On Dec 12, 2009, at 6:28 AM, Jeff Miles wrote:
Sure Macs cost more in the beginning, but in reality when I realize
how long they last they probably end up being cheaper. Of course
there are a few exceptions. Like the 15" multisync monitor that was
a piece of garbage. And the G5 iMac with mot
I understand your logic, but I think even for home users of computers
it's misplaced. With only a few exceptions I find home users of
computers on them more then most people are on their cell phones.
I've been down the route of family members and friends asking for
recommendations and sayin
I never asserted that a craftsman doesn't value quality. Apparently
you made that up out of nowhere in order to interject another Mac/PC
dig.
In the example I gave, the person appreciated quality so much that he
produced projects worthy of display in the Smithsonian, year after
year. The tools and
On Dec 11, 2009, at 5:42 PM, Richard P. wrote:
Personally, I think it's more important to have a skilled person
behind the tools, than just looking at the quality of the tools. ...
The
work he did was impeccable, as evidenced that the Smithsonian kept
calling him back. Yet to look at his shop
Personally, I think it's more important to have a skilled person
behind the tools, than just looking at the quality of the tools. FYI,
a friend worked for years restoring vehicles for the Smithsonian. The
work he did was impeccable, as evidenced that the Smithsonian kept
calling him back. Yet to lo
So we keep discussing this because you keep mischaracterizing what I say. I
never 'my joy is in getting low cost tools', you did. You said it once, I
corrected you...now you are saying it again as if it's fact. Just because
you have said it, doesn't make it so.
*My joy as it were, does not come
Defective of course is Tom's hate for MS showing through. Windows is as
'defective' as a mac, it's just that macs are safer by obscurity. That
said, his point is correct.
On Fri, Dec 11, 2009 at 12:28 PM, tjpa wrote:
> On Dec 11, 2009, at 11:35 AM, Stewart Marshall wrote:
>
>> I wonder what th
No, Mike. I am saying your joy is finding, getting the low-cost tools.
My joy is finding the quality tools. I look at cost if I find several
quality tools. I refer to tools that are important to me, in
professional pursuits where my reputation and my time are on the line or
a serious hobby. I w
On Dec 11, 2009, at 11:35 AM, Stewart Marshall wrote:
I wonder what they are doing that this becomes a huge concern?
PC client gets an email that says it is from Fed Ex. It says "Monthly
statement attached as PDF." Client does have a FedEx account. They
open the PDF, but it appears to be da
Are you saying there are no quality tools that are low cost? Perhaps you
just aren't a good shopper. I never said a 'reasonable job', but I don't
need a 25 dollar hammer to hang a picture as I said. By your logic, your 25
dollar hammer, would do better than a 5 dollar hammer at putting a nail i
Mike, maybe these are two diametrically opposed points of view. I look
for a quality tool likely to produce a professional result, predictably
and efficiently. My joy is the quality of the output and using
efficient, well-built tools. You seem to look for the least-expensive
tool that can do a r
That is one of my posts, yes. I am not able to hallucinate the accused
words.
Thank you,
Mark Snyder
-Original Message-
You mean this comment?
Stewart
At 06:32 AM 12/11/2009, you wrote:
>So Much BS! I predicated my statement with the difference between a
>hack and a pro. You are p
If you read, I gave an apple as one of the inexpensive that would do the
job. I think you are confusing what I said with what someone else said.
Can you show where I did this? I can show you where I said purchasing a mac
mini is an example of an inexpensive tool that works.
*
How would I apply th
Ugh, please live up to the honorific! Thou hast painteth me with colors
most unbidden. The reverend is bereft of logic!
Thank you,
Mark Snyder
-Original Message-
You make one side of the argument and Tom fills in the gap. I am
discussing the whole thing because between you and Tom y
That, Mike, must be a WFB misperception. I said crummy, crappy tools.
*You* said M$. I said quality, professional tools. You cried expensive
Apple. You seem to imply that Apple makes the only quality tools; I
would refute that.
Thank you,
-Original Message-
If it was some sort of 'W
You mean this comment?
Stewart
At 06:32 AM 12/11/2009, you wrote:
So Much BS! I predicated my statement with the difference between a
hack and a pro. You are permitted to be a hack. Just don't show up
when I am asking for the pro's with crappy tools; I won't give you the
job - I will just l
You make one side of the argument and Tom fills in the gap. I am
discussing the whole thing because between you and Tom you are a tag team.
Stewart
At 11:21 AM 12/11/2009, you wrote:
Rev, you keep attributing things not said in my posts like some demon.
My posts discuss quality. Your posts
Rev, you keep attributing things not said in my posts like some demon.
My posts discuss quality. Your posts are refutations of imagined costs
or biases.
My kindest description of that is slippery discourse.
Thank you,
Mark Snyder
-Original Message-
OK lets use this line of argument
If it was some sort of 'WFB' trick, then your trick being the MFB is to
exchange inexpensive for crummy. I never mentioned crummy...I said
inexpensive, you made the inexpensive = crummy analogy.
*Not "going off" Mike, just not quite parsing your defense of crummy
tools. So if I want to build a b
Please quote that comment back to me from one of my posts, Rev. Me
thinks it was inserted by a mind other than mine!
Thank you,
-Original Message-
True but you made the comment about crappy tools equating any windows
machine as a crappy tool, since they cost less than a Mac then cost
OK lets use this line of argument.
You will not accept anyone who uses a Windows machine because you
consider them crappy tools.
So the equal argument would be like this.
I consider Chevy's to be crappy cars so therefore I will not hire
anyone (If I were a mechanic) who drives a chevy as the
We who? The voices in your head?
On Fri, Dec 11, 2009 at 9:30 AM, tjpa wrote:
> On Dec 11, 2009, at 11:04 AM, mike wrote:
>
>> I went into Harbor Freight about a year ago to just look around, I had no
>> plans on buying anything. I found a 10 piece set of pliers for 8 dollars.
>> All of them s
I never mentioned cost as a requirement for quality. That seems to be a
WFB trap or argument trick.
My mother is becoming very forgetful. A quality computer tool for her
is something easy to use. But I am talking about people who do
professional work and my long-retired mother does not qualify.
True but you made the comment about crappy tools equating any windows
machine as a crappy tool, since they cost less than a Mac then cost
must be a factor.
Stewart
At 10:41 AM 12/11/2009, you wrote:
I never mentioned cost; _you_ made that assumption, Rev! Your
assumptions are flawed...
Tha
I never mentioned cost; _you_ made that assumption, Rev! Your
assumptions are flawed...
Thank you,
-Original Message-
You make a bad assumption cost = quality
You are saying that the Rolls Royce is indeed a better car for
everyone because it costs more money therefore it is of the hig
I wonder what they are doing that this becomes a huge concern?
I surf and work on the net most of the day rarely do I ever have a
worry about this.
MY 19 year old son spends a lot of time on his computer surfing the
net. I have to clean his machine up periodically but I know where he
is goi
On Dec 11, 2009, at 11:04 AM, mike wrote:
I went into Harbor Freight about a year ago to just look around, I
had no
plans on buying anything. I found a 10 piece set of pliers for 8
dollars.
All of them still work great, two of them sit in a junk drawer for
small
household needs, they do exa
Keep dancing, don't address the issue!
On Fri, Dec 11, 2009 at 9:15 AM, tjpa wrote:
> On Dec 10, 2009, at 9:23 PM, mike wrote:
>
>> Another ridiculous assertion made by someone who clearly has never had to
>> meet a budget, you should do government work.
>>
>
> Ben Franklin warned against being
On Dec 10, 2009, at 9:23 PM, mike wrote:
Another ridiculous assertion made by someone who clearly has never
had to
meet a budget, you should do government work.
Ben Franklin warned against being penny wise and pound foolish. Today
we call it total cost of ownership.
I find that with clien
I went into Harbor Freight about a year ago to just look around, I had no
plans on buying anything. I found a 10 piece set of pliers for 8 dollars.
All of them still work great, two of them sit in a junk drawer for small
household needs, they do exactly what a 20 dollar or 25 dollar pair would do
The problem is you seem to equate inexpensive with crap. I don't. I don't
buy 'crappy' tools, I buy the tools that will do the job, whatever job,
well. I don't need a 400 dollar hammer because I don't use a hammer to make
my living. If I already have that hammer, of course I'd use it, but I don
You make a bad assumption cost = quality
You are saying that the Rolls Royce is indeed a better car for
everyone because it costs more money therefore it is of the highest
quality and everyone should save up and wait till they can afford a
Rolls Royce then they can buy a car?
I don't buy MAC
Not "going off" Mike, just not quite parsing your defense of crummy
tools. So if I want to build a birdhouse, hang a picture or build
something in the backyard I need crappy tools? If I already use
professional tools, these projects are beneath those tools? Do you
apply this to computers? If so
Not sure why you are going off when I agreed with you. Habit maybe? Which
part is bs? I said 'Those building homes need better tools than someone
putting together a few pieces of wood.' Was that the BS?
On Fri, Dec 11, 2009 at 5:32 AM, Snyder, Mark - IdM (IS) <
mark.sny...@ngc.com> wrote:
> S
So Much BS! I predicated my statement with the difference between a
hack and a pro. You are permitted to be a hack. Just don't show up
when I am asking for the pro's with crappy tools; I won't give you the
job - I will just laugh. Why such defense of crappy tools? I am in IT,
so when applied t
Quoting tjpa :
On Dec 10, 2009, at 2:47 PM, mike wrote:
Those building homes need better tools than someone putting together a few
pieces of wood. Interestingly, when I have a friend of mine over who is a
professional carpenter, he doesn't make fun of me because of the saw I
use. He knows I
Another ridiculous assertion made by someone who clearly has never had to
meet a budget, you should do government work. Under your reasoning..I hate
to even call it that, I should buy a 700 dollar drill for piddly little jobs
around the house even though a 60 dollar cordless drill will do the job.
None of my machines use sleep. My own is usually running something,
maybe just fold...@home. But I turn it off at night. I also have them
all set to power down the monitors after a couple hours.
Last year with her new Vista laptop I gave the wife a choice of sleep
or shut down. She's a total non-t
On Dec 10, 2009, at 2:47 PM, mike wrote:
Those building homes need better tools than someone putting together
a few
pieces of wood. Interestingly, when I have a friend of mine over
who is a
professional carpenter, he doesn't make fun of me because of the
saw I
use. He knows I don't do it
Those building homes need better tools than someone putting together a few
pieces of wood. Interestingly, when I have a friend of mine over who is a
professional carpenter, he doesn't make fun of me because of the saw I
use. He knows I don't do it for a living, I don't need the level of tool he
The difference between a hack and a pro are skill-level and the quality
of their tools.
I am picky about choosing tools. I spend whatever time is necessary to
learn what is good and what is not before I make my choice.
Thank you,
Mark Snyder
-Original Message-
You got some right there,
You got some right there, the computer is just a tool. Good job confirming
what we knew about the MFB community.
And after taking the kids to Mary Coyles last night, I can say with gusto,
ice cream is better than computers. They have been doing it sixty years so
they are pretty good at the ice c
On Dec 10, 2009, at 1:35 AM, mike wrote:
Part of the problem is how MS approaches touting the features. Part
of it
is haters who see 'windows 7 boots faster than vista' as not that 7 is
faster but that vista is crap. Shockingly they don't look at Apple's
advertising the same way, some will ne
Part of the problem is how MS approaches touting the features. Part of it
is haters who see 'windows 7 boots faster than vista' as not that 7 is
faster but that vista is crap. Shockingly they don't look at Apple's
advertising the same way, some will never satisfy, better to just ignore
them, nod
I'm not sure who you heard this from but it is not true. But then,
Vista isn't slow to boot, so clearly this source is suspect.
On Wed, Dec 9, 2009 at 10:07 PM, db wrote:
> 7 may wake quickly from sleep but I hear that in practical use it is even
> slower than Vista to boot...
7 may wake quickly from sleep but I hear that in practical use it is
even slower than Vista to boot... which because of battery life is what
you will be facing regularly with a laptop.
db
mike wrote:
Yeah this one is really odd. The ad campaign with the guy talking about
running 7 on his lap
Yeah this one is really odd. The ad campaign with the guy talking about
running 7 on his laptop and his home computer and his kids laptop and they
all share the media together without any problems is far better. This one,
is just weird.
On Wed, Dec 9, 2009 at 2:47 PM, tjpa wrote:
> On Dec 9, 2
On Dec 9, 2009, at 4:35 PM, mike wrote:
Sounds like more MS bad advertising ideas...make a problem that wasn't
really a problem seem like it's been fixed.
Some companies will say absolutely anything to get the rubes to part
with their dollars.
**
Sounds like more MS bad advertising ideas...make a problem that wasn't
really a problem seem like it's been fixed. Who knows, the only time I've
seen this issue is either when malware etc is on the machine or in network
situations where the admin has written bad scripts that run on login.
Otherwis
I am seeing a relatively new Windows 7 ad that touts how quickly a
computer can awaken from sleep mode under the new OS. In the ad, this
awakening issue appears to be such a big deal that Toshiba, along with
MS I suppose, flies a user all the way fprm the United States to Japan
just to show her
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