Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
Our country is devided. People in the south get jaws, people in the north get hal. And there is a fight to use either reader. I have both. Mainly because I had hal for school and got jaws later. At 06:27 PM 10/31/2006, x-sight interactive wrote: >well, i know that, tried to tell the school, they wouldn't listen, they keep >using supernova because they have people working for dolphin computer access >who used to go to the college and it was just down the road, blah blah blah, >freedom scientific are in the usa so it'd be harder to get support, blah >blah blah, we don't have enough money, blah blah blah, so i can't really >control what the school does, i can only control my computer. the school >have given me access to their vs.net discs, with it being a network license, >but i don't know whether they've updated it from that end, but i have jfw >7.0 on my system, so would 2003 or 2002 work with that or is it still not >worth installing that version? >and how can i check which version i have before installing it? > >thanks. > >regards, > >damien > > > > >- Original Message - >From: "Thomas Ward" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: "Gamers Discussion list" >Sent: Tuesday, October 31, 2006 12:35 AM >Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic > > >> Oh, I see. Well, I recommend putting on VS.NET Express 2005. VS.NET >> 2003 was known for huge crashes and VS.NET 2002 was worse. >> If they are using Super Nova it was no wonder the IDE sucked. Super Nova >> isn't known for supporting Visual Studio anything very well. For that >> you need Jaws 7 or Window Eyes 5.5 or later to be effective. >> >> >> x-sight interactive wrote: >> > it wasn't actually my computer i tried it on it was one of the college's >> > that i go to. >> > >> > they run windows xp service pack 2 and supernova (what??? yuck!!! lol) >as >> > their screenreader. i don't know what the versions are for the ide and >the >> > net stuff, it wasn't 2005 express though they bought a proper license >for >> > it. could've been 2003. >> > >> > regards, >> > >> > damien >> > >> >> >> ___ >> Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org >> To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can >visit >> http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make >> any subscription changes via the web. >> >> >> > > > >___ >Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org >To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit >http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make >any subscription changes via the web. ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
Hi Damien, If it is VS.NET 2002 don't even bother installing it. It is unaccessible, the IDE totally sucks, and it uses a very very old .NET framework that isn't supported any longer. VS.NET 2003 is ok, it works well enough with Jaws 7 and Window Eyes 5, but the only reason I can think of against it is that it still uses .NET Framework 1.1. Now, days developers are in the process of migrating from 1.0/1.1 to 2.0 which is supported in VS.NET 2005. One thing I can say in favor of 2003 was that the debugger wasn't so chatty and didn't interrupt Jaws and Window Eyes with constant error windows if you typed in a wrong function, misspelled a variable, or similar offence. x-sight interactive wrote: > well, i know that, tried to tell the school, they wouldn't listen, they keep > using supernova because they have people working for dolphin computer access > who used to go to the college and it was just down the road, blah blah blah, > freedom scientific are in the usa so it'd be harder to get support, blah > blah blah, we don't have enough money, blah blah blah, so i can't really > control what the school does, i can only control my computer. the school > have given me access to their vs.net discs, with it being a network license, > but i don't know whether they've updated it from that end, but i have jfw > 7.0 on my system, so would 2003 or 2002 work with that or is it still not > worth installing that version? > and how can i check which version i have before installing it? > > thanks. > ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
well, i know that, tried to tell the school, they wouldn't listen, they keep using supernova because they have people working for dolphin computer access who used to go to the college and it was just down the road, blah blah blah, freedom scientific are in the usa so it'd be harder to get support, blah blah blah, we don't have enough money, blah blah blah, so i can't really control what the school does, i can only control my computer. the school have given me access to their vs.net discs, with it being a network license, but i don't know whether they've updated it from that end, but i have jfw 7.0 on my system, so would 2003 or 2002 work with that or is it still not worth installing that version? and how can i check which version i have before installing it? thanks. regards, damien - Original Message - From: "Thomas Ward" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Tuesday, October 31, 2006 12:35 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic > Oh, I see. Well, I recommend putting on VS.NET Express 2005. VS.NET > 2003 was known for huge crashes and VS.NET 2002 was worse. > If they are using Super Nova it was no wonder the IDE sucked. Super Nova > isn't known for supporting Visual Studio anything very well. For that > you need Jaws 7 or Window Eyes 5.5 or later to be effective. > > > x-sight interactive wrote: > > it wasn't actually my computer i tried it on it was one of the college's > > that i go to. > > > > they run windows xp service pack 2 and supernova (what??? yuck!!! lol) as > > their screenreader. i don't know what the versions are for the ide and the > > net stuff, it wasn't 2005 express though they bought a proper license for > > it. could've been 2003. > > > > regards, > > > > damien > > > > > ___ > Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org > To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit > http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make > any subscription changes via the web. > > > ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
Hi Damien, Unload Me is used to unload the active form. If the form happens to be the main form the game will close. x-sight interactive wrote: > unload me? that's strange lol, so what's the difference between end and > unload me then? > > regards, > > damien > ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
Ah, thanks for the correction, Jim. I used the wrong flag. I used
Capture rather than Playing. Been a long while since I did anything with
VB 6.
Jim Kitchen wrote:
> Hi Damien
>
> In DirectX there is a function to have it wait for the wave file to finish
> playing. It looks something like
>
> wave1.Play DSBPLAY_DEFAULT
> Do
> DoEvents
> Loop While wave1.GetStatus = DSBSTATUS_PLAYING
>
> There is also a function just to check to see if it is still playing so that
> your game can be doing other things in the mean time.
>
> And here is my Hello World VB6 program
>
> x = MsgBox(" Hello World ", 1, " ")
>
> You may want to put a
>
> end
> unload me
>
> Just so that the program finishes correctly.
>
> HTH
>
> BFN
>
> Jim
>
> Anything simple is stated in the most complicated manner.
>
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> http://www.kitchensinc.net
> (440) 286-6920
> Chardon Ohio USA
> ___
> Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org
> To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit
> http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make
> any subscription changes via the web.
>
>
>
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Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
Oh, I see. Well, I recommend putting on VS.NET Express 2005. VS.NET 2003 was known for huge crashes and VS.NET 2002 was worse. If they are using Super Nova it was no wonder the IDE sucked. Super Nova isn't known for supporting Visual Studio anything very well. For that you need Jaws 7 or Window Eyes 5.5 or later to be effective. x-sight interactive wrote: > it wasn't actually my computer i tried it on it was one of the college's > that i go to. > > they run windows xp service pack 2 and supernova (what??? yuck!!! lol) as > their screenreader. i don't know what the versions are for the ide and the > net stuff, it wasn't 2005 express though they bought a proper license for > it. could've been 2003. > > regards, > > damien > ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
Hi Damien, Waiting for a sound to finish is quite simple. DirectX DirectSound can check the status of the playback of a sound which can be put in a while loop. When the state of the sound changes the loop ends and the function continues. In VB 6 it would look like this. Do While dsSoundBuffer.GetStatus = DSCBSTATUS_CAPTURING DoEvents Loop The object dsSoundBuffer is used genericly in this instance. If you had a sound buffer called dsFireMissile you would put that in the place of dsSoundBuffer above. As far as using VB 6 rather than visual C++ at this point I say go for it. ++. VB is not an incredibly hard language to learn and you might have fun doing things without having to learn all of C++. I used C#.NET and VB.NET myself rather than working with C++ because C++ has a huge learning curve. I don't recommend C++ for newbies unless he/she wants to put allot of work in to the effort. However, all things considered I would recommend C#.NET or VB.NET before VB 6. However, if you feel VB 6 will help you I'd say give it a try. x-sight interactive wrote: > waiting for sounds to finish most of the time. i don't know of any other > time i'd need to make it wait. but when i say creating forms i'm talking > about making general programs also. oh, so a timer is just like a control, i > see. in autoit you have the sleep function for it waiting, the TimerInit > function to initialise a timer,k the TimerDiff function to work out the time > on the timer, but, well, maybe i should stick to vb for making game > programs, at least for the moment, if i'm to get some fun out of it without > getting frustrated with c *smile* > > regards, > > damien > ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
Hi Damien, Well, in my experience learning from a person doesn't work as well as reading programming books and working through them on a purely beginner to advance level of learning. Books can fill in so much more than any one person. That includes college profs which only have an hour or so each day to cover the high-points. It is the books themselves that hold the goodies. x-sight interactive wrote: > wow, sounds cool. > just godda understand it all now. i have this guy trying very hard to teach > me c but i just don't get it. i'm not giving up this time ... > > regards, > > damien > ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
You may want to ge tonthe agdev list and discuss this.
To answer your question however, unload me runs the unload event of the
form which let's you clean up what ever messes you've made.
-Original Message-
From: x-sight interactive [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Monday, October 30, 2006 4:46 AM
To: Gamers Discussion list
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
unload me? that's strange lol, so what's the difference between end and
unload me then?
regards,
damien
- Original Message -
From: "Jim Kitchen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "x-sight interactive"
Sent: Monday, October 30, 2006 9:11 AM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
> Hi Damien
>
> In DirectX there is a function to have it wait for the wave file to
> finish
playing. It looks something like
>
> wave1.Play DSBPLAY_DEFAULT
> Do
> DoEvents
> Loop While wave1.GetStatus = DSBSTATUS_PLAYING
>
> There is also a function just to check to see if it is still playing
> so
that your game can be doing other things in the mean time.
>
> And here is my Hello World VB6 program
>
> x = MsgBox(" Hello World ", 1, " ")
>
> You may want to put a
>
> end
> unload me
>
> Just so that the program finishes correctly.
>
> HTH
>
> BFN
>
> Jim
>
> Anything simple is stated in the most complicated manner.
>
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> http://www.kitchensinc.net
> (440) 286-6920
> Chardon Ohio USA
> ___
> Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail
> to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can
visit
> http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any
> subscription changes via the web.
>
>
>
___
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Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
unload me? that's strange lol, so what's the difference between end and
unload me then?
regards,
damien
- Original Message -
From: "Jim Kitchen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "x-sight interactive"
Sent: Monday, October 30, 2006 9:11 AM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
> Hi Damien
>
> In DirectX there is a function to have it wait for the wave file to finish
playing. It looks something like
>
> wave1.Play DSBPLAY_DEFAULT
> Do
> DoEvents
> Loop While wave1.GetStatus = DSBSTATUS_PLAYING
>
> There is also a function just to check to see if it is still playing so
that your game can be doing other things in the mean time.
>
> And here is my Hello World VB6 program
>
> x = MsgBox(" Hello World ", 1, " ")
>
> You may want to put a
>
> end
> unload me
>
> Just so that the program finishes correctly.
>
> HTH
>
> BFN
>
> Jim
>
> Anything simple is stated in the most complicated manner.
>
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> http://www.kitchensinc.net
> (440) 286-6920
> Chardon Ohio USA
> ___
> Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org
> To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can
visit
> http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make
> any subscription changes via the web.
>
>
>
___
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Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
Hi Damien
In DirectX there is a function to have it wait for the wave file to finish
playing. It looks something like
wave1.Play DSBPLAY_DEFAULT
Do
DoEvents
Loop While wave1.GetStatus = DSBSTATUS_PLAYING
There is also a function just to check to see if it is still playing so that
your game can be doing other things in the mean time.
And here is my Hello World VB6 program
x = MsgBox(" Hello World ", 1, " ")
You may want to put a
end
unload me
Just so that the program finishes correctly.
HTH
BFN
Jim
Anything simple is stated in the most complicated manner.
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.kitchensinc.net
(440) 286-6920
Chardon Ohio USA
___
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Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
well damon. I will at some point get the entire visual studio express dotnet. I will probably dabble in vc# and probably vwd. I will have everything though and well I'll see How far I will get. At 02:12 PM 10/30/2006, x-sight interactive wrote: >ok guys you win. i'm still using autoit for now, but i've given up comaudio. >it broke on my system and philip bennefall's having problems with it. i >can't get it to work at all on mine. > >i did actually try at one point with msvs.net and the ide was terrible - >kept hanging on my system. so all i have now is msvs6. so yes, i'm currently >trying to learn dx myself and am beginning to understand it. however there >are still basic concepts i don't know how to code in vb, like how to make it >wait, how to create arrays, how to use timers, position forms, if i can sort >all that out i may just switch from autoit altogether, don't know yet. > >regards, > >damien > > > > > >- Original Message - >From: "Liam Erven" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: "'Gamers Discussion list'" >Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2006 12:38 PM >Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic > > >> Quintin: >> >> Autoit is an excelent language to get your feet web. However, if you are >> serious about doing anything serious, your best bet is to learn a language >> like c sharp or vb. I'm a very big vb fan, and I know me and Tom will >> disagree. But, it's what works for me, and it's what I can teach people >on >> the best. Grnated, my dot net stuff is rusty, but I'm still learning, and >> I've found all I need to know to get dx to work fairly well. However, Tom >> is right in that there is not a lot out there for beginner programmers. I >> really really do not like autoit though. There is much better out there. >I >> won't write a whole list of the things I don't like, just know that I >> dislike it greatly. Hahaha. >> >> Liam >> >> -Original Message- >> From: Quinten Pendle [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] >> Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2006 5:28 AM >> To: 'Gamers Discussion list' >> Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic >> >> Hi Thomas >> Where can one find the agdev-newbies list to subscribe to it? >> Also, what do you think of AutoIT as a programming language? >> The little that I saw of it, looked quite good. >> Best regards >> Quinten Pendle >> PENDLE PRO >> Klerksdorp, South Africa >> >> Tel: +27 (0) 83 395 4593 >> Email: >> [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> MSN: >> [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> Skype: >> ahakimbo >> Website: >> www.pendlepro.com >> >> >> -Original Message- >> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] >> On Behalf Of Thomas Ward >> Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2006 10:51 AM >> To: Gamers Discussion list >> Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic >> >> >> Hi Robin, >> In the future posts like this should probably go over to the agdev-newbies >> list where we discuss such issues like this more in depth. >> However, since I am writing this email anyway. I will answer as many >> questions as I can, and I have a few questions of my own. >> >> /Snip >> > I'd like to learn how to write programs and games in VB. >> End Snip >> >> Is there any special reason you decided to go for Visual Basic rather than >> say C#, called C-Sharp. >> I highly recommend going with C-Sharp over VB for the primary reason many >> things are better documented and supported. One of these important areas >in >> particular to you will be DirectX. While you can use MS DirectX in VB >games >> Microsoft does not officially support it, and do not >> >> provide code samples, instructions, etc on writing games in VB .NET 2005. >> >> Snip >> > 1. Is it possible to write good games in VB? >> End Snip >> >> Yes, but you will find that good and reliable documentation for newbies is >> extremely lacking. Visual Basic became famous among amature and rapid >> >> application developers during the 90's but it's popularity is on the >> decline. Most of the VB croud have switched to C-Sharp. >> Just some historical background when DirectX 7 and 8 came out Microsoft >> unvailed it with VB 6.0 examples etc and offered newbies a simple basic >> language with a good set of multimedia libraries for developing games and >> other amature home wrote applications. >> In 2001 Microsoft converted all t
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
hmm.
I did programm structures.
Although I havn't seen actual c here is my translation.
instance.
An instance is the current thing running at that time, and previous instances
ofcause.
And well commands and interupts.
Its not all of it but I did 2 programming courses and I well I have some
knowledge.
But mail me off list I may attempt to learn all the studio things.
We will see.
At 02:43 PM 10/30/2006, x-sight interactive wrote:
>ya know? i really, really, really admire them people that can understand
>languages like c. visual basic and autoit are, what, 3 lines, if that, to
>write a simple hello world program. in c it's 85 lines, half of which i
>don't have a clue what they all mean, such as:
>
>HINSTANCE hInstance,
> HINSTANCE hPrevInstance,
> LPSTR lpCmdLine,
>int nShowCmd
>
>that hardly makes sense at all to me. those aren't even the start headers. i
>can make out little bits, like CMDLine is for command line parameters, etc,
>but most of it is half another language altogether, whereas
>#include
>GUICreate("Hello World!")
>GUISetState()
>is a lot easier to understand. that's why i started with autoit. maybe i'm
>just far too impatient *grin*
>
>regards,
>
>damien
>
>
>
>
>
>- Original Message -
>From: "Thomas Ward" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>To: "Gamers Discussion list"
>Sent: Thursday, October 26, 2006 3:04 PM
>Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
>
>
>> Hi Liam,
>> No change isn't always bad, and in this case I feel it was about to
>> happen sooner or later. As I understand it from what I have heard from
>> Microsoft on the subject was that many VB programmers in the field
>> bombarded MS with requests to update the language and include more
>> features present in more powerful languages such as C++ and Java. These
>> days it is unreasonable to not have a good oop design present in a
>> programming language. Especially, seeing as all the really popular
>> languages like C++, Java, Python, etc have a good oop design and are
>> more popular than non-oop languages.
>> Strictly speaking from my personal opinion and experiences when I was a
>> student in college they started us out on VB 5. Oh, I was happy as a
>> clam to be able to write something constructive, Mr. Programmer, and
>> all. However, as time went on I got in to more complex languages like
>> C++ and Java, and with them came more complex advanced concepts, new
>> design conventions, and so on. Once I learned, grasped, and understood
>> the advantages of what C++ and Java had to offer VB 5 seamed like a
>> joke, or a toy language for kids.
>> I mean I was really impressed with a simple subject like class
>> inheritence. How you could start out with a master class let's say
>> starship, put all your major variables and functions in there, and then
>> begin branching out, and create more and more specialised classes which
>> inherit the more generalised classes. With the creation of one instance
>> of an object you have access to not only the specialised class you have
>> access to variables and functions to everything that specialised class
>> was derived from. Even cooler you wrote the variables and functions
>> once, but everytime you create an instance of an object which points to
>> that class those variables are duplicated in memory for the specific use
>> of that object without having to write them over again for that item,
>> object, character, you are storing data for.
>> I guess to sum it up I learned oop design, and I couldn't live without
>> it. I found languages without oop design to be backward, outdated, and
>> really the hard way of doing things.
>> Liam Erven wrote:
>> > Jim. It's much much different. There's many major differences than in
>vb6.
>> > I was surprised to find out you could program in vb6 like you would in
>an
>> > older form of basic, but the whole system is much much different now.
>> > Change isn't always bad. I'm really enjoying this new version quite a
>lot.
>> >
>>
>>
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>> any subscription changes via the web.
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
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Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
waiting for sounds to finish most of the time. i don't know of any other time i'd need to make it wait. but when i say creating forms i'm talking about making general programs also. oh, so a timer is just like a control, i see. in autoit you have the sleep function for it waiting, the TimerInit function to initialise a timer,k the TimerDiff function to work out the time on the timer, but, well, maybe i should stick to vb for making game programs, at least for the moment, if i'm to get some fun out of it without getting frustrated with c *smile* regards, damien - Original Message - From: "Thomas Ward" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Monday, October 30, 2006 4:31 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic > Hi Damion, > > Snip > There are still basic concepts i don't know how to code in vb, like how > to make it > wait, how to create arrays, how to use timers, position forms... > End Snip > > When you mean make it wait are you waiting on a certain sound to finish, > wait for a Windows message cue, or what exactly do you need to know > about waiting. > As far as arrays goes any VB book has good documentation on how to > create an array. They are actually quite easy to work with. > As far as timers goes those are easy as well. Select one from the > toolbox, place it on your form, and go in to it's properties. Name it, > set it for how many cycles per second you want it to update, and press > enter on the timer control and VB will nicely create the function for > you. From that point just put code in it like any other function that > needs to be updated every so many times per second. All you need to do > from that point is enable or disable the timer in another function like > GameTimer.Enabled = True. > As far as potioning forms I don't see you needing to fool with Forms > much. The only major form you will have to deal with is the main form > where your game code will go. > > > ___ > Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org > To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit > http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make > any subscription changes via the web. > > > ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
it wasn't actually my computer i tried it on it was one of the college's that i go to. they run windows xp service pack 2 and supernova (what??? yuck!!! lol) as their screenreader. i don't know what the versions are for the ide and the net stuff, it wasn't 2005 express though they bought a proper license for it. could've been 2003. regards, damien - Original Message - From: "Thomas Ward" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Monday, October 30, 2006 4:34 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic > Hi Damion, > > Snip > i did actually try at one point with msvs.net and the ide was terrible - > kept hanging on my system. > End Snip > > Hmmm... Which version of the IDE did you have? Also what versions of > Windows are you running, screen reader, and when was the last time your > computer has had a good reformat and reinstall of Windows. Visual Studio > 2005 Express shouldn't be locking up unless your Windows is messed up or > there is something incompatible on your machine. > Smile. > > > ___ > Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org > To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit > http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make > any subscription changes via the web. > > ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
wow, sounds cool.
just godda understand it all now. i have this guy trying very hard to teach
me c but i just don't get it. i'm not giving up this time ...
regards,
damien
- Original Message -
From: "Thomas Ward" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Gamers Discussion list"
Sent: Monday, October 30, 2006 4:07 AM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
> Hi Damion,
> Actually, a Hello World type program can be written in C++ in 6 lines as
> long as you are writing a text program without all the Windows Win32
> junk with it. It would look like this.
>
> #include
> int main()
> {
> std::cout << "Hello world!" << endl;
> return 0;
> }
>
> So saying you have to have 85 lines to write a Hello World program in
> C++ simply isn't true. However, what you seam to be getting confused
> about is the Microsoft Win32 API. That is responcible for handling
> Windows, buttons, listboxes, and other Windows controls. If you count
> the Win32 API and want Hello World to appear in it's own window rather
> than in a text window than 85 is probably about right.
> To understand the stuff you are talking about such as HINSTANCE you need
> to understand the Win32 API. For example, HINSTANCE hInstance is an
> object that is often used to control the current handle of the active
> window. The HINSTANCE hPrevInstance is the previous instance, of the
> window handle and so on. The
>
> LPSTR lpCmdLine is a string used to process commandline parameters that
might be externally passed to the application.
>
>
> \
> x-sight interactive wrote:
> > ya know? i really, really, really admire them people that can understand
> > languages like c. visual basic and autoit are, what, 3 lines, if that,
to
> > write a simple hello world program. in c it's 85 lines, half of which i
> > don't have a clue what they all mean, such as:
> >
> > HINSTANCE hInstance,
> > HINSTANCE hPrevInstance,
> > LPSTR lpCmdLine,
> > int nShowCmd
> >
> > that hardly makes sense at all to me. those aren't even the start
headers. i
> > can make out little bits, like CMDLine is for command line parameters,
etc,
> > but most of it is half another language altogether, whereas
> > #include
> > GUICreate("Hello World!")
> > GUISetState()
> > is a lot easier to understand. that's why i started with autoit. maybe
i'm
> > just far too impatient *grin*
> >
> > regards,
> >
> > damien
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > - Original Message -
> > From: "Thomas Ward" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > To: "Gamers Discussion list"
> > Sent: Thursday, October 26, 2006 3:04 PM
> > Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
> >
> >
> >
> >> Hi Liam,
> >> No change isn't always bad, and in this case I feel it was about to
> >> happen sooner or later. As I understand it from what I have heard from
> >> Microsoft on the subject was that many VB programmers in the field
> >> bombarded MS with requests to update the language and include more
> >> features present in more powerful languages such as C++ and Java. These
> >> days it is unreasonable to not have a good oop design present in a
> >> programming language. Especially, seeing as all the really popular
> >> languages like C++, Java, Python, etc have a good oop design and are
> >> more popular than non-oop languages.
> >> Strictly speaking from my personal opinion and experiences when I was a
> >> student in college they started us out on VB 5. Oh, I was happy as a
> >> clam to be able to write something constructive, Mr. Programmer, and
> >> all. However, as time went on I got in to more complex languages like
> >> C++ and Java, and with them came more complex advanced concepts, new
> >> design conventions, and so on. Once I learned, grasped, and understood
> >> the advantages of what C++ and Java had to offer VB 5 seamed like a
> >> joke, or a toy language for kids.
> >> I mean I was really impressed with a simple subject like class
> >> inheritence. How you could start out with a master class let's say
> >> starship, put all your major variables and functions in there, and then
> >> begin branching out, and create more and more specialised classes which
> >> inherit the more generalised classes. With the creation of one
instance
> >> of an object you have access to not only the specialised class you have
> >> access to variables and functions to everything that specialis
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
Hi Damion, Snip i did actually try at one point with msvs.net and the ide was terrible - kept hanging on my system. End Snip Hmmm... Which version of the IDE did you have? Also what versions of Windows are you running, screen reader, and when was the last time your computer has had a good reformat and reinstall of Windows. Visual Studio 2005 Express shouldn't be locking up unless your Windows is messed up or there is something incompatible on your machine. Smile. ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
Hi Damion, Snip There are still basic concepts i don't know how to code in vb, like how to make it wait, how to create arrays, how to use timers, position forms... End Snip When you mean make it wait are you waiting on a certain sound to finish, wait for a Windows message cue, or what exactly do you need to know about waiting. As far as arrays goes any VB book has good documentation on how to create an array. They are actually quite easy to work with. As far as timers goes those are easy as well. Select one from the toolbox, place it on your form, and go in to it's properties. Name it, set it for how many cycles per second you want it to update, and press enter on the timer control and VB will nicely create the function for you. From that point just put code in it like any other function that needs to be updated every so many times per second. All you need to do from that point is enable or disable the timer in another function like GameTimer.Enabled = True. As far as potioning forms I don't see you needing to fool with Forms much. The only major form you will have to deal with is the main form where your game code will go. ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
Hi Damion,
Actually, a Hello World type program can be written in C++ in 6 lines as
long as you are writing a text program without all the Windows Win32
junk with it. It would look like this.
#include
int main()
{
std::cout << "Hello world!" << endl;
return 0;
}
So saying you have to have 85 lines to write a Hello World program in
C++ simply isn't true. However, what you seam to be getting confused
about is the Microsoft Win32 API. That is responcible for handling
Windows, buttons, listboxes, and other Windows controls. If you count
the Win32 API and want Hello World to appear in it's own window rather
than in a text window than 85 is probably about right.
To understand the stuff you are talking about such as HINSTANCE you need
to understand the Win32 API. For example, HINSTANCE hInstance is an
object that is often used to control the current handle of the active
window. The HINSTANCE hPrevInstance is the previous instance, of the
window handle and so on. The
LPSTR lpCmdLine is a string used to process commandline parameters that might
be externally passed to the application.
\
x-sight interactive wrote:
> ya know? i really, really, really admire them people that can understand
> languages like c. visual basic and autoit are, what, 3 lines, if that, to
> write a simple hello world program. in c it's 85 lines, half of which i
> don't have a clue what they all mean, such as:
>
> HINSTANCE hInstance,
> HINSTANCE hPrevInstance,
> LPSTR lpCmdLine,
> int nShowCmd
>
> that hardly makes sense at all to me. those aren't even the start headers. i
> can make out little bits, like CMDLine is for command line parameters, etc,
> but most of it is half another language altogether, whereas
> #include
> GUICreate("Hello World!")
> GUISetState()
> is a lot easier to understand. that's why i started with autoit. maybe i'm
> just far too impatient *grin*
>
> regards,
>
> damien
>
>
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Thomas Ward" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "Gamers Discussion list"
> Sent: Thursday, October 26, 2006 3:04 PM
> Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
>
>
>
>> Hi Liam,
>> No change isn't always bad, and in this case I feel it was about to
>> happen sooner or later. As I understand it from what I have heard from
>> Microsoft on the subject was that many VB programmers in the field
>> bombarded MS with requests to update the language and include more
>> features present in more powerful languages such as C++ and Java. These
>> days it is unreasonable to not have a good oop design present in a
>> programming language. Especially, seeing as all the really popular
>> languages like C++, Java, Python, etc have a good oop design and are
>> more popular than non-oop languages.
>> Strictly speaking from my personal opinion and experiences when I was a
>> student in college they started us out on VB 5. Oh, I was happy as a
>> clam to be able to write something constructive, Mr. Programmer, and
>> all. However, as time went on I got in to more complex languages like
>> C++ and Java, and with them came more complex advanced concepts, new
>> design conventions, and so on. Once I learned, grasped, and understood
>> the advantages of what C++ and Java had to offer VB 5 seamed like a
>> joke, or a toy language for kids.
>> I mean I was really impressed with a simple subject like class
>> inheritence. How you could start out with a master class let's say
>> starship, put all your major variables and functions in there, and then
>> begin branching out, and create more and more specialised classes which
>> inherit the more generalised classes. With the creation of one instance
>> of an object you have access to not only the specialised class you have
>> access to variables and functions to everything that specialised class
>> was derived from. Even cooler you wrote the variables and functions
>> once, but everytime you create an instance of an object which points to
>> that class those variables are duplicated in memory for the specific use
>> of that object without having to write them over again for that item,
>> object, character, you are storing data for.
>> I guess to sum it up I learned oop design, and I couldn't live without
>> it. I found languages without oop design to be backward, outdated, and
>> really the hard way of doing things.
>> Liam Erven wrote:
>>
>>> Jim. It's much much different. There's many major differences than in
>>>
> vb6.
>
>>> I was surprised to find out you could program in
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
ya know? i really, really, really admire them people that can understand
languages like c. visual basic and autoit are, what, 3 lines, if that, to
write a simple hello world program. in c it's 85 lines, half of which i
don't have a clue what they all mean, such as:
HINSTANCE hInstance,
HINSTANCE hPrevInstance,
LPSTR lpCmdLine,
int nShowCmd
that hardly makes sense at all to me. those aren't even the start headers. i
can make out little bits, like CMDLine is for command line parameters, etc,
but most of it is half another language altogether, whereas
#include
GUICreate("Hello World!")
GUISetState()
is a lot easier to understand. that's why i started with autoit. maybe i'm
just far too impatient *grin*
regards,
damien
- Original Message -
From: "Thomas Ward" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Gamers Discussion list"
Sent: Thursday, October 26, 2006 3:04 PM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
> Hi Liam,
> No change isn't always bad, and in this case I feel it was about to
> happen sooner or later. As I understand it from what I have heard from
> Microsoft on the subject was that many VB programmers in the field
> bombarded MS with requests to update the language and include more
> features present in more powerful languages such as C++ and Java. These
> days it is unreasonable to not have a good oop design present in a
> programming language. Especially, seeing as all the really popular
> languages like C++, Java, Python, etc have a good oop design and are
> more popular than non-oop languages.
> Strictly speaking from my personal opinion and experiences when I was a
> student in college they started us out on VB 5. Oh, I was happy as a
> clam to be able to write something constructive, Mr. Programmer, and
> all. However, as time went on I got in to more complex languages like
> C++ and Java, and with them came more complex advanced concepts, new
> design conventions, and so on. Once I learned, grasped, and understood
> the advantages of what C++ and Java had to offer VB 5 seamed like a
> joke, or a toy language for kids.
> I mean I was really impressed with a simple subject like class
> inheritence. How you could start out with a master class let's say
> starship, put all your major variables and functions in there, and then
> begin branching out, and create more and more specialised classes which
> inherit the more generalised classes. With the creation of one instance
> of an object you have access to not only the specialised class you have
> access to variables and functions to everything that specialised class
> was derived from. Even cooler you wrote the variables and functions
> once, but everytime you create an instance of an object which points to
> that class those variables are duplicated in memory for the specific use
> of that object without having to write them over again for that item,
> object, character, you are storing data for.
> I guess to sum it up I learned oop design, and I couldn't live without
> it. I found languages without oop design to be backward, outdated, and
> really the hard way of doing things.
> Liam Erven wrote:
> > Jim. It's much much different. There's many major differences than in
vb6.
> > I was surprised to find out you could program in vb6 like you would in
an
> > older form of basic, but the whole system is much much different now.
> > Change isn't always bad. I'm really enjoying this new version quite a
lot.
> >
>
>
> ___
> Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org
> To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can
visit
> http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make
> any subscription changes via the web.
>
>
>
___
Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org
To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit
http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make
any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
ok guys you win. i'm still using autoit for now, but i've given up comaudio. it broke on my system and philip bennefall's having problems with it. i can't get it to work at all on mine. i did actually try at one point with msvs.net and the ide was terrible - kept hanging on my system. so all i have now is msvs6. so yes, i'm currently trying to learn dx myself and am beginning to understand it. however there are still basic concepts i don't know how to code in vb, like how to make it wait, how to create arrays, how to use timers, position forms, if i can sort all that out i may just switch from autoit altogether, don't know yet. regards, damien - Original Message - From: "Liam Erven" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "'Gamers Discussion list'" Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2006 12:38 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic > Quintin: > > Autoit is an excelent language to get your feet web. However, if you are > serious about doing anything serious, your best bet is to learn a language > like c sharp or vb. I'm a very big vb fan, and I know me and Tom will > disagree. But, it's what works for me, and it's what I can teach people on > the best. Grnated, my dot net stuff is rusty, but I'm still learning, and > I've found all I need to know to get dx to work fairly well. However, Tom > is right in that there is not a lot out there for beginner programmers. I > really really do not like autoit though. There is much better out there. I > won't write a whole list of the things I don't like, just know that I > dislike it greatly. Hahaha. > > Liam > > -Original Message----- > From: Quinten Pendle [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2006 5:28 AM > To: 'Gamers Discussion list' > Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic > > Hi Thomas > Where can one find the agdev-newbies list to subscribe to it? > Also, what do you think of AutoIT as a programming language? > The little that I saw of it, looked quite good. > Best regards > Quinten Pendle > PENDLE PRO > Klerksdorp, South Africa > > Tel: +27 (0) 83 395 4593 > Email: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > MSN: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Skype: > ahakimbo > Website: > www.pendlepro.com > > > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > On Behalf Of Thomas Ward > Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2006 10:51 AM > To: Gamers Discussion list > Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic > > > Hi Robin, > In the future posts like this should probably go over to the agdev-newbies > list where we discuss such issues like this more in depth. > However, since I am writing this email anyway. I will answer as many > questions as I can, and I have a few questions of my own. > > /Snip > > I'd like to learn how to write programs and games in VB. > End Snip > > Is there any special reason you decided to go for Visual Basic rather than > say C#, called C-Sharp. > I highly recommend going with C-Sharp over VB for the primary reason many > things are better documented and supported. One of these important areas in > particular to you will be DirectX. While you can use MS DirectX in VB games > Microsoft does not officially support it, and do not > > provide code samples, instructions, etc on writing games in VB .NET 2005. > > Snip > > 1. Is it possible to write good games in VB? > End Snip > > Yes, but you will find that good and reliable documentation for newbies is > extremely lacking. Visual Basic became famous among amature and rapid > > application developers during the 90's but it's popularity is on the > decline. Most of the VB croud have switched to C-Sharp. > Just some historical background when DirectX 7 and 8 came out Microsoft > unvailed it with VB 6.0 examples etc and offered newbies a simple basic > language with a good set of multimedia libraries for developing games and > other amature home wrote applications. > In 2001 Microsoft converted all there Visual Studio languages to the .NET > Framework furthering increasing the power of the languages as well as a > universal development platform, and unvailed a new rapid development > language C#, called C-Sharp, which had many improvements over VB, used C++ > style coding conventions, reused allot of concepts from Java, and became a > very new and innovative language. Now, it is rising in popularity, and in > some areas has passed up VB in popularity among amature programmers. > In 2003 when Microsoft DirectX 9.0 was unvailed to the world the > documentation was for C++ and C-Sharp users, and VB devs were left in the > cold documentation and support wise. &
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
Hi, I can say from previous experience paperback programming books do not scan well, and do not make it in any sense through the scanning process. It is better to buy the programming books through a online vender like Safari rather than scan them. Jude DaShiell wrote: > If you can get a scanner and bought beginning programming language books > that aren't available, why not check for them on bookshare.org? If you > don't find them why not consider becoming a bookshare.org volunteer and > uploading those scanned books. They'll go through a proofreading process > and be made available eventually to the whole bookshare.org membership. > It's $50.00 for the first year's membership but if you scan books or do > other volunteer work, your next year's membership will be cut in cost by > the credits you've earned. > ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
If you can get a scanner and bought beginning programming language books that aren't available, why not check for them on bookshare.org? If you don't find them why not consider becoming a bookshare.org volunteer and uploading those scanned books. They'll go through a proofreading process and be made available eventually to the whole bookshare.org membership. It's $50.00 for the first year's membership but if you scan books or do other volunteer work, your next year's membership will be cut in cost by the credits you've earned. On Wed, 25 Oct 2006, Liam Erven wrote: > Quintin: > > Autoit is an excelent language to get your feet web. However, if you are > serious about doing anything serious, your best bet is to learn a language > like c sharp or vb. I'm a very big vb fan, and I know me and Tom will > disagree. But, it's what works for me, and it's what I can teach people on > the best. Grnated, my dot net stuff is rusty, but I'm still learning, and > I've found all I need to know to get dx to work fairly well. However, Tom > is right in that there is not a lot out there for beginner programmers. I > really really do not like autoit though. There is much better out there. I > won't write a whole list of the things I don't like, just know that I > dislike it greatly. Hahaha. > > Liam > > -Original Message- > From: Quinten Pendle [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2006 5:28 AM > To: 'Gamers Discussion list' > Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic > > Hi Thomas > Where can one find the agdev-newbies list to subscribe to it? > Also, what do you think of AutoIT as a programming language? > The little that I saw of it, looked quite good. > Best regards > Quinten Pendle > PENDLE PRO > Klerksdorp, South Africa > > Tel: +27 (0) 83 395 4593 > Email: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > MSN: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Skype: > ahakimbo > Website: > www.pendlepro.com > > > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > On Behalf Of Thomas Ward > Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2006 10:51 AM > To: Gamers Discussion list > Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic > > > Hi Robin, > In the future posts like this should probably go over to the agdev-newbies > list where we discuss such issues like this more in depth. > However, since I am writing this email anyway. I will answer as many > questions as I can, and I have a few questions of my own. > > /Snip >> I'd like to learn how to write programs and games in VB. > End Snip > > Is there any special reason you decided to go for Visual Basic rather than > say C#, called C-Sharp. > I highly recommend going with C-Sharp over VB for the primary reason many > things are better documented and supported. One of these important areas in > particular to you will be DirectX. While you can use MS DirectX in VB games > Microsoft does not officially support it, and do not > > provide code samples, instructions, etc on writing games in VB .NET 2005. > > Snip >> 1. Is it possible to write good games in VB? > End Snip > > Yes, but you will find that good and reliable documentation for newbies is > extremely lacking. Visual Basic became famous among amature and rapid > > application developers during the 90's but it's popularity is on the > decline. Most of the VB croud have switched to C-Sharp. > Just some historical background when DirectX 7 and 8 came out Microsoft > unvailed it with VB 6.0 examples etc and offered newbies a simple basic > language with a good set of multimedia libraries for developing games and > other amature home wrote applications. > In 2001 Microsoft converted all there Visual Studio languages to the .NET > Framework furthering increasing the power of the languages as well as a > universal development platform, and unvailed a new rapid development > language C#, called C-Sharp, which had many improvements over VB, used C++ > style coding conventions, reused allot of concepts from Java, and became a > very new and innovative language. Now, it is rising in popularity, and in > some areas has passed up VB in popularity among amature programmers. > In 2003 when Microsoft DirectX 9.0 was unvailed to the world the > documentation was for C++ and C-Sharp users, and VB devs were left in the > cold documentation and support wise. > Since I know both C-Sharp and VB as well as DirectX I know I could get > DirectX up and running in no time in VB, but for a newby I don't see that > happening without good samples and training. > > Snip >> 2. Where can I find the toolbox? > End Snip > > Press contr
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
Hi Ron, Assuming you have the proper training materials you should be able to pick up either C#, (C-Sharp,) or VB.NET rather quickly using the Express compilers from Microsoft. I highly recommend the beginner books like Learning VB.NET, Learning C#.NET, and the In a Nutshell series from O'reilly because they start you out from a absolutely newby and talk you through very simple basic programs, explaining everything, and work your way up to more complex things. Your first program might be a simple text program that displays Hello World or your name, and by chapter 13 or so you will be designing Windows forms and Windows based applications. In the chapters from 1 to 13 they don't consentrate on complex things but discuss each concept such what is a variable, what is a class, what is an object, how to use loops, if statements, perform math operations, and so on. The time it takes depends on how fast you grasp each chapter and concept, and how fast you go through the training materials. I'd say on average 6 months to a year before you can really right your first game like a space invaders shoot-m-up or so. For this effort I really should write a free, open source, shoot-m-up game in C#.NET or VB.NET and post it on USA Games where people could have something to look at. Ron Schamerhorn wrote: > Greetings > > I was just wondering if either express editions of C# or VB# would be okay > for a non-programmer such as myself. For playing around with and what sort > of learning curve, in time and such would I be looking at? > I'm actually quite interested in learning how to program. > > Ron > > > ___ > Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org > To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit > http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make > any subscription changes via the web. > > > ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
Hi, Yeah, Jaws 4 definately won't cut it. You should at least have Jaws 6 or 7 for Visual Studio 2005 or Window Eyes 5.0 or better. I hear Window Eyes 6 beta 1 has some improvements with 2005 so it is possible Jaws 8 beta does as well. Jim Kitchen wrote: > Hi Thomas, > > Yeah, not only don't I have the system requirements, but after I said that > maybe I should check out VB 2005 I remembered that I bet that the version of > JFW that I am running 4.02 probably will not work with anything newer than > VB6. > ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
Hi Thomas, Yeah, not only don't I have the system requirements, but after I said that maybe I should check out VB 2005 I remembered that I bet that the version of JFW that I am running 4.02 probably will not work with anything newer than VB6. - Original Message - Hi Jim, Yeah, if you have the system requirements I think that is a good idea. Just a note to everyone VB.NET 2005 requires Windos XP SP2 to run. If you are on Bookshare I believe they may have one or two books on VB.NET programming. Also safari.oreilly.com is another good place to scope out books on the topic. What you will want is a book that has one of those chapters that covers the differences from VB 6 and VB.NET. Jim Do you know how to make an egg roll? You push it! [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.kitchensinc.net (440) 286-6920 Chardon Ohio USA ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
Hi Thomas, Thanks for telling me about the changes from VB6 to VB 2005 etc. - Original Message - Hi Jim, Yes, I am completely certain of it. As I mentioned in previous posts many many things changed when Microsoft released VB 7 which was VB.NET 2002. VB.NET 2003 and VB.NET 2005 improved upon the 2002 version with 2005 being apart of the .NET Framework 2.0 current framework. There are some features of the language that remain the same. For example an if statement is written exactly the way you always wrote one. while loops, for loops, subs, functions, etc are basicly the same as VB 6.0. However, one of the major changes is classes. in VB 6 classes were optional, and were pretty primative compared to C++, Java, and other languages out there. In VB.NET classes are not optional they are a core part of the language. Everything, I mean everything, is contained in classes, and from those you create your object data types. In the old days, VB 6 and company, most folks put there global variables, major subs, etc in modules. In VB.NET you put them in, guess what, classes. Then you create an object to access those functions, variables, etc from your main class. Since VB.NET is all about classes the classes are pretty comperable to modern oop design standards with inheritence, multiple inheritence, over loading, and so on. You can even have partial classes which is a split class where your global variables are contained in the design class and the functions and subs are contained in the class itself. The .NET Framework which is the core behind all the .NET languages including VB.NET 2005 are a series of *.dll files with hundreds of base classes for performing a huge number of tasks such as: creating Buttons, Timers, selecting random numbers, saving and restoring the state of an object, creating Windows forms, performing various math calculations, accessing the Windows registry, and millions of other things. Needless to say the libraries are huge, and there should be a class for just about any ttask you desire. Then, we could go in to the entire topic of managed code verses unmanaged code. Again a topic to large to mention in one email here. However, decisive to say VB.NET is way different from any versions before it. P.S. There is no VB 2004. Smile. Jim Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps; for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.kitchensinc.net (440) 286-6920 Chardon Ohio USA ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
not sure but I plan to download the entire visual studio express on my system at some point. At 05:09 AM 10/27/2006, Ron Schamerhorn wrote: >Greetings > > I was just wondering if either express editions of C# or VB# would be okay >for a non-programmer such as myself. For playing around with and what sort >of learning curve, in time and such would I be looking at? > I'm actually quite interested in learning how to program. > >Ron > > >___ >Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org >To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit >http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make >any subscription changes via the web. ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
Greetings I was just wondering if either express editions of C# or VB# would be okay for a non-programmer such as myself. For playing around with and what sort of learning curve, in time and such would I be looking at? I'm actually quite interested in learning how to program. Ron ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
Hi Jim, Yes, I am completely certain of it. As I mentioned in previous posts many many things changed when Microsoft released VB 7 which was VB.NET 2002. VB.NET 2003 and VB.NET 2005 improved upon the 2002 version with 2005 being apart of the .NET Framework 2.0 current framework. There are some features of the language that remain the same. For example an if statement is written exactly the way you always wrote one. while loops, for loops, subs, functions, etc are basicly the same as VB 6.0. However, one of the major changes is classes. in VB 6 classes were optional, and were pretty primative compared to C++, Java, and other languages out there. In VB.NET classes are not optional they are a core part of the language. Everything, I mean everything, is contained in classes, and from those you create your object data types. In the old days, VB 6 and company, most folks put there global variables, major subs, etc in modules. In VB.NET you put them in, guess what, classes. Then you create an object to access those functions, variables, etc from your main class. Since VB.NET is all about classes the classes are pretty comperable to modern oop design standards with inheritence, multiple inheritence, over loading, and so on. You can even have partial classes which is a split class where your global variables are contained in the design class and the functions and subs are contained in the class itself. The .NET Framework which is the core behind all the .NET languages including VB.NET 2005 are a series of *.dll files with hundreds of base classes for performing a huge number of tasks such as: creating Buttons, Timers, selecting random numbers, saving and restoring the state of an object, creating Windows forms, performing various math calculations, accessing the Windows registry, and millions of other things. Needless to say the libraries are huge, and there should be a class for just about any ttask you desire. Then, we could go in to the entire topic of managed code verses unmanaged code. Again a topic to large to mention in one email here. However, decisive to say VB.NET is way different from any versions before it. P.S. There is no VB 2004. Smile. ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
Hi Liam, No change isn't always bad, and in this case I feel it was about to happen sooner or later. As I understand it from what I have heard from Microsoft on the subject was that many VB programmers in the field bombarded MS with requests to update the language and include more features present in more powerful languages such as C++ and Java. These days it is unreasonable to not have a good oop design present in a programming language. Especially, seeing as all the really popular languages like C++, Java, Python, etc have a good oop design and are more popular than non-oop languages. Strictly speaking from my personal opinion and experiences when I was a student in college they started us out on VB 5. Oh, I was happy as a clam to be able to write something constructive, Mr. Programmer, and all. However, as time went on I got in to more complex languages like C++ and Java, and with them came more complex advanced concepts, new design conventions, and so on. Once I learned, grasped, and understood the advantages of what C++ and Java had to offer VB 5 seamed like a joke, or a toy language for kids. I mean I was really impressed with a simple subject like class inheritence. How you could start out with a master class let's say starship, put all your major variables and functions in there, and then begin branching out, and create more and more specialised classes which inherit the more generalised classes. With the creation of one instance of an object you have access to not only the specialised class you have access to variables and functions to everything that specialised class was derived from. Even cooler you wrote the variables and functions once, but everytime you create an instance of an object which points to that class those variables are duplicated in memory for the specific use of that object without having to write them over again for that item, object, character, you are storing data for. I guess to sum it up I learned oop design, and I couldn't live without it. I found languages without oop design to be backward, outdated, and really the hard way of doing things. Liam Erven wrote: > Jim. It's much much different. There's many major differences than in vb6. > I was surprised to find out you could program in vb6 like you would in an > older form of basic, but the whole system is much much different now. > Change isn't always bad. I'm really enjoying this new version quite a lot. > ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
Hi Jim, Yeah, if you have the system requirements I think that is a good idea. Just a note to everyone VB.NET 2005 requires Windos XP SP2 to run. If you are on Bookshare I believe they may have one or two books on VB.NET programming. Also safari.oreilly.com is another good place to scope out books on the topic. What you will want is a book that has one of those chapters that covers the differences from VB 6 and VB.NET. Jim Kitchen wrote: > Hi Liam, > > Thanks. Maybe I should try down loading Visual Basic 2005 Express and take a > look at it. > ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
Hi Liam, I hear you there. I also have the problem with the error Window as well. It is not just related to VB.NET but all the IDEs have that particular problem with screen readers.I find it down right frustrating to say the least! The visual IDES have always done error checking, but in 2005 the debugger seams to be fanatical about its error checking. It pops a Window up for just about any miner infraction or miner mistake. If the screen reader could scream it would be screaming at me. The best solution I have found is to write my code out side of the VB.NET CS.NET IDE in a text editor of my choice, debug, and compile, in the IDE. Liam Erven wrote: > The issue I have is the error windows that pop up and get in the way. I > can't make them stop, but I end up working around them. > ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
Hi Liam, Thanks. Maybe I should try down loading Visual Basic 2005 Express and take a look at it. - Original Message - Jim. It's much much different. There's many major differences than in vb6. I was surprised to find out you could program in vb6 like you would in an older form of basic, but the whole system is much much different now. Change isn't always bad. I'm really enjoying this new version quite a lot. Jim "Getting old is when a narrow waist and a broad mind change places!" [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.kitchensinc.net (440) 286-6920 Chardon Ohio USA ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
Jim. It's much much different. There's many major differences than in vb6. I was surprised to find out you could program in vb6 like you would in an older form of basic, but the whole system is much much different now. Change isn't always bad. I'm really enjoying this new version quite a lot. -Original Message- From: Jim Kitchen [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, October 26, 2006 5:20 AM To: Thomas Ward Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic Hi Thomas, Are you sure that one can not program in Visual Basic 2003, 2004, 2005 etc the same way as one does in Visual Basic 6? I mean I have always been told that one can not program in Visual Basic 6 as one did in GW Basic, Quick Basic etc, but it sure works for me. BFN Jim I tried snorting Coke once but the ice cubes got stuck in my nose. [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.kitchensinc.net (440) 286-6920 Chardon Ohio USA ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web. __ NOD32 1.1659 (20060713) Information __ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
Hi Thomas, Are you sure that one can not program in Visual Basic 2003, 2004, 2005 etc the same way as one does in Visual Basic 6? I mean I have always been told that one can not program in Visual Basic 6 as one did in GW Basic, Quick Basic etc, but it sure works for me. BFN Jim I tried snorting Coke once but the ice cubes got stuck in my nose. [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.kitchensinc.net (440) 286-6920 Chardon Ohio USA ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
I have used pascal and java script. I was origionally planning on using vb but I may just learn c#. This doesn't mean ofcause that I won't get all the bits and pieces. At 02:13 PM 10/26/2006, Ken the Crazy wrote: >me too--but I can't even begin to understand vb2005--maybe it's just that I >am using express? All I know is there are too many things on screen at >once, and it couldn't upgrade the wrecking ball from vb6 for me--so unless I >can learn vb.net I'm sticking with vb6. >Ken Downey >President >DreamTechInteractive! > >And, >Coming soon, >Blind Comfort! >The pleasant way to get a massage--no staring, just caring. > >- Original Message - >From: "Jim Kitchen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: "Liam Erven" >Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2006 9:20 AM >Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic > > >> Hi Liam, >> >> I'm with you. Visual Basic, DirectX and the sapi5 TTS is what works for >> me as well. >> >> BFN >> >> Jim >> >> I am using BASIC, because I don't want to be C-sick. >> >> [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> http://www.kitchensinc.net >> (440) 286-6920 >> Chardon Ohio USA >> ___ >> Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org >> To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can >> visit >> http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make >> any subscription changes via the web. >> >> >> -- >> No virus found in this incoming message. >> Checked by AVG Free Edition. >> Version: 7.1.408 / Virus Database: 268.13.11/496 - Release Date: >> 10/24/2006 >> >> > > >___ >Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org >To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit >http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make >any subscription changes via the web. ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
I just sat down and pounded out a quick guess the number game in vb dot net. It's very easy to use when you break it down and figgure out each window. I am not planning on upgrading any of my games to dot net though. -Original Message- From: Ken the Crazy [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2006 8:14 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic me too--but I can't even begin to understand vb2005--maybe it's just that I am using express? All I know is there are too many things on screen at once, and it couldn't upgrade the wrecking ball from vb6 for me--so unless I can learn vb.net I'm sticking with vb6. Ken Downey President DreamTechInteractive! And, Coming soon, Blind Comfort! The pleasant way to get a massage--no staring, just caring. - Original Message - From: "Jim Kitchen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Liam Erven" Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2006 9:20 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic > Hi Liam, > > I'm with you. Visual Basic, DirectX and the sapi5 TTS is what works for > me as well. > > BFN > > Jim > > I am using BASIC, because I don't want to be C-sick. > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://www.kitchensinc.net > (440) 286-6920 > Chardon Ohio USA > ___ > Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org > To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can > visit > http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make > any subscription changes via the web. > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.1.408 / Virus Database: 268.13.11/496 - Release Date: > 10/24/2006 > > ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web. __ NOD32 1.1659 (20060713) Information __ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
The issue I have is the error windows that pop up and get in the way. I can't make them stop, but I end up working around them. -Original Message- From: Thomas Ward [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2006 9:02 PM To: Ken the Crazy; Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic Ken, There are allot of technical reasons why VB.NET 2005 could not upgrade the Wrecking Ball from VB 6 to VB.NET 2005. Most of them is the languages are as completely different as daylight and dark. VB 6 wasn't very oop design oriented VB..NET 2005 is totally oop design oriented. VB 6 depended on it's own runtime libraries and the Win32 API, and VB.NET relies upon the .NET Framework. This is a massive incompatibility between the two languages. As for VB 2005 Express it is a good IDE. It is very similar to the Pro and Enterprise versions of Visual Studio 2005 except some features were wripped out. However, VB 2005 is a totally new IDE from VB 6. You'll have to learn the layout and hot keys for the new IDE to use it effectively. For example, to get to the VB toolbox once you are on your form do a control+w then the letter x to bring up the toolbox. As I mentioned earlier today in a prier post the toolbox itself has majorly changed and you will have to take some time familiarising yourself with the multicolumned toolbox. Another important hot key is use control+w followed by s to bring up the solution explorer. This will put you in a tree view where you can browse the files, resources, forms, etc in your project. To read the out put of your previous build or a list of errors do control+w followed by e and it will take you to the error output Window where you can use the up and down arrow keys to review it. I think a large part of your issues with VB 2005 Express is not knowing the hot keys to jump around the various child Windows to get where you need to go. Also I know that Window Eyes seams to do a better job of keeping track of these Windows than the shark, AKA Jaws. However, you are absolutely correct VB.NET 2005 does have an extremely large amount of info on the screen at once, and for someone sighted it is not a problem as they can just look at the area they are interested in. For us screen reader users it is a matter of knowing how to get the screen reader to jump to that child Window and stay there without wandering off in to another area we are not interested in. Fortunately, most screen readers like Window Eyes can shrink the mouse view down the the focused area rather than viewing the entire screen. Ken the Crazy wrote: > me too--but I can't even begin to understand vb2005--maybe it's just > that I am using express? All I know is there are too many things on > screen at once, and it couldn't upgrade the wrecking ball from vb6 for > me--so unless I can learn vb.net I'm sticking with vb6. > Ken Downey > President > DreamTechInteractive! > > And, > Coming soon, > Blind Comfort! > The pleasant way to get a massage--no staring, just caring. > ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web. __ NOD32 1.1659 (20060713) Information __ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
Ken, There are allot of technical reasons why VB.NET 2005 could not upgrade the Wrecking Ball from VB 6 to VB.NET 2005. Most of them is the languages are as completely different as daylight and dark. VB 6 wasn't very oop design oriented VB..NET 2005 is totally oop design oriented. VB 6 depended on it's own runtime libraries and the Win32 API, and VB.NET relies upon the .NET Framework. This is a massive incompatibility between the two languages. As for VB 2005 Express it is a good IDE. It is very similar to the Pro and Enterprise versions of Visual Studio 2005 except some features were wripped out. However, VB 2005 is a totally new IDE from VB 6. You'll have to learn the layout and hot keys for the new IDE to use it effectively. For example, to get to the VB toolbox once you are on your form do a control+w then the letter x to bring up the toolbox. As I mentioned earlier today in a prier post the toolbox itself has majorly changed and you will have to take some time familiarising yourself with the multicolumned toolbox. Another important hot key is use control+w followed by s to bring up the solution explorer. This will put you in a tree view where you can browse the files, resources, forms, etc in your project. To read the out put of your previous build or a list of errors do control+w followed by e and it will take you to the error output Window where you can use the up and down arrow keys to review it. I think a large part of your issues with VB 2005 Express is not knowing the hot keys to jump around the various child Windows to get where you need to go. Also I know that Window Eyes seams to do a better job of keeping track of these Windows than the shark, AKA Jaws. However, you are absolutely correct VB.NET 2005 does have an extremely large amount of info on the screen at once, and for someone sighted it is not a problem as they can just look at the area they are interested in. For us screen reader users it is a matter of knowing how to get the screen reader to jump to that child Window and stay there without wandering off in to another area we are not interested in. Fortunately, most screen readers like Window Eyes can shrink the mouse view down the the focused area rather than viewing the entire screen. Ken the Crazy wrote: > me too--but I can't even begin to understand vb2005--maybe it's just that I > am using express? All I know is there are too many things on screen at > once, and it couldn't upgrade the wrecking ball from vb6 for me--so unless I > can learn vb.net I'm sticking with vb6. > Ken Downey > President > DreamTechInteractive! > > And, > Coming soon, > Blind Comfort! > The pleasant way to get a massage--no staring, just caring. > ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
me too--but I can't even begin to understand vb2005--maybe it's just that I am using express? All I know is there are too many things on screen at once, and it couldn't upgrade the wrecking ball from vb6 for me--so unless I can learn vb.net I'm sticking with vb6. Ken Downey President DreamTechInteractive! And, Coming soon, Blind Comfort! The pleasant way to get a massage--no staring, just caring. - Original Message - From: "Jim Kitchen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Liam Erven" Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2006 9:20 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic > Hi Liam, > > I'm with you. Visual Basic, DirectX and the sapi5 TTS is what works for > me as well. > > BFN > > Jim > > I am using BASIC, because I don't want to be C-sick. > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://www.kitchensinc.net > (440) 286-6920 > Chardon Ohio USA > ___ > Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org > To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can > visit > http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make > any subscription changes via the web. > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.1.408 / Virus Database: 268.13.11/496 - Release Date: > 10/24/2006 > > ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
Hi Jim and all, For purposes of this discussion for the newbies I think we should make a destinction between VB, meaning VB 6 and before, and VB.NET meaning 2002, 2003, and 2005. The primary reason for this destinction is that VB 6 and earlier were not primarily concerned with object oriented design concepts although it did have some. In VB.NET 2002 and later Microsoft adopted a Java-style object oriented design for VB.NET, C-Sharp, C++.NET, and that through old VB programmers for a loop. Suddenly, they had to relearn how to program using an Java-style object oriented design rather than the way they had been doing things. For those of us who had worked with Java the idea everything was based on an oop design was no big deal. The concepts were simple, and got on with learning on how it was to be written. Another point to make a destinction is in VB 6 we often imported Win32 dll files in our projects, and in VB.NET we depend heavily on the .NET Framework and not the Win32 API directly. In short Microsoft made several drastic changes between VB 6 and VB.NET 2002 and later which in many ways almost made VB.NET a completely different language except for the common language coding conventions, etc. Jim Kitchen wrote: > Hi Liam, > > I'm with you. Visual Basic, DirectX and the sapi5 TTS is what works for me > as well. > > BFN > ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
Hi Christian, Like I was saying in the last post VB.NET seams to be less documented in some areas than C-Sharp. Fortunately, the .NET languages are so similar that what you learn in C-Sharp will apply to VB.NET and VB.NET concepts will apply to C-Sharp. The difference is of course the structure of the programs, sintacs, etc... The key reason to the .NET frameworks success is that all of the .NET supported languages use the same set of libraries, namespaces, classes, etc for performing programming tasks. For example, in C style languages like C-Sharp they use allot of punctuation symbols like braces, brackets, and so on. Where in VB style languages they use less punctuation say it out right like End If, End Sub, End Function, End While, and so on where a brace would end that same block of code in C-Sharp. I'm not certain as to why this is, but I know many in the agdev comunity seam to feel comfortable with VB for the simple reason everything is more-or-less plane english like End If to end an If statement, End Function to mark the end of a Function block, and so on. However, I have been programming for about 10years, and most programming languages such as Java, Perl, C-Sharp, C, C++, etc are unlike VB and use braces, brackets, and so on to mark the start and end of a block, and I have never had a problem in figuring out where a block of code start and stops. Christian wrote: > Hi Thomas and all, > I would also be very interested in this since I am currently learning Visual > Basic 2005 just for accessible games. If i don't find much of that > documentaiton i might switch language before i have completed this one. > Many thanks, > Christian > ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
Hi Liam, I am figuring your decision to use VB is because you began with VB 6 which makes perfect sense to update your skills to VB.NET since some of the "newby" stuff was already learned, and you can focus on more technical topics that relate specificly to VB.NET. In theory if you used VB 6 and DirectX 8 you can convert that to VB.NET and DirectX 9 provided you figure out the changes and pitfalls along the way. Problem is when talking about newbies and VB.NET and directX 9 Microsoft has aabandoned VB users in promoting C-Sharp. That's my main reason for not promoting VB.NET. I have nothing personal against the language, but unless you have prier experience with VB languages and DirectX learning and picking up is the hard way of going. Although, I know Che Martain did it with VB.NET 2003 with allot of help from Justin, and he at one time confessed to me that he would have rather gone with C-Sharp if he had it all to do again. An important point i'd like to flush out is once you learn one of the .NET supported languages the real key is understanding the framework. Once you are familiar with the framework learning in working in the other languages is much easier. There is a very good book on Safari that teaches you everything you want to know about .NET forms and the Framework, but guess what? It is written for C-Sharp users. Grin. Liam wrote: > Quintin: > > Autoit is an excelent language to get your feet web. However, if you are > serious about doing anything serious, your best bet is to learn a language > like c sharp or vb. I'm a very big vb fan, and I know me and Tom will > disagree. But, it's what works for me, and it's what I can teach people on > the best. Grnated, my dot net stuff is rusty, but I'm still learning, and > I've found all I need to know to get dx to work fairly well. However, Tom > is right in that there is not a lot out there for beginner programmers. I > really really do not like autoit though. There is much better out there. I > won't write a whole list of the things I don't like, just know that I > dislike it greatly. Hahaha. > > Liam > ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
Hi, You can find the agdev-newbies list home page at http://lists.agdev.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/agdev-newbies where you can setup your account info for the list, view archives, and so on. As for AutoIt it's not technically a programming language but a tool kit. Personally, I am not very fond of it. If you are serious about real programming high-quality games you need a fully qualified programming language like C++, C-Sharp, or even VB with Microsoft DirectX used for your music, sounds, input, and optionally graphics. I don't know how far you wish to go with this, but if you want to write games of the quality of Tank Commander, Shades of Doom, or any other games like it or better than go with a real programming language. Quinten Pendle wrote: > Hi Thomas > Where can one find the agdev-newbies list to subscribe to it? > Also, what do you think of AutoIT as a programming language? > The little that I saw of it, looked quite good. > Best regards > Quinten Pendle > PENDLE PRO > Klerksdorp, South Africa > > Tel: +27 (0) 83 395 4593 > Email: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > MSN: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Skype: > ahakimbo > Website: > www.pendlepro.com > ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
Hi Liam, I'm with you. Visual Basic, DirectX and the sapi5 TTS is what works for me as well. BFN Jim I am using BASIC, because I don't want to be C-sick. [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.kitchensinc.net (440) 286-6920 Chardon Ohio USA ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
Hi Thomas and all, I would also be very interested in this since I am currently learning Visual Basic 2005 just for accessible games. If i don't find much of that documentaiton i might switch language before i have completed this one. Many thanks, Christian On 2006-10-25 at 12:28 Quinten Pendle wrote: >Hi Thomas >Where can one find the agdev-newbies list to subscribe to it? >Also, what do you think of AutoIT as a programming language? >The little that I saw of it, looked quite good. >Best regards >Quinten Pendle >PENDLE PRO >Klerksdorp, South Africa > >Tel: +27 (0) 83 395 4593 >Email: >[EMAIL PROTECTED] >MSN: >[EMAIL PROTECTED] >Skype: >ahakimbo >Website: >www.pendlepro.com > > >-Original Message- >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] >On Behalf Of Thomas Ward >Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2006 10:51 AM >To: Gamers Discussion list >Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic > > >Hi Robin, >In the future posts like this should probably go over to the >agdev-newbies list where we discuss such issues like this more in depth. >However, since I am writing this email anyway. I will answer as many >questions as I can, and I have a few questions of my own. > >/Snip >> I'd like to learn how to write programs and games in VB. >End Snip > >Is there any special reason you decided to go for Visual Basic rather >than say C#, called C-Sharp. >I highly recommend going with C-Sharp over VB for the primary reason >many things are better documented and supported. One of these important >areas in particular to you will be DirectX. While you can use MS >DirectX in VB games Microsoft does not officially support it, and do not > >provide code samples, instructions, etc on writing games in VB .NET >2005. > >Snip >> 1. Is it possible to write good games in VB? >End Snip > >Yes, but you will find that good and reliable documentation for newbies >is extremely lacking. Visual Basic became famous among amature and rapid > >application developers during the 90's but it's popularity is on the >decline. Most of the VB croud have switched to C-Sharp. >Just some historical background when DirectX 7 and 8 came out Microsoft >unvailed it with VB 6.0 examples etc and offered newbies a simple basic >language with a good set of multimedia libraries for developing games >and other amature home wrote applications. >In 2001 Microsoft converted all there Visual Studio languages to the >.NET Framework furthering increasing the power of the languages as well >as a universal development platform, and unvailed a new rapid >development language C#, called C-Sharp, which had many improvements >over VB, used C++ style coding conventions, reused allot of concepts >from Java, and became a very new and innovative language. Now, it is >rising in popularity, and in some areas has passed up VB in popularity >among amature programmers. >In 2003 when Microsoft DirectX 9.0 was unvailed to the world the >documentation was for C++ and C-Sharp users, and VB devs were left in >the cold documentation and support wise. >Since I know both C-Sharp and VB as well as DirectX I know I could get >DirectX up and running in no time in VB, but for a newby I don't see >that happening without good samples and training. > >Snip >> 2. Where can I find the toolbox? >End Snip > >Press control+w then press the letter x. Your screen reader should land >you on the toolbox area of the screen. Keep in mind there is two columns > >in the toolbox window. There is one side which sets the type of tools >you wish to view, and the other side is the actual tools themselves. For > >your first experience with this I would say arrow up to have it show all > >tools, and then you can tab in to the tools and view the entire list. >Obviously, later on you may want to customise your view as there are >only certain types of tools you need for certain projects. > >Snip >> 3. Is it a good idea to create a webbrowser at first? >End Snip > >No. Any seasoned developer will tell you that you need to start out >extremely basic. For example my very very first program I wrote as a >student was a text program which did nothing more than display my name >on the screen. Some use hello world, your name, or whatever but the idea > >is to get you use to structures of programming, understanding functions, > >variables, data types, etc. Unless you know the basic termonology and >use for things in a program you can not begin to write one. >So first advice keep it simple stupid. Your first batch of programs are >going to be lame, boring, throw away, projects, but worth the practice. > >Snip >&
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
Quintin: Autoit is an excelent language to get your feet web. However, if you are serious about doing anything serious, your best bet is to learn a language like c sharp or vb. I'm a very big vb fan, and I know me and Tom will disagree. But, it's what works for me, and it's what I can teach people on the best. Grnated, my dot net stuff is rusty, but I'm still learning, and I've found all I need to know to get dx to work fairly well. However, Tom is right in that there is not a lot out there for beginner programmers. I really really do not like autoit though. There is much better out there. I won't write a whole list of the things I don't like, just know that I dislike it greatly. Hahaha. Liam -Original Message- From: Quinten Pendle [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2006 5:28 AM To: 'Gamers Discussion list' Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic Hi Thomas Where can one find the agdev-newbies list to subscribe to it? Also, what do you think of AutoIT as a programming language? The little that I saw of it, looked quite good. Best regards Quinten Pendle PENDLE PRO Klerksdorp, South Africa Tel: +27 (0) 83 395 4593 Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Skype: ahakimbo Website: www.pendlepro.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Thomas Ward Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2006 10:51 AM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic Hi Robin, In the future posts like this should probably go over to the agdev-newbies list where we discuss such issues like this more in depth. However, since I am writing this email anyway. I will answer as many questions as I can, and I have a few questions of my own. /Snip > I'd like to learn how to write programs and games in VB. End Snip Is there any special reason you decided to go for Visual Basic rather than say C#, called C-Sharp. I highly recommend going with C-Sharp over VB for the primary reason many things are better documented and supported. One of these important areas in particular to you will be DirectX. While you can use MS DirectX in VB games Microsoft does not officially support it, and do not provide code samples, instructions, etc on writing games in VB .NET 2005. Snip > 1. Is it possible to write good games in VB? End Snip Yes, but you will find that good and reliable documentation for newbies is extremely lacking. Visual Basic became famous among amature and rapid application developers during the 90's but it's popularity is on the decline. Most of the VB croud have switched to C-Sharp. Just some historical background when DirectX 7 and 8 came out Microsoft unvailed it with VB 6.0 examples etc and offered newbies a simple basic language with a good set of multimedia libraries for developing games and other amature home wrote applications. In 2001 Microsoft converted all there Visual Studio languages to the .NET Framework furthering increasing the power of the languages as well as a universal development platform, and unvailed a new rapid development language C#, called C-Sharp, which had many improvements over VB, used C++ style coding conventions, reused allot of concepts from Java, and became a very new and innovative language. Now, it is rising in popularity, and in some areas has passed up VB in popularity among amature programmers. In 2003 when Microsoft DirectX 9.0 was unvailed to the world the documentation was for C++ and C-Sharp users, and VB devs were left in the cold documentation and support wise. Since I know both C-Sharp and VB as well as DirectX I know I could get DirectX up and running in no time in VB, but for a newby I don't see that happening without good samples and training. Snip > 2. Where can I find the toolbox? End Snip Press control+w then press the letter x. Your screen reader should land you on the toolbox area of the screen. Keep in mind there is two columns in the toolbox window. There is one side which sets the type of tools you wish to view, and the other side is the actual tools themselves. For your first experience with this I would say arrow up to have it show all tools, and then you can tab in to the tools and view the entire list. Obviously, later on you may want to customise your view as there are only certain types of tools you need for certain projects. Snip > 3. Is it a good idea to create a webbrowser at first? End Snip No. Any seasoned developer will tell you that you need to start out extremely basic. For example my very very first program I wrote as a student was a text program which did nothing more than display my name on the screen. Some use hello world, your name, or whatever but the idea is to get you use to structures of programming, understanding functions, variables, data types, etc. Unless you know the basic termonology and use for things in a program you can not b
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
Hi Thomas Where can one find the agdev-newbies list to subscribe to it? Also, what do you think of AutoIT as a programming language? The little that I saw of it, looked quite good. Best regards Quinten Pendle PENDLE PRO Klerksdorp, South Africa Tel: +27 (0) 83 395 4593 Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Skype: ahakimbo Website: www.pendlepro.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Thomas Ward Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2006 10:51 AM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic Hi Robin, In the future posts like this should probably go over to the agdev-newbies list where we discuss such issues like this more in depth. However, since I am writing this email anyway. I will answer as many questions as I can, and I have a few questions of my own. /Snip > I'd like to learn how to write programs and games in VB. End Snip Is there any special reason you decided to go for Visual Basic rather than say C#, called C-Sharp. I highly recommend going with C-Sharp over VB for the primary reason many things are better documented and supported. One of these important areas in particular to you will be DirectX. While you can use MS DirectX in VB games Microsoft does not officially support it, and do not provide code samples, instructions, etc on writing games in VB .NET 2005. Snip > 1. Is it possible to write good games in VB? End Snip Yes, but you will find that good and reliable documentation for newbies is extremely lacking. Visual Basic became famous among amature and rapid application developers during the 90's but it's popularity is on the decline. Most of the VB croud have switched to C-Sharp. Just some historical background when DirectX 7 and 8 came out Microsoft unvailed it with VB 6.0 examples etc and offered newbies a simple basic language with a good set of multimedia libraries for developing games and other amature home wrote applications. In 2001 Microsoft converted all there Visual Studio languages to the .NET Framework furthering increasing the power of the languages as well as a universal development platform, and unvailed a new rapid development language C#, called C-Sharp, which had many improvements over VB, used C++ style coding conventions, reused allot of concepts from Java, and became a very new and innovative language. Now, it is rising in popularity, and in some areas has passed up VB in popularity among amature programmers. In 2003 when Microsoft DirectX 9.0 was unvailed to the world the documentation was for C++ and C-Sharp users, and VB devs were left in the cold documentation and support wise. Since I know both C-Sharp and VB as well as DirectX I know I could get DirectX up and running in no time in VB, but for a newby I don't see that happening without good samples and training. Snip > 2. Where can I find the toolbox? End Snip Press control+w then press the letter x. Your screen reader should land you on the toolbox area of the screen. Keep in mind there is two columns in the toolbox window. There is one side which sets the type of tools you wish to view, and the other side is the actual tools themselves. For your first experience with this I would say arrow up to have it show all tools, and then you can tab in to the tools and view the entire list. Obviously, later on you may want to customise your view as there are only certain types of tools you need for certain projects. Snip > 3. Is it a good idea to create a webbrowser at first? End Snip No. Any seasoned developer will tell you that you need to start out extremely basic. For example my very very first program I wrote as a student was a text program which did nothing more than display my name on the screen. Some use hello world, your name, or whatever but the idea is to get you use to structures of programming, understanding functions, variables, data types, etc. Unless you know the basic termonology and use for things in a program you can not begin to write one. So first advice keep it simple stupid. Your first batch of programs are going to be lame, boring, throw away, projects, but worth the practice. Snip > 3. Where can I find a good VB tutorial that explains all or at least > most of all the features and how to use them? End Snip Well, I am very fond of recommending http://safari.oreilly.com which has books on just about any programming topic you can research for $20.00 US monthly. if you are going to do VB I suggest reading something like VB .NET In a Nutshell by O'reilly and Associates. Snip > 4. Is there someone here who can program in VB and who could give me > some lessons? Thanks for End Snip I know enough of VB .NET to get you started in designing games, but unfortunately I have a rather tight schedule aready and can't take on a student at this point in my life other than ocational
Re: [Audyssey] Learning VisualBasic
Hi Robin, In the future posts like this should probably go over to the agdev-newbies list where we discuss such issues like this more in depth. However, since I am writing this email anyway. I will answer as many questions as I can, and I have a few questions of my own. /Snip > I'd like to learn how to write programs and games in VB. End Snip Is there any special reason you decided to go for Visual Basic rather than say C#, called C-Sharp. I highly recommend going with C-Sharp over VB for the primary reason many things are better documented and supported. One of these important areas in particular to you will be DirectX. While you can use MS DirectX in VB games Microsoft does not officially support it, and do not provide code samples, instructions, etc on writing games in VB .NET 2005. Snip > 1. Is it possible to write good games in VB? End Snip Yes, but you will find that good and reliable documentation for newbies is extremely lacking. Visual Basic became famous among amature and rapid application developers during the 90's but it's popularity is on the decline. Most of the VB croud have switched to C-Sharp. Just some historical background when DirectX 7 and 8 came out Microsoft unvailed it with VB 6.0 examples etc and offered newbies a simple basic language with a good set of multimedia libraries for developing games and other amature home wrote applications. In 2001 Microsoft converted all there Visual Studio languages to the .NET Framework furthering increasing the power of the languages as well as a universal development platform, and unvailed a new rapid development language C#, called C-Sharp, which had many improvements over VB, used C++ style coding conventions, reused allot of concepts from Java, and became a very new and innovative language. Now, it is rising in popularity, and in some areas has passed up VB in popularity among amature programmers. In 2003 when Microsoft DirectX 9.0 was unvailed to the world the documentation was for C++ and C-Sharp users, and VB devs were left in the cold documentation and support wise. Since I know both C-Sharp and VB as well as DirectX I know I could get DirectX up and running in no time in VB, but for a newby I don't see that happening without good samples and training. Snip > 2. Where can I find the toolbox? End Snip Press control+w then press the letter x. Your screen reader should land you on the toolbox area of the screen. Keep in mind there is two columns in the toolbox window. There is one side which sets the type of tools you wish to view, and the other side is the actual tools themselves. For your first experience with this I would say arrow up to have it show all tools, and then you can tab in to the tools and view the entire list. Obviously, later on you may want to customise your view as there are only certain types of tools you need for certain projects. Snip > 3. Is it a good idea to create a webbrowser at first? End Snip No. Any seasoned developer will tell you that you need to start out extremely basic. For example my very very first program I wrote as a student was a text program which did nothing more than display my name on the screen. Some use hello world, your name, or whatever but the idea is to get you use to structures of programming, understanding functions, variables, data types, etc. Unless you know the basic termonology and use for things in a program you can not begin to write one. So first advice keep it simple stupid. Your first batch of programs are going to be lame, boring, throw away, projects, but worth the practice. Snip > 3. Where can I find a good VB tutorial that explains all or at least most of > all the features and how to use them? End Snip Well, I am very fond of recommending http://safari.oreilly.com which has books on just about any programming topic you can research for $20.00 US monthly. if you are going to do VB I suggest reading something like VB .NET In a Nutshell by O'reilly and Associates. Snip > 4. Is there someone here who can program in VB and who could give me some > lessons? Thanks for End Snip I know enough of VB .NET to get you started in designing games, but unfortunately I have a rather tight schedule aready and can't take on a student at this point in my life other than ocational pointers such as this email from time to time. Smile. ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
