On 09.01.2012 22:08, Walter Dnes wrote:
On Mon, Jan 09, 2012 at 04:47:22PM +0700, Pandu Poluan wrote
Is it possible to load the firmware blob after booting, from the shell?
I don't think so. These are not standard kernel modules (*.o) files.
You could build the radeon driver as module
On 2012-01-09 00:48, Walter Dnes wrote:
Hm... if you didn't compile it in you would have needed an initrd;
didn't think of that... :-(
* with only one binary blob. it just works
* multiple blobs should not be included in the kernel, otherwise it gets
confused. If multiple blobs are
On Jan 9, 2012 3:24 PM, pk pete...@coolmail.se wrote:
On 2012-01-09 00:48, Walter Dnes wrote:
Hm... if you didn't compile it in you would have needed an initrd;
didn't think of that... :-(
* with only one binary blob. it just works
* multiple blobs should not be included in the kernel,
On 2012-01-09 10:47, Pandu Poluan wrote:
Is it possible to load the firmware blob after booting, from the shell?
I don't think so; KMS needs it to talk to the gpu so either it needs to
be in an initrd (loaded with the KMS/framebuffer module) or compiled in.
That's how I understand it anyway...
On Mon, Jan 09, 2012 at 04:47:22PM +0700, Pandu Poluan wrote
Is it possible to load the firmware blob after booting, from the shell?
I don't think so. These are not standard kernel modules (*.o) files.
--
Walter Dnes waltd...@waltdnes.org
On Sat, Jan 07, 2012 at 12:44:36PM +0100, pk wrote
Hm... I also use a radeon (w/ KMS) and needs this binary blob but I
compile that into the kernel*.
*Device Drivers ---
Generic Driver Options ---
[*] Include in-kernel firmware blobs in kernel binary
If you don't
On 2012-01-07 02:17, Walter Dnes wrote:
I think I've found one item so far that requires udev. My laptop's
graphics chip needs a binary blob from radeon-ucode. That binary blob,
in turn, requires the presence of /usr/lib/libudev.so.0 which is a
symlink to /usr/lib/libudev.so.0.9.3 (which
On Thu, Jan 05, 2012 at 08:30:52AM +0100, pk wrote
On 2012-01-05 01:02, Alan McKinnon wrote:
On my notebooks and test/development VMs, that's different. Those need
udev.
Why does it need udev specifically? Just curious... if there's a
technical need for something else than /dev
On 2012-01-05 08:43, Alan McKinnon wrote:
I fiddle around a lot with the hardware on those and udev deals with
that nicely considering udev is designed to deal with that nicely.
I confess to being quite ignorant when it comes to what magic udev does
behind the scenes but what makes it
On Thu, Jan 5, 2012 at 03:21, Canek Peláez Valdés can...@gmail.com wrote:
On Wed, Jan 4, 2012 at 6:35 AM, Pandu Poluan pa...@poluan.info wrote:
- 8 snip
You were there in the thread linked by Walt, udev is just one of several
packages maintained by RH people that *demands* /usr to be
On Thu, 5 Jan 2012 11:01:49 +0100, Nicolas Sebrecht wrote:
You might like it or not but udev is a core system tool, nowadays.
Yes, today. It wasn't yesterday and it may not be tomorrow. I like udev,
but I do not like the direction it is taking. I am not alone in this and
there may be a critical
On Thu, 5 Jan 2012 16:07:04 +0700
Pandu Poluan pa...@poluan.info wrote:
(As a side note, initramfs introduces not one, but *MANY* additional
breaking points: the tool used to generate the initramfs might be
buggy and/or feature-incomplete, the initramfs itself might encounter
an unrecoverable
On Thu, 05 Jan 2012 09:17:23 +0100
pk pete...@coolmail.se wrote:
On 2012-01-05 08:43, Alan McKinnon wrote:
I fiddle around a lot with the hardware on those and udev deals with
that nicely considering udev is designed to deal with that nicely.
I confess to being quite ignorant when it
Alan McKinnon wrote:
Dunno about lazy old fart, but splog (snarky pedantic lazy old git)
definitely is. I think we decided that Neil is the lazy old fart :-)
I'll take the plain old fart title. lol Drs think my body is at
least 70 anyway. I think my brain is old to but that's not what
On 2012-01-05 12:46, Alan McKinnon wrote:
I switch on a modern computer and it:
- loads a feature rich OS (UEFI) from a fixed point in firmware which
then
- loads a feature rich OS (grub2) from a fixed point on a storage
device which then
This is a precise argument why coreboot (and
On 2012-01-05 13:08, Alan McKinnon wrote:
I don't claim any special deep knowledge of these things, but a
superficial glance over the packages tells you a lot. udev is designed
to deal with any realistic device needs on modern systems - it's the
kitchen sink.
Fully agree... :-/
Alan McKinnon wrote:
Dunno about lazy old fart, but splog (snarky pedantic lazy old git)
definitely is. I think we decided that Neil is the lazy old
fart :-)
I can't be bothered to answer that one.
--
Neil Bothwick
Q: What's the proper plural of a 'Net-connected Windows machine?
A: A
On 2012-01-05 15:03, Dale wrote:
I'll take the plain old fart title. lol Drs think my body is at
least 70 anyway. I think my brain is old to but that's not what they
test, YET. o_O
Here's the condensed version of what's happening (laughing is good for
you or so I hear):
pk wrote:
On 2012-01-05 15:03, Dale wrote:
I'll take the plain old fart title. lol Drs think my body is at
least 70 anyway. I think my brain is old to but that's not what they
test, YET. o_O
Here's the condensed version of what's happening (laughing is good for
you or so I hear):
On Jan 5, 2012 7:10 PM, Alan McKinnon alan.mckin...@gmail.com wrote:
On Thu, 05 Jan 2012 09:17:23 +0100
pk pete...@coolmail.se wrote:
On 2012-01-05 08:43, Alan McKinnon wrote:
I fiddle around a lot with the hardware on those and udev deals with
that nicely considering udev is
On 2012-01-05 17:20, Dale wrote:
rm -rf /usr /lib/nvidia-current/xorg/xorg
ROFLMAO. That one space bar hit caused a bit of trouble. WOW. I would
have been pretty pissed. lol
Yes, buy it's the comments (and pictures) below that made me laugh...
the link is a definite keeper... :-D
Best
On Jan 5, 2012 11:44 PM, pk pete...@coolmail.se wrote:
On 2012-01-05 17:20, Dale wrote:
rm -rf /usr /lib/nvidia-current/xorg/xorg
ROFLMAO. That one space bar hit caused a bit of trouble. WOW. I would
have been pretty pissed. lol
Yes, buy it's the comments (and pictures) below
On Thu, 05 Jan 2012 16:50:45 +0100
pk pete...@coolmail.se wrote:
On 2012-01-05 13:08, Alan McKinnon wrote:
[snip]
mdev has a much narrower scope where things are considerably more
static.
Currently it does have a more narrow scope, yes, but that can change,
no? Although I'm not
On Thu, 5 Jan 2012 15:52:04 +
Neil Bothwick n...@digimed.co.uk wrote:
Alan McKinnon wrote:
Dunno about lazy old fart, but splog (snarky pedantic lazy old git)
definitely is. I think we decided that Neil is the lazy old
fart :-)
I can't be bothered to answer that one.
On Thu, Jan 5, 2012 at 1:02 PM, Alan McKinnon alan.mckin...@gmail.com wrote:
On Thu, 05 Jan 2012 16:50:45 +0100
pk pete...@coolmail.se wrote:
On 2012-01-05 13:08, Alan McKinnon wrote:
If /usr is local, what really is the point of having it separate
from /? Have you ever found a Linux
On Thu, Jan 5, 2012 at 5:01 AM, Nicolas Sebrecht nsebre...@piing.fr wrote:
The 05/01/12, Pandu Poluan wrote:
And mdev might be a 'toy' to you, but embedded Linux developers will
vehemently disagree with you.
And based on the responses in this thread, server guys will also
disagree with you.
On 2012-01-05 19:02, Alan McKinnon wrote:
structure. Too little control is just as bad as too much
Well, I am a control freak so... I started out with Redhat a long time
ago and then ended up with Linux From Scratch but it needed a bit too
much maintenance so I found Gentoo as a good
On Thursday 05 Jan 2012 18:20:16 Michael Mol wrote:
On Thu, Jan 5, 2012 at 1:02 PM, Alan McKinnon alan.mckin...@gmail.com
wrote:
On Thu, 05 Jan 2012 16:50:45 +0100
pk pete...@coolmail.se wrote:
On 2012-01-05 13:08, Alan McKinnon wrote:
If /usr is local, what really is the point of
On Thu, 5 Jan 2012 13:20:16 -0500, Michael Mol wrote:
Apparently they're going the 'app store' route in Windows 8.
WooHoo! 200 fart apps on the first day.
--
Neil Bothwick
... I'm simply not a nice girl, she whispered tartly.
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Description: PGP signature
On Thu, Jan 5, 2012 at 5:08 PM, Nicolas Sebrecht
nicolas.s-...@laposte.net wrote:
On Thu, Jan 05, 2012 at 02:20:21PM -0500, Michael Mol wrote:
FWIW, I had a /dev/cdrom symlink long before *devfs* even existed, let
alone udev.
We are not looking for device paths that existed berfore udev.
On Thu, 5 Jan 2012 16:38:20 -0500
Michael Mol mike...@gmail.com wrote:
But I see
an improvement to let me tune the NIC names if I need to. I have
routers with *lot of* NIC cards where this feature is very usefull
(expressive names are much better than ethX).
I, too, noted this as a
pk wrote:
On 2012-01-05 17:20, Dale wrote:
rm -rf /usr /lib/nvidia-current/xorg/xorg
ROFLMAO. That one space bar hit caused a bit of trouble. WOW. I would
have been pretty pissed. lol
Yes, buy it's the comments (and pictures) below that made me laugh...
the link is a definite keeper...
Alan McKinnon wrote:
I see that as a liability not a feature. Our routers have very clear
naming conventions for interfaces and they are exactly how Cisco
enumerates them and no other way. It's a firing offense to dick with
them and dream up useless descriptive names. Mind you, these for the
On Jan 6, 2012 8:50 AM, Dale rdalek1...@gmail.com wrote:
Alan McKinnon wrote:
I see that as a liability not a feature. Our routers have very clear
naming conventions for interfaces and they are exactly how Cisco enumerates
them and no other way. It's a firing offense to dick with them and
Pandu Poluan wrote:
On Jan 6, 2012 8:50 AM, Dale rdalek1...@gmail.com
mailto:rdalek1...@gmail.com wrote:
Alan McKinnon wrote:
I see that as a liability not a feature. Our routers have very
clear naming conventions for interfaces and they are exactly how Cisco
enumerates them and no
On 2012-01-06 02:29, Dale wrote:
Yea, they were funny. Sort of surprising tho. Most people were making
a joke about it. Mistakes happen tho. I'm sure it wasn't intentional.
It's easy to make such a mistake when in a hurry, or tired or distracted
for some reason; I'm also quite sure it
On Jan 6, 2012 10:04 AM, pk pete...@coolmail.se wrote:
On 2012-01-06 02:29, Dale wrote:
Yea, they were funny. Sort of surprising tho. Most people were making
a joke about it. Mistakes happen tho. I'm sure it wasn't intentional.
It's easy to make such a mistake when in a hurry, or
On Jan 4, 2012 6:19 AM, Dale rdalek1...@gmail.com wrote:
Neil Bothwick wrote:
On Tue, 3 Jan 2012 15:31:20 +0100, Nicolas Sebrecht wrote:
I know. It's the I want to get the rid of initramfs thing that looks
crazy to me.
No one is saying they want to get rid of the initramfs, because they
On Wed, Jan 4, 2012 at 6:35 AM, Pandu Poluan pa...@poluan.info wrote:
On Jan 4, 2012 6:19 AM, Dale rdalek1...@gmail.com wrote:
Neil Bothwick wrote:
On Tue, 3 Jan 2012 15:31:20 +0100, Nicolas Sebrecht wrote:
I know. It's the I want to get the rid of initramfs thing that looks
crazy to me.
Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
On Wed, Jan 4, 2012 at 6:35 AM, Pandu Poluanpa...@poluan.info wrote:
On Jan 4, 2012 6:19 AM, Dalerdalek1...@gmail.com wrote:
Neil Bothwick wrote:
On Tue, 3 Jan 2012 15:31:20 +0100, Nicolas Sebrecht wrote:
I know. It's the I want to get the rid of initramfs thing
On Wed, Jan 4, 2012 at 6:33 PM, Dale rdalek1...@gmail.com wrote:
Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
On Wed, Jan 4, 2012 at 6:35 AM, Pandu Poluanpa...@poluan.info wrote:
On Jan 4, 2012 6:19 AM, Dalerdalek1...@gmail.com wrote:
Neil Bothwick wrote:
On Tue, 3 Jan 2012 15:31:20 +0100, Nicolas
On Wed, 4 Jan 2012 18:49:29 -0500
Michael Mol mike...@gmail.com wrote:
As I said about my ex once, time tells. Sometimes, time is the
only thing that does tell too. Reminds me of wine although I don't
drink it.
I think it's absolutely ridiculous to look at udev and mdev as winner
or
On 2012-01-05 01:02, Alan McKinnon wrote:
On my notebooks and test/development VMs, that's different. Those need
udev.
Why does it need udev specifically? Just curious... if there's a
technical need for something else than /dev population (and possible
configuration of devices, i.e. tell the
On Thu, 05 Jan 2012 08:30:52 +0100
pk pete...@coolmail.se wrote:
On my notebooks and test/development VMs, that's different. Those
need udev.
Why does it need udev specifically? Just curious... if there's a
technical need for something else than /dev population (and possible
In the instructions here, I've set up a revised dev-manager ebuild in
an overlay. I've requested the changes to be incorporated into the
official ebuild and it appears to have been accepted. See...
https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=395319
It should be rolled out eventually, and the
On Tue, Jan 3, 2012 at 17:04, Walter Dnes waltd...@waltdnes.org wrote:
In the instructions here, I've set up a revised dev-manager ebuild in
an overlay. I've requested the changes to be incorporated into the
official ebuild and it appears to have been accepted. See...
On Jan 3, 2012 7:35 PM, Nicolas Sebrecht nsebre...@piing.fr wrote:
The 03/01/12, Pandu Poluan wrote:
(Come to think of it, has *any* distro ever attempted this...
'unconventional of going udev-free?)
mdev is not an udev replacement. It's a very minimalist udev designed
for embedded
On Tue, 3 Jan 2012 13:32:09 +0100
Nicolas Sebrecht nsebre...@piing.fr wrote:
The 03/01/12, Pandu Poluan wrote:
(Come to think of it, has *any* distro ever attempted this...
'unconventional of going udev-free?)
mdev is not an udev replacement. It's a very minimalist udev designed
for
On Tue, Jan 3, 2012 at 20:13, Nicolas Sebrecht nsebre...@piing.fr wrote:
The 03/01/12, Pandu Poluan wrote:
But I can see a use case for mdev completely replacing udev: servers and
virtual machines.
Servers, especially production ones, have a hardware change only once in
every
Am Dienstag, 3. Januar 2012, 14:36:08 schrieb Nicolas Sebrecht:
The 03/01/12, Alan McKinnon wrote:
If you go back through the list archives you will find the enormous
thread that caused Walter to start down this road in the first place.
His efforts are an attempt to deal with the gigantic
Nicolas Sebrecht wrote:
The 03/01/12, Alan McKinnon wrote:
If you go back through the list archives you will find the enormous
thread that caused Walter to start down this road in the first place.
His efforts are an attempt to deal with the gigantic bloat-fest that
the udev devs seem to revel
On Tue, 3 Jan 2012 15:31:20 +0100
Nicolas Sebrecht nsebre...@piing.fr wrote:
Then again, using initramfs is yet-another-component waiting to
break.
Knowing Murphy's Law, it will one day fuck up everything.
And the mdev alternative won't follow this law?
It's not immune to it, just
Alan McKinnon wrote:
On Tue, 3 Jan 2012 15:31:20 +0100
Nicolas Sebrechtnsebre...@piing.fr wrote:
Then again, using initramfs is yet-another-component waiting to
break.
Knowing Murphy's Law, it will one day fuck up everything.
And the mdev alternative won't follow this law?
It's not immune
On Tue, Jan 03, 2012 at 05:22:09PM +0700, Pandu Poluan wrote
(Come to think of it, has *any* distro ever attempted this...
'unconventional of going udev-free?)
Alpine linux has done it http://alpinelinux.org/ Unfortunately,
they're so minimalistic and server-oriented that they use uclibc
On Tuesday 03 Jan 2012 15:22:29 Walter Dnes wrote:
On Tue, Jan 03, 2012 at 05:22:09PM +0700, Pandu Poluan wrote
(Come to think of it, has *any* distro ever attempted this...
'unconventional of going udev-free?)
Alpine linux has done it http://alpinelinux.org/ Unfortunately,
they're
On Tue, 3 Jan 2012 15:31:20 +0100, Nicolas Sebrecht wrote:
I know. It's the I want to get the rid of initramfs thing that looks
crazy to me.
No one is saying they want to get rid of the initramfs, because they are
not using one. What people object to is being forced to start using one.
--
Neil Bothwick wrote:
On Tue, 3 Jan 2012 15:31:20 +0100, Nicolas Sebrecht wrote:
I know. It's the I want to get the rid of initramfs thing that looks
crazy to me.
No one is saying they want to get rid of the initramfs, because they are
not using one. What people object to is being forced to
On Dec 2, 2011 2:50 AM, Walter Dnes waltd...@waltdnes.org wrote:
Corrected #!/sbin/busybox ash to #!/bin/busybox ash in step 3. The
weird part is that my system actually booted and ran fine even with this
typo in the script.
Amazingly enough, my system also works. Albeit with two red
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