not get an 
acknowledgment.  thanks   Ed#  _www.smecc.org_ (http://www.smecc.org)  

In a message dated 10/13/2016 4:37:20 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time,  
vintagecompu...@bettercomputing.net writes:

The  buzzing definitely seems to be coming from the motor.  I put a  plastic
tool to the casing and could feel it vibrating. However, I can turn  it by
hand (clockwise) and see all the gears and striker mechanisms  working.

It did manage to work briefly yesterday.. it did kind of a  'reset'.  But
yeah.. not today.

-Original  Message-
From: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org] On Behalf  Of Paul 
Koning
Sent: Thursday, October 13, 2016 4:28 PM
To: General  Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts  

Subject: Re: ASR 33 buzzing

>  On Oct 13, 2016, at 7:14 PM, Brad H  

wrote:
> 
> Posting  around hoping somebody might be able to point me in the right 
>  direction.  I tried greenkeys but no response.
> 
> 
>  
> I have an ASR 33 I got.  When I plug it in on Line mode there is  a 
> clicking in the power supply area and nothing else.  If I put  it to 
> Off or Local, there is a loud buzzing sound and eventually a 2A  fuse 
> on the back left side of the machine blows.  It's like  something's 
> stuck but the noise is kind of hard to pin down.   Wondering if there's 
> any Model 33 experienced guys out there.  :)
> 

Given the blown fuse I'd suspect a stuck mechanism, so the  motor is stalled
and you're getting overcurrent.  Try turning the  motor by hand to confirm.

paul

Re: NWA auctions

2016-10-13 Thread Chris Elmquist

I mentioned to someone else that that 747-400 simulator is, umm, "famous",

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zacarias_Moussaoui

"Moussaoui allegedly received US$14,000 in wire transfers from bin al-Shibh, 
originating fromDüsseldorf and Hamburg, Germany, in early August. This money 
could have helped him pay for flight training about two weeks later at Pan-Am 
International Flight Academy in Eagan, Minnesota. On August 13, Moussaoui paid 
US$6,800 with US$100 bills to receive training in a 747-400simulator. The 
simulator that Pan-Am uses is operated by Northwest Aerospace Training 
Corporation (NATCO), a training facility affiliated with Northwest Airlines. "

On October 13, 2016 4:00:03 PM CDT, Dennis Boone  wrote:
>> No, it doesn't make an incredible amount of sense for some of this...
>
>Considering how many cabinets full of computer equipment were labelled
>"avionics rack", it's clear the auctioneers had no clue what most of
>this stuff was.
>
>De

-- 
Chris Elmquist

Re: Gould 32/77 (was: NWA auctions)

2016-10-13 Thread Bob Rosenbloom


On 10/13/2016 9:01 AM, Rick Bensene wrote:

I'm curious what the Systems 32/77 is..
Wasn't Gould SEL?  maybe an SEL system?


The 32/77-series was a 32-bit machine implemented in ECL, based on
earlier SEL designs, but is definitely Gould in design/manufacture.

Some of the machines in the series had a very powerful (for the time)
floating point unit (known as the IPU) that operated in tandem with the
main CPU that vastly increased the number-crunching power available

The machines were mainly intended for real-time control applications (as
used in the flight sim applications in the auction)

The machine ran a real-time executive called MPX-32.

More information: http://www.encore-support.com/htmls/32_77.htm

Years ago, I had some experience with these machines.  They were quite
powerful for their time, and were also workhorses that just ran and ran.
Very robust design.

These are neat machines, and I hope that they end up in the hands of
someone that can care for them rather than ending up scrap.

--
Rick Bensene
The Old Calculator Museum
http://oldcalculatormuseum.com




Well... with a momentary lapse of reason, I bought the Gould / SEL 
system. It won't go to scrap.
No idea how I'm going to get it, and what I'm going to do with it, but 
after reading about it last night,

I thought it might be fun to play with. We'll see...


Bob



--
Vintage computers and electronics
www.dvq.com
www.tekmuseum.com
www.decmuseum.org

Speaking of Flight Sim. love Mysteries at the Museum but misuse of HP PROP

 
I love this  Mysteries at the Museum show but  sometimes   some of the pros 
they use are a bit off!
 
FACT checking props on Mysteries at the Museum! Why is link using a  200 A 
or B HP audio Oscillator!  there he is at a work bench with this HP  thing  
and a set of bellows  allegedly 1929   era.
 
I laughed  my ass off.   Ed#
 
from history...
 
The  Origin of the Link  Trainer.  Today in aviation history, on April 14, 
1929, Edwin A. Linkfiled  his patent application for his first Link  
Trainer, 
 
and  what of HP first product? the  200a and  the special  one  for Disney?
 
1938
*   Work begins 
*   HP invents first product 
*   Oscillators for Walt Disney
==



ok  there we  go! just can't be near 1929.. now  I  am sure  some time  
Link   Had or his people used   early HP stuff...
but not  in the  time  frame as presented in 29 or   neat  29.

Ed#  _www.smecc.org_ (http://www.smecc.org/)

Re: Where are the cctech archives before November 2014 ?

2016-10-13 Thread Sam O'nella

Good find on archive.org even in .gz format still. I'm fairly positive the 
incident was discussed on the mailing list and vcfed. Issues happen and it was 
a perfect storm.
I like to chock it up to new technology failing us. ;-)
Kudos to Jay for keeping this alive as well as he does. Lots of great history 
and stories are definitely discovered and archived here.

Re: Getting out of the hobby

2016-10-13 Thread drlegendre .

Couple more words on this..

"I do feel the hobby has changed. I haven't, which is why I don't post
much here any more. When I started it was all people trying to restore
and run the genuine old hardware. Now it seems there are a lot of
emulators running on hardware I don't understand"

There are still plenty of enthusiastic, younger folks who are most
definitely into running the "genuine old hardware" - it's just that this
list hasn't traditionally offered much of a draw for these users. As noted,
the list was formed by and for users of the classic-era 'big iron' gear,
many of whom have simply succumbed to attrition in one form or another.

To summarize, the future of a list like this is in the 8-bit (even 16-bit)
"home computer" kids.. like myself. They are fond of CBM, Atari, Apple,
BBC, TI, Timex-Sinclair, Osborne, Kaypro, Wang and so on. If the hobby is
to remain alive, these folks need to be welcomed in..

On Thu, Oct 13, 2016 at 7:00 PM, j...@cimmeri.com  wrote:

>
>
> On 10/13/2016 12:46 PM, tony duell wrote:
>
>> Perhaps I am one of the lucky ones (for once). I started being interested
>> in classic computers long before most people...
>>
>> ...
>>
>> I do feel the hobby has changed. I haven't, which is why I don't post
>> much here any more. When I started it was all people trying to restore
>> and run the genuine old hardware. Now it seems there are a lot of
>> emulators running on hardware I don't understand. And add-ons to
>> perfectly understandable and hackable machines using microcontrollers
>> and FPGAs that you can't probe with a logic analyser. That sort of thing
>> is what I got into classic computing to avoid, so I am not going to
>> put such devices into my PDPs, etc.
>>
>> -tony
>>
>
> Hear, hear!
>
> - J.
>
>
>

Re: Gould 32/77 (was: NWA auctions)

2016-10-13 Thread Mark Linimon

congrats!

mcl

Re: Gould 32/77

2016-10-13 Thread Jon Elson


On 10/13/2016 12:27 PM, tony duell wrote:



I don't know my PDP stuff well.. the 11/45 is from around the early 70s right?

1972 I think. It's a very nice machine, all TTL (over 1000 ICs in CPU, MMU
and floating point processor). I suppose the 11/70 is even more fun
(with 22 bit addressing, etc) but the 11/45 is one of my all-time favourites.

-tony

Yup, we got an 11/45 used and ran RSX-11M with about 4 users 
on it, it worked VERY well, given the limited memory we had 
on it.  But, of course, when we moved up to a VAX, that was 
even better!


Jon

Re: booting 6085 XDE 5.0 settime.boot

On 10/13/16 3:17 PM, Mike Ross wrote:

> Assuming you've installed this to an emulated disk... if you can chuck
> the disk image over to me there's a few things I could try... I have a
> 6085 running VP & Lisp images from Dave's MFM emulator.
>

the way that the script works for viewpoint is it is installed in the Scavenger
partition, which doesn't exist in an XDE 5.0 install w/o ViewPoint (see below)

from the VP install script:

Request 6085 VP Standalone: Common Software
Comment Installing Standalone Common Software...
Online RD0
Data User Standalone and Remote
Data User Terminal Emulation Common Software
Erase Scavenger
Fetch Scavenger SetTimeDove.boot
Set Physical Scavenger Y
Set Boot Scavenger .
Comment Installation of Standalone Common Software is complete
Close

-- the XDE install script

--XDE5.0InstallationFor80MBDisk.script
-- Created by J. Luis Clavijo
-- Last edited by J. Luis Clavijo 18-Dec-86 14:40:50

\Partition 80 MB disk into 2 volumes for XDE only
Comment Partition 80 MB disk into 2 volumes for XDE only
Comment WARNING - PARTITIONING DISK DESTROYS ALL CONTENT
Confirm Continue?
Pause 4
Comment SECOND CONFIRMATION REQUIRED
Confirm Continue?
Comment Partitioning Takes approximately 5 minutes.  Please wait.

Physical RD0 Y
Online RD0
Create RD0 XDE 2
Tajo 6 normal
CoPilot  debugger
-- 2 SP between CoPilot & debugger for default size
Check RD0 Y
Comment Disk partitioned

\Partition 80 MB disk into 4 volumes: 2 for XDE and 2 for ViewPoint
Comment Partition 80 MB disk into 4 volumes: 2 for XDE and 2 for ViewPoint
Comment WARNING - PARTITIONING DISK DESTROYS ALL CONTENT
Confirm Continue?
Pause 4
Comment SECOND CONFIRMATION REQUIRED
Confirm Continue?
Comment Partitioning Takes approximately 5 minutes.  Please wait.

Physical RD0 Y
Online RD0
Create RD0 XDE 4
User 45000 normal
Scavenger 3300 normal
Tajo 2 normal
CoPilot  debugger
-- 2 SP between CoPilot & debugger for default size
Check RD0 Y
Comment Disk partitioned

\Partition 80 MB disk into 4 volumes: 2 for XDE and 2 for Interlisp
Comment Partition 80 MB disk into 4 volumes: 2 for XDE and 2 for Interlisp
Comment WARNING - PARTITIONING DISK DESTROYS ALL CONTENT
Confirm Continue?
Pause 4
Comment SECOND CONFIRMATION REQUIRED
Confirm Continue?
Comment Partitioning Takes approximately 5 minutes.  Please wait.

Physical RD0 Y
Online RD0
Create RD0 XDE 4
Lisp 2 normal
LispFiles 2 normal
Tajo 2 normal
CoPilot  debugger
-- 2 SP between CoPilot & debugger for default size
Check RD0 Y
Comment Disk partitioned

\Partition 80 MB disk into 6 volumes: 2 each for XDE, ViewPoint, and Interlisp
Comment Partition 80 MB disk into 6 volumes: 2 each for XDE, ViewPoint, and 
Interlisp
Comment WARNING - PARTITIONING DISK DESTROYS ALL CONTENT
Confirm Continue?
Pause 4
Comment SECOND CONFIRMATION REQUIRED
Confirm Continue?
Comment Partitioning Takes approximately 5 minutes.  Please wait.

Physical RD0 Y
Online RD0
Create RD0 XDE 6
Lisp 2 normal
LispFiles 2 normal
User 3 normal
Scavenger 2700 normal
Tajo 15000 normal
CoPilot  debugger
-- 2 SP between CoPilot & debugger for default size
Check RD0 Y
Comment Disk partitioned

\Install XDE Boot Files only
Online RD0
Comment Ready to Install XDE Boot Files
Confirm Continue?

Request XDEBoot1
Comment Installing Boot Files (part 1)...
Fetch CoPilot CoPilotDove.boot
Close

Request XDEBoot2
Comment Installing Boot Files (part 2)...
Fetch CoPilot CoPilotDove.boot
Close

Request XDEBoot3
Comment Installing Boot Files (part 3)...
Fetch CoPilot CoPilotDove.boot
Close

Request XDEBoot4
Comment Installing Boot Files (part 4)...
Fetch CoPilot CoPilotDove.boot
Fetch Tajo TajoDove.boot
Close

Request XDEBoot5
Comment Installing Boot Files (part 5)...
Fetch Tajo TajoDove.boot
Close

Request XDEBoot6
Comment Installing Boot Files (part 6)...
Fetch Tajo TajoDove.boot
Close

Request XDEBoot7
Comment Installing Boot Files (part 7)...
Fetch Tajo TajoDove.boot
Initial RD0 DiskInitialDove.db
Close

Request XDEBoot8
Comment Installing Boot Files (part 8)...
Pilot CoPilot MesaDove.db Y
Germ CoPilot Dove.germ Y
Diagnostic CoPilot MoonRise.db Y
Comment XDE Boot Files Completed
Close

---

so you can boot setTime if you partition w XDE and VP partitions

Re: booting 6085 XDE 5.0 settime.boot



On 10/13/16 7:42 PM, Al Kossow wrote:

> from the VP install script:
> 
> Request 6085 VP Standalone: Common Software
> Comment Installing Standalone Common Software...
> Online RD0
> Data User Standalone and Remote
> Data User Terminal Emulation Common Software
> Erase Scavenger
> Fetch Scavenger SetTimeDove.boot
> Set Physical Scavenger Y
> Set Boot Scavenger .
> Comment Installation of Standalone Common Software is complete
> Close
> 

the other thing if there is a setTime tool is disable the hang at boot by 
setting the switch \200


\Initialize 6085 PCS with XDE and ViewPoint
Confirm Ready to start?
Online RD0
Set Physical CoPilot 
Set Boot User Odu}\370
Set Boot CoPilot W<-- \200
Boot CoPilot W <-- \200
Close

Re: Gould 32/77

2016-10-13 Thread Jon Elson

On 10/13/2016 08:38 PM, Noel Chiappa wrote:

 > From: Jon Elson

 > of course, when we moved up to a VAX, that was even better!

Heh. Give me an 11/45 with an Able ENABLE any day! :-)

Noel

No, the 11/45 was pretty good, but not great for image 
processing and other programs with a lot of data.  Once we 
got the VAX, I rewrote NASA's Mini-VICAR image processing 
program and we were able to run the TeX typesetting program, 
among others.  Those were not so practical on the 11, mostly 
due to the address size.

Jon

Re: ASR 33 buzzing

I missed those somehow.. thank you.  Got a lot to learn with this beast!

Sent from my Samsung device

 Original message 
From: couryho...@aol.com 
Date: 2016-10-13  10:30 PM  (GMT-08:00) 
To: cctalk@classiccmp.org, vintagecompu...@bettercomputing.net 
Subject: Re: ASR 33 buzzing 

did  you  get the  links  we  sent you  over 
on the greenkeys  list  for  sources on 33 manuals and paperwork 
we  sent you?  We did not get an acknowledgment.  thanks  
Ed#  www.smecc.org 

In a message dated 10/13/2016 4:37:20 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time, 
vintagecompu...@bettercomputing.net writes:
The 
  buzzing definitely seems to be coming from the motor.  I put a 
  plastic
tool to the casing and could feel it vibrating. However, I can turn 
  it by
hand (clockwise) and see all the gears and striker mechanisms 
  working.

It did manage to work briefly yesterday.. it did kind of a 
  'reset'.  But
yeah.. not today.

-Original 
  Message-
From: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org] On Behalf 
  Of Paul Koning
Sent: Thursday, October 13, 2016 4:28 PM
To: General 
  Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts 

Subject: Re: ASR 33 buzzing

> 
  On Oct 13, 2016, at 7:14 PM, Brad H 

wrote:
> 
> Posting 
  around hoping somebody might be able to point me in the right 
> 
  direction.  I tried greenkeys but no response.
> 
> 
> 

> I have an ASR 33 I got.  When I plug it in on Line mode there is 
  a 
> clicking in the power supply area and nothing else.  If I put 
  it to 
> Off or Local, there is a loud buzzing sound and eventually a 2A 
  fuse 
> on the back left side of the machine blows.  It's like 
  something's 
> stuck but the noise is kind of hard to pin down.  
  Wondering if there's 
> any Model 33 experienced guys out there. 
  :)
> 

Given the blown fuse I'd suspect a stuck mechanism, so the 
  motor is stalled
and you're getting overcurrent.  Try turning the 
  motor by hand to confirm.

paul

Re: NWA auctions

2016-10-13 Thread Mark Linimon

On Thu, Oct 13, 2016 at 12:49:50AM -0500, Mark Linimon wrote:
> Printronix

Printronixes, plural.

fwiw I also went through the "day 2" auction and although there are some
open-frame aluminum racks, most of the items of interest to this list are
in the "day 1" auction.

No, I'm not just saying this because there's something really cool I want
to bid on in the "day 2" auction :-)

mcl

Re: NWA auctions

they were pretty  famous  for running simulators   for   pilot training
Ed# _www.smacc.org_ (http://www.smacc.org)  
 
 
In a message dated 10/13/2016 12:19:45 A.M. US Mountain Standard Tim,  
dersc...@gmail.com writes:

The  Systems 32/77 is a Gould/SEL machine.  32-bit, ECL.  I don't know  
too much about it, but it's cool looking.  Wish I had the  space...

Re: NWA auctions




On 10/12/2016 11:04 PM, Josh Dersch wrote:
Any idea what this might be?  Looks interesting, but not a lot of 
information to go by apart from the "Display Systems Incorporated" 
badges...


https://grafeauction.proxibid.com/aspr/Portable-simulator-display-screens/32464587/LotDetail.asp?lid=32464587 



- Josh 


There is a horribly stylized some set of letters in front of the Display 
Systems Incorporated.  I don't know if I could figure it out even if the 
photo was close up and focused.  I hate designers. Typical crap they 
pull, make logos with letter you can't figure out if you tried.


The blurry blob to the left the tie first "D" is some set of letters or 
a word, can't tell.


thanks
Jim

Re: NWA auctions

2016-10-13 Thread E. Groenenberg


On Thu, October 13, 2016 06:13, Al Kossow wrote:
> https://grafeauction.proxibid.com/asp/catalog.asp?aid=117590=288#288
>
> someone needs to grab those 11/45's!
>
>

There are a few DEC terminals & printers too, as well as a Documentum M200
punchcard reader.

Ed
--
Ik email, dus ik besta.
BTC : 1J5fajt8ptyZ2V1YURj3YJZhe5j3fJVSHN
LTC : LP2WuEmYPbpWUBqMFGJfdm7pdHEW7fKvDz

Re: Where are the cctech archives before November 2014 ?

2016-10-13 Thread j...@cimmeri.com



Just curious, what was the incident that happened?

- J.

On 10/12/2016 9:29 PM, Jay West wrote:

Walter

I think you need to ask a few questions before you toss that kind of nonsense 
out.

For your info - this is a hobby. It is done in spare time. The time period you 
speak of - the archives have NOT been lost. Because unlike what you intone - we 
do care. Those archives are safe and sound, just not in a publicly accessible 
format. One of our kind listmembers has been working for eons to reconstruct 
the publicly viewable content from them.

I will tell him that you are going to volunteer to help him.

J

-Original Message-
From: cctech [mailto:cctech-boun...@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Walter F.J. 
Mueller
Sent: Wednesday, October 12, 2016 4:22 PM
To: cct...@classiccmp.org
Subject: Where are the cctech archives before November 2014 ?

Hi,

I detected that links I had to previous postings where invalid. Looking at

http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctech/

I see that the archives before November 2014 are lost. When I look into the 
WayBackMachine I see


https://web.archive.org/web/20141025062159/http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctech/

https://web.archive.org/web/20150103042513/http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctech/

that between October 25th. 2014 and January 3rd, 2015 some incident happened 
which wiped out the archives before November 2014.

How comes that the 'classical computing' lost it's memory ??

  With best regards,   Walter

P.S.: It's a bit astonishing to me that a list like cctech, which is
in some ways about history, has lost it's own history, and even
doesn't seem to care about it.

Re: NWA auctions

2016-10-13 Thread P Gebhardt




>https://grafeauction.proxibid.com/asp/catalog.asp?aid=117590=288#288
>
>someone needs to grab those 11/45's!


Again on the wrong side of the pond :(((


--- 

Pierre's collection of classic computers moved to: http://www.digitalheritage.de

Re: NWA auctions




On 10/12/2016 11:46 PM, Mark Linimon wrote:

On Thu, Oct 13, 2016 at 12:49:50AM -0500, Mark Linimon wrote:

Printronix

Printronixes, plural.

fwiw I also went through the "day 2" auction and although there are some
open-frame aluminum racks, most of the items of interest to this list are
in the "day 1" auction.

No, I'm not just saying this because there's something really cool I want
to bid on in the "day 2" auction :-)

mcl

There appears to be a Documation M200 card reader in one photo, though 
not called out.


thanks
Jim

Re: NWA auctions




On 10/13/2016 12:11 AM, Pontus Pihlgren wrote:


Also don't miss out on the VT330 (color graphics terminal!) and
Documation card reader.

I'm curious what the Systems 32/77 is..

Wasn't Gould SEL?  maybe an SEL system?

/P

power supply DEC Expansion Interface RZ5X

2016-10-13 Thread william degnan

WTB $$ power supply DEC Expansion Interface RZ5X.  I guess I'd take a
busted RZ5X that has a good supply too.

Located Landenberg, PA
contact me via vintagecomputer.net/contact.cfm if you have one for sale

Here is a pic of the back, it's part of my MicroVAX 3100 system.
http://vintagecomputer.net/digital/MicroVAX-3100/DEC_StorageExpansion_RZ5X-AA_rear.JPG

I did not see anything on Ebay that was a for-sure match.

b

Where are the cctech archives before November 2014 ?

2016-10-13 Thread Walter F.J. Mueller


Hi,

I detected that links I had to previous postings where invalid. Looking at

  http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctech/

I see that the archives before November 2014 are lost. When I look into the
WayBackMachine I see

  
https://web.archive.org/web/20141025062159/http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctech/
  
https://web.archive.org/web/20150103042513/http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctech/

that between October 25th. 2014 and January 3rd, 2015 some incident
happened which wiped out the archives before November 2014.

How comes that the 'classical computing' lost it's memory ??


With best regards,   Walter


P.S.: It's a bit astonishing to me that a list like cctech, which is
  in some ways about history, has lost it's own history, and even
  doesn't seem to care about it.

RE: Where are the cctech archives before November 2014 ?

2016-10-13 Thread Jay West

Walter

I think you need to ask a few questions before you toss that kind of nonsense 
out.

For your info - this is a hobby. It is done in spare time. The time period you 
speak of - the archives have NOT been lost. Because unlike what you intone - we 
do care. Those archives are safe and sound, just not in a publicly accessible 
format. One of our kind listmembers has been working for eons to reconstruct 
the publicly viewable content from them.

I will tell him that you are going to volunteer to help him.

J

-Original Message-
From: cctech [mailto:cctech-boun...@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Walter F.J. 
Mueller
Sent: Wednesday, October 12, 2016 4:22 PM
To: cct...@classiccmp.org
Subject: Where are the cctech archives before November 2014 ?

Hi,

I detected that links I had to previous postings where invalid. Looking at

   http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctech/

I see that the archives before November 2014 are lost. When I look into the 
WayBackMachine I see

   
https://web.archive.org/web/20141025062159/http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctech/
   
https://web.archive.org/web/20150103042513/http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctech/

that between October 25th. 2014 and January 3rd, 2015 some incident happened 
which wiped out the archives before November 2014.

How comes that the 'classical computing' lost it's memory ??


 With best regards,   Walter


P.S.: It's a bit astonishing to me that a list like cctech, which is
   in some ways about history, has lost it's own history, and even
   doesn't seem to care about it.

Re: Where are the cctech archives before November 2014 ?

2016-10-13 Thread Paul Koning


> On Oct 12, 2016, at 5:22 PM, Walter F.J. Mueller  
> wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> I detected that links I had to previous postings where invalid. Looking at
> 
>  http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctech/
> 
> I see that the archives before November 2014 are lost. When I look into the
> WayBackMachine I see
> 
>  
> https://web.archive.org/web/20141025062159/http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctech/
>  
> https://web.archive.org/web/20150103042513/http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctech/
> 
> that between October 25th. 2014 and January 3rd, 2015 some incident
> happened which wiped out the archives before November 2014.

I suppose that means they could be restored from archive.org...

paul

Re: Where are the cctech archives before November 2014 ?




On 10/12/2016 2:22 PM, Walter F.J. Mueller wrote:

Hi,

I detected that links I had to previous postings where invalid. 
Looking at


  http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctech/

I see that the archives before November 2014 are lost. When I look 
into the

WayBackMachine I see

https://web.archive.org/web/20141025062159/http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctech/
https://web.archive.org/web/20150103042513/http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctech/

that between October 25th. 2014 and January 3rd, 2015 some incident
happened which wiped out the archives before November 2014.

How comes that the 'classical computing' lost it's memory ??


With best regards,   Walter


P.S.: It's a bit astonishing to me that a list like cctech, which is
  in some ways about history, has lost it's own history, and even
  doesn't seem to care about it

I don't think the PS applies.  I sent you my archive via PM.

I don't know how the links on the archive pages are set up, but editing 
and adding it back there in a form that matches what pipermail has done 
is probably the problem.


I didn't capture from 9/2012 thru the Oct 2014 date, if someone has 
those saved or for that matter thru present complete month, I'd 
appreciate that.

thanks
Jim

Re: Manuaal for the original Sun Workstation

2016-10-13 Thread Pete Lancashire

Pick someone who will  scan it and put it on a public site, bitsavers etc

-pete

On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 6:28 PM, Richard Loken  wrote:

> I received seven requests for the Sun Workstation manual.  I guess I will
> draw a name from a hat or something...
>
>
> --
>   Richard Loken VE6BSV, Systems Programmer - VMS   : "...underneath those
>   Athabasca University : tuques we wear, our
>   Athabasca, Alberta Canada: heads are naked!"
>   ** rllo...@telus.net ** :- Arthur Black
>
>

PDP-11/23 system for sale in Portland Oregon

2016-10-13 Thread Scott Baker

Update: After removing all the boards, checking jumper settings, etc. and
reinstalling everything again. I am please to announce some progress. The
PDP-11/23 now boots up to the diagnostic monitor.

Thanks very much to people who replied with technical help and particularly
to Glen Slick who helped with board identification and configuration and
help me fix the QBUS slot assignments. The original slot assignments were
wrong and the bus termination was not at the end of the QBUS. The current
slot assignments are:

Row 1: AB - M8186, CD - 256KB memory
Row 2: AB - DSD disk interface, CD - grant continuity
Row 3: AB - M8028 DLV11-F async interface / console port
Row 4: 
Row 5: 
Row 6: 
Row 7: AB - M8016 KPV11 power fail / line clock
Row 8: 
Row 9: ABCD - M8012 BDV11 diag ROM / QBUS termination

I have added a few pictures here:
http://sierracircuitdesign.ddns.net/temp/pdp11/

Next Steps

1) Find the manual for the diagnostic monitor to figure out how to run some
test.
2) Locate some 8" floppies with RT-11 loaded and connect the floppy drive

Re: Where are the cctech archives before November 2014 ?

2016-10-13 Thread Paul Koning

> On Oct 12, 2016, at 5:22 PM, Walter F.J. Mueller  
> wrote:
> 
> ...
> 
> P.S.: It's a bit astonishing to me that a list like cctech, which is
>  in some ways about history, has lost it's own history, and even
>  doesn't seem to care about it.

Perhaps no one noticed?  Not all mailing lists have widely used archives.  
Especially mailman archives that have no search feature.

paul

Re: Highway interface [warning contains an ebay ref], but is an old VMS network interface

2016-10-13 Thread Peter Coghlan

>
> I'm sure there are fellow roadgeeks on this list, so I find VMS(*) in this
> context to be thoroughly ambiguous. :)
>

Well, at least you can be fairly sure it's not this one:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automatic_milking

I wonder if this has any hardware in common with VAX vacuum cleaners?

Regards,
Peter Coghlan.

Re: NWA auctions


On 10/13/16 12:11 AM, Pontus Pihlgren wrote:


On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 09:13:19PM -0700, Al Kossow wrote:

https://grafeauction.proxibid.com/asp/catalog.asp?aid=117590=288#288

someone needs to grab those 11/45's!


What are those modern looking peripherals? Looks like storage, it might
be the real find here.

Also don't miss out on the VT330 (color graphics terminal!) and
Documation card reader.

I'm curious what the Systems 32/77 is..

/P



The WBC 3000s in the 11/45 rack are RK05 emulators, from what I've been 
able to determine.


The Systems 32/77 is a Gould/SEL machine.  32-bit, ECL.  I don't know 
too much about it, but it's cool looking.  Wish I had the space...


- Josh

DEC items for sale, swap or giveaway

2016-10-13 Thread malcolm

I have a collection of DEC items available for sale, swap or giveaway.

They are mostly VAX or MicroVAX items, as well as a few PDP-11 items.

These are in Melbourne, Australia. I appreciate this may not be of much
interest to the rest of the world.

If interested, please take a look here -> http://avitech.com.au/?p=1285

Thanks.

VCFed, the BBS!

2016-10-13 Thread Evan Koblentz

Everyone should experience the joy of connecting to an authentic dial-up 
bulletin board service. That’s our story here at Vintage Computer 
Federation and we’re sticking to it. :)


It’s why we ordered an 8-port analog PBX with a GSM module today: 
http://www.excelltel.com/en/enproductslist.asp?id=612


Our plan is to connect this to a PC running the MajorBBS software. 
Visitors at our NJ museum and at Vintage Computer Festival East (or 
heck, why not bring it with us to VCF West too?) will get to pick from a 
selection of vintage computers, hear a dial tone, hear the handshake, 
and be productive at 300-2400 bps. People could also telnet in over the 
Internet and, in phase two, dial in through the GSM connection.


We’ll share an update this winter when the PBX arrives.

Re: Y Combinator is restoring one of Alan Kay's Xerox Alto machines

2016-10-13 Thread Curious Marc

Session 9 here gets us into microcode RAM trouble:

https://youtu.be/VWQ7hbV7bN0

Ken’s corresponding blog article

http://www.righto.com/2016/10/restoring-ycs-xerox-alto-day-9-tracing.html

 

Marc

 

And it finally boots on session 8!

https://youtu.be/9OQMhvArI9g

 

> On Sep 10, 2016, at 7:46 PM, CuriousMarc 

> wrote:

> 

> Video of session 6 is up:

> https://youtu.be/b7yVhMT7tr4

> Found our first bad IC. Probably not our last one.

>  

>  

> On 9/3/16 11:08 PM, curiousma...@gmail.com wrote:

> Episode 5, still does not boot, but we are starting to follow long

> why: https://youtu.be/Wr7vDZpniNIr

>  

> Marc

>  

>  

> On Jul 31, 2016, at 6:12 PM, CuriousMarc 

> wrote: 

> Next Episode:

> https://youtu.be/EDw8U1a6s78

> http://www.righto.com/2016/07/restoring-y-combinators-xerox-alto-day_31.html

> Marc

>  

> From: Curious Marc [mailto:curiousma...@gmail.com] 

> Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2016 2:01 AM

> To: Curious Marc; cctalk@classiccmp.org

> Subject: Re: Y Combinator is restoring one of Alan Kay's Xerox Alto

> machines 

> Ken's in-depth blog post to go with the previous video

> http://www.righto.com/2016/07/restoring-y-combinators-xerox-alto-day_11.html

>  

> On Jul 5, 2016, at 2:46 PM, Curious Marc 

> wrote: 

> Video from yesterday’s work on the Diablo cartridge disc:

> https://youtu.be/PR5LkQugBE0

> Should be up in a few minutes.

> We were tickled pink to have official representation from PARC

> (former Xerox Parc) at the session. Marc

>  

> Ken’s new post on the monitor repair to go with my previous video.

> http://www.righto.com/2016/07/restoring-y-combinators-xerox-alto-day.html

> Al Kossow got us a new CRT tube, so we are probably going to try

> that this week-end. Marc

>  

>  

> Latest entry from Ken Shirriff, trying out BCPL (ancestor of C). On

> the emulator, not yet on the real machine:

> http://www.righto.com/2016/06/hello-world-in-bcpl-language-on-xerox.html 

> Marc

>  

> There are only two entries right now:

> http://www.righto.com/2016/06/y-combinators-xerox-alto-restoring.html

> http://www.righto.com/2016/06/restoring-y-combinators-xerox-alto-day.html

> Marc

>  

>  

>

 

 

 

-- 

73  AF6WS

Bickley Consulting West Inc.

http://bickleywest.com

 

"Black holes are where God is dividing by zero"

Re: NWA auctions

2016-10-13 Thread Pontus Pihlgren

On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 09:13:19PM -0700, Al Kossow wrote:
> https://grafeauction.proxibid.com/asp/catalog.asp?aid=117590=288#288
> 
> someone needs to grab those 11/45's!
> 

What are those modern looking peripherals? Looks like storage, it might 
be the real find here.

Also don't miss out on the VT330 (color graphics terminal!) and 
Documation card reader.

I'm curious what the Systems 32/77 is..

/P

Re: DEC items for sale, swap or giveaway




On 10/13/2016 12:25 AM, malc...@avitech.com.au wrote:

I have a collection of DEC items available for sale, swap or giveaway.

They are mostly VAX or MicroVAX items, as well as a few PDP-11 items.

These are in Melbourne, Australia. I appreciate this may not be of much
interest to the rest of the world.

If interested, please take a look here -> http://avitech.com.au/?p=1285

Thanks.
I passed this along to a friend who is local to you, Dave Rose.  I don't 
know if he has any interest, but he may know some old fart collectors in 
his circle of friends around you that would be interested.


I'd love to make some deals if we were closer.
thanks
Jim

Re: VCFed, the BBS!

I mean  please add 110  Baud  Evan!
 
Ed# 
 
 
In a message dated 10/13/2016 12:35:48 A.M. US Mountain Standard Tim,  
cct...@snarc.net writes:

300-2400  bps

Re: Highway interface [warning contains an ebay ref], but is an old VMS network interface

2016-10-13 Thread Tom Moss

For a moment there I thought I was getting work emails sent to my personal
account!

I happen to work for a company that is contracted to build and maintain
Highway Control systems for Highways England (Formerly Highways Agency)

I can't say I've seen anything that old in production now, but we used to
have PDP-8s and 11s long before I joined the company.

Until fairly recently we were using Alphastation DS10s and DS15s to control
Variable Message Signs (a staple of British motorways, basically a large
orange dot-matrix display on an overhead gantry for anyone who hasn't seen
them, they privide traffic and weather information, and are used to set
speed limits and close lanes), MIDAS systems (Inductive loops in the road
for measuring the flow of traffic), traffic cameras, and I believe the
Tamar Bridge and Dartford-Thurrock River Crossing too.

There's a new-ish HP Integrity server running OpenVMS still, no idea what
it's for. We're mainly a x86 + Linux shop now.

We still have 7 of these Alphas on the scrap pile, which I've spent a
couple of weeks trying to get permission to save.

-Tom

On 13 October 2016 at 09:44, Peter Coghlan  wrote:

> >
> > I'm sure there are fellow roadgeeks on this list, so I find VMS(*) in
> this
> > context to be thoroughly ambiguous. :)
> >
>
> Well, at least you can be fairly sure it's not this one:
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automatic_milking
>
> I wonder if this has any hardware in common with VAX vacuum cleaners?
>
> Regards,
> Peter Coghlan.
>

Re: Highway interface [warning contains an ebay ref], but is an old VMS network interface

2016-10-13 Thread Adrian Graham

On 13 October 2016 at 11:07, Tom Moss  wrote:

> Until fairly recently we were using Alphastation DS10s and DS15s to control
> Variable Message Signs (a staple of British motorways, basically a large
> orange dot-matrix display on an overhead gantry for anyone who hasn't seen
> them, they privide traffic and weather information, and are used to set
> speed limits and close lanes), MIDAS systems (Inductive loops in the road
> for measuring the flow of traffic), traffic cameras, and I believe the
> Tamar Bridge and Dartford-Thurrock River Crossing too.
>

That sounds like the company I nearly joined in 2001 but didn't because I'd
have had to commute to Guisborough every day. They wanted VMS people for
new highway info systems for the new managed motorways they're still
building now.

-- 
adrian/witchy
Owner of Binary Dinosaurs, the UK's biggest home computer collection?
www.binarydinosaurs.co.uk

Re: VCFed, the BBS!

2016-10-13 Thread Rod Smallwood





On 13/10/2016 11:27, couryho...@aol.com wrote:

I mean  please add 110  Baud  Evan!
  
Ed#
  
  
In a message dated 10/13/2016 12:35:48 A.M. US Mountain Standard Tim,

cct...@snarc.net writes:

300-2400  bps

Fido on a Rainbow of course

Rod Smallwood - Sysop FidoUK1 1984

--
PDP-8/e PDP-8/f PDP-8/m PDP-8/i
Front Panels ex Stock - Order Now

Re: Manuaal for the original Sun Workstation

2016-10-13 Thread Santo Nucifora

On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 10:24 PM, Pete Lancashire 
wrote:

> Pick someone who will  scan it and put it on a public site, bitsavers etc
>
> -pete
>

I believe what Richard has is a later published revision of this document
on Bitsavers already. This one is a draft copy :
http://bitsavers.informatik.uni-stuttgart.de/pdf/sun/sun1/800-0345_Sun-1_System_Reference_Manual_Jul82.pdf

I will absolutely be willing to scan it and I was one of the one's who
originally requested it as well,

Santo

Re: Any Kryoflux, Discferret, Catweasel, or other floppy flux images wanted

2016-10-13 Thread Santo Nucifora

Hi Eric,

First off, thanks for attempting this.  I spent last night trying to
recreate a disk using the CP/M-86 streams I had posted with the Kryoflux
and failed.  I'm going to play with it a little until I can get a working
reproduction so I would not rely on those Kryoflux streams just yet.  I am
guessing the only way I can reproduce a disk is through the Kryoflux
streams written back to a disk but I can't seem to do that.

I noticed that Discferret had a wiki page on the Victor 9000 format.  It
looks like it handled the format but it looks like it is a dead project and
I'm guessing you can't get Discferret boards anymore.  I was thinking of
trying some of the Commodore GCR formats to see if that might do it (being
that it is theoretically close except for the vartiable speed track part)
but it looks like you can't write back IMG files that it creates.

I'll have to do some playing around first but once I figure it out, I'll
let you know.  Since this is the very first disk I am trying on the
Kryoflux, I'll pick something easy and try to reproduce the disk.

Santo

On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 6:06 AM, Eric Smith  wrote:

> On Mon, Oct 10, 2016 at 6:42 PM, Fred Cisin  wrote:
> > What Eric is working on is software that can decode disk formats that are
> > NOT necessarily WD/NEC FDC compatible!  And writing a file similar to the
> > one created by IMD.
> >
> > That will most certainly NOT then be convertible by IMD into a Victor
> 9000
> > disk!
>
> That's a good explanation.  I was thinking of it as non-standard use
> of IMD format; the resulting IMD file would contain the logical
> contents of the Victor 9000 disk, but because the IMD format doesn't
> (yet) have suitable definitions for Victor 9000 format, the file would
> purport to contain IBM-compatible MFM sectors.
>
> I don't really have any plan for a way to convert these Victor 9000
> pseudo-IMD files back into actual diskettes. I could write an
> imdtoflux program as a counterpart to the fluxtoimd program, which
> would help with a portion of the problem.
>
> > However, OTHER software, that understands the file systems could then
> > extract files.  For example, if it is successful, then it might be
> possible
> > to take the Victor9000 IMD file produced by fluxtoimd, run it through
> IMD to
> > write that content onto a disk in a WD/NEC compatible format with
> > similarities of parameters other than encoding (eg. Chromemco?), and then
> > read files from that disk using XenoCopy or equivalent.
>
> I'm not sure how flexible XenoCopy is, but Victor 9000 format used
> Zoned CAV, so tracks have varying numbers of sectors, from 11 to 19.
> The pseudo-IMD file will preserve that organization. If the IMDU
> program doesn't get upset by the variable number of sectors per track,
> it might be able to extract the sector data into a raw binary
> filesystem image. Assuming that MS-DOS on the Victor 9000 uses the
> obvious mapping of FAT cluster numbers to track/head/sector, the
> resulting raw binary filesystem image might be usable with existing
> utilities for FAT filesystems, such as mtools.
>
> There's always been such a bewildering variety of mappings of CP/M
> blocks to track/head/sector that I wouldn't put any money on the same
> conversion working for Victor 9000 CP/M-86 disks.
>
> In both cases (MS-DOS and CP/M-86), if it proves necessary I'll whip
> up another simple utility to convert the pseudo-IMD file into a usable
> raw binary filesystem image.
>

Re: VCFed, the BBS!

Please add 100  Baud  Evan!
  Ed#
 
 
In a message dated 10/13/2016 12:35:48 A.M. US Mountain Standard Tim,  
cct...@snarc.net writes:

300-2400  bps

Re: VCFed, the BBS!

Great!   110  dial up  for those of us  with our  teletype? Heck with free 
nationwide long distance cross country connects will  not be financially 
painful!
 
sounds  fun
 
 
In a message dated 10/13/2016 12:35:48 A.M. US Mountain Standard Tim,  
cct...@snarc.net writes:

Everyone  should experience the joy of connecting to an authentic dial-up 
bulletin  board service. That’s our story here at Vintage Computer 
Federation and  we’re sticking to it. :)

It’s why we ordered an 8-port analog PBX with  a GSM module today:  
http://www.excelltel.com/en/enproductslist.asp?id=612

Our plan is  to connect this to a PC running the MajorBBS software. 
Visitors at our NJ  museum and at Vintage Computer Festival East (or 
heck, why not bring it  with us to VCF West too?) will get to pick from a 
selection of vintage  computers, hear a dial tone, hear the handshake, 
and be productive at  300-2400 bps. People could also telnet in over the 
Internet and, in phase  two, dial in through the GSM connection.

We’ll share an update this  winter when the PBX arrives.

Re: Getting out of the hobby

2016-10-13 Thread Philipp Hachtmann




On 10/11/2016 10:07 PM, Seth Morabito wrote:


I've ever collected classic computers is because I've loved
playing with them. That's really all there is to it. I enjoy the sights,
sounds, and smells of firing up vintage computers and seeing them work.

Oh, I agree so strongly!


On the money front, as I said I've never been in this for the money.
There was a time when most of this stuff could just be had for free, and
that was fun! Going on rescue trips was a blast.
I'll never regret
driving down to LA from the Bay Area to rescue a PDP-11/34, or the time
that a bunch of us got togethr and picked up an 11/45 and an Imlac PDS-1
from Bill Gosper's house. What a time that was -- I didn't even keep any
of it, I was just there for the rescue and the camaraderie.
Oh, this part of your posting remembers me to interesting times that 
have passed without me realizing the point when that happened.
I also remember the feeling when you find some stash full of interesting 
things. The dirt, cleaning, trucks and trailers full of gear. I liked 
it. But in the last years those opportunities are getting rare. My last 
real haul was in 2013 when I picked up some pdp8/e systems.

But who knows what will be...


And secondly, lately there's been a lot less of "firing up vintage
computers and seeing them work", and a whole lot more "carefully
replacing capacitors and praying that the vintage computer will still
fire up".  We've reached the point where the hardware I love is dying.
Hm, don't fully agree. Yes, capacitors can be nasty. But repair is a big 
part of the hobby.

When I fire up a machine, I always expect that it needs some repair.

Sometimes I thought of getting out of the hobby as well. It comsumes so 
much (partially rented!) space full of strange "scrap". And during the 
last years my life has moved on a bit, there's less time left.

On the other hand I always regretted badly when I let go something.
In the 1990s, I was about 17 and not yet in vintage computers, I put a 
fully working mint condition and complete Tandy 200, including power 
supply, manuals, original bag - to the trash can. I regretted that...


And the stuff you let go today, might never come back. Ok, QBus and 
newer stuff might have a higher availability.



Kind regards

Philipp




--

Dipl.-Inf. (FH) Philipp Hachtmann
Buchdruck, Bleisatz, Spezialitäten

Alemannstr. 21, D-30165 Hannover
Tel. 0511/352, Mobil 0171/2632239
Fax. 0511/3500439
phil...@hachtmann.com
www.tiegeldruck.de

UStdID DE 202668329

Re: NWA auctions

2016-10-13 Thread Ben Sinclair

Check out this video of a flight simulator running on some PDP-11s:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y-DpcvY4aBk

Those rack mounted zip drives look like the same devices in the "Decpack
avionics cabinet" auction.

They're calling them "avionics," so I wonder if these are from a flight
simulator?

On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 11:13 PM, Al Kossow  wrote:

> https://grafeauction.proxibid.com/asp/catalog.asp?aid=117590=288#288
>
> someone needs to grab those 11/45's!
>
>

-- 
Ben Sinclair
b...@bensinclair.com

Re: NWA auctions

2016-10-13 Thread Ben Sinclair

I just now realized that these auctions are out of a Delta Airlines
facility! Plus they are in MN, so within range of myself.

On Thu, Oct 13, 2016 at 7:32 AM, Ben Sinclair  wrote:

> Check out this video of a flight simulator running on some PDP-11s:
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y-DpcvY4aBk
>
> Those rack mounted zip drives look like the same devices in the "Decpack
> avionics cabinet" auction.
>
> They're calling them "avionics," so I wonder if these are from a flight
> simulator?
>
> On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 11:13 PM, Al Kossow  wrote:
>
>> https://grafeauction.proxibid.com/asp/catalog.asp?aid=117590=288#288
>>
>> someone needs to grab those 11/45's!
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Ben Sinclair
> b...@bensinclair.com
>



-- 
Ben Sinclair
b...@bensinclair.com

Re: NWA auctions



On 10/13/16 12:11 AM, Pontus Pihlgren wrote:

> What are those modern looking peripherals? Looks like storage, it might 
> be the real find here.
> 

They are Wilson Labs disk emulators.
Like I said, someone needs to get these.

Re: Any Kryoflux, Discferret, Catweasel, or other floppy flux images wanted

2016-10-13 Thread Philip Pemberton

On 13/10/16 11:39, Santo Nucifora wrote:
> Hi Eric,
> 
> First off, thanks for attempting this.  I spent last night trying to
> recreate a disk using the CP/M-86 streams I had posted with the Kryoflux
> and failed.  I'm going to play with it a little until I can get a working
> reproduction so I would not rely on those Kryoflux streams just yet.  I am
> guessing the only way I can reproduce a disk is through the Kryoflux
> streams written back to a disk but I can't seem to do that.
> 
> I noticed that Discferret had a wiki page on the Victor 9000 format.  It
> looks like it handled the format but it looks like it is a dead project and
> I'm guessing you can't get Discferret boards anymore.

I have about a dozen bare DiscFerret boards in my cupboard if anyone
wants one.
The board house ran them as hot-air levelled instead of silver-plated,
so they need the SMD pads for the RAM and FPGA (and ideally the PIC too)
cleaning with desolder wick before having those parts installed.
Electrically they're fine.

If you'd prefer to run your own boards (maybe you really like the gold
on purple that OSH Park do?), I have no problem with someone downloading
Eagle, running CAM and uploading the resulting Gerber files to a board
house. Student Me would have appreciated it if you'd have kicked him a
few quid for doing that, but these days... screw it, go have fun. It's
GPLv2 / open hardware. If we ever meet in person, say thank-you. That'll
do. :)

Heck, go make a box full of DiscFerrets for you and your friends. I'd
actually like to see people getting something out of it more than I'd
like to see money from it :)

There's even an ATE program (FerretTest) which can give you a rough idea
where to look for bad solder joints and things. Lots of things to help
you DIY boards (though I actually wrote it because I had a run of boards
with solder bridges on the RAM and FPGA which were causing read/write
issues).

As far as "dead project" goes, it's only dead in the sense that I have
no inclination to buy parts and assemble boards again. Anyone who's been
following DiscFerret for long enough knows the tale. The record's been
stuck so long it's worn through, so I won't repeat it :P

Regarding the API and microcode, they're not "dead", they're "stable"! I
can't think of anything else to add. What more does it need than read
and write? Tell me!

TL/DR: it was a university final year project that kinda escaped the
lab. I'm glad you all still like it and talk about it. I never saw that
coming.

Cheers,
-- 
Phil.
classic...@philpem.me.uk
http://www.philpem.me.uk/

Re: NWA auctions


On 10/12/16 10:08 PM, jim stephens wrote:




On 10/12/2016 9:37 PM, Josh Dersch wrote:


On 10/12/16 9:13 PM, Al Kossow wrote:

https://grafeauction.proxibid.com/asp/catalog.asp?aid=117590=288#288

someone needs to grab those 11/45's!




Thanks for the tip!  Against my better judgement I put in a bid on 
the one without the trim on the faceplate...


- Josh


Will you help get one of the 747 full motion boxes back to my house?  
they have several of those, plus several DC-9 simulators. :-)


Anyone interested in Gould or in Evans & Sutherland should look thru 
all the listings.  There is one tall cabinet that appears full of E 
equipment.


thanks
Jim



Sure thing :)

Any idea what this might be?  Looks interesting, but not a lot of 
information to go by apart from the "Display Systems Incorporated" badges...


https://grafeauction.proxibid.com/aspr/Portable-simulator-display-screens/32464587/LotDetail.asp?lid=32464587

- Josh

Re: NWA auctions

2016-10-13 Thread Adrian Stoness

someone should enquire about the raised floor

On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 11:04 PM, Josh Dersch  wrote:

> On 10/12/16 10:08 PM, jim stephens wrote:
>
>
>>
>> On 10/12/2016 9:37 PM, Josh Dersch wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> On 10/12/16 9:13 PM, Al Kossow wrote:
>>>
 https://grafeauction.proxibid.com/asp/catalog.asp?aid=117590=288#288

 someone needs to grab those 11/45's!



>>> Thanks for the tip!  Against my better judgement I put in a bid on the
>>> one without the trim on the faceplate...
>>>
>>> - Josh
>>>
>>>
>>> Will you help get one of the 747 full motion boxes back to my house?
>> they have several of those, plus several DC-9 simulators. :-)
>>
>> Anyone interested in Gould or in Evans & Sutherland should look thru all
>> the listings.  There is one tall cabinet that appears full of E equipment.
>>
>> thanks
>> Jim
>>
>>
> Sure thing :)
>
> Any idea what this might be?  Looks interesting, but not a lot of
> information to go by apart from the "Display Systems Incorporated" badges...
>
> https://grafeauction.proxibid.com/aspr/Portable-simulator-di
> splay-screens/32464587/LotDetail.asp?lid=32464587
>
> - Josh
>

Re: NWA auctions